Hoops Tonight - Jimmy Butler carries Heat over Tatum and Celtics

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absolutely everything about this game tonight. Then we're gonna bring Carson on and we're gonna do three questions from this series, and then we're gonna do a lot of a lot more of talk about tomorrow night's game between the Golden State Warriors in the Dallas Mavericks. Before we get started, a couple of quick housekeeping notes. Make sure you like this video and subscribe to the Volumes YouTube channel so

you don't miss any more of our shows. We're basically gonna be going live for every single NBA game the rest of the season. If not live, then at least some sort of YouTube content, So definitely after every game, come to the YouTube channel after the game. Don't forget to follow me on Twitter at underscore Jason lt for any video content. I did a bunch of uh. I recorded a bunch of video on my TV during the game to try to demonstrate some concepts that I'd like

to get into tonight. So if you hear me talking about something and you want to see a video example of it, go to my Twitter feed. So I want to start with Boston. And I know it sounds crazy because obviously Miami put forth a great performance tonight, and we are going to talk about Miami and what they do really well, what they did really well tonight, and some signs of optimism looking forward in the series. But

Boston is the better team. They've clearly demonstrated that basically since January, and I think they've clearly demonstrated that in this playoff run. However, they just got out of a seven game war with Milwaukee, and there's not just physical wear and tear, there's emotional wear and tear and literal injuries that manifested in the form of Marcus Smart having this I think I believe it was the hip contusion

that left him out again. I'm not sure exactly what it was, but I would imagine that the people in Boston just simply thought, hey, I'd rather give Marcus Smart three days, three full days off before we get into game too, rather than have him turned right around after Game seven, especially if you're confident in what you can do in the series, which I believe Boston is. The Al Horford thing is super weird health and safety protocols.

I suppose that means COVID, although we're not certain. I think the fact that I believe Shams Serenia reported that he's probably out for Game two as well, and that obviously kind of strongly hints at it being COVID. When I saw those two specific injuries, you know, or two specific uh guys being out of the lineup for Marcus Smart,

less concerned. Obviously, Marcus Smart is very important to the best Boston lineups, which we will get to here in a few minutes, but without Horford in particular, it takes away Boston's ability to run five out basketball, which is

when they're at their best. We did a whole thing about this towards the end of the Milwaukee series when they said Rob Williams was available for Game seven, and I said I wouldn't play him because they're four out one in offense is not as good as their five out offense, and when they have Al Horford and he can pop and or just spot up off the ball, it just gives a lot more room for driving lanes, which become obviously way more important as the game progresses,

especially when Miami gets more aggressive. But that fatigue was inevitably gonna play a role, and I thought Boston came out and played a really good basketball game to start. I've talked a lot about how Boston's offense and their decision making is the driving force behind everything that they do. Tonight email Udoka in his first quarter interview on the live broadcast said that it's the first leg of their transition defense, which is something that we've talked about at

length on the show. It's something that you made Udoka specifically talked about in them in the second round series with Milwaukee. Their offense is so important to just the transition into their defense so they can get set rather than giving up transition opportunities. Well, to start this game, they had excellent offensive execution but Miami switches everything, right, and as we've talked about on the show, you have

to attack switching defenses rather than settling. If you turn a switching defense into an isolation contest, you stagnate yourself, you stagnate your teammates, and you put the outcome of the game on the strength of whether or not you can make pull up jump shots, because you're not just

gonna beat people straight to the rim. There's gonna be help side, right, and so a lot of times in those isolation situations, you're getting to the rim and turning and taking fade away jump shots, or you're not even attempting to drive to the rim and you're taking step back jump shots around the perimeter. Right. Well, Boston on their first five offensive possessions got the basketball into the paint, which is a huge part of how they got off to such a good start, and Jayson Tatum in particular

was the driving force behind that. But over the course of the game, I don't know if it was fatigue a little bit I thought was defense of pressure from Miami, which will get a little bit further into but they're like, go with the rope. They gave up two thirty point quarters, which is extremely uncommon for this Boston defense. And you know what, that's how it goes. Sometimes when you're in a Game one of a playoff series, right after a

Game seven, you're run out of gas. Miami second half run, I thought, was completely fueled by ball pressure in aggressive defense in the passing lanes. Now, to be clear, ball pressure is actually something that should help your offense if you're disciplined, because pressuring the ball puts you out of position. When you're reaching, when you're lunging, you put yourself out

of position as the defensive player. So if you were the offensive player and you're disciplined, and you take care of the basketball and you weaponize their pressure against them, you can get a lot of straight line drives in passing lanes. If a guy is overplaying a passing lane, then the back door is wide open for everybody. Right, So, aggressive defenses are basically purposefully compromising their own defense for the sake of trying to get you to get sloppy

with the basketball. And that's what was so smart about what Miami did because Boston's biggest weakness, as I've talked about through this entire playoff run, is game management having a player who truly understands the flow of the basketball game and can get them into their stuff and understand exactly what's happening. Jayson Tatum played a magnificent first half

of basketball. You know, our guy calling Cowherd opened up his show today on FS one with the rant about how he said Jayson Tatum was a top three franchise corner stone in the NBA. Now I disagree with him because I wouldn't take him third, but he's certainly in that conversation, which is absolutely wild, the ascent that Jason Tatum is on. But then we're gonna get a little bit further into what Jason did well. But in that second half Miami, when they brought the ball pressure, it

was Jason Tatum who got sloppy with the basketball. It was Jason Tatum who wasn't handling the ball pressure. It was Jason Tatum that wasn't reading the defenders that were gambling in the passing lines. That's a hole in his game right now. It was a hole that manifested in the Milwaukee series. And it's exactly why I picked Miami to take this to six games. Even though I believe

Boston is the better team and they will win. I said frequently that Boston would have extended stretches in this series where they would not be able to score, and that happened in that third quarter. I believe they had two points the the first like seven or eight minutes. I think Miami started on a twenty two to two run when things were going south. When Miami came with all that pressure and aggressiveness on defense, there was no

savvy floor general to weaponize that aggression against Boston. And again, there's not that many guys like this in the lead, So it's it's a it's a difficult problem to confront. You basically are limited to the top guys like Lebron and Luca, you know, a Yoki or or a Chris Paul right, Like, they're only a handful of really high level initiators. Then you've got guys that are pretty good at it, Guys like Steph Curry, Kevin Durray, Janice, guys that do feel the flow of the game, even though

they're not fantastic playmakers. Right. But it's just once you get off of that, it's like you're looking at role players, you're asking that's where you're looking at like a Ricky Rubio to come in and do that for you, which then that presents a whole bunch of other issues. But this is gonna be a person sent problem for Boston throughout this entire last two rounds. I said on Twitter earlier today that Boston's best punch is better than anybody's

best punching basketball. The question is going to be how frequently can they get to that best punch, because right after an incredible first half, they utterly and completely fell apart to start the second half in their basic offensive, fundamental decision making. And so it will be on Jayson Tatum to make that adjustment to understand that Miami's aggression can actually be used to his advantage as long as he understands that that's what's happening. Miami is gambling, Miami

is putting themselves out of position. But to Miami's credit, this is what they do. You know, as much as we criticize Joel Embiid and James Harden for crumbling in that second round series, so much of what they did is Miami making them crumble. Miami is the definition of a team. We we've called them on the show a sponge in the desert that you squeeze until every last drop is out. They maximize their talent and ability. They are so incredibly tough that they will expose teams that

aren't tough. I believe this Boston team is tough, and I believe they will respond. But that's what happened to Philly. They got met by a tough team that challenged them and all of the toughness areas of the game of basketball, and the seventy sixers wilted. And in that second half tonight, when Miami punched Boston in the mouth, Boston took a little while to respond. Wasn't until the early fourth quarter when they went on that ten o run to cut it from twenty to ten that they actually kind of

started to respond and make something happen. But I thought, you know, this is this is what Miami does so incredibly well. They're in better shape than you. They're more disciplined than you when they amble, even they're gambling, even they're aggressive front facing defense. That's that's always looking to attack you on the ball and always looking to attack you on the past. All of that stuff is extremely polished,

and everybody's in the right place. I wanted to look at the other side of the ball for a minute, so when Miami's on offense, because Boston did not have a good defensive night. If you guys remember in the preview that I did, I talked about how I expected Boston early in this early in the series to not switch, because every team tries to start the series by not switching as much as possible, except for Miami. Miami does

it the the They're relentless with it. But the reason why they try not to switch is you don't want to give up size mismatches as like in large sample size. Coaches don't want to because they don't want their smaller players to be banging with Bam at a bio in offensive rebound situations all night long. They don't want to. It's it's a physical wear and tear play. The more you can keep Tyson on BAM, the more you can keep keep you know, I think they started Grant Williams

on BAM. The more you can keep those guys there, the easier it is for all your other perimeter players to not have to bang bodies as much. That's what they think. I thoroughly disagree with that. I've always said that the advantages of switching cancel that out because you're asking these Boston guards and Wings to blow up screens NonStop, to fly through screens, and early in the game they did. Derek White single handedly blew up to dribble handoffs for

for runout dunks. Jayson Tatum blew up two additional dribble handoffs. They literally were blowing up every Miami action. Just just get like, when a dribble handoff is happening, the way coaches teach is you want to literally be in between the offensive player and the guy who has the ball. You want to you wanna sandwich yourself in between that dribble handoff and disrupt that change. And they were doing an amazing job of that in the first quarter. Here's

the problem. That's exhausting, and they just got out of a war with Milwaukee, and so over the course of the game, suddenly they started dying on those screens. Now, Boston switches perimeter actions, So if Jayson Tatum and Jalen Brown there two guys are involved in action, they'll switch. But anything that involved Daniel Tys, anything that involved Rob Williams, or anything that involved whoever was guarding BAM, so at the beginning of the game, it was Grant Williams on BAM.

Those three guys, so those three situations, they were in a drop coverage, dropping off of BAM or dropping off of whoever Tyson Rob Williams were guarding. And so what got Miami back into this game, and what I thought was really smart was they persistently attacked whoever Thys was guarding. They not as not as the the the offensive player

looking to score, but just as the screener. Because if you set a pin down with tyss Man, Tys is sitting down in the lane, and so you've got guys like Gabe Vincent Max True's coming off of these screens and Whoever's guarding them is getting hit by Tyson's man in their wide open. That's how Tyler Harrow came in

and instantly had an impact on this game. They were just he was just coming off of bhy ball screens and Daniel Tys or or whoever it was that was guarding the screen or was just sitting down in the lane, and he would come off and score. So at some point in this series, Boston's gonna have to try to take that away. At some point they're going to have

to look to make them an isolation team. And my thing is with Marcus Smart back in the lineup, coming back probably in Game two, and without Horford, whether that's Game two or game through, we'll see they'll have a better opportunity to do that. Those are their best switchable groups. A huge part of this was a personnel issue. Now, what was encouraging for Miami fans. Jimmy Butler did in a easing job attacking mismatches in the second half. Jerry

Butler is is interesting player for basketball fans. We had a little conversation my producers and I earlier today about whether or not Jimmy Butler is an interesting basketball player, and for casual fans not so much, because he doesn't bring above the rim flash and he doesn't bring perimeter flash. And if you don't bring one of those two, then you're not a very highlight oriented player, and a lot of fans aren't going to be interested in what you do.

But for hoop Heeds, for real people that are in love with the game of basketball, there's something so impressive about what he does. He's an inch taller than me. He's about six ft seven, but he's really short arms. He's got a six eight wingspan shorter than mine even, and you not nothing's really impressive going on there as a physical wing player on either end of the floor. But what he does have is he's incredibly strong and he's an incredibly good shape, which is a huge part

of why he thrives so much in these environments. He's got the toughness up here and the physical tools to actually inflict that toughness on people. And most importantly, Jimmy

supplements everything he does with easy offense. I had a coach at Arizona Christian University my last year playing in college, and he used to tell me there's an easy way to get twelve points every game by running in transition for a layup once a half, by crashing the offensive glass and getting a put back once a half, and by getting to the foul line once a half. If you do that, you'll score six points in each half, and you'll get you'll be a person who averages double figures.

And I always thought that was super interesting, and it's something that I tell all of my high school kids because it's such a it's a it's an easy way to get them to understand that effort and focus on details actually gives you offensive production, the things that help get the girls and get the love and get all the attention, right. And Jimmy Butler is an absolute monster at those specific things. He's gonna get a steel in a passing lane and a runout dunk every single game.

He's gonna get an offensive rebound put back every single game. He is going to run the floor and transition on the wing after somebody else makes a play in every single game he gets to the foul line. He manufactures points with the officiating every single game. And that is how a guy that doesn't have the physical tools of Janice, doesn't have the perimeter school a skill of a k D, doesn't have the vision as a playmaker of a Lebron,

doesn't have any of that. But he's a hell of a lot closer to them than he is to a Jalen Brown, Right, And that's just a testament to everything that he does. It's it's another smaller example of squeezing the sponge, of getting every last drop out of what you have in your ability. If you're a Miami fan, the encouraging thing is in that second half, he was able to attack mismatches frequently when Boston did final start switching,

particularly Derek White and Peyton Pritchard. Now, if you're a Boston fan, the counter to that is if you have the opportunity to have Marcus Smart and Al Horford out there, suddenly those mismatches don't exist anymore. Boston's best lineup with Tatum and Brown and with Grant Williams and Horford and with Marcus Smart, there is nobody for Jimmy Butler to attack except for maybe Marcus Smart, who's the defensive player

of the year. And so especially in those groups, if they go to their switching and they take away all those dribble handoffs and easy shots that Miami gets, that's their best chance to win. Boston eventually is going to have to start switching everything and they need to get all their guys back. You know, with Jayson Tatum, I want to talk about him for just a couple of minutes.

This is this is exactly the difference between being a guy who's ascending into superstardom and being in that group and being a staple in that group, being in that group to five to ten years, being the guy that's consistently at this level, night in and night out, for the for for your entire prime. You have to be able to adjust. You have to be able to thrive in different environments. Jayson Tatum did an amazing job attacking the paint early in the game against their switching defense,

but he was facing single coverage. He was getting middle penetration, which is so important to compromising the defense because it's so much harder to help in the middle of the floor than it is to help on the baseline. That's why every coach when they're telling you to guard perimeter players, you want to funnel to the baseline. Funnel to the baseline, never funnel to the middle, because if you funnel to the middle, it's a lot harder to help and recover.

Tatum was getting middle penetration, but then in the second half, they started picking him up full court, a ton more ball pressure, playing passing lanes, trapping him on some of these ball screens, and sending double teams when he tried to put the ball on the floor. And Tatum adjusted in the fourth quarter, but it's too late. The game is over. He has to be quick. You have to be quick with that adjustment on your feet. You have to be you turn the ball over once you understand

exactly what happened. Okay, it's ball pressure and they're playing the passing lanes. This is what I have to do to counter. When Jimmy reaches, I need to beat him to the basket and then make a quick read to a shooter. Then work the ball around and I'll get it back in a position where I have a chance to attack. I expect Tatum to make that adjustment, but

these are part of those growing pains. He has to find a way to get that disastrous third quarter out of here, because they had a good stretch in that fourth quarter, got it two single digits. This was a game they almost stole in spite of all of that, but they did too much damage to themselves in that in that third quarter that it became too big for

them to overcome. Last note on Miami. One of the things that makes that I find so important about what Miami does on offense is they are constantly trying to give their guys advantages. I was so annoyed with the Lakers all year because they never did any of this stuff. They never did they never had their guys coming off of pin downs consistently. They never had their guys coming off of dribble handoffs consistently. That those are little details

that give advantages to players. We talked about this a lot like it's call we call close that attacking or you know, essentially, any time the defense is already compromised when you have the ball, you have a better chance. If you are facing a set defense and the defenders right in front of you and you have to break him down to get by him, that it's a lot harder.

And so what I've always found so impressive about Miami is even though Jimmy Butler is capable of walking down some of your defenders on the floor and getting isolation baskets, they want Jimmy coming off of pin downs all day long because he's gonna get Jimmy Butler on his or he's gonna get Jason or Jalen Brown on his hip and work him into the lane. Right. They know Max Strus can knock down spot up threes, They know Gay Vincent can knock down spot up threes. They know Tyler

Harroll can knock get down spot up threes. But you know what they all be come a lot better, will you give them an advantage every time, and so they have Tyson's man go down instead his screen. So that's how gay Vincent got going in that second half, and then he started making tough shots over the top of the defense. But Miami understands that you don't always have to make it hard. Boston made it hard on them

in that fourth quarter by doing more switching. They're going to be extended stretch of this series where they do that in Miami is gonna struggle. So during the opportunities that you have to give your guys advantages. When Boston is going to drop and not switch those screens, you have to keep doing that because that those are your chances to float your offense for extended stretches. So that with things that so that when things get stagnant late, you have a twenty point lead and it's too hard

to overcome. Looking forward in this series, I expect Smart back next game. I expect Corford back in Game three. I expect a lot more five out which is gonna make it a lot harder for Miami to play their physically aggressive passing lane and ball pressure defense. They'll have a lot more space us to work with and I think Boston will get it to get it together. Also, just buying Marcus Smart that time off, buying Al Horford

that time off, that's important, you know. Obviously, Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum are younger, so they can recover quicker. They have a really good chance to bounce back here in Game two. I expect Boston to win Game two. All right, we're gonna bring my guy Carson on and we're gonna get a little bit further into the weeds here. Yeah, Jason, Well, I am here as I often am, to ask you

some of the biggest questions on our minds tonight. We're gonna touch a little bit on the Western Conference Finals in a second, but we'll stick with this game first. And obviously you have been a huge Celtics advocate. You've talked about them as a title favorite since the late stretch of the regular season, and as you said earlier, you picked them to win this series in six. Obviously they come out, they lose game one. So on a scale of one to ten, how concerned are you about

your Celtics pick in this series? So in terms of the basketball, I'm not concerned at all. I didn't see anything today that would sway me on that pick. The one thing that has me a little bit concerned about my pick is this Horford thing. And if you would have missed one game, I wouldn't have thought twice about

it because I expected Miami to win tonight. But if he misses game two and they have to play this much tice again in game two, and they have to play Rob Williams this much again in game two, and they play four out one in instead of five out, and Rob Williams and again Rob Williams had some log lob dunks tonight. Vertical spacing is a real thing, But what do I say? Vertical spacing is not the same

as perimeter spacing. It makes it significantly harder. And really, when Miami shrunk the floor on Boston there in that second half, you could see that. So Horford being out will make them stealing game to a lot more difficult.

But I still expect Boston to steal game two. That said, yeah, I would say that on a scale of one to ten, I'm probably at like a four just because of the Horford thing, Like because falling down to oh just makes it super applicated because of the home court advantage situation.

So losing Game one against Milwaukee, you know, you know, coming back, like you still had three additional home games left, right, and in this case, like if you drop both of these games at home in Miami, then suddenly you now have Game seven facing you in Miami. So now you basically have to win the next four games to steal the series in six, or you have to go on the road to Miami to play game seven, which is extremely difficult to do as we know. So from that standpoint,

the Horford thing is definitely concerning. But I still think Boston gets game too. Do you think at all that Miami has been underrated just in broad conversations or that you've underrated anything about them individually? I Boston, to me, excuse me, Miami to me has the highest floor out of any team in this field. That's coaching, that's every player on the roster having a chip on their shoulder.

There's a lot of things like that. But I I very closely watched this game, charted a bunch of things, tried to go play by play. I was actually watching the feed behind because I kept having to fast forward on commercial breaks as I was going back to watch film and rewatch possessions, and when Boston switched, Miami did

not get great stuff. When Boston, especially with Tyson on the floor, would ran drop for the handoffs and the high screens, they got a lot of really good shots, not just threes, but specifically Jimmy Butler is really good at weaponizing those pin downs to get downhill. Jimmy Butler, we talked about him earlier. One of the things that's so underrated about Jimmy Butler is his short range game.

You know, everyone talks about the mid range these days, right, because the analytics movement drove everybody towards attack the basket and take threes, right, And so there became this inefficiency, this market inefficiency, and all this space that you could operate the mid range, especially his lineups got smaller and you had all these guys that had opportunities to attack mismatches for pull up jump shots in the mid range. Well, Jimmy is great at the short range, which I think

is frequently glossed over as an offensive skill set. These are the little push shots and floaters and hooks and short spinning jump shots and things that are like five ft away from the rim, like five to seven ft

away and Jimmy's really good at that. And what they would do is, you know, they Jimmy would work Jalen Brown down to the short corner and they'd have Taisko set the Tysons man go set a screen and he curl around it, and Jimmy get Jalen get on his backside and you just kind of work his way into

the lane and make short shots in the lane. And so from what I could tell, the shots that Miami was getting that were quality shots were pretty We were fixable by a pretty simple adjustment from Boston, which is do what you did when you were at your best, when you were healthy towards the end of the regular season, which is just switch. You know, bam At a Bio guards some dribble handoffs for bo Austin. You know what Bama a Bio does. He jumps out and guards the

guy who's coming off the handoff. It's hard, you have to communicate. It presents its own set of issues, but it's proven to work, especially in this setting, and so I think I think in general, as good as Miami is, what this was tonight was Boston through a really good first half punch and then hit their absolute floor in the second half, which, as we've said, Boston has one of the lowest floors in this field. In Miami hit their little ceiling in terms of transition runouts and things

like that. But to me, Miami didn't show me anything that I didn't already know about them tonight. Let's go a little bit deeper into that second half change in dynamic because sus came out first half, they had sixty two points as a team, Tatum was pretty much sparkling, and then all of a sudden second half forty five points overall, but just fourteen in that third quarter in absolute dude, So, Jason, do you think that that second half of Austin was more about bad offense on their

part or was it good defense from Miami? To be clear, it was good defense from Miami, but Boston played into it with their I mean, Jayson Tatum went through like a five or six possession stretch where he just walked across half court and turned it over like four times before they even got into their sets. And it wasn't even like it wasn't even like he was losing control

of the basketball. It was like he was bringing the ball off the floor, they would be fronting the high post when he would try to make a high post entry so that the gate could get into their offense, and so like they would fight for position and he got to throw up, but he wouldn't even see Jimmy Butler just completely cheating off of the week side to come in and get that steel off the entry to the high post. Like just basic fundamental. Like Miami's doing

a great job. They're playing textbook aggressive defense, but the counter to aggressive defense is fundamental, disciplined offense. And Boston didn't run any of that in that third quarter. So again, when you got two run it's disingenuous for me to say one thing happened. It was obviously great Miami and

terrible Boston. But to me, the adjustment moving forward, Miami is going to have extended, extended stretches in the series where they play aggressive like that, where they pick up full court, where they deny passing lanes, where they jump off of off ball players to try to gamble for steals, and Boston has an easy counter to that, which is just calm down and take care of the basketball. Alright, let's slip to the offensive side for Miami and You touched on this a bit earlier, but it was really

a Jimmy masterpiece overall. He now has had his last five forty pieces all come in the playoffs. No regular season forty point games in the last three years, Jason, but five in those same post seasons. He's just that kind of guy. And he's putting up overall these playoffs thirty eight five and a half on better than sixty true shooting. So is he a guy who doesn't get enough respect? Do you think Jimmy gets enough respect around the league? He doesn't, but it's because of the regular

season stuff. Like I would argue Lebron hasn't gotten nearly enough respect over the last half year a half dozen years because he mails in a lot of nights in the regular season and there are guys at the top of the league who don't you know, Jimmy Butler is

a man who understands the long term vision. He understands that there are sixteen games to be played in the late spring early summer that are a hell of a lot more difficult than what they're doing in the regular season, so they'll take a lot of nights off when he does play. Sometimes he will float through games. But you know, Carson, you asked me after our last show, you said, is Luca don Chich the best offensive player in basketball? And

if you remember, I said yes. But one of the reasons why is I said, the guy that I'm always going to be drawn to is the big power wing that can punish mismatches, score and pass. That's always going to be the guy that I'm drawn to. And that's what Jimmy Butler is. It's not it's not a coincidence that he raises his game in this environment. He brings all of those things to the table. He can defend like crazy, he can guard the other team's best player.

He's a defensive playmaker, meaning he understands like momentum plays on defense, gambling for steals. That's there's no two baskets. Are like what Luca did to Phoenix in this in that first half. Yes, he only scored eight points in the first four possessions or whatever, but it's not just eight points. It's making you feel helpless. It's it's sucking the life out of the other team. It's not just two points for Jimmy Butler to gamble a passing lane and get a run out dunk. It also sucks the

life out of the other team. It's a psychological blow there, like like a pick six in football has a similar type of vibe. It is such a disastrous outcome for the other team even though it's just two points, that it has a psychological impact. Jimmy Butler understands all of that, and then on the offensive end of the floor, he brings all of that to the table. He can score at all three levels. He can playmake the hell out of the basketball. He can any your small, skinny, whatever,

slow footed defender on the floor. He can attack them in any way if you send the extra defensive attention his way. He's not going to force the action. He's going to kick the ball out. He's got isolation moves that it can go to and crunch time. The dude is is just He's the definition of a guy who is built for this environment. And then he has the physical strength and endurance to thrive as well. He's built

to survive in this environment. And I think, I think, I think, even though the public may not get it, I bet you all the guys around in the league have the appropriate fear of Jimmy as a superstar. Yeah, and it feels like in this game it's kind of his signature tenacity and relentlessness that really shines through. He gets to the line eighteen times. He's so aggressive attacking those mismatches as this game went on, and there's just something about him where he elevates his game. I mean,

he had a brutal midrange shooting season this year. He was thirty eight percent overall, But in a game like this, it's like all of a sudden, he has some dazzling moments there. And you mentioned the defensive playmaking like his two fourth quarter blocks. He going for show stopping momentum plays. That block on Jayson Tatum, that's not a discipline traditional close out, that's what I'm trying to block this shot.

And then he had the other block from behind. Hyper aggressive play, and that's just kind of what he does, right. He brings that fearlessness and we saw it in the finals where he again overperformed expectations. If he leads this team two another NBA Finals, and even if they don't win, he's the clear best guy on two finals teams. That's something that not a lot of players throughout NBA history

have on their resumes. So what do you think the legacy of Jimmy Butler looks like if he does that, and maybe even if he doesn't, but he just has another phenomenal series here and continues to have that playoff over performance. That's a really interesting question. You know, there are there are a handful of guys like this in NBA history that have had extensive winning impact that hasn't

necessarily manifested into anything. You know, um and like when the way I defined it is like a guy that isn't on the same level as the top players in the league, but on any given night, he damn sure

can be. And I like another a great example of this of this, I think is like Paul Pierce in the late two thousand in the late two thousand's, Like, I don't think there's ever a moment in time where Paul Pierce anybody thought he was like a real m VP candidate, right, a real full crumb centerpiece of a team. But like that, that dude would go toe to toe with Kobe, that dude would go toe to toe with Lebron, he would be in that in that setting, and up here he thinks he's at that level. Up here, he

has that same audacity as those guys. He has that fearlessness, like you said that, that understanding of what it takes to win in that environment. Now inevitably what's happened to Jimmy is he keeps just running into the better player, right, And I believe that's gonna be what happens in this series with Jayson Tatum over the course of the series,

Jayson Tate, m will make that clear. In the NBA Finals in Jimmy played about as well as you possibly can, but he ran into Lebron freaking James and and that's

just how that goes. But at the end of the day, like like Jimmy Butler's legacy to me is the definition of a player who absolutely maximized his individual potential, which is all you can ask, how many how many six seven wings with short arms do you know that could be theoretically be a finals MVP if a couple of things break their way that also aren't really great shooters, and like like it's it's it's an incredible it's an incredible testament to just just you know, Eric Spoilster talked

about this. I've talked about this on the show before. Eric Spolster talks about the type of player that Miami is drawn to, and he talks about how they win games with extra efforts, and there's a lot of truth to that. Any coach will tell you that. And when you've got a team full of guys that are like that, and your superstar is like that and sets that example, you're gonna win a lot of basketball games that you

might otherwise lose. And I thought, you know, again, Boston is the better team with more talent, and Miami handled him tonight. And that's a big part of That's a big part of why I picked this series to go to six. It's a big part of what Miami's upside is. It's they they grind out basketball games on the margins. Yeah, and Jimmy is the ultimate grinder. It feels like of any star basketball player of this era, that is his brand and he has certainly found a fitting home in

Miami for that. All right, let's flip to the Western Conference Finals. Warriors MAVs obviously tips off tomorrow. We talked a few days ago, and you refer to this earlier about whether or not Luca is the best offensive player on the planet, and he's firmly in that conversation, and you said that you were even leaning yes in that conversation at this moment. So is there any answer for

him in this matchup with the Warriors? Jason, Yeah, It's so funny because, yeah, I I've been in the various versions of this conversation, either on Twitter or on other podcasts for the last couple of days, and you know, the Warriors fan base rightfully is very confident, and they've been given a reason to be very confident. But to me, like, it's it's okay to be confident in your team and to be a fan of your team and acknowledge certain realities,

you know what I mean. Like, even even with the Laker team in which I covered, and obviously as a Lebron fan, I was rooting for that team, like I knew that they were always do you remember the exhibition games before the Bubble playoffs, like the whatever they called them, the seeding games or whatever, and the Lakers were so horrific offensively that there was a ton of pessimism surrounding that team. That team was always at risk of going

ice cold from three. It was It's just a reality that you have to be aware of and you'll be better as a fan when you're to acknowledge certain realities. I think this series, I'm very confident in Boston to to beat Miami. I'm picking Dallas, but I'm not super confident in that. I think this series is close to a coin flip. I just him giving a slight edge to Luca, and as the team that doesn't have home court, I believe they would win in six on their home floor.

That's why I made that pick. The reality of the situation is something that Golden State Warriors fans have to acknowledge. Even if you win this series, Luca is gonna light your ass on fire every night. There's not a soul on that team that can guard him. The only game that I could see him potentially struggling is Game one because Luca, similar to Lebron, is very much a feel things out type of player. He's going to be going into that game testing what works and what doesn't. Hey.

I like, for instance, I expect Andrew Wiggins to guard him from the opening tip. It'll be like, Hey, let me see what we're on. Andrew, Like, if it's a late clock situation and I have to score on and let me see if this move works. Let me see if that move works. Can am I capable of backing him down in the post? Or am I gonna have to work for him from the perimeter? Does he have the length to bother these shots or those shots or whatever it might be. He might do the same thing

to Draymond. He might call for a bunch of switch screens from Stepsman and Jordan's pools Man just to see what Golden State does to try to prevent those switches, just so that he can document all that information. Lebron used to do that all the time, and Cavs fans would complain like, why isn't Lebron being more aggressive? Why

isn't Lebron being more aggressive? And sometimes he would just screw with you to prove a point and come out in the next game and shoot every time just to show like, hey, I can do this, but I'm not worried about a scoring spurt. I want to win the series, and the best way for me to win the series is to understand what works and what doesn't. And so I expect Luca to kind of feel things out in game one, but outside of that, like, Luca is going

to be amazing in this series. It's it's one of it's a very safe bet because he just is going to have a physical mismatch against everybody on your roster, and even if you're a Golden State fan, and even if you're rooting for them to win, and even if you expect them to win, which again, I will not be the least bit surprised. I will be shocked if Miami wins this series. I will not be the least

bit surprised if Golden State wins. But you, as a Warrior's fan, have to acknowledge that, even if you win, Luca is a mismatch problem. Just acknowledge it. It's the reality. Yeah, And I don't know if there's many situations in which he is not just a brutal mismatch. Right now, and as we said, he's in the conversation for best offensive player on the planet. So let's look at the superstar opposite him, because it does feel like right now, Luca

is the premier guy in this series. He has had the advantage over Steph as of late in terms of physical imposition, which he always will, scoring and playmaking volume really even just pure shot making, like he has been the better guy consistently throughout these playoffs, throughout the latter stretch of the regular season. But Jason can steps still be the best player in this series, and if so, how does he go about doing that? Yes, he can, and he has to be. He literally has to be

for Golden State to win this series. Steph has to be the best player. And if they do, I don't I believe it will be because of him. Now, the thing is is that Dallas isn't Dallas is two things really well. On defense, they do. They're very good dribble contained team basically everywhere outside of Luca and maybe like Kleiba right, but like like Reggie, Bullock is great at sliding his feet and keeping keeping people in front. So

is Dori and Phinney Smith. Even Jalen Brunson and Spencer didn't what he do a pretty nice job at sliding their feet and keeping people in front. There. Dallas is also extremely well coached. We talked about how they basically shut down every single Phoenix pick and roll action that

they run towards the end of that series. I expect Dallas over the course of the series to solve that solved, but become become capable of adequately guarding a lot of Golden State's actions, their off ball actions, they're split cuts there, everything that they do to try to generate shots off ball right, and so's at a certain point there will be a time in this series where Steph and Jordan's Pool in particular, are going to have to create shots

for themselves and beat people to the rim and engage help defenders so that they can get open shots for their other shooters. Jordan Pool is a wild card. I don't know what to expect from him in this series. But Steph is the guy. Steph is your two time m v P. Step is your most reliable player two thousand sixteen, Steph, you know, the the at the very

peak of his career. I won't even say, I'll say last year, when I thought he was at his very best, Steph, I would I would be picking Golden State to win this series because he would just have his way with Dallas over the course of the series as a score.

And you know, as I said, like there was there was a shot profile with Steph last year that existed basically from two thousand fifteen two last year where he had that audacity to relentlessly attack people off the dribble and take incredibly you know, step shots, right, and the step shots are almost not entirely out of his repertoire,

but they're kind of out of his repertoire. And a lot of that has to do with they have a lot more offensive talent now because of Jordan Pool's elevation and Klay Thompson being back, and you know, Clay Thompson wasn't even in the picture, and Jordan Pool was le a lot less consistent, especially early in the year, right, So he doesn't need to. But my point is Dallas is gonna make him have to. Dallas is going to make step have to create shots in those types of situations.

And so again, like I think Luca is the best player in the series for the record, I I have to think about this, but I probably think Luca is better than Lebron now too. So to me, this is just as much about Luca's rise in Lebron and steps age into Klins. So this is not an anti Steph thing. I'm just saying that in order for Golden State to win this series, Steph is going to have to tap into his prime. He's going to have to tap into the best version of himself in order to beat this

Dallas defense. How big of a legacy moment is this series for staff? Not at all? I mean I know that, I know that's not first takey. I know that's not some something super entertaining. But for me, like when guys start undergoing their physical decline, Like, the only way that I get critical of guys at this phase in their career is not related to their ability to reach their basketball ceiling. It's related to controllables. Like got all of you who listened to me all year. I was super

critical of Lebron this year as a leader. I thought he came out with a way lower intensity from the start of training camp. He waited half the season to even attempt to try on defense, and then he tried for a couple of weeks and then stopped again. He did passive aggressive stuff. Lebron was a bad leader, and like, I'm never gonna criticize him for his physical a clin He's in his He's about to go into his twentieth season this fall, but there are controllables there. Steph in

the controllables has been magnificent this year. I think he's the best leader in the NBA. I've compared him to Tim Duncan. Everything that he has, the that that is not you know, that is not a wild card. He's done what he's had to do. He just has lost a quarter of a step. It's made it difficult for him to create his own shot and as a result, his percentages have plummeted once again. He's shooting just barely over thirty from three in this postseason after he had

a down year shooting in the regular season. That stuff that, to me is just physical decline. And if Steph loses this series as a small guard towards the tail end of his career coming off of a sprained foot, like I think if you're ripping down step at that point, you're being You're being a nefarious, disingenuous, you know, online Twitter troll. That's fair. I think Steph has certainly done what's necessary to prove that he's a top fifteen guy all time, and this isn't, like obviously a top tier

legacy moment for him. I do feel like it's kind of big in some ways though, just in that his career has been so unique because obviously he was late rising to his absolute prime and then he had two years like that pre Katie, and all of a sudden everything he does is intertwined with Katie, and then he misses the season with injury. Last year's his peak self, but the team just isn't obviously, you know, capable of really contending. And now he finally has this contender caliber

team around him again. Even though you're right, it does seem like he's regressed. He's so close to his prime that you sort of still have those superstar expectations for him. Actually, I would say most people just will. And it feels like most people would probably view the Warriors is the

better team overall. So I agree with you this is not going to define Steph's legacy in any way, but I do feel like it's kind of a big moment just because there are so few years we have of quasi peak Steph with a contending caliber team around him matching up against like another superstar kind of guy, and this is one of those moments. So it's interesting, you know, that's the key there is, Like it's not a legacy

defining thing. What it would be is a signal of a change in the times, Like if the Warriors lost this series and looka outplayed Steph. I wouldn't start relitigating Steph's career. What I would say is, hey, the changing of the guard, like here comes Luca and Janice, and the days of Lebron and Steph are probably over, not over,

but they're on the tail end. And now now you know, when Lebron and Steph were at their peaks, when things went their way, they won every single time, right, and then when things didn't go their way, sometimes they still won. And then there were other guys that sometimes one because things broke their way, right, Well, Lebron and Steph will enter into a phase of their careers where they need things to break their way, now you know what I mean,

which is how it goes. And it's just one of those deals where like as you age, your margin for error shrinks and and you you have to play at your absolute ceiling to reach where you need to reach, you know, like it's one it's one of those it's it's one of those deals where if as a as a player, you have to understand your opportunities and how few they are. That's why I was so critical of Lebron.

You're an eight year in year nineteen and you literally came into training camp and didn't try like or mailed it in. Expected expected Russell Westbrook to come in and carry the load for you so that you can ease your way into the season. Anthony Davis did the same thing. Now, guess what, the season's gone and next year you're older and and that's the gamble that you play with this kind of stuff, Like the opportunities are few and far between.

And I think for the record, you know, because Steph has rescued Gold State on a handful of games in this playoff run that could have swung series. And for I think Steph senses that urgency and he like, you just don't know. You you don't know if you're gonna go into next year and then suddenly become Chris Paul and you're hurt all the time. There's not there's never

a guarantee of next year. And so from that standpoint, like, yeah, it's not a it's not a career defining moment for staff, but what it is is it's potentially one of his last opportunities. Alright, guys, that is all we have for tonight. Alright, guys, that is all we have for tonight. I sincerely appreciate your support. A couple of quick housekeeping notes um this episode. If you missed any portion of it you don't have time to look on YouTube, you can always find it

on our podcast feed. You can find that link on my Twitter feed. Follow me on Twitter at underscore Jason lt to see video content. I'll probably do a deep dive into this game tomorrow morning. Uh don't forget that we're gonna be going live after every game this week, so come hang out on YouTube after the final buzzer. I'll see you guys then, very excited for Warriors and Mavericks tomorrow night, game one. I will see you guys. Then the volume