Validation Addiction

This is he said a YADIHO with Eric Winter and Rosalind Fantev.

Today we have a very fun guest. I'm so excited to chat with her. This is gonna be a lot of fun. Maury Fontanez. She is an entrepreneurial woman who has been really lifting up. She guides Fortune five hundred companies and c suite leaders, performers, and other public figures to navigate change, challenges, and growth in both their personal and professional lives. She has a new book coming out that we'll get to talk about. She has a podcast. She has so much going on. I need some help.

I mean, listen.

I always say that I don't have the traditional path into this kind of guidance and teaching because a lot of my work is actually fundamentally spiritual, right. It's about learning what your soul desires and following that truth. But I come from a background of crisis management for fortune one hundred CEOs and companies and public personalities in the entertainment industry. So basically I was the person running into the fire that people had created that they were.

Running out of.

And I spent twenty years doing this, writing messages for people to say to re earn the trust they had lost in whatever public scandal had happened. And I did this, and I did it well, and I continue to grow in that space until I hit a point where honestly, I kind of had my own crisis internally, which was what am I doing Why am I writing a bunch of words that people are saying that they don't believe.

And more importantly, why do.

They get into crisis to begin with? And that question became the north.

Star for the rest of my life. And I started to pursue answering that question.

And what I found was I do it because I'm deeply intuitive, and that means I know the answer to the problem. Why do I know it because I don't have fear in that moment, because it's not my crisis. What blocks us from our intuition is the fear. And so I set out to start coaching people to learn how to reclaim that inner wisdom so that they could avoid those moments, but also so that they could learn to.

Trust themselves again.

And I made a hard left and started a whole new career from there.

It makes it makes sense, and I feel, you know, it's interesting about what you do right, because it is. I truly believe it's a gift when someone can tap into that and know that what their intuition, what their gut is saying, can really help somebody if they take it to heart and they apply it. And I'm assuming because you said yourself like you have your own fires you deal with right, And I don't know, do you ever work with your own life coach as well? Because

I have mentors, I have healers, I have somatic coaches. I you know, I believe in, you know, the Eastern medicine kind of way of multiple modalities all at once and ofsing of addressing us as humans as an energy system. So I work with all kinds of teachers of guides,

I mean, and that makes sense and it's great to hear as well, because a lot of times when someone goes to help you, you're like, wait, but do you actually practice what you preach? You know what I mean? And do you apply it? Because it's so easy to sit on the end. Not easy, but it's there's an ability to sit on the outside and guide people but not follow your own words of wisdom. And I even will debate my wife about this sometimes I'm like me, all kinds of advice, but do you take your own advice?

Sometimes yeah, And it's hard to take their advice when you feel like, oh, well, you're not taking the risk of doing the courageous thing, and like, don't you feel eric like you could tell when you're with someone a guide, a teacher, or a healer, a therapist, and you're just like, ooh, it feels like you're saying things you don't actually like take in cellularly, like can't totally yea.

You know, there's a couple of topics that my producers are brought up that I found fascinating. One of them right away that struck a chord was especially in my business, is validation addiction. Something that I know you've tapped into and spoke a lot about share with our listeners. A little bit about your definition of that, and then I want to talk to you about my thoughts and get into that.

Yeah, I'd love to hear your thoughts, so listen. We all, as human beings, rely on validation from a very early age. Why because we learn very young that we need the acceptance of those around us to survive. So validation becomes a survival stratch. At a very early age, we are learning. We're watching what is it that I do that makes

Thing to do.

When we believe that illusion, what we do is we start to look outward instantly, what do you think? Do you think this thing I did was valuable? Do you think I'm valuable? Then you add social media on top of this, all right, you know rich foundation of looking outside, and now we have a society that says, oh, guess what I can measure how valuable you are by other people's interactions with you. And so we've become addicted to validation as a form of checking in on our value.

You could probably have a full career just doing this for actors, because the truth is, I do you have to work with any other company in the world. You could just focus on actors, because yeah, actually I'm just actors, just creatives. The funny thing about the creatives, and I try to explain this people all the time, is that we are in a business where you're you have no choice but to be told you're valuable by somebody else

Would not agree with you more.

And I would just add one fine point on it, which is that word value, even an athlete, tying your value to what you produce is part of the toxicity of our whole culture. You are your career, you know the amount of money you can command, sure, absolutely, But the minute that we believe that our value as a being has to do with what we produce, all of a sudden, we're a human doing, not a human being.

So that work around value is so important.

And I will say I have the opportunity to sit across a zoom in a session with people I grew up watching in the movies and coaching them now, and sometimes I have to think, like, wow, okay, this is the direction your life took you Why? And it's because my message is one of listen. You're a storyteller. The way you tell your story as a creative is not always going to align with however someone has a vision for a story. But it does not mean you hold

It's funny I trying to even relate this to sports, and you made it very clear which was which was valid. And I've said this to my daughter and again, like competitive tennis for a young kid is brutal, Like it's a really tough support. There's no there are no referees. You're in an individual sport. You're on this island by yourself. You're you're constantly having to produce and work and work and work, and it's just never ending. It's it's like a you see it in a pro circuit, right, It's

Yeah. And were you proud of yourself?

Yes?

I really try to focus on with my kids so I can break them of this validation addiction is not even ever since they were little. It was like I would stop myself from saying I'm proud of you. First, I'd start with are you proud of yourself?

Yes? Why because I did X, Y and Z.

You know, I'm proud of you too, But like, let me start by reminding you you need to be proud of yourself, not anybody else.

I like that. I'm actually going to take that, take that advice right there and use it with her and my son. You know, he's young playing soccer or young still, but everybody's always like, you know, did you score a goal today? I'm like, it's not about the goal It's about how did you play? Did you work hard? Did you run?

You know?

And did you hustle? You can make the greatest sit There's a number of things. Yeah, And that's something that I think is very important to shine a light on Are you proud of yourself? First? Because it doesn't matter if I'm proud if you're not proud of yourself.

And as adults, we.

Can ask ourselves that same question every day. You know, it didn't go the way I planned, But am I proud of myself right now? And if the answer is no, what part of me is not proud of myself?

Yeah? You know, God, that whole thing that you like you let into and talked about with social media. That's where I feel like that's one of the biggest pitfalls is that people constantly post for approval. They're seeking attention. And I have to remind my wife about this a lot. And you know, if you're looking at comments from somebody and you love all the positive comments, you need to be accepting of the negative comments because you're going to

And the positive I say this to you know, a lot of my performers that are really active on social like the positive and the negative are all projections.

None of it is about you, none of it.

The great stuff is a projection of what the person desires to be, wants to aspire to the way they're idolizing you. The negative stuff is a reflection of their shame and their self hatred and their envy. None of it is about you, Like you can't take any of it personally because we are all and I mean this in the kindest way, self centered beings, meaning that our experience on this planet revolves around our experience on this planet, which means that that's what we project out at each

Yeah, it makes sense, makes sense. Another topic I want to get your definition on because I find it interesting is the burnout crisis. Yeah, talking about why people are disengaging in how to reconnect authentically. Talk to me about that.

Yeah, I mean it goes back to this idea of in our culture and many cultures, that our value is measured by what we produce. If you buy into that, if you buy into that as a truth, you are on your way to burnout just from that belief system, because you are constantly trying to prove that you matter, that you should be taking up space by producing, and there by the way is never going to be enough producing. I'll take myself for example, I had a dream of writing a book with a major publisher.

Guess what I did that.

Guess what I want more?

I want to.

Now achieve more because I, myself, a teacher of these truths, has bought into the fact that the more I achieve, the more I can show my value. Now the work for me is to reframe it around purpose. No, the more you achieve, the more impact you have, which allows me to go back into a place of this isn't about other people liking what I'm doing. It's about helping.

That brings so true to me in my own personal life and also just again, I go back to my kid with her sport, because it's you. Burn Out is so big in youth sports in general, and I think there is that constant need to prove, prove and if you're not getting it, if you didn't win this thing, you're not good enough. And if you're not good enough, why am I doing it? And then you put all these hours in and eventually you're just like, I hate it.

Yeah, but it's.

Hard to appreciate it when you don't know what it's for the sake of.

Yeah. So one purpose, like one.

Exercise I give my creatives, my artists is or everyone even the CEO is like, I want you to have a for the sake of statement?

What is this for the sake of?

So? For example, my greatest value at all is freedom. I exist for freedom, my own freedom and the freedom of everyone that my work touches. So for the sake of is this is for the sake of freedom? When I use that frame, everything I do has to fit in that bucket. If it's not providing freedom for me, my family, my followers, my clients.

I'm not going to do that thing.

So find your reason why, like your big reason why, and your clue is what do you value most? What is the thing you know that your soul values the most. That is the connection to your purpose. And when you can map everything back to why am I doing this, then it's easier to appreciate it in the moment.

That you know. That's great. That's a great way of phrasing. At night, I think subconsciously, I've even thought about stuff like that, because there's been jobs I've taken and I'm like, why am I taking this job? Like this is strictly a money job, and then I go back and I go but wait, my priority has always been my family, my kids, providing, you know, being there for them. And if it's a job that keeps me a Los Angeles,

That's that's exactly what I mean.

You have your eye on the north star, so you can find appreciation. Because here's the thing. We can get into victim mode. This is how we humans are, Like, this is happening to me. Guess what my loves. You are making it happen. Everything that is happening you have made happen, either from the consciousness of total belief in yourself and dignity and purpose, or from the consciousness of lack and fear and shame. But whichever one you pick, is the world that you're creating around you. It's not

I already know I'm gonna probably have to hire you to talk to my kid, to my daughter, and my wife. I wish she was here for this podcast. She would have learned that she might have learned I was right about a couple of things. But that would be bad too.

Oh so you want to you like, let me ask you that.

Well, that's a great segue actually into another one of the topics, which is advice on love and relationships. To create your most high frequency relationship, to build on each other, talk to me about that.

So think about what we just talked about around validation.

When we don't know that, we externalize our value when we don't like stop to think about it. We also then mistake validation for love for loving intimate relationships. I think that often we go into or I did at least in my first marriage and my relationships prior to that. We go into relationships looking for the other person to fill that black hole inside us that we have around questions of our own validity, lovability value, Like we think that if someone else just loves us enough, that that

The point is.

How do I be at my most resourced self, which I call is your higher self, my most dignified sense of I know I hold value, and I'm also going to listen to the wisdom inside me first and foremost.

I'm not going to hand it over to you, my partner.

I'm going to keep following my own north star, and I'm going to find a partner who is good with that, who wants that for me, and who is doing that for themselves, which creates a fiercely independent relationship, but in a way where you're actually there to cheerlead and celebrate one another and have really honest conversations with each other.

Well, I feel like I've been in that situation, especially in my past marriage. Funny enough as well, where maybe you're holding the person back and ultimately you're afraid to lose them, right, Like you're afraid to let them fly instead of trying to find ways you can elevate yourself while elevating them. Am I right?

And why are you afraid to lose them?

Yeah, I mean that's a great question to ask. I think, you know, sometimes maybe you devalue yourself or you devalue a situation, you know what I mean. And I think that's something you know. In my marriage now with Rozen, we've been together for nineteen years, but in our relationship we've always found a way to lift each other and support each other's careers. It's never felt competitive. Yeah, it's always been you do that, I'll do this, we'll we'll

And you know, my hypothesis is that we're afraid to lose them because we've put our value, our value into them, so we think that if they go, there goes our value. And that is how I operated in my first marriage, where it was so holding on so tightly to like, please stay or please do what I need to feel loved so I can love myself.

The minute I realized, oh my god, I.

Don't need you for that, my entire relationship with relationships changed to the point where I'm remarried now and in our vows my current husband I said to each other, I exist to allow you to embody your higher self, and the minute I get in your way, I need.

To go away.

I think you probably know many people, and I know I've never been fully like this, but I've had moments like this, and I know people that have been fully. You know, in this space where you become your partner, you morph yourself into the person you're dating, like, oh you like that, I like that. I'll figure out how to like what you like. I will become you. And that ultimately is a dying relationship. It's never going to be sustained because as soon as either that, one person's

Yeah, because that's the little people please are inside you.

That same little six year old that came up with that strategy to please people to get love is still at the steering wheel in an adult grown relationship and is replaying that same strategy.

Yeah, this is all great stuff. And I know, let's talk a little bit about what you have coming up. And I also know you have a podcast, but you have a book that's coming out. Correct, Let's talk about that higher self that's right.

Yeah, higher self, reclaiming the power of your intuition. It is really this blend of my method in a book, blended with my memoir and my life story, because I really mean when I say I'm walking alongside you.

So I want to show you how I did the things that I tell you to do.

And then some of the case studies of some of the more like brilliant, amazing people that I've gotten to coach and how they've been transformed. And really the book is written as a love letter from your higher self to you. So it's written about you, the reader, and I talk you through your childhood and where you may have found some of these limiting beliefs and these coping strategies, and I show you how to let them go so that you can make room. And at the end, really

I love it sounds like a mandatory read if you're ask me. And this is out now, so everybody can jump on this right away. Exactly, and then you have a podcast signal with Maury and Melissa. Correct.

Yeah, so that's a podcast where we have this kind of dialogue. It's me and my best friend and she's really there. You know, I can get really metaphysical and start talking about like huge concepts. Melissa is like, you know, your average everyday person who's so hilarious, and she's just there to like ask questions that the cynic would have or be like, wait a minute, what are you talking about?

Break it relatable? Yeah, you'll lost me a whole lot totally.

So we have a lot of fun and we talked to a lot of great people.

Oh that's great. So everybody can check that out anywhere you get your podcast.

Anybody listen to podcasts and high yourself anywhere you would buy your books.

I love it. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast. This has been great. I mean it when I say I might hire you to talk.

To my daughter, let's do it.

I'm in She'll get a lot out of it.

Yeah.

I appreciate your time, my pleasure.

It was so nice to talk with you.

Thank you. All right, Well, I think we all definitely learned something from Maury without a question I did. I really wish Roslyn would have been here, because I'm telling you I would have been said I was right on a couple of my thoughts. But if she listens to this podcast, you'll know I said that. Otherwise, maybe she'll

If you want to follow us on Instagram, check us out at e said ajav or sens an email Eric and Ross at iHeartRadio dot com.

He said.

AJAB is part of iHeartRadio's Miculduda podcast network.

See you next time.

Bye,