Welcome to How to Money.
I'm Joel, and I am Matt, I'm Emily, I'm Kate.
That's right, and today we're recording an episode with our wives talking about money.
That's right, man. This is our fifth annual. Is that what we're gonna call this? We do this just about every year, and specifically we do it while we're at the beach. It's a way for us to not get too far behind in the episodes that we're creating. So we make a little bit of work with pleasure. And we've got our wives here, Kate and Emily. And before we get to the questions, Yanna, what do y'all think about this house that we're staying in? Because I'll go
ahead and quick explainer. This is by far the nicest beach house that we've stayed in, and I would say that we come a long way since some of the early beach days.
Have we Ever, we have more than one bathroom for eleven people, so that is a win. Now, this house is awesome. It has a pool, which is fantastic when you got seven kids.
Yeah, I think it looks like Kate does not like it. She's just pounding over there for some reason. But o. Kate does like it because well, it's got the dopest stove that we've ever cooked on. Have you ever?
No?
No, and now I will cook on nothing else.
Yeah, So that's not good for your budget.
You feel like it's worth it the additional money for the additional luxury. I think it was.
I was thinking just this morning, how we Emily mentioned a house with just one bathroom which we legitimately stayed at in Jacksonville Beach. There was one like outside, but then there was one inside, and so for all of us to share that bathroom is literally like an outhouse.
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, you when you were in there.
So it was like splitting that house was kind of crazy, and it was we remember we finally figured out the name spelled backwards it was it was called autumn Ott and we were like, what does that mean? It was tomatoes spelled backwards because they had tomato stuff all up in the kitchen.
We were sitting there playing games, and yeah, I looked up there and realized that, holy, it's like it was It's like the scene in The Shining where the kids saying red rum the whole time, and finally it clicks and we're all kind of horrified.
That's actually exactly how it went.
Down, and we're like, that's why there's tomato parafernally. Yeah.
Yeah, as the kids get older, it's like we need a little more space and and so and this.
This is definitely an upgrade.
But I think it's nice to go from uh like crummy slumming it, and it makes you appreciate the nicer thing a little bit more than if you just like upgrade all the time and everything's nice all the time. So I don't know, I have fond memories of that trip, even though I know, like going number two was weird because there was one bathroom.
Everyone was there.
It was awkward.
I also want to just shout out that we have no kids and diapers for the first time on this vacation. Everyone swimming. I mean, the boys are on lifefest, but they're swimming, and it is a game changer.
I feel more like a like an adult rather than a parent chasing chasing a kid.
I've actually read a book, like maybe only a chapter, but that is the first in a lot of years.
Yeah. Yeah, it's okay, different, definitely different vibes. Do you So here's my here's my question. Or thought for y'all. Do y'all have any regrets about this house, because I'll go ahead and say I think I have been the one that has had the most not cold feet. But when we were initially looking at some of the different properties, I was just like, Oh my gosh, are we really going to spend? Like literally when you use Kate sent it out as a joke, I was like, oh, we
could get this one, ha ha. But then we basically the more we looked at it, the more we thought, oh no, what if we got this, This would be amazing, zero.
Regrets, more jokes, no regrets, no regrets. Let's do it again next year.
It's great. Yep. I think this one is worth the money.
It's an anial trip and I don't know it's even proximity to the beach, walking there, the pool, all that stuff.
It's this. This is like it's definitely got the like the value is there. Yeah, we couldn't go back to Atama. That would be the one. Like it's worth the money. It's just it always comes under the individual, like is it worth the money to the person? Like is it worth the money to us? Essentially? Yes?
Yea seven kids, I mean the kids in the huh.
Yeah, well, I mean you guys still reach out and ask for a discount, didn't you.
Oh yeah, well, I think we had initially booked it through Airbnb. And then this is a little trick by the way. You see, you see who lists it, and oftentimes it's a vacation rental company. And then we were like, wait a second, we're still in the cancelation window. Let's cancel this joker. After we reach out to the vacation rental company and it was like thousands of dollars less then, and and so literally I was looking up the dates
for next year. It's more than it's a more than three thousand dollars difference if you book through Airbnb versus booking directly.
Holy count.
So when that's when you're looking on airby me and you see a place, don't necessarily book right away. Maybe maybe you can see if the owner or the vacation rental agency can give you a better price.
That's right, Okay, So let's go ahead and get in the questions before hour before kids start making their way up here after the movie runs out downstairs. I think we should probably start this episode off the way we start off our interviews, which is we always ask guests and y'all know this, ladies, but we ask our guests what their craft beer equivalent is, Like, what is their splurge the thing that they spend money on that to
a lot of folks is maybe a complete waste of money. So, first of all, Susanne, I think she wanted to know if y'all like Kraft beer. But then secondly, like, what is something you actually splurge on? And specifically she was wanting to know if we have a splurge budget, do we set money aside for splurges for us individually? Kate? How about you kick it off?
Sure? I do like craft beer. We enjoy visiting brewers and different cities when we visit, and it's just sort of one thing we do when we travel, but it is not my craft beer. Does that make it's I love craft beer, but it is not my craft beer. My craft beer equivalent, like money, splurge is probably plants.
Yeah, I can attest to that.
Plants inside and outside, and probably also art supplies. Buy so many art supplies for projects that are unnecessary but fun. So yeah, that's what that's what mine would be.
That is something that you spend money on that. I think most people would say, what you're spending how much on paper or things that you think should not cost a lot of money?
But yeah, yeah, I also love craft beer and but yes, it's not my splurge. If I was going to splurge me in in this season of life, I think two things. Books. I'm reading a lot of books, and I love books. I'm willing to spend money on it. But also just convenience right now, like we're doing instacart this week instead of having to go to the grocery store, and it is amazing. I wouldn't normally do that, but anything that kind of is convenient, and this season helps speeds things
up or it gives me more time. I am all about it.
Well, I'll say that I did go to the grocery store yesterday, So what we might do with some is car but yeah.
That's true.
We tipped you, though, we tipped you for yours.
Grocery store.
Uh, so we're going to get some more list for questions later on. There were a lot of thoughtful ones posted in the Facebook group. Can't wait to get to those. But real quick, I think we should talk about like this this time last year, our beach trip last year, we were still not We were planning on moving, but we weren't sure if we were going to pull it off, especially our family. You guys were under contract or had already even closed maybe, I guess on the house, and
we were like maybe. And then quickly thereafter we ended up going on our contract on a place. We both moved a week apart from one another, moved to the burbs from the city. And it's been an interesting year, uh, to say the least for our families, as we've adjusted to kind of a new a new way of life in a new place. So I'm just curious, Emily, in particular, what has this past year taught you before we get into like the hardcore money stuff.
Oh, that's a that's a big question. That's a fun question. I think it's taught me resilience and adaptability, and that it's important to look for the best and the good and people and situations even when it's unfamiliar, and that you are out of control in life more than you think, but that that's not a bad thing.
Well, and I think partly what you're referring to, Emily as well, like a tree came crashing throw roof, We've been in a we've got rear ended in a car accident, so we've been displaced out of our home for a couple of months. So it's been for us even more than just moving to a new place. All those other things added in which is made We've gone.
To a lot of and how to usher three kids through a lot of change. And so I think that's just showed us a lot about ourselves and a lot about other people, and how do you just make the best of it even if it's not ideal, and how to be grateful for what things are, even if they're not familiar. I like control. I think I've said it before on this podcast. I really like control. And this has been a year in which I just haven't been in control. But that's been a good thing. I'm also
grateful for where we've landed. It's been good. It's just taught us a.
Lot what's specifically about the move. And so I mean we've I think you know this, but we recorded an entire episode, maybe right after we moved, or maybe right before, talking about just the different reasons how to move and the different factors that we considered. But what about moving to our our little burb just outside of Atlanta. What has made that, I guess worth the move.
Yeah. Space partly. I mean we have a huge yard. Now, we have a driveway for the first time. It is hilarious how much our kids are like, it's a driveway, we can play games a garage.
Like yeah, honestly, I know that I have made fun of garages in the past. I'm like, it's a house for your car, yeah, and like, who's going. But the utility that comes with having a garage, it's incredible. I mean all of the it's it's where you put all the things that you use outside, but you don't necessarily want to soar them. In's side, I'm like, Okay, I guess I've kind of come around, you know, when it comes to garages. But yeah, they're great. All the things
that were where we moved. Yeah, more space, like you said, but just being closer to nature. There's a certain degree of like the neighborhoods and the town encourage family life essentially, Like there's a lot of things that make it I think easier sort of like you're saying, like you're talking about convenience, and it's certainly it's certainly possible to raise
a family in town. But I do think that, at least for us, like there was a mindset shift that when we moved out to the Burbs, we sort of like when we talked about working out, Like when we moved, it was easy for me to make this mental shift of like, oh, Matt is somebody who works out now, but that coincided with a move. So it was like
this physical, tangible change that took place. And I think like the fresh start effect that we talked about with Katie Bill exactly exactly, And I think something is similar when it comes to sort of making some of these what feel like sacrifices at the time, right moving out of a city and having this it's a change of mindset, while there is still sort of an actual change in sort of the amenities or the restaurants or the festivals.
You know, Like it's a lot different taking our kids up to the Square going to a Fourth of July Parade than it is to take them to East Atlanta Village for the Eastlana Strut, right, And we went to both of those through over the past ten years or so. But I guess, Kate, like I'm curious if you have any regrets or anything you miss, specifically from living out here in the burbs as opposed to living in town.
I don't think this is a regret, but I definitely miss the community that we had built over sure fifteen years. I mean that was those were old established relationships, and yeah, we're kind of jumping in in the middle of a lot of old established relationships now and trying to find your way into a comfortable position in those people's worlds is a little bit hard. They've got rhythms, they've got people. They do this every Fourth of July? Do they do
that every Halloween? Like we are having to figure out a lot of stuff sort of from the middle. It feels like, I'm glad we didn't do this five years from now. It would have been even harder, harder, Like.
We're trying to pull it or bust into Jerry's apartment, But Jerry's apartment is other people's lives, and I agree.
That's what it does.
It's hard to be new. I mean, there's just a huge learning curve relationally.
Yeah.
Yeah, and everyone has been so kind. I don't want to I don't want to downplay that at all. Everyone's been so nice. It's just your in a rhythm of doing certain things and you don't always think of that new family down the street, you know, So it does make it it's a little hard for me. I'm not as bold of a person, and so I would kind of rather be invited than like go out and show up at people's houses. But I've got to show up
at some houses. I mean I really have like shown up at some people's houses where I didn't know if I was going to really know anybody. And I'm just gonna see how it goes socially. It can be hard, and you kind of do it like for your kids, like you know, your kids need the friends too, So that's kind of given me confidence to to pour into those relationships and try to make them make the best.
Yeah. Well, the fact is we are closer to a costco, so that does make things slightly more affordable. As we've been able to fully embrace the costco membership.
We're not joking about that it meets and all.
I mean I would again this is something else that made fun of. But now that we live closer and literally there's a costco closer to us than the Aldie by like fifty feet. That's why you got the Kirkland signature tattoo on your lower back. Then I love it. You're all about it now, which I love pretty much. All about it all right?
So I want to talk real quick too about There was a listener question on a recent Ask htm episode and it was just so fun to hear from a listener who his girlfriend was in grad school to become a licensed therapist, and so he was like, has it like messed up your world as much as it is to mess mine up? I gave my best reply to that, talking about have Yeah, it has messed it up, but in a lot of good ways too. So Leslie, she said, how did you know it was the right time to
go back to school and eventually the workforce. You're not in the workforce yet, you're still in school, but next year you're going to start interning, so we're on the precipiciode that and did the ages of your children play a big role? What's that kind of it's been over two years now you've been in school.
What's been like for us?
Well? First, my favorite quote has when Joel looked at me after proofreading like my third paper and was like, you know, I never knew I had so many problems until you started grad school.
But it's big good Chris was bliss.
Yeah, So I mean it's definitely rocked our world. I think again, you know, being new, going back to school, learning anything new, you know, it kind of shows you who you are in a new light as you develop new skills. But I think especially this profession which you're doing so much introspection and internal work. So yeah, it has It's changed us, and it's changed me I think for the better. I think it's helped me feel more steady and have a sense of identity and purpose and
less anxiety. But I'm also specializing in couples and families, so we've talked a lot about our relationship and kind of learned to say, yeah, this is good, but we also long for more. So what does it look like to love each other well? And where do we actually need to grow? What are we not doing well? And that's just a rocky process to be honest and take a good look at yourself and your marriage and what you've created and to call what's good, but to also
push yourself to grow. So it's been really really good work, but it's also been probably an intense is maybe a good word season for us, but good? And then I love the question how did I decide to go back? Yes, my kids' ages had a lot to do with it. We had just I went back when my youngest was one, so I had just finished nursing, and I knew that we were done with having children, and so I kind of felt some freedom to start thinking about what I
wanted to do next. I also knew I generally just loved working and kind of loved the career it had before, and knew that I wanted to go back to school, and this is a direction I was probably going to go, but I didn't actually have courage to do it. It wasn't like my first choice to go back to school. I think the pandemic in which it just took a lot out of our family kind of gave me the courage to say, Okay, I've given a lot to hold our kids together through school and a newborn, what do
I want to do? And then I had another friend who was in her fifties who had just gone back to school for a counseling degree, and it was just such an encouragement to think, you know, like I'm going to do this. There's never a perfect time, but this is what I've wanted to do, and I'm just going to jump off the deep end and do it.
So, yeah, it's been a killer experience for you, but I think it's been good for our family. It's not always easy, right as we're having deeper conversations, harder conversations at times, but it's also been really good, I think for the kids to see you pursue something that you love and something that you're really good at. And I think it's helped you and I connect relationally intellectually in different ways too. So it's yeah, not always easy, like you said, but it's been good.
So quick follow then, and I'm going to kind of jump around a little bit as we've got some of these different questions. But has that changed the dynamic for y'all? So, Emily, you're in school, you're reading a lot more writing, you've got a lot of homework, that kind of stuff. Has that changed the different at home roles? So this kind
of alludes to Jess's question. She wanted to know what do you think about the balance of financial contributions versus the domestic tasks or housework like the mental load of managing a home. The labor is valuable. How do you divide it?
Oh man, that's such a great question because you know, as a family, we definitely value the domestic part of it, even though you're not making money for it. But it's it's really shifted the dynamics, I think majorly in our home because I did even though I was still working
part time, I worked from home. In some years I wasn't working at all, especially when I had newborns, and I took on like a very large share of the domestic tasks and you just kind of were out of you know, you went and worked and did your thing there.
So I think we all took out the garbage and stuff. But yeah, it was definitely doing far yes.
Yeah, and so we've really had to shift, Yeah who does what? And I think, you know, it's not even always this conversation where we had it intentionally on the outset and lived it out. It was just kind of more, you know, maybe things were falling apart or certain chores weren't getting done and I was overwhelmed and we just had to sit down and be like, Okay, here's a problem. How do we fix it? Who who does it make
sense to do what? Okay, so I actually need you to step up more here, and I need to step up more here, and then this is just going to have to go by the wayside. So it's definitely shifted
it for sure. We have a lot more conversations about how to divide it, which is tricky being in school because I don't feel like I can yet justify uh, you know, I'm just spending a lot of money in grad school and not making any yet, and so that's been tricky for me to kind of have to justify taking the grace to need the space and need the help.
Takes more communication too, I think, yeah, for sure. Right although your six figure salary, I know it's coming and that's that's the light of the end of the Yeah, keep keep pushing. And I think we've also been less afraid to hire out a few tasks.
Mowing the lawn. I used to mote a lawn all the time. I don't on the law anymore.
We hired somebody to do that same with a once a month house cleaning like that's it's something. Those are kind of non negotiables at this point, so that we have the freedom to just enjoy our lives a little bit more and enjoy our downtime as supposed to always doing chores. But also I think, yeah, allows us more time for your schoolwork and for hang out with kids, family time stuff like that.
And shout out to extended family. I mean, that's another reason we did move to the Burbs. We're in your family and we have a lot of family help, which really you cannot put a value on. Yeah, it's priceless, true.
Which yeah, fingers well, yeah, we'll go down that path just yet. But I'm curious because you're not in grad school, Like, what are your thoughts on like, basically, you are primarily a mom, you're primarily a homemaker, Like, what are your thoughts like between the balance of obviously the many different roles that women can have.
Yeah, I am at home. I feel like right now my role at home is something I'm really thankful for. It's been a huge year of transition for us, and being home and kind of being flexible and available in all the ways has been great for the transition for our family. I think being a stay at home mom can be such a wonderful, noble, life giving thing. I think it can also be the opposite of that, and so I feel like I kind of do the best
I can to maintain my identity in that. And I think that's what makes it sustainable for.
Me right now, Like finding the balance between you as an individual versus the role that you're playing.
Yeah, I think it could take over and I could just disappear into the work of it. And I think finding within stay at home mom the things that are part of who I am at my core, like doing art alongside my kids, or working in the art and landscaping while they're out there. You know, I enjoy cooking, so even like finding myself a little bit in that. Just I mean, I'm just kind of doing the day
home mom thing my own way. It does not look like Instagram, does not look like right the people around us even sometimes it feels like but it's it's my own version of it. And it's the way that it's sustainable for me is that it just has to it. Just I think it's important for our kids to see our own identity, whether or not that's in your career or just in the things that you love and the things you do around them and prioritize and so yeah, I think I'm just finding my version of it right now.
Totally. Yeah, I love I really like that. I really like thinking through what is it that we're communicating specifically with you being the primary parent at home throughout the day and carpool and all that, But everything we do communicate something to our kids, and I think it's worth thinking through, like, all right, what are we teaching them through this? What are we teaching them by saying no in this case, or what are we teaching them by saying yes in this other way, or just the.
Way they see their mom living their life, Like our house might be messy, but I'm doing making something beautiful or whatever I'm doing, Like they I've got three girls who may go straight into the workforce or maybe a stay at home mom, and I just want them to know that whichever direction they go or their personal identity is going to be a big part of their family culture. And so you can exhibit that in a number of different ways.
Totally, Yeah. I wanted to bring that up cause I think it's awesome that I mean that, y'all, Emily, you and Kate are very different, at least at this snapshot, at this point in time, Like I almost wish that like Joel was a stale home dad and like I was the one that worked or something like that, to be able to provide some of the variety, because I think the variety and seeing that there's a lot of folks out there doing different things but you can still do it well, live a great life and do well
from a financial standpoint as well, that all of that's possible. It may not look exactly like you said, like some folks lifestyle and Instagram. You may not be able to afford every single thing that you want. There are going to be sacrifice as often if you only have a single partner that's working, But that doesn't mean it's not possible.
Yeah, all right, so you mentioned money there. We've got some more money questions lined up from listeners. We'll get to a bunch of those. We'll get to that right after this.
All right, we are back and we're gonna kind of dive it more into We've been talking more about like life and living, which I think is a good thing, but we certainly want to make sure that we're tackling some of the specific money questions that listeners had, and so let's get straight to it. H Jessica, she asked. She said, what's one budgeting or money saving idea that you had to talk your husband out of? Or vice versa. I guess something maybe that you had to talk us
into or vice versa. What's something that we had to talk you out of?
Yeah, this way? Do you read it?
Which way do you think she's asking it?
I don't know, but I read it. Do I have to talk to you out of stuff? Or do you have to talk me out of stuff? And generally Matt has to talk me out of stuff.
I think of spending money or talk you out of different ways to save money.
Well, that's what I was trying to think through because it's it's sometimes financially financially related, but it's some it's oftentimes just like something big and giant that our family doesn't need to.
Take on, like a expense, or like a farm, like a farm in the book.
Yeah, like do we need which we need to fence in our entire front yard so I can grow like corn and oakrah without the deer eating it? Like maybe I have a whole spreadsheet about that. Maybe I do, And maybe Matt said no, but it's no, he would never say no. But It was a long conversation about like what makes the most sense for us to do, and it it wasn't uh that.
So you're saying then that I am talking you out of spending money.
Yes, but I don't think it really comes down to money. I think it just comes down to like that just isn't practical that just like you dreamed about it and thought about for too long one day and it got too big and it's too much to ask of our family, like financially part of it, but also just farming.
I get it. Yeah, Emily, is there something that Joel's like? I feel like maybe this one, this question might be geared more towards because Joel is like the ultra Google borderline cheap when it comes to the different hoops that he's willing to make his family jump through, specifically you, I am sitting here.
This question immediately made me think in all seriousness, when we were pregnant with our first child, Joel was like, what was any and natal nurse practitioner? She can do this at home, right, Like, we don't need to go to the hospital. We can save a lot of money if your mom just comes in and helps you have a baby, Like that is not how this works. You know, in general, Joel is an idea machine for sure. I think there are a million ideas money same ideas that
go through his head every day. Any verbally processes most of them.
I was going to say, you don't even hear all of them. I know.
That's the scary thing. And I think, my usual what do I have to you know, I don't talk him in or out of it. I think I more just ask reflective questions, typically, which is how much time is that going to take, like a.
Real counselor don't provide the answer, let him discover the answer on the zone.
Let's reflect. Do you have time for this? You know, I'm thinking of this.
Recent jedi now at this point he doesn't even know. Yeah.
I mean, I'm generally up for it. Like I he's great at saving money and being free girl and getting creative. I just kind of know my boundaries, like we have a limited amount of time and I have a limited amount of patients. Can it fit within that? If so, great, go for it. You know, Like he wanted a phone upgrade and like bought an iPhone to trade it in for an Android that was cheaper, and I don't even know, but I was like, literally.
Bought one on Facebook Marketplace.
I talked about that because Google had such a good trade in and I did it.
But I know you were a little skeptical.
Yeah, but I was like, look, I need a new phone, like can you make this happen? And can you do this quickly? And so I think that's more I we talk about it because there's a lot of ideas that fly through our house.
Ye all, was there a recent fight because the next question, this one is from JJ, what's the largest monetary decision that you and your spouse disagreed on? How did it resolve? So basically they're looking for the dirt.
No, we got a lot of diner other.
Than the pregnancy, which, by the way, having had to pay cash out of pocket, that's I mean. We were literally talking through different ways we could have a baby on the chee you should have had, Emily's mom is what you should have had.
Probably you heard my mom was like, no way, will I ever delivered your child?
But yeah, like, aside from some of the smaller things, was there a big one where y'all were at odds.
Kay, you know, Kate and I were even talking about this, it's that's such a great question, and yes, we're definitely at odds. To be honest, I feel like the bigger things are easy to agree on, like how we're going to invest money or the ways we want to save, or do we renovate or buy a house or are those big things we've been on the same page. It's the small things that I think we get tripped up on, like do our kids need a new backpack every school year?
You know, I want them to get one, and Jill like, no, they don't need one out of principle, work just fine, Yeah, exactly, And so it's.
This tells those other kids to get off my lawn.
It's the smaller things that I think kinda trip us up at times that we tend to get stuck on.
Yeah, I think it's true.
And I think it's a mental blockade for me that leads to those discussions oftentimes, and usually it's something I just have to get over and be like, yeah, you're right.
Well, and I think that's pretty common. I mean, life really is made up of small moments rather than the large ones, which is true financially, it's all the small decisions you're continually making.
Yeah, that could be tricky for sure. Okay, is one come to mind as far as disagreement that we had. We are in perfect harmony and we are in unison when it comes to how it is we spent except for the fence.
Fence, see except for the farm in the back.
Can you cage match it inside of that? Okrah? Growing fence is my question? So you I mean you literally you brought that up and literally that probably is one of the bigger disagreements that we've had. And not unlike Emily. It comes down to think asking some of those questions.
And it's not just addressing the fence. It's like where you know, you ask the questions to get to what's underneath that, but kind of asking those questions, figuring out what's practical and honestly, I think figuring out like what the trade offs are going to be, because it's like, Okay, we can figure we can decide that, like this is something that we prioritize, But what does this mean for us? Not just now, but what does this mean for us for instance down the road if we keep dumping that's
negative connotation, I want to say dumping. If we keep spending money on you know, on our current home. What does that mean for our ability to potentially move to a home that has a room for each one of our kids, which might be nice in a couple of years. That kind of thing. I think those are the sort of concessions that you make when you buy things now, and comes down to asking some of those questions, trying to figure out what is it that ultimately want?
Right, Yeah, I mean really, the disagreement was not a financial one. The disagreement was an emotional one, where like I had pictured this whole thing it was going to be beautiful and wonderful, and the finances of it didn't make sense and the brass tacks of it didn't make sense, but emotionally, I was really excited about it. And so having a super practical conversation about something I'm like kind of emotionally swept up in. It's just a kind of recipe for disaster, is sort of how I see it.
So I don't really know how better we could have resolved it, Like we just had to keep talking about it, and I had to kind of like come down off
my mountain a little bit. But it was, Yeah, it was just an emotional thing, and I feel like a lot of our conversations with finances, we are able to keep the emotion out of the conversations because things are pretty labeled and numbered at our house and this was just not And so it did show us why it is so helpful for us to have most things in little boxes, because this one thing wasn't in a box, and it was like a big conversation.
Sure. Yeah. Basically what we're talking about is budgeting. And so at the beginning of this year, we sat down and we decided, Okay, how much money are we going to spend this year on the house, And not only how much money, but what specifically is that money going to go towards, like what projects? And like you said, this was new and not included on that and doesn't mean we're not necessarily going to consider in the future, but for this year, it's like, Okay, we're kind of
at our limit. We're we're tapped out regarding how much money we just proactively decided that we were going to spend this year. So, I mean, we're talking basically about sticking to a budget, not necessarily. I'm not a dream killer as well, Like that's not my intention. The intention is to say, like a trainer would right, like a physical coach, like a coach or any kind of coach. It's like, hey, this is something that we said was important to us, that we said, this is what we're
going to do. Can we do that? You know? Is this something that we can push off to next year and maybe you know what boom, nothing like rises to the top of the top of the pile for next year and it's something that we knock out at the very beginning.
But Oka Garden twenty twenty four I'm talking about that's the that's the real campaign that everyone wants to see, which.
I would love to say, I wish you could see the all mixed front yard on a budget. They've done a beautiful job. It's amazing a lot with a little for sure. Yeah, it looks so good because they are intentional and planned it out and thank you are good at executing every bit of.
That in the shop like pros so one for the danyg deer.
Dear except for the deer.
Do any listeners have advice on deer? That's what we need.
Oh, we've done, We've done all the things, Kate, Just like, okay, I'm not going to start asking you to pee into the picture and then go out there and creating an invisible boundary. But we're maybe I'm.
Going to kind of create a predator boundary.
I think a.
Bazooka is one possible, but you might have run into other troubles if you do that. H Yeah, with that, all right, let's talk about younger us for a second. Man, the good old days right there, These are the good old days right now. But Kathy wants to know, how do you adjust to handling finances together after you get married and you guys are coming up on your fifteenth what are you anniversaries are? Or sixteen sixteenth, sixteen? You just have fifteen and we're coming up on our thirteenth.
So yeah, getting married, adjusting finances as you come together.
And you got that, well, I came to our marriage with no money and no job, so we had to really quickly figure out how we were going to feed two people and pay for bills and everything on one.
A very small minimum wage.
Salary graphic designers salary.
In some ways, I'll say, is good.
Absolutely right, it was really good.
And like, on one hand, it sounds really intimidating, but it's also man, is it easier to do that when you don't have habits or bad habits or poor spending patterns ingrained where you're trying to hit reset on those things. Because I think a lot of folks are finding themselves as single individuals where they're working for maybe a decade, earning a pretty good salary. They're able to do whatever
it is that they want with their money. Taking that to a relationship trying to figure out what to do that was more kind of y'all y'all situation a little bit. It's the Yeah, I think that you're right.
The older you get, the more you are self reliant, the harder ways to combine and then and to merge everything together. We were still relatively young, making relatively little, and so it made it easier, I think in a lot of ways for us to just be like, all right, we're putting all the one pot and we're doing this together.
But I do see how it's a different thing if you're getting married in your mid to late thirties or forty something like that, and you're like, I've I've got my own stuff, i've got my own way of living, I've got my own budget, and I don't necessarily I love you and want to live together, but I don't necessarily want everything to be under one roof money wise, I think I get where people are coming from on.
That, for sure. I think for us we didn't because we weren't in that scenario. We went to a weekend Dave Ramsey seminar and got some basic budget tips from that, and.
Well that's all. Yeah, at the time, as far as I knew, he was the only guy out there talking about personal finances, and I'd run across him in the thought, all right, just from a general not getting into debt or at least getting out of debt, and we were in a fortunate position. You now, now you're like the beneversion of Dave. Yes, I don't at all regret having found my way into the personal finance space via Dave Ramsey.
No, I think it was a great foundation, a.
Lot of amazing stuff for a lot of people, specifically getting out of debt. But beyond that, yeah, obviously we take a more a more nuanced approach refleshiable tactics after that.
Sure, Yeah, even then, I think there were things that we weren't we weren't totally iron board with. We never did like cash an enveloped situation because Matt was always about like credit card perk points.
I mean, so we were.
Doing that way back then. But we had a we had a budget from early on how we were gonna live and eat. And I learned really quick how to cook. We never eat out like it was. It was a like trial by fire way of learning to budget and live together and not have any money all at once.
Yeah, And I think we learned together with the fortunate position we found ourselves in.
Yep. What I would say about confining finances that I feel like we're still learning because I think it gets it's different in every season as you have more money or less money, or children and things. And what I would say to anyone who's starting out combining finances is self awareness is so helpful because money, there's just so much value we place on money that we're sometimes not even aware of. You know, what did it represent to you as a kid, did you have it, did you
not have it? How did your parents spend it? When you see your partner spend it in a way differently, what emotions does that bring up? Does it make you happy or scared? Like I just think self awareness of knowing what money represents and what you want to do with your money is so important, and just to remember that while the end goal is important, the process of how you get there as a couple really like seals the deal. And so how do you learn to talk to each other? How do you learn to listen to
your partner with their financial concerns? Can you have empathy and understand and can you talk out the importance? And it's just a slow process. We're still doing it. I mean, you don't arrive I think the smooth joined finances ever, you know, even if you're wealthy. So just learning how to process well and hear your partner and know yourself I think is super important. Yeah.
I don't want anyone to think that there's like something you figure out when you first get married and then you're.
Like set, You're set. Yeah, no, exactly. It is a problem. Like I'm still fighting, not fighting, but having disagreements over whether it's how much money we're going to spend on the yard, how much we're going to spend on kids' backpacks, these types of things. And I think what's at the center of that is communication as asks or says discuss financial communication with your spouse how involved is she in
the daily, monthly, yearly finances? And she goes on, if something happened to you, would she easily be able to pay bills, access accounts, understand the investments. Do you discuss financial goals both long term and short term? Does you know your asset allocations? How often y'all talk about these types of things asides? So far we've talked about I guess situations that arise because of life, right, like, okay, kids are going back to school. What does that look
like as far as getting a backpack? But are y'all proactively talking about things like if you went to a marriage and finances conference, they might say, talk about these these types of things.
How often are y'all doing that? That's a good question. I think this made me think a couple of things. It made me think, one, I need to probably do a create something to where if something happened to me, you have all of the account logins, passwords, and here's where all the accounts is.
And and this was a humbling question because like for the past six months, I've been like, you know, if you die, there's like a half of our money. I'm not gonna know where it is. Or what to do with it.
Like we've literally been talking about my death frequently.
It's a great Now.
They coming up, which like how much is that for you? And so I will say this, like we have all of the proper like, uh, we have life insurance, right, we have enough an event where I would feel some of that, Yeah, you know some of that. But I'm also like I need I need to do a better job and really accumulate everything in one place for you.
Yeah, probably because you do take over most of the finances. I mean I'm not in it, but I will say I know every investment that you are in. I mean we discussed every investment or rental properties or whatever.
That looks like you don't know about the goal that Joel has buried different locations in the backyard or she knows. I mean I know where that is. But right right, well you also should know.
Okay, I'll be watching your life insurance those two. Yeah, So I think it's they're more casual conversations. This is where I actually love that we have because all mixes to do it different than the large guards. This is great to have do different perspectives. I feel like we don't necessarily have it.
I also need that document.
I mean yeah, unfortunately, like it's in a similar way like I think you I mean you correct me. I'll let you talk that homework. You say it homework by the way, for the two of us, you know where everything is.
I know where all our accounts. I know the document that all of our account information is on and all of our password information is on. And so I was thinking through after I read this question, like how would I what would I do in this situation? And I think I could just go through that document probably get to everywhere I needed to get. And I do know where our investments are. I'm pretty sure I know where all of the investment money goes. But it would be good to have that document for sure.
Yeah, well it exists, but we just haven't. I guess when we talk about it. So like she was asking about like the you know, she's essentially asking about the regularity, and from a daily expending kind of standpoint, I feel like every week, ideally like three times a month, that the kind of thing I update to you. And I'm like, all right, this is I get a perfect month.
I guess I Oh, yeah, I was gonna say, I think I get updated about once a month, where are where we are in our grocery about I feel like that's the first update that I.
Because that's one that you have because I do our day to.
Day spending exactly. I buy all the things that we need for the kids and all of the groceries, and then you pay all the bills and stuff like that. So that's our breakdown.
Yeah. But then at the end of the month, I always like review with you. I'm like, hey, this is kind of where we ended up. This is how much we went over, this is how much under we were. I'll do like a net worth update that kind of thing. So I guess it's always verbal though, like we never sit down and I don't like show you the spreadsheets.
I mean I can access it if I wanted.
To, and you know what, you know it's there.
But it's really complicated, y'all. Yes, yeah, it's very complicated.
So Matt doesn't do anything halfway. Maybe some folks call it like the oh crap folder or something like that, but basically, if something were to happen, something that literally lists it all out, how much is in each account, how to access what it's for.
We all be doing it now when we get back.
From the whole episode on this after we.
After you'll write those up, yeah.
Exactly, folder.
Yeah, and you got to have some of those other things in place, like life insurance and and you know where the money's at, and know you know the rental properties we have and you know, uh, you know where our money is at investigt Vanguard Fidelity.
Right.
Uh, no shock to anybody who listens to the show. But it's it's important to have all that outlined in documents so that it's easy because even you leave behind a lot of turmoil if if you leave this mortal coil, right, and so you have to make sure that your significant other is prepared. But let's start about goal setting. And she wants to know how do y'all decide how much to save each year as a couple. How do you navigate which fun and or big purchases to put that money towards.
We have an annual budget meeting and review everything from the previous year, set goals, not just financial goals, but also lifestyle goals for the next year at that meeting. So, but because our income is variable, we don't know going into that meeting, what if there's going to be a surplus, what is the surplus going to be?
So this has always been the case.
This has always been our think pretty.
Much since the very beginning. We've never had a set income for the year, so we've we prioritize and we know that, hey, we want to make sure that we're.
At least But we even discussed, like, I think we're going to spend a little more on grocery this year, So that's going to take our monthly budget for grocery a little bit higher. But we also set goals for our travel and lifestyle. We are naturally frugal, and so we have pushed ourselves to spend a little more on fun things like kids' activities or extracurriculars for them, or a trip for our family. So we've had to push
ourselves on those goals a little bit. But because we talked about them in the beginning of the year, that money goes in, a certain amount goes in monthly, and by the time that arrives, it's not a big hit. So we do a lot of goal setting.
Yeah, atter like those are the savings buckets or the sinking funds. But what's interesting though, it's like what you literally are talking about ways for us to spend our money, which is a shift because I mean originally when we first got married, it was more about how much can we set aside and invest and whatever it is that
you measure, you're going to see that improve. And so what we found was that over time, especially as our kids have gotten older, that we needed to take a more intentional step, not in how much we were saving and investing, because we were doing a very good job of that, because that is very quantifiable, but what we weren't doing is finding ways to prioritize lifestyle, which is what the word you kept saying there, Like it comes down it comes back to what are the different experiences,
What do we want our kids to be exposed to, what by the time they leave our house, what kind of things do we want to have done. So it's kind of essentially like almost like planning backwards to a certain extent, and that didn't necessarily come natural. So for us, it's been over the past two or three years it's thinking through what do we want to do as a
family together. And we've been fortunate enough to still be able to save and invest a ton for the future and not having to worry about that while starting to loosen the ratchet a little bit when it comes to spending and giving ourselves permission to spend in some of those ways that are important to us.
Yeah, that's like lifestyle optimization coming to the forefront, which even comes down to how we schedule our work weeks and what that looks like and are we working too much, are we taking enough breaks? Or in the overall fifty two week spectrum, but also in the five day a week spectrum, do both of those look the way we
want them to look? And money plays a part in that in some of those discussions, right, because you can work more and you can dial up an income you know, you can work as much as as much as you want and really try to ratchet that up. Or you can say, wait, that's probably not the thing I want to optimize for the most anymore, and there are other more important things that I want to achieve or ways
I want my life to look more balanced. But do you have any thoughts on that question about yeah, big purchases, where do we like to allocate money?
So this is feels like a trickier question because we don't have black and white goals. Honestly, I think we've kind of just had goals we've agreed on in general, which is we wanted to had an emergency fund, we wanted to have enough cash flow to not feel stress. And then there are things I think we committed to
at the time, like school. We know, you know, school was worth it, and that was a goal that we're putting things aside for your school grads scht my school, sorry, my grad school particularly.
Not flight school for your eight year old.
Or right exactly exactly. And I think in general we have similarities that help. Like we love to travel, we like vacation. That's pretty easy for us to spend on that, or frugal when it comes to maybe clothes or shopping,
so that's easier as well. I think when it comes to goals and being on the same page for us, a number and a budget doesn't always settle the conversation, probably because we tend to be a bit more emotional or I definitely am more emotional, and so the meaning behind it is usually something I always have to talk through. So if something comes up or pops up that you want or that I want, I think it's a conversation about yeah, it's value and what it means and do
we have the money, does it stress other things? Is it okay? Is it worth it?
Even if we have the money, is that something that we value to put the money towards.
Ye?
Right, yeah.
Can we wrestle with that internally individually but also together as a couple.
Yeah, So we're taught. I mean so I think. I guess it's hard to talk about it. Are hard to know how to share because it's actually not super black and white. Yeah, And it's just more about the conversation and the moment in the season of life.
I think too.
That's where something Getting the big things right means you don't have to stress about the small stuff as well. We do think about it in terms of like doesn't align with our values, but not necessarily like oh can we afford to buy plane tickets to Scotland? And is
how expensive can we really afford this trip? We don't have to ask that question because we have one car, it's older, blah blah blah, whatever the like, We've purposely kept our mortgage, you know, far below what most people would say you can afford, right, And I think when you do that, then those smaller things like we have a large enough cushion where we can be like, yeah, let's pounce on that. That sounds like fun. We have a
big almost like an opportunity fund. It's how I think of it, and when opportunity comes along, we can pounce as something really cool if you and I both agree and we think it's worth it. So I think of that as kind of like a fun approach to money. As opposed we're less rigid in our budgeting like you guys.
But I think that's a part of what Gen's or is it Gin or Anna? I mean is asking like how because you said if you agree, right, and so I think that's really what she's getting at. How do you decide if you agree? Because because on one hand, you might say, yeah, heck yeah, I want to go to Scotland. That's ands I do too, Like that sounds like a lot of fun. But Emily might be like, well,
doesn't really sound like something I want to do. So I guess I'm gonna maybe Anna isn't asking this, but I'm going to dig further, like, how do you decide if you disagree? Yeah?
What if you evaluate differently?
Yeah? What if you value it differently?
I think if we kept budding heads over something and I said, listen, travels really important to me, and she says it's not to me. We would probably diverge in some ways, and I might say, cool, well, then I'm going to find a way to pull this off with a buddy or something like that. Or if you said, listen, this other thing over here is really important to me
and I said I don't value that. That's okay for partners to value different things, but you just have to make sure that both it equal access to be able to pursue those things they love. Matt, I notice you haven't been crafting nearly as much as Kate on this trip. You don't care about it as much the same as that you but you appreciate I think her crafting this, and you don't mind her splurging in that way. I think the same would be true of us. Like we do share a lot in common, we have a lot
of things. But or even something you're willing to go to a concert with me, maybe let's say that you don't care about as much and you're like, it's yeah, it's worth it because I want to do that with you, even though that's not necessarily the thing I would choose to do totally.
That's true. I mean this is such a great question because I think this is at the heart of so much conflict about money as we value different things, and I think what we're saying is there a different ways to settle that. And I think there are times when it really is a budget, like you just need three hundred dollars to spend every month that maybe the other person just doesn't have an opinion on and it might be considered luxury to them but necessity to you. And
that's how you decide that. And I think there's actually seasons in our marriage when we've done that, especially when we were newly married and money was tighter, and I mean we really started out with nothing. That was actually more of a way we handled it. I think now as we've learned each other a little even more intuitively and we understand the values more like it's sometimes just more conversation. This is important to me. Can we make room for this? Can we not make room for this?
But I think it's a lot of conversations.
Yeah, well, okay, so I want to jump real quick then, because Lauren, she basically had a question that was right in line with it, Like she was essentially asking about luxury spending. I'm not going to read her whole question, but she was like, manicures, massages, different things like this that your partner or your spouse might think is a
total waste of money. How you justify that? And what you said is right, I mean hit the nail around on the head, which I think is kind of having like a splurge account, some sort of fund that gets funded, like you said, Joel, that gets equal access. But you're just not going to agree necessarily that that should be
how the other person spends money. But you should respect them enough to say, well, I love you, and even though I don't care for those things, you should have the freedom and feel told not guilty to be able to pursue those things. Do you all think that that's the answer is to have? Obviously is it can't be something that's like illegal, like there aren't illicit things that are taking place that this person is buying where it's
secretive and unhealthy in that way. But when it comes to what it is that you value, do you think that that's a good solution.
Yes, yeah, I think it is great.
We have separate categories that get funded every month, and we do not, for the most part, discuss any of those purchases before we make them. Yeah, so because some of those purchases are like, it's weird. It's weird stuff that I bought and I just wanted to try out, and Matt does talk about it.
Modgpodge formula that waterproof.
Can you believe it?
It is literally?
Okay, I'm excited because a perfect example is literally mogepodge and you painting with the kids. What are they like oysters? And while you're doing that, I get up early and I go and work out at the local CrossFit gym and pay twenty bucks for one workout.
Yeah, we're not going to talk about either one of these things, which.
Which is exactly like you're not necessarily in agreement that that's a wise use of my money and vice versa. But we also have enough respect and love each other enough and we know that that fuels something like that's good for us in different ways.
And I just want to remember I yes, and I think it sounds exhausting to talk through all those little things. So if it is below a certain amount, like I just it comes out of this category that's just labeled Kate, and I just send when I send over the numbers monthly to Matt, I just say this comes out of Kate. This comes out of Matt.
It's like it's on a card that you keep up.
It's on a card.
Is that way if you need to make a return or if it's not something like.
I don't see it, don't discuss return.
We don't talk about it. It's a These are day to day expenses and at the end of the month or as we're getting close to the end of the month, you just send me how much of that payment that you made to that card that's that then gets deducted from your Splurge account. So yes, we don't call it as slurg account. We just call them like personal accounts, like there's a Kate account. And these aren't act separate accounts. They're just buckets.
They're buckets within an account, and that's where like if I get my hair done, that's where it comes out, or if I buy clothes for the kids.
I'm the one that got a massage. I didn't tell you that. You didn't while I was visiting the folks.
That's something I wanted more to do more upsizes. I love getting massaged, but I do it like once a year, sad at least it's something I need to increase in my life.
So just can the therapist in me say one thing? Oh yeah, so I think that is I think that's a great solution. I'm actually just thinking of other practical solutions. I've heard couples who they're in charge of certain categories like one's grocery, one's home care. And if you save money, whatever money you save budgeted, that goes into your personal account. So it's like motivation, like the incentive. Yeah, there's incentive then to actually earn money within your own budget. So
I think there's a lot of creative ways to do it. Again, I just want to emphasize that there's not necessarily a right way. I think it really is about the process. If you are fighting over the value of things, I think you got to sit down and talk about what it means to you and how you're going to solve the solution. Now, what that looks like. These are great practical ideas on what that looks like. And like, yeah, the conversation may be exhausting for some, it's not exhausting
for us, you know. So I think it just really depends on how you're built. But I think knowing your partner and knowing what you value and having some practical ideas like this, you know, then you can make your own recipe for what that needs to look like.
That's right, all right, I feel like we're going a little bit long, but we do have a few more questions we want to get to you from listeners. Specifically, we're going to talk about like food, favorite meals, favorite stores. We'll get to all of those right after this. All right, we're back.
We're still having a conversation at the beach about money and lots of other things with our better halves today on the show. And this is just one of the best episodes to record every single year, and I hope listeners enjoy it as much as we do getting to actually have this conversation. But let's make this more of a lightning round. We've got some questions that maybe don't involve quite as much.
Just like back about it longer, says the lady who charges by the hour, right, exactly exactly, Just come back next week. We'll fix it by that.
On sure, let's go to one from Jen. She wants to know what are your absolute go to meals that make all members of your household happy.
Okay, it's the food wizard. She should answer every food question. She's a genius.
Our kids love fried rice, which is a combination of rice and all of our leftovers, so that's always a win. They also love when Matt cooks salmon.
Oh, crispy salmon on the griddle.
Salmon, it is always a hit. Or if you smoke any kind of meat, they love that too. Which but we turn into like tacos or have with you know, mac and cheese and broccoli or something. Everybody likes all those meals. I get weird sometimes and I push my family to eat weird things, but those are all easy.
Current And I'll also say our kids tend to be very adventurous eaters. I think a lot of folks listening are like salmon. Your kids like crispy, Like what does that even mean?
I like the skin on the backs.
So the trick is, we get the big fresh filet from Aldi, never been frozen, and you get that griddle, take it outside because it's gonna smell. You get it screaming hot, put the hot oil on there, and salt the skin, put its skin side down and let it just go and that skin gets all crispy. It's like a potato chip.
Also, Matt pitched it to them like potato chips, and so that's what they think it tastes like, and that's part of why they love it.
That's the winter.
Now you're starting to sound like our buddy Franky from Strugglemeals over there, just given recipes on the Yeah, all right, and what's that?
Okay?
The go to the meal our kids love is probably, to our ever loving shame, it's this spaghetti that my grand's just resp me from my grandma. And yeah, it's brown.
It's brown.
It's like it's from the active orange.
Look right, is what I would say. That's how I classify it. And it's not nice, but it's it's made from canned soups and stuff like that. But our kids love it. They love it, and so I grew up eating it my kids.
I just want to make not that I eat it. I am having a Saladin, yes, but when I'm in class, are gone. That's what you cook for them, and they love that chicken pot pie. I have a very simple chicken pot pie recipe and make a lot. I am not a food wizard. Actually, pretty much all I know I've learned from Kate, Like, Kate, what are you making for dinner? Tell me how to make it. That's what we're having tonight.
Well, they love mac and cheese. To make mac and cheese, a lot of mac and cheese goes.
With everything, right, Kate, Kate tell me that one too.
All right, Nina has a couple of questions. She says, what's your favorite store to shop? And where do you get your haircut? How much would you pay for one?
Uh?
You know.
One of the number one perks. But moving to the Burbs is affordable haircuts. I found. Well, no, jo I go to the same place. Joel's mom goes to that and okay, it goes too because she can cut and color hair for under one hundred dollars.
So I did you not?
Yeah, which is insane? Under is it? No? No? I think it's like maybe when I just get it cut, it's still maybe it's color.
I mean you're talking like, yeah, but you can you're probably Cheryl hook cut. Well, it's so you're paying four to five times.
Oh yeah, it's so cheap that we told our friends in the city who now trap out to the Burbs to get their hair cut. Lisa's shout out to Lisa.
Don't we're not going to share her number because right, yeah, we don't want to see her rates go up. We want her to be paid competitively. What she's she's like your dentist. Yeah, you know we talked about on the show. I edited that out so that well, I didn't want it to sayd like I was disparaging his office, that kind of thing. So yeah, springs coming out of the chair as well. Exactly okay, but so real quick lightning
a round. You have a favorite store, she was asking about favorite shop, favorite store.
I shop a lot of secondhand stores, a lot of thrift stores, a lot of antique stores. Most of my clothes are from the thrift store. And I do not hesitate to tell people all the time that's where I got my clothes. But I just love seeing people's old stuff. I think it's so interesting. I really don't like going to store and spending a whole lot of money on I'll do that maybe a couple of times a year. I'll buy, like a new dresser, nice jeans, but I will say the last nice dress and jeans I got.
We're at a good will near my house. People in the burbs are just putting stuff in the thirst store with tags on them, tags.
On them getting the good stuff.
Kate is also a thrift store wizard, so she comes home with all kinds of good mine.
It's just a wizard.
She is a wizard a lot to get into the bottom line, is a wizard.
Okay, so stores, you know, I'm gonna be honest. I'm not a huge shopper, so I think when I would you say that.
Joel does more of the household one of the grocery store. It is something to share with. Yes, yes, my mom loves shopping.
If I caught my mom, I guarantee you she's either at home just got home from a shopping trip, or she's at the store shopping. So like, I inherited this gene and I tried to, uh, I don't downplay it because my mom loves shopping.
So oftentimes I'll be like, Joel, I want these kind of shoes. They're kind of expensive. Here's a picture of them. You know, can you find them in Joel? Like, I honestly think you buy all my shoes. Like I cannot think of the last time I actually went shopping for shoes because you find them all. Yeah, this is what I want. Go find it and he and he does.
I feel more like I'm like a dog chased it for a b.
He's a shoe wizard.
I can be a.
Personal shopper and this might be a side hustle.
You really could. Yeah, so you know, I'm more intend to like when I'm out, Like I think if a family trip. I was out shopping with your mom and we ran into this little boutique and I bought like four things, which I usually don't do, but now like I've worn those four things all summer, Like I tend to buy things that I like that I will just swear a lot that I can. Yeah, experts generally. Sorry, I wish I was more helpful with specifics, but it's all good.
Target probably is another go to if it's like, eh, where else are we going?
It's just quick. I mean, it's just easy. You can get everything a one stop And.
I love Costco, but I refuse to wear any clothing on him from Costco. Sorry, sorry, guys, Like.
It's just I have a pair of sandals.
Yeah, most of the clothing like it's just sorry, it's just for doesn't quite do it for they it doesn't fit me have a butting sense of style. Let's keep moving U. Dan basically asked, like, and him and his wife, they're thinking about having kids soon. They're trying to find that balance between saving a ton of money now, like saving and investing and getting ahead with their finances, versus thinking, we're about to have kids, we should splurge a little bit,
go on trips. How do you think he should approach that whole, that dichotomy? Essentially, Emily, you have any thoughts as a mother of three, I.
Think it's just it's both, you know, I think it's easy to think of your life as before and after with kids, but it's it's not true, Like they're not the end all of everything. And so I would say, like, if are there smaller trips that you could take that allow you still to save some but also to go on a trip, and it's just all are nothing, especially
when you think about throwing kids to the mix. Just isn't I would just think more broadly, I guess, is what I'm saying, So take the small trips, make the memories, because it's so true you don't get that time back without kids, But you also need to save some for kids as well.
Yeah, the power of compounding returns. Like when I look back, I do not regret having saved and invested as aggressively as we did because of the options that it now affords us. Now, I mean true, but you agree.
But that being said, we went on some predy epic trips.
Right, you know they're kids that are huge. I mean we still talk about those trips. I think those were a foundational we did.
We try to do them on a dime and like whether it was a baby moon kind of kind of trip where it's like we're staying within the state but we're cool that we haven't explored yet, and we're getting like one of the cheapest per night places we can find, and we're driving, which means no airfare all that kind of stuff, or we're getting a lot of ways you can cut the costs. Yeah, yeah, I mean I talked
about our thirteenth anniversary trip. It's gonna be to New York City and Southwest points like for the wind to book both flights. Right, So those are the kind of things where I think there's ways to do it, ways to skin the cat without like foregoing not maxing out the wroth or something because you're like, let's let's have more experiences before the baby comes, or like you I think you really can do both for sure, Like you.
Should probably think more in that mindset, like you're not going to do one all the way and you're not gonna do the other one all the way. But the true answer is probably somewhere in the middle. But where exactly you're going to fall in the middle comes down to Dan and his wife and what's important to them and.
Helps you think creatively, I mean black and white thinking and either thinking just like snuffs out creativity, So get creative balance.
I mean yeah, like just going into having kids with your relationship and a balanced oh yeah, where you guys are both feeling good relational, Like if you have done nothing but save money and sit at home and then you have kids, like one of you could could potentially be resentful in that scenario. And if all you've done is travel and you go into having a kid with no money, that could be really stressful for one person in that scenario.
So it depends on the company.
I really think that the balance and the health of the relationship whatever it looks like for you guys to build health in your relationship before you have kids. If that's travel great, If it's not, that's okay. Just because everyone else baby means doesn't mean you have to like whatever you need to do to feel on the same page as your partner is the right thing to do.
Yeah, I think sometimes loving money is the answer to everything. Like we think that from a political perspective too, right, it's like, oh, funnel more money to the schools, that'll make them better, And it doesn't always pan out like that, and in fact, that's the obays true so much of the time.
Yeah.
Yeah, And so if we can do it thoughtfully, spend the money thoughtfully, then I think can go a long way, and then we have enough hopefully to invest and prepare for that future kid as well.
But yeah, I would say maybe do fully fund an emergency fund. Oh yeah, if you're like, make sure that that's funded.
Yeah, we're not advocating for yolo spend all the money you've got now in order to get the memories in because definitely don't do it if you're going into debt, right, But.
No, yeah, definitely not. And I mean, babies can end up costing a lot, as we have personally found out, so having that emergency fund there is good. It doesn't mean you save every cent, but it does mean that you have that cushion behind you.
Totally okay.
On the kiddo note, Susan says, how do you decide how much detail to share with your children about your finances? Kate, you want to start this one off?
Sure?
I mean we talk about money a lot with our kids. It's small casual conversations. It's not hard numbers like this, how much the house costs? You know they're going to ask that. We're not going to say.
They do ask that the older they get their curious.
But you could tell them one hundred dollars and they'd be like whoa. Yeah. So we don't talk about the numbers as much on big things like that. But they are handling money at the ages that they are, and they have little, little amounts of money to their name, and so we are running through scenarios with them as
they decide to spend it or not spend it. And I think just small casual conversations that aren't loaded with emotion is a great way to introduce them to money in a like, I guess, a balanced, easy way that isn't Yeah, loaded with a lot of meaning or weight behind those conversations, and they overhear us have conversations too, like if we're comparing gut or cleaning quotes, like they're listening to us talk through the pros and cons of the different options and what they're going to do, and
they're listening to us have conversations that are also not loaded with emotion, and sometimes do have a little piece of that where they hear us disagree. So I think all of all that to say, like they're part of the ongoing conversation of money in our house. It's not like pervasive, but it comes up a couple times a week and they hear it and or they're part of it,
or they ask questions. So I just want them to not feel like it's this totally separate thing from life where they like handle all of this in uh secrecy or yeah, yeah, like it's part of everything we decide to do.
Yeah, I think totally.
At least me, growing up, the conversations were typically fraught around money. There's a lot of emotion, and it was also like when you're not supposed to hear it, and so when I heard it, it was super emotional and that wasn't necessarily the best the best thing for the way for a kid to get initiated into money convos. So yeah, taking the emotion out of it, but also making it normal every day I think is really important.
Where Evy was telling me, your oldest was telling me today, like she made seven bucks for doing something to your rug or somebody fixed her.
Yeah, got braided tassels on her rug, and that little robot vacuum keeps unbraiding them. And so I stupidly was like, you can have a dollar for every one of those that you fix, and then she fixed seven of them. I was like, okay, well, yeah, this is kind of a lot, but all.
Right, it's great. I would say the emotion I do try to instill around money is just gratitude. I think when kids grow up used to a certain standard of living, you can lose perspective that that it's actually a gift and that not everyone else has the same privilege or can think about money the same. So I think, like this beach else, like we've talked about how nice it is. We're like, isn't this great? We're thankful for the pool and we're fortunate, and like.
Maybe this is a privilege. Folks. We're still a little uncomfortable with this.
I don't know, you know, so I think, which I actually do agree. I think learning about it unemotionally has been is great. But I do try to foster the sense of gratitude and a little bit of perspective, you know, because as Americans we're wealthy and you know, living it's been interesting, even moving from the city to the burbs. The way you see money spent is different. And having those kind of conversations just on perspective and how other
people might feel about money or view money. Those are things I think kids inherit from us too.
Defending off a sense of entitlement is absolutely not terribly easy, and it's like a constant task, right to help your kids understand and feel that sense of contentment and thankfulness, gratitude, and so yeah, that's definitely something we work on a lot at the dinner table and other times too. It's like, yeah, let's be thankful for this thing because it's a big deal.
And you know, even if it's not some sort of splurge that you know, broke broke the bank or anything like that, this is a big deal for our family to spend money this way, we're going to really appreciate it and be thankful for.
It, and we're just gonna enjoy it.
Yeah, yeah, totally. No, I do think that is good to not like divorce emotions from it completely because it's still because then it doesn't feel real, right, because then you're just crunching numbers like AI or something like that. You're just like computing data. And that's not what we are. We're not just computers, right, Like, we're individuals that have feelings that do get to enjoy things, and so keeping that in perspective and keeping it within sort of a
healthy framework is really helpful, by agree, Matt. True, but okay, So last question the Kate and Emily show. Rihanna asks if Kate Emily if they had their own bestie podcast, what would be the topic? What do y'all think y'all would talk about?
If weird thing, the.
Weirdest, most disjointed Emily believe it or not to talk to each other about it?
Yeah, I got to mention this to Kate. I can't forget it weird.
I write it.
Down sometimes when I come over, I like pull out my phone to the notes section. I'm like I got some questions over this next week, guess what happened. That's what it would be us going through our notes and our.
Phone talk about crazy stuff in the past week.
Lotterandom. Yeah, but I think parenting in general. I mean, I feel like what we talk about the most is like relational dynamics within our family, within our community. It's like between our families. There's just it's just interesting talk a lot about parenting and like relationships.
Yeah, I just also just information. I mean, I love the way Kate thinks create and I love to hear about her farm and her garden and all thrift story. You know, I just appreciate a friend. I just feel like we just talked about weird information on weird things, and that would occupy your time. It would be not cohesive, and that's why we don't have That's why we are not the podcast.
Guys, what's the overarching theme?
Though we don't weird things that we're not.
Totally going to usurb Joe Rogan, I think we need to start this immediately.
These conversations are are quite meandering as well.
Or embarrassing things we've done that would also there's a lot of that, Like I cannot believe the interaction.
We could just call the podcast awkward moments.
Oh, Kate and I could totally fill that up. We give you an hour, Yeah, easily.
We'll make sure to let let everybody knows.
Because they're kids.
Right, Okay, we've gone along, but let's quickly share. The beer that we drink that we shared today was Madame Rose or Rose No, I guess Madame Rose. This is a Belgium styleiled Ale by Goose Island Beer Company. Ladies, what were your thoughts? Oh, Emily, you didn't even drink yours?
You know, this isn't my style of beer. I like it. It's really good.
It's a good three empty glasses in one drink about.
Half of it. It's more for me, that's true. Well, now I'm embarrassed. Is it a sour beer?
Yeah?
Yeah, okay, okay, yeah yeah, so that's just not my jam and it's got a lot of vinegar.
You're an ipa gal.
Yeah, I would drink an ipa all day long, as sour is not my jam. But it's good, Like I can appreciate the craft and quality, but I'm just not gonna put that back.
Yeah, this one had cherries in it, and this one is from twenty seventeen, so this had like that.
Might be why I had more in your mind, like more vinegar. Yeah, yeah, oxidized a little bit, But I mean that being said, there is still a lot of body, there's still a lot of sweetens.
Yeah it is, and that's probably why I like it. I like the sweet too, but yeah it was. I'm not the one who likes to drink pickle juice, not pointing fingers.
So on that note, you probably be.
I did you know we used to make a drink at home where we would mix apple cider, vinegar and fresh cranberry juice together and I would add it to my water to flavor it. And now, honestly this is pretty reminiscent of that.
So like our podcast would be full of Kate's remes.
So was that Miss Braggs or something like that? Apple sider vinegar with the mother? Why would you do that? Again? Was that like a gut health thing? Yeah?
Also, I just really love vinegar. I mean I drink I am the one literally she drinks pickle juice. Let's be clear, only good pickle juice, not the kind of food coloring. Yeah, I forget that obviously it burns your.
Gut net promotes gut health. Did you dig it? Man, it's right up my alley.
It was Flanders Red Vibes, which is one of my favorite beer styles out of Belgium. Cherries gave the nice little sweet and the fruity notes along with the oak.
I mean this thing agent wine barrels as well, so it had I think that's where some of the oak came from, some of the depth hitting all the notes for me for sure, definitely glad we got to enjoy this one. Glad you picked this one up and that's gonna be it again. If you are still listening, we appreciate you listening to the fifth Lives episode. It's been a lot of fun, ladies. We're thankful for y'all.
By Annuel, We'll see you do it twice a year. Popular demand, take me to the.
Beach twice a year. Take me here. I'm already, I'm not here.
We need to do Plus, we're gonna have to promote your new podcast, so true.
Yeah, Ley Wed, thanks, thank y'all for coming on the podcast today.
Thank you guys, And.
I'm guessing we probably won't have any show notes up. I guess we will, but I don't know what we'll link to, but you can find those up on the website at hownamoney dot com and Joel. Until next time. Best friends are out, Best Friends Out,