Okay , today we are actually talking to a friend of mine, Amanda Conley, and we're gonna be talking about a really good topic regarding leadership development and leadership coaching with her today. So I'm excited. I'm really excited to have you on the , uh, the show today. Um, Amanda,
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.
You're welcome. So with that , um, why don't you tell me a little bit about your business now. I know you work for an organization that I'm familiar with, but why don't you tell me a little bit about your story and how you got involved with the business and , uh, just tell me, tell me kind of the backstory as to how you got involved with cmp.
Sure, sure. So cmp , um, we've been around for about 22 years now. We've got three different pract practice areas. We've got out placement, executive recruitment, and then we've got leadership development , um, which is my portion of the business. And so I get the honor of working with many executive coaching opportunities, training opportunities, leadership development strategy, and many validated assessments , um, which I'm very fortunate to be doing what I love to do.
So the way I got started, it's kind of interesting. I was an executive for raising canes and chicken fingers many years ago.
I didn't know that
Was , and Joe Frache actually was a consultant that came in and he assessed our executive team and , uh, really provided some wonderful insights and did several different sessions with us. And during one of my one-on-ones with Joe, he said, what is it you're passionate about? You know, what do you really wanna do? And I said, well, eventually I'll do what you do. That's really what I'm passionate about, .
I like really building leaders and working with individuals who are passionate about their own work and, and partnering with them. And I said, but I really like, you know, where I'm at right now, and so I'm gonna stay here for a bit. And then I ended up leaving Kane , so went to c v s , um, for a while, and Joe and I stayed in contact , um, for that entire time period. And then when he purchased C M P , he asked if I wanted to come on board and lead the leadership development space.
And so I jumped at the opportunity. And so it was really the right time, right place, right time. I think , um, I'm very fortunate that I was able to have the time at C V S and at Kanes , and I needed that to be able to really learn and grow even more , um, than I have. I've been in HR for over 20 years, and so I needed that extra time and I'm glad I had it and, and joined C M P and we'll never look back.
Okay . Wow. That is so cool. I didn't, I honestly didn't know that about you, Amanda. So this is kind of the fun part of doing, of having different guests on the show because I get to know the person too. So, yeah . Um, it just shows you also the power of networking. So it really shows you how to stay connected. And it sounds like Joe did a really good job.
He must have seen , you know, that you had a , a really good , uh, he had a good eye for talent and he probably saw that you had some really nice, really good skills. So I'm glad he landed you. So that's the way that I got to meet you a few years ago. So I'm excited about this. So , um, thank you . So with that, I'm just gonna jump in because we are here as, as you mentioned, you know, you're the practice leader for leadership development and coaching.
So I'd like you to start out with, because you know, it's , it's interesting because our audience are kind of like middle market size companies, typically, we try to, we try to , um, pro um, share good content regarding leadership development for business owners, C level executives. So from your de you know, if you were going to go ahead and share a definition of leadership development for our audience, how would you encapsulate that in a couple of a couple of sentences?
Sure. Leadership development for me is a lot about that respectful, challenging of one another. We weren't born to be leaders, you know, we , we were born and we've learned over time through mentors, partnerships, individuals who really invested in us , um, allowing us to become the leaders that we are today, allowing us to really grow and, and become our authentic leadership self.
And so to me, develop is development from a leadership perspective, is figuring out who you are as a leader, who you wanna be, and then who do you wanna be today might be different than who you wanna be five years from now. And that's the wonderful thing about being human. We can evolve , our brains are very invaluable. And so we're able to really take on additional pieces of information, adjust, adapt, and evolve. And most importantly, cascade that to others.
I think that we have a great deal of responsibility as leaders , um, to others. I mean , if you think about the impact that we have, not only on their careers, but on their professional personal lives , um, as a whole. And so it's our role as leaders to make sure that we're investing in them being that whole person, that satisfied person, that if they're not happy with what they're doing, we challenge them . We really need to get to the bottom of why are they doing what they are doing today?
Are they in the right place? Is this the right time for them to start thinking about things differently? So that respectful, challenging to me really matters. And oftentimes the higher we move up in leadership, the more people avoid , right? Giving us that feedback. Um, and so we miss out on that quite a bit. And I think that that's our role as leaders to continue to invest in ourselves and develop ourselves and continue to grow. We're all a work in progress.
That's great. Now that , that is, that is so interesting. And I look back at, I was in corporate America for about 23, 24 years and kind of rose up the ranks. And I think it is true that once you get to a certain place, you may find that you feel like, oh, well I've already, I've, I've mastered this because I wrote , I I I've rose to this level or this title and what have you.
But it's, but it really is critical that even doesn't matter who you are, the place you sit at, whether you're a , uh, you know, chief HR office or head of sales, head of , uh, operations, you know, investing in yourself critically, really continuing to look for ways to improve yourself is really, that's , that's some great , uh, those are some great words of advice right there.
Yeah. Very important. I think it also becomes even more important if you think about it cuz your span of control is greater, so your degree of influence is greater. So the investment in yourself and in others should continue to increase, not decrease , um, being open to learning more. And I mean, if you just think of the world today, we're in a very different place than we were five, 10 years ago. So we've gotta learn and evolve.
Um, otherwise the business is gonna move forward without us and we're not going to be leaders if we turn around and there's no one behind us. Right. ,
We're just
Standing alone .
That's so true. So, so when do you think about, so if you, if you go in from a consulting perspective with C M P and, and that an organization of let's, I don't know , just for example, purposes, an organization of 300 people have never done any leadership development programming or leadership development training itself.
Where w how would you start a a a a process of actually starting to work with them or starting to explain why it's so critical and important for that company who has really done nothing around leadership development. What would you tell them about why it's so important to actually start that process as soon as possible?
That's a really good question cuz that discovery is very important. Cuz if you don't have that buy-in at the top, then that sustainability may not be present. And so really it's that discovery piece of reminding them and showing them how the cost of not investing in their leaders is so great that we should not avoid that. If we avoid it, we're leaving money on the table every single day.
So we can prove through C M P systems that there is an r o i to the training programs, to the coaching programs, to the assessments, the things that we do there as an r o roi .
So I really talk more about if it's a financially driven individual, which typically those executives are going to be, that we talk about the financial side and the ROI and leaving money on the table If it's someone who's, you know, really that heartfelt kind of human capital piece, someone to talk about the people side of it. I do a blend of both. Let's share about the r o I really from that human perspective too, and what that cost is if we don't do that.
So we talk through things, of course, retention, engagement , um, the type of candidates that are coming in and the type of leaders that are being built and when the last time is that they've invested in themselves. And oftentimes it's a leader might read a book or two, but then it stops there. And I'm guilty of it myself. I read all the time, , I'll get to the end of the book . I'm like , oh, that was really great.
You know, and I'll highlight a few things and sometimes I go back to it, but often I don't unless I practice it. And so I really try to be mindful and leadership development is about really being mindful, putting the spotlight on those things that matter , um, to the organization and to those individuals. Mm-hmm . So it's really important that discovery and that attachment to that mindset shift too.
Hmm . So when you mentioned, you mentioned it a couple of times, I think , um, around r ROI on leadership development. So can you just share for , um, our audience, what, what is typically the , in the studies you've looked at, what is, what would you say is an , is a expected ROI back on leadership development? So they invested, I'll just throw out a number just for simplicity's sake.
So if they invested $50,000 , um, in leadership development and coaching, what kind of an r o I could that organization expect with let's say the next one to two years?
Yeah, there's a lot of different studies around that. Typically what you wanna see is that 30% of return really on what that investment is year one. And then it just continues to grow. Cause if you think about if you learn something new and you get a 30% return on that, you're passing it on to someone else, you're passing it to a team of a hundred, what is your return at that point? Right? It's exponential. So it's really defining what matters.
What type of investment do we wanna make and what type of return are we expecting back? And have it be very targeted around what it is that those expectations are very defined metrics, success measures, things of that nature. And we're not one to come in and do kind of a fluffy session and then we leave. It's what do we really need to get to the bottom of. And we'll talk about that, I'm sure a little bit farther into our conversation today.
But that's what's really important is how, is what you're learning going to stick and going to cascade and to the rest of the team. There's nothing better than going into any of our clients. And I hear their leaders saying things that I mentioned during a session, right? Mm-hmm. that start to become their own vernacular.
There was a , a call that, I had a coaching call just before this and she had a retreat with her own team and was starting to institute the models and things that she and I had spoken of. And so now her team's starting to speak the same language. So the more in times that you invest in your leaders and it's kind of that repetitive, kind of really solidifying what that messaging is, the greater your ROI is gonna be because then it becomes a cultural shift in your organization.
And at the end of the day, that's really what we're seeking. We don't want just that one leader to become stronger. We want that one leader to become stronger, which then makes our team stronger, which then makes our clients our client retention higher, which then really helps just so many different facets of business. So that's really what we wanna focus on when we think about roi . It's not just what you get from that one session. Mm-hmm .
and a lot of studies will look at that one session and I say, look beyond them , it's really important to see what those cascading effects are gonna be.
Right. Oh no, that's, well you packed a lot into what you just said too, so, so for companies that, you know, going back to the example I mentioned previously, run companies that are not, haven't done a lot of leadership development and coaching work.
How would you, if you were gonna break up the components of leadership development, for instance, you know, pure, like skills-based work, you know, learning, let me just, you know, I'll , I'll, I'll just pull a couple out and you can, of course correct me if I'm wrong or off base here, but if you're thinking about just around just being a good listener, effective communications, conflict resolution, handling change as a purest skills-based , um, how, how would you break down , if you were
looking at a leadership strategy, how much of it would be truly skilled skills-based training and observation or maybe books and then reflecting on those versus coaching, you know, doing a 360 assessment and doing coaching work versus the actual rubber meets the road, the application component where that one manager, you just got up a session, actually did a retreat with her folks and she was implementing some of the skills and some of the things you had , you'd been , uh, working with her on.
How would you kind of, you were trying to bucketize that into different segments. How would you, if you can just put on some rough percentages of what would that look like?
So , you know, I love assessments, validated assessments, , you and I have talked about that quite a bit mm-hmm. . So I do like that to be a component of it. Uh, I believe that self insight , when we see ourselves on paper, the aha moment is unbelievable. And what we see cuz they'll say , well, I don't know. I don't know if I, I believe this piece of it, or I don't know about, you know, this component of this assessment if I believe in it or not.
And then we'll talk through how does it apply at home, how does it apply at work? And then they're like , I do do that. You're right. That is something that I do. That is something I, I need to change and I need to adjust. But to answer your question on those different components, which you, you mentioned, which are all wonderful and different things to tackle, it has to start with trust mm-hmm . .
And there's a Harvard Business Review study that's astounding and I use it as a reference and some of my training that 58% of employees will trust a stranger more than their boss. Hmm . I find that to be so frightening, right? So if we don't start with trust building and really get to the bottom of, if we're not at that trust build stage, you're not, it doesn't matter if you're an effective listener, effective communicator, all those other items.
Cuz if you're missing trust, you're gonna miss a huge piece of the impact of what that can have. So for me, the trust is I'll start with a hundred percent trust first. Then once we reach that and then move into percentages around that self insight , that assessment piece, understanding ourselves, understanding our team, understanding the impact of how we're wired and different ways that we are wired today, doesn't mean we have to stay that way.
You know, I mean there's so many studies around neuroscience that show how we're able to replace behaviors, we can change those neuro pathways. And so a lot of the training that we do isn't just about the skills-based piece , um, that you mentioned, but it's practicing what behaviors are serving me well, what do I need to replace with other behaviors and does my team even trust me? And if they don't trust me, I won't even move forward with a session effectively.
So I really start with that trust building first and being very transparent and honest. So there's a lot of different exercises and, and things that we explore through that. And then the skills can come. But if you think about leaders, they should be send spending just a fraction of their time on the how to do things, right. Being in the weeds and most of their time around strategy, being more effective, what do I need to do?
And so for leaders, we gotta stick with that and to be effective and build strong strategies and to have that buy-in, we have to have trust. It has to be there.
Hmm . And that, that really is amazing when you mentioned that, that people will trust a stranger more than they do 50
Brightening .
That's just, it is , it really is. And it just shows, well it goes back to, you know, typically the number one or two responses to why people leave a company. Yes . They sure they leave. Sometimes it is monetarily driven, but in a lot of cases it's because they don't have trust or respect for their manager.
That's right.
They're direct boss. So it's really fascinating. Now I was telling a group last week about that too, and they were just, yeah , I think they were a little bit surprised.
And that's why, you know, the work that we do, we also, we do a lot of, you know, we do more foundational training for a lot of first line managers and supervisors just because it's so, it doesn't matter how, how good the president or c e o is, is at the end of the day, the person, the person they have the most interaction with their direct manager or direct team lead and supervisor.
So that we've gotta really treat , it's anybody who's in the human capital space is as we are, I think we really have to be, it's gotta be paramount that, you know, making sure that you're , you're , you're , uh, um, you know, it's almost like the dr the sergeants, you know, the sergeants and the the lieutenants. Making sure that your people who have the most connection with the employees are the ones that are actually you .
You've gotta really, to me, you start there because if they can't get it right and you can't focus on the C level folks around strategy Yeah . Then you're really going to be in a, in a, in a tough spot. So, yeah . Um, we're gonna just take a short break now, Amanda, so Okay . We'll take a short break for about , um, 30 seconds or so and then we'll be back with Amanda Conley from C M P and look forward to continuing our discussion there. So thanks so much. Thank you.
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Thanks very much , uh, for coming back and thanks so much for Amanda Connolly for giving us some great insights around leadership development. This has been, I , I very, I say, I say this very sincerely, Amanda, whenever I, whenever I have a podcast guest on , I learn something new and I've been in HR for over 30 years, so I, I I , I think I know quite a bit, but it's always fun just to come back with somebody like yourself and who's a subject matter expert in the field of leadership.
So , um, prior to our break, we talked about leadership, we talked about 360 assessments, I think you referenced that. So for some of the audience members, they may have no idea what a 360 assessment is. So if you wouldn't mind just giving them, letting them know what it is and in what kind of a situation a company or leader should be using a 360 assessment from a developmental perspective.
Oh, absolutely. So a 360 really allows us to get insight into how others perceive us. So it's a bit different than other validated assessments where it's that self insight based on questions that, that we are asked of ourselves about maybe behaviors and such. But this is perception management and so a 360, we'll get information from your direct reports, your boss, your peers, your colleagues.
It might be an internal or external colleague relationship that you want to really understand their perception of you. And so we're only as good as others think that we are sometimes in their eyes, right. To be successful we've got to manage perception. And so to start with that, it's really understanding , um, where others see us . And so a 360 gives a way for an anonymous tool , um, to being given that information from each of those different radar groups.
And many 360 s have different competencies associated with the statements that the Raiders are responding to. So C M P actually has our own 360 , um, because we are finding that some 360 s out there didn't look at competencies such as emotional intelligence, which we deem to be extremely critical , um, to the success of a leader. And so we developed our own.
And so we have a 360 assessment that pulls in all that information from the different competencies we're able to identify if there's a gap in my own self rating, then that of maybe one of these other radar groups. Then it tells me my direct reports might think I'm incredibly strong in emotional intelligence or communication, but it's my peer group that I really need to work on. I need to maybe change my communication style with that particular group.
And then the open-ended comments provide us so much value cuz it's comments sometimes that people might not share with you face-to-face, that they're willing to do something , um, in a more structured platform and provide the feedback that way. And so it really opens the door between the coach and the coachee if they're in a coaching partnership with a 360 to really dive into, okay , let's talk about this peer group then.
If we're wanting to work on communication, why might your communications look different with this group? What's happening? What do we need to maybe replace some behaviors around that? And then we do high volume 360 s two . So an organization might reach out to C M P and say, I've got 300 employees, I want to have a 360 completed for them and we're gonna em debrief those internally.
Um, so either option is provided, whether it's that support with a coach or internally, some people have a strong HR team that might support that as well. But the main thing is to have a, a good structure around that 360, being able to provide that anonymous feedback and then be able to look at competencies that really matter for the success of whether it's a leader or individual contributor depending on the 360 that you select.
Right. Okay . Great. That's a really nice overview. And I've used, you know, we've used at the HR Catalyst, we've used 360 for a number of years, but it really is a powerful tool.
So , um, how, well, just switching gears a little bit, how well would you say, if you're gonna just give a , let's say a simple letter grade , like middle market size companies, let's say companies , um, 30 million , um, 500 employees, 30 million in revenue, how well would you say in your experience, do those companies actually do leadership development?
Um, you know, and if you're just gonna use a simple letter grade , what, so what would you say the grade in , in most cases , um, they would receive,
Ooh , I'm a harsh grader, ,
That's
Ok . One . Um, I would put it at a low D um, honestly, in most cases, yeah, I think, and it's not with with malice there , I think there's good intent , um, with the way that they hope to develop their employees. But oftentimes that might be driven by someone read a great book, you know, or, or heard something that they think, oh, you know what, my team could benefit from that.
And then they dive right into whatever that is without the big discovery as to is that what will be most impactful for your participant group? Is that something that you should be spending the time on as phase one or might that be a phase three or phase four?
And so I think really that discovery is sometimes tough to do , um, if you're trying to do it internally about yourself without having that feedback from kind of a 360 , um, sort of point of view or from someone outside coming in and really looking under the hood. Cuz we don't know what we don't know, right? And so being able to get that feedback from others is really important to say, if I invest in this, is that gonna create the most value?
And there have been times when we've had clients reach out to us and they'll say, we want a training session on X and then we'll say, wonderful, you know, we can customize that for you, or we've got off the shelf solutions, whatever might work best for you. But then we start to talk to those key stakeholders , um, during the design phase and they will tell us, that's not really what I need from my team. What I need is this.
And so then we start to go down maybe a different path or a blended approach that's gonna be able to tackle that. And of course, starting with trust each and every time, cuz the main thing is being effective.
We're so busy and so taking, you know, another day or two , um, out of our teams, we wanna make sure that it's something that's going to have that impact for the organization and, and that hits home for them because it's palatable, the change that can occur, the aha moments that occur when you bring people together and you start to create this culture of accountability and this coaching culture, if you will, we call it, when you bring these teams together, it's, it's powerful. It really is.
And so those sessions can really provide such great value if you're heading on the right topic.
Wow . No, that's great. I could , I , I know we could probably carry on for another half an hour just on what you just said there.
So , um, but I do love that, you know, you , you , the focus that seemed like part of that whole foundation is around trust because you , you , you think about over the years and this, gosh, I'll probably date myself here, but I think going back to like Enron, going back to these classic, I I worked for an organization, I guess I'll be polite and we'll not use the name of the organization, where there was definitely some things that were unethical going on regarding financials and how the
financials were recorded , um, that brought down the company. So that ultimately drove the company from being extremely successful to within about three or four years later, it actually went through bankruptcy. And this was a company that, you know, had a hundred thousand employees.
So I think it , it just shows you how many organizations now just the trust level of a C E O president of the organization quite often , um, you know, the trust level is something that a lot of your, a lot of employees just, there is a lot of mistrust because there have been a lot of mistakes that made there that are really not in the company's self-interest. So mm-hmm. . Yeah. Interesting.
So , um, so would you say, so is leadership development leadership coaching, is it a system, is it a process? Is it a strategy? Is it all of the above? None of the above.
I would say it's all three of those. And also mindset. I would throw a mindset in there because if you don't have the adoption or acceptance of what you're attempting to change, nothing will change. People will go and they'll check the box of whatever it is that you're, you're trying to present to them and then they continue doing what they're doing. So that adoption and sustainability of whatever you're trying to develop in your leaders and in your team is extremely important.
So without systemic processes , um, you're not gonna be as effective, obviously, but also without that mindset , um, what kind of buy-in do I have and, and have you done a good job with the discovery, all those pieces we've talked about, I would add that , um, to that list as well.
That's great. So if you were gonna say, so if you're just gonna give me, you know, three, what are keys to success within the system, the strategy, the process, and I kind of gave you, I was, and I , I make this a little tougher on you, Anna . Just say, if you give me the top three, in your opinion, what would that top three be?
I would say don't leave money on the table. Make sure that you're talking through what are your goals. Mm-hmm . And if you're leaving money on the table today, which we all do, I mean, everyone's guilty of it, there are things that we could continue to improve upon, make sure that you're focused on, on the right things to not leave that money on the table. I think that's number one.
I think , uh, reminding our leaders too , their responsibility to mitigating the risk that exists in organizations. Whether it is the mistrust, like you mentioned before , um, the lack of accountability, the lack of ownership. Um, it's your responsibility , um, as an owner of a company and, and really as a leader in any organization to mitigate those risks. Um, you have a responsibility to the livelihood of every one of those employees, their families.
Um, that personal and professional impact that we have, again, as leaders is extraordinary. And so I feel like it's, it's our role. I feel like we're not really , um, we're not really holding up our end of the bargain, if you will mm-hmm . if we're not providing , um, that process and that support and development for our individuals. So I think that mindset of that risk mitigation's also really important too.
Um, and I think also making sure that you've got a structure in place that has that proven r o i is really important. So I think if you miss the boat on that and you're really just going after whatever is the fancy new training program that's out there, I think you're also gonna miss the boat there. So I think that that's probably the, the third component that's really important.
Have a trusted partner , um, helping you through that process to make sure that you're, you're going to hit the mark and, and that you've got that, that adoption like we talked about earlier.
Hmm . No, that's great. So, and but with your ex , the experience that you have, Amanda, what, what can, what can create, what can cause failure here? Failure in the leadership develop , you know, you start working with a client, you've had a really good relationship with them for, let's say a newer client you've been working with for six to 12 months, and that all of a sudden you hit a , um, you know , you know, you hit a brick wall. What could actually cause that derailment in your opinion
That you weren't tackling the right things to begin with? Hmm . And so, or you're moving forward too fast. And like I mentioned before, you might be working on something that they're not quite ready for yet because you haven't started with the trust building. There's a really interesting team performance model. Don't know if you've ever seen it with Drexler.
And it really talks about where are you at in that high performance stage, trust building's, number two , um, goal clarifications, number three, and so forth. And if you meet with a team, they might think, you know what, we're already a high performing team. You know, we're moving forward with X, Y, and Z processes. Then I meet with the team and I'll ask them on this model, where are we at? And they'll say, we're still at trust building , or we're still atlo for clarification.
Or you might even have a , a member or two on the team that says, I'm trying to figure out if I'm even in the right place. Like, why am I here? I'm at phase one. So even if you only have one person on your team that's there, you're not a high performing team. Hmm . Because it's kind of that cartoon, if you've seen it or you've got the whole team kind of pulling one person up by a rope to try to get 'em up the hill. You're not an effective team in that moment. Right?
So it's walk together, walk together until you get to that hill, make sure you've got a structure and a plan in place, and then you all move up the hill together. And then you're able to really reach that high performance. And oftentimes we, we miss the boat on that. We think if we've got a good idea, everybody's gonna get on board with it. Mm-hmm. , that's not necessarily the case.
So that self-assessment that we talked about before, that team assessment, perception assessment, all of that is really important to determine where are we now, and then where do we want to go, and then what's in between there. And so we can help with each of those three phases. But you can't go straight to phase three, right . If you haven't even figured out phase one. And oftentimes we try to do that, we're in a hurry,
, right? We all, I think everybody is, human nature is now, right? So we all want to , we , we live in a world of instant gratification. So, which is not a Oh yes . Not a good place to be .
Oh yes. .
So , um, so for business owners that are listening to this, so business owners , um, a C-level executive, and they don't have, or you know, they, they don't have a leadership development program now whatsoever, or they have their , after hearing you, they're like, wow, we're really missing the boat here. We gotta do something about it this year. Uh, the beginning of 2023, and wow .
So what would be the three reasons you would tell them you need to start doing this now and not continue to procrastinate regarding putting together a, a , a leadership development program?
Yeah. I would say first give yourself grace. Uh , we all want to do what's best for our employees. I always try to assume good intent mm-hmm . , um, in every situation. So give yourself some grace to know that you've done the best you, you thought you were doing to this point. Um, so even if I gave that terrible grade that I gave earlier, yeah , there's always time to recover. So you've got support out there.
Um, take the time to really understand , um, what's needed with your team, find the right support partner , um, to help you through that. And, and really starting with giving yourself some grace, it starts with identification, right? None of us know what we need to change until it's brought to our attention. Right.
And so hopefully with your podcast, it's, it's , some individuals are having some aha moments where, yes, this is something I need to provide for my team, and then I need to find the right partner to figure out what it is I need to provide for the team. So I think that those are really important components of making sure that you're making that decision for the investment with leadership development.
Right. No, that's great. So perfect. Now , um, thank you so much for this, Amanda. This has been so insightful for me. Again, I just, I honestly just, every time I do this, I, I find out something new about, about , uh, leaders of the topic. You talked about a little more about you two just personally. So it's great. It's always exciting to do this. So , uh, any final thoughts on the leadership development you wanted to share with our audience?
Ooh , there's so many. Just some final ones. I would say , um, really continue to invest in where you're passionate. If you find something that you're passionate about that's going to really help drive you as a leader forward. There's so many times when I'll meet a leader and they're kind of in that, that state of burnout, especially now with everything then we've all been through as a society in the past several years with Covid and everything else.
How do you need to shake it up to really move forward? So find a passion. And for me, I'm a , I'm definitely a little bit nerdy. So I took an m i t course on neuroscience , um, and had it really change neuro pathways and replace behaviors and, and to help with coaching. And so find something that you're passionate about and really just hone in on that skill, hone in on changing, know that you're not stuck with whatever behaviors you have today.
And just remember that the amount of influence and accountability that you have in a leadership position, and make sure that you're not falling short of what you would hope , um, to be as a leader , um, and what you would like to provide to others. Cuz if we all had that mindset of just giving back mm-hmm . and learning and growing and developing, I mean, what a wonderful state we would be in if we could really influence others in that way and be that way ourselves.
Hmm . Well that's, that's awesome. Thank you so much. So now we're gonna have a little bit of fun with you . So , um, Yeah , . Um , so three, so, and , and it's, I think you mentioned a little bit ago, you mentioned that you're, you're an avid reader. Yeah . So if you only had you , your top three business books you'd recommend to our audience, what are they?
Oh , I'll , well I'll share some of the ones that I'm reading now. Some are reading for a second time, but there's so many out there. And again, it's gotta be the one that, that really resonates with that individual. But there's one book I'm reading right now that I love and it's coach the person, not the problem.
Um , that really dives into, sometimes in coaching you, you really hone in on what that individual wants to achieve versus what does this person want to achieve as a whole individual and how do we need to move forward with that? And as leaders, I think we need to understand that with our team , um, as well. So it goes beyond just an , a professional coach or executive coach like myself. It, it's also as a leader, how do I wanna show up for others? How do I wanna mentor others?
And don't become a fix it person and make sure that you're guiding them through the PO process so that they're whole , um, as well. That's one I'm reading. The other one that's the , just listen , um, I'm reading that one as well, which is really interesting. Uh , it's a study around just how important it is for not just listening, but it's the validation component. And so they, they, I don't wanna spoiler alert on the book, but they did a , a research study which is really interesting.
And it talked about just the impact of validation in communications versus really just being a good listener. The days of just mirroring what you're hearing from another individual is, is not alone going to be able to kind of suffice any longer. You've gotta re really be able to kind of validate , um, that individual that you're communicating with. So I thought that was fascinating. Um, my other one is Man's Search for Meaning I , you've probably read that. Mm-hmm.
, I've read it probably three times. I'm on my third time right now, so I don't know what that says about this season of my life probably cuz I'm an empty nester now. Uh , so really just trying to define what is next? Does it look different , um, in this next season, right? So continuing to obviously build our team from a leadership development standpoint, but how do I wanna challenge myself a little bit more? And so I thought reading that book again, dusting that, that little gem off
would be helpful. That's great. A good one . That , that is great. So , um, yeah, so let's see now a couple more questions for you. So , um, podcasts, are you listening, I'm not sure if you're a podcast list or not, but if you, if you are, what are two podcasts that you're currently listening to?
So one I , and I do do, I like podcasts. I think they're fun, especially when you have guests on and you get different perspectives. And so there's two, I'm gonna do a shameless plug for CMPs podcast , um, American Narratives.
Um , it's really interesting cuz we bring on executives from all different walks of life with very just diverse backgrounds and we get to hear kind of their trials or tribulations , um, what makes them successful, what makes them tick, and, and what we could pull from that , um, experience, which I think is really important , um, to be able to learn from. And then my fun one that I'm listening to now too as well is The Happiness Project. I don't know if you've ever listened to that one, .
Um, it's really good. And so they talk a lot about , um, these crazy things that we do to ourselves. Like negative self-talk is one that just came up and I coach on that quite a bit. And so of course , uh, that resonated with me where we are sometimes our own worst enemies. Hmm . And so how do we kind of work around that and, and how do we build a he happy life for ourselves with gratitude and, and grace and all of those things that we could all use a little bit more of in our lives.
Um, so they bring on some fun just guest speakers and it's a really interesting podcast. If you haven't listened to it, I I actually think you would enjoy it.
Okay. No, I need to, I need to, I may listen to it tonight so just because I know I love to , there's so much good content out there for podcasting, so, no , that's a great one. Um, so what would you say , what would you tell your 16 year old self today?
Ooh , I would tell my 16 year old self to slow down. Um, I've always been a very, very driven individual. Started extremely young and looking back at who I was when I was 16, I was just ready to grow up and be an adult and, you know, work. And at the time I thought I would be a dentist, actually. Um, a little interesting fact I probably never shared with you.
And so I was just on a , just a really fast track to growing up and I don't think I, I benefited from some of the more 16 year old type things that I should have cuz I was a 16 year living and a 40 year old's body . But I 16 year old body, 40 year old's mind, I guess I should say. But I just, I would've slowed down a little bit more. I would've taken joy in those kind of tiny little trivial moments a bit more.
I try to do that today, but I, I'm still kind of that high driven individual to today and moving forward, but taking those moments that really matter and, and spending the time to sit in it and just be grateful
For this . Yeah , no , that , that's great. And you live in such a beautiful part of the us you know, you live up there in the mountains of No Northwest Arkansas, so it's Yes . Um, last question then we'll find out how people can get connect with you. So , um, so, so eighties, favorite eighties band.
It's still my guilty pleasure today. The police.
You gotta love the police.
Ah , I just, sometimes you just have to go back to that good eighties music that was just kind of raw and kind of brings you back to those wonderful moments too of the eighties. It's just a good time. Yeah . . So the police is really a band that, oh , I could go back , I could still listen to them every day .
Yeah, there's, they do. And I sometimes I'll, I'll, I'll go on Spotify and listen to police and or, you know, just, I love Sting's voice too. Just kind of that very high , whenever you hear Sting first, first measure or two, you can tell it's Sting just because he has such a Oh yes . He has such a u you know, unique vocal ability.
Yeah, he is got a very distinctive style. It's wonderful.
He does. So the
Amys though in general though, we just had good music back then. I know .
Good
Style , good music.
I know what happened to the music. I tell you that's a whole different podcast I'll have to do with you later . So Yes . Yes . Just a decline in music in America, so it's . Um , so with that , yeah . So with that , Amanda, so how can people get in touch with you with, with you at CMP? What are , what are the best ways to connect with you and maybe carry on the conversation or they want to find out more about the work that you do at CMP? How would , uh, how would they connect with you?
Oh, yes. I, I really look forward to the opportunity connecting with your audience. Um , they can go to our website at careermp.com Okay . And be able to really check out all the wonderful things that we're doing, different lines of business, and you'll see my name on there so you can reach out to me directly.
I'd love to chat with you and, and learn more about your business and any struggles that , that your readers have or listeners have , um, I'd love to hear about that and connect with them too. Life's about making connections, right. To circle back to our very first conversation or point of conversation, it was the connection with Joe that led me to CMP. So you just never know meeting the right person what it can lead to.
So I, I open up the opportunity to have discussions and connect with your listeners.
Right. Oh no, that's great. Yeah. The connections now. I think so much of it is about, it's about having a good circle of people who are well-intentioned. I think you talked about, you know, they people that you can, you know, and trust is really critical. So I think this is one key thing I've really, really kind of resonated with me is making sure from a leadership perspective, you have a leader that you can trust because it is so critical.
Not only today, but it's timeless that there's , um, you know , you've gotta have that kind of a relationship. So , um, with that, Amanda Connelly at CMP, thank you so much for your time. This has been a awesome podcast. And if you wanna learn more about 360 assessments and leaders of development and coaching, please reach out to Amanda at the information she's shared with you and look forward to our next podcast next month. Thanks so much. Talk to you later. Bye-Bye.