Battling Money Anxiety #197

our anxiety and how it pertains to our money. We're gonna talk about mental health a little bit, and we're gonna talk about some specific ways that we can reduce the amount of anxiety that we have surrounding our money. Yeah. No, I think that's so helpful because money anxiety is is, like you said, a huge problem. It affects eight and a half out of ten of us. So that, yeah, that's that's quite a bit of people that are that

are affected by money anxiety. And I think there are you know, really good tips so we can give to help mitigate. Some of them are our mental things, ways that we need to approach our money, and then other things that we need to discuss our money moves that we need to make in order to be able to reduce the anxiety that we feel about our financial situation. So we're gonna get into all that stuff today on the show. But Matt, before we get to that, we had a listener right in about a strategy to to

save money at the grocery store. And I know you responded and you mentioned the credit card that you use at the grocery store. But what was his take? And kind of, yeah, what what do you think about using what was a prepaid card? Yeah? Prepaid cards, and that's not something we've talked about before, but he was mentioning

this specific card. It's called a Kimbo a k I m b O makes me think to Kimbay Mutamba, who was a basketball player for the Hots for a long time, and he used to wag his finger and people's faces after he blocked their shot. Yeah, yeah, no, no no, but yeah, he just smushed his name together. And you get this card, the paid card. So what's interesting about going with prepaid cards? And this isn't something we've really

talked about before. When it comes to budgeting, we tend to go to the extreme of saying, hey, if you really needed to take control of your spending. Look to the envelope system. A lot of people do that where they will withdraw a certain amount of cash and they literally will have that cash on them and they will only use that amount of cash and once they're out of money, they're out of money, right, And so you can see this really playing out well when it comes

to groceries. When it comes to entertainment, there's a hard limit really helpful for a lot of people. Exactly you you would have to go and withdraw more cash, you know, Yeah, so it would be a more painful process to kind of cheat, right, there's something tangible that runs out versus you know, you're putting that money on a credit card and there isn't a tangible limit necessarily, and so I think prepaid cards, first of all, can be a great alternative to using cash because you can put a certain

amount of money on that card. And what's great about that is once you run out of money on that card, well that's it. You know, like you need to wait until the first of the month before you're able to

replenish that money. But with this specific card, one of the things that was the coolest feature about the Akimbo card was that you can set up text alerts, and so every time you make a purchase with that card, it'll a tell you how much you just spent and be it'll tell you the remaining balance that you have left on that card. And that is kind of a game changer, man, because it's because you were doing that manually.

And that's because you text your wife like a couple times a month, a couple of times about what the balance is on the grocery budget or her specific money or yours. I mean, like you're updating the entertainment funds, that kind of stuff. And he was like, dude, let a Kimbo do it for you. Yes, yes, yes, you know exactly because Kate, she's interested in our finances, but not to the extent that I am, right, And so like, she wants to know what these updates are, but she's

not going to go seek them out herself. And so if she automatically got these updates, because you know, in our family she handles the groceries, that's one of her areas of expertise and what she purchases, but if she were to get an update on her phone that told her how much was left, man, she has perfectly up to date information automatically. She doesn't have to come check in with me, you know, a couple of times a month. That's assuming that I haven't been proactive and sent her

that information ahead of time. But it just streamlines things. It makes things easier. And so the big question, though, is is it worth me not getting my six percent on groceries? Because I think I just mentioned this to you recently on an episode, But I got that blue Cash Preferred American Express card and we get six percent on groceries and that is the highest percentage you can

get cash back on a regular card. So regardless, I think we are going to try this out though, because I want to just try not and just to know what that feels like, see how it changes maybe me

and Kate's relationship, the dynamics there a little bit. And if it works out better and in the end, if we end up not going over budget slightly because that information is readily available, well then it's worth not getting that six percent back, right, Uh, it might be worth not having these, you know, small arguments over over the monthly budget. I'll I'll gladly lose six percent back to

avoid some arguments exact. But I'm a numbers guy, and I see six percent that I'm leaving on the table, you know, of about five bucks a month, which is what we spend on groceries, and that's not jump change essentially, that's that's sort of the fee that I'm paying in order to go to a system that would be a little bit easier. Yeah. Well, I'll say I haven't really

looked into the Kimbo card. I know there are lots of different kinds of prepaid cards out there, and so yeah, one thing I think is important to mention here if someone is thinking about doing a prepaid card, A lot of prepaid cards have a lot of nasty fees associated with them. So that's something to be aware of before you do jump into using prepaid cards in order to

kind of help you budget it. Yeah, it could. If there are zero fee prepaid cards that make it easier for you, right and provide text alerts like this, then it can be a win win to to be able to help you budget well, but not have tons of cashing in your pocket because that's an awkward place to be too. But yeah, just something for people to be aware of. A lot of these prepaid cards come with monthly fees. Come with lack of usage, fees and stuff like that, and so you just don't want your money

to be drained. That's on the hard because you chose that route instead of instead of something else that that just wouldn't fee you to death exactly. So yeah, it's a lot to consider because you have the behavioral relationship side of it, and then you've got the numbers and sense side of it as well. You need to take all those things into account. But but yeah, hopefully this is something we can try out soon and I'll let you know how it goes. All right, sounds good. I'll

look forward to hearing. All right, Matt, let's mention the beer that we're having on the show today. We're drinking a beer called Sour Opal. It's an American wild Dale buy Firestone Walker Big brewery out of California, and our buddy Josh sent this one to us. So, yeah, looking forward to having this one with you. Man. Yeah, he was kind of enough to send us a bunch of beers. This is one that was kind of sitting in the back of the fridge. We had a bunch of his

a few months ago. Uh, I'm really excited about this one and we'll definitely share our notes and what we think about this beer at the end of the episode, Yeah, for sure. But now onto the subject in hand, Matt. We're talking about battling money anxiety, and it is just a highly relevant issue, even more relevant right now. People's

money anxieties are flaring up. As you know, the unemployment numbers are are pretty dismal, and people are just having a tough time with their personal finances in a rough economy. And it's also important to note that money anxiety doesn't just play low income earners right. More and more stories have been written in recent years about well off people admitting their own money anxieties, their own difficulties with money. People making a hundred thousand dollars or more are living

paycheck to paycheck, just like half of Americans are. So that anxiety that comes with managing your money, it's not something rare or unique. You're not alone if you are somebody who does find their personal finances to be an anxiety producing area of their life. And people prone to anxiety or depression are less likely to have a retirement

account where they're saving for the future. That's not good and that's according to a seventeen finding from a Cornell study, these anxieties are doing great harm to the reality on the ground of people building up and saving for their future matts. So it's not just that we feel these things, but but these feelings that the anxious feelings that come along with not handling our money well or or being

unsure about how to go about handling our money. Uh, it produces actually an inability to to take positive action in the future. And so it is a topic that we really do need to cover. Yeah, well, really that the question is what came first, the chicken or the egg. Do they not have a retirement account because they're anxious, or are the anxious because they don't have any money in the bank? Man, could be a little bit of both, Yeah,

and I think it is. And obviously, like it's not a one size fits all sort of situation, Like people have varied circumstances with lots of different things going on in their lives, and you know, our finances are only a small part of it. Obviously, that's what we're gonna be focusing on today, is the money aspect of it and how that anxiety is sort of manifesting itself in our finances, you know, and this the stress and this anxiety that we have, it seems to be getting worse.

The president of the American Psychiatry Association and need to Everett. She said that US adults are increasingly anxious, particularly about health, safety and finances. Right in COVID nineteen, it hasn't done anything to lessen the pact of anxiety on our nation. Most of us are feeling familial and financial stressors even

more now than we normally would. Uh. There's some new research from qual Tricks, and they show that since the health crisis began, that thirty of folks reported increased insomnia, half of respondents felt more irritable, and six of people say that they have higher levels of stress altogether. Man, I know, for me, I guess this isn't really money related, but like just going to the grocery store stresses me out a little bit. I know, before there was a whole lot of good data out there as far as

what you were supposed to be doing. The CDC hadn't uh instituted the you know the face coverings, you know mask rule essentially. But like I would go into the grocery store and I would kind of hold my breath, like like when I would walk past groups of people because like I didn't know what else to do. And I realized that holding your breath really stresses you out while you're trying to run around the grocery store with

a shopping list. I do not recommend that, but yeah, I mean the stress shows itself in all sorts of ways in our lives, and yeah, we see that played out in a big way when it comes to our money. Well, I'm glad I didn't find you past out in the bacon aisle with the blue face or something like that. I'm like shooting for the exit, and I'm like, I think I can make it. I think I can make it. I can't make it. I can't make it, And down

goes Matt. Well, that I gotta say too that this issue in particular is is pretty personal in my life. My wife struggles with anxiety. It's been something that that we've had to talk about more and more through the years. It's something that we have to kind of maintain constic communication on, like how are your anxiety levels. It's something that we've kind of grown accustomed to having be a

part of our lives. And I've learned a lot about it as we've grown together through dealing with the difficulties that come with kind of some of the anxious tendencies that she has. Medications help some, but we've also had to be just really intentional in order to combat these anxieties together as a couple. And so, yeah, we're fortunate that that money isn't one of the reasons behind her anxiety, because you know, we have done a pretty good job

over the years of handling it well. But that's why I think tack tackling this topic feels so important is because it is personal in a lot of ways to me, uh, into our family. Well, dude, thanks for sharing that. You know, money anxiety just financial stress in general, Like, that's something that most all of us deal with in one way or another. Right, It's a very real thing. And even though a lot of us we might try and deny it,

were all more susceptible to it. Then we realized one of the biggest problems, I think it's not even realizing that we might already have this anxiety, you know, it might be present in our lives now. And so what we want to talk about next are the different signs the symptoms of some of this financial stress, and we'll talk about those right after the break. All right, now we're back from the break. We're talking about battling money anxiety, and in particular, people need to know what the signs

are that they might be dealing with it. I mean, I think some people might be like, duh, I'm pulling my hair out over here, like looking at my bank statement, and so some people might just automatically know that they're suffering from from money anxiety. Some of our listeners who are handling money really well might not have as much of a clue though that it still does plague them. And I know that can be the case for me that sometimes, you know, money issues do come up in

my brain that cause me some anxiety. But it's not because I'm living hand to mouth, I'm living paycheck to paycheck. It's just because I'm not thinking or handling that situation very well. And yes, so so so knowing some of these signs can be can be really helpful and and really shine a light on what might actually be happening beneath the surface. Some of these symptoms might be more subtle than we realize. Yeah, completely, Yeah, So let's get

into a few of them real quick. And one is paying too much attention to the stock market, financial news, and your four oh one K balance. In this down term, we've experienced a lot of stock market volatility, and so if you're tending to head to CNBC way more than you used to, you're checking your four o one K balance on a daily basis or a weekly basis, well,

that's a sign that you have some financial anxiety. And if you can't let it go, if you can't turn those things off, then that is definitely a sign you need to watch out for. Yeah, man, I think this is especially true too for us, You and me, like we're relatively young, and we we've got a lot of younger listeners, and so if you are investing for the long haul, you don't need to look at your your balances daily or even weekly because it doesn't really matter.

It doesn't matter what the market is doing right now, because the impact of these fluctuations that we have currently are going to have such a small impact on the amount that we have in our nest egg, you know, twenty and thirty years from now. So if you are a younger listener in particular in your twenties or thirties, checking your portfolio and looking at your balance that really shouldn't even be a practice you have at all. Yeah, So that's one sign feeling depressed when you even start

to think about money, budgeting and saving. I mean just kind of realizing, Matt, that you have to get a handle on things that you need to take some action, and just getting into a funk because of it, not being able to even make that first stab at opening up a mint account or wine ab account to start tracking, and just feeling a general kind of sense of malaise when when you are trying to confront some of the money issues that do exist in your life. That another

sign that you are financially anxious. And another one too, is is too much emotion associated with attempts at frugality.

So if you are trying to make some frugle moves, you're trying to cut back on subscription services, you're trying to cut the cable cord, you're trying to lower your your internet bill, whatever it is that you're trying to do to to change the way you handle money and to save money, but the way you handle it emotionally is just a little chaotic then I would say that's a sign that you're you're too money anxious and something

needs to change, you know, Joel. And what's interesting about like that point too, is that a lot of those things you talked about, you know, like cutting your subscriptions, like finding ways to save more money, investing more like these are all things that we talk about all the time on the show. It's basically, maybe what we're saying is that by listening to our show, maybe that's causing you anxiety. So stop listening. No, that's not what we're saying. No,

that's a terrible idea. These are still good things to know and to be aware of, right, Like, you need to have that knowledge. But at the same time, we need to strive after not judging our worth based on how much we're able to reduce our expenses, how much we're able to increase our saving. Right, it's good to

do these things. But if we are, you know, like you said, if we're being too chaotic, if we're being too emotional about it, if we're tying our worth to how much of this we're actually able to get done, if we're trying our personal worth, you know, to our net worth, how much we actually have in the bank account. Well, like, that's when it can become unhealthy. Right, So a lot of the things that we're gonna talk about today are

are good things to do. So I just wanted to mention that quickly because just to kind of reframe what it is that we're talking about here, A lot of the stuff that we talk about are good things, but can always be taken to an unhealthy level. Yeah, and there are a lot of people to Matt who are handling their money really well, but they have an unhealthy frugal obsession, and over frugality can really harm a relationship,

it can harm you as an individual. So, yeah, we love frugality, but there's a balance, right that that comes along with everything in life, and I think we try to approach money from a balanced standpoint where we don't want people to to cut to the bone in order to to save a few extra dollars. There's a place where we can approach frugality, cutting back, being thoughtful with our money in a way that doesn't necessarily pile on

to our anxious feelings. Yeah, and so another couple maybe symptoms of financial anxiety is maybe the opposite of what we're talking about here instead of beings so frugal, maybe you just don't really care anymore and you're letting others take the reins and completely resigning yourself from even thinking about money. Yeah, that could be a spouse, a partner, or that could also be a financial advisor, either one

of those people. And if you're just letting the reins go completely, that's a sign that maybe you've let money anxiety take over the point that you've relented completely from from even thinking about it. Yeah, and even on the flip side of that as well, is maybe if you're trying to take full control over all of your finances, including the things that we don't have control over. We're gonna talk more about that later on, but you know, again,

there's there's two sides of the coin. Another sign you might be suffering from some financial anxiety is if you go on some shopping spreeze when you're not feeling so great, right, Like, if you go on these spending binges to help you to feel a little bit better, maybe spending some money after you've had a hard day out where or maybe you've had an argument with your partner, or if you

find yourself spending money regularly. You know, it doesn't even have to be a lot of money, but even if it's a small amount, but it's something that you do every single time to kind of lift your spirits a little bit, that could certainly be a sign of some financial stress. And so those are just a few examples, right, Like, we we all let our money anxieties, uh, manifest themselves in our lives in different ways, but it is important to think about what ways those anxieties are triggered in

order to deal with them at all. Yeah, Matt, So, so let's talk about some practical ways to combat the anxiety that people might be feeling. If they realize that some of those symptoms of money anxiety, that those were true to form for them, that that they exist in their life, Well, how do we start combating that? And a few of the first things are are we well, we need to talk about resiliency and mental health. And first it's I think it's really important to recognize that

anxiety is normal. You gave the stat of Americans suffer from some sort of money anxiety, and anxiety is kind of just a part of the human condition overall. None of us can completely avoid it, and it's helped us to survive unprecedented things throughout our history. Right, anxiety actually has a positive effect in some ways, it's almost a physical necessity. But it's also important to mitigate unhelpful anxious feelings, and so to stay active, making exercise of priority, getting

good sleep. Those physical actions can have a massive impact on your overall ability to battle money anxiety in your life. And Joel, it's worth mentioning right that you and I we are not psychiatrists or psychologists, were not trained counselors here, but a lot of what we're saying here, I believe is something that any of those folks would say, which is that you need to have some balance in your life.

You're talking about maintaining healthy relationships, maintaining physical health. I think anytime we we tend to find ourselves drawn into one specific niche or tiny little area of our life obsessively, it can have negative effects. And so by seeking after balance in our lives as a whole, I think that we can all intuitively see how that could benefit us. Yeah, you can't completely divorce the money anxieties you feel from

the other habits that you have in your life. And if you're having a hard time with those other things. It's gonna have an impact on the anxieties you feel over your money. And also too, we just said anxiety is normal, it's really important for us to recognize that as being a normal part of our life. But too, it's important to to give ourselves the ability to be honest and to maybe even get mad about something that

hasn't gone our way. I'm sure that many of us have experienced more anger or tears over the last couple of months as we have been in lockdown mode in our homes. It's been hard financially, it's been hard physically, it's been hard familiarly relationally, this this whole thing is

taking a toll on so many of us. But most of us tend to feel shame when we let our emotions get out of control, and it's important to give our emotions a place to exist and not just to tamp them down below the surface, because then they're gonna potentially boil up in kind of just unhealthy spending patterns or unhealthy ways of looking at our finances, and not to mention the other detrimental effects of not actually letting our emotions out in a healthy way. If we're just

pushing them down under the surface. Something's bound to boil over and it's going to be a more toxic of and when that actually happens. Yeah, buddy, that's right. All the emotions are important, just like on the on that movie Inside Out right right, Yes, Okay, you don't want Money Island to go crumbling. You need to have all the emotions working together in a healthy way in order to have a well functioning person. Another thing that we

can do as well is to accept reality. I think it's important for us to maybe point out the obvious here as well, uh, and that is that we have very little control over these issues that our world is dealing with right now. The events that are unfolding are unprecedented, and so if we are able to accept that reality for what it is, um that this is our life now, or you know, at least for the time being, then we could greatly reduce the amount of stress that is

going to be in our lives. Yeah, you're not alone, and the reality of things sucks for so many people right now. So kind of accepting that reality can you have a really positive impact mentally, Matt and I think too, it's important to note that some people really do need to seek real mental help. Anxiety is caused, of course by by so much more than just money issues. So if anxiety is a consistent issue in your life, there are resources to to help you out, so we would

recommend go see your doctor. The National Alliance on Mental Illness also has resources on their site local resources to help you as well help connect you to a professional. So that's important to note too that as Matt and I are not professionals that we're talking about money anxiety here, there are other things that are going on in your life in all likelihood, and we don't have the answers to all of them, and so yes, seeking real professional

help might be where you need to turn. But Matt and I we do have some expertise and in particular with what you should do with your money in order to really curb those anxieties to be able to help you make more positive choices. And we're gonna get to some of those things right after the break. M okay, Joel, we're talking about money anxiety, right and we we discussed some of the general things that we can do when

it comes to mental health and our anxiety there. But let's go ahead now and dive into some of these specific money things that we can do to reduce the amount of things idea that we have surrounding our personal finances. And the first thing that we want to cover is to make sure that you are doing what it is that you can do. We each have a locust of control, and so we need to know what it is and

make changes to those specific things. Uh, it's when we try and control the uncontrollable that's what leads to anxiety. So maybe the downtime that you have because you're in your home a lot more these days now is the perfect time to create a budget or maybe you can finally write down the why behind your money. Just don't resign to to not do anything at all productive. That sort of procrastination, not putting off of things that we know that we need to do, that can compound the

anxieties that we are currently feeling. Yeah, man, I think if you've got along to do list and it's Saturday afternoon and you instead decided to watch five hours of Tiger King on Netflix, You're gonna feel even worse about that to do list. When you're done, it's not gonna feel good. And so, yeah, doing what you can do taking some steps in the right direction is huge. It's also important to reframe things and to serve other people.

It's easy, I think, to wallow in our own grief in a time like this and partu killer, but there are others out there who have it harder than we do, and I think it's important right that we give ourselves

the ability to be honest. Like we said earlier, we're not trying to minimize your situation by reframing things, but by reframing and considering what's good about where you are, that can improve your current outlook and can help manage some of those anxieties, right and so so helping those in your community, your your neighbors, people are in the hardest situations right now. That'll give you a sense of purpose in hard times like this. It's almost like counting

your blessings. Basically, even though you might have it hard, there are certainly people out there who have it even harder than you, and so acknowledging what is good is so helpful right now? Yeah, certainly, man, You know, by reframing your situation and serving others, that might allow you to maybe even completely flip your perspective right, and that's when you'd realize that you've actually got it pretty good.

Another thing that we'd recommend for folks to do is to make sure you have some time set aside to work on these money related issues. Sometimes the anxiety that we feel towards our money like that can build because we haven't created a rhythm for handling budgeting or maybe expenses, bill paying things like that. Because we don't pay much attention, there's this sort of, you know, this nagging sensation in the back of our minds all the time. I like to think of it as this kind of constant drip.

So if you can create weekly counter space to deal with, you know, these regular money tasks, then it will help to curb that nagging feeling that you have throughout the week because you know that you'll get it handled at the appropriate time and you can still watch Tiger King at the appropriate time too, if that's what you're into. That's twice now that you've mentioned that, have you been watching now? So we watched the first episode and I was like, I can't keep going this, I can't do it.

I know it's everybody's obsession, but it's a little It was like a month ago. I feel like we're a little behind the time. That's a good point. Yeah, we are. We are a little laid on the uptake on that one. Okay, well, on that note, so during the quarantine, you know what, Kate and I have actually been doing a little rabbit trail that we're going down here. But we have watched some of the Marvel movies, right, but we've never been able to really piece them all together because we're not

super uber nerds. But we're fixing that. One of our friends posted this infographic, uh and it shows all of the Marvel movies and specifically the order that you're supposed to watch them in. Uh. And it's not based on the order that they came out, but it's the order that these events transpire, the chronological the Marvel Comic Universe, got or no, it's Marvel Cinematic Universe. I gotta get that right, otherwise I'm gonna lose my cred. But the but the m c U. And we've really been enjoying it.

You know, a lot of folks might think this is kind of silly, right because it's superheroes, But man, we have really found enjoyable in this time where we're kind of we are inundated by the news and just the harsh realities that we're being faced with. But you know, we're talking about making sure that we're taking care of

our financial business. But that's something that we've done. We we have the calendar alerts set we you know, we have dedicated times that we have meetings, We have processes that we go through when it comes to communicating about our money. And so that allows us to take Friday night and make sure that we watch a movie and for it to feel like the weekend because all the days feel the same. Let's just be honest. Okay, you can guilt free, do it exactly if you if you've

already have those other things in place, totally name. That's awesome, all right, nerd. Well, let's move on. So another I think thing that can help people as they're dealing with money anxiety is to talk to someone else. Sometimes we're just anxious, right because we feel they need to be heard, and talking to a friend our partner can can help us get our concerns on the table, can help us kind of put some of those anxieties in the light.

And sometimes they just need to face the light of day right, and that alone can help us feel better as someone walks alongside us in our anxieties. And Matt two, we mentioned that there are other resources. Well, there are some free mental health resources that USA Today documented. Will put a link to that uh in the show notes. But there are also discounts to popular apps like talk Space and better Help Right Now. Other times, though, we we need expert advice from someone who knows what they're

talking about. Right, It's not necessarily just telling a best friend. Well, you actually know what you're talking about, Matt, So telling the best friend would be helpful in that situation. But other people, maybe their best friend doesn't know a whole lot about money, so it's not super helpful. Well, that's

what's great about not for profit credit counseling. You'll have the ear of someone who cares and can leave gitimately help you in fcc dot org is one of the websites you know you and I have recommended that people go to for not for profit credit counseling. And actually on Monday's episode, this coming Monday, we're gonna talk with

a friend who works in a credit counseling organization. His name is Thomas Nichie, and he'll have some really helpful information to share, especially if you are suffering from debt, and if it's debt that's causing a lot of your money anxieties. Right now, I think that's gonna be a great episode, Matt. I can't wait to share that one with everybody. Another recommendation that we have is to compare less. Comparison is the enemy of personal progress, and so we

would recommend you not to do that. Do not compare your life to those around you. Comparing our situation to those around us, like, that's gonna inevitably lead to more anxiety. And when we do that, we're often holding up a false reality, you know, like the facade of our friends lies, like from our vantage point, it's not the reality of what they are actually dealing with. A lot of us like to share our lives, the better part of our lives on social media, right like, whether that be on

Facebook or on this Agram. But believe me, do not believe those instagram live Like everybody knows that that is just the highlight reel is is often how it's touted. But it's hard to remind ourselves of that in the moment when you're kind of sit there stuck at home, you know, doing whatever it is that you're trying to avoid doing because you're on your phone on Instagram or something like that, or you're up in the middle of the night with a crime baby scrolling through Instagram and

you're like, I hate these other people. Well, the good news at least, though, is that people aren't, you know, posting pictures of themselves climbing some beautiful mountain or you know, some exotic vacation, because people aren't doing that quite as much. But regardless, it's easy to envy somebody else's life, regardless

of what you're currently going through. You know, like you might see their perfectly decorated home and all their house plants that they have because they're spending all their time now at home, and you think, oh man, all my house plants look like they're dying and all those house plants look great. That idealized life can take all different forms,

especially given the time that we're in now. Yeah, for sure, sometimes there's something really small they kind of can take root, just as we see kind of how somebody else's live in life and we're jealous of it, and that can have Yeah, just a big impact on how anxious we start to feel, especially when it becomes like a possession arms race, which is always unhelpful. But yeah, another important thing to do to combat money anxiety is to take baby steps. We mentioned just a little bit ago, doing

what you can do well. Rome wasn't built in a day, and working towards the elimination of money anxiety overnight is gonna also prove fruitless for you. So we would suggest that you do as much as you can to accumulate a series of small victories and then enjoy those winds then come back for more. Right, So, like a one percent increase in your four oh one k allocation, that's a big win. Just sitting down and creating that budget, or eliminating one bill from your life because you decided

you didn't need it anymore. You didn't need that monthly bill in your life, you didn't need the service. Well, that is a win and you should celebrate it, and so those baby steps can be huge. Another one would be like hitting that two thousand, four hundred and sixty

seven dollars in an emergency fund. Right, that's another win, And all of those things really do help to quell those money anxieties that that easily rear their head, and uh it's it's like whack a mole, man, you can pop them down as you do start to accomplish some of those baby steps that are that are really meaningful. Well, you just mentioned that emergency fund, right, that two thousand,

four undred sixty seven dollars. Let's go ahead and highlight that though, because uh man, that is hyper practical, like that is something that all of us can do, regardless of the stage of life that we're in, if we did not already have an emergency fund set up, because let's be honest, without some you know, financial margin in our lives, it's gonna be really hard for us to

completely stave off these money anxieties. When you don't have margin, when you don't have a cushion between you know, when your life looks good and when you when your life looks bad, well, then you're gonna constantly be flipping from

good to bad, good to bad, good to bad. Right if you're always centered around that bank balance at close to zero and you're not sure if you're gonna face withdraw penalty because you took out too much more than you had, Yeah, that's a that's a really anxiety inducing state to live in. Yeah, Essentially, you want to give yourself some breathing room when it comes to your finances.

And so actually funding that emergency fund, that cushion, uh that you know you need, can that can go a long way to actually alleviating some of the anxiety that you feel towards your money. Yeah, for sure, getting that the fund is a huge first step. It creates that margin and it makes it far less likely you're going to be living on that anxious edge of the financial precipice. So, yeah, Matt, I mean anxiety and worry they have a place in our lives, right, There is a necessary human benefit to

enduring anxiety. Neither anxiety nor worry are wholly bad in and of themselves, and in fact they're they're kind of basic human instincts, but many of us live with them as constant companions, and they seem to infiltrate every single area of our life. And money is one of them in which they can rear their ugly head the most, and that is not what they're meant to do. And you can develop a positive relationship with money. You can

kind of flip the script. You can change things around, you can get rid of the constant, nagging anxieties that plague you. It's gonna take some proactive measures, some intentionality, but in the end, taking steps to reduce the anxiety in your life will improve your mental health and it will ensure that you end up saving more and interact

with money issues in a much more positive way. So hopefully this episode was able to give people some insight into kind of what causes financial anxiety and then some practical steps to be able to at least partially with themselves of some of those anxieties that that are plaguing them. Because yeah, I know so many more people are feeling

financially anxious right now, and I hate hearing that. Yeah, man, so many of us are are dealing with these anxieties, and I think that's what's important as well to note is that if you are feeling this, if you have these emotions, you're not alone. And so again, hopefully, yeah, you're able to find some directions some help from this episode. All right, buddy, let's go ahead and steer back to the beer that we had on this one. We shared

a sour opal. This is an American wild Ale by Firestone Walker Brewing Companies sent to us by our buddy Josh. What were your thoughts on this one, buddy? Yeah, man, so I thought this one was, of course, very tasty. I love me a good wild ale, and Firestone Walker has been making some really good ones in recent years.

This one has a lot of similarities to some of my favorite Belgian Goose is A Goose is kind of this beer that is aged for different lengths of time and then it's blended together to make just this fantastic oak aged concoction of a beer. It's tart, it's complex, and it's funky and and so this one in particular just really had a lot of those flavors going on, which that's one of my all time favorite beer styles. And I feel like fire Stone Walker hit the nail

on the head with this one. It's a really delicious take on that style. There's some nice oak flavors coming through to go along with that tartness and a little bit of sweetness. So yeah, man, I really really enjoyed this one. Nice. I'm glad you like this one, man, because I definitely did as well. Wait we poured it. There's this kind of blonde color, so I guess technically you can call it a blonde sour, but this was

so good. It had that perfect balance between Like the first thing I noticed was a kind of sweet candied apricot sort of flavors going on, But that coupled with the bright acidity with it being a sour, kind of added some balance and some nuance to it. But then on top of that you mix in the toasted, woody kind of aerial notes. I read on the bottle too. It said there's like a hint of toasted coconut as well, which I feel like you could totally pick up on.

And so it rounds itself out with all these sort of flavor points and it does it so stinking well. Like earlier, you know, we're talking about making sure that you stay healthy, like kind of maintain balance in your own life and make sure you don't go in one direction like too hard, too heavy. I feel like this

is like the perfect beer example. Like this our opal is so balanced in all these wonderful aspects that bring just so much flavor, and they just do it so well man Firestone Walker, Like they remind me of Cascade as well as the brewery. It seems like a lot of these West Coast breweries just have fantastic American wild barrel aged wild beers programs going on. And so I'm

glad we got to share this one. I would have much preferred to have had my very own bottle of this one instead of sharing it with you, But yeah, glad we got to have this one on the show, buddy. Yeah, man, it was delicious. You know what, I'd rather share with you than have my own, though so unselfish, really, you would rather have half of a good beer than one of your own very good beer. I do like drinking a beer with a good friend. But no, I lie, I would take it. I'm just trying to make you

look bad because we're drinking the exact same thing. You know that, like one of ours isn't tainted. I guess, well, certainly better to share one than to not have one at all, that's true. But all right, man, I think that is going to be it for this episode. Listeners can find our show notes up on the website at how some money dot com. We'll have some links there to some of the information, some of the resources that we mentioned today. Yeah, for folks that are listening, who

have been listening for a while. Well, we would really appreciate it if you leave a five star review on iTunes if you like our show, and you know what, if you have some constructive criticism to share, well you can go to how the Money dot com slash do Better and drop us a line. And you know what, Matt and I read all those emails and they really help us hone the show to be better. So we we really do appreciate your feedback if you go to the website and leave some for us. Yeah we want

to do better, Yeah we do. All right man, Well that's it, So until next time, Best friends out, Best Friends Out. M