Making Our Returning Citizens Whole (with Desmond Meade)

Voter Protection Corps. We could probably make four more episodes zoned voting because it's that important in this election year to flex that form of our collective power. This episode you're listening to right now is also related to voting, but it's also about something much more. To quote our guests, it's about putting respect on our vote. He said to me, voting is a sacred act which takes you to a place where you say I am voting, says I am,

I exist, My voice counts I matter. Those aren't the words of just any citizen, but someone working among and on behalf of a population whose voice often doesn't count.

Those would be returning citizens, people convicted of crimes in the United States, and in this case, people convicted of felonies in the state of Florida, and my humble opinion, Florida is one of our more retrograde states when it comes to voting rights because this state did not restore voting rights to people convicted of felonies for a hundred

fifty years. That changed in with the passage of amendment for this initiative garnered an overwhelming six of Floridians to vote to restore voting rights and thus visibility and dignity to one point for million people in that state. It was the largest restoration of voting rights in fifty years in this country. And the returning citizen who helped organize that grassroots efforts who I had a chance to speak with.

His name is Desmond Meade. He's president of the Florida Rights Restoration Coalition and author of the book Let My People Vote, My Battle to Restore the civil rights of Returning Citizens. I spoke with Desmond not just about voting, but about changing the narratives of power in our democracy and about affirming ourselves, about saying I am and I matter. You'll notice some noisier than usual audio from Desmond because he squeezed us into his schedule while he was in

the middle of his Let my People Vote bus tour. Yes, Desmond was literally on a us. Have you ever done zoom on a bus? I don't think so, and I don't recommend it, but we got some decent audio and what do you have to say is so powerful? Take a listen. I am Desmond me the executive director of

Florida Rights Restoration Coalition. My organization is the organization that's led by people who have previous felony convictions as well as those who have loved ones that's been impacted by the criminal Justice is the rights that you're trying to restore. What rights are these? In the Florida Rights Restoration Coalition, we're trying to restore voting rights right now. You know, when the person is convicted of a felony offense in many states, such as the Florida, they lose their civil

rights upon that conviction. And included in that civil rights is the right to vote, the right to run for office, the right to serve on a jury. There are other collateral consequences that's associated with the loss of civil rights that could impact a person's ability to find safe and affordable housing, or to get employment or occupational license. But the granddaddy I think of all those rights is voting rights.

I'm hearing some noise in the background, Desmond, tell us where you are, tell us what you're doing right now, and right now, I am all I tend in the state. Tend in the northern part of Florida on the bus or let my people vote us that we're riding in going from city to city, from county to county, really trying to energize a base of folks to really turn out.

Actually early in this election, we realized that this is probably the most critical election that this country has ever seen, and we are, I think, in the middle of the defining moment of our country and our democracy, and it is extremely vital that every American census play a role in what's going to happen in a few weeks. M When did you start caring so much about voting in

the state of democracy? Man, that's a great question. You know, I think that if started with first learning how to care about me, right, and you know, in the process of learning how to care about me, learning how to care about others. It's somewhere within that realm of love for my fellow human beings that we discovered that one of the mechanisms that we can use to actually improve

the lives of other people, it's through voting. And then in the process of really finding out more and more about voting and seeing how it works in and the impact that it can have in that process. Actually, I do not only say it's levels to this right. I actually went to a whole new other level I didn't even know existed last month when I went to go vote for the first time in over thirty years, walking up understanding that I'm getting ready to engage in a

sacred act. I didn't even understand the sacredness of voting. You know. I talked a lot about the value and how the right to vote is, all this and all that. But what I did not capture or fully understand until I went to go vote was about how sacred voting is. And so when I was in that voting booth, actually voting, I was engaging in the sacred act and understanding that the level of sacredness about voting actually transcend partisan politics.

It transcends the politics and It transcends even the racial anxieties and biases. That sacredness of voting actually takes you to a place where you say something so simple yet so powerful, takes you to the place where you say, I am. Voting is like that ultimate thing that says I am, that I exist, that my voice count, I matter. When you put in the sacrifices that our ancestors have made the blood right. It was blood that purchased this

right and sanctified it. When you kind of understand that, then you have to understand that people got to put respect on your vote. And not only do people have to put respect on your vote, because it's so easy for us to say, you put some respect on my name, right, Well, guess what, we got to put respect on our vote because we have got to come to this space where we understand that this vote is so sacred that we can't just give it away or we can't allow it

to remain dormant. We have to put respect on our own vote, you know what I'm saying, And we put respect on it by doing it. When we don't use it, we're just totally dishonoring not only ourselves but the work of our ancestors. And then when we just easily give it away to people without making them work for it, then we have devalued our own. Though. When you try to use your vote some years back, you weren't able to.

Can you tell me a short story of trying to support a candidate You cared a lot of out, but you weren't able to do so when that formal version of voting, Wow, you know, yeah, this one candidate that I was wanting to support with all my heart because I loved her to death. And that was my wife. You know, she ran for office in twenty sixteen, and man, I'll tell you we poured so much into her race.

And I remember a few months before the election, somebody was like, man, I know, you can't wait to vote for your wife, And it was like they stuck a knife in the old wound and twisted. It reminded me that because I live in to say, the Florida, I can't even vote for my own wife. And that was painful. That was painful. That was like somebody you know that overcame so much and think that they have arrived just to get slapped and said, oh no, you have it,

you're right back. You know where you thought you had escaped from that You're still not good enough and you're still not worthy, and you know it was that was that was a painful moment for me, really was. Your book is very moving, Desmond. Let my people vote, my battle to restore the civil rights of returning citizens. And there's a part of it that jumps out to me where you're making your return and you are astonished that a black man with a criminal record living in the

shelter can enroll in community college for free. Talk to me about your own political education in that moment of getting your degrees and what was that like for you. I think that goes to show the power of the narrative, right that when we allow a narrative, no matter how false it is, to test festered in our minds and

in our society, it creates these illusions. But you know, there's so many states where people automatically get the right to vote back once they severyday time, or some stays to where people don't ever lose the right to vote. And I can guarantee you that there's somebody in that state with a felery convinction that believe that they can't

vote because of the narrative. And so it was narrative like that that had me thinking that number one, you know, you needed to have money to go to school, that you had to be of good moral standings, and you couldn't have an arrest on your record, and and you definitely couldn't be a drug addict, you know, and and and you definitely couldn't be homeless. And so it was only a certain type of people where school was available to. Now, let me tell you something, and let me say the

power to narrative. Because I graduated high school. You know what I'm saying. I did real well in high school, just some time in the military. But even though I had been exposed to all that at that moment of time, me thinking that there was no way I could be going to school to get a degree was a product of just a narrative that caused me to believe that

I couldn't when that was far from reality. And that's just the power of how if narrative couldn't raise hope and cause us to think that our situation would never change, it's that same narrative they got people saying my vote don't count or don't matter. You know, it's that same narrative, they've got people thinking that nothing will ever change no matter what we do, So we might well just accepted why even bother going through the most of the vote.

It's that same narrative that kept me from even trying to get an education. So you've helped change another narrative in your state with the passing of Amendment four in approval by the people of Florida, not just members of the legislature, to restore voting rights to formally incarcerated people one point four million formally incarcerated people. That's a major

narrative shift. At that time, Flooryda was convicted about a hundred and seventy thousand people a year, a hundred and seventy thousand people getting convicted of a failing offense and losing the rights for life. But out of those hundred and seventy thousand, less than was even sentenced to prison.

So what do you think the rest of them where? See, sometimes we forget that this plea bargaining system and its cash bailed system, which forces people to into it to plea bargains to get out of these conditions as sooner than later right and forces people to take convictions on things that they are not even guilty of, actually inserts them into a vicious cycle of mass incarceration. But reality

is is that yeah, one point four million people. But first of all, we need to let them know there with people, because the other thing, it's easy to think about somebody when they're locked up or coming out of prison right when it's a whole different perspective when you're talking about somebody that's in your home right now, that's sitting next to you on your church prew that works with you, you know, you kind of view the slightly different.

And so part of that is that narrative change. And my signing star is that we were able to organize a controversial topic in the controversial state at a controversial time and win with love. We won without dividing people we want, without instilling fear or hatred and anyone we want with love, bro, you know, and we engage in one of the toughest battles and we won in beautiful fashion. Love.

And part of that is how are we engaging folks in such a way to where they're understanding that their efforts is not for me, right, but if for someone that they love, that's what got them? You know. One of the key things that really set the tone for this valid inness, but just approaching someone and asked them one simple question, you know, that simple question was do you know anyone that you that's ever made a mistake? M We'll just let that sit there for men and

let them just think about that. Right, So when we talk about fellonists and franchise, my face ain't popping up in their minds. It's someone that they love, whether it's their son, their daughter, granddaughter, grandson, uncle, favorite uncle at that right, But it's someone that they loved that pops in their minds, and I let that marinate, and that's that image that they take with him in the vote booth.

They don't take mine because some of them might be racist and they can care less about me get my rights back. Some might be Republican and could care less about somebody that might vote Democrats getting their rights back. But when they're winning the boom, they wo wasn't voting Democratic Republican, They wasn't voting black and white. They were voting love. They're voting based on someone that they love.

One hell of a secret sauce um and some of those recipes you'll find in my book just think over there, the cookbook how to do Amazing Things and Overcome amazing obstacles Chef Desmond Cookbook for a Healthier Democracy. I love it. I like that. Like that that might be my next title, right, cookbook for Democracy. I like that you mentioned this narrative.

This new story works for multiple races of people. It works for multiple party members, and particularly the Republican Party which has really made a name for itself and trying to restrict the number of people who can vote. You know, I'm still a little reeling that so many you don't get to six with just Democrats voting, and so you

have moved people from quote unquote the other side. And yet after the historic victory, you see the clamp down and the attempts to amend the ballot initiative that was passed overwhelmingly and restricted and imposed these fine payback requirements before you really get your rights back. Were you shocked by the Republican led legislature's attempts to rein in the one point four reduced that number by putting these fee

requirements on top. I was not shocked. Listen, at the end of the day, you said something you gave me another quote. We don't draw the lines in the same politicians. Soo h. You see when you take politicians away, even when you look at COVID nineteen in response COVID nineteen pandemic, let me tell you some of the most beautiful moments that we see in that is when people come together and handled their business, the ugly parts of the pandemic,

and when politicians are involved. You know, when we ran our campaign, people used to try to characterize it as a bipartisan campaign. That you useduld piss me off. I'm like, no, we're not. Heck, no, we're not. You know, okay, I'm sorry. You're a nonpartisan campaign, Like, we're not that either. I pushed back strongly against that. We're not. We weren't no bipartisan. We wasn't a nonpartisan. We were an organic grassroots effort that welcomed and enjoyed by partisan support. And the differences

we let with the people, not with the politics. When you take the politics out of it, where's the division, right, where's the division? And so we didn't have to make people cross lines. We just got rid of the line, so there was no crossing needed to be done. You know, we created our own line. We created a circle around everybody, whether you was young, old, black, white Latino, whether you was conservative and you're thinking progressive and you're thinking or

you know which way to think. We included you because you as a human being that knows what it feels like to make mistakes or had a loved one that has made mistakes, and you know that you don't ever want to be not forgiven for anything you've done for the rest of your life. That's where we organized and so we and we intentionally kept politicians out of it. So yeah, no, I wasn't surprised what happened, because you know, you got politicians or what comes to politicians is a

heavy dose of arrogance, and that's what it was. Bro I mean, when you look at it, just think about this story. You have this homeless family that's been living in the street for years, when it ranged, when it snows, when it's sleep, when it's til. They're out there in the elements right with no protection, and politicians will walk past them day in and day out and not lift the fingers. You with me, all of a sudden, the people come together and say we're gonna build this family

a home. The minute the people build a home, here comes the politicians going in the house trying to dictate out, rearrange the furniture. Right, that's exactly what happened. Fellais and franchise and has been in place in Florida for a hundred and fifty years, and politicians did not address it. They did not, so the people took matters in their

own hands. And the minute we were successful with it, now they had the arrogance to insist that they tell us how to implement wait committed, keep their hands out

of it. But the minute that happens, that's when you see the lines getting drawn again, and you started seeing the division and then and the insults back and forth both sides, right, And that really hurt us in our hearts, because we know we just accomplished something beautiful, that we showed the world that in spite of our differences, in spite of the color of our skins or our political persuasions, that we can't come together as human beings to move

major issues without having to tear each other apart, without having to degrade each other. We showed that it was possible, and they were resorted right back to the old way of doing things, and it hurt our hearts and to see because at the heart of all of that was that it was real people's lives that we were talking about, but the politics then overshadowed that. How have you and the people's movement here responded to this politicization and to

these restrictions, keep all elevating people over politics. That's how we responded when everything went down. We're like, you listen, other people see obstacles, we see opportunities. We see the lawsuit come in. We won the lawsuit in the Northern District Court and then it was appealed by the state and the eleven Circuit Court of Appeal reversed the lower court's ruling and sided with the stay to Florida and you know required that you know, people pay outstanding legal

financial obligations. Folks looked at that as a setback. We looked at it as an opportunity to step up. What we did was that we end up organizing the entire country, over eighty eight thousand people from all over this country. We organized celebrities like Michael Jordan and Lebron James, Michael Vick,

Ariana Grande. We organized corporations like Levi's and Viacom, you know, and all kinds of foundations to raise over twenty five million dollars twenty five million dollars to help people remove those obstacles so if they want you, they're able to participate in democracy right now. To me, that was so beautiful. So when their challenges that we faced, we take those opportunities to do great things, to do amazing things, and we used it not to further divide our country, but

we used it to bring our country together. And there were people who were conservative that donated to that because we were talking about democracy, that no American citizens should be forced to choose between putting food on their table or voting. It's it shouldn't be a decision they will be forced to made, you know. And folks stood up and said they were gonna free to vote in Florida because the markets she should not be held hostage. And to me, that was beautiful. Let me tell you something.

We like courageous people, right, but we can't have the courageous people unless we have fear. And so these moments, these obstacles, in these attempts to suppress our vote or

intimidate preventers from voting. We should look at these moments as opportunities to show how courageous we are, because the level of courage that we need to show up to vote this year is nowhere near the level of courage that our ancestors had to muster up to fight through the state sanction violence, to fight through the hangings and the burnings, to fight through the just outright blatant a

terrorism that was rained down upon them. And so this little bit of something here, nah man, this is the time that we step up and we look forward to these opportunities because now when they're trying to do that, we show up with even more people. So I'm glad you're trying to be suppressive because now I can get more Pooky the ray Raids to come out and hang out with me and vote. You know what I'm saying.

I'm glad that you that you want to try to make it difficult for us to get access to the ballot box, because now you're gonna help us engage most celebrities and make them more aware. So now they're not just getting involved because of this election, they're planning on get involved long term. So now instead of having one or two. Harry Belafontes. Man, We're about to have hundreds of Harry Belafontes in our entertainment and sports industry. That

is great, you know what I'm saying. And that sets the foundation for a more vibrant democracy as we're moving forward. So hey, bring it on, Bring it on, man. Look at you gotta look at you didn't get those muscles by just sitting back relaxing. You had to get some weights, didn't you. You have to experienced some tensions. And you know the most important thing you had to do to get those muscles. You had to tear some See. You know what I'm saying. That's the only way the other

than layer is going to grow. And you can only tear it if you experience tension. And so I embrace these moments. People who bully people, you know what they are in college point. We already know that, right. But this is what we also know, though, is that when you stand up the people like that and you punch them in their mouths, you know they'll turn tail and run.

They'll turn tail and run. And what I say is that for people like me, I've been in prison, I've been hooked on drugs, a matter of fact, I've been hooked on crack all right, I've been homeless, I've faced down death. People like me don't scary easy. So whoever the people out there trying to bully, they pick the right ones with returning citizens, because we don't scare that easy.

And so we're gonna clap back, and we clap back, or we respond to that by showing up with even more people, with more of our family members and friends and more returning and so that democracy would not be intimidated. We're not gonna allow that they got the right ones this time. There's a lot of people who hit me up knowing I was going to talk to you, and they said, how can I help? I see what's going on in the news. I'm fired up, I'm ready to go.

What can I do? And so that's a specific question from listeners to the show, but a more general question putting from your recipe book, what are you encouraging people to do around this election but also beyond it? And I think that it is so important that we find other people to take to the polls with us. And here's the deal. We need to have conversations not only with our friends, but people that we don't normally typically

talk to all the time. We may talk to our next door neighbor, but what about the one of the corner, you know, what about the one across the street? You know. We need to talk to people. We need to interact and come in proximity with our other brothers and sisters. It's out there in the community, people left walking around and may not have the kind of hope or outlook that we have, and just we need to find ways to engage them and bring them to the post with

us point blank. This should be an affair that we want to do and we look forward to doing and not feeling like we have to do. You know. I see the long lines out there now, you know, and it can be daunting. But I think that we have to have that resolve that we are going to show up because we need to make sure that our voices are heard. Because if we don't show up to make sure our voices are heard, then the bottom line is then it's going to be up to other people to

decide whether or not our lives do matter. Yeah, that's the translation. I think a lot of folks are missing, and you put it really really perfectly. Thank you. For that, you get interviewed. A lot of people reach out to you. You run this organization, you're part of this movement. So I want to give you a chance. You know, we're here to talk voting, we're talking democracy and more broadly.

But what do you want to share that I may be having that teed up for you or haven't asked you that you don't get asked to discuss very often, but feels very important to you on this topic. I mean, that's a great question. So here's the one I think that you know, I don't think it gets a enough about the sacrifices. You know, a lot of times folks just see the end results. You know, they see oh yeah, I remember four past and don't really have a deeper

appreciation for the sacrifices than it takes. I was in the meeting today and and I think what I want to share with folks, and what I shared with the meeting, you got to figure out who you are. Are you the chicken and you the cow? With you there you the pig? Right? And what I mean by that is that you've got the really understand that there's a difference between the contribution and the commitment and how the best way to understand it is through thinking about the ham

and cheese on it. Because we know that the greens of the ham and cheese omelet is the eggs, the ham, the cheese, if you're poorl like me growing up, the milk, right, And so we know that the milk and the cheese come from the cow, the eggs come from the chicken, and the ham come from the pig. Well, the cole made the contribution to the ham and cheese almor, The chicken made a contribution to the ham and cheese armor. The pig made a commitment to the ham and cheese almor.

And we've got to understand that gifts what all three, all three are needed to get the ham and cheese omelet. We just need to know what role we're playing in that in that particular situation. And at the end of the day, you've got to find something that you're willing to die for, right, and really be serious about and not let it just be rhelory because a lot of

times we do use rhetory. You know, I've heard so many people that I die from our children, but yet they won't turn up to a PTA meeting for their children. So I look at that the rhetoric, but when you die for your child, that means you'll fight for your children. That means you will show up and make sure they're getting the right type of education and all of that other stuff. I'm talking about something that you're willing to invest your whole body and soul. Let you what are

you willing to sacrifice for? And when you find that thing that you embrace it. And this work that we're doing here it could look glamorous, but at the end of the day, there's a specific amount of sacrifice that had to go into it. And I would like every now and then when I've been interviewed to talk about what some of those sacrifices are. But there is there's

a lot that I had to sacrifice. I had to make, but I was willing to do so because, like I told my my team the other month, I'm at peach for myself now because I found something other than my family that I'm willing to die for. And I'm good now, bro, But I am willing to die to make sure that every American citizen have opportunity to experience what I experienced when I voted for the first time in over thirty years.

I'm willing to die to make sure that every American citizen has an opportunity to experience what I experienced when I voted for the first time in thirty years. Thus spoke Desmond Meade, So what are you willing to die for? What are you willing to commit to? Are you going to play the role of the chicken, the cow, or the pig to make sure we make this omelet Desmond Meade.

He really could create an amazing cookbook, goodn't he? You can find his organization, the Florida Rights Restoration Coalition, on their website Florida r r C dot com or follow them on social They're everywhere at f L Rights Restore. That's Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter. You can find Desmond on Twitter at Desmond Mead m E A d E. Or on Instagram. Add the number forty four after that, Desmond Meadet.

Thank you, Desmond for a powerful, powerful lesson. We are posting this episode the transcript, show notes, and more as usual at how to citizen dot com. And as usual, it is now time to get into the actions for this episode. In our first category, internal actions Things you can do alone A bit more reflective We've got three things for you. Answer this question Desmond's question, do you know anyone that you love that's ever made a mistake?

Think about it. Number two, Answer this question, Desmond's question, are you the chicken, the cow or the pig? Because that's how you make an homly. You need all those things. But the cow makes a contribution, the chicken makes a contribution, the pig makes a commitment. We need all those roles to make this omelet of self governance and people power and democracy. What role are you gonna play? Where and how? Think about it. Lastly, in the internal section, read Desmond's

book It's Great. Let my people vote My battle to restore the civil rights of returning citizens. We have it linked in the show notes. We also have it in our online bookshop, which is adding more titles by the week. Visit it at bookshop dot org, slash shop slash how to citizens for the external actions feeling sets of threes right now, so three here Support the Florida Rights Restoration Coalition.

Go to Florida r RC dot com, slash volunteer. Make yourself useful to this pro democracy movement in our midst Find other people to take to the polls virtually or actually we've recommended this before. We can't recommend it enough. Talk about voting all the time, and coordinate with your squad to get it done. Help each other out. You don't have to do this alone. And lastly, spread some good news. We are inundated with depressing information or outright

disinformation during this time. Amplify the opposite. Find a good news story about voting or about democracy more broadly, and tell everybody you know. The Solutions Journalism Network has a great resource at Solutions Journalism dot org slash hub, and they've got this carousel of recently published beautiful news which will actually strengthen your faith. Let's do this together. It's the only way to get it done. Thank you, Thank

you as usual. If you do any of these actions, big or small, tell somebody tell us email action at how to citizen dot com. Put Desmond in the subject line, or maybe a chicken or cow or pig. We'll figure it out and use the hashtag how to citizen online. Send us general feedback to comments at how to citizen dot com, and you can visit the show's website at how to citizen dot com. It really helps the word of mouth, so leave a review. Tell somebody about this show.

If it's helping you, citizen better, let them know how do Citizen with barrettuon Day is a production of I Heart Radio Podcasts. Executive produced by Miles Gray, Nick Stump, Elizabeth Stewart and barretton Day Thursday, produced by Joel Smith, Edited by Justin Smith. Powered by you