Welcome to Hacking Your Leadership.
I'm Chris and I'm Lorenzo, and Lorenzo on this episode, I want to talk about something that happened to me. I was in a meeting room with about fifteen or twenty people and we were going over strategy on something and the person running the meeting, one of two people running the meeting, is a person that I've known for a while, and this person tends to interrupt everyone.
And it's it's difficult.
Because they don't interrupt it to say, you know, shut up.
You're wrong, or that's ridiculous, be quiet.
It's it's not an interruption from a standpoint of you're wrong, stop talking.
My point of view is better.
It's almost almost a shared excitement in some cases, or a reaction to half the story because they're trying to engage.
It's. The point is it doesn't seem.
Malicious, but it was clear and it has been clear that when it happens to somebody in the room, myself included, it feels wrong. It feels like, it feels disrespectful. It feels like I like I haven't been able to say what I need to say, and I could see eye rolls coming from other people in the room when that when that would happen, And it got me thinking about, you know, how how has this happened for so long?
Because it's it's happened with other people that I've seen over the course of months, and and you know it either no one said anything or or they have said it,
and it's falling on deaf ears. And I guess the point I'm trying to say is what we need to talk about here is is how to handle this or whether or not it should be handled, and when it is handled how and if it's if if it's bothering you, is it doesn't need to be handled or is this something you just kind of like chalk it up to everybody's different you you walk away or how do you?
How do you do this?
Yeah? Well, I think first of all, it's a it's a great example.
I think there's a lot of things that in conversations I I kind of chalk it up to like self awareness. There's like a lot of habits that people have interrupting kind of being one of them. Because again, even though even though it might act to move, you know, it might work in a way that moves the conversation forward or faster, or there's excitement. I get that a lot, like there's excitement and dialogue or healthy debate and somebody
you know interrupts quite often. But if you don't, if you're not conscious of it, and if you're not you know, thinking about it, and if nobody's giving you that feedback, like that's really the hardest part there is if nobody's talked to you or pulled you aside and mentioned it.
It's hard to work on if you don't see it, especially because and what I've seen in having you know, family members all over the country and relationships with parents and things like that, like this is one of the things that's it's it's typically in somebody's personality, like they are this person at home and at work. It's not like they just turn it on for work and now
they start interrupting everybody. But you know, to to to address that type of disrespect, I think step one is having that conversation and pulling somebody inside and saying, hey, I want to talk a little bit about you know what just happened to the media or are you conscious of this or have you been given this feedback before? But especially in a space where you may be trying to you know, collect ideas or thoughts or even pushback.
I think it's important to first have that conversation with someone.
Yeah, I think you're right with that.
I think about the times when I have withheld feedback on something like this where I could have given feedback on this and chose not to, versus times when I could give feedback and I chose to give it. And I think what it comes down to is is this I think I think I try to judge or assess the intent of the person who's doing the interrupting, and.
If in my mind it's.
From the standpoint of you know, excitement and engagement and lack of self awareness, then what happens is like if if I was given feedback on something and it was and the thing that I was doing was rooted in a lack of self awareness, my reaction would be like I would instantly start going through all the interactions that I've had with people over the last however many, you know, months or whatever, and from a standpoint of, oh my god, I did like what how did.
I do this to other people? What did I do? Like just from a from a wanting to preserve the relationship.
Standpoint, like not a defensive like you know, get out of my face standpoint, but just like a genuine like, oh my gosh, I care about these relationships. I hope I haven't hurt them, and wanting to make them better. And I think I try to put myself in the shoes of another person before I give that feedback and think, I don't want to make them feel bad for something that they didn't do out of malice.
I I but but I'm doing.
Them a disservice in the long term if I don't, because if they're more likely to react positively and to make the changes hearing the feedback from somebody to have a really positive relationship with versus someone who just like met them for the first time, they do their whole interrupting thing. After the meeting, that person goes up and says, hey, that was really rude.
Stop it. You know that's that's a harsher way to hear it.
And then if that, if that, if that person has never heard that feedback from anybody before, that could that could hit Like the longer you go without getting feedback,
the harder it hits. And so I think, you know, if you if you like a person, if you have a relationship with somebody, you almost have a responsibility to to at least you know, set the seeds and you know, you know, set the wheels in motion of giving that feedback so that they can, you know, take the steps if they choose to, because it ultimately's on them to
make the changes. But but if you consider yourself a colleague, I think there's going to be some personal responsibility to start that feedback process.
Yeah, And I want to be clear too, I think sometimes interrupting is a good thing and you have to do it. And whether it's redirecting a conversation or you know, stopping something from you know, builing it over, or if somebody is sharing information that's that's not correct, you know, like like to not allow it to just live and have people here.
Like I I know that I use.
Interruption as a tool, and I think it's definitely should be applied when needed. But I think to your point, if it's something that is always happening, if it's something that's just a part of somebody's personality, you know, talking talking to them about it, whether it's a pure relationship or reporting relationship, I think both of them it's a very important thing to bring up and to share and to showcase if you have true intention to help somebody
get better. But I think the to me, the larger piece of it is kind of like as you were talking through examples and stuff like and the reason why we allow it. I think sometimes we allow it because there's an element of authority potentially or almost like admiration.
Like I think some people that a lot of people look up to, that a lot of people make would be considered like a you know, a great leader or a mentor somebody that typically always has really good insight or perspective or that's like we almost allow it, and to a degree sometimes expect it from leaders that are in that space because we really want to get to
what their thoughts are. Anyway, So if they interrupt me, I'm good with that because I'm trying to get them to share with me what that might look like in the future. But doesn't necessarily take away the fact that it could be a very disrespectful thing to some And culturally, another piece of that is some people like it is a it's both sides here.
There are a lot of cultures where you know.
Talking interrupting engaging in conversation that way is very accepted and kind of expected, and if you don't do it, you never get a word in. And then there are other cultures, you know, in backgrounds of people that as soon as you do it once they just stop talking because like you would never disrespect an elder, or you would never create conflict at work.
Those types of things.
So I think it is a big conversation to have, and I think that it you know, just the idea of you know, disrespectful behavior. So much of that is defined by the person that's feeling disrespected, and I think it just it requires and in leadership, a really good awareness of body language and responses that you see from people in certain situations to understand how they take certain things.
Yeah, I agree with that.
I like one of the things you mentioned in there was this idea of, oh, if I'm being interrupted, it's because I want to get what the boss is thinking anyway.
So I become fine with that.
And you know, I think in some situations that's not necessarily unhealthy, because if the goal of the meeting is to is to get to what the boss wants anyway,
then that's fine. But I think there there there's collateral damage when that happens, because if if a boss is constantly interrupting, even if the in this particular meeting, that's what you want because you want to get their thoughts so you can move forward anyway, I think it stifles future contributions from people when when the goal isn't just to get what the boss is thinking, but the goal is to collaborate and to you know, come to agreements
on what strategy should be as you're as you're building strategy, and so there I know that there are people when I was in that meeting the other day, I know there are people who just didn't say anything because they knew they would be interrupted, and so that you didn't contribute. And was it a problem during during that meeting. Maybe not, Maybe they didn't have maybe they didn't have much to contribute anyway, But I know on a long enough timeline it is a problem.
On a long enough timeline and enough.
Meetings, there is enough potential good ideas or good contributions or or relevant feedback. You know that doesn't get said when when a person is just known for being the one who will constantly interrupt, Eventually.
It will hurt. It will hurt.
Things in terms of the relationships and in terms of you know, potential business outcomes when people just stop speaking up because somebody is doing you.
Know, a lot, a lot of disrespecting.
Yeah, let me ask you when you think about, you know, over time, is this something that you've seen more of or less of? Because as you were talking, in my head, I was thinking about my observations as far as like, is this something that's a lot more prevalent today than it was before?
Like, what's your opinion on that? That's a great question.
I think probably less.
I think I see maybe less of it over time from from people as a whole. I think there is an increase in emotional intelligence from a lot of people in general.
Like I think as emotional intelligence has become.
More valued and you know, something that people look for in another person, I think that the a lot more people have that then maybe had it, you know, twenty or thirty years ago.
And one of the criteria of that, I think.
Is just kind of respecting others, not interrupting them, letting them finish, even if you even if you are like chomping at the bit to like say what you want to say, just the idea of letting somebody else finish.
In general, I think so I see a little bit less of it now.
There are there are one off examples where individual people that's just who they are, you know.
But yeah, I would say less. Why do you disagree? You know?
I think I seem more interrupting, but actually like it having less intention of actually interrupting. It's like more of an attention thing where like you may be talking to someone and they're just not paying attention to what you're talking about, and then they interrupt you because it's not even like in their head that you're talking. Yeah, I see that more often, but it's not with the intention of like trying to interrupt a conversation.
Sure, So it's like it's just like, you know, kind of the a result of the YouTube life where everything's on demand and everything's a distraction.
It's almost like it's almost like.
The the subtle ADHD that we've all developed in our own brains over the last ten years because of just the constant influx of stimuli. And I think there's maybe there's a some some negative effects of that.
Absolutely, And with that it brings us to this episode as a one minute hack. But first a few words from our sponsors.
All right, for this episode's one minute Hacker's or I wants you to do. When it comes to giving somebody feedback or addressing a situation where someone is interrupting constantly or being disrespectful constantly, you know, there there's two things to consider. One is whether or not the disrespect was intentional. So you know, some people interrupt because they are actually being disrespectful, and some or they're trying to be disrespectful, some people in a because they are just excited and
don't think they're being disrespectful. And then on the other side, there's there's the question if to ask yourself is whether or not feedback is needed. And so if you think about a situation, there are situations where a person wasn't meant meaning to be disrespectful, but feedback is still needed. And there are scenarios where a person is being disrespectful but it's actually not appropriate for you to give feedback.
And so you have to think about each scenario and figure out, you know, is this something where it's my job to address this and if so, how.
Do I do that?
Do I do it immediately when it's happening, Whether there's people around or not do I wait and do it later on when it's just me and that person one on one. And all these things are are are things to consider, but in general, if a person is if a person needs the feedback on something they're doing, either interrupting constantly or being disrespectful constantly, you know, if it's your responsibility to give that feedback or if you want to see a change, it has to start with giving
that feedback. And and the only times that I can think of where that it's not appropriate to do are
when either it's a one off interaction. You're never going to see that person again or interact with them again, So why why go down that path that's between them and the other people that they're they have relationships with, or when it could be something that is it could be detrimental to your career, And and and then sometimes it's appropriate to take a partner when when going forward that instead of doing it on your own.
Yeah, I like, I like the idea of understanding. And I said this earlier that like there's a time and place for it. It's absolutely an element of normal banter and dialogue and conversation as well. I think many times, like when I feel if I would say, like I got this, you know, I felt disrespected because somebody interrupted. It's probably because I felt I had feelings about something else in general, and they also interrupted me, and I didn't.
Like that either.
You know, like that's typically a lot of it, but but when leaders do it consistently, I absolutely like myself personally, I just I just stopped talking to this. Okay, Well, in my mind, what they have to say is more important than when I have to say, so I'm going to allow it. I'm going to kind of go from there.
But I also know that that in many instances, I have to be I have to give that feedback if I felt that way, because if I felt that way, there's a chance that others might have felt that way, and.
Somebody, somebody should be aware of it. If there's something that they constantly do.
Yeah, there's an element of ownership for other people's experience. And if you're if you're a leader of leaders, or if you're a leader of people, and you know that the person who's doing the interrupting interacts with everybody, there can be an element or a feeling of personal responsibility to address something with somebody. Even if it's not negatively impacting you directly, You just kind of, like Grin and Barratt or get through it because you don't value their
opinion anyway, and you move through your day. If that can be impacting others that you feel a personal responsibility for for their experience, then it can be necessary to address that on behalf of them. So that's something you definitely want to consider as well when it comes to just whether or not it's your responsibility to say.
Something absolutely and with that it brings us at the end of this episode, this is how your leadership. I'm Lorenzo and I'm Chris, and we'll talk to you all next time.