Hangin' with the 'Boys: Analytics, Picks & More

Christmas Looney, and Christmas Nate. What is Nate doing? Nate has a has an engagement. We have about forty five guests from American Airlines, American Airlines employees in the building, and they went on a tour and then they went to Ford Center and some of the practice suites over there and got to watch practice and got to eat lunch, and then got to hang out with Nate for a

couple hours. So he's over there entertaining and talking football and answering questions and yeah, just hanging out and sold us out today, brought us sold us out today. He had big plans, but you're stuck with me and Kurt. But hearing about probably twenty minutes ish. Ten minutes, Yeah, we're ten minutes. We're gonna have Tom Robinson on. We don't really know what his title is, but we do

know I like Douglas's title for him. What was that, Douglas? Hey, hey, Mick Wizard, I know we don't have anybody today, come on here if you want. Ye see, nobody wants to hang out with us with MAT's not here. So Tom will be in and a football analytics guy. And I'm actually really interested because I know I've known Tom for a long time. He actually started out I believe, over in DCM and it whenever I was I think, I think so, I think that's where I know him from.

So he's been around for a while. And then he now runs the whole analytics operation for the team, and I'm interested to see like what they're able to track and what they're doing with that information, and how are they sharing it across the league or how all that stuff works out. So it's pretty pretty top secret info, some of that stuff, I bet it is. I'm wondering how much he's gonna be able to tell us. That's gonna be really interesting. I feel kind of bad because

I've I've seen. I had never placed the name. I don't know Tom very, I don't know him at all, so if he walks in here, you don't well see, I think I figured out. I've seen this guy walking around who I didn't know who was, and I've heard the name Tom, and I think I finally put the name with the face and so um tall skinny guy. Yeah, yeah, I actually walked by him yesterday and oh he was with Chris and I looked at him. I think I think that's Tom. But I'm looking forward to hearing the

story there. Yeah, so cool. So we will have him here in a little bit. In the meantime, we need your help because we have no poss we have no Nate. It's just me and Kurt and we're not that interesting. So we need your phone calls. So we already have one phone caller already. Welcome to the show, good friend of the show. By the way, Jay and Rhode, I yes, Hey,

what's the fellas. I am so glad that I got through today because I wanted to wish you personally a very merry Christmas, and I want to thank you for all the love guys have shown me over the past couple of years. Well, thank you, Jay, thank you for calling in. We're glad you got through too, man, MS pans you got big Christmas plans? Uh No, not really eat me either, Jay. I'm just gonna sit on my

couch and play video games all day. I'm gonna order I'm gonna order a big pizza the night before, eat half of it, and save half of it for Christmas Day because nothing's open. Yeah, you know, I accuse my friends very carefully, and you know, you know, I have a small family, so you know, I told my mother, you know, yeah, yeah, go go with your friends. You know, I have big plans. She doesn't listen to the show. She doesn't even know how to use Twitter, so it

doesn't matter. She won't hear this. You know. Yeah, my everything's pool don't worry about it, you know. Yeah, you know, keep a brave face. But you know what, guys, everything's gonna be pooled this week. Last week, I'm gonna be honest, I didn't even try to get through last week because I don't know, I just had a bad feeling about the game. I didn't have a good gut feeling, you know. But this week I have a good gut feeling We're gonna take care of business this week. We're gonna win

the divisions because I noticed details. And at the end of that game last week, what I noticed is when we lost and the player started shaking hands, there was no smiling. Everybody looked like they were ready to kill somebody. Everybody was mad. Okay, as opposed to other teams they lose a game. Yeah, yeah, they're all smiling this, that and the other. You know, you know how they do up with powboys. Unless I miss something, they weren't smiling. Okay.

I like that DeMarcus Lawrence's quote. They got hit in the mouth, they're ready to hit the opponent in the mouth. Now, Well, that's what you know. That's what toughness is. Toughness is not defined by how much of a beating you can this show. Toughness is defined by how much of a beating you can take and if you can bounce back up off the mat when it happens, whether the ball or life. Okay, we're gonna take care of business this week. I have my good gut feeling. I just know that

it's coming. And there's also a very special girl coming to the scheme. Her name is Lowa. You know who Loa is. We do not, of course you don't. It's a rhetorical question. Lola is the law of averages? Now, unless I miss my guess, we haven't scored on defense since last year at Washington. Okay, we are so overdue.

How you know our defense has been strong? How we have not gotten the ball that's been tipped and we've run it into the end zone, or how a fumble just hasn't come our way at the opponent's twenty and we walk in that. You know that that will happen this week. I mean, because dance is good for those and the guys are all business and you know Dak, you know, we're all you know, he's a guy with a lot of fortitude, you know. And last week the game and just it just it's just there's no such

thing as a good loss. But it does help you to refocus, especially if he played the game. You know, you do get a little copy because it's happened to me, you know. But everything's gonna be fine this week. Guys. I don't want to take up all your time. You already did, Jay, he took up We gotta go. The podcast is over all, right, I love you guys, brother Christmas love you too. Man. Thanks for calling. We win this week. I will call up next week and sing

amri the right way? All right, all right, I hold you to it. All right, Jay, have a good one. You worried about this game, Kirk? You know, I guess it shouldn't be because seven and a half point spread? Is it? Seven? I thought it was higher than that. Um. Yeah, they're big favorites. And that bothers me, does it? Because I think it's gonna be a closer game than than seven and a half. Yeah, that Tampa's defense is just

so bad. I guess my worry is if if we have to outscore them, you know, if we if we have to put up thirty points too, right, you know, can you keep up? They get it if they get a lead on you, you know, they they're I think we talked yesterday about it. They put up a lot of points even in losses, but they haven't the last two games. They faced New Orleans and Baltimore. Both teams have pretty good defenses, and they didn't do much against them.

So hopefully that continues and our defense steps up and takes care of business. Yeah, Chris and Connecticut. What's up, buddy, Hey guys, how you doing great? How are you? I'm doing pretty well. I want to wish you guys are very merry Christmas, Happy New Years and all that kind of jazz. Yes, Sarah, you too. Hey. Um, I guess I was first of all I wanted to say the other day I called in and made the comment about it's not rocket science, and I didn't want to implay

it's not a complicated game. I just meant, not rocket science. You should use zeke. That's it. No point, hey, point was well taken. Nate talked about that for two days after that. He was like, man, that dude just just simple, just like simplified everything. It's not that hard. So hey, give it a try, right, that's right, that's right. Hey, Hey, I guess my question I had a question for you guys.

I mean, um, you know, my worst nightmare, even before the Indidiapolis scheme, is thinking that we're gonna have to go into New York or they're gonna have to go into New York and win it to get in. And uh, I'm a little nervous about the defensive performance, you know, starting in the fourth quarter against Philly, it's been five really bad quarters. Do you think there's something there or or or was just a complete they were due to just due to have a bad game. I personally think

they just got the crap beat out of them. They got they got overmatched. There's it's just like boxing or UFC. Sometimes you just sometimes it's a bad matchup for your team. And I think Indie was just a terrible matchup, especially with the injuries they have. They I think they just got it was just a butt kicking. Yeah, I don't. I think the intensity just wasn't quite there. They were riding that five game streak and Indie's backs against the wall. They've got to win and get in for sure, we

kind of had a game to play with. And yeah, I just don't think they matched intensity, especially, I mean the first half was closed, but when Colts came out and over right down the field to open the third up, it was done. Yeah. And you know, if I know anything about who is this? Who is this? Rod Marinelli? Who is this? This is Taylor Stern. Taylor Stern, Welcome to the show. Welcome, How are you guys for having me?

Douglas No applause for Taylor. Wow, I was. I was looking for the tay what drop and I couldn't find. But what the name Chris from Connecticut, Chris from Connecticut. I will let you know that Rod Marinelli is one of the most intense guys on the planet Earth. You know, non bet and I know that he's probably getting the Marinelli Madness video like you have never because they're playing Tampa Bay this weekend. That is the team that he won the Super Bowl. That is his squad that he

knows he has to win again. Tell everyone and Chris what what marion Ellie Madness is For those that don't know, Yes, Marionelli Madness is a video feature that he shows to the team, the defensive guys on Saturday nights before the game. It is graphic, it's insane, it's insane, wild crazy, probably against Peter standards. And yeah, national geographic footage, yeah, it's right, really horrid national geographic footage with Pete with with player

human heads on animals and like things like that. Very Grifins nickname started from that used to have people like he would literally ask for highlights of orphans digging up ditches. Yeah, that was and it's and it's it fires the players up. They love it. It's it's awesome, and he really puts time and energy into it. Works with one of our video editors here to like give feedback and do different things.

So it's it's pretty awesome. One time I watched it with him too, and you'd think that normal people would be laughing and kind of like thinking like, oh, this is crazy. He gets so intense into it. He's like and this is you know, I'm looking at my guy. Um. I don't want to say Antoine Wood's real nick name on here, but yeah, yeah, he's very similar to Nick Hayden's. Yes, if you remember a few years ago. Yeah, So so there you go, Chris, I think he's here. I'm ready.

Thanks for Thanks for that. You're making me feel a little bit better. Their Taylor, do you what do you think is gonna happen Sunday? We're winning? Uh? You know, I'm really nervous for some reason about this game. I don't you know, I really don't know. I can't figure this team out for the life of me. Yeah. Well, I'm really nervous that they're gonna have to go and Washington to New York. I do not want that to happen. Man, that is not a good scenario. So thank you man. Yeah,

us too, Thanks Chris. Alright, man, have a good holiday. Marionelli had a quote yesterday saying that how do you fix this? You practice with the same intensity bring to the game. I wondered if I haven't been out to practice, but I wondered if they Well, I heard that pads. I heard last week they had like a great practice

week and that. But then I know, but then sometimes like that will affect you in the game because you'll be a little bit overconfident instead of the feeling of like I need to really come out and bring it my best, where you're like, god, I've been crushing it this week. If you watch the Amazon All or Nothing the week before the Atlanta game, the old line's just killing it in practice. They're just slaying it. I know we've got Tom coming on here, but yeah, sometimes that

doesn't Are you sticking around or you gotta run? I can stick I can hang around, hang around with Tom. Let's take a quick break and when we come back. We've got Tom Robins. What's your title exactly? Tom, Director of Football Research. We just called you sports football analytics guys. What we did Analytics Wizard, Analytics Wizard. All right, we will be right back and we'll have Tom Robinson on

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thanks for that. Receive you this week? Who was that? Huh? Where's the last one received this week? No? No, I like the biscuit one. Get that bread. We'll just keep it simple. Speaking of getting that bread, tom Welcome to the show man, Hollo. There's our all right, all right, So give us a little bit of background. You've been around, how you've been with the organization. So I've been with the Cowboys dating back to two thousand and I think

tellousand nine. Okay, so you've been around a while. Yeah. So I came on board around the time that m AT and T Stadium it is under construction, okay, And initially worked with the team as a consultant and worked on a number of projects related to the to the opening of the stadium, and then kind of came came on board full time about m after a year into the stadium being open, okay, and then kind of moved into my current role on the football side. I think

this is my fifth season. How did you go from it? Sounded like you were Wait, let's preface the whole conversation. First. We we don't really know what Tom does. We know what he does, but we don't really know how in depth. So we're going to ask him a bunch of questions that we probably shouldn't ask. Yeah, we are, and he's gonna tell us, Hey, no, I can't answer that, or I'm not comfortable answering that, or I'm not telling you. So Tom, you just you keep us at arms linked

where you need to. Don't feel bad about telling us you can't answer before we ask those I'll just say my first impression of Tom where I first felt like, you know, I was like, who is this mystery man? Is really a training camp because you know, you guys have both been out there. You go to training he sits at his little table and it's like it's a special table if you would, because there's no seats or anything around the end zones of training camp fields. And

Tom's got the setup. He's got the laptop of the little tower. Yeah, you know that something important is Happenings are really green today, Thank you Shannon. They really, they're like popping out of your m Thank you Christmas. Eve. What a nice boss he is. That's when I was like, who is Tom? You know what I'm talking about? It's like something is happening there. Well never he looks really important. This guy matters. Yes, all right, Kurt, sorry to stop

you down. Well what was your question? I actually feel bad too, because I've seen Tom around everywhere. I've never actually really met him. I've heard the name, I've seen him. I never this first time I've had a chance to kind of put the name with the face. Kurt, this is Tom. This is Kurt. Apologize for not introducing myself. Look, ye started to come down here with us again, get your headset on there. Have you met Tom before? This is Tom, Tom, this is me. We got one guy

in here him. So how did you get sound like you're basically an it guy? How did you transition into becoming sort of this football analytics really in depth kind of stuff for the for the football department. Sure. Yeah. So my my background kind of both educationally and professionally has always been data in analytics. And so I worked for a number of years as a consultant um kind of working with you know, larger companies Fortune five hundred

and whatnot on business intelligence, analyt kind of data warehousing. Um, excuse me, Uh so, missus Jones not a Fortune five hundred company. He's he's pretty ahead of them. I'm sorry, he's at Fortune five hundred companies, that Fortune five hundred people. Okay, oh yeah, yeah, for real, give me someone that. Yeah.

And so, you know, I got an opportunity to, I guess, work with data see a lot of different business models, and you know, I always had been fascinated by sports and analytics, and you know, passionate football fan wanted to kind of marry the two together and coming on board

with the Cowboys. I felt like I very fortunate to come on board at a good time because football analytics is something that's just starting to take off, and so it wasn't like there's this you know, big, kind of talented, experienced workforce out there that has all this knowledge that that you can draw from. So kind of jumped on an opportun and indeed to kind of move over to football, kind of work on analytics, dive deep into the data

and kind of have been enjoying it ever since. Is it hard to I mean football is kind of a very old school like baseball. Is it hard to convince people to pay attention to these new stats? Football? People probably think math is magic black magic, yes, oh speaking of me, But anyway, yeah, I think as as I've gone through the years, it every year it becomes easier

and easier. I think, you know, are I feel very lucky that, you know, I work for a ownership team and a head coach that that really kind of seek knowledge and kind of want to see what the numbers are telling us about decisions that we're making, you know,

be that um personnel decisions. You know, who were who were kind of pursuing in the draft, you know kind of what we're doing kind of you know, with game management, what kind of what are some of the numbers that you can tell that you're that you guys, you really dive into UM. So I'll try to kind of stay within the bounds of what I've what has already been

said publicly about what we're doing. But you know, one thing that we do and a lot of other clubs are doing, is you know, we closely monitor our player workloads during practice, and so our goals in doing that are what we kind of multiple goals. One is you know, we want the UM you freshest, fastest, kind of most athletic products that we can put on the field on Sundays. And if you look at kind of the character of our team, you know we are going to try to

play fast, We're going to try to play physical. We have players, you know, come to our team from from other you know, professional teams, and they always comment about just the intensity of our practice, and so I think what we're trying to do is keep an eye on that. UM. We want to push our team hard, you know, we want to develop some of those qualities that carry over to Sunday. But we're trying to do so kind of in a in a very kind of practical, controlled sort

of way. So it's kind of within that realm of high performance. You know, how do you uh, you know, kind of keep your foot on the gas but then kind of not overdo it. So are you measuring like distance, run and heart rate? Like what all kind of I don't know how much you can share, but like, what are some things that you guys are like tracking that that you can let us know about. Sure, now I

think you've you've hit on a couple of them. Yeah, So we're looking at you know, distances that players have covered. We're looking at um, some some biometric data, you know, heart rate, heart rates, something we have just kind of started to explore. Um, We're getting into a lot of kind of distances covered at certain velocities, and you know, we want to we want to keep a close eye on kind of that explosive those explosive efforts that players

are going through in practice. Yeah, because those are the efforts that kind of best prepare them for Sunday but also take the most put the most wear and tear on the body. Yeah, how much do you work with the draft process, Like, are you looking at guys that are still in college right now. Obviously you can't go to their practices and do that. But how much are you working to find the right guys during the draft. Yeah, so kind of myself in my department. You know, we

wear a lot of different hats. I fall under our scouting department, and so I kind of look at one of my primary areas of responsibility being the draft. The draft and kind of preparing for it, you know. So

we're gathering as much data as we can. You know, so a lot of stuff people know about, you know, college stats and production and uh, you know, combine and pro day measurements, and you know, we're interviewing players and kind of you know, doing our own draft evaluations, and of course we have our own you know, models that we're putting together to study all this and try to tie it all together. So that surprises me how much

internally you're using the numbers for our own team. I kind of assumed you were charting and tracking other your opponents coming up. I mean, I assume there's some of that involved in there. Oh, that's that's definitely true as well. So do you guys share info with other teams across the league, is there like a you have to give this information to the league wide or you know, the league does a great job of disseminating a common set

of data and information to all the teams about the players. Yeah, so about so like the next gen stats that the league's now putting out, they have a website. I think that you go to that puts that that's something that the league mandates. That is something that's now shared kind of league wide, and that was a big development for us this offseason. We for the first time this year, we're able to see player tracking data for all thirty

two teams and both sides of the ball. So in seasons passed, you know we had player tracking data, we would only see it for our own offense or our own defense. So it makes it hard to do some of the more advanced analysis you want to do. You know, like if you're trying to look at the interaction between a receiver and a defensive back, you know, to try to calculate separation on a route, you know, you can't

do that without both sides of the ball. But we're now getting that and I think over the next several years you're going to see all kinds of new insight I think emerge you know within you know NFL front offices, but also in the public you know. So yeah, I think I see some great work being done on side psyche ESPN. You know, if you look at some of the work of somebody like Brian Burke, you know he's

looking at that the sports science guy. No, No, he's he's more of a data analytics football analytics in particular, but kind of looking at past protection and um, you know, defensive linemen, how they're rushing, and starting to use that player tracking data to quantify some of those those numbers. My question is your workload is more when when do you have the biggest workload throughout the season? Yes, throughout the season, through the whole year, when your draft, offseason,

what you like, what you're what you're big it. I'll say it never really slows down for us. Yes, you know, the NFL is kind of our year round business. And you know, within my group's kind of area of responsibility or areas of responsibility. You know, we're focused on UM scouting, you know, so that's both um you know, pro scouting for free agency and college scouting for the draft. UM. You know, we're also helping our coaches with kind of

advanced work on opponents. Um. You know, in addition, we have a big kind of sports science focus, UM also working with you know, with the sports science piece kind of working with strength and conditioning. So you excited about a facet of what you do. So are you excited about even the smallest pieces? Huh oh for sure? Yeah. I think are you like a numbers nerd completely? Do you just yea, That's what I'm saying. Yeah, he's excited about even the smallest integral parts of it, you know,

as well as the big part. Yeah. Do you think it'll football will ever get to where and this made me think of it when you set a dB going against a wide receiver. Do you think it'll ever get to the point where it gets so analytical that, you know, in the about halfway through the third quarter, this guy gets a little bit more tired by looking at the numbers that they're sharing across the league, and then you

can exploit those matchups. I'm sure there's I don't know if the league would ever because that would almost be a competitive advantage or something. But do you think it'll ever get to where it's that analytical where you can do things like that, you know, I don't know. I

think that's really difficult to say. Like the I think one thing that could play a part in it kind of like you're saying, is just kind of the what the competition committee prefers, because it's it is possible that the league could could make a decision to share kind of real time player tracting data, you know, on during a game, and then at that point, you know, maybe

teams would try to take advantage just some knowledge like that. Yeah, Well as reading something just this week that I thought was interesting just um is in an article and it was kind of throwaway comment, but the article made mention that a team's trying to you know, kind of I guess run more plays on that I guess go towards their own sideline to kind of tire up ye posing

defensive line on substitutions to make them run further. Yeah, what's the staff that you see and guys starring Nate that you see primarily, you know, over and over with really successful athletes like oh, you know, if this guy has you know, this range or whatever begins, Yeah, like you know that that means like they have some ounce

of success aheaded for them. You know, I think we're we're always kind of pursuing value, you know, with I think the way that we think about improving our team, and I'll kind of say, I don't think we want to like marry ourselves to any single metric, but we're trying and to look at a number of different areas.

So we want guys that are big and fast and explosive and Nate Knew smart and instinctive and and come from big programs, you know, like you're your ideal if you could, you know, kind of write it down on paper and say this is exactly what we want. We want guys that have, you know, all these great qualities that they're smart, and they learn things quickly, and they have the right football character. Cooper, Yeah, Cooper's perfect example. Well,

you know, to the numbers thing. I noticed the other night when I was watching the seventy six ers place, somebody it was talking about Joel and Bed and then you know, and just simple numbers sometime because his numbers in the first half are just off the chart versus the second half, and they saying, is it the team around him? Is it that he gets a little fatigued? So whether we do it first, other other uh sports are working on the same thing. Baseball has to come.

So like, what what do you think it's like in baseball get critics of saying it's too too much analytics? Now do you how do you feel about that? Do you think football could risk that kind of thing? Um? I think baseball just the nature of the interaction between a picture and hitter, you can very much kind of isolate that interaction and it lends itself so well to all kinds of analytical work. So I think it's you're almost hurting yourself if you're not, you know, kind of

pursuing analytics heavily. There our sports not there yet, and I'll be the first to admit that. You know, it's there's too many interactions when you have eleven different guys on each side of the ball, you know, kind of squaring off, and of course they all have their own responsibilities and there's just an infinite number of interactions that take place there. You know, we will never be able to I think, you know, kind of isolate things the same way you can in baseball. But I like that

aspect Versupoort. I think it makes it more challenging to do analytics and football. And I've talked to folks from other sports that are doing you know, kind of work at the highest levels, and they'll say the same thing. They're like, and football is the toughest. You know, I don't know how y'all do it, but they Yeah, So I think the pioneers, you know, you can say, we're in baseball and basketball is kind of really move the needle. Lately,

basketball there's three point them. Nobody's taking tools anymore because if you hit thirty five percent of your threes, and you can hit forty percent or forty five percent of your tools, and you still lose the game. So that analytics, you know, Charles Barkley got mad because they brought analytics into the game. But they're gonna find a way. Believe me, in the NFL will find a way. What do you, as a former player who had none of these kind of stats, you know when you were in the game,

what do you How do you feel about this? Oh, it's all good with me because the bottom line is is you better than me? Are you? Are you better than me? When in a sixty minute game, when I line up against the great Devons of I'm who gonna win the battle. Now you can have the numbers that say that you the better at three, that you got you more condition, you will get tired, so I start

leaning on you. I Okay. We were talking to Jesse Holly earlier today and he was saying, like noon games really do affect the players more than I think people think. And he was talking more about like your days start so much earlier, you have to kind of like adjust your routine, your sleep schedule and especially different on you know, road games in at home. Is that something that you guys look at to like sleep schedules and kind of like just daily routines. Yeah, I will openly man, I'm

not our expert on that topic. Oh but there is like should be Scott Center. He actually said he would come on the show. Would just need to ask he's our nutritionist, is that? Oh but he looks at like sleep and stuff too. Yeah, So his his focus areas are kind of nutrition and then kind of recovery, and so he's deeply focused on on sleep and kind of those aspects of what we're doing. So see look at Tom doing your job where you Kurt. He's booking guests

and he's been on the show twenty minutes. You've been on the show for two years and I'm ahead of you, So I'm linking these guys. But question, So that's Douglas, by the way, behind that wall stream, it's not God. Yeah. So you're talking about there's the analytics aspect of UH from the basketball perspective, the baseball perspective, how advanced they are, and then what Shannon was talking about earlier, which is how fatigue somebody might get in the third or fourth quarter.

And I know I've read like four hundred meters eight hundred meter sprint athletes. I've I've seen interviews with their coaches and the sprinters and the way they've got their conditioning and strategies for those races down. Sounds like that's the direction Shannon was going. I don't know if you're familiar with that at all. So what's your question, Douglas, Well, is that are those related? I'll tell you good talk.

Thanks for thanks for jumping in there, Douglas. Now with it within that realm of sports science, I've I've kind of taught um I guess as a professor at Northwestern kind of in their program for kind of sports analytics and that's where you graduated from, right. I did graduate from there for grad school, but um, you know kind of some of the associations I've had there professionally as well as so kind of that academic side of the world.

But then I would also say there's kind of an applied kind of sports science community out there, if you will, And I think this group will kind of meet at conferences and conventions pretty regularly and kind of draw inspiration from one another. And I think where you'll see a lot of the innovation come from kind of like Douglas was saying, is you know the kind of the Olympic bodies.

You know, we'll we'll invest heavily and kind of the best method and tools for measuring things and for developing athletes. And and then I think, you know, we on the team side a lot of times will kind of draw inspiration from those guys. It's a lot of times, you know, stuff will get handed down from say an Olympic body, you know, to a team setting, and a lot of times it may not even be you know, our team sport, but it might be soccer or rugby, and it will

get applied there and more research will happen. So there's kind of a nice interplay between kind of the academic side of the world and kind of applied side. And so I would say all the time that we're kind of drawing inspiration from one another. Now that the nature of those sports are different. You know, we're we're such

a start and stop sport. You know, we uh, you know, go through the line of scrimmage, you know, plays run, there's you know, ten seconds of you know, sprinting all out you know, frantic activity, and then we go huddle again and it stops. You know. So it's a little different than say a sport like soccer, where it's kind of a you know, continuous flows. For basketball's you know, more of that lucky yeah, hockey they're continuously skating up and down the down the ice or track, where it's

more of an all out run. But but we I think you can borrow things from all the different sports. Do you ever look at like players, like after they have injuries and compare some of their stats to see like, you know, oh, this guy you know towards a CL or mcl and now he's coming back, this is what he used to do, this where he is now, Like

compare historical data before and after an injury. Yeah. I don't want to get into specifics about kind of the way that we do those things, but I would say we definitely do yeah, and we we were kind of, I think pioneers in our efforts to kind of start to introduce new technology to to kind of player tracking. So one of the systems that a lot of teams will use as Catapult, and we were one of the

first kind of North American customers. So we consider ourselves lucky that we were because now we have a ton of historical data and we can look back, you know. But some other teams don't necessarily, Yeah, teams that are newer to it, Yeah, they haven't accumulated as much, so they don't have data on players throughout their careers or over multiple seasons, you know, so they're not I guess the more daddy you collect, the more you can do with it. And so we've we feel lucky that we

have so much ahead of the game. It sounds like I think I think we were in that regard. I would have loved to have seen, like over the years with Jason Witten, to see like how some of his stats would have changed, like especially because he always kept the same intensity. You know, people always talk about like, oh, he goes at every practice the same, but just like to see how age might have affected that. Yeah, he

was wearing tear on your body. I won't say specifically anything about how his performance numbers because I could get myself in tronic, but there's going to be a statute of mutations on that at some point. Though. He was the model with consistency though. I mean, you know, more so than probably any player we've ever had. He would show up, you know, to work each a you know,

never miss a you know, a rep in practice. And that was just kind of his his model for for as long as I was here, and he he long predates me. They said his forty time was didn't really diminish much over his career. Quit trying to get tom in trouble my mind time did you ever run a forty or did you get to ten? He said he could beat anybody the first two guards. He was faster. I could. It was its documented, bro. But but anyway, my friend, Uh, I'm glad you came. Man. Yeah, man,

this is awesome. Yeah to have you on again. I'm sure after we digest this a little bit, we'll be like, Oh, we should have asked him do this, We should ask one more question. Last question he's got to go is uh, the stats say should rarely punt. You believe that? Do you think that's the that's true? I'm not. I'm not gonna come like a lot of trouble on that way. Yeah.

You know, it's amazing about that st because the people been on that for years that you should rally punt, but they never factor in that time that that you don't punt and don't make it. Yeah, and then all of a sudden you gave the team seven points. They never talked about that. But this is most of the reason I didn't say anything, because it's most I've asked. Kurt could have asked anybody something. Oh I'm fascinated by this.

So he's a numbers nerds, So you're not fascinated by concrete cowboys shows and stuff like that, or me and Nate. There's too much craziness going on there. I just let a game you have literally talked to Tom Moore on this show, that you have talked to me and Nate the past year, is to see the best Kurt. Yeah, Yeah, this is Kurt's best version of himself today he's been listening to Garrett's being the best version of himself. Well, Tom,

this was awesome. Man. We know you're busy. You got to get back to work or appreciate you taking some time out and sounds great. Yeah that get just dude out myself. We'll take a quick break. Thanks again. Tom will be right back on hanging with the boys and tailor you love. I mean, if you have a right thing, then cutting the chord is scary. But then I found out I could switch to DirecTV now and still get

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in the pro Shop or at Stetson dot com. Today, back to hanging with the boy back and I don't have anything to read, so let's just get after Come to the Star. Yeah, come out here and hang out. Sign him for the camps. Cool spot, Santa, Welcome back to you. Thanks guys, what are you doing? Just walking by? And so we needed help. I was on Twitter and I saw there were only two of you guys, and I was like, oh, perfect time. Sorry fars No, I

was like, Shana never invites me. And when I usually tell him that, He's like, just come on, yeah, anytime you want to drop in and just drop in. I like this. Don't you like it? Nate? No, I don't name. I don't let Shannon get your trolled. Just Jay and I have the best of times. On Sundays, we are dear friends. On Sundays we're different. What do you have all the time? What do you have over there? Nate?

What are you doing Christmas? Looney? I have gone back and watched that part of yesterday's show about ten times. If you did not catch yesterday, we go watch the video for you. Thank You need to develop a sing Nate is an ultimate team player. Shannon, don't go through Bubba bits to get a deal. You need to work out a once a week segment for her. I'll tell you what segment. This is the original bring Tay what back?

But really I'm gonna be pumped that I get to be back when moment because tell us all what you do. She does a lot, Yeah, tell everybody, but yeah, well a lot is credited to this guy. I was gonna say, she does everything, Channon gets credit for her Yeah, I take all the credit, give her all the work. And then I say, when I first started here, it was just Shannon and I doing social media. We ran all of the accounts, but at that time we didn't have the star accounts at and T Stadium, DCC Cowboys. So

what you mean about social media? You we were posting, we were scheduling, we were handling, and what are some of the things that you was posting home? Facebook, Twitter, Instagram. We started the YouTube YEP back in the day, and then it started snapchat right right right. It expanded into this mass brand crazy department, and now we have what ten people working on our department. Now it's like, hey, Shannon, at the end of the meeting and it was just him and I and I get back in the good

old days when life was easy. I'm sorry. I get to do a career game in post Game with you, right, and then you have something with brand I get to do Cowboys Hour with Brad Sham having cover four Cover four. Heye, right, there is a pretty awesome show, explained the cover for

what you What was that entails? Well, that started two years ago when we're back, when we were still at Valley Ranch and we were deciding about putting shows on Connected TV, right, and I think everyone's thought process was, oh, you need a flagship show for connected TV, and so they thought we need to have a millennial type show

that catered to more of the younger audience. We knew that we were moving over to the start and wanted it to be live too, right, wanted it to be live, wanted it to have like it was, it's only fifteen minutes. It's still's only like fast paced high tan. Yeah, and then it became what it is now and we haven't blast is Jesse Holley, Yeah, Dave Hellman and Lindsay drapers Em. Yeah. I mean what is it all about football? And do y'all get out of and talk about other things? You know? Yeah?

I think I would say it's all about football. Marries back to football, and it's not all cowboys all the time. It's about what's going on around the league and social media and stuff. Turn up Tuesdays a lot of you know, touchdown celebration dances. A lot of them have been choreographed by Kurt. And I don't know if you guys know that he's in he's in the off season. Kurt Daniel side Hustle is a touchdown choreographer. So that's a great

social idea. We should do that. We should touchdown. Gonna come away and be to meet mild mannered Kurt and didn't get with with a millennial and turn out come on man, hair's growing back from fast kids. He knows how like yours. He knows how to turn out. He's got five kids. Four you are you are like April half you're older. But what day you will have that fifth key? We're telling we're telling Kurt it would take an act of God for day. Yeah, that's what's going

to happen. Hey, it's happened before. I wish your wife named Sarah Lauren. We told Kurt he was gonna cancer. You kick cancer's ass and he's gonna have a kid. That ain't happening, Kurt, boy. Better Christmas gift than Kurt just dominating cancer. Yeah right, yeah, give us you went to the doctor this morning, to the doctor. Give us an update. Um, when I when this started, I had, you know, issues in my neck, chest and abdomen. The

neck and the chest are gone. I still have some of the abdomen, but it's they're changing the treatment to kind of morning maintenance thing. So so how long? How it's progressing like you should? Yeah? So you'll have treatments for a while, prolong. Yeah, it's still another couple of years of this, but it won't be as often or as like toxic, so you won't. So you you'll have a treatment on Friday, and you won't. It won't knock you down a week later. I hope not. So it shouldn't.

It won't be as much what they're giving me won't be as toxic. I guess how to put it. But when are we going to be able to go drink? Hopefully? Now? You kind miller lights, he needs to run. Where's sure you weren't about? You weren't gonna be here today, so we're saving him for next week. Week? Actually you know about I heard, oh, mama, mamas about think of a segment? You created it already? Hey what but would be what

it's gonna be about? You get with him and he'll tell us and we'll have a segment like well, it'll be more than Satan be like thirty minutes. I'm here for it, like once a week we bring a week okay, and we want to bring her into what would you like you like after the game? Like Wednesday? Looking ahead? Okay, so Wednesday or Thursday? About Fridays, Mama grows. You're taking up all mama gross tad, and I feel back because I love her dearly way better than her son. Like

she knows. She knows though, like she's like, yeah, man, I feel bad for Mama girls some time. Man, why I'm gonna be talking right though? You know I'm the way I am because of her. She made this, She created this physically, mentally, spiritually, and most already on the air. She just didn't know it. Love you mom. Hi, Hey Angel, y'all you what we have a new member to our show? Are you watching? I am you have two new members? Hey Taylor, Hi Angel? Say that again? I said, Hey Taylor,

hy Tyler. Look, my son outed me while ago and made the whole world think that I'm a bad mom because he's going to eat pizza on Christmas Day to tell you that he never gets to come home at Christmas and that I have Christmas dinner cooked every year. So there we go. How are you a bad mom because I'm getting pizza the night before? Oh my god, I'm playing video games and eating pizza for Christmas. Everybody out there probably with, oh, that's a wonderful Christmas. That's

my me. Some people that they don't know that that's your favorite pastime. They do. Now, hey, Mama Grows, we know that you didn't do well, so we we're skipping over that. We're just gonna talk about how your week went and who your new picks. Don't don't tell us what game, don't break down the games, but what was your record last week? Five and no? Okay, no, we're all about how many did you win last week? None?

That's oh and five, not five and old. I know everything's backwards in Louisiana, but come on, numbers stay the same. Tell us, tell us going forward. What's your picks? Okay? The Falcons and the Panthers. Okay, now, downtwn Kurt, I don't have anything to write with. I've got it Falcons and the Panthers. Your Falcons are giving up three and a half, and I gotta go with the Falcons. Falcons

minus three and a half. Okay, yeah, oh wait, wait, wait wait, this is just for entertainment purposes only, this is not We do not condone gambling on the show. Get Tom back here? Do you not need Tom in this room? They're in this segment because he might lose his job, so they're this is for fun Weston Graduate. All right, We're going with the Bears and the forty Niners. The Bears are giving up for yes man, the Bears Bears minus for Street. They won one ever thought to

beat the Seahawks. Yes, really, yes, Okay, we got the Texas and the Eagles. The Eagles are giving up two and a half, and I have got to go with Texas. Yeah, Texans plus two and a half. Okay, that's the Steelers and the Saints. Saints are giving up five and a half. They're at home. I think after last week's shame, shame, they're going to come back and beat the Steelers. Of course, I'm taking the Saints five and a half. Saints plus minus five and a half Saints for minus five and

a half. Okay, okay, the Cowboys they're giving up seven and a half. Yes, but they're at home and they're playing the Buccaneers. And they better win this game. Yep, I'm going to Showboys seven and a half and what day? Huh? Hold on home Cowboys seven and a half. They just took his head off. What you think you think? You think they're that good at Cowboys? They're playing at home and this is a much okay home must win. All right,

let me ask you something, Mom. We don't have a lot of time left, but let me ask you this because I took my whole seconds. Mom, backing up quick, you get you get to see a lot of the Bucks games because they show the NFC South games a lot right back home? Right? What do you see in the Bucks? What's gonna happen? What do we need to do? They're very inconsistent. Uh, they played this quarterback, that quarterback. They they are high one week and they're low the

next week. Um, we just need to play our game and punch him in the mouth. Punch him in the mouth, or punch him in the MF and mouth. That's it. That's where we need to punch him and mouth. I say it, Mom, say punch him. No, no, gross, don't do that. Let him lead you down their path of destruction. Hey, if the Cowboys needed any gift. The Bucks are thirty second in red zone defense. Oh and guess what we are. We're thirty first. You should have one more red zone. Hey, mom,

did you watch yesterday show? I did. Did you see the joy on Nate's face when he played his Christmas music miss with his little tree? I have not seen him act like that without a plate of cookies in front of him ever, lud Ludy's Christmas tree. These Christmas songs, that is so funny. Yes, I thought, well, I ain't going to play them. Don't deserve That's all right, it's our last show for Christmas. You gotta man bring you next week since we're wearing ugly sweaters all next week. Yeah,

sweater Those things are awesome, y'all. Yesterday all y'all look ma'am, So we gotta gotta get you one. I gotta get Douglas one, and we gotta get your mom one. That's three more. Okay. What's your size? Smaller? Medium? What's your side? You're on the air, so l Kurt, what's your size? I mean, Douglas? What's your size? Two XL or three XL. You don't wear no three XL. We wear it with some leggings like a dress, Douglas, my shoulders are big.

Something happens is this swimmer the dogs? That means we're gonna Hey, So we promised mother gross from will not take up your your second this week? Okay I would. Okay, look because my feelings are gonna be hurt. I'm not special anymore. Oh yes, you are. You are. You're special because you got to put up with me. That's an angel. I'm so glad for you. Time for you. So are you coming into town for Christmas? No, she's a terrible mom. Hold on, you're not coming into town and you're gonna

get on Shannon by eating pizza. Yeah? No, Shannon's going out there. She needs to come home sometimes night, you know. I mean, I'll be home from Artagros. Okay, we have to Hey, I have to work. I have to work at least half of the day on Monday. So for me to drive four and a half hours, spend the night, get up and come right back doesn't make much sense. I'll come when I can stay long her family first, Shannon,

shut up, Douglas. You won't even cut your hair. You know what's so funny, man, is Shannon will switching you gotta get off the fins. Sanna, you gotta get off the finsh on what as you had jumped both sides that a minute? On what in and everything? Hey, I never noticed that I was having this discussion last night. What were my two imaginary friend's names, Nikolai and what was the other one? Oh god, I can't remember that too, Yeah, yeah, one,

I remember God. One ran away, Thank god the toilet Nikolai. Nikolai was the one that was there forever. But he flushed my contact down the toilet. Not me, is Nikolai. All right, mon, we got a Christmas party. We gotta go to. Y'all do have fun and if ever tell you, but I do, you know what? And I don't know if that love is real because we're not gonna have anything but pizza and beer. Video games? Wow, video games? All right, Mom, love you. I'll call you Christmas. Taylor.

Thank you, guys, Thank you kind about Kurt. She no, she was talking about Kurt. Kurt. Thanks for showing up, Thank you, Thank for crashing the party. Let's all hit together. Thanks for bringing for bringing it, Douglas, thank you for what you do. Oh yeah, we're gonna have to roll on the show next week's awesome the row. This guy, it's our time right now, It's our time right now. Yeah, he's ready to roll. Man. Thank you, Douglas Sake, you kid,

Thanks everybody, Thanks, thanks, Thanks, Luny Tree. We'll be back Monday, y'all having a one show ten o'clock on Monday. Don't know who's on it yet. We'll be back on Wednesday. Have a great weekend, have a merry Christmas. We love all of you. We'll see you next week on Hanging with the Boys. Right now beside to write this out of mister Ron. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.