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$45 upfront for three months plus taxes and fees, promoting for new customers for limited time, unlimited more than 40 gigabytes per month, slows, full turns at MintMobile.com. I recently had a bad week. So bad that my older brother, who is 44 years old, lives across the country, has two little kids and a pretty big job, texted me and said, want me to get on a plane? We can eat pizza and watch romcoms and not talk for a week. I said no, but he was right. That was the thing to offer.
These movies play an important role in our lives. Their hope, pretty costumes, pretty people and swelling music accompany us through bad weeks. They are the medicine that our 44 year old brothers offer us. They are considered light and fluffy. But I think what we mean by that is that these movies are accompanying rather than challenging.
Because these movies are not bad. What I have learned over the last 10 episodes of making this podcast is that even a pretty ridiculous movie, like How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days, has professionals at the top of their fields doing excellent work. The closer attention I pay to this movie, the more impressed I am by its craft. By its efficiency, yes. But also by its true skill.
At the end of last season, we realized that the true love story in Prednipredchitus isn't between Lizzy and Darcy, but between the reader and Lizzy. And the same is true here in How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days. Its greatest weapon is what the greatest weapon always is, the leading lady. I was lucky enough to chat with Ann Helen Peterson about this movie. Ann is arguably one of the great culture critics of our time, the author of the Culture Study newsletter and host of the Culture Study podcast.
She saw How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days in theaters when it came out, and many times since then. And here's what she said about why this movie works. Kate Hudson vibrates off the screen. Like she's just, she's zany, right? Like she is. She's hot and zany and charismatic. Yes, so charismatic, like a cult leader, which is why the more I appreciate this movie, the more mildly disturbed I am by its confused messaging.
All of this talent and skill used to take care of me in my bad weeks, but also to potentially send some unclear, at best messaging to me when I'm weak. Even throwaway lines from the rom coms we watch again and again get under our skin. Nora Efron was making fun of Sally in one hairy Met Sally when Sally said,
and yet as 40 loomed, I thought, oh God, this is the age Sally was scared of becoming. So with all of its craft and talent behind it, the last question I really have to ask about how to lose a guy in 10 days is, how is this movie working on me? And the message that this movie gives us is clear. Next good, Celine Dion, bad, regular Coke, good, diet Coke, bad, backless dress, good, matching your dress with your headband and purse, bad.
And it is only because Kate Hudson is so flippant cute that any of this is remotely palatable. After remember that this is 10 years before Gillian Flynn killed the cool girl in her novel and then the movie Gone Girl once and for all. Cool girl is hot cool girl is gay cool girl is fun cool girl never gets angry at her man. She only smiles in a shagrin loving man. Here's Anne Helen Peterson again.
I think anyone who is around our age has to unpack a lot when it comes to core girls because it was so fetishized and venerated for so long before Gillian Flynn described it very perfectly in a way that blew up the stereotype entirely. And I think that I talk with a lot of women about trying to figure what they actually do like because for a long time they're like I shouldn't like that or I shouldn't act like that or I shouldn't want that.
And that could be intimacy that could be things that are overly feminized that could be ways of dressing. Because they don't fit this larger cool girl understanding. So I think that it is an incredibly useful tool. For when you come across those moments in your life and you're like wait a second. Do I actually feel like I don't like that do I actually feel like that's stupid or do I feel like that's not worth my time or whatever how much of that is.
This programming that if I do like those things, then boys won't like me. But then I always get stuck on the character of Michelle played so brilliantly by Catherine Han. Michelle is Andy's friend who is so needy and feminine and floral that Andy is basing her performance of annoying woman on Michelle. Michelle is not a cool girl and yet at the end of the movie she gets her guy. So every time I get to the end of the movie, I find myself confused.
Is it saying that you have to be a cool girl like Andy to get the guy? No, because Michelle gets her guy in the end too. So was the movie saying that Andy has men in dating politics all wrong that men don't actually want cool girls? That doesn't feel right either because the fact that Michelle gets her guy feels like it's in spite of parts of her personality. And it's a twist that she could actually hook a guy. Whereas no one is surprised that Matthew McConaughey wants Andy.
I brought this confusion to Anne Helen Peterson. Does Andy learn something in this movie? Oh, like, oh, hot guys will always like me. Like that's honestly that's the lesson of this movie. If you look like Kate, don't worry about it. The lesson of this movie is that Kate Hudson is hot and charming. Yeah. What do you think? I know I'm trying to figure it out.
I mean, there's the moment where she's sitting on Michelle's couch and the guy comes back to Michelle and is like, all those creepy things that you did, it turns out I liked it. And I think that she potentially learns, yeah, that like being your authentic self will get you your authentic match. Yeah. And that like asking Michelle to not be Michelle, she wouldn't have gotten this guy. Right. You don't have to perform.
The real self was there and then she tried to dissuade him by not being the real self. So the real like, if you're just your real self, like things will happen as they're meant to be. If you pay very close attention to this movie, meaning if you watch it upwards of 10 times in six months and then talk to world-filled experts, you may eventually realize that Andy actually loves the song, You're So Vane, and knows all the lyrics. This is not a cool girl thing to do.
Loving this song shows that there's a bridge between the cool sexy Andy that Ben met the other night and the psycho matching Andy, that she has been weaponizing to torture and lose Ben despite how hot she is. Then you might realize that Ben doesn't just love cool Andy, but loves the hyper ambitious, hyper competitive one who likes angry girl music too. How nice.
All I have to do is be myself and Matthew McConaughey will love me and then because I married, we'll have two incomes and I'll worry about money less. And then I can quit my job before I have my next job and go after my dream career of writing about politics. Of course that's what I want to watch on my couch when I'm having a bad week. I just think that this movie wants to have it both ways. It wants me to think I could have the dream while also laughing at my dream, calling it desperate.
Here's me talking to Anne Helen Peterson one last time. So one of the things that we're tracking is like who we're laughing at and when. And that's one of the other interesting things about this movie, right? For the most part, we are laughing at Ben. Yeah. Because like she's scheming. She's setting him up. She's setting up the booby traps or the right like parent trap stuff. And he's then like tripping over all of it.
Yeah. And so I think that that's another way that this movie is sort of like light on its feet in terms of the gender politics. You're not laughing at Andy. And yet the gender politics of who you're laughing at still feels bad. Right. Because you're laughing at Ben feel cringe. But like he's cringing because like women are crazy. Right. You're laughing at this idea of women. Yes. Right. The idea of women that Andy is able to disarticulate herself from because she's not like those other girls.
And we are able to disarticulate her from that role because we know we're in on the joke. Right. We know so clearly that she is performing and this isn't her true self. And also that the rest of Kate Hudson's star image at that time and now reminds us of that is the case. If I hadn't watched this movie 10 times, I can guarantee you that I would not have picked up on all of these things on the politics of gender and desirability. Definitely would not have reflected on how it and movies like it.
Subliminally impacted the way that I have imported myself over the last 25 years. Thinking about those questions is what I'm looking forward to as we continue in this series. What a movie is saying to me explicitly and what it is actually saying to me subtextually. Now that I can stop watching how to lose a guy in 10 days, I do think I'll miss it. Ben's tight t-shirts and Andy's evolving relationship with her curly hair.
But when I do miss it, I'll just water my plants and be thankful that they can't actually die in 10 days. And I'll put on a matching outfit and listen to Fiona Apple knowing that all of this is sexy because I'm just being myself. This podcast is brought to you by eHarmony, the dating app to find someone you can be yourself with. Why doesn't eHarmony allow copy and piece in first messages? Because you are unique and your conversations should reflect that.
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Only at a sleep number store or sleepnumber.com. So it is time for us to look not just at any scene of Hadalusicae in 10 days, but at the final scene we have made it to the end of this movie. In order to start off our season and looking at a scene, we spoke to the wonderful Lauren Sandler, my co-host for the previous seasons of Hot and Bothered. So today we decided to get my co-host for our upcoming season of Hot and Bothered, Hannah McGregor on the phone to look at this scene with me.
Let's give Hannah a call. Hi Hannah. Hi Vanessa. So I just made you watch the final scene of this film with me. Can you please summarize for the people what happened? So Ben has read Andy's article in which she basically says that she fell in love with him and he is chasing her down. He goes to her place of work where he does not find her but is briefly ogled by her colleagues.
He picks up their love forn and finds out she is headed to Washington for a job interview and he is like I got a stopper from Leven Town. And so he hops on his motorcycle and heads to her home. He sees her getting into the cab after exchanging a very fun tug with I believe her a door man.
She takes off in a New York cab and then there's a real fun chase scene where there's so many cabs that he can't tell which one she's in and he keeps like pulling up the side cabs and looking in and being like is that Andy and it's not. He finally catches up to her on the Manhattan bridge and she convinces the cab driver to pull over even though it's a bridge by threatening to puke in an estuary.
And they have a confrontation by the side of the road where she says that she has to go to Washington because that's the only place she can write the kinds of stories she actually wants to write and he says bullshit in his amazing Matthew McConaughey accent and does a lot of like sassy body language is like I'm calling you out.
She's like a lightning bolt throughout the scene. He's like standing all angles. It's very like one one hip is out and one shoulder is up and the neck is sort of cocked and it's very like what you're going to do about it at the OK. Yeah, it does kind of feel like a shootout doesn't it? He's got a kind of gunslinger hip going on. But instead of a shootout it's a bluff off and he calls her bluff and then they truly open their whole entire mouths on each other's mouth.
I feel like he opens his mouth more than she does it looks like he's trying to swallow her it's open. It is a open mouth kiss and then the camera pans away. Yep, as they make out on the bridge as sparks fly and then he's like oh look it's our love for and she does a joke about not cool Andy one more time and goes oh boobie boobie boobie. Also, he pays the cab driver to take her luggage home and TBD whether that cab driver actually does that or takes the money and leaves.
I trust the cab driver what I don't trust the cab driver to do is remember the exact address of where she lives. I'd be like where did I pick her up? This was my 800th fair today like best of intentions. Where does this lady live? There's no consequences to this and these people were annoying. I'm going to take this money and drive away forever. I know. Okay, so what do you think of this scene romantic a G A what are your thoughts?
I mean, I love a chase at the end of a rom com. I love the generation of some artificial steaks as though if she gets on the plane to Washington she can never come back.
And he can't go and hurt and he can't and there's no phones and they can't wait until they've gotten off the bridge which is only a little further like I enjoy that as an affectation of rom coms because I think it is a reminder of the way that like small things become larger than life when you are intensely emotionally invested in them like no he needs to get her now.
He has had a major emotional revelation and he needs to talk to her now and we don't have cell phones. I like that. You know, I find it both funny and charming as a as a conceit of the genre and for better for worse, I find this couple pretty frickin cute together. Yeah, I like I like the way that they're like a little me just gave away something about myself. I believe you.
Do you believe that I like that I do like that I like one of my love languages is people reading me and I like that in this final scene he is reading her. Yeah, and his body language so sassy so sassy I just hate this scene that she's like I need to move to Washington DC for my career and he's like bullshit. I'm like you don't know maybe she kind of does need to move to Washington DC for her career. I know that there are writing jobs in New York.
It's just very quick that she gives up on like what might be an important job opportunity why can't she go to Washington and do this job interview. I can't think of a single reason. I like that's all like there's an assela from New York to DC. You all have only been dating 10 days and you've spent a lot of the time lying to each other. Of course I mean that as a conceit like you pretending you care about your career is you hiding from the actual thing which is love.
I feel like is kind of a conceit of the 2000's romcom yeah right this like oh you're a busy career woman must be that you're actually hiding from what you really want. Which you know I think I have a tendency to take that less seriously because it is so transparently goofy to me as a conceit totally. But you are right that is the assumption that like you're just afraid like I do have a job interview in a different city and I have booked a flight.
So I just don't think anything would be lost in the movie if he was like we'll go to the interview there advertising jobs in DC and she goes really and he goes well let's see how it plays out and then they make out on the bridge. Like I just don't think that that's less emotionally resonant of him saying to the cab driver please take the ladies stuff to LaGuardia she's got a ride.
I don't know like I just don't believe he just shows up on the plane beside her and it's like we're both going to Washington. I want to support you in this I yeah I just like don't think that that's less emotionally resonant and so I am all for sacrificing feminism for the emotional resonance of a good romcom ending. I just think that this is a moment where I could have my cake and eat it too and so let me yeah yeah I mean I guess the matically it matters because she has held him a moment.
She has held him emotionally added distance through her sort of treating of him as a objective of writing like that her career and her like what I actually care about here is being a writer has been a tool that she has used to not give into the sort of vulnerability of being in love. So like there's some thematic resonance there but you're you're right at the end of the day they could have just hopped over to Washington real quick for a job interview and then eaten her face.
And then just just swallow that whole fit can't go to a job interview when you have a face. That's true you would have had to not eat her face. As the saying goes I like this activity of talking about the ending of a movie and then speculating about how we would have improved it could we do it again several times why don't we do this is part of our new podcast every other week from now on. Oh a great idea of fabulous promise.
So Hannah we are now starting the main series of hot and bothered where we are going to be looking at a romantic movie mostly rom coms we're going to take two weeks to look at every movie. We are going to start with the film sleepless in Seattle because we are going to spend a few weeks thinking just about the rom com goddess Meg Ryan. Yeah we're going to really we're going to get into Meg Ryan and the exciting politics of her haircuts.
We have to start with sleepless in Seattle because Gina who loves sleepless in Seattle know who Benjamin Barry and how to lose a guy in 10 days. My God the segue the segue podcasters it's like professionals are making this podcast. You actually get graded at the end of every year as a podcaster with how how many segways you were able to successfully do.
And so we're really racking them up so we are going to start in two weeks sleepless in Seattle and then we are going to make our way through the of of Meg Ryan. Hannah I'm so excited to make this podcast with you same I can't wait. You've been listening to hot and bothered we are not sorry production our executive producer is me and a sultan our consulting producer is Russell made. And a huge thanks to Russ for helping us shape this entire series.
We are edited and produced by Ariana Nettelman and distributed by a cast. Thank you so much to our soulmate level patrons Molly really who we would chase through an airport to declare our love to Becky Boo who we would wait for. For hours on the Empire State Building for Elizabeth Schwindsburg whose heart we would play a game of one on one basketball for. And then Lauren Bayer O'Connell who we would choreograph a dance for and dance it in front of the entire summer camp.
A huge thanks this week to Anne Helen Peterson a huge thanks for the last several months to the brilliant Hannah rehab for talking to me week after week about this weird movie. And thanks to our team Julia Erge Nikki Zoltan AJ Irama's Hannah rehab Margaret E. Twilson Caitlin Hoffmeister Courtney Brown Natalie Fulcert's Fidious Reyes and Stephanie Paul Sal. This podcast is brought to you by eHarmony the dating app to find someone you can be yourself with.
And it doesn't eHarmony allow copy and piece in first messages because you are unique and your conversations should reflect that eHarmony wants you to find someone who will get you. How are you going to know who gets you and people seeing you the same generic conversation starters they message everyone else conversations that actually help you get to know each other. Imagine that get to get you on eHarmony sign up today.