Hangin' With The 'Boys: Stephen Jones Returns

in for Nate, but just a guest. We got a special guest. We have a very special guest, and we'll get right to it. We are joined on the show by Steven Jones. How are you today, Steven? Hey, I'm doing great, guys, good to be on and uh like I'm not holding up this seat. Well I'm in Nate seat. It's hard to feel. Nate stretched it a little bit. We'll appreciate you joining us. What's what's a day like around OTAs look like for you? What what do you

do on a OTA day? Well? Uh, you know, you're just out there a little bit, trying to get a little glimpse of what these guys are looking like you know, right now, Will and I did a quick count. I think we've got ninety players out there. In forty five of them are new first time around. So there's a lot to look at and certainly, you know, you enjoy the fruits of the work. I mean, we're obviously very optimistic about what we've done with this team, the pieces

we've added. Uh, certainly missing a lot of familiar faces out there when you think about Tony and Dez and and Jason. But at the same time, it's exciting because we do have so many new faces, not only players, but coaches and uh, certainly I think the new coaches along with the guys who've been here a while or certainly looking forward to the challenge and working with these guys who are really wanting to step step their play

up and step up. And obviously in a lot of cases here, if we're gonna be looking for some players to step into some shoes that legends, real legends of the Dallas Cowboys, Uh, they're gonna have to step up and fill those type of shoes. But it's an exciting time. Uh, it's a it's nervousness, but it's a good, nervous and so uh uh, you know, you you step out there and you take a look at it now, albeit you're looking at them in shorts and helmets and it's not,

as we call it, real football yet. I mean, they're they're learning, they're learning systems, they're learning some of the techniques that we expect from them, but you're not seeing real football yet. And so we really won't know what we got our hands on until you put on the pads there and Oxnard for the first time, and uh start to play some of those preseason games. You'll get a lot better feel for what some of these guys can do. Speaking about Oxnard, real quick, y'all release the

dates of camp. I don't think we officially have. We're still working on our schedule. You know. Sometimes you know, you don't you do things. You might start a day or two here for the start of it, do a little let people get acclimated, and then head out. I know we've done that before, but I think Jason's trying to come up with his final recommendation for us in

terms of how he'd like to proceed with training camp. Okay, it seems like the youngest team we've had I haven't done the math on the age, but it seems like such a young team this year. Is that create any concerns? Does that change anything of how the seasons approached it all and what's how the preparation comes. Well, I think it's a good mix. You know, you look at that offensive line, they're certainly seasoned. They're one of the best

in the NFL. Certainly that's what you want. Then you look at what you'd call young guys and Dak and Zeke and you know, I read a deal the other day where they're two of the type MVP candidates in the NFL, and so they certainly I don't look at them necessarily as a young guys anymore because they've been around the block. Uh, certainly that receiving corps albeit, uh there's no death, there's you've got guys like Cole Beasley and Terrence Williams and uh, you know that crew that

have done some good things for us. But that's probably one of the greener groups. And then anytime you lose a Jason Witten, Uh, certainly that's a green group. But certainly we think probably U are more excited about the group than most because you know, we see some good skilled players there. And now there's no high draft picks there. There's you know, there's no Jason Witten, so we understand that. And then defensively, you mix Sean Lee and with that

young group of linebackers. I think he's got that covered deal all with that group of defensive lineman. And then you mix in that secondary back there with Byron and uh and then it gets young. But it's exciting to think of the players that we've added back there and feel good that they're gonna make a difference. I want to ask you about the receiver position, Stephen. You mentioned I think you mentioned the draft. There is no Atlanta

type Julio Jones. Guy's gonna get your hunry catches. And again, the offense isn't built like that You've got. It's a Zeke run first offense. But how do you size up what you've done at receiver and knowing that Dak's the type of guy that likes to hit the open guy anyway, He's not going to force things, how do you how do you think that position stacks up? Well? I think you're spot on. I think you know you'd probably be way too optimistic to think we've got a true number

one receiver as we sit here today. Hopefully you know, maybe that changes, who knows, But I will say this, when we sat down in the off season to look to go back to that term, Dac friendly what was in his best interest. I think these moves could end up making dact better because I think he's a quarterback. He's very cerebral. He certainly understands the system, he works at it, and he likes to work through his progressions

and that's hard to find in quarterbacks. A lot of them are good going first, progression, second, and then things get blurry. For him, he likes to go first, second, third, fourth, and not feel any pressure to have to force the ball. And I think with this group of receivers and tight ends now and that's what made him great. Don't get me wrong. Between Doz and Jason, certainly there's always pressure to get the ball to players like that and sometimes

even when it's not necessarily the the read. And I think, now, Dak, can you know, not feel any pressure, work through this progressions and get the ball. I you know, I could easily listening to Scott and Jason see games where you know he eight different people touch the ball, you know, catch footballs and and so I think that's what we, you know, are going to look forward to for right now.

I think a lot of teams get it done. There's good teams that get it done that way without the dominant Julio Jones does Bryant type of receiver, and we feel confident and that we can be very successful moving the ball with this offensive line Zeke and then really letting Dakh just run the offense. So you think that he's coming off a down years injured, now he's had some off the field stuff going on, Can Terrence still be is He's still gonna be counting on as he's well,

he's got to go to work. I mean, there's no question, and that's not his character. H In my opinion, I think Terrence is a you know, top top end guy. I think obviously, you know, from what you see there, probably made some bad decisions that night, but uh, you know, nobody's perfect. But if you look at Terence's full body of work, I think Terence is a good person. He's gonna work hard. But you know, we brought several receivers in.

We lost Dez and but we brought in obviously drafted u Gallop and then you turn around and uh, you know, paid some decent money, uh to Deante and to Hearns, and so it's gonna be competitive. And anyone who thinks they're just going to walk out there and something's gonna be given to him, you know, they got another thing

coming signed. Jay's a great, great receiver coach. We think he's one of the best in the NFL, and he wanted it to be very competitive, and that's what we're going to have a competitive situation to make this roster at receiver. When you're out there watching practice, are you watching the coaches some as much as the players at times, just to kind of see Jerry's mentioned your new ideas new you know, just it's a new group. As much

as there's some change on the roster. Well, I've probably the one, you know, I hate to say you've enjoyed. You know, you enjoy watching one go more than other. But obviously Chris Frossard's bringing some energy out there. Reminds me a little bit of Jerome Henderson. He's in his cleats.

I think he still thinks he played dB. I know Jerome did so, but he brings a lot of energy, certainly very vocal, not unlike Ride, and certainly have enjoyed watching him coach these young defensive backs and he looks forward to it. He loves the talent and the group. If you take obviously the draft that we had last year, where you take four defensive backs, it's a you know, certainly a young group, but a group that he's certainly

fired up to work with. I know he said personally they had Shadobe as their guy to pick right behind us they're in Seattle, that they were going to pick him. So he loved Shadobe coming out and certainly loves what Byron represents with his length and moving him back to corner. Obviously, he was a big part of that move, wanting to move him back to being that long corner. And so we're excited about what's going to go on back there.

But I do find myself watching both. You watch watch those coaches that are a course Ride, you can't ever miss Ride. Yeah, he's gonna give you a laugh. Ever practice in terms of getting in those guys and work at them. And it's always interesting when you bring in these young defensive linemen because boy, their eyes are like holy, what did I get myself into. I'm not so sure some of the reasons we lose some of these guys,

like a McClean. As he went to bed, he was fired up about coming back to Dallas, and then he went to sleep that night said pod drills riding and I think I'll go to Atlanta. Well, we know you got to get out of here. I have one question that's that's kind of off the field, related with with Father's Day coming up here in a week and a half or so, what is the Jones household like around Father's Day? I mean, your dad's you know, done some really cool stuff in his life. He's got everything. Do

y'all just do you still buy gifts? Do you just hate out? What? What's that like? Yeah, well we do. And uh, it's a special day obviously. I've been so blessed to have a wonderful father who's I've been blessed not only to what he was as a father figure when I was growing up, but also to be able to work side by side with him my entire life. So, uh, you know, so special, and he's given so much as

a father, not only to me, but my brother and sister. Uh, you know a lot of people you know find that hard to believe that you know, a guy like that has uh spent just as much time being a great father, and that is what he is. He's all about family. Certainly, I'm blessed to have four wonderful children. The three daughters that have done so well, and my son will get to hopefully all spend time together. I'll get to spend a little time with my father and then I'll get

to spend some time with my kids. And Uh, I joke a little bit that I'm that guy. I've got the real famous father that I've known forever. So I got his suitcase in my left hand. And little did I know, though i'd have a son, that they were gonna walk right by me in Hyland Park and ask for his autographs. So I've got and I never thought I'd love ever minute of it. So it's great, uh being a father, and then obviously being so fortunate to have a father, and even further than that, two wonderful

grandfathers that my father loved. H two had such a special influence on my life, both my grandfathers as well as my father's. So it's a it's a great day. Uh. I wish all fathers out there a happy Father's Day, and the only advice I give is, you can't ever spend enough time with your kids, so love them and squeeze them and enjoy the day. We enjoyed the time that you gave us today. We appreciate you coming home.

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When you crave a Doctor Pepper, nothing else will do. Grab an ice cold twenty ounce of doctor Pepper today, Doctor Pepper, the one you crave back to hang in with the boys. We're back on hanging with the boys. Gonna be harder hard to follow that up. You can do it. We know you can't. We can try. We kind of glossed over this because we were trying to get to Stevens so fast because he only had ten minutes to spend with us. I think we actually held

him longer than that. But uh, Rob Phillips, the great Rob Phillips, I don't believe if you ever been on this show. I used to co host the show and it was called something else. Yeah, not hanging with the Balls. Well you hadn't been on since we changed the format. Huh, I don't think so. No, But Nate, Nate's got it covered. You know. Well, we appreciate you filling him for him. Thanks, of course, thanks for coming on. Thanks so good to you do. Look, of course, you know we asked him.

We were asked him last minute. Hey, you know, Steven's gonna we are actually gonna cancel the show today because Nate was gone. We were like, hey, we all got a lot going on, and Kurt, don't you have a website to build or something something like that. Yeah, something's been working on that a little bit. And uh, Kurt was so great of getting Steven on. He was like, hey, we've we've got Steven. We warned him, like, well, hell yeah, let's go. Man, what time let's do it? So ran

over and asked Rob. I said, hey, we need a third We're having the show today. Steven's on. So he goes and changes, goes home and drives all the way across Dallas change his clothes just for us, just for Steven for it, leaves us hanging in. Yeah this these get up. Yeah, y'all look terrible. That's that's okay. Problems No, no, no, I got I got TV just outside, which I don't know why they told me to wear a sport coat. I guess I'd look so terrible when you're not you're

not hot enough out there? Apparently apparently not. Apparently. No, we appreciate. We know you're busy, so thank you for coming home anytime. What are you working on? What are you working on these days? Ah? Well, we're doing some Deep Blue documentaries that will come out. Kurt's working on some as well. Can we talk about any of those? What the subject? I'm actually going to interview Cliff Harris today for nice several several documentaries. And you just interviewed

a couple of people, right. Um. We interviewed Calvin Hill yesterday and We've had a few others down the road, So yeah, we've got kind of got four or five we're kind of in the works here that I'm helping out with. What can we talk about what they are? Uh, we're working on one about Dwayne Thomas, who was the kind of mercurial running back in seventy seventy one, fascinating individual, um doing stuffing on Tony Dorset. Obviously everybody knows his

Hall of Fame career. One of my favorites. Growing Yeah, yeah, it's him in my bedroom many many times, knocking pillows down and yeah, crossing the end zone, yeah, the scoreroom. Yeah, it's he's interesting and that's why we're doing the stories that in our generation he was the man. You know, he was second and rushing i think when retired, but today he's sort of an afterthought. He's yeah, I mean, it's all in it, and so we're helping to kind of tell his story. And then um Percy Harward. It's

one I've talked about before. I've been beating people down with for I don't know how many years. We're fighting getting that one going, and uh, what else we got going on? I think Bob Bliley we're gonna work on one on on that so we got several from Crawford. Tyron Crawford is should be an unbelievable one from what I've heard that the interviews that have been conducted. So that's also going on. I'm not involved with that one. So it's fun though. It's I think Rob can say

the same thing. It's fun talking to these guys and putting these stories together. Yeah, we're working on Bill Parcels and the oh three season, his first season in Dallas, shaking things up, bringing some Jersey down to Texas and changing the whole culture around here. Was that the Quincy year? It was Quincy the next year? Quincy was a third year guy at that point. But when did they cut him at camp with the next summer four? Yeah? Oh

three was his best season. You know, Bill kind of molded him and he was pretty efficient that year, and you know that was That's part of the story, is the talent level that they had was not very good. It was it was bad actually overall on paper, they didn't do Campo any favors. No, No, the cupboard was pretty bare and uh yeah, just the culture change and obviously he was gold when he was here. Those thirty minute press conferences were musty television, the opposite of what

we have now. I like Jason Garretts press conference, I really do. But I mean there's a real those are carried live because of Bill Parcels. Really he started people don't realize and are y'all tell him that you may be outlining this in the documentary, but he changed a lot of things that carried over through this, like shutting down practice except for certain times and things like that. That is that a lot of that going into this documentary. Yeah,

I mean there's still things that still. I mean, Stephen Jones was just here and every now and then I'll hear him give a Parcels is m you know in an interview two sides of that pancake or something like that. You know, his impact is still here and he really he set up the Cowboys forced success with some of the guys he found. Obviously went in Romo, but you

know they didn't get to the super Bowl. But but the culture change and the path they got on the right path when he was here, I've always wondered my favorite part of the Garrett press conference is actually the walk off after where it's off came. He kind of talks to the reporters and it's a little a little more relaxed and um, you know you can learn some kind of background stuff. But what was Purcell's But did he do that same type of thing? And what were

they like? I can't remember if he had walk offs or not. I don't I don't think he did very all the time. Yea. The best thing about Bill was he would go he would go on a topic. It could be horse racing, it could be anything, and you could find some kind of tie in either to your life or to football. But there was also some genius behind that because maybe, as Jock Taylor told me, maybe the locker room opens fifteen minutes late and you got

less time to bother his players. You know, he kind of wanted to be he wanted to be the Yeah, he was a genius at a kind of you know, playing the media at times, selling a story he wanted to sell and uh and really being the only disseminator of information. Don't talk to my assistants, don't talk to the trainers. You come to me and I'll tell you if I feel like it, I'll tell you what's up with injuries? Or whatever. So have you interviewed him yet for that? Yeah? Yeah, Kent and uh and Scott Purcell

and I down there last month doing well. He's seventy five. He raises horses, now, that's what race horses are raising him, I know. But he the race horses or you know, I think I think so. I think so he's big into horse racing, right, Oh, he loves it. He loves it. Um. So, yeah, he's doing he's doing well. He's tan, he's looking good golf. I think he was on his way to play some golf after has he has he mellowed and chilled out and he's or the same life. He was great. Yeah,

he was great. Now he he might have scared me a couple of times when I was twenty two, just you know, right out of college coming here trying to cover the great pill barcelves. But yeah, he's it was it was. We really enjoyed. I think it's gonna be a lot of fun. But it's like our interview with Mike Ditko. We went down to Florida inter the same thing. It was just kind of intimidating, scary presence, but he was a great guy. He's got interview you got a

couple of fun stories. Yeah, fun story. I don't know if we should share here. Just the process of yeah, getting there was interesting for sure. O So Rob, Yes, sir. Since we're not really familiar with you, it could be taken several different ways. I thought we were no, we are, but on the show we're not. Yeah, you know, so

what do you? We talk about it all the time, what we're most excited to see going into camp, and we talked about on this show a lot how this might be the most exciting camp we've had in a long time, maybe ever. With all the coaching changes, the whole secondary pretty much is new, with the you know exception of probably Jeff Heath and Byron, and Byron's only been here what four years, switching positions. You've got you know, the offensive line had some hiccups last year with injuries

and stuff. They tried to shore that up. You got Dak that came off of a crazy successful, you know, rookie year, a great kind of undercover sophomore year where some people think he didn't have a great year, but on paper he did. You got Zeke back hopefully for a full year. All this, all these backstories and crazy stuff. What are you what's the one thing going into camp that one or two things that you're like, this is what I'm going to camp, and I would want to

see every single day. I think I asked Stephen about it. To me, the wide receiver position is fascinating to me, and it's I liken it a little bit to two thousand and nine when I was here covering. That was Wade's team and they had cut t O a couple months prior to camp, and they really didn't have a number one receiver. That's the last time I can think of a Cowboys offense that didn't have like a go to guy. You know, you didn't have t O, but you at least, I guess then you at least had

Jason Witten in his prime and somebody stepped up. Miles Austin stepped up that year and became a Pro Bowl guy, kind of out of nowhere. That's him, Thanks Doun, classic

Miles SoundBite. He's a great guy. So there's there's the expectations around this team are are really interesting because I think maybe some of the media don't think they're gonna be a playoff team, may not be close to the playoff team because of all the youth and because of some questions they have, particularly on offense putting guys around Dak. I mean, you've got nine total catches at the tight end position career and it's all Jeff Swain and so

who's gonna step up? You know? But there's there is talent at wide receiver and I throw table on Austin and that mix two even though you might call him a running back. The question though, is do they need a number one guy? And you do have to have somebody I think step up and at least draw attention, draw double teams, something to get Cole Beasley a break that might have scared you a little bit. Yeah, some mighty scare you a little bit on the other side,

I think. So, I think that's his It's a great opportunity for him to step in and say, hey, you can, you can be the guy on this offense. And the only thing really holding him back is ben injuries in Jackson. Yeah, so I think that's the hope. I think Michael Gallops the guy to watch, you know, Terrence Williams and Cole like, we know who they are, who they can be for

this offense. Um, but Gallup's interesting to me. You watch him out at practice and he's an explosive young guy, So so he might be a guy that competes for time. I think it's I mean, we said this last week that there's like eleven wide receivers on the roster, and Beasley and Williams are the only ones that have any kind of service time with the team. Everybody else, I think Noah Brown and Lenore have been here one year. Everybody else's brand new. It's weird, isn't it crazy? Yeah?

And so like for continuity for Dak, it's not. It's not ideal, I guess, but you know, they decided to move on without Dez. I think that they made that clear and they think they can do this by committee. And the thing to remember is you got you got twenty one on the field, and if you got him for sixteen games, that's a nice guy to lean on in your running game. And you just have to have some reliable receivers. The thing that it cites me the

most about this offense is the offensive line. Connor Williams pick I loved it. I think, hands down, yeah, awesome. He's looking good out there. I think from a he's athletic, he's physical. If he can stabilize this line, I think they can get back to being what they were. You know, people talk about twenty sixteen, but you know the first half of last year they were really good, putting a close to thirty points. Where are they going to put him?

Where's he playing? He's probably your left guard? Now? Is there any concern with the whole Martin situation? And I don't think so. I guess we didn't get to that with Stephen, but he talked about a couple of days ago, like, No, that's just part of the process, part of the deal. I mean the fact that he's been here working out, just not practicing. Obviously he's still been around a little bit. I just and I wanted to ask Steven. I just

questioned spending that much money on another guard. I mean the salary's the top guards are getting now is I'm not sure anybody ever saw that coming. Yeah, and now, if you already got a pretty high priced offensive line, you've got a quarterback you got to sign soon, you got potential defensive and you got to sign soon. Man, do you want to throw more money at the offensive line, especially when you just drafted a guy that looks like he could be, yeah, pretty solid guard. I would throw

more money at Zach because I think he might. He's to me, he's he's your best player pound for pound, and I might put Zeke right up there. But on the whole team. Yeah, I mean he's. I mean he's you could argue he's the best offensive lineman in football just pound for pound what he does, maybe at least the interior lineman. Um. He just doesn't make mistakes out there, and he's kind of he's a leader in his own way,

the way he goes about things. Really, all those guys are, so I would pay him, But Kurt, I was gonna ask Steven that same thing, like you've you've got a budget for some things coming up. Yeah, you know, like you said potentially to Marcus Lawrence, dak is eligible for a deal after next year. What's he going to command? I mean, those are questions, But damn if I would have known you were going to ask that, I would have not asked my Father's day question. I am not

a positive. You know that's good. So who's your topical it's two weeks away. Who's your who's your who's your starting five coming out of training camp on the offensive line. Offensive line, I mean, I think you've got the three Pro Bowl guys tying Travis Zach. I think having Connor Williams drafted as your left guard, Kurt, I mean, I think that that makes it easy to keep Lyel where he is. Yeah, Nate was talking about this last week. You got to put him in there and just let

him go. There's no let's try this guy here, let's do this, let's move it. Put Connor Williams in there and go. And I didn't. I didn't get out to practice yesterday. Did they have him working with the first team munity? He's been at well, did I know he was the first first ota. Yeah, he's been at left guard, and they've got, you know, just the flexibility they have now with Cameron Fleming, who's played in the Super Bowl, by the way, to be a swing tackle for you.

Chaz Green has been working at guard, at right guard, that's what it is, right guard. With Zach being out, I don't know where you play him, but they've added some depth there and because look, that was arguably the biggest issue they had last year. What happens if something happens to Tyrn Smith, DAC needs to be protected a little bit more, a little bit What made you think

that that Atlantic game? Atlantic game? The rest of the season all or nothing kind of reconfirmed that Nat Snate is convinced that that Atlanta game, Dak changed like he he changed. He I believe that. Look at the first

eight games the last eighty, well his production changed. What does he mean, like like PTSD type number of sacks, and I mean it was yeah, just mentally mentally it affected him somehow in his game where you know, you take a beating like that and he just thinks that that that that kind of changes the dynamic at the quarterback position. Maybe the ball comes out a little quicker. Yeah, yeah, I mean I've I haven't seen something like that in years from the press box, I mean literally every time

in college. God, he was running, Yeah, he was running for his life for sure. I think they found a way some contingencies to fix that. Yeah, and you know it also didn't help having Zeke out as well. Yeah that's true. But so back to the wide receiver position. Since they have so much depth now and they've gone out and gotten they continue to add guys to get in the mix for for you know, whether it's camp bodies, whether it's really to compete, whatever. I mean, you've got

some you know. I don't think there's a clear cut number one. I think they hope Hearns is that guy. But everybody else is in the conversation. I don't think anybody's safe on this roster. I could see any six or seven guys making this team and not be surprised if any of them don't. What are your opinions on, you know, the bad decision Terrence Williams obviously made. Can't ride a scooter? For I can't believe he can't ride

a scooter. Just put that in the garage. He rides a scooter about the advising him on his pr didn't do that. That had to that that scooters broken, Just get rid of it, get you a new one. But maybe it's operating error since we've seen him. Man, No, no, something was wrong seconds down all with that scooter. Man, something's wrong with that scooter. Is there any do you guys think that there's any You know, we probably could ask Stephen this as well. Is he in danger of

not making this team? Were you listening? I kind of asked that, didn't I kind of you did actually listening. No, yeah, but what do you guys think? We one, he's coming off kind of a down year, didn't score a touchdown, his yardage was I think the lowis has ever been. He's hurt. He's gonna miss the higher ots, mini camp.

I'm not sure when he's suspected back for a training camp and then I don't think, yeah, I would think camp is probably Now he's got this, which you know on a one off isn't really maybe that big a deal. But I mean, there's he's had a couple other little stupid incidents, nothing where he faced legal trouble, but it was just kind of silly stuff. You have to kind of wonder, I mean, is this a guy you kind

of know what you've gott in him already? Is he worth whatever other troubles that may come up or whatever other injury difficulties he's facing. I don't, like you said, there's so many other guys on the roster, and like Stephen said, there's gonna be competition, I wouldn't. I wouldn't say he's guaranteed at all. I think his experience is important because if you take him away from this roster it's Cole Beasley and that's it. Like from last year,

It's incredible, that's unreal. How much it would you can you kind of guy like I mean, Hearns obviously doesn't have experience here, but he has into the NFL. Does that count for anything? Absolutely right now? And you know, picturing Terrence healthy for training camp, I would put him in Alan Herns right now as your starters to start out, with Cole being kind of that another starter in the slot.

But Michael Gallup is gonna you mentioned competition. I think he's gonna push for playing time right off the bat, and I just I wouldn't think something like this though, is going to threaten his his spot. I know people have talked about, well, the NFL could come in and who knows, maybe they issue some type of punishment because we've seen that happen outside of whatever happens legally, and then you know, guaranteed money not necessarily being you could

avoid that if he's suspending all that. I think his experience is important and I would keep him on this roster certainly entering training camp and then see how the competition shakes out. But to me, letting him go, the idea of that, like man turning over your entire receiving corps. I don't know, but I think he'd have to fall on his face to let in training camp and then thank you kind of together. Whoa who did you see on the air live? Oh yeah, oh my goodness, that

was one of many I thinks. But now it's the internet us here in this room. Hopefully he comes back more motivated and has something to prove and yeah, recognizes where he's what he's gonna do. But it's amazing even without Dez here, It's like, how many receivers can you have? Like how how much can the ball get spread around? Especially with Tavon Austin, Like it sounds like they've got a a role defined in mind for him, maybe as a running back, maybe as a wide receiver, probably both.

Do you see him as kind of a Lance Dunbar type guy in this in this on this team, totally mismatch guy, move him around all over the formation? I asked Scott Lanahan a couple of weeks ago. He said, Yeah, we look at him as a receiver first, but that doesn't mean you can't use him in the backfield. Yeah, they list him as a running back. Yeah, Cross, I mean, I think he had sixty carries last year for the Rams.

So find a way to stretch the defense vertically horizontally and maybe that opens up some things for other guys. Have they been using cole um and OTAs that whenever you guys have been able to watch practice, have they been using him any different? Or they moving him outside or is he still strictly inside? Like what are they doing with him? Yeah, Brian wrote about there yesterday outside a little bit. D try to try to free him from that bracket coverage, you know, where they just clogs

the middle of the field and takes him out. It's so important that get him going, I think because two years ago he was he was Dak's safety. But yeah, yeah, oh god. What'd you think of the album? You know, the autobiography? Not terrible? Yeah, I agree, not bad. I mean I don't think it was great. But for his first, you know, his first project, and and for it to be kind of you know, produced here locally and all that, I thought it was. I thought it was pretty good, man,

not gonna lie. I think it was pretty solid. What do you think I like? I mean, I'm not proficient in the rap game. I'm more nineties rap, you know, and I'm getting old, but I enjoyed it. Kurt. Yeah, I'm kind of along with you. What I've heard I liked. Again, I all Kurt has heard is I've heard. I've heard one other. Uh yeah, my eighty stings. My rap rap games not up to rap games. Pretty thin, you'd say,

my level of knowledge. What's your opinion on that, man, we kind of talked about it, but just having a side gig outside of football, that's you know, fans think football players you shouldn't be doing that, you should be playing. Well, they do have months off at a time. They do have free time. It's not like they go they wake up, they come straight to the facility, they work out, they watch tape till ten o'clock or eleven o'clock and then

they go straight. They have downtime. They have families, they have hobbies, they they're they're normal people. Just because they're on lockdown about seven or eight months out of the year with football doesn't mean they can't do other things. I have no problem with it. What do you think does that distract him? Is that? What do you what

are your opinion? It drives me crazy that people feel that way, like absolutely drives me crazy, Like and it goes back to the best example I could think of as Tony Romo playing golf, Like, yeah, people got so mad about that because he would go off and play around in February, Like, what the hell's he supposed to do? He was a single guy. You know, I guess you're supposed to watch film and slip like a pizza box underneath the door or something. You know, not everybody is

Sean Lee. Not everybody might be that literally, you know what. You know what I read and I don't I think it was on our website. It might have been one of your articles of Dave's. They were talking to Sean Lee about the young guys and vander ash and what he thought, and Sean Lee, He's like, watch, I watched film on him to know what kind of player he was and read a little bit about who does that.

This guy's a rookie come in. Sean Lees in the league for what eight nine years and he's watching film on the rookies that are coming in to know who he's playing with. I mean, that's unreal. And that's how you intimidate a rookie right there. Yeah, I've watched film, you know, in that uh, that game against you know Marshall, you really blew it on that third and one, Like what you screwed up your keys there? Dude, I don't know, man, I he's a genius. He's a Machine's amazing, He's a machine.

He'll be a coach as soon as he steps off the field or whatever. Hell, he already is a coach. He's a coach on the field for sure. So well, let's take one more break before we uh, before we end the show, and I want to get your thoughts. We're talking about linebacker Jalen Smiths had some some not surprising some some comments, you know, the last few days, the last couple of OTAs. Get your thoughts on that.

We talked a little bit about tight end situation. I shouldn't want to get youall thoughts on you know, what do you think going into camp? That seems to be like a kind of a coin toss all the way around there. And then we'll talk about other stuff when we come back on Hanglo Boy Cowboys fans know that the second best of anything simply won't cut it, and your skincare should be no different. A long time locker room favorite of the players and the official men's skincare

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back to hanging with the bulls. We are back in in case you're wondering, As Rob said, what was that that again? Doucho sell you are you there, Dougie? So I was like, I'm not simp messed up. I gotta call the show. That was after a trip to the dentist. Was there photo evidence of that? I think I've seen it. Just oh, I have a video down up there. I have a video on my Instagram account that I don't

even remember posting you. I was just like smiling and looking at taking a video selfie, just like, hey, oh yeah, I had a tooth. Lucky you didn't, Zani the or anything speaking of pulland but you got over there, Kurt Holland. Holland, I said, I had a tooth pulled. Speaking of pulling, Weggie's pulling. I don't know what he's talking about. Don't no, just read the damn thing. Adjust your cleats, adjust your pads, even just your helmet. But seriously, don't adjust your underwear

because once it's been seen, it cannot be unseen. Tommy John has contour pouch that nestles the boys and moisture wicking fabric to keep you cooling dry on the field or in the stands. I've got mine on today. I bet Rob does. Rob looks so good always always two of my favorite words, nestles and moisture. I love so strong at the balls And you went, you just change your whole wardrobe too, I did. I changed out. Yeah, I changed. Yeah, I swapped all my drawers. Nice swapping drawers.

All right, get yours swapping drawers at Cowboys Underwear at Tommy john dot com Forward Slash Cowboys for twenty percent off your first order Tommy john dot com Forward Slash Cowboys. WHOA, there you go. Paul's coming back this year. Yes, she said he's bringing friends too, rights Paul. Yeah, Scottish Paul. He's coming to Uh, He's going to the Texans game and then he's coming to I think the Titans game is the week after. He's staying for a week, so he's gonna try to catch two games, one one in

Houston and one here. So probably have him back on the show when Yes prepared. So let's talk about a few things. First off, what's going on at tight end? Who is there a front runner going into training camp or whoa, and what's up with that guy? Zeus? What are you thinking? I want to see more out of Jeff Swain, not only because he's a friend of the show and he'll come on any time we ask him. But he's a good dude and we met his folks. Yeah, really nice people. Yep. But he's a good player too.

He's a good player, and I think they underutilize him. He's you know when they when they called his number, he's been there. He's a good I think he's a good blocker. I think he's a better pass catcher and

route runner than than people think. Um. But you know, this team's kind of or at least the fans have been in love with Rico the last year year and a half after unknown he showed albat But he's kind of one dimensional right now, and he does he need to step up his blocking game to get more playing time. What's going on at tight end? He he almost I think he said yesterday, it's almost like step eight going back to step one at step eight from step eight,

you know, because of all the time he missed. I mean, just think about a guy that was playing in middle school playing football and then he makes the transition and it's going kind of well, and then he sits out a whole another year. So I don't know what the expectations are for him. I know pass catching, he can be effective. We saw him with a couple of touchdowns in preseason. Blocking is probably the biggest thing and the thing about it is in this offense and Jason Wentnen

you talk about it. They asked their tight ends to do so much, to handle so much responsibility in line, all backfield, all those things. Can he pick that up? And to me you mentioned Swam, I think Dalton Schultz, the rookie a real opportunity to step in and be effective right off the bat because he played at Stanford and they're like a factory for tight ends. So think part of that the blocking aspect, especially as mindset. And does Rico have that. I mean, you gotta get in

there due the dirty work any maybe he does. I'm not hit people exactly. What about Jarwin, He's still in the mix. A touchdown yesterday, look good. He's a guy that can, like you mentioned Swam kind of underrated, can separate down the field and get open and make some plays. You know, So there's some athleticism there I just the

Rico thing is just and dynamite drop Doug. But that like, uh, it's fascinating to me because I just I want to see more of him and see if he can get back to where he was last summer, because it was just a shame that he missed all that time. Can you see like Jarwin because they put him on the active roster and towards the end of the last year, so exciting to see what he can do. Think Philly tried to put him on their practice squad and Cowboys made the move. They didn't really have a role for

him back then. They just want to keep him. Can you see them keeping all four tight ends and running more two tight end sets and change or here here's a bigger picture question and it kind of fits into that. I think the one thing that everybody could agree on last year that I talked to casual fans hardcore fans is this team didn't do a very good job of mixing things up. Like when you saw certain formations, you

knew what play they were going to run. When you saw this, you knew this was coming, and they ran it looked like just a basic offense pretty much all year and even people that don't really know football that much that would talk to me. They'd be like, put somebody in motion, Like move one guy from one side to the other. Run you know, some different sets. Can you see? Do you think they go into this season not learning anything from last year and just go ahead,

here we are again, this is what we're doing. Or do you think they'll try to mix it up. I think a little bit that's overrated because I think they tried putting Dez in motion. They moved him around, trying to get him, you know, better opportunities. But yeah, I mean I think you can. I mentioned Cole. You gotta find ways to get him freed up a little bit. That's one example. I think Tavon Austin being here, he's kind of a chess piece. You move him around, find

some different opportunities for him. But that's why I asked Steven about the coaches, because Jerry has spoken of that, like we may need to do some things a little bit different tactically and bring in some guys Paul Exander on the offensive line, new receivers, coach guys that can come up with some new ideas and add to what Jason and Scott are doing Yeah, Kurt, Yeah you got anything? Or do you may move the next up sitting there looking at I mean, I know Rob looks good in

that jacket and talk too much. No, I'm interested in what he was saying. Don't be coming at me. Whoa, whoa. This is like me and Mickey going at it and talking. I love it. Sit world the same side of the table for each other. Jerk Kurt up. I agree with him, Okay, goods confrontation like I wouldn't expect that from Kurt Cood such a nice guy, good answer feeling. Kurt's like a black belt in Mma. Kurt. He's just calm and just waiting for an excuse to do something. You ought to

see our controlled rage. You ought to see our director meetings. When we're in the room, I'll say hell, come at Kurt and he'll boy, he'll snap at me, and I love it pretty awesome. But we have a hate hate relationship, so a lot of you. I love you too, Man livebacker position uh Jalen Smith came out and said that he's like three points something percent body fat, He's gained

like ten ten fifteen pounds and muscle. He's running a shuttle time that if he was if it was at the Combine this year, I think he would be third overall out of all players, not just at his position. So it sounds like physically he's getting to or where he needs to be. How do you think that's gonna translate?

From what you know? Everybody looks good without pads one, How do you do you think he's gonna make it a bigger step this year and be the player they thought they drafted when they took a chance on him. They are very confident of that. I mean, we got to see it right and and some of what you know, he had some struggles last year, but some of it was just asking him to play that many snaps. I think he played almost seventy snaps one game or something

like that used him or whatever. Yeah, some of it is just being comfortable in the scheme in addition to trying to move better. And we asked him yesterday where's your brace that he's been wearing because he had the drop foot last year, and said, I don't know where it is. So that's good, right to not know where that thing is because he doesn't need it, he says, right now, as long as he didn't walk off limping. Yeah, yeah, and I think there's signs out there that he's moving around.

But where does he fit in in this because obviously he seems like the pass rusher on the move, almost like a Sean Lee position, But you're not gonna move Sean right and can't he handle the strong side? I mean, yes, he fit in well. They've had him at middle right now with vander Esh, I think working second team, And you said it, I mean he can be a guy moving forward for you as a nickel rusher. The Sam spot just gets less overall snaps. It just depends on

what they do in the nickel. With two linebackers, who's it gonna be. He's gonna be Vanderesh and Sean. Could Jalen work in? I think you can find snaps for all three guys. And obviously you need depth because guys get hurt. Sean has gotten hurt in the pass and so you need depth. But I think Vanderesh also fits that middle linebacker spot because he's a big linebacker who can move. What about Damien Wilson, He's still in the mix there. Sure that's another guy. Brian mentioned him on

our show the other day. Just don't forget about him. He's a guy that's handled the sam spot athletic, physical linebacker. So I think it hurts losing Hitchins for sure, but I think they feel a little bit better about it. But Jalen's the wildcard because you know, he was at his best last year when he was playing twenty thirty snaps. Maybe that jumps up to thirty forty fifty, you know, maybe maybe continue that way. Man, something that should be

scary for other teams. If you keep Shawn Lee healthy, which if you have other options at the linebacker spot, you keep him off the field a little bit more. That gives him a better shot of being healthy. Vander esh if he's the guy they fell in love with and turns into what they hope he does. Jalen plays it eighty five percent of what he was at Notre Dame. You got a solid, solid linebacker. I mean, that's a

that's a top five linebacking crew in the NFL. If those guys paying out like they're they're going to, I mean, like like you hope they do. So what uh what about defensive line? What are you see out there on the b lines? Our guy Charles Tappers, Yeah, Malik's outlist, Taper Tappers out, David Irving not practicing. I don't under explain David Irving to me, explain it? Why, how does

this happen? Well, that's what the offseason programs for. I guess I don't know when you show up apparently, yeah, right, so he needs to get his conditioning up. Yeah, but don't know he's he's working out on the side. He's not practicing with the team because the staff is determined he's not even good enough shape, right, which is mind boggling.

And he's been a guy where his weight is fluctuated where he can play tackle for you, he can play in for you, but if you yeah, he's gonna have to lose some if he's gonna play defensive end for them in this spot. I'll tell you what. All he's got. All he has to do is stand out there for about two hours a day. He doesn't he have to move. For those of you that don't know, he may need to lose it. Yeah, you're gonna play tackle for you too,

which probably that's where he played primary last year. Right, It's supposed to be one hundred and two degrees here this weekend, so just to let start. Let's go here. I'm glad you asked about days. Can we push that up by like a month, Let's just get Yeah, let's get there in June. Yeah, next week, let's go. Let's do that. No, as long as you don't have to stay though in August. Yeah, yeah, start paying taxes. Do

I know anything else about Tapper's concussion? Like I heard Jason Garrett say that that's what happened in his press conference, But Rob, did you guys find out anything further about how it happened? I don't. I don't know exactly how it happened. Obviously it was an accident, Um, I don't. It doesn't sound like he's anything too serious. Fortunately, no foul play involved. No, they're in short some T shirts they do, especially on the line they're they're banking, banging

each other around. Things can happen. Yeah, you can end up banging heads. It happens. Yeah, but it's it's unfortunate for him because it's like, now you draft Doran's Armstrong, who they like. That's Nate's pet cat. He likes him, Yeah, said he hadn't even really seen him practice. He's like when I just looked at him and like he's like, I'm watching him all a camp. That's my guy. Who's your guy? Who's your camp guy? So Nate, I mean, Nick is kind of enamored right now. You can probably

figure out why. With with Katie Cannon. He thinks he's got a solid shot of making his team Baylor Homer, Baylor Arkansas. You know Nick's gonna be like he's making the team. Nick's I mean, Nate's pet cat is uh, Doran's armstrong? Who's your who's your pet cat? Um? Maybe like an underrated guy like Connor Williams isn't a good pick,

right because no, because yeah that's too obvious. I like Mike White competing with Connor Rush Cooper Rush sorry for the backup spot at quarter broad Us really likes him. Dennie Big Yeah, just a big quarterback. Poise can spin it man. He threw a dime to Gallop I think last week over the shoulder down the sidelines, like wow, it's you know. And the thing I like about him is he really his touchdown interception ratio in college was really really good. Like he's smart with the ball, young

quarterback that doesn't make mistakes. So if you're gonna be the backup, which he's got to win that job over Cooper. You gotta be able to be efficient to be a bus driver, so he but you gotta watch what about you? Who?

Who's your pet cat? Going into camp? Well, part selfishly, I had a chance to do a story on cam Kelly and really engaged kid, really liked him, and I'm interested to see how he fits in with the kind of player in the kind of kind of scheme to CHRISTI Shard is building here and so I'm interested to see how he does. He's got a great story too, coming back from injury. And yeah, yeah, did you see

the picture of that. I tried to avoid it. Someone tried to show me and I will refuse to look at Okay to go, well, we have I believe one more pet cat. We didn't say, Oh yeah, Shannon, my pet cat, man, I don't even know. That's a great question. Some homework for you. Yeah, that's some homework I have to let you know on Monday. Speaking of Monday, I believe that's our last show until we go to camp. Whoa, no, no,

I think we got two more. We got two Monday and then because mini camps the next week, I think we got one more. I thought we had two more. Well, anyway, we're coming to an end here and get a little break and then we uh we go daily once we get out to camp. What have you decided when you're coming yet? None of the exact dates, but I think it'll be the first week or two. Better stay for

two Straighten this out for crying out loud. You tell her to talk to Nate because he's gonna disown you, kick your ass one if you don't come out there for more than two days. Which on the show the Internet, it's the Internet. It's not a family show. Rob By the way, Rob is an alumnus of this show. Uh, he said that earlier. I didn't say that. Star man. It's okay. Hey, you don't listen to Rob. I don't listen to Kurt. We got a dysfunctional family. Yes, it's

my attention span comes and goes. Well, Kurt, thanks for showing up, Rob, Thank you so much for filling in for Nate. Steven Jones, thank you for joining us for a little bit and giving us some of your valuable time. Douglas, thanks for doing what you do. Kent, thanks for pushing buttons and everyone in the studio that makes this show happen.

We appreciate it. We will be back on Monday at our normal time, I guess eleven o'clock on Hanging with the Bus has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.