I remind people of this all the time. You know, I don't run a marathon to win it. I run a marathon to experience it. It's about the like, the training aspect of it, but also being there in community with these other people who have also been training, and we're all there together, working through this like journey for lack of a better word together. This 26.2 mile journey, you know, and it's like, this is not about competition.
I don't want to beat the person next to me, I want to cross the finish line with them 80%.
When you hear about people starting their fitness journey, about starting a new habit, especially at the beginning of the year, believe it or not, 80% is the percentage that quit by February and that can really leave people feeling kind of down about themselves. Maybe you've been through that too. So what do you do to keep moving?
How do you keep that mindset from moving forward and being able to be in a positive frame of mind On top of joining me for one of my Havening Happy Hours, which is always a great way keep that mindset from moving forward and being able to be in a positive frame of mind On top of joining me for one of my Havening Happy Hours, which is always a great way to be kind to your mind and work on habits and thoughts and moods and behaviors?
I want to welcome my good friend, Cheri Page Fogelman, to come on the show, because she's not just a trainer. She's a lifeline for fitness newbies and returning warriors alike, helping you live longer, stronger and definitely more fulfilling. With over two decades of experience, Cheri, you've been a powerhouse and have breathed life into everything from cardio sculpt to core classes and everything in between.
We've had so much fun when we met together working on Daily Burn 365, which is where we were like pioneers on the show. We started on that show back, I think, almost 10 years ago, and it's countless programs that you have developed over the years have been a part of over the years, including Good Vibes, wellness, burn Along and you bring such passion and knowledge and just pure motivation to the mat Girl. It is so good to see you.
I haven't seen you, I haven't been in your physical space in years and I feel like I just saw you yesterday on set.
Because we look exactly the same as we did. Then Do we? Do we look the same? I don't even know.
We haven't aged a day, Not a moment. Not a day, not a minute skill. This is just so great to be with you.
I'm just so glad. It's so good to be here.
Thank you for having me, Hilary. This is amazing. You were one of the first people, if not the first person, I thought of, because you work so much with people who are in the beginner side of working out. And when we think about working out, when we think about fitness, there is that fitness negative right, that whole idea of like I need to exercise to lose weight, I need to exercise for this one goal.
And I thought you know what you are just.
You were just a wealth of information in this area and I remember it too because you know, going back nine years now almost I think it was 2015, where we first met on set, I had taken a break from fitness myself and I'm like, oh my God, how am I going to do this? I mean, this is hard. And just taking that first step, like will I follow through?
And just seeing how you've shown up for people over the years, it's like the perfect example of the perfect coach and somebody to be by your side because you really do it so beautifully.
Oh, thank you. You know, I'm one of those people I just don't give up. I really have that marathon mentality and I think I was maybe born with it and maybe that like is hard to relate to for other people, but that's how I show up for people and that is like my superpower. Yeah, you know. So I'm just been really trying to you know. So I'm just been really trying to hone in on how I can help people with that.
Yeah definitely.
I love how you said that I am helping people live those longer, stronger and more fulfilling lives. That's that's really the key, right? It's so funny. I just want to like kick the first person who decided to do a marketing campaign that fitness was all about weight loss because it is. It is actually.
Eating is more about weight loss and fitness is more about so many other amazing things immune system, skin health, heart, lung health, never mind how it helps you in your daily life, just to help you feel more awake and more warm and have to clear that foggy head feeling, and it actually helps with your creativity.
So often people are using fitness as a springboard for weight loss and when they don't see the weight loss, they lose heart and abandon it when they're missing out on all these other benefits of weight loss in the meantime, right. But why do people drop off? Why do people lose their New Year's resolution focus? I think a lot of times people aim too high and I really coach to aim low, which sounds it's like the opposite of what your graduation speaker said to you. Right, aim low.
You never hear a trainer say that, but I do say that a lot. Aim low. Let's take care of these small goals. Make them part of your daily or weekly life and your regimen and then build on those from there. I think people also just set themselves up for failure when they don't give themselves grace. They're like I'm going to do this every day.
Like they fill out the chart and there are some people that do that Absolutely, but they didn't start there. Ch. There are some people that do that Absolutely, but they didn't start there, right.
Chances are, they didn't start there. There's the one in a thousand that starts there and succeeds and that's wonderful. Bravo to them. But I think I know for myself, even like to say I'm going to do this every day and then, like I've already like my, I'll share my new year's resolution. This year is to learn how to do a handstand. It's a little thing but as a woman in my midlife, it's a kind of a fun resolution.
And I was a modern dancer for 10 years and professionally, and this was still one of those things that I was never. I wasn't a gymnast, I was a dancer but never a gymnast. So like I didn't do handstands. So this year I was like you know what? This is something, and it's really not about doing the handstand, it's about making the commitment to continue to practice, the process goal yeah.
The try, the try is the big part, the try.
And I'm giving myself grace. I haven't gotten it on every day, but still getting it in. As much as I've had was more than when I didn't have it as a goal. Yeah, so I'm already doing better, even though I'm not like checking off every day, and there's not a gold star every day on my chart, you know. So give yourself grace.
Grace is a big one. I talk about that a lot too. I love that you're in alignment with that. Because we go for these huge goals and if we fail, the, the outcome, the final what we're looking for, it's easier to give up because you're like I'm never going to get there. I'm never going to get there. So the aiming low doesn't necessarily mean you have to end low. It's just the next step to the next low and the next low. Right, you're stacking. Yeah, that's a really good way of putting it.
Do you share that? When you, when you approach those that you're working with and you say aim low, I would imagine some of the looks you might get are like, girlfriend, I'm like I'm not, but I have big goals I want to run a marathon.
What do you mean? Aim low, right. So when you have reached that process goal, that initial aiming low process goal, then you can reevaluate and readjust and you aim for the next low level Right, and from here, like when you're walking upstairs, each level isn't that much higher than the last one. But then when you get to the top of the stairs and you look back down, you're like wow, I came up a whole flight of stairs.
You know, yeah, you don't realize it's a big deal. Right, yeah, right.
So baby steps.
Definitely. I love that, and you know one of I was on. I was working out this morning with a bunch of our old friends from our DB 365 days and a number of them. I said, hey, I'm talking to Cheri today and the questions were flooding and first of all, they're like tell her. You said hi, we love how she supports us. So we're getting all the shout outs today.
But one of the questions that actually came up was that when you have a loved one actually this came up more than once from a couple of the gals in the group and I think it was Liz and Leah so shout out to them how, how do you encourage a loved one to work out or to move their body and give them that incentive to want to do so? When you're doing it, you know how do you do that without being like you need to do this or what.
So that was something they brought up and that was a really good question.
Oh, that is such a good question because it can be so sensitive and I think one of the just as an aside, one of the most important things I've done as a personal trainer recently was become a trauma informed personal.
Yes, ma'am.
And I'm really sensitive to all of these negative connotations that fitness has and how they can be so triggering, right. And so I think, like me personally, some of the things I've done for folks because I'm on this like crusade for fitness and my family and friends and neighbors know it, you know so they also kind of like they're like. Sometimes I can sense that they're like talking to me as they might talk to like a priest or a minister or something you know.
They kind of like curb their language when they're talking about the food they eat or, you know, curb their language when they're talking about when they didn't work out. You know as much as when they're talking about when they didn't work out. You know as much as they wanted to, or whatever. And I'm like you guys, I'm here to support. I'm not here to judge, and it's nice to remind your family members of that. I'm here to support. I'm not here to judge.
But it's also really helpful, I've found, to invite them along on a walk to make it about a social thing instead of making it about a fitness thing. We can walk and talk and we're going to walk and talk and then, hey, how about we take that route next time? So it's not about like exercise per se, but it's about that time together. Um, I have a friend who is, you know, doesn't like exercise. She knows it, I know it. She tells me all the time I didn't get her a gym membership as a gift.
I got her a museum vip pass as a gift, because she, when she's in a museum, she walks like a woman on a mission to see all the exhibits, but and and it's inside, right, so the weather doesn't affect it, but to get her a gym membership would have really been a like like, a negative thing for her, you know, and it would have never gotten used.
So it's these creative ways to bring activity into the equation without being oppressive, and I think inviting people, people along to make it social makes it fun.
That is such a great idea. You know what that aligns with in a lot of ways. Yes, it's gentle and it reminds me somewhat of like the love languages right? If someone isn't really wanting to work out or go on a run with you, maybe they're like I'm not a runner and I know you're a runner You're kind of meeting them where their love language is, which could be. I know they love the arts and given. It's not an actual love language, but you're not giving them what you want.
You're giving them what you know they will enjoy, and there's an element of it it's like I care about your health. This is a great way to get walking. I'll even go with you, right of it. It's like I care about your health. This is a great way to get walking. I'll even go with you. That's a beautiful, beautiful way to support somebody. I love that, Cheri, really beautiful yeah. Thank you.
Yeah.
So that's how you would rally somebody. I wouldn't even say it that way, because it almost sounds manipulative to say it that way, but that's how you would support somebody on their journey, correct? Yeah, just a couple ideas. How about motivating yourself? You know, it's really starts with self first, doesn't it?
Totally, oh my goodness. And I think some people think that trainers just innately have this like wake up and they're motivated to exercise like every day, and it's not true. It's very not true.
We suffer from all of the things to you guys, and I got to tell you when it's cold outside and when it's gray outside and when I know this is my day to go for a run, there are times when I set the timer and I allow myself to whine, and I allow myself to whine for maybe a full minute, maybe even longer, and I just like like I don't want to go and when the timer goes off, then I put my hat on and go out the door and go, and I know that I've like already allowed myself that time to whine, so it
makes it kind of a little bit easier knowing that I got that out of my system. Yeah yeah and then there's days when I go you know know what I just can't. I'm going to get on the rowing machine instead and I give myself the grace it's fine, you know, like it's just cold and I just can't, like the chill is too much. Right now it's February and so like focusing on the winter weather is like easier because it's right here in my face, but same applies for the summertime.
If I'm trying to get outside and it's so hot and oppressive I'm like can I rally?
But you're good about it, Because I mean you even called me earlier today and I knew you were outside walking.
I can just hear it in your voice.
You're calling me. You're checking all the technology. I'm like are you running a marathon? What are you doing, right?
now. No, I was out for a run. I was catching up on the news and on the podcast.
I do want to go into something briefly and we're not going to go heavy, because I don't do that on this show, but just because you brought it up. In this world that we're living in right now, it can be very difficult to stay positive, right, no matter what side of the fence you're really on, there's a lot of noise.
So how does somebody like Cheri, who is on the path of helping people and supporting people and motivating people and also bringing that trauma-informed part of it because I too am trauma-informed, so I get it how do you stay in a more positive mindset when sometimes it feels like things around you are crumbling?
Yeah, I've been thinking about that a lot recently. You know, sometimes I don't.
That's okay too.
Yeah, and sometimes I mean my rowing machine's in the basement, and so I have let out a couple of like primal screams in my basement while on the rowing machine, which is, you know, probably the best place for it because I don't think any neighbors get concerned.
But I think it's reallyed this time of American history to being in a marathon, and it's this like emotional marathon almost, because we're having to sustain ourselves through this like constant barrage of news and emotional ups and downs, and so, fortunately, I have trained and run several marathons and it requires a lot of self-care. So drink in the water. These are the basic things right Getting the sleep, making sure you're getting enough protein, making sure you're getting your workout in.
The workout helps relieve stress. It is scientifically proven. The workout helps you relieve stress. It's one of the best ways to help relieve stress. Getting hugs oh, we love hugs, we love hugs.
Hug it out, girl.
Hugs are also one of the best ways to relieve stress. It has to be 20 seconds or longer, that's right.
Yeah, yeah, that's good old oxytocin.
Yeah. So, like taking in the news personally, I'm trying to do something about it. I've been calling my senators, I've been calling my congresspeople, I've been calling my state attorney general and letting them know, as a constituent, what my opinion is. And so I feel like I'm doing something and then moving on with the day, setting it aside and going back to my work or my time with my daughter or things I need to be done around the house. There's other stuff in my life.
So, feeling like I'm doing something and then stepping aside, I'm making in the evenings I just did a post on social media about this yesterday to read myself a bedtime story.
Loved the post that you did about books because I've been doing the micro reading myself and it's, you know, as my father used to say, it's like massaging the neurons You're constantly igniting the mind in some way. You don't have to finish the full book. That's also putting pressure on yourself. Aim low, try some different books, right, exactly?
Oh, actually, so sorry. No, I'm not reading all of those books right now. Those are books that I have read, and when you said micro reading, I was like so you've heard about micro reading. Yeah, this is I when you posted you comment.
I did.
Yes, yes, I looked it up, because I hadn't heard of micro reading comment. I did, yes, yes, I looked it up because I hadn't heard of micro reading.
So it's kind of where you just 15 minutes, you choose 15 minutes and you do one book. Maybe you're in another book another day. I'm actually creating a HIListically Speaking library of all the authors that I've had on this show. I have a feeling Miss Cheri Paige Fogelman will be one of them soon. We're going to talk about that too.
But putting those books there so people can like maybe one day you want to dive into movement, maybe one day you want to read a fiction book, maybe one day you want to learn more about mental health or whatever it might be for you. Maybe it's a children's story, but it just gives you a way to like change it up a little bit and learn new things. So it's like 15 minutes, but I saw those books there. I'm like is she reading?
all those books, what's going on? No, those are just books that I have read yeah, love that yeah. And I was just kind of looking at my bookshelf and I was thinking like, oh, you know what? I just want to highlight how lovely it is to step away from the news. Yes, because I think it's super important For me.
I feel a lot of responsibility to keep up with what's going on in the news and to know what to speak out about, but I also I think it's very important to step away from it and to give my mind that, like other action, right, it's like exercise in one way, it's like doing cardio and then it's like doing strength training.
Absolutely, and you know I have to do that myself and I talk a lot about secondary traumatic stress. It's kind of an area that I've become an expert talking about in the open space, especially now that I'm in that mental health space more trauma informed as well. It's like we have to protect ourselves because how can we show up for others if we're not showing up for ourselves?
And you really do need to step away from the noise, whether it's even turning on the news, to taking in all of of your clients information all day long, or even your little ones or your, your partners or whomever it might be. We're taking in a lot of information, we're processing it and it's stored negative if we don't, if we're not careful, you know, because the brain loves to go to the negative. It's how we're alive and safe in this world. So finding different things to do is really important.
I mean for me, you know me, I'm havening like a bat out of hell, you're a havening endurance athlete. I'm a havening endurance athlete. Yeah, I guess that is what I am, because it's not something I just talk about, it's something I do. It's a show and tell For me. It is my main technique that I use in my everyday and with my clients. But there's a reason why I really dive into that. It's because I know that it's helped me, and if it's going to help me, then it's easier for me to talk about it.
Sharing others, like what you do as well, by the way, a good place to stop real quick, just to remind people that, if you're interested in trying a free Havening experience, come to one of my happy hours. I do Havening happy hours every month for free. It's an opportunity for you to learn about this neuroscience-based technique. I'm a certified trainer and also a certified practitioner, and this is neuroscience folks.
This is a way to be kind to your mind, to self-regulate and self-soothe for self-care, and I just recently did an episode where I did a short-havening experience inside the podcast, which I'd never done before. So it's a great way to just self-regulate, hold space for yourself and when you're in the trauma-informed space, like both Cheri and I are, we hear a lot. We hear a lot. We have our own big T's and little T's in our lives.
So let's talk about that for you as someone who is trauma-informed, because this is becoming a buzzword. By the way, oh, totally. Like hyphenate that trauma-informed right. What does that mean for you like?
what is Cheri introduction to that and how are you trauma informed? right personally, yeah, please after my daughter june was born she's now eight and a half years old we were trying to continue to grow our family and I was ended up going through IVF and we were going through IVF for four years and we did get pregnant and then I miscarried and had what's called a missed miscarriage and this was right after Roe was overturned.
Fortunately I'm in Pennsylvania, but that meant I had to have a D&E and that's the procedure to remove the products of conception from inside you, which is really kind of scary and upsetting. But fortunately I live in Pennsylvania where it is not illegal, and it is illegal in some places in our country at this point in time, which is really sad because it is healthcare and I just that whole experience was really upsetting and I couldn't talk about it for a long time. I went through EMDR.
It took a year to go through the EMDR and it's amazing to me because this was a trauma that was kind of infiltrating my life in ways, I wasn't really expecting it, but also like in an effort to grow the family and to be a mom again.
I was kind of like falling short of being a mom to June, which kind of was crappy because I was so like burdened by this trauma that I was, like you know, blowing up at her and you know, like not parenting in a way that was like helpful, and I wasn't, I was being a difficult partner to live with, and so it was for me. That was a little not a little a pretty big journey for me to work through.
And, and during that time is when I became trauma informed as a personal trainer and, really like to be honest, I was already doing a lot of the things that they were talking about in the certification and education that I went through. But it really helped to solidify all that for me and to reinforce it. And then I felt like more justified in how I train and that I'm not necessarily training somebody to. You know, do chin-ups?
Or to pick up heavy weights and lift them up overhead per se, but empowering them to get up in the morning.
Sometimes that is the biggest step.
So giving people the grace that you know and just allowing for that space for them that that being here and doing this is okay, and it's amazing how hand in hand the fitness work works with the talk therapy.
Yeah Well, and that's that's so important. So there's three. You know there's really three different kinds of therapy to support your wellbeing. There's psycho pharmaceutical obviously medications that are needed for some folks. There's psychotherapy, which is talk therapy, and then there's psychosensory. I would say even EMDR would fall between both of those, the psychosensory and the psycho psychotherapy.
By the way, for folks who don't know, emdr means eye movement, desensitization, reprocessing, eye movement, desensitization and reprocessing. So it's like it is a very deep, trauma-informed technique that really only licensed professionals do.
There are techniques that are similar to it, like the flash technique, and we have a lot of people in our community, in the Havening community, that actually, as licensed therapists, find the EMDR it gets equated very similar, but the difference is that Havening tends to be more softer. It's something you can really do to yourself and self-apply, but it is a very, very deep technique.
And so when you said that, I'm like, oh, that's going deep, that's real trauma work that you're doing when you're working through that, and I'm glad that you had an awareness that you needed that kind of support. I'm sorry that you went through what you went through, but what's the biggest lesson and takeaway from that experience? Because it is a loss, it is a grief, and how has Cheri grown from that experience?
Because it is a loss, it is a grief. And how has Cheri grown from that experience today? Maybe just the giving myself grace.
Yeah, that's a word you use a lot, by the way.
Yeah, it is, I've noticed. I've said it a couple times here in this conversation.
What does grace mean to you?
Not putting the pressure on very hard.
Not putting the pressure on very hard.
Yeah, taking the pressure off a little bit, you know, just allowing myself to be, as opposed to trying to be something else.
Right.
Being something bigger, being something more. You know? Yeah, because, man, some days you just got to show up.
Some days it is just about showing up Again. That's going back to the aim low, that could be your high. Yes, just waking up, you know, that's a gift in itself. And when and I'm sure you've heard this too, I know I have with clients, especially when I'm doing deeper trauma work is that some days it's just putting your feet on the floor, let alone, you know, waking up in the morning. So it's learning how to support yourself. It doesn't mean putting on the sneakers and going for a run.
It might just mean getting up and just being present and allowing another day. Yes, you know, yes. Yeah, how does that work for you as a mom? Yes, you know, yes. Yeah, how does that work for you as a mom? How are you using everything you've learned and who you are and how you continue to develop and become more aware to make sure that June is that kind of adult in the making like becoming well-rounded, and giving her the tools?
she is a unique kiddo who is actually pretty hard on herself and she's already had these like like existential crisis moments where she's like I don't know what I want to be when I grow up and we're like you're eight, it's okay, I know adults you don't even know what they want.
I'm still wondering exactly so.
Um, yeah, it's, it's, it's amazing, but we do. We do the deep breathing together and, um, you know, as a personal trainer, I um, I'm always interested in mental health and in mental strength as far as athleticism goes, I attended this lecture a couple weeks ago. that was about like mental training for your female athletes. Right, it was specifically female athletes. It's so wonderful the like components they went through for that, and one of them was just like mistakes happen.
It is expected that mistakes will happen. Even the pros make mistakes, but you got to like it's how you move through. The mistake is key, and so I went over these things with June. You know like, hey, mistakes happen Even when we're in the kitchen cooking. I'm like mistakes happen. Look, I dropped the spoon. It's how we deal with it how we move through it and that, um, there there was a whole like breathing technique that they, that they recommended where you.
It was based on box breathing, but to be honest, it was. It was more than that. It was, um, breathing in and as you hold the breath.
So box breathing is the four counts to breathe in and then you hold the breath, so box breathing is the four counts to breathe in, and then you hold the breath for four, four counts and while the breath is held, you're coming back to your predetermined like focus word, your like word that helps you like zone in on what you want to be or need to be or can be or this. So for June, her word was connect, and I know this eight-year-old came up with this on her own. I said, okay, wonderful.
And then when you breathe out, you're breathing out and visualizing in that second. Those four counts how you want these next minutes to go for yourself, and so it's not just about athleticism and doing this in sport, although this was the platform in which it was presented to me, and as a trainer. I'm like how can I help my clients by utilizing these things? But just in life, I'm like, June, something goes sideways. Some kid picks on you in the hallway. Breathe in, connect.
This is how I want these next couple moments to go.
And it puts the control on their hands too. You know I work a lot with children and the social emotional learning tools are so important for them to learn Because I think you and I grew up in an age where go to detention if you do something wrong. Go to your room and think about it, and no child is thinking about what they did. They're thinking about how they got caught. No child is thinking about how they can process their emotions if somebody's scolding them on having emotions.
Here we live in a day where we're seeing the importance of a child permission to be who they are and feel, and then giving them tools to inspire themselves. Like I'm not inspiring them, you're not. I'm not healing them, you're not. It's giving them tools to build resiliency, to be that right. They're building resiliency so that they are more well-rounded, they know how to be aware of what's coming up for them.
And then they have beautiful tools like the breathing or taking a walk or yes, doing havening or anything that they can put in their little brain candy jar or their little mental health toolbox to pull out when they need it, and the more we offer that. It's really beautiful to see what can happen when a child has control of which direction they want to go and listen.
as we both know, it's not a fully developed brain, but it is developing and developing exactly and she's learning this emotional intelligence and it's so exciting to to be witness like to get a front row seat. Yeah, in this child's life, um, she's also like she's very involved in sport. However, does not like to compete, and so we talk about that too. You know, it's not really necessary to compete to be able to enjoy a sport.
She did all of swim team last year, didn't compete in one swim meet, and I'm like you know what? I think you still got a lot out of that and I'm okay with that. She is competing in her first wrestling tournament of the season tomorrow, actually yeah and and last year she did compete in two wrestling tournaments and this might be the only one this year, and I'm also okay with that she does.
We focus on what she learns from the competition and not about her winning or losing, but what she learns and how much fun she can potentially have. And so we just say, like, do you have fun there with your friends and getting to cheer them on and them cheering you on?
Yeah, that's the most important thing is that a kid could just be a kid. What are your feelings when you see parents that are just really on their kid? I mean, we see it on the field a lot. I remember being at a game a couple years ago with my girlfriend and we were watching her kids play soccer and one of the dads, who I believe was a coach too, I wanted to rip them off the field because these kids were.
They were not even I don't think they were even six or seven years old, and it's like how are, why are we? Why are you doing that with a child when they're just having fun, is it? What are you teaching them? You?
know. Yeah, I almost want I wonder what their unfulfilled experience in the sport was.
Totally was thinking the same thing. I'm like what's he lacking?
Yeah, Well, you know, did he play soccer as a kid and not get picked for the team?
Exactly Like is this his unresolved trauma as well, but it's trickling down on not only his own child but an entire team. And that's when you can say, you know, the parents stepping in not necessarily berate the person that's the coach, unless something is just out of control, but have the conversation with your child after, like, you know how to respond to this. You know, because that's a, that's a tough one and you see that a lot, like you know, if they're not winning, they're losing.
Why does it have to be one or the other right? Why?
does it have to be one or the other. So this is really what it's taught to children, and this is is one of the things that I have a problem with to be, honest that fitness is so connected to competition and, like people, I remind people of this all the time. You know, I don't run a marathon to win it. I run a marathon to experience it.
It's about the training aspect of it, but also being there in community with these other people who have also been training, and we're all there together, working through this journey for lack of a better word together. This 26.2 mile journey and it's's like this is not about competition.
I don't want to beat the person next to me, I want to cross the finish line with them you know, so it's, it's a. It's something that I again come back to as like how fitness gets these negative connotations and, like probably half, I'm going to say the population doesn't have a competition like gene. You know. It's not part of their makeup to compete. And should these people be involved in sport?
Because, as children, you're told, if you're not competing then you shouldn't be involved in sport, and that's why I'm applauding my daughter who's on the swim team and didn't go to a meet. Yeah, but still went every day to practice and was like, enthusiastic about being at practice.
You know and be a part of something you know. I think that's one of the reasons why I love group fitness, because it's not so much about oh, they're lifting more than I am or oh my gosh, they're doing modifications. Clearly they're not where I am. It's the energy and the vibe of being in the room with other like minds that are there for the mission of better health.
Yeah, the support.
The support, the community, and we learned so much about that with how we met the community. Support was what moved me into initially getting into health coaching, because we had health coaches. Oh yeah, and you know what? Shout out to Lisa Wheeler, because she was the first person I had that conversation with and I said I'm really interested in holistic health coaching, which was funny because I already had gone through.
I was already working with the Institute for Integrative Nutrition, which is where I got my coaching certification for integrative nutrition, but I was working with them as an on-air doing their education module. So when I came back around and there were a couple of us in the group that did it, I was actually watching myself as I was getting certified in some of the videos which was like, wow, that's kind of amazing, right, but it was, it really is right, it's, it's.
It's that community aspect or accountability, whether it is one other person like yourself as the trainer, as the coach, or a group of people that have maybe their is different, right, maybe their aim low is different, but their outcome is better. Health community support gosh, having that is so important, don't you think?
absolutely.
That's really what I'm like up on my soapbox every day yeah screaming from the and there's so many good programs that do that I I mean, I know now you're working with uh, you'd have you have your program within the good vibes wellness, which is a really wonderful with shout out to JD Roberto for starting that and that's been thriving and growing, and so many trainers that we know are in that group as well. And I think it's it's also to keep in mind.
It's not just physical fitness, it's mental fitness, because there is a mindset aspect to it. You're changing a habit, a thought around that habit, your mood around that thought around that habit, a behavior around that mood, that thought, that habit, right?
So I am nodding emphatically yes, yes, yes, right.
So there's so much that goes into it. So, anyway, just want to give people, just remind you that Cheri Page Fogelman is just here talking to us about like taking those little steps, the aim lows, like knowing that you can reach the next step, whatever that might be for you. And I know one step that you're working on is your book. Yes, me as well, so I love my fellow authors in the making. How has that process been for you, oh man?
It's only two. It only took me eight years to write the book. Yeah it started out as a collection of notes, that these were reoccurring conversations that I realized I was having with clients over the years.
And I said, you know what, instead of me just continuing to like give these one person lectures to my clients, I'm going to write these down and and just put this collection of notes all together in like a pamphlet or something for my clients and I'll just give it to them, as you know, when they first start, training with me is like a welcome to training with Cheri pamphlet, right. And it never happened.
And it started to grow and and I realized there were more questions, because at that point I was on Daily Burn and I was involved in the Daily Burn Facebook group, which was like I don't know how many, like three million people or something.
That's very generous.
I'm not sure it was that big, but it was thousands it was thousands, right and people asking questions on the daily right and I was answering questions on the daily like giving like professional feedback about how to approach different training techniques and why something would be like what are the pros and cons of this training technique as opposed to this training technique, things to watch out for?
And I'm realizing that there are these like these smaller questions that have like broader um ripples right, and so I started to kind of compile it all into this book that I like I said it took eight years to write and then I went through the whole ivf thing, which put the the book on the back burner, because I don't know if you've talked to anybody who's been through IVF or maybe you've been through IVF.
It is a full-time job that is in addition to the rest of your life, which maybe you already have a full-time job which is the coordination of the appointments and the medications and the acupuncture and the research that it requires.
Because you know these are recommendations, but you make the decision ultimately on how you want to go through this, and so the book took a back seat, a back burner, for the whole period of time and um, and it's just been just recently that I've been able to to pull it out and dust it off, you know, and it took me a year to put the proposal together. And now my process goals are to weekly submit to one agent a week.
Good.
Which is low. I'm aiming low, but I'm doing it and I'm doing more than I was. So that is on top of all the other things in my life that I'm aiming low, but I'm doing it and I'm doing more than I was. So that is on top of all the other things in my life that I'm juggling.
Well, you just declared it. So, yeah, no, I've been doing it, I love it, and you know what You're motivating me, because I've had my proposal written since I want to say August, because that's when I got the Hay House Honorable Mention for it and that was really like a reminder to myself there's something good here to publish right. But it's the fear that steps in once in a while, where you're like, oh, fear, who am I?
Why would anybody want to read my stuff? Who do I think I?
am, even if people have said they love your stuff. It's something about protecting ourselves from actually going forward with it. But I'm with you, sister, I'm going forward with it. I'm doing the same thing. Yeah, I'll see you at the book signings. We'll have a joint book signing oh, that's a good idea.
Yes that is a great idea. That means we both have to get published near.
Ron, sometime, whatever We'll make it happen, I will say that I do have an accountability partner now Good.
One of my friends who is working on growing her business. She's not even working on a book, but she said, look, I'm working on this and you're working on that. And let's like state our goals to each other and then talk to each other every two weeks about what our goals are and if we've achieved them and, if not, what stood in our way and how can we brainstorm ways to work past them.
And I was like, yes, yeah, sometimes you just need somebody else to say how you doing, and not necessarily have you finished that, but not a nag how you doing.
Yeah, just to help and support you and also to like okay, you're hitting a roadblock, okay, let's, let's discuss, because maybe I've got some insight on it that you haven't thought about. Maybe I've worked through things in a way that can help you.
Yeah, love that Accountability is so important. I mean, you're a coach and a trainer and you know what the best coaches have coaches.
Yes.
Right, yes, yeah, love that. So we had a question when I was on the Zoom this morning working out with our peeps what are some book suggestions that Cheri has? And we saw your layout of some of the books you read. But do you have anything you're reading right now that you are like, oh Well, I'm reading James right now, and that was one of the books in this selection. Yeah, yeah.
I love it. I actually have my computer stacked up on a stack of books.
No, I love it, I actually have my computer stacked up on a stack of books, no judgment there, not the same books.
I'm just seeing what else you got Burnout Burnout it's a really good book. Do you know this?
book. No, yeah, I know the feeling Exactly here. I'll just pull it out, I'll do a little plug for burnout. We can put it up. Oh, burnout, burnout, burnout, burnout, burnout.
The secret to unlocking the stress cycle. Okay, now I can't read who the author is, but we'll author it. It's sisters, emily and amelia.
Nag nagosi all right, we're gonna put that in the um, we'll put james and we'll put burnout in the notes of this podcast, because people love to have the books, and then maybe we'll even add it to the library HIListically Speaking Library and who knows, I'm always looking for new guests that share powerful ways to be kind to your mind. That's good, and do you find that you have a lot of time living where you live now, because you're not in New York anymore? I don't want to say where you are.
That's up to you to share what that is.
I know you're in PA To read, to do more things, not live in the New York life anymore. No, I have less Because I used to read on the subway and I lived in Brooklyn so it was like it depended on the day, but maybe like a 30 minute commute to and from work, depending on where I was rehearsing a show. Maybe I had an hour and 15 minute commute home every night. That I don't have that time on the train to read anymore and I'm needed as a mom, so I feel like I have less time.
To be honest, yeah the micro reading is key.
Yeah, 15 minutes. You know I'll be honest. You know when I've been doing it the most, because I don't want to take my phone with me anymore, because I'm so guilty of doing this and it's awful. I do it when I'm taking a bath, like I will take a bath, I take the book with me. I leave the phone because sometimes you're like scrolling anywhere, like you will scroll anywhere. It's not good to doom scroll.
Oh see, I actually work from bath sometimes I work from bath.
They make the desks that you can create. I just hold my phone.
I've been guilty of it.
Though I send the emails to people, I'm like they don't know I'm working from bath, right, they know now, like I'm doing a Zoom meeting, with the Zoom camera off, why does it sound like there's ripples and waves in the background?
No, but sometimes, when I'm doing that and I'm settling down at night cause that is part of my self care is that I will, you know, draw a nice bubble bath and have my book and I and that also lets me know 15 minutes, so I'm not like a prune later, but um it because it's so. It really is changing a habit.
Not doom scrolling, not looking at your phone, the last thing before you go to bed, you know, take time to think about the positive things that you want to put in your subconscious mind, because it's listening, it hears everything you know 100% and it stores it. So find something that you can actually work on, you know. So that's that's.
That's what I'm reading is right before bed. Yeah, definitely work on, you know. So that's that's one thing. That's what I'm reading, is right before bed yeah, definitely book book light, a little clip that goes on my book and I lay in bed and tell myself a bedtime step away from tech.
Yeah, tell yourself a bedtime story. When's the last time we have mothered ourselves to share a good bedtime story?
I love that I'm a big believer in treating yourself like you are a five-year-old oh yeah and really like taking command of your day and saying, um, have you uh been outside to play yet today? Have you uh taken a bath today? Have you brushed teeth? Have you had your vegetables? Have you had your water?
These are things, things that, like you know not not to say that I talked to my daughter that way but, like as I parent her, I'm thinking through like, okay, what has she done today, and how do we navigate through the day to make sure that she's living the healthiest, best life possible, you know, and how often do we do that for ourselves?
Oh, it's so true. I have a picture of myself as like five years old on my mirror in front of me and I look at her every once in a while. When stuff comes up for me, I'm like, is this Hilary at the age I am now, or is this Hillie that is needing the support right now? And and then you step back into it and sometimes you have a good cry. I remember, like going through the trauma, informed work that I did when I was doing my certification, which was like a year, six months.
I can't remember how long the training was, but, man, I opened up learning some things about myself in that time too. It was deep work, totally.
Giving ourselves grace, yes, grace oh good.
That's a really good segue into what we're about to do, sister. So I have my game that I do. Every guest gets to be on the Brain Candy rapid fire game. Basically, what I have been doing is writing words down that you've said. I imagine you know one of them could have come up that you've said during this conversation and what I want you to do is come back with just one word. What comes to mind when I say that word back to you? Just one word rapid fire, word association.
You got it Okay. You ready to rock and roll? Yes, okay. Health, wellbeing, immunity, life Fitness, success, miscarriage, immunity, life fitness, success, miscarriage perseverance. Author aspiration okay, I know it's hyphenated, so I'm making it one word trauma, informed grace.
Yeah, grace is that my word?
is that my word? Okay, um perseverance, marathon experience. I want to throw this out because you say it and I really like it, but it's two words aim low yeah, I knew you were gonna say just let's hyphenate it. Success, success. I love that. And let's see one more word Exercise Flow. Stay in the flow. I like that.
Yeah.
We'll end with that. That's good. Those are good words. This was great.
This was so wonderful.
Oh my gosh Thank you so much, I so miss you. I want to come out to where you are and listen folks. I haven't shared this yet. I think I've probably shared this elsewhere, probably in a, like a story. When I when it happened but when I went out to the location where Cheri lives, I was there shooting when I was the Formica DIY girl for a couple of years, shooting all the content for them I said, hey, girl, I'm coming to Lancaster and we'll work on it.
I'm working on it and you said, come for dinner and it was so great because you made me a beautiful piece of salmon and we hung out and we played with the cat Stanley.
Yes, stanley has since parted ways, so has Eliza.
I remember they're pouncing together in kitty heaven over the rainbow bridge. So we love our babies right. But just spending time with you and it was just so great and you're so warm and welcoming. And anyone that knows you, anyone that watches you, anyone that takes part in just being in your space, knows just how genuine and authentic you are and, look, that's the kind of vibe that we want to be around. Those are the kind of people we want to bring into our space.
That's definitely the HIListically Speaking vibe. So thanks for saying yes and being here.
Totally Thanks for inviting me. This has been such a wonderful treat. I miss you too. And this is such a nice excuse to get to like spend an hour or whatever chatting with you Well we'll have to make it an in-person in Lancaster.
I'm going to get torn apart by the community because I don't know what I'm saying. Am I even saying a word?
I think there's like I think I'm missing a vowel somewhere.
It's like L apostrophe C-A. Now you're making me question how to say it lancaster, lancaster there you go lancaster yeah, I like the um central market there, which is really fun and there's a really cute coffee shop.
I remember going to there there's it's a cute town absolutely, and it's got like a nice, like hipster community and some, yeah, some really good like-of-the-box thinking art-wise and culture-wise.
And I recall the biggest traffic jam I got into was being behind a horse and buggy.
Oh, shut up.
No, that's true, I was sitting there. I'm like, is he turning? What's happening? Do I go around the horse and he had it pimped out. The bottom of his carriage was pimped out. Yeah, the buggy had lights on the bottom. I'm like what? Who Are you rumspringing? Because definitely rumspringing. It was pretty awesome. That's amazing. It was pretty awesome. That is not typical, no, but you know what you do. You right, right, be who you are Totally Be who you are. All right, my love.
Well, we are going to share everything about Cheri in the podcast notes of this episode.
Except the coordinates of my house, except the coordinates of your house.
That's part two, Listen. I was trying to be like under the radar about it, but you're like everybody knows, it's fine, it's okay.
Yeah, it's all good.
Anyway, so we're going to share everything but the coordinates in the podcast notes of the show. It's been such a joy having you, absolutely adore you, and I would say that we're gonna we're gonna make this happen more often, so yay, same, Hilary, same.
Thank you, thank you.
If you're not already connected to Cheri, this is the chance to raise the vibe, bring good people into your life, because you know that's what HIListically Speaking is all about. So check out the links I shared with you in the notes of this episode, including those books that Cheri mentioned which sound very interesting. So those will also be in the podcast notes. Links to those books. Look, you can add them to a little micro reading.
If you don't do that already, this is a really great opportunity to try it. I love it 15 minutes a day and we're going to add those kind of books into the HIListically Speaking library. So be on the lookout for that, because that is dropping soon. And wherever you're tuning into HIListically Speaking, be sure that you're hitting that subscribe button.
Be sure that you're downloading these episodes so that you can check back and listen to conversations like this whenever you need a little extra support and share your thoughts in a review or comment sections. I'm listening and learning from everything you share and I love hearing what you have to say. Want to join me on my monthly Havening Happy H hours? We talked a little bit about that during the episode as well. These are my gift to you every month online. I do a guided Havening experience.
I've been doing this for about five years now to give you a chance to be kind to your mind. Join others who want to find value in self-soothing and self-regulating for self-care. The link to register is in the notes of this podcast episode. You can also find more information out about if you're interested in bringing Havening into your personal life or even your profession. I do training, certifications and mentorship.
All of that is available to you and you'll find it in the notes of this podcast. HIListically Speaking is edited by Two Market Media with music by Lipbone Redding and, of course, supported by you. So thank you so much for joining me every week time and time again and just letting me know that you support this podcast and I in turn, support you. I'm grateful for you every day. Finally, I invite you to think about each step that you're taking.
Each step is a choice moving you into the direction that you want to go, and choice is very powerful. So remember, like what Cheri said, aim low, aim low and give yourself grace, because every step is the next step towards that goal. You're doing great and remember I love you, I believe in you and I'm sending hugs your way. Be well.