Hoops Tonight - Top 10 Players in NBA Playoffs: Where do LeBron, Steph Curry & Kevin Durant land?

three days, we're gonna be going live. Excuse me, We're gonna have a video going up tomorrow morning that's going to be breaking down Friday nights games, and then on Sunday evening we're gonna be going live with mister Colin Cowherd to break down what should be a wild Sunday of NBA basketball. But today as a primer for that, where you're going to be going over the ten players you would best want heading into this playoff front, and I can think of nobody better to get into the

nitty gritty of that list. Then our guy Carson, who we have on the show pretty regularly, we're gonna have him on and we're gonna break down our top ten playoff players. Carson, how's it going, man? I'm doing great, Jason, and I'm very interested to see how this all shakes out for you, because I just came up with my own list for this a couple of days ago, and I think so much talent at the top of the league that it really kind of depends on what you

value most. There could be a bunch of variety I could imagine between our two lists without it feeling totally crazy to me. So very interested in where you go with all this. So the first question we you and I were kind of hashing out before we actually got into this list, before we actually started recording, was whether

or not we were going to factor in Luca here. Now, I would say, judging by the point spread, it would appear that the Chicago Bulls are going to rest their players against the Dallas Mavericks, which will put them in a good position to win their last two games because I think their Sunday game is against Santas. However, Oklahoma

City has I can't remember exactly who it is. I think it's a jazz I match up with the Jazz that they just won, and then they have one more game and they play, I believe at home against Memphis, and in deary Memphis will probably be resting their players in that game, so I'd say there's a better than a coin flip chance that Luca don Chie does not

factor into this playoff run at all. However, even though I'm not sure that I would put him this far down heading into a playoff run where he had a more secure seed, I don't feel comfortable putting him ahead of anybody else on this list under the circumstances because I don't think he's been very good here in the last month or so, So I put Luca at tenth and again when we when we break down what he brings to the playoff stage, he obviously brings otherworldly shot making,

otherworldly playmaking. He's that half court surgeon that I've always been a huge fan of in the NBA, especially on the playoff stage when teams start to switch more or in his ability to attack smaller players and generate quality shots. His weaknesses. Doesn't defend, obviously, doesn't pay attention in the details of the game. He gets beat on box outs and things like that all the time, doesn't run back and transition. And then I've really been unhappy with his

attitude as of late. It feels like he's been pouting, and again, like I get it, it's a discouraging situation with everything surrounding what happened to the Mavericks after the deadline. They traded the textbookcase of the drop one athlete and then suddenly you dip below a certain like like absolute minimum of height and athleticism. In the NBA, they lost or in Finnie Smith, and they fell apart. And I'm not a Luca I don't think again, I don't think

it would have been enough. I don't think they would have won a series or done any real damage in the NBA playoffs this year. However, Luca could have got him there, and he did it. And so for the time being, I'm a big believer in winning being the top thing that we factor in when we discussed these players. So call it a punishment, call it like a temporary a little like you know, penalty box or whatever it is.

But even though I would probably put Luca higher, I have him at tenth right now, I would have Luca a few spots higher. I'd have him at seven on this list, And I think that the reason for that is just that he is in arguably the most valuable archetype, which is, as you said, dominant playoffs score extremely versatile, their dominant playmaker who can elevate your team offense far beyond where your talent level would suggest that it should be.

And he is legitimately one of the greatest offensive playoff performers we have ever seen. His playoff career stats are thirty two and a half nine and eight on fifty eight percent true shooting, and we have seen him every single time he's been there overperform even these incredibly high expectations.

We have taking the Clippers to back to back battles when he was facing a massive talent deficit and he was the best player probably in both those series, and then last year obviously elevating the MAVs to the Western Con Finals, knocking off a sixty four wins Suns team

with just this unbelievable offensive barrage. So I understand the issues with his defense, and I don't think he's quite as skilled as like a Steph Curry a Nikola Yokis when you're talking about elevating team offense, just because those guys don't need to single handedly possess the ball every single possession. I have a massive impact like like Luca does. Yok can do so much with quick touches, playmaking. Steph just his gravity at all times when he's on the court.

So that's why I'd have Luca below those guys if we're looking at the like all offense, very little defense quotient. But I do still think his offense is so valuable and he gets me into conversations that some of these other guys, who maybe better two way players, may have had better home stretches this regular season, just don't get me in because Luca is so dominant offensively. Yeah, it goes beyond the defense stuff. There is a lack of

versatility with Luca. I want to cut him some slack because he's in the middle of the season and he's incorporating a new player. But like, I'd like to see him, over the course of the next few years demonstrate the ability to be an involved offensive cog without being the heliocentric guy. And that's something that's something that I'd like to see him see him work on. But like, at the end of the day, his game has been proven

to translate to this level. Between the two Clippers series over the previous two years and then him taking the Sun's out last year and getting to within three wins of the NBA Finals, you'd be lying to yourself if you acted like Lucas game doesn't translate to the playoffs or contribute to winning on that stage. It's just yes, it's playing and simple. There are players that are better than him. So at number nine, and again I want to I want to be clear, this is not the

same as like a traditional player rankings. Like to me, a traditional player rankings is like a hierarchy in the league that is a combination of like what you bring during an eighty two game regular season, what you bring in terms of your championship pedigree, what you bring in terms of your playoff resume recently, but also like like with a with an eye towards the future, and what we can expect from you and that, Like to me, it's like an a hierarchy that's a factor of a

bunch of different things. This list is intended to be for just this playoff run, based on how guys are playing right now, so it's a totally different type of list. But at number nine, I have Jason Tatum, and you know, obviously his three point shooting bumps up his efficiency from a scoring standpoint to a level where you look at the points per game and you look at the true shooting percentage, and you can't deny that this is a

scoring machine that generates points at a high rate. To me, he's the closest thing we have to like a modern James harden and types in terms of just the pure scoring results. Obviously he's not in the same stratosphere as a playmaker, but it's one of those guys where every day you go back and you look at the box score and he's like, oh my gosh, you had thirty five again on you know, sixteen shots or seventeen shots

or whatever it is. But it's he's he's got a little bit of the grifts to get to the foul line now that he didn't used to have. He's consistently tweaked his shot diet to take higher value shots. He's taken a lot of shots at the rim and a lot of shots above the break at the three point line, and not a lot in the middle, and it's resulting in some efficiency. The biggest thing that freaks me out

with Jason Tatum a couple things decision making. He's actually a better playmaker than he gets credit for, and the Celtics are at their best when he's passing the basketball. But he does have a tendency to go through these long, extended stretches where his decision making is poor and he usually Jason Tatum and his offensive approach to me is the big like Bellweather for how the Celtics are playing

as a team. And then lastly, just a lack of shot making versatility, so like his go to moves are so rigid and there's only a few of them, and as a result, like he becomes a little predictable at the end of games, whereas like Jaylen Brown has this real creation ativity in audacity to his shot making that I think helps him thrive on those stages and a lot of times, I think Tatum becomes predictable and guardable at the end of games, so that decision making peace

in la and that you know, like in terms of pure production, he belongs on this list, but I don't think he has the versatility really on both ends of the floor to be higher than the guys above him. This is exactly where I have Tatum, and I think that you've laid out a lot of the strengths and weaknesses of his game really well, if you look at him, he's in the archetype of like Ideally, if we were to get the best version of Jason Tatum, that value

would be like a twenty nineteen Kawhi Leonard. But the reality is there are just a few areas in which he's not on that level. Very good defensively, not quite at that level in terms of impact. But more importantly, it's what you laid out, it's the overall offensive inconsistency.

If it's a question of being heavily reliant on that three point shot, creating it for himself, off the dribble, which at times does leave him, if it's at times issues with decision making, playmaking, and just the reality that he doesn't have the sort of relentlessness I'm going to get to my spot and that spot might be twelve feet away and I'm just gonna hit my fade away that I trust myself to make it a sixty percent

clip that like a Kawhi Leonard does. So there's a difference in terms of consistency ultimately efficiency on the biggest stage. I think I think that this is where you have to have take him, probably in that nine or ten range. The only reason I don't have him at ten on my list honestly is because of availability. He has been quite consistently available. But if he were in that true top tier, the Celtics would have won the title last year and they would be clearly my title favorite this year.

They've had the most talented rosters, but the reality is his inconsistencies has held them back in that really high stakes arena. That's a hunt that it's really that simple, Like he would have won last year and he'd be the runaway favorite this year if he was one of those guys because Boston has the best team. It's literally

that simple to me. I have at number eight Kawhi, and you you pointed out something that I've that I think is so vitally important because Kawai and Tatum are similar archetypes in a lot of ways, Like they've both kind of come along as playmakers to the point where you can at least count on them to make the right reads when they're in certain situations and they bring

that efficient scoring right. But the part that you got to, and this is where points per possession is actually kind of a bad indicator of just the overall scoring versatility of a player. Doesn't mean that points possession doesn't have value, it's just it doesn't tell the whole story. So Jason Tatum, on a points per possession basis on different shot types, is going to have a similar type of efficiency to Kawhi Leonard if you look at it like isolation, high,

pick and roll, all these different things. But because he relies a lot above the break three's and obviously getting to the rim has a lot more to do with the schematic of a five main unit and spacing and that sort of thing than actually like a reliable possession by possession type of result you pointed out perfectly. Kawai

has these moves that he can go too. That's like, Okay, it's only worth two points, But like, if I get to my spot, I'm hitting this sixty percent of the time, and that's so immensely valuable when you get to the late game playoffs scenarios. Because again, even if Tatum's like, oh, I'm hitting this pull up three at thirty eight percent, that's great. That means you're gonna get you know, roughly one point two one point three points per possession, right, awesome.

Here's the problem. You don't get to take that shot at the end of the game and just notch one point two points to the scoreboard. No, you're gonna miss two of them before you make one. Maybe or maybe you make it. But from a percentage standpoint, there's a better than fifty percent chance that possession is ending in nothing.

And if you need a bucket on that possession or it's a rescue possession at the end of a clock, having a go to move that is an extremely efficient shot, like Kawai's mid range pull up jump shots over both shoulders or out of the post, over out of the post, over both shoulders, or going right or left and picking role. Those are just immensely valuable shots in the grind of

NBA playoff game. So the big weaknesses for me with Kawai health obviously, like this dude, the last time we saw him healthy heading into a playoff run broke down in the second round. He relies a lot on pull up shooting, so if he does start to miss, he's not a guy that gets to the rim super consistently. And then from a playmaking standpoint, there's a little bit of a ceiling there. But right now I have Kawhi at eight. I would have Kawai even a little bit

higher at number six. I think he is an all time playoff performer, and I think that his game just seamlessly translates the dominant wing scoring, the solid playmaking, the dominant defense that we can see from him on that playoff stage. Last four times he's been to the playoffs, he's averaged over twenty nine a night on fifty one thirty eight eighty nine splits and soy, as he's worked his way into full health this year, he's been the normal Kawhi that we expect. He's been that dominant guy.

So I agree with you the availability as a concern, but there is no doubt that when we see him there twenty seventeen, right, he's a different player since then. But he was kicking the Warriors, with some people consider the greatest team ever. He was kicking their ass after he had just had two incredible series before that, both

Clippers years. He was great, with the exception of like that finishing stretch against Denver and then he got hurt in Toronto was one of the best individual playoff runs of this century. So I just believe in that value. I think that offensively he has every bit as good as he's ever been, and I'm going to bet on that translating because we've seen it translate with him every single time he's been there, and some of these other guys who may have had more impressive regular seasons can't

say that in the same way that he can. Well, what bums me out, though, is that team is not very good and he's had it for a quick exit and it's just really unfortunate. Number seven Lebron James, Oh, I still think when it comes to this playoff stage, and the reason why I have him down low is a couple of things. Health obviously is a big question mark. There's just not a guarantee that he'll be available throughout

this entire playoff run. And then also he's having his worst jump shooting season since twenty fifteen, and that is just such an important part of his Now. He has shot the jump shot well since returning at just in the last couple of games. I want to say, he's like seven for his last sixteen from three, and particularly in the second half against the Clippers the other night, he really had everything going. But it's been a little bit of an issue this year, and that I think

lowers my confidence in him a little bit. But Lebron James, to me is there's a reason why Lebron and his career has been the most dependably great playoff player, in my opinion, in NBA history, even in the Lebron mj debate, regardless of who you think is better. And I think Michael Jordan has definitively had a more dominant NBA career in terms of the way he performed relative to his peers.

But Lebron James is far more dependably great because Michael Jordan was reliant on shop making to a certain extent, and he had bad playoff games. You'd have a game where he goes seven for thirty, you know what I mean. Lebron James. I've never seen a player in my life where if it was a big playoff game, you could count on him to play extremely well. And I think

it's because he has the perfect combination of tools. When you combine his ability to score it all three levels and to attack matchups, which is so important at this level. He is a top tier surgical half court playmaker, and defensively he's incredibly versatile. Yeah, he's not the same defensive player in terms of consistency that he was when he was younger, but we've seen this time and again, and we saw it in twenty twenty and he's done it

even just since returning this year. When he's engaged defensively, he is still a very impactful defender that can succeed and help, that can protect the rim a little bit, that can guard on the perimeter. Lebron, I believe, brings all that versatility to the table and as a result, he's capable of impacting the game in so many different ways that if hey, my jump SHOT's not falling, cool, he's gonna go eight for twenty two. He's gonna have twenty seven, nine and eight, and he's going to be

a net positive on both ends of the floor. That's his bad game, and that then it's like if the jumpers start falling, now we're looking at thirty five, nine and seven and a totally different type of game. So like again, it's the health and his jump shots a little finicky this year, but I still think, I still think on this playoff stage he's every bit as good as any of these guys. I'm really surprised I have Lebron higher than you, Jason, which I about that fact.

I think that the reality is we have never not seen Lebron James translate to the playoffs since he became that reliable, solid pull up jump shooter. Obviously you have the twenty eleven finals, but that was an entirely different player. I think that if you look at the combination of physical imposition, getting to the rim at will, genius playmaking, the only thing keeping him from being a bona fide top five guy to me is the inconsistency of his

jump shot this year. But at the end of the day, I have faith in Lebron shooting at a respectable level in the playoffs. I think that this regular season is probably more of an aberration than his overall body of work, where he's consistently been that thirty five thirty six percent range from three and then. I just think there's a

control of the game. There's an all around offensive dominance and the ability to be at least not exploitable defensively, Like for example, Luca, who has this unbelievable offensive value but can get picked on on that end more than Lebron. I just can't bet against it. I mean, he's still putting up his efficient thirty to night, having a massive impact on winning while having a horrible pull up jump

shooting season while having had some health issues. He's thirty eight, but he is still to me immortal, so I have

him in my five spot. Interesting. Yeah, So to be clear, like if I'm going into a first round series and Lebron's healthy and I know he's going to be available for that game, just because of how big of a fan I am of his game, I'm always going to be at that going like Lebron might be the best player on the floor in this game, Like that is such a firm possibility in every matchup, But going into a two month long playoff run, you would be foolish to bet on him over some of the guys above him.

So number six, I've Nickela yokich strengths obviously outstanding playmaking and play finishing. His efficiency is just hard to even fathom. I mean what he's been pushing seventy percent true shooting this year, right the big thing. There's two things that

worry me with Yokich. Obviously defensive versatility. I actually think when he's really locked in, he can be an average rim protector, which is enough to be fine defensively, but in the in the versatility department, with way that teams are going to try to pull him away from the rim. Obviously that's a weakness. And then I also get a little bit worried with Yokich as it pertains to aggression.

So like he reminds me a little bit of early Lebron where when the game calls for him to just go make his own shots, sometimes he can be a little bit too much of an offensive engine that's just trying to create shots for his teammates instead of doing the Joel Embiid thing, which is like, I'm Joel freaking Embiid. You can't guard me the next five possessions, I'm going to shoot over your shoot over the top of you.

You know what I mean. And it's not that he can't do that because obviously, like when we look at it, his post up scoring is the very best in the league. Basically he does have that ability, but it's more of a mentality thing for me. I think I think he struggles with identifying when the team needs him to just shoot every time down the floor. So that's why I have him at six right now. The one thing that I will say is that I think we have seen Yoki get that a lot more on the playoff stage

than he might on your average regular season night. Of course, this has been with abysmal backcourt talent in the last two years, but his last two postseasons he's been over thirty points a night very efficiently, So I do think he gets it a bit more on that stage. And the reality to me is he's the best offensive basketball player in the world, and so that to me has

to put him in my top four. But the differentiator for me between him and my two and three spots is his exploitability defensively, because it's not just that he's a blow average defender. It is the fact that he's playing the most important defensive position, and it's just easier to involve a center in any action right, bring him up into pick and roll, just attack him at the rim and challenge him as a rim protector, so that

knocks him down for me. I still do feel like six is too low, though, because we've seen Yoki lift his team to be a top five playoff offense every single time that he's been there, and the only time that we've seen them with the kind of playoff talent in these last few years that you could expect even win a series when that roster wasn't as talented as this year, but in the bubble they went to the Western Conference Finals, they beat a Clippers team that was

clearly more talented, and Yokich was out of this world. In the last two years individually offensively, he's been everything that you could have hoped for. So I just think that offensive value, the fact that he's proven that that translates clearly is something that for example, a well Embiid has not done in the playoffs. It is something that an Anthony Davis can't claim to have because he can't be that reliable number one every single night offensively who

will make you a lead on that end. And so I do think that Yokis should be a little bit higher than this. I get the defensive concerns, but he's so great offensively, so monumentally great, that I have him at my four spot. And again it's about like this list is splitting hairs, like the guy. All the guys that I have ahead of him are so insanely good. I think there's one you'll probably disagree with, which is

my number five, Anthony Davis. So when I was thinking about his strengths, the first thing I put down is just physical tools and I just want to Obviously we can go it like the play finishing, the rim, protection, all these different things, but Anthony Davis, to me, is the number one athletic wrecking ball in this playoff field with what he can do defensively protecting the rim and

switching out onto the perimeter. I actually believe, even though I think Janis deserves to be called the best defensive player alive because of what he actually does in a nightly basis and his availability, that's his crown. I actually think Anthony Davis has the highest defensive ceiling in the NBA. I believe that when Anthony Davis is at his best, nobody can protect the rim while also coming up high out of a drop coverage while also switching, blitzing, rotating

everything that he does. Nobody can do what Anthony Davis does. It blows up NBA offenses. I've actually never seen a defensive player due to an NBA team what Anthony Davis did to the Miami Heat in the NBA Finals in twenty twenty. He absolutely and completely devastated their offense to the point where they did not know what to do. And that was an NBA Finals team, and then on the offensive end of the floor, say what you want

to say. Obviously there's some limitations there, and there's no doubt that he's not the same offensive player as someone like Yogis or someone like Embiid. But you're gonna get twenty six, You're gonna get you know, high fifty percent shot, and on any given night he can go forty forty five points if he's got his touch going on a handful of his particular shots that he leans on. This,

to me is the textbook playoff translatability quotient. No one in the world would take Anthony Davis over Nickel Yokets or Joel Embiide with what they can do to raise the team's floor over the course of a season because of their higher offensive ceiling, they are better options to

build your franchise around. But when the ball gets tossed up in the NBA Finals and it's the Western Conference finals, or it's in one of those late round playoff series against an elite team, what he does translates to that level in such a visceral way that it like it's it's hard to describe, but it's just like a sheer force of nature. Type of thing that, to me, increases his playoff impact to a level that very few guys

in the league can actually reach. There's a case that he's the best guy in this adding because, like, he was better than Lebron through that entire twenty twenty run basically until until late game situations where Lebron's half court surgery became the value piece, but he was the best player in the bubble basically in terms of his overall impact on winning. I think I think his injury history has turned people away from him in a lot of

different ways. But I think Anthony Davis there's such a huge gap between his ceiling and his actual consit level of consistency, But you could argue his ceiling as higher than everybody, and that's why I have him at number five.

It's interesting. I think that AD is a tough guy to rank, but I think that for me, the issue was with the offensive consistency, with the playmaking limitations, with the fact that as liable as he is to go for thirty five, he is to go for seventeen, He might only take eight shots in a game, and I just think there's a burden offensively on a lot of these other guys that Ad has not had to bear because he has Lebron, and so that allows to cover up for some of his limitations because when he can

be the best defensive player in the world and this awesome second option offensively, it's like, yeah, Ad is unbelievable. But a lot of guys are single handedly asked to elevate their offenses to being elite, which is what gets their team into those elite conversations. And so that combined with availability, moves a D down a bit for me.

I think that Bubble a D was like the best version of him we could ever possibly hope to see unless he shoots that well from three again this year, and still I think that push come to shove, Lebron was the more valuable player. The Lebron was the better player. And that's just an archetype thing. If you are that great perimeter initiator who can also defend, especially, it's just

more valuable if you're that great offensive engine. And so even compared to a guy like Kauai, the reason I would lean him is because I just trust the offense more and I know he's going to have a high level impact defensively, so I don't have a problem with Ady at five. I just am not sure that the consistency makes me comfortable having him up that high for sure.

And again, this is the reality is like you are a product of a basketball team, and takeaway shot making from Jannis, like from his teammates, suddenly some of his offensive limitations come to the surface. There's no doubt that in a vacuum, Anthony Davis is not the same player as Nikola, Yoka, Joel and beat. Bottom line, though you put him with Lebron and he can cover some of those weaknesses. His winning impact is so massive in all of these other areas of the game that it kind

of unlocks that. And like, the reality is as he is with Lebron, And so we can talk all we want about these different varying factors. But if the Lakers happen to end up the eight seed because they lose to Minnesota in the first playing game and then beat Okay seed in the second playing game, and they head up to Denver for Game one, it's not like Yoki gets to look at him beat and go like, hey,

I'm better than you. It doesn't matter. He is with Lebron, And that means in that series, he's gonna have Lebron and his teammate, which means he's going to be able to impact winning in that context. And to me, that's what makes him such a terrifying playoff player. But again, all your points are completely fair, and we are splitting hairs at a certain point here. Number four, Joel Embiide, the big things that I worry about with him are basically just the same things that I worry about with

Yoga's defensively, footspeed and defensive versatility. Getting lost in transition or getting pulled away from the rim. That actually became a problem consistently in the playoffs last year, him giving up straight line drives when he got pulled out to the perimeter, particularly in semi transition when he was kind of away from the rim. But this is the modern day version of Shack in my opinion, in terms of in terms of just the way that he warps the

defense from the center position. You cannot guard him in single coverage anymore. He's so deadly with that damn pull up jump shot at fifteen feet that it forces defenders to come up on him. And he's so damn big and strong that when he goes to those RiPP threw moves. It just he's going to win that confrontation one hundred percent of the time. He has reached a point in proficiency as a jump shooter that he is a huge

problem now, just a gigantic problem. And so like he in terms of a player that consistently dictates double teams and causes you to have to completely fundamentally change the way you defend, I actually think he's one of the most He's one of the most imposing game plan changing players on this list. And then again for what you want to say about his defensive versatility, he is an outstanding rim protector in my opinion, especially here in this

last couple of months. So I've embeat at four right now, I totally get it. I think Abeat is a different version of himself than we've ever seen before because of how incredibly proficient he's been as a jump shooter, and also because I think the other dimension to his game that's been unlocked is the pick and roll game. I mean, a couple of years ago, we never really saw Ebead run much pick and roll at all. He didn't have

a great pick and roll ball handler. Now he does, and James Harden, and he's gotten so good at that free throw line, jumper and everything that feeds off of that, getting to the rim, getting to the line that he's the highest scoring pick and roll player in the league when you're talking about roll men's So I do think this is the best tomb that we've ever seen. That being said, I think his playoff resume is easily the weakest of anybody in this top ten, and I don't

think that we discussed that enough. We have consistently seen his decision making playmaking fall apart in the playoffs two point eight assists per game to three point four turnovers in his playoff career, Jason, and yes, he's a better playmaker decision maker than we've ever seen him be, but he's still probably the weakest out of this entire group there, and he will see a lot of doubles and so he has to consistently make the right reads there or

else some of his value is going to diminish. We've seen him struggle as a shot maker. He has not been the same jump shooter finisher in the playoffs under forty seven percent from the field, under thirty percent from three. We've seen him struggle to get to the line. His free throw attempts from the regular season to the playoffs have gone down by basically two a game in these last two post seasons, which makes a lot of sense. There's a lot of foul baiting. You just don't get

that in the same way in the playoffs. And then we've seen his health fall apart. Every single time that Philly has been to the second round, he's missed a game. And on top of the game that he's missed, right, he's been playing with some sort of injury probably at some point in some of those surrounding games, and just in a lot of do or die situations and a lot of those series where Philly has a talent advantage,

he's fallen apart. He was bad last year versus the Heat with an orbital fracture, sure, but under twenty a night, forty three percent from the field, twenty six percent from three more turnovers than assists. Year before that was the disappointing loss with the Hawks. Year before or yeah, year before that, they just got swept by the Celtics. Year before that, they got he was terrible against the Raptors.

So I think this is the best version of Embead, ever, but I do think he needs to prove it, and I do think the archetype of I can lift everybody offensively is more valuable than embiads. I will be this dominant scorer when he hasn't been a dominant score in the playoffs. And I do agree with you. In a playoff setting, you play against a great pull up jump shooting team, you play against a team that's going to involve him in a lot of pick and roll, and

he's got to cover a lot of ground. I do think that his defensive value is not what some people might expect it to be because he is a slower plotting guy. So I'm lower on embe that the consensus for this. I just think the Lebron, the Kauhi, the Luca Tiers, those guys we've seen it offensively, and Ebiad has been better than any of them this year. But I just have faith in what we've seen on this playoff stage a bit more so. I had Embead at eight when I did my rank. Wow. Yeah, everything you

say about Embiid's playoff resume is real and true. In my opinion. However, I actually think he is not just the best version of himself. Now, I think Embiad is considerably better than he was last year. It's hard to describe, but like I noticed this in my own basketball development as I was growing up. But like it doesn't happen linearly, like you take leaps, Like you figure things out and

you take leaps. There's like a like it almost happens overnight sometimes when something clicks for you in a specific area of your skill set and it's like, oh, suddenly, like this makes sense to me now and I can do this at a higher level. I actually think and be legitimately has taken a leap up to the next tier of superstardom in this season, and so everything you're saying about his playoff resume is true. But I want

to see if you can do it this year. I want to kind of give him the opportunity to prove that he's improved. Number three, and I actually think this guy has been arguably the best player I've seen this season when he's been healthy. But I'm tossing just basically the I'm giving essentially leeway to the two guys in front of him based on their championship HEED agree in recent years, but a number three I have Kevin Durant. I think, obviously he's having I believe the best pull

up jump shooting season in history the league. And not maybe not in terms of effective field goal percentage compared to some of the three point hunters, but in terms of like dynamic three level pull up shooting or two level pull up shooting. I should say it's the best in the history of the league by far. As someone tweeted out last night, A Kadi himself tweted out, he's shoting over sixty percent on two, forty percent on three

on free throws. It's unbelievable. He's actually having an incredibly underrated playmaking season. It's one of the It's one of the biggest things that I think is misrepresented about Kevin Durant's game is he's kind of portrayed as a score that can't pass. But he's other than maybe Yannis a lot of these top tiers forwards. He's a much better pastor than Tatum. He's a much better passer than Kawhi Leonard,

like like Katie, is a legitimate playmaker. The only real weakness with Kevin Durant is he does not get to the rim, and so that kind of limits him in terms of reaching a ceiling and playmaking that you that you have to apply consistent room pressure to get and then he can be dependent on his pull up jump shot going in which he almost always does, but we have seen it not and it's absolutely a risk because

here's the reality. Kevin Durant was awesome last year in the regular season two and then he ran into Boston, the shot stopped falling. Next thing you know, they were out of the playoffs in four games. So I want to cut him some slack. It's one week of basketball, but that I think is the thing that kind of

holds him back from that. Katie, I think, has never definitively been the best player in the league, and I believe that is a result of the fact that he does rely on jump shooting pull up jump shooting to have that top tier impact while some of the guys around him have impact while some of the guys around him aren't as reliant on jump shooting as he is.

That's interesting. I would say though, that I think that ever since he arrived in Golden State, with the exception of last year, Katie has been an exceptional playoff performer, and I think honestly, twenty nineteen and then twenty twenty one in Brooklyn, those were the two best playoff versions of Katie that I have ever seen, Like just an unstoppable scoring level in that series against the Clippers, for example, in twenty nineteen, and then in that series against the Bucks,

the level of complete offensive engine that he was scoring and playmaking just dominant. I mean, across those two playoffs he's over thirty three a night on fifty one two eighty nine splits. It's just I do believe that he is largely unstoppable, and last year was weird. I do not think that that is a repble result. I think there is a completeness with him offensively where he elevates any team so immediately in the NBA, we've already seen

it in Phoenix. He just comes in and he's like, yeah, I'll shoot sixty five percent from and we're undefeated, and I'll do so much off ball and to me is

the top two score of all time. He has been a great playmaker this year, as you said, and he's had the best defensive year of his career probably, and I think that that is the distinction when I'm comparing him to Stephen Yokich the other guys in my top four, those guys are better offensive players in my opinion, because there is a more complete impact there is what we've already talked about, Steph elevating everybody with his mere presence,

Yoki just genius playmaking. But the reality is both those guys in their own ways can be exploited defensively, and Katie in a role that he has played for a majority of this year, that secondary rim protector can be a very impactful, positive defensive player while being the best score alive and being able to play so many roles offensively, dominant pick and roll, dominant isolation, dominant catch and shooter.

And so I really really value that. I value how consistently we've seen it from him, and I think this is the best Katie that we've ever seen. So I have him at number two on my list again, like he could just as easily be one for me Again, You're right, twenty twenty two was an anomaly. That's a fact, but it can happen. That's like, it's here's the thing. Pull up jump shots are the most difficult shot in basketball. That's just a fact. He's the best at them, but

really good physical defense can disrupt his base. And we've seen him again. It had been a very long time, but we did see him running to pull up jump shooting problems relatively often. From twenty thirteen to twenty sixteen, we did, and then he had this stretch where he was excellent, and then we saw that anomaly again last year. Again, you can make a case for him to have him at number one. I'm not. I don't think there's a

player on this list that's perfect for the record. The last guy I would have put on this list that was perfect was twenty eighteen Bron. He had every box checked resounding, there was not a weakness in his game. Every guy on this list has a weakness. Now, that's that's kind of the difference in my opinion, and that's why Lebron's the second best player to ever pick up

a basketball. But number two I've Steph Curry. And again there's the the gravity thing sometimes gets overplayed because people want to prop Step up in some ways and that that is a fact, but it is real, As is always the case, the truth is somewhere in the middle. Like like all superstars dictate multiple defenders. That's just that's just a fact. So sometimes like portraying stepp is the only guy that does that, I don't think is an

accurate representation of the of reality. But what makes steps defensive attention so unique is that it pulls multiple defenders away from the basket. We talk a lot about basketball efficiency, right, and oh, like a quality three point shot. You know, even an average three point shot is better than a quality fifteen footer because sheer math, right, But what's the

most efficient shot in basketball? A layout? And even on Steph's bad shooting nights, he is constantly pulling multiple defenders away from the rim and creating opportunities around the basket.

And those opportunities are extremely high percentage opportunities. That's why I think even though Yoki you think Yokis is the best offensive player in the league, I still think Steph is and I think he and I would I think you would agree that Steph has been the most dynamic offensive player or best offensive player of this era in terms of like the total picture. Absolutely. The only thing that really holds him back again is his physical tools.

And to his credit, he's bigger and stronger than people think. He's six foot three, he spends a lot of time in the weight room. He's well built, but at the end of the day, he cannot impact the game with his size and strength the way that guys like Janis and Kevin Durant and Lebron James and Jason Am and Kawhi Leonard and even Joe Olmpide can and those sorts of that sort of thing. I think as as always

held stepped back just a little bit. But it's irrelevant that dudes a four time championship champion and he's won a title as the best player twice, and I gave him the nod over kd here quite simply because I am such a big believer and a applying the appropriate

respect to an NBA champion. He went into Boston the most talented roster in the league last year, down two games to one on the road, and he killed those guys, and and there's just there's just there might be three or four guys on that list that we're doing today that are even capable of that. And to me and to me that that resulted in the trophy and that needs to be paid the appropriate amount of respect. I

have him at number two. One of the things that I think is really funny about just the evolution of skill in today's NBA. And I was just thinking about this the other day. Is when we talk about peak Steph, a lot of people probably still go to twenty sixteen, right, unanimous MVP. This efficiency we've never seen. Steph has so clearly been better these last three years at basketball than

he was then. If you want to talk about relative to the competition, that's fine, but absolutely right, he's stronger. He's had these unbelievable pull up jump shooting seasons last year and on the regular season, but last year's playoffs was the most impressive individual run we've ever seen from him on that stage because he elevated this team that didn't have another consistent offensive star to be great offensively in the playoffs. We talk about their defensive foundation all

the time. They were a better playoff offense last year they were fourth than a playoff defense where they were six. And so they've always had that two way formula, but Steph has always been the offensive foundation that makes them brilliant year and year out. So I will not push back against Steph being number two. For you again, to me, I slightly lean Katie, just because Steph as much as

he has improved defensively and worked on that. It's like you said, if you're not an exceptional defender at six three, with the level of switching that we see in today's NBA, you can be attacked, you can be exploited. And so it's not a strength for him, whereas for Katie it can be. But his playoff resume is so underrated. He's consistently been great on that stage, one of the most prolific and efficient playoff scorers ever, and it's so much

beyond that elevating the offense. I agree with you. Obviously every star is attracting multiple defenders, but I don't know who is reshaped an entire defensive approach every single possession just by being on the court like Steph. So I think he's up there for the greatest offensive engine of all time, and I think he's as good as he's ever been. So I think he belongs in this top three at the very least, and that's where I have

him at three. Yeah, and it's similar to Lebron. His bad games carries so much impact as a result to that.

But yeah, right, there's a limited The best way I could describe the Steph Curry defense thing is like, it's not a good option to attack him because he is a good defensive player, but it's a much better option to attack him than anybody else on the floor, right, And so what ends up happening They target Staff and and and it's just it's it's just it's just a ceiling, so to speak, that that kind of caps him from

reaching like that that next level. But to me, it's like such a testament to his greatness because to put it simply, how many guys that we consider to be top seven, eight nine players in the NBA are are not supreme athletes, none of them except for Staff, He's the one guy who overcame what and what's crazy is compared to other humans, he's a freak athlete, like literally a freak athlete who with great size, like it's probably what ninety eight percentile for men on planet Earth and height,

But it just doesn't matter because in the NBA they're all like that, right. But uh, but yeah, I haven't met number two, number one deserving. In my opinion, janis unbelievable, relentless, grim pressure. I think he's the best passing wing in

the league. Other than Lebron and Luca. Defensive versatility, his ability to protect the rim as a primary rim protector and pick and roll while also devastating teams as the lowman guarding the weak side corner and blowing up plays behind Brook Lopez, and his ability to switch out onto most of the wings in the league, and he actually

does okay on guards as well. I believe that that in combination with just the way that his game translates to this phase, and the fact that as the level of physicality increases, his advantages increase, as it becomes more and more like football and a little bit less like basketball. The only weakness you can really you can really attack with him is his over the top shot making, and he's actually regressing a little bit in that regard. But it's just kind of like the Anthony Davis thing, like

they have Chris Middleton. Although Chris Middleton just perceived an MRI and is gonna have to like that. We haven't talked about that, and we'll probably get into it, Carson the next time we talk, when we start focusing more on the playoffs. But that Middleton knee injury is very significant because you know, kind of coming into that Celtics

win the other. Like a week or so ago, we were kind of you and Milwaukee is kind of separating themselves, and then they tailed off a little bit, and now Chris Middleton's hurt, and now things feel more open than they've ever felt in the NBA, which just kind of why everyone's kind of coming back around towards Boston because

you know, it's like they're the most talented team. But the reality of the basketball predicament is is Janis does have Chris Middleton, he does have Drew Holiday, he does have Joe Ingles, and so they don't need him to be an over the top shot maker in order to succeed.

And so even if you want to look at him in the face and say, yeah, well I'm better than you at this specific thing, within the context of team basketball on the Bucks and the way that they cover for his weaknesses, nobody in the NBA impacts winning on

both ends of the floor the way Jannis does. Right now, I think that you're absolutely right, And there's a couple key differences in my opinion, between this Yannis and the version of Yannis that we could see exploited right Like we saw a teams that were built similarly to Boston to stop Jannis with these great variety of wing defenders who you could build the wall with and you could

really challenge him. We saw it in Toronto and they beat him, and we saw it in Miami and they beat him, and then Boston beat him, but not really. I mean without Middleton going seven, Yannis was unstoppable for

many stretches of that series. And the keys are his playmaking development, and I agree with you the addition of like a Drew Holiday presence, and now you can't really even say that that inability as a perimeter shotmaker holds him back from being number one when he is so physically dominant, very good as a playmaker, and I think right up there for the best defensive player alive and so versatile on that end. It's like the guy walks into thirty one, twelve and six efficiently and will wreck

the game defensively. It's really really tough to say that anybody else is better than that has a higher baseline than that because of the just physical imposition and the defensive floor and ceiling that he has every single night. So Yannis to me also has to be number one. Yeah, so one last thing I want to shout out with Yannis before we get out of here. He's kind of

figuring out the pacing himself elements now too. This has always been one of the most underrated parts of Lebron James's career, and he gets criticized a lot for it, and it makes sense because it's like, yeah, like if you're voting for MVP and he's kind of mailing it in on two like two thirds of the nights, and you know, so like Jannis in twenty twenty is just attacking every game like it's his last game. You know.

I get that within the context of awards, but what part of the genius there for Lebron is he's like, dude, I got a two month grind ahead of me, you know, and that two month mind, I'm going to need to be at my best physically. And I think Jannie, like,

I love the way he approached this season. He kind of had like a baseline gear which was still arguably the best player in the world during the first two thirds of the season, and then here in the last third he's like, all right, guys, time to pick it up a little bit. And he's been good for like he's just been utterly bludgeoning teams really ever since, and I think that's a testament to just how he's kind of grown as he's become more experienced. But that's all

we have for today, guys. Shout out to Carson, thanks for coming by to chat through the list. We are going to be back tomorrow morning breaking down this Friday night slate, and then we'll be back on Sunday evening with the Great Colin Coward, and then we'll get into some stuff on Monday, breaking in the playing games, and then hey, from there, from Tuesday, we're going every night until the NBA Finals, when we'll start having fewer games. But I appreciate you guys rocking with us, and we

will see you tomorrow morning. The volume