Pete Newsome 00:09
You're listening to The Hire Calling Podcast. I'm your host Pete Newsome. And I'm joined by Ricky Baez. And I almost forgot Ricky, this is your source for all things hiring, staffing, and recruiting. How are you today?
Ricky Baez 00:20
I am doing great. Pete asked me why I'm doing so great.
Pete Newsome 00:25
Why, Ricky? Why today?
Ricky Baez 00:27
Why today? Because as soon as we're done with this, I'm gonna go to McDonald's. And I just found that over the weekend that McDonald's has happy meals for adults. And after I stopped laughing at that thinking, What a horrible idea. I'm like, I'm gonna go today, and I'm going to grab on for myself because I'm gonna make today a happy day for me. I definitely want it right as I was making fun of it and quickly switch to I want one.
Pete Newsome 00:53
Does that mean you get a toy?
Ricky Baez 00:55
Actually, it does. It really does. It's a weird look into it. As soon as I get it, I'm gonna send you a picture, we can put it on the website, it's gonna be a complete waste of time.
Pete Newsome 01:04
I look forward, I look forward to that. We weren't able to record last week because of hurricane Ian, which is been devastating to the state of Florida. Anyone in the state that hard I doubt there's anyone in the state who hasn't been affected either through friends or family.
Pete Newsome 01:20
You and I were both fortunate we had some power loss, but and some cleanup to do. But all things considered extremely fortunate not to have severe property damage, like so many Floridians, are dealing with and it's just been an awful, awful experience over the past few days in our state.
Ricky Baez 01:41
It has and you know, it's I lost my power for 20 hours in my patients for 120. But that's nowhere near the devastation that people on the West Coast and South Florida are experiencing right now. So, my heart and thoughts go out to everybody over there.
Ricky Baez 02:00
As of right now, today, Tuesday, October, what is it the fifth, the fourth, October 4, we still do have a rescue in efforts and some on Sanibel Island on the West Coast, because the causeway was destroyed, and nobody can get in or out be a car. So they have to go for your vote or either police FEMA or Coast Guard helicopter. So it's it, recovery efforts are still ongoing, and it's gonna be a long time before that part of the state feels any kind of normalcy.
Pete Newsome 02:30
Yep, it's been an awful, awful thing. But life does go on and has to go on. And so here we are recording, and we're going to get back to business as best we can. And fortunately, all of our employees are, are healthy and safe. And there has been some property damage. That's that, that some folks are dealing with. And that is really tough. And they're taking that one day at a time.
Pete Newsome 02:54
But we have to get back and keep moving. Unfortunately, there's a lot of craziness in the world that's just added to it. And, you know, we're gonna keep looking forward, while keeping our thoughts on the past as well. So So today, we are going to talk about what we expected to happen in 2022. So we're three-quarters of the way through the year.
Pete Newsome 03:18
Last December, we published a blog that was the staffing talked about the staffing trends we expected in 2022. So we thought it made sense to go through these and see how accurate we were in our expectations. So So what do you think? Do you think we're going to find that what we thought was going to happen and 2022 has actually happened?
Ricky Baez 03:42
I think we are Pete, I'm willing to guess that we are going to see some of these predictions we're spot on. Right? Because especially, you know, let's just dive in it because the first one is going to really drive this point home. Because and by the way if you want to find this go to the fourth quarter resources.com. And the blog section, there were the 10 recruiting trends for 2022.
Ricky Baez 04:05
It was published on December 6, 2021. And the very first one, Pete is it's a candidate-driven market. That was that that's what was predicted in December. And to be honest, it really has been that has come true. Recruiters from my point of view, from my perspective, have had a hard time really finding that candidate, not because they're not out. There are just so many out there. And there are so many to choose from right?
Pete Newsome 04:35
Yeah, it's been a candidate's market for a while. Since we came on the other side of COVID. It has been throughout the year. I think it's slowing down. I think if we made that prediction right now for 2023. I don't know that I would make the same prediction. I think we're seeing a lot of conditions change in the market, you know, the recession. If we're NY And how are we going to be in one? If we're not?
Pete Newsome 05:02
That's a different discussion. An inflation war is a supply shortage. We've already seen layoffs in the tech space. So yes, absolutely. 2022 Up until now has very much been a candidate-driven market. We want it to be that way. Of course, that's good. Yeah, that means there's lots of hiring. That means that companies are doing well and spending money and feeling confident about the future where they're adding their staff to their headcount. And all of those good positive things. I'm afraid it's slowing down.
Pete Newsome 05:37
And we're seeing that already too early to tell over the next three months, what will what we would predict if I was writing this blog right now, which we will need to write to this update for 2023. Man, I wouldn't want to write it until the last day of the year, probably because there are a lot of moving parts right now.
Ricky Baez 05:56
A lot of organizations are getting creative in how they reorganize, right, because a few months ago, we saw core Vana, right, they, they laid off about 2000 employees, for honestly, it's laying some people off some tech spaces or laying people off. So you're starting to see that, that hump. I don't know if you noticed what meta Facebook is doing.
Ricky Baez 06:19
I don't know if, if you saw what they were doing they are reorganizing, and based, you know, to be more efficient. And if they have some people who they don't need in that specific position, then they find positions for them somewhere else in the company. And they have X amount of time to do it. If they don't they get a severance package, but they're not calling it a layoff.
Pete Newsome 06:40
They're not how generous of them.
Ricky Baez 06:42
This is really interesting, right? Because I understand why they're not calling in a layoff because that's gonna hit their stock prices. But I guess the reason I'm bringing that up is that now that market is going to be even more saturated with candidates, right, but we can't see that beacon, how we used to see it before.
Ricky Baez 07:00
And I'm wondering if that's going to be the trend for next year, how we're not even going to see that layoff or predicted, it's just gonna be a saturated market and go from there, which is gonna make it harder for recruiters to actually keep their finger on the pulse on what kind of people are, are out there looking for a job. So it's gonna be really interesting next year.
Pete Newsome 07:18
Yeah, I think there's a lot of room for it to slow down and still be okay, in the employment market. Because there have been more jobs than there are some skills to match those jobs for years. Other than the brief period when COVID first started, since we came on the other side of the real estate market tanking and everything that happened with mortgages, then in 2008, it's been a candidates market.
Pete Newsome 07:46
And it's been stronger than ever over the past two years, I would say right, about two years now. So I think there's room to pull back a little bit without it being too tough. I'm afraid we're going to go back to a more significant degree. Of course, I'm afraid of that. I mean, there are so many factors that could lead to it. beyond our control, of course, is individuals, but hang on for the ride, I think this is the best way I think of it for the next couple of months anyway.
Ricky Baez 08:16
And I'm wondering real quick, I, I'm wondering what this is going to look like forget 2023. Let's take a look at 2024. Because I'm willing to guess, Pete, that some of the recruiters they're going to see in two years, they're going to, they're going to see a radically different resume than what they're seeing right now. Because more and more people, you know, going back to the great resignation, going back to quiet quitting, going back to quiet firing, there are some people who do go into the gig economy, right?
Ricky Baez 08:43
And they do that for a couple of years. And I'm wondering how that's going to show up in resumes. In about two or three years, there's going to be a lot of time where it's corporate America, corporate America, tentative networker, corporate America, corporate America. So that's going to be coming up. So for recruiters, you might want to put that different hat on, because you have to, I don't want to say learn or just expect to see that kind of a different resume coming up in about 24 months.
Pete Newsome 09:08
I think it's even. I think you're right, I think it goes beyond recruiters where companies are going to have to decide how they manage their workforce or they're the work that they have to do. And as we've talked about recently, a few times, the freelance economy that we're both fans of and think is in many ways the wave of the future is growing. I saw a number yesterday and I'm not ready to talk about it in detail because I haven't seen all the data behind it.
Pete Newsome 09:38
But that annualized revenue number in the gig economy is now 5.3 trillion. So every time I see a new updated number, it continues to grow. And it's very consistent with what we see and what we expect. So companies are first having to get over an It employs being remote and dealing with that. And by the way, coming on the other side of the storm, there's been no, but I've never been happier to have our employees be remote because it has taken a huge strain out off away from a situation that's already strained. Right.
Pete Newsome 10:22
And that is when do we close? What do we stay open to? Do we close when the storm and those who followed it would know that it was expected to hit the Tampa Bay area? And it ended up hitting about I don't know, what is it about 70-80 miles south.
Ricky Baez 10:39
It was about 80 miles south through Fort Myers.
Pete Newsome 10:42
And so it absolutely destroyed that area. But Tampa, a lot of people left Tampa to go down there? Well, not. Most people probably went somewhere else. But the people in the southwest Florida area didn't leave in the way that they would have because they didn't realize they had to sew boats and lack of preparation because they didn't expect it to hit them. The point is you don't know where the storms are going to go.
Pete Newsome 11:09
And almost until they're on top of you. And in years past with the business when we still were all in the offices, there's a really challenging situation just like every school has to make a decision every every every company does to when do we close? How do we handle it? What's the right balance there, there's never a perfect answer. And this year, with a fully virtual workforce, we were able to say go where you need to go when you need to go, it's not even a consideration in you can still earn you can still be productive.
Pete Newsome 11:43
And you can go somewhere safe without having to ever compromise your safety or sacrifice anything along the way. And we just basically had an open policy of doing what you need to do when you need to do it and let everyone make their own individual decisions. And boy, what a nice thing that was so companies already have to deal with that. And that's a struggle for a lot of organizations who as we know, right?
Pete Newsome 12:08
We won't beat that horse today. But now they're going to have to deal with this freelance market even more. Because whether you want it or not, it's here. And that you know, your HR, I mean, HR folks like you are going to be in high demand, I would expect to help companies navigate that because it does, you're not an employee anymore. And this choice is going to be very different for you.
Ricky Baez 12:32
I'm starting to see that now. I'm starting to see that now. So the beginning stages of it the appetizer per se, it's starting to happen right now. Because I do have some clients asking me for some help with that because they are having a hard time bringing people in.
Ricky Baez 12:48
And they even have an even harder time keeping people on board because the same policies and procedures that motivated people, three, or four years ago, are not necessarily the ones that are motivating, motivating people today, right? So we just got to keep a finger on that pulse from a proactive perspective, instead of waiting for something to happen, and then you're behind the gun.
Pete Newsome 13:08
So let's move on to number two, this is going to be a 24-hour-long podcast this right, right? So the second was that the quality of candidates is going to be more important than ever.
Pete Newsome 13:20
And what we meant by that is that knowing that candidates are going to have multiple opportunities, knowing how many jobs there are and that candidates have a greater tendency to disappear and change their minds and or have something else come up the depth of qualification, which is always necessary, and something you should take very seriously it was has been more important than ever to make sure that the candidates really want the job. Right? Because if it's not a job that they're really committed to, they're going to bail.
Pete Newsome 13:56
So that's what we expected to happen. Do you think that that's proven to be accurate?
Ricky Baez 14:01
Absolutely. I think so as well. And and how people can take notice of that I'm assuming that people organizations take a look at your 30-day turnover. If you have a relatively high 30 Day turnover, that means something happened with the hiring process. Because that that in 30 days, if somebody says, You know what, this isn't for me, I'm just gonna go somewhere else, then yeah, obviously, that's going to be an issue.
Ricky Baez 14:23
So so from a recruiting perspective, from recruiter perspective, you have a lot to choose from. So now you have to be even more laser-focused on the skill sets that the organization is going to need, not from right now to six months. But what that's going to look like a year, two years, five years from now, because you want to make sure that you communicate that as well.
Ricky Baez 14:44
So this is more on the organization because the organization has to tell the story of who they are, what they stand for what they believe in. That way you can really touch the heartstrings of the right candidates are you looking for and the quality that they have to keep them engaged. Not just for 30 days, but for two or three years down the road to get a really good return on investment. So I think this one definitely has come through for 2022.
Pete Newsome 15:07
Absolutely. Okay. Next one, or organizations? Go ahead.
Ricky Baez 15:13
I'm sorry. Go ahead.
Pete Newsome 15:14
Will adopt diversity hiring goals. Yes, diversity hiring goals.
Ricky Baez 15:22
That's right. That's right. And this is going to be more on top and then than ever before, because look, if it's, I'm gonna go to local government real quick, right, because local government normally recruits from the community, right? They hardly ever recruit from anywhere outside of the community, unless there's a high-profile position, like an executive or fire chief or something like that.
Ricky Baez 15:42
So if the recruiting structure if the recruiting strategy is calibrated the way you're supposed to be. And then you're supposed to recruit the same type of demographic, from the recruiting pool, from the talent pool, right?
Ricky Baez 15:58
But sometimes there are some gaps there. So now that we have such a candidate-driven market, this is a perfect opportunity for organizations to really take a look at where they're investing the recruiting dollars, and what communities which community, we just, for those of you in HR who have worked for organizations that have government contracts, you know, this is part of the AP rules, the the the affirmative action plans, which by the way, they're not quotas, it's just a strategy. I tell my students that all the times AAPs are not quotas, there's just a strategy.
Ricky Baez 16:30
And this is a great opportunity for organizations to take advantage of that, and stretch out their marketing dollars. So yeah, I think this one this year, more than ever, next year, even higher, I'm gonna win, I'm willing to bet that right now.
Pete Newsome 16:43
So this was one that I would say at times controversial. It's one that, I have a couple of different thoughts on, one of which is, should it be necessary? If you are, if you're hiring for the best candidate, if you're hiring for the candidate who is most qualified, who's the best fit for the role, whatever that role might be? Right?
Pete Newsome 17:10
Whether it's, you know, a professional basketball center, who, who asked to be, you know, are taller than everyone else? Or, you know, an accountant? Should you consider your diversity in your hiring, even if it means not hiring the most qualified candidate for that particular role?
Ricky Baez 17:35
No, because to me, you're running dangerously close to a quarter, right? Because then what you're saying is, all right, we got somebody who's qualified, but then we're trying to hit this goal, we're gonna bypass the qualification or the goal, now you're in trouble. Okay. So the way I'm looking at it is, is not necessarily have that structure for the quarter towards the end.
Ricky Baez 17:59
But let's figure out where you invest in your marketing 1000. Because if you're investing your marketing dollars, from a recruiting perspective, if you're investing your marketing dollars in an area that brings a specific demographic, but not in another one that you might want to spread that wealth around. Now, once you do that, and nobody applies, nothing you can do, right?
Ricky Baez 18:19
Because you still got to focus on the qualifications, right? But if you're able to show that look, I've had a job fair in this community, a job fair and that community, and I gave out candy, I did all these things and peep and nobody can show up to interview, what more can you do? So I want to make sure that everybody that's listening right now is yes, this is something that's really big right now.
Ricky Baez 18:42
And it's going to be big, later, bigger later on. But let's focus on where you're holding these events and where your marketing dollars are being spent to make sure that you give the right opportunity to every neighborhood or every community in your area to make sure you've got the most diverse plan possible, which it's I don't think it's going to have I guess it depends on the candidate and what he or she would like to apply for.
Pete Newsome 19:07
Yeah, I think it seems like you associated that answer with the socio-economic, you know, hiring, but what about things like gender, where I will tell you that my company has never had any kind of policy around that. And as never needed to in terms of the diversity of our hiring because it just naturally falls in line with I think the makeup of our community as a whole and the industry as a whole.
Pete Newsome 19:41
And I pay attention to what our numbers are by race and gender, but we've never needed to do anything special. And I wonder at times when companies do is like, are they addressing a problem? versus avoiding winning in the first place. I feel like we've never had a problem in that area. And our numbers indicate that that's true, as you know, but companies that need to go out of their way, is it because they were doing something wrong initially, and they're trying to correct it? Or are they doing it for the show, in some cases, more so than anything else?
Ricky Baez 20:25
I'm also in companies that do reactively. Because something did happen, and after a long investigation is lost, they kind of have to, and then some companies do it proactively. Right? From the gender perspective, I don't know, I just, you know, that I don't know how, from a recruiting perspective, and I'm just, I'm just pulling this out right now.
Ricky Baez 20:43
I don't know how we would create a marketing plan to hire that specific type of candidate. But the policies that we have are important, right? Because if somebody comes in and they say, Hey, I want to be dressed like this, instead of that, right, then yeah. And we have to be understanding with that and I completely understand that. So from diversity and inclusive perspective, yeah, this organization does.
Ricky Baez 21:09
A lot of organizations should. But I just don't know how what that will look like from a recruiting marketing perspective. I'm gonna have to do some more research on that. And that will be interesting for 2023.
Pete Newsome 21:20
Okay, well, we'll keep paying attention to that, for sure. Alright, so number four, increase investment in social media, employee referral programs, and job boards. 100%, right? No question 100%.
Ricky Baez 21:33
Man, TikTok. Google reviews are crucial right now. It's just anything in social media, any organization that does not have the social media tools, in their marketing plan, a ditch is not going to get anybody. It's just not going to work? Right. I don't think I think that's been the case for the past five years. Right? Not just for 2022 and beyond.
Pete Newsome 21:57
well, I think it's even more so I can tell you that the world of having a digital presence has increased, and I think is continuing to increase. And to me, that's what it is as much as anything else. All of these are tools that allow you to be more successful when hiring and in a candidate-driven market. So it sort of goes hand in hand. To me, I think, if the market shifts, we hope it doesn't.
Pete Newsome 22:27
But if it does, and we have a recession into a serious recession, I guess they're all serious, but a severe one, right? That, then we may see that pull back a little bit. Well, you know, companies won't spend money on these things if they feel like it's easier to hire. But right now, I don't know any organization that thinks it's been easier to hire over the last two years.
Ricky Baez 22:52
No, yeah, me either. So absolute. So it's everything from TikTok to Facebook, and Instagram has been crucial tool a in any recruitment strategy toolbox. So I don't know of any organization that doesn't do it. And I don't think that's going to change anytime soon. That's only going to get more and more provocative.
Pete Newsome 23:10
Absolutely. All right. Number five, competition and persistent skill shortages pose an ongoing challenge. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You know, in some areas more than others, but the more refined and specialized skill set, the harder it is to find people in those roles.
Pete Newsome 23:27
And so specialization, to me is, if I'm giving advice to anyone who is early in their career, I think that is it does, there are so many areas you can specialize in from skilled trades to technical skills, to financial skills to health care, find something that you really want to do and specialize in it because you will be sought after very highly. And that's, that's what we expected. And that's exactly what's coming through.
Ricky Baez 23:59
And this is something that I have seen here at four corner resorts actually, this happened a few months ago, where this is this is the value of having a state staffing agency on your side as an organization because that value is that you have recruiters that really pay attention. And I mean, really pay attention to what the client needs, right? Even what the client verbalizes.
Ricky Baez 24:20
And what they don't verbalize because then when the client says I'm looking for a candidate that has a, b, and c, right, and then the recruiter pays attention to that, they find a candidate that may not have A, B, and C, but because they take a deep dive into the profile wants to build a profile for that candidate, they find out Wait a minute, this skill set can equal this, that skill set can equal that. I see two situations here.
Ricky Baez 24:42
I think it's a few months ago when one of our recruiters was able to sell a candidate skill set to a client where the client wasn't really aware that's a skill set that they needed, and it turned out to be one of the best hires that they have. So that's why this one is crucial. It's even better to have a staffing agency on your side, when you get recruited, who really care about what the client is looking for and that they really find all those nice, not easy-to-find skill sets from the candidate and make that connection.
Ricky Baez 25:11
So this one is big because it's important because there are so many people out there a candidate-driven market is really easy for a candidate to say the right things, and then maybe slip through the cracks when they really don't have the skill set. That's where it's crucial to have a recruiter who knows how to take a deep dive into the profile to make sure you make a good connection with the client.
Pete Newsome 25:29
Absolutely. Great points. All right, number six, remote recruiting will remain popular. Well, we talked about that earlier. Needless to say remote, everything is going to remain popular. I remember it. Of course, I remember it was a policy I put in place when I first started 4 Corner, which is that we had every candidate. Not only were we working in the office, but we also had every candidate come in the office to meet us, and we would not submit a candidate unless they physically came into our office. And that was 17 years ago, 18 years ago.
Pete Newsome 26:06
What a different world. Imagine trying to do that now you'd be laughed out. I remember a guy that was a consultant we worked with back in, I don't know what it is around 2010. He was from California, and he could not believe we still had this requirement back then where every candidate would come into the office where we just didn't feel comfortable submitting them and he couldn't believe it.
Pete Newsome 26:31
He goes, I can't believe they will actually do that. And I've it because, in California already that had been you know, that was not even on the radar. I think back to that time and those conversations and think how many how many candidates we miss out on because of it. But I'll tell you this, we always had you have super high quality. That was one of the things our reputation is built on because we took that extra step. So I don't regret doing it. But it does seem like a distant memory. In terms of what would be practical today.
Ricky Baez 27:06
I'll tell you what, Pete You know, it's compared to 1020 years ago, obviously a completely different world, right? 17 years ago, you can they just had to come in, we had a meeting which I understood why that was necessary, right? Because it's a big difference. And there's this a different connection when you meet somebody in person. Today, remote recruiting will remain popular and is going to remain popular and I'll even venture into guests in 10 years is going to be radically different than what it is today.
Ricky Baez 27:31
I guarantee, mark my words. Let's mark this ad on Tuesday, October 4, right 2022. Ricky said this, and in 10 years, we're going to be having job fairs in the metaverse, I guarantee a peep. Everybody's gonna have one of those goggles, and we're going to be meaning everybody virtually it's going to be a recreation of a job fair. And it's going to be in the metaverse. So let's keep doing this show every week for 10 years. And then let's revisit this.
Pete Newsome 27:58
I think you're probably right. And I think that's really weird. And I think that it's not a great thing for society.
Ricky Baez 28:08
So it was that movie Wall-E? While Yeah, true. True that in Ready Player One, that one I saw that and it scared me. I'm like, yeah, that's, that's, that's been five years. So that's gonna happen, we just gotta be ready for it.
Pete Newsome 28:23
Well, if you think about it, you don't have to leave your house to get food. Or it means everything's delivered to you. You don't have to leave your house to work anymore. That's not how humanity evolved. And while these are conveniences and I'm a huge fan here, this is hypocritical to some degree. I'm working at home now. And I love it. I think it's great for our employees, selfishly, for self-serving Lee, I think it's great for me.
Pete Newsome 28:54
But when I think of generations to come, I think, gosh, you know, that's going to be very limiting in terms of how everyone evolves. And so while we're taking full advantage of what technology allows us to do today, and the convenience and comfort that comes with it, I think there's gonna be some downside that we don't yet know what it's going to look like.
Ricky Baez 29:17
I mean, Pete, I'm going to be really, really personal with you right now. I haven't worn socks in three weeks, right? Because I'm working from home. I wear flip-flops all the time. And whenever I meet somebody I flip flops on. So it's, it's a very different time. And I think it's going to be even more different as time progresses. Because here's what's happening. Pete You know, people like you and me.
Ricky Baez 29:39
We remember a time before the internet. We remember we remember a time before social media. You got people in the workforce right now that are coming into it right now that they remember social media Facebook from the time they were born. So they never know a time without social media. So these are the folks who are going to make decisions for the business. The world now for in and in the future.
Ricky Baez 30:03
So that's what I'm saying it's, it's going to get even more technical, because of the type of decision makers that are going to be in charge in about 1020 years, because that's all that they've known. So we might as well be ready for it.
Pete Newsome 30:15
Understood. Yeah. And it's, well, like you said, 10 years from now, we'll check back to this day and see, see what happened. More candidates express interest in mental health benefits, that's number seven, I think we've seen that to be, unfortunately, necessary.
Pete Newsome 30:38
And even this morning, on our, we had a team call and talked for a few minutes about the need to reach out for support and help if need be, it's, it's, it's a strange, still a strange place for me to go, you know, just just like, you know, as I say, you know, I'm, when I think of things like putting in diversity hiring in place, I think, Gosh, what, why should that be necessary, just do the right thing, you know, be be be, like, don't discriminate on anything like that shouldn't, it shouldn't be necessary to say, right or to do.
Pete Newsome 31:16
And that's how I've always tried to operate. And that's why we don't have a policy like that in place. And similarly, I think it should be a given that if you need help, emotionally, or mentally, then you should, you should have a place to go or someone to ask should be able to talk about and to help should be there, and the support should be there. But I also realize in these areas, that that's probably a little naive to just take things for granted.
Pete Newsome 31:48
And, and so I get it too, and see the value of having these programs in place. And unfortunately, as I said, the isolation that's come with the anxiety and worry that has been forced upon us all. Man, it's caused some some some mental health damage, that's for sure.
Ricky Baez 32:14
Well, Pete, this is one that's near and dear to my heart. And for the past five, or six years, I've been pushing mental health benefits, and for now, not pushing, because in every organization if you have benefits, you have an EAP, the employee assistance program, it's it does provide some hands-on mental health benefits. I've been trying my hardest to make it more normal for people to ask for help.
Ricky Baez 32:37
Because the reason this is not such a popular program, is because there's a stigma behind it, right, they don't want to call EAP. They don't want to use the mental health benefits, because they don't want to be labeled as somebody whose it's, I hate to say this, but this is where people are afraid of crazy. And that's not the fact that all right, there are things that people go through especially through this last pandemic, right? So someone like me, I gotta tell you, I'm an extrovert, Pete.
Ricky Baez 33:02
And if you put me in an office, not talk to anybody don't do anything anger, um, I'm gonna go insane. So, in the past 10 years, I've had to, use this and I am not afraid to say it. Because, again, there is a stigma and I want to normalize it. When people need help, please ask, please ask, there's always some benefit there. Where, where, where there's always a benefit there where employees can take advantage of that it can really help them in from business leaders and HR professionals.
Ricky Baez 33:34
This is something that's really big right now, and it's gonna get even bigger, later on, the best thing you can do is to promote the benefits you have and make it okay for somebody to ask for help, but they don't get labeled. So that's the best thing we can do as leaders.
Pete Newsome 33:46
Yeah. So, candidates, have this has become increasingly important as a benefit. We both agree it's going to continue that way. And yeah, it's, it's it is, I think it's good that it's become so much more normalized to talk about. I think, almost on a weekly basis, I hear someone in my personal life mention, you know, go talking to their therapist about something or other I don't, I don't do that only because if I had a therapist, they'd quit.
Pete Newsome 34:16
They leave the profession. I don't think they can handle what I would share. But, but it has become, you know, normalized, and unfortunately, you're more necessary because of all the external factors that are going on, so, yeah, that this one is going to stay around for a while and unnecessarily but rightfully so, or unfortunately, but rightfully so. Right? So recruiters find new ways to use AI.
Pete Newsome 34:47
That's number eight. So let me just say first that what we call AI is not really AI. It's effectively an if-then statement. that's promoted and advertised as AI. So yes, recruiters are continuing to try to find ways to increase efficiency and leverage automation and their process. And companies out there continue to tout AI. So that is it's a trend and we're trying to all figure out the way to build a better mousetrap. Right? I mean, that's, that's a given. I don't see that going away anytime soon.
Ricky Baez 35:29
No, it's not. So here's, I want to be clear, but this one because this is getting, it evolves every year, every single year, it gets better and better. I don't think I've ever shared this story with you, Pete about five years ago. I just say, you know, let me test the waters. Let me interview out there. And I started interviewing and I started chatting with this one recruiter online about my qualifications.
Ricky Baez 35:54
Let's go ahead and schedule something. Anyway. I had a really good conversation with this recruiter to find out later on after the interview was scheduled. It was a chatbot. I was talking to Pete, it scared me I had a good I wanted to friend him on LinkedIn. That's how a person will that conversation happen. And that was five years ago, right? But even then, honestly, Pete It's nothing's going to be the human connection. That human connection still needs to be there.
Ricky Baez 36:27
But this should be used has been used and is going to continue to be used as a tool to assist recruiters. So yeah, this is only going to get even more evolved as time goes on. And look, if you haven't seen Terminator just don't go too crazy with it, because Skynet will go active, and then we're all in trouble. And I don't want to I don't want it to blame HR for that. Well, they don't want another Terminator movie. And blame HR for that.
Pete Newsome 36:50
Did you see it just a few days ago that Elon Musk announced a new Tesla robot? I haven't looked into him too much yet. But
Ricky Baez 37:01
I mean, I'm about time, right? Haven't people thought he's a robot? So what is it his kid or something?
Pete Newsome 37:07
You know, as a Tesla owner, I would say Elon probably should focus on the service component of the company a little better these days. Let's just leave it attacked.
Ricky Baez 37:19
Someone's getting a well-written letter for customer support.
Pete Newsome 37:22
You can't even get a hold of a live person. It's a whole different. Yeah, what what what has made those? As I'm a second-time Tesla owner and man, it's services. Interesting. I'll just say that. And so anyone listening who has a Tesla right now probably knows what I'm talking about. And I'll leave it there.
Ricky Baez 37:46
Want to know who's listening to your Tesla right now from the garage? It's sending an email right now for you?
Pete Newsome 37:51
Well, Ricky, it's not in my garage is in the shop. So there you go. Got it. This is for the third time in six months that I've had it anyway. So we'll move past that one. But yes, artificial intelligence in whatever that form is today going it's going to continue, to grow. That's right.
Pete Newsome 38:18
Reaching passive candidates is more important than ever. That's number nine. So that's, that's, that's a layup. I think. Because, yeah, when there's such a shortage of qualified candidates for any individual role, you have to go to the folks who are who aren't looking. And that's something a good recruiter does anyway. But it's an absolute necessity these days and has been for a while.
Ricky Baez 38:40
This is something that out of Pete out of all of them. This is the one that is big and has the biggest light on it the biggest spotlight because this one is crucial right now. Because you have to start looking for candidates before the candidates need a job. You've got to start building relationships with these folks before they need your services. Because what's going to happen is when they start to need your server, there are so many recruiters out there, right? Everybody's trying to pitch and they're gonna go to whoever they have a relationship with.
Ricky Baez 39:09
And this is something we drive to our recruiters in our organization on a weekly basis, start reaching out on LinkedIn, start building these relationships, see what you can do for them to make, you know, to just make that connection that way when they need some help. There's only one person they'll call unless you as that recruiter, so this one is right here.
Ricky Baez 39:28
Because you know, I'm big on building relationships. And that's exactly what this is. This one is not going to go away anytime soon, especially with AI and especially all this technology stuff happening out there always evolving. It is crucial to building those relationships for people who don't need a job right now that was easy to play some later on.
Pete Newsome 39:45
Yeah, it's that's such a great point. And it's easy to say really difficult to execute. Because you have to think beyond today. And in a just-in-time world which is the one we live Then it, it's it's incredibly difficult to do and unless you have you look further in the future, but that's the way that that's its own show.
Pete Newsome 40:10
That's how recruiting should be done. That's how relationships should be built. And so I'm glad you made that point. But yeah, if you're, if you're reaching out to someone, only when they can do something for you at that particular moment, it's not doing it right. And, and you should always, you should always be thinking ahead.
Ricky Baez 40:30
Is that here all the time, and it works? Yeah, it works beautifully. And you can tell, just look us up on our Google reviews. Right? It's you got five stars, and you got all these business names out there that I thought you were earlier? Oh, yeah, that one, maybe with the misfit, which, by the way, I Googled it, and it says it's the right spelling anyway, inside joke. All right.
Pete Newsome 40:54
So the last one, number 10.
Ricky Baez 40:57
Oh, a larger focus on retention. Yes, folks. Pete, I'm sorry, I'm gonna, I'm gonna happen to so but strong enough to hold me. So this is the one that I, if I gave me the pan, because one of the things in this, I make sure all of my students are aware of this, right? We put so much emphasis such a big emphasis on recruiting telling our story on making sure that when we convince somebody, we sell the idea of coming to work for this organization, that's the best decision you could possibly make for your career.
Ricky Baez 41:31
We do that and what a lot of organizations do is once they come on board, we forget about them. We forget about them, and we don't pay any attention to them. Folks, let me tell you this, right, now you've got to have the same energy, you've got to have the same drive, to continue to educate the people that come to your organization to help them grow to whatever their career aspirations is with the same ferocity, the same energy you had in recruiting them, you cannot let that drop because what's going to happen to you spend so much time and effort to bring them in.
Ricky Baez 42:02
And if they leave you within 30 days without bringing you any kind of return on investment, you just wasting your time and money. And you want to make sure that you keep focusing on that retention piece to make sure that the time money and effort spent and bringing them on board doesn't go to the wayside. So this was a big one for me.
Pete Newsome 42:17
I don't think I could add anything to that. I think I think you said it. You said it really well. There has been a larger focus on that for all the reasons we've talked about. And we'll see. I mean, as we go forward, it kind of to wrap up this show is in with this last point. These layoffs are continuing, I just had another alert. While we've been on there's another company just announced is announcing so this is a tough time.
Pete Newsome 42:52
Or an interesting time, and hopefully it won't become a tough time, but it might. So that focus on retention, I don't know that that'll be a prediction and 2023. But it should always be top of mind for an organization. No question about it. So, Ricky, it sounds like for the most part, all 10 of these things that we said would happen? actually, happen. So how about that is good for us?
Ricky Baez 43:19
So I need you to send me six numbers, six lucky numbers. But don't worry, you'll get 10%. Right? And well you know, we'll go through a Bitcoin conference together and hang out. But I need you to give me a six, you know, six numbers for the lotto man because these were spot on. Alright, so let me ask you. I know you said some of these that you didn't know about 2023. But let's make believe is December right now. Which one of these do you think would not make it to 2023? I don't know if any.
Pete Newsome 43:50
Well, I think the number one I don't, right now, if I had to bet. So we'll see if these is accurate yields. Let's revisit this in a couple of months. I don't think it's going to remain a candidate-driven market to the degree that it has been now, the exception to that even then, in 2008, when things were really bad, those with specialized skills, and in very, they're very in very high demand.
Pete Newsome 44:18
They're always going to be there. There's always going to be a good market for those folks. But as I don't know, I look I have to be conscious of what's happening and what the risks are as a business owner. But I want to be optimistic, but I tend to look at and think okay, what's the worst case worst likely scenario? And I think the external factors that are happening in the economy and around the globe right now are I don't know what they mean.
Pete Newsome 44:56
There are a lot of signs that are there that are a little scary. So You're right there. I want to be very wrong and think that things are going to get worse for a while. But, we'll see, right if you plan for the worst and you hope and expect the best that they can happen and you're pleasantly surprised. So that's how I'm but what about you? Do you have any one of these that you think we would not be won't be predicting three months from now?
Ricky Baez 45:27
I think I think you're right about number one, number one, which is the candidate-driven market, I think with the way things are going right now, it's slowly turning that tide. Right. But that doesn't mean that recreating that just means that recruiters cannot forget the skill set that they're still looking for it right, because what happens is when it's the other way around, right? Yeah, when it's the other way around, then everything is so scarce.
Ricky Baez 45:50
And I don't know you become you drop your standards, I guess those are some things that sometimes happen, we just got to be careful that when it does turn around, you don't change your standards, just because it's going to be harder. You really want to maintain the standards there and just keep them there. Because if you don't, it really is going to affect your business. So that one I think is going to change your 100%. Right. The other ones are going to stay there. I think Man, to be honest, I think so do it again in December. See what happens.
Pete Newsome 46:15
Yes, we will. I love it. All right. Well, thank you. And thank you for listening in today. We look forward to being held accountable for anything we predicted going forward. We'll continue to revisit and, and drive safe out there.
Ricky Baez 46:30
Have a good one, folks. And remember, if you want a topic for the show, hirecalling@4cornerresources.com and go to your favorite podcast platform, download us give us a like, let us know what you think, and let us know pretty soon we're gonna be doing another q&a.
Pete Newsome 46:45
We're doing alright, thanks so much. Have a good one.