Steph/LeBron Comparisons

a bunch of different ways. Now. We had the weird interview where somebody said that Steph was the Michael Jordan of this era. We had the Bill Simmons podcast for him and Syrah, so he went all in on a couple of different topics related to whether or not step was the best player of the last ten years, and whether or not him and Lebron have had different different

levels of impact on the game, changing the game of basketball. Um. So, the three main questions that I want to hit today in the step Lebron conversation is one, is Steph the Michael Jordan of this era? And then two, could Steph ever pass Lebron? And then last, how did Lebron and Steph change the game? Just kind of getting into that because there's a lot of people who think step step has changed the game, but Lebron hasn't. But Lebron has changed the game in a lot of ways. So I

wanted to get into that as well. So let's start with this Michael Jordan's concept. So you know, obviously Steph is not the Michael Jordan of this era because he hasn't been better than Lebron James. That said, you know, I don't even think Lebron James has been the Michael Jordan of this era because there's a huge difference between the way that MJ dominated the league in the way

that Lebron dominant dominated the league. Now, there's a couple of different elements to that, right, because MJ dominated the league in the nineties during an era where both Larry Bird and Magic Johnson had their careers cut short by

on like unfortunate circumstances. Larry Bird throughout his back towing his driveway and French lack and and Magic Johnson got hib and in both cases, guys who in their late primes would have been able to go on a run to potentially derail Michael Jordan's championship contenders just never really got that chance, and so then you ended up with guys who were in a significantly lower tier all time trying to take titles off of m J. Guys like

you know, Karl Malone, guys like Charles Barkley. And so part of that is you have to give credit to Michael Jordan's for being so much better than everybody in his era. That is a legitimate, uh testament to how

good he was at the time. But at the same time, you know, you also have to factor in the fact that you didn't have a year like this year where you're looking at Lebron and Kevin Durant and Steph Curry and Nicola Yokich and Jana Santana Croompo all playing like super duper duper duper duper stars, like there's there never There hasn't been a season like that during the nineties that we could look back to and be like, here's a year where MJ dominated an unbelievably stacked top of

the league. It just didn't happen. So again, you could choose to interpret that two ways. You can interpret it as MJ was just way better than everybody. So that's a credit to MJ or MJ took advantage of a downturn in talent in the NBA. There's a bunch of different ways to look at that, but Lebron, who has been by far the most dominant player of this era, even that dominance isn't the same type of dominance that

you saw from Michael Jordan's. So that's why I compared them more to the Lebron step dynamic, to me, compares a lot more to the Magic Johnson Larry Bird rivalry that took place in the eighties. Now those two players are closer all time than Stephan Lebron are. I have Lebron to maybe one, depending on what they asked me. I have Steph right around number ten, whereas Bird and Magic are both in that four five range. So they're

definitely closer to each other than Stephan Lebron were. But Stephan Lebron are definitely a lot closer to each other than Michael was to anybody that he played against in his era. So that's kind of what I was trying to say. A lot of people interpreted that tweet that I sent out as some sort of shot at Lebron. It wasn't at all. It's just the dynamic between Lebron and Steph it's very different now, uh than than the mj dynamic was in that era. But could could Steph

be the Michael Jordan's this era? Absolutely not, because what Michael Jordan did in the nineties is kind of unprecedented in modern basketball. There hasn't been anybody in this era who has come close to that level of dominance, and that needs to be respected. That that phrase is somebody the Michael Jordan of this era just shouldn't be thrown out unless we have a player come into the league who is just monumentally better than everybody else in the game.

That's what it would require to to receive that distinction. Okay, moving on to question number two. Could Steff ever pass Lebron?

Of course you could. There's nothing saying that Steph. Couldn't, you know, rip off an MVP this year in the finals, MVP this year, and then come back next year and be an MVP again and win another NBA title and rip off two or three in a row, and all of a sudden you're looking at a guy who's got five or six titles and was definitively the best player on you know, multiple championship teams that he would certainly become a conversation, but he does have a long way

to go. That's the important thing that you have to understand, and it's a lot easier said than done. Like it's it's it's one thing to look at the situation and be like, Okay, Steph is on arguably the best team in the league right now, and he's he's you know, in the conversation for m v P, although I think Kevin Durant has surpassed him in recent weeks because he

hasn't been playing as well. But let's say, you know, it's just the the idea of step ripping off multiple m v P s and ripping off multiple titles at this point, it could happen, but it's a long shot. A lot of things have to break his way. He has to stay healthy, he has to avoid a physical decline. He needs to get something out of Andrew Wiggins. He needs to get something out of Jonathan Cominga and Jonathan and James Wiseman. He needs Draymond Green to not physically decline.

He needs Klay Thompson to come back from this injury and to look like more or less what he was and before he got hurt. A lot of things have to break right for that to happen, but it could. And I'm not like, yeah, I'm a Lebron fan, but I'm not beholden to him. I'm not like, in the first and foremost, even though I am a Lebron fan, I'm a basketball fan and I take NBA history very seriously.

That's why I've been so heads attempt to put Lebron above Michael Jordan's because I do think there's a certain amount of respect that is owed in that direction. And I feel the same way you know about this Lebron Steps situation. Steph has a lot to accomplish in order

to pass Lebron, but it certainly is possible. But you have to keep in mind, like with Lebron, even if even if you just like a lot of people want to simplify it to Lebron has four rings and step has three rings, but it's actually a lot more complicated than that. Like Lebron on all four of those championship teams was definitively the very best player on his team, whereas with Steph there's one in two thousand fift team, where he was definitively the best player on his team.

But then there's the other two where you know he was playing with somebody who arguably was better than him at the time. Now, I personally think that Steph at the time was every bit as good as Kadi, if not a little bit better. But there are people who think that kat was better, and those teams, you have to admit that specific accomplishment doesn't necessarily feel the same as a Lebron in two thousands sixteen beating the Warriors

with with Kevin Love and Kyrie Irving. The point is is, obviously no two titles are weighed the same, and I'm not trying to undercut titles by any stretch of the imagination, but Lebron's four are clearly different than steps three, two of which he did he got alongside Kevin freaking Durant

at the absolute peak of his powers. But even if we set that aside, even if we said, okay, Steph has four titles, Lebron has four titles, you have to look at the rest of Lebron's resume for him to have made First Team All m b A as many times as he has for him to win four m vps, and I think he absolutely should have one at five. A lot of the ones in NBA history that people look at as Lebron should have one m v P,

I actually disagree. But in particular the year they just won the title, he should have won the MVP that year. That should not have been Nice's award. It was a huge benefit thrown to Janice through advanced metrics and a lot of things that had to do with the Bucks playing in a terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible Eastern Conference, and that was legitimized when he lost quickly in the bubble.

The point being, you know, Lebron has this extensive resume, multiple m vps, multiple you know what does he have now? Ten finals appearances. There's so much more to Lebron's resume above and beyond what you get with the championships that it's just it's so much would have to be added to what Steph has done in order for him to pass Lebron. And you guys know, like I'm not. I got to do a conversation with a couple of guys yesterday about this on Twitter. But you know, you don't

have to love one and hate the other. That's been the most confusing thing to me over the course of my time being on Twitter, seeing people think like, Okay, I like Steph, so therefore I must hate Lebron, or I like Lebron, so therefore I must hate Steph. Like to me, when I see stuff like that, I'm like, do you even like basketball? Because I love basketball and I love watching Steph play basketball. Do I get annoyed

sometimes by some of the things his fans say? Sure, but I also get annoyed by the things Lebron James himself does and says, you know, because he could be so corny sometimes. The point is is, like, as a basketball fan, it's I struggle to understand how anybody could not like the two of them, and look at the two of them and understand how much better they are

than everyone else that has played in this era. And again like step has the ability to pass Lebron, and I have a ton of respect for stef and I love the way he plays the game. But right now there's a pretty significant chasm there. He would have to make up a lot of ground over the course of the next few seasons. He has an opportunity to Golden State has a ton of talent, a lot of their talent. He's young. He absolutely has the opportunity to pass Lebron,

but he has a long way to go. And that's not a slight against step And I've heard a lot of people with that tweet that I said out yesterday saying no, it's k D. It should be Braun and k D, or should be Katie and Steph fighting for that third spot. I vehemently disagree. Now, Kevin Durant has a very good basketball resume in its own right, but Steph has accomplished more at every level of the game than Kevin Durant has. He has the more m vps,

he's He's won more championships. He definitively has won a title as the best player on his team. Kevin Durant has not. He may or may not have been better than Steph. And then on a day in, day out basis, over the course of the last decade, Steph has impacted winning more than Kevin Durant has, in my opinion, and that has manifested in the way that his teams have performed in the standings year in and year out. I don't care that they lost in the in the playing

game last year. If you look at that team, they shouldn't even have been in the play in if Steph had not landed on his tailbone on a freaky play where he fell into the stands in the year before he broke his hand. So like, I don't really look too much into that. It's very similar to Lebron missing in twenty is just injury related, but over the worse of the last decade, steps record is unassailable against someone

like KD. So to me, Lebron is definitively number one, but Steph is definitively number two, and Katie is probably definitively number three. But there isn't really there's a very clear and discernible boundary that separates those three guys from each other, in my opinion, And it's not a disrespect to any of them. It's just the reality of what

they've accomplished on the court. Like you can argue whether or not Steph or Lebron has been better in any specific season because maybe you value one skill set over another. Maybe you think what Lebron does impacts winning more, maybe you think what Steph does impacts winning more. But the reality of the situation is in terms of what actually has happened on the scoreboard, in terms of actual team accomplishments, Lebron has Steph beat. He has step beat by significant margin,

and Steph has KD beat by a significant margin. So in terms of their place in history in this lead, it's pretty clear where those three land. But I'm never gonna shut the door on Steph being able to pass Lebron. He certainly came. He just has a long way to go, and I think that it needs to be pointed out now. Moving on, how did how did Lebron and step change the game? This was the big topic that was brought

up in that recent Bill Simmons podcast. So Steph obviously changed the game in a bunch of different ways people think about. You know, there's certain areas of the way step change the game that actually aren't remembered correctly. Like the league was trending heavily towards taking more threes with or without step that would have happened anyway. Where I think Steph changed the league has a lot to do with what the pick and roll ball handler does or

what the isolation ball handler does. It used to be that an off the dribble three point shot was incredibly taboo. You would never it would you would be extremely rare for you'd even see one in m in an NBA game, and almost never at the lower levels, and it was consistently viewed as a low percentage bad shot that was bad for the offense, is bad for the flow in rhythm and confidence of your team. It was just all bad.

And that was kind of the ironic thing of the two thousand fifteen and two thousand sixteen Warriors was Steph taking all these shots that people thought were bad shots that actually ended up being good shots because of how good he was at converting them, which inevitably led to a change in defense. And this is where step changed the game. It's funny if you guys, remember, if you ever watched an NBA game from the late two thousand's, almost every team in the league did some variation of

a hedge and recover on pick and roll defense. So you like, just just imagine watching the old Calves games and you'd see, you know, Larry Hugh's garden the ball handler and the ball handler would come off a ball screen and you see zydrenas galwas kiss or Anderson bears.

Youw like run almost out to half court on like a hedge to try to send the ball handler back, and then the guy guarding the ball handler would go under the screen, and he'd go under the screen and try to meet the ball handler on the other side.

It's a hedge and recover defense. It was the most common pick and roll defense, you know, fifteen years ago that was rendered completely useless by Steph Curry because every single time, as soon as he beat the hedge, the hedger would recover to the roll man and he'd have a little bit of a gap of space between him and the guard going underneath the screen, and he would just make people pay every single time knocking down the three. And now if you watch, almost every team runs a

drop coverage where they chase over the top. Why is that. It's because every guard has now tried to copy what Steph Curry did, which is shoot threes off the dribble, going over the top of a screen and pick and roll. And so now since every single guard in the league

can do that, at least the majority of guards. You know, there are a lot of guards who are extremely good at that, but there are so many guards that are good at shooting coming off the top of the screen that now almost repick and roll defense involves the guy guarding the ball handler to chase over the top of the screen. That is an example of Steph completely changing the game and the irony there there is. You've seen so many guys try to copy Steph by attempting to

take a ton of optagital threes. But what they missed and the reason why those guys aren't as good as step the reason why there's such a huge gap between a guy like Dame Lillard and Steph. You know, it has a lot to do with the other facets of the game that Steff has never gotten enough credit for him moving every single time he passes the ball. He's always in motion. He is never making himself easy to guard.

If you want to guard Steph well for forty eight minutes, it requires a team effort of consistent attention, and every time you lose him, he will make you pay, or at least as a high percentage chance that he will

make you pay. That sort of off ball action that Steph weaponizes is something that no one else has been able to replicate at the guard position, and that's the irony of people trying to be like Steph Is, they miss that huge part of his offensive game and how important that is to UH to staying a threat and making sure that you don't get diminished in your impact in a playoff series, because that's the important detail there.

You know, Steph has shot below from three in his last two playoff runs, that doesn't mean he's played poorly. All shooting percentages, especially on jump shots, go down in the playoffs because guys are tired. It's a much more physical game. It's a much more slower paced game, and it's just harder to make jump shots when you don't have your base underneath you. That's why steps shooting percentages dropped in the playoffs has nothing to do with anything

other than the natural order of things in the playoffs. Now, the flip side of that is that's where all the other things Steph does carries so much value. Everything step Doubs does in terms of his gravity, that absolutely translates to the playoffs. Step everything he does as a defensive player, making it so that you know, like step Is, it's just a bad idea to attack him in isolation now because he's expreien. He's very strong and he does a

good job moving his feet, and he is good. He's got quick hands, and so you know, obviously he might be the best option for you to attack in a lineup with the Warriors that has like Andrew Wiggins and you know UH Andrea Guadala and Klay Thompson in it, right, But the truth of the matter is like even when

you attack step it's not a great matchup. He holds his own and then off the ball, he does a very good job always being in the right spots, using his hands and doing all of the little things necessary to make him a plus defender instead of a minus defender. And that's always been the big difference between him and all of the other UH guards in the league that try to be him. They think it's all about three

point shooting. It's not all about three point shooting. There is a total package to what Steph Curry brings to the table that is different than what these other guards are doing. And that's why those guys can't touch that impact. And that's why what Steph does works all the way through June, whereas you've seen Dame consistently flame out in earlier rounds. It's just a different total package of a

basketball player. Now where I pushed back on what uh real quickly, one last thing with Steph, his off ball style does cultivate a ball movement that is very different than what you see in other offenses. It's very difficult to replicate. You know, We've seen a little bit of it from Spurs teams in the past, but the Warriors just keep the ball moving around really, really well, and a lot of that has to do with Steph being off the ball. But there's a flip side to that.

The role players that play with Steph have to be a certain archetype, whereas the role players that play with Lebron have to be a different archetype. Right, Like we've seen We've literally seen Lebron load up on playmakers like you did in two thousand nineteen, if you guys remember, and it kind of didn't really work because you know, it actually makes more sense to have playmakers with a guy like Steph because with Steph he drags bodies away

from the paint. So what you've really need are guys that can run a lightning quick four on three attack

and get layups or wide open threes. If if that's what it provides with the point being with step you're looking for guys that can attack with an advantage on a shrunken court where the paint is open, So it actually helps better that it helps more to have guys like Andrea Guadala who are not great shooters but can put the ball on the floor and make really smart, intelligent, quick decisions with the basketball, and when they get to the rim, they can finish at the rent, whereas with Lebron,

you actually do want shooters and cutters. You want guys that do stuff without the ball in their hands. You want guys that have a good understanding of when to cut off the ball to the to the basket, and you want shooters that do a good job of relocating and doing things off the ball to occupy defenders so that Lebron can attack or when they're guys help that can consistently make you pay. And then obviously for both guys,

you want them to be able to defend. But that's the point, like they both played super unique styles that require specific types of role players, he swapped Lebron and Steph today, arguably both teams would underachieve to where they are now because of the way that those specific role player groups are catered to their specific skill sets. So moving on to Lebron, because this is this is where I disagreed with what Bill Simmon was saying, because built

Lebron James absolutely has changed the game. When Lebron came into the league, when he was playing with Paul Silas, if you ever go back and watch, you could find it. All you have to do is look at old highlight films of Lebron when he was a rookie. Look up the one when he was playing against Tracy McGrady, that famous Christmas Day game. He was constantly off the ball.

And not only was he off the ball, they had like to kind of they put like two big guys on the block, and they'd set kind of constant cross screens and they'd have Lebron run the baseline, and when he'd run the baseline, he'd catch on one of the wings and if he was open, he'd shoot a jump shot a lot of times midrange jump shots, or he

catch an attack. But a lot of what Lebron was doing was what all small forwards and power forwards at the time, like if they were really talented offensive players, a point guard would bring the ball up the floor. They'd run an action to get you to a spot on the floor where you thought you could succeed, and they would hit you in that spot and let you go to work, kind of like what Carmelo Anthony did

during his whole career. Carmelo Anthony is an example of a player who came at the same time as Lebron, but rather than changing the game the way Lebron did, Carmelo kind of became the ultimate version of what we were doing as a league at that time. Lebron popularized helio centrism, and this is a style of basketball, just like with Steph that people have attempted to recreate, but

they fail. We've seen guys like James Harden, like Trey Young, like Luca don Chez attempt to do what Lebron does, but for whatever reason, it just doesn't have the same level of impact. And there's a very specific reason for that when you get into a playoff setting in particular, and by the way, when I say helio centrism a quick definition, I just mean get the ball in the hands of your best player, not your point guard, but your best player, and effectively have him play point guard.

At the top of the key with the spread floor either an isolation or the high pick and roll, and let him consistently make decisions out of that. With the spread floor, it's just really hard to guard a guy thirty ft from the basket, So he's probably gonna beat his man off the dribble, and then from there he's gonna get you in rotation. He's either gonna get you helping at the rim or missing a cut or something along along those lines on the weak side, and he's

gonna consistently make you pay. But the key difference between that style the way Lebron does it, in the way that You're Lucas and your Trays and your James Harden's do it is Labron applies consistent rim pressure and there so, essentially in a playoff series when teams are switching a lot and it becomes kind of an isolation contest, the guys that get to the rim, the guys that get high percentage shots at the rim, typically win those battles, whereas guys that depend on step back jump shots or

Finnesse type of moves away from the basket, they succumb to the fatigue elements. That's where that's why James Harden is shot so poorly in the playoffs in his career. That's step back three. Any of you have ever done that shot before? Have you ever tried that shot? It's it's every bit as athletic a move as a dunk. To generate the separation you need stepping back and to get enough lift to knock the shot down. It's like

a dunk. It's extremely tiring, and so when you get like when you're tired and you get to the basket. As long as you're getting to the basket, you can still make those layups at a high percentage, right, But if you're taking step back three's and you're tired, they're probably gonna start missing. And that's what you see happen with Luca, That's what you see happen with James Harden. So that's what you see happen with the tray Youngs

of the world. They play a helio centric style, but they rely on more difficult shot making, and when the fatigue elements of the postseason come into play, they tend to fade. But we've seen lebron Celio's entric style last all the way through the end of June consistently because of his specific attack, his method of attack, and there are a bunch of other elements too, right, Like, Lebron is probably a better passer than all three of those guys,

So that's another reason why that works. Just like with step he's an off the dribble jump shooter, but he's just way better off the dribble jump shooting than any of those guys. So you're not only are you trying to copy a specific skill that you're not as good at, but you miss all of the other elements. And then the big one of the other big difference is the last thing I wanted to mention about Lebron's heliocentric attack is the way that he attacks from different spots on

the floor. When you watch James Harden, chances are it's gonna be a live dribble thirty ft from the basket, either on the left wing or the right wing, and he's either going to call a ball screen or it's gonna be isolation. But it's gonna be a series of dribbles between the legs, either setting to a left right crossover, right to left crossover, or into his step back three. You're consistently going to see that there will never be a point in the game where James Harden catches in

the corner and tries to make something happen. There will never be a point in the game where James Harden posts you up. There will never be a point in the game where James Harden tries to get a face up touch at the midpost or the high post. There will never be a point in the game where James is going to run the floor and do a deep seal underneath the basket. You're getting all of that with Lebron. Lebron is going to mix in post ups. Lebron is going to mix up face up, mix in face ups.

He's gonna mix in dives to the basket off the ball where he tries to get easy touches right under the rim for layoffs. He's going to, you know, find like probably a half dozen different types of attack that he brings at you in a playoff series, mixed in with your normal heliocentric, high pick and roll, high isolation type of players, and so becomes because of that, it becomes much harder to guard him over the course of a playoff series when you're Guarden James Harden. There's a

reason why he struggles towards end of games. You give a guy like you know, you give a good defensive player who's guarding him possessions in a row to watch the same move at the top of the key, like chances are eventually he's gonna pick up on cues. Okay, I think he's gonna go left here. Okay, I think he's gonna go right here. Oh, it looks like he's

setting up for a step back. You eventually become a tuned to what they're doing, and you figure out how to eventually start to bother them a little bit more on those shots, and that's when the misses start coming. You can't do that with Lebron because he mixes it up so much. If you started sitting on some of his isolation moves far from the basket, he will post

you up. If you're too strong and he's not getting a physical advantage on you in the post, he'll move you further away from the basket and try to face you up. He has so many different angles to his offensive attack that he stays versatile enough that he doesn't get undercut by the normal things that undercut offensive basketball

players in the postseason. So kind of insummation looking back at this, Yes, Lebron and Steph both have brought changes to the game, and Lebron with his heliocentrism, stepped with his author dribble, jump shooting, and with everything else that he does on the basketball court. But the truth of the matter is is nobody in the league does it as well as they do it, and that's why they're

still in the top tier. That's why step at his age and Lebron at his age are still in the top tier superstars in the league, and why everyone who tries to be like them seems to fail. It's because everyone wants to minimize what they do down to one thing like Steps shooting right or Lebron high pick and roll or high isolation, when the reality is that they do so much more to impact the game, and everyone who tries to be like them inevitably comes up short.

Now everyone brings a different touch right, like Janice is going to find a whole new angle to his game. Janice is basically, you know, Joannice is basically a shock that dribbles from the perimeter. So he's kind of unprecedented in his own way. And just watch, I bet you the raptors try to do this um um with Scotty Barnes. They're gonna try to turn him into honest. And the truth of the matter is Joannice is honest. No one else is going to be able to be what Janice

can can be. You know, everyone talks about Ben Simmons. If I swapp Ben Simmons, Ben Simmons onto the Bucks, would he be able to do what Jannice does? Hell no, absolutely not. There's Janice is a one of one. Step is a one of one. Lebron is a one of one, and there's there there's nothing. There's no ability to to

recreate what they do. Um. But I just I wanted to, you know, because the Steph Lebron topic can be so toxic because Step fans hate Lebron fans, or step fans hate Lebron for whatever reason, and Lebron fans hate step for whatever reason, which, like I said earlier, is lame because if you like the game of basketball, you should like them both. You can dislike a basketball player for regular reasons, right, Like I'm not a huge fan of James Harden and his style of play, but that's not

associated to my like for another player. I don't dislike James Harden because I like Lebron James, you know, but there's a lot of Steph fans who dislike Lebron just because they like Steph. And there are a lot of Lebron fans who dislike Steph just because they like Lebron.

And I've always thought that was silly. And when I look back at this era, I'm really thankful that I got to watch this era because this is two of the top ten basketball players, top ten basketball players of all time, who have gone to gone to war basically consistently over the course of this decade, and they've definitively been you know, any given season, if you pick they're

the best player in the world. You know, like it it's been cool to be able to winness this and I hate that people want to undercut one of them to raise up the other, you know, Like it's like if you if you prefer Michael Jordan over Lebron, just say you thought Michael was better. It doesn't have to be.

Lebron plays in a Pansy league, right Like, if you think Lebron is better than step it doesn't have to be steps And you know, a system player, you know, like David Mediman said all those years ago, like it doesn't have to be that, it can be. I think steps incredible, but I think Lebron is a little better, which is where I'm at. I think step is the ninth or tenth best basketball player ever, and probably when he's all said and done, will be closer to five

or six. But he's definitively below Lebron. That's not a shot at Steph, just the reality of this situation. And I'll react to new information. If over the course of the next five years Steph rips off three more and he's definitively the best player on all three teams, and he wins two more m v p s, then guess what, we have to have a new conversation about Lebron and Steph.

But where we stand right now, Lebron has an extensive resume that runs laps around what step is accomplished, and he's won four titles where he's definitively been the best player on all four teams. So right now there's a gap. There might not be there in five years, but right now there's a gap there. So saying something like Steph is the Michael Jordan of this era is outrageous. That's just it's just not realistic. Like I said earlier, like Lebron might not even be the Michael Jordan of this

era because he hasn't been dominant enough. But I just in general, I wish all of the toxic discourse surrounding these two players would go away because they are the two best players of this era. Kevin Durant is definitively beneath both of them, so they need to be Both of them need to be pumped up and to be remembered and enjoyed while they're here. All right, guys, that's

all I have for today. This is this recording. We'll air on Dash Radio tomorrow morning at seven am Pacific Standard time, and will be on my podcast feed here at about four pm Pacific standard time. So if you miss the beginning and you want to check that out, you can find out our podcast feed, and then Rog and I will be back for our normal postgame show tomorrow night. Thanks as always for the support. We'll see you guys in a day or so.