0:00:08.1 BROOM: Hi, welcome to the Higher Education Coffee and Conversation podcast. I'm Cheryl Broom, CEO of Graduate Communications. This is the ninth episode of the podcast, and I'm super excited to report that we've had more than 300 downloads, so thank you so much for listening, and I hope the content on a podcast is engaging, insightful and meaningful to you. Today's guest, Dr. Dilcie Perez, is the vice president and assistant superintendent at Cerritos College in California. Cerritos College is the only community college in California, and it may be in the whole nation, that has purchased property for homeless students. The village provides safe and secure housing and support services to students who face housing and security. Not only that, the college has set up a number of systems to support students, and is a national leader in diversity and equity efforts. The work the college has done has resulted in improved outcomes for students and is proof that when a whole college works together, it can break silos to create amazing support structures for students. There is so much to learn from Dr. Perez. So, let's get started. Alright, well, welcome to the podcast. And thank you so much for joining me, I'm really excited to have you on.
0:01:23.3 PEREZ: Thank you for having me.
0:01:24.6 BROOM: So, I always like to get started by asking guests to tell me a little bit about themselves and their background within the community college system, and you have a particularly interesting background, so I'm really excited to have you share that with the audience,
0:01:38.3 PEREZ: I grew up and was born into a military family, and so I've had the wonderful opportunity of traveling in the country, I've lived in Arizona, Maine, Georgia, Japan. And so, I feel very privileged. I've had that experience. I married into a man that was in the Marine Corps, and so we also had the experience or traveling the country and was really exciting. I went to college, and I went to really six different community colleges to collect my degrees as I was traveling the military, but landed after I got married in Oceanside and Camp Pendleton, and learned about a school called Cal State San Marcos that had just opened in San Diego. And so, I went to Cal State San Marcos and received a degree in political science, and then began to work in the field and industry, worked for a district attorney, well, I was a paralegal legal investigator, also worked in insurance for an insurance company as a Claims Examiner for a while, but ultimately landed in outreach at Cal State San Marcos and got my Masters in 2000 from Central Michigan University. And at that time, distance learning was growing and expanding, and on Camp Pendleton, they had a Central Michigan site where they would fly out the faculty members to teach the classes, which was really cool, and so really enjoyed that program and got my Master's in Administration.
0:03:20.5 PEREZ: My husband's military career took us back to Japan, and I didn't think that I would ever be coming back to California, I thought our chapter in California was done, but we were in Japan for about a year and a half, and Cal State San Marcos called in Japan and said, We have an Interim Director of Student Life opportunity and would love for you to come back. And so, I interviewed in my pajamas over the phone, and actually got the interim assignment, and I did that for about five years, and then was promoted to the Associate Dean of co-curricular Education, did that for about another two years, and someone had talked to me about... Getting in a doctorate. And so I applied to a Dr program at San Diego State, and at the same time I became the Dean of Students at Cal State San Marcos. I enjoyed being a Dean of student, I learned in that position that I enjoyed crisis situations, and I was very good at navigating very difficult student challenges, and so I got my doctorate in Educational Leadership with the emphasis in community colleges.
0:04:38.6 PEREZ: People were saying, What are you gonna do once you finish your doctorate? And I said, I'm going to rest, I'm going to rest. But a friend of mine told me about their job opening at MiraCosta College, and I always knew from my prior experience in community colleges that I wanted to give community colleges a chance and go back as a professional and not just a student, and so I applied for the position and I was lucky and privileged to get that position and had the opportunity to be there for two years and loved that experience, and just in collaboration with my supervisor at the time, and just thinking, after the two years, if I ever want to be a vice president. What would I need to do? And so literally applied for a position Cerritos College as Vice President of Student Services, and in 2019 started there as the Vice President of Student Services, and I have been here and enjoying it and learning and grow. So that's a little bit about me, but it's been a great, great journey.
0:05:44.6 BROOM: I remember when we hired you when I was at MiraCosta because another... I think he's associate vice president at the time, Scott Gross called me from Cal State and said, I can't believe that you're taking Dilcie Perez. So, you were very highly respected on that campus, and I know that you did a lot while you were there, and now at Cerritos College, one of the reasons that I was so excited to have you on the podcast is that your current institution is really setting the bar for Student Support Student Services for issues around diversity and equity, and you're in such a unique part of California doing some really cutting edge programs. And I imagine it's very different than what it was like at Cal State San Marcos.
0:06:37.6 PEREZ: Yes. Yes. Yeah, I think the student population is quite different than San Marcos, and that... We are in Los Angeles County, many people don't know where Cerritos is, in the city of Norwalk, and we have about 21-22,000 students, predominantly about 70% Latinx and a mixture of other disproportionally impacted groups, and about our 6% Caucasian and White. And so, it's very different than even my time at Cal State San Marcos and MiraCosta, and those are primarily white institutions, so even how you do equity work looks very different. So yes, I've enjoyed learning, I think, how to work and partner with students and faculty and students in each of the environments.
0:07:33.1 BROOM: What are some of the really unique programs that you have on your campus, and now we talked a little bit about them while we were prepping for this podcast, and I have a big long list, I love for you to touch on some of the great things that you've been doing.
0:07:45.9 PEREZ: So, in June of this past year, in 2020, we actually had the opportunity to open up what we call the Village and the Village is the first of its kind in the state of California, but it is geared towards supporting our students who are experiencing homelessness, and so our campus had the opportunity to purchase a property, which is about five minutes away from our campus, where 24 to 28 of our students who are experiencing homelessness will live... There are seven town homes each, we'll probably have about four to six students, and then students will have the opportunity to live there for as long as they are progressing forward with their degree. So, while we own the property and have purchased that as a campus, we have partnered with other non-profit service providers who are experts in the area of supporting students around basic needs and homelessness, and so they run the facility or the property for us. And we have the ability to provide an invaluable resource and support to our students, we have received lots of excitement about that, but in addition, we've also received funding from the Chancellor’s Office to also get into partnership with other providers and master lease agreements within the community.
0:09:16.7 PEREZ: So students who are over 24, which is a population that's often not served by the social service agencies because it's typically 18 to 24, so we wanted to provide financial resources and support to our students who have family members and who are over 24 with helping to supplement their rent, and so they also have the ability to get additional support with housing in order to support that, also brought on a licensed clinical social worker who is our mascot, Franco the Falcon. And so we call a lot of our basic needs efforts Falcons Nest, and so Falcons Nest is our centralized support, and it's actually an office, so it is a system and a mechanism to support our students, but it's also a physical space that houses our care manager and a community resource officer, as well as our partners with Cal Fresh, and we have a Franco's Market, which is set up like a Trader Joe's and a Franco's Closet, which offers students’ professional clothing attire, and that it is set up like a store, quite honestly, with a fitting room. So, what is important to us is that we are providing basic needs and support so that our students have been it and respect it, and so we want them to feel as if they were going to a store to shop to receive those items versus receiving a distribution of sorts, the piece that's really important too is our ability to offer fresh food, fresh produce to students, and so there are refrigerators and a sink at Franco’s market.
0:10:58.0 PEREZ: So, for us, what we want to do is centralize our service and support so that students don't have to hunt around, is that they know that if you go to Falcons and tell us that you have a need. Or case manager will help you assess your needs, connect you to on-campus resources, but also connect you to long-term resources in the community. One thing that I love about Cerritos College is that we understand that it is not our job to solve every need, it's important for us to understand them so that we can connect students to those resources in the community whose primary mission is to service people in the community, and so we want to connect them to those long-term resources, and so we are really excited about the efforts that we are doing, and I have to tell you that the one thing that I'm always proud of, and I think people may not realize is that we look at the demographics of the students who are being referred to our housing program, and when you look at the GPA of those students... I don't know why they're here, and I'm guilty of this, but you would think that they may not be the best students, but I'm proud to report that the average GPA for that student population of the folks who are referred is above a 3.0.
0:12:28.1 PEREZ: And so, students are very serious about wanting to commit to education, they just need help removing the barrier of housing and financial insecurity, so that is a primary commitment for our board and for our President who have set out a vision for us to really remove this as a barrier, and we are strongly committed to achieving it.
0:12:51.9 BROOM: I really like how you focus on that basic needs, support with dignity and respect. I think that I've seen food pantries in a number of community colleges that are downstairs or in a closet, you're making a trip to get food, it's very clear that you're in need, and it's not something that's offered in such a supportive environment, so that philosophy that your college is seting forward of dignity and respect must be felt by the students as well, just by how you've made environmental decisions on how to set up in the space for these students. Do they feel respected? Have you felt that from students...
0:13:38.8 PEREZ: So, I think it's interesting, so the physical space of what we call the Falcons Nest was built right before and finished right before COVID hit. We don't want to create it to be a social service office, we almost wanted to be center-like where students can come and feel comfortable hanging out and me. And so that is the goal and the philosophy, and so I will tell you that we haven't fully experienced the physical space yet, but that is the philosophy by which it's been designed, however, I will say this, we have been doing food distributions and grocery card support, and I will tell you what I have appreciated about our student community is their desire to also help others, even in the midst of helping themselves, so I would say to you that I will... I haven't seen the physical space, I know that oftentimes, with even our food distributions, the students who we are helping to serve are the ones who are also helping to some others, but that really, I think resonates that we're a community, and it's a community challenge that we all are vested in or our president or board or executive council all come out and work our food bank distributions that we're having once a month right now, and each of those distributions are serving between 1,500 and 2,000 families each month.
0:15:04.0 PEREZ: So, I think you're right, it is a commitment that people experience and what we want them to fill as part of a community. Yeah.
0:15:12.6 BROOM: So, it sounds like you've really created that culture on campus because it's embraced, not just by administration, but down to the student level, a culture of care, and you've actually gone through a program... A care type program, and I don't remember the name of that, but as a culture of care, is it something like that…
0:15:39.4 PEREZ: Right, so I think... And this is funny, but not funny, so I've had the privilege of setting up a structure like this on three campuses and and so I've learned a certain thing, but what I will say to you is all of them are usually... I think San Marcos Cares. Right. And then at MiraCosta, MiraCosta Cares, right? And then it's Cerritos. And so, I think while it's not very novel anymore, the reality is, I think it's an important message to send to students, and so yes, it's creating a culture of care and a network of support that it is beyond just any one resource or any one person that we really need to create a network of support... support to help our students be successful. One of the things that's very difficult sometimes is that people don't understand why are we as a college campus taking this responsibility on, and I think the premise and the thought has to be grounded in that this is a social justice issue. It is not something that our students necessarily asked to be in, many of our students are first generation, lower social economic status, and so we have to understand and think about the institutional and societal systemic oppression that occurs that often hinders a students ability to...
0:17:07.5 PEREZ: I think navigate, either financially or not, again, obviously mental health continues to be a challenge that we want to support our students with, and so these are societal issues that present themselves in our campus, and so we have an opportunity to remove judgment, and I have to say that if you're going to do this work, you have to move beyond looking at someone's outer appearance, or looking at what they're wearing, what they're driving, what they're carrying is they're really thinking about... It doesn't matter what that story is, if someone... Most people would not sit in line for three hours for a box of food if they didn't need it, most students would not ask for help, and there's a struggle to ask for help, so there's something in that story that we may not be privy to, but what I have seen though, is that those situations where people take advantage of the system is more like less occurs very rarely. Right. And so I just encourage that as people begin to do this work to move past the judgment, knowing that it is better to help the majority then to penalize the majority for the actions and the few...
0:18:19.2 PEREZ: And so, we have some very strong systems in place that really prevent any type of abuse or misuse, we take it seriously to be good stewards of the funds that we receive and make sure that they are getting to the students who most need them.
0:18:33.8 BROOM: It's a great philosophy, and I could see how it is a very different philosophy than some colleges, because there's a lot of transactional relationships between students on campus, where it's like, you come to campus, you learn here's your admissions and financial aid in and out in the now and your approach seems to be more of like of a 360, escorting a student through being there as they make their journey, which is a philosophical difference from how some institutions operate. Sure.
0:19:08.4 PEREZ: And I think that you're absolutely correct, and I can only speak for me in this, but I think this is becoming more prevalent than even when I was going through my doctoral journey and I was really focused on researching student success and what that looked like. I realized that I came from my family. Both of my parents went to college. Both of my brothers went to college. So I came from a family, a college-going culture, and what's interesting to me is they were pivotal moments where there were things that happened in my life outside of my control, there were... Math wasn't my strong suit, and so you have impostor syndrome. Researching is overwhelming, but I realized in that moment, in that process of being a student, that if I needed help, I wasn't first generation, I wasn't lower social economic status, I had all the support in the world, and if I needed help getting through... How much more with someone who had all of those bars against them need help. And so that is what has driven me, and I think a lot of my colleagues to remain committed to this work, because we have, unfortunately in Higher Education, created systems and structures that weed students out by holds and deadlines, and I'm not talking about academic deadlines, I think those are important, but deadlines that are not associated with their success in the classroom...
0:20:35.9 PEREZ: Right. And so for me, from a student services perspective, my job is to help them overcome all of their barriers so that when they sit in that seat, in that classroom, they are ready to focus on their school work and to perform and to meet the rigor of the curriculum, and I don't say that light-hearted, because I think that oftentimes, people think that we are asking them to decrease the rigor in the classroom, and I actually think what I see in the students who are applying for these programs is if we help them with their basic needs. They will perform well. They have everything they need. It is just that if you are of not eating, you don't know where you're sleeping, you are not in a good mental health state, you cannot focus on your academics. Yeah.
0:21:24.6 BROOM: And I think I actually was going to ask you what you would say to somebody who argued that all colleges, be it a university or community college, shouldn't be playing this role that this is really outside of what college is intended to be, providing services maybe should be left to other government agencies, but I think you kind of just answered that. Right.
0:21:50.8 PEREZ: I did, but I guess what I would say to you, because I think there are also folks who get into this work at community colleges and want to meet all the needs for all students, right. And I think we have to stay focused on our academic mission, and our goal is to triage, understand and get them connected to the outside... The community agencies that can help them. And what I say to our team, and I have to say this often, every single thing we do needs to be connected to their achieving their educational goal, if we are doing this and they are not progressing towards the educational gap, then we might be doing this in vain and need to look at, are we taking on more for student success than they are...
0:22:33.8 BROOM: Right, and so you're actually weaving student outcomes into services and having that be a metric
0:22:43.4 PEREZ: And also known, which is also not holistic student support, your student development, is that piece that you talk about with 360 support, understanding that we are educating the whole student...
0:22:54.1 BROOM: You said something really interesting about yourself, being positioned to be successful in college and still needing help, I had a conversation for another podcast that I haven't edited again, so it's going to be out soon, but I had a conversation with a student who was formally incarcerated for over 20 years, he was incarcerated as a result of the three-strike law, his third strike was very minor, but he ended up getting life in prison, and he didn't know what a link was, he went to Palomar College and the faculty member was talking about a link... You gotta click on the link and click on a link... While in prison, you don't have the Internet. So, he was like, what is the link? And I was blown away because we don't... We have this curse of knowledge where it's, this is the way our parents went to college, we went to college, we know what a link is, we have the Internet, we have food, so you don't know what others are experiencing and how detrimental that is to their success and the barriers that are there. It's amazing, it's sad, but it's so uplifting to hear what your campus and other colleges are doing to help students achieve their goals.
0:24:11.9 PEREZ: Yeah, thank you. It's exciting to work.
0:24:14.9 BROOM: Definitely, and one of your previous colleges Cal State Marcos, you had mentioned that the university actually successfully closed the achievement gap.
0:24:26.6 PEREZ: And I can take no credit for it. I think that it was also part of the culture, but there was a very specific team and very specific, and I will say Dr. Jeffrey Gilmore, who really single-handedly began to work with students as individuals and call students and contact students and communicate with students, and when a student dropped out, they would reach out to that student and come back and... So, it was some years ago, but they actually closed the gap because of all of our campus efforts, and so I feel very privileged to have that and been a part of that. And so, now, and particularly community colleges are doing a lot of the Student Equity work, I have hope because I've seen it done, it's not a far-reaching goal that it's not achievable. I truly believe if we align structures and systems really to be focused on the student and where they might need assistance and help, I think we could all... close to the gap.
0:25:27.7 BROOM: Yeah. I remember when I was at MiraCosta, we had this... And this is prior to you joining, but we had this culture shift where it was students first, and thinking back, it's amazing to think that that had to even be a shift, we should always be students first... What you're doing is putting students first, but over time, large institutions tend to be inflexible with their rules and their processes, and so it was a culture shift, like why asking questions, why are these rules, why are these deadlines, why are these punitive measures helping students or are they making... Our jobs in the institution easier.
0:26:13.1 PEREZ: I think you're right, and having done a lot of my research on this, I spend time really thinking about, there is tradition in history in the academy, in higher education that I think is very valuable, and I also think there are forms of academic elitism that we say we made it through, you should be able to do... And it's kind of not a form of hazing, but it's almost this like we're developing and growing you, if you jump to these four hurdles and we're teaching you to be resourceful, and I think that... I struggle with that is I look at the number of holds that some... Our institutions have that literally, I think one institution I was talking to, they had a hold on students 25 dollars to the campus, but yet they were going to get financial aid in the next few weeks, but they would drop all of their classes. There are holds for just minute things that I think as a campus, it's just reframing our thinking, and you probably have heard in community colleges, we have had a strong commitment to access, and I believe a that more students are attempting and starting college than ever before, however, our Student Success numbers, and graduation rates and achievement of their educational goals, it is not moving,
0:27:41.4 PEREZ: Not shifting as significantly as it needs to, and it is imperative upon all of us to really begin to think about, Are we maintaining the status quo for the sake of, I don't know, making students earn their way, that has nothing to do with really their academic abilities, or their ability to be resourceful.
0:28:10.4 BROOM: And when we talk about equity, I think that statement really is kind of at the heart of that, are our policies creating equity on campus, or are they creating barriers and
0:28:21.8 PEREZ: Literally... And I would say a barrier, or are we weaving students out... And I think that one of the things at one of the previous campuses, we were going up for accreditation, and it just was pivotal for me that we often... All we talk about is the students who are successful, we often, if a student drops out, do we spend time calling that student to find out why are we reaching out, do we know the students we're losing? And I think most campuses don't have a mechanism in place to contact you and to have dropped off and dropped out, and I would venture to say having done this work for a few minutes is that when we start calling students, we will find that many of them left for reasons that are within our control, and
0:29:13.4 BROOM: Sometimes simply asking them if they wanna come back is enough to get them to return
0:29:22.3 PEREZ: Because you notice that they were gone, that you cared about them, and they weren't just a number to you. And I think you're right, because you're investing in them, and I think you can have folks help develop a plan of action or work with a student to help them come back. It's a cultural shift, it... Even though I think that most people in many people, hard-working people that are committed to equity, it is easy to become insensitive to the impact that some of the structures are having on our students, and so it has been very... It's shifted our perspective on our campus, where we raise those questions of each other and people... You should see when the light bulb goes off, that folks are really like, I didn't even think about it as an equity issue, and it was... And they're committed to equity. So I think part of what I think it's a constant communication and constant goal to be a learning organization, where you're always reviewing and in a place of inquiry, because it's easy to become blind and the urgency of the day and all the different demands that we have, to lose sight, that we may be creating systems and structures that are hindering our students...
0:30:36.6 BROOM: I love that statement so much, because I tell you that people start... Colleges start... Oh, I think this is not just... college but all institutions. They start something wonderful, maybe they start a discussion around equity, or they start a program, or they start something, and then a couple of years go by, but that communication around it doesn't continue, so it's been started and it's there, but it's not part of the culture and there isn't this constant, like you said, culture of inquiry and discussion, so the new people come or new students come and nobody knows why that thing is there, what that thing do or why that program exists, and then it kind of fizzled away or it doesn't work. So I think that's such a key point is to not just become complacent with the services that we create, but to constantly be talking and sharing and questioning and being inquisitive about Why are we doing these things, can we keep doing the better... Such an important point. That's my soap box for today.
0:31:46.0 PEREZ: No, I'm on it with you, and I have to say it's also being open to new ideas to solve the challenges, and you would be amazed, and I think we all know this, but it's easier to have then done... Ideas don't know hierarchy, they don't know organizational structure, there may be someone in facilities that has a great idea that can help student services, there may be someone in Student Services has a great idea to help facilities, and I think that oftentimes we're so siloed and we can't get out of the urgency and the medic of the day that we can't... We need to be more intentional about creating spaces for us to create that space to think right, and to look at really and reflect on who are and what we want and how we want our students to be successful. And so I will say to you, no matter what comes out of those types of conversations... It is good, it is. Well, perfection is not the goal. Are learning and growing and changing and shifting, that's the goal, not so much a particular service or initiative, 'cause they may go away with time, but it's created that culture that creates that space for new ideas and reflection to occur
0:33:03.4 BROOM: If somebody wanted to get started having discussions on campus are better serving students in new ways, what's worked with you to build momentum and consensus.
0:33:13.8 PEREZ: I think the first thing, and we say this often, and I think people take it for granted, is to listen. So I think it's creating the space to talk to students to get the qualitative and the quantitative data about what their experience is, what challenges they are facing on any particular campus, because while there are commonalities across campuses, there are some unique nuances and challenges that students face that I think we would be surprised how easy some of the challenges would be to address, and so I think it's first talking to students and creating mechanisms by which to grow their voice and to hear what their experience is. Secondly, I think it is critically important to talk to faculty and the staff, so as we know, faculty probably see students more than any other office and often are on the front lines, and it's interesting because I was teaching at a four-year institution in a graduate program, as a faculty member and a student during the break and I work in Student Services, and then a student during the break asked me to come outside and they were crying profusely and they looked at me and said, I just found out that I'm HIV positive.
0:34:41.9 PEREZ: And despite the fact that I work in Student Services as a faculty, I had no idea what to do. Like I was thinking, Okay, run through your relation ideas and I do some suggestions. Right. And so I think about that experiences. I think of my colleagues and Academic Affairs who every day are being faced with the unique challenges of students have and just being president in the classroom and trying to hear that story to not only address them for students, but to support and provide resources for those that are on the front line working with students so that they can give that support to students as quickly as possible, and then I think it's getting into a position of being real and transparent and authentic. And I would say, and I think that this is a common thing that we say that, is that we need courageous leaders who are willing to look at the organization and really begin to look at it in a reflective manner to see what needs to shift and change, and to be willing to engage people in those discussions, and for me, it's really important that we not place blame, that we not point fingers, the reality is it is what it is and we're here because...
0:35:57.9 PEREZ: And we are right. It doesn't matter why we got here per se, but I think that it's creating that space for us to come together collectively to begin to create a list and prioritize it. What we can do to address the needs of our students. And I think if I had to give one other thing that I think is critical and crucial is that we have to pay attention to the students that we lose, and we have to pay attention to those that are at risk and... Yes, they need the most work, yes, they need the most effort, but I truly believe that when we start caring about those individual stories, it's when we will start seeing the achievement gaps close.
0:36:45.8 BROOM: Well, wonderful advice, and I think that Cerritos is very lucky to have you leading them and leading Student Services, and I'm going to invite my listeners to look you up on LinkedIn, connect with you. I would love that. Great, and then to take a look at the services on the website too, because you have a lot of that listed and good information on there to learn more about the amazing things that you've accomplished in the way that you continue to serve students.
0:37:18.4 PEREZ: Well, thank you and I have enjoyed our conversation, and thank you so much for the opportunity...
0:37:26.2 BROOM: Thank you for listening to Higher Education Coffee and Conversation. If you like the podcast, please leave me a five-star rating and discover more great higher education-related content, make sure to visit us at graduatecommunications.com, and with that, I'm going to say thank you for listening, thank you for the hard work you do for students, each and everyday.