What's up, guys, Welcome back to the podcast. A couple things I want to discuss today. First, a conversation I want to have ant Man's with me, producer of this podcast, and I want to talk about fame and what that means. If anyone is listening that's maybe aspiring to be famous or wondering is it healthy to be famous or is
it okay to be famous? I kind of want to run down that road and speak to that, and I might have some things that are not what you think I'm going to say, maybe, And then we're going to finish the podcast after that with answering your questions. You could email me podcast at grangersmith dot com. Podcast at grangersmith dot com. We're gonna have this conversation like we're just sitting in the cabin a truck, this you and I. In fact, that's what kind of what we're doing right
now yet except for we're sitting in a podcast. But you you are great at these kind of conversations because you get them going for me. Okay, you you have a good way of cultivating like you do on After Midnight or this podcast.
It's usually a random text or voice message. Is how the conversations most of the time, and then you can respond when you have time, and then I respond back when I have time. So now we're just consolidated. Put it all on this podcast.
That's right.
See if it works the same.
Yeah, So once again, that email is podcast at grangersmith dot com. Fame. I've had three separate conversations about fame in the last two weeks. The first one, I should go backwards because the first one's going to reveal everything. Let me go backwards, Okay. The most recent one is a some dear brothers friends of mine that are just now signing a deal.
Oh really, So they're at the beginning of where you've you've been there it was what twenty years ago, fifteen years or twenty years was?
Well, there's been several times at several beginnings for me. The pub first publishing deal I was twenty years old, okay, first record deal was I was thirty four.
Okay.
So these guys are just now signing, and they're asking me, Hey, I need some counsel on this. How can I maintain my life as a father with young children, as a husband, as a Christian, as a member of our church. How could I do all this if things go as well as this record label wants them to go, basically what they're asking. Okay, the second conversation I had, and I'll go back to that, But the second conversation I had is the middle conversation was in I'm not going to
name this. It was in a state where I was speaking, and I spoke to a young girl who is in the Christian music industry and she is in a place where things are starting to really pop for her. It's not like she just signed a deal, but she is now she's been with this label for a little bit and things are like really looking good. They're wanting to
make her collab with all these different people. And she is with her husband backstage at an event I spoke at, and she's saying, I need some council because things are accelerating quickly.
She's got one that's starting, one that's in middle ish, yeah, of her career.
And then the first conversation, the catalyst to all of this, it really made me think about it was I was speaking to a group of pastors in another state, and after I spoke, in fact, in fact, what I spoke about was John three point thirty, which is John the Baptist saying he must increase and I must decrease talking about Jesus, John the Baptist talking about Jesus, and there is this there's this idea that in twenty twenty four, how do we actually live that out? How do we
possibly live out? He must increase and I must decrease in a world where we need to have a successful podcast and it's a successful radio show and a successful platform, and the widgets that we sell need to be we need to be selling more of those widgets, and we need to be always see growth in order to see growth that's tied directly with our success, and success is usually tied directly to how well people like us, and how well and how big a deal we make of ourselves.
I think, though, to the track of fas can also coincide with a conversation with someone who is middle management trying to get to upper management, or someone who's entry level trying to go to the next level. Sure, because it all ties back to a lot of the same thoughts, Sure, the same intentions. I mean, more times than not, when you start off, you're getting paid minimum wage or less, and the ambition is that I'm going to make more money, and that I'm going to do better for me and
do better for my family. And so the conversation is really the same whether you're making literal widgets or you're walking on a stage somewhere.
Same conversation. So here's here's kind of the reference that I use at that pastor's conference to speak to what you just said. This is in the Book of Psechariah, chapter four, starting in verse six. It says this. Then he said to me, this is the word of the Lord Toud's Zerebeble, not by might nor by power, but by my spirit, says the Lord of Host. Who are you, o great mountain? Before zerebebyle you shall become a plain, and he shall bring forward the topstone amidst shouts of
grace grace to it. Then the word of the Lord came to me. This is Zechariah speaking, saying, the hands of Zerebebel have laid the foundation of this house. His hands shall also complete it. Then you will know that the Lord of Host has sent me to you. For whoever has despised the day of small things shall rejoice and shall see the plumb line in the hand of Zerebebel.
So what's happening here is Zerebebel is the king of Israel, and he's a much lesser king because the exiles have returned from Babylon and they're rebuilding the temple.
Got it.
So as they're rebuilding the temple, all the old men of Israel, they saw the old temple in all of its glory, at Solomon's Temple, just incredible structure. They watch Zerubebile, the new king, start to bring people together and start to rebuild it. They literally see it and cry. They literally weep, and we see in Ezra they're weeping so loud that it's it just as loud as the people
shouting for joy is the weeping. And they're weeping because it looks so pathetic, and they're going, I remember the temple was incredible, and now it's this. How pathetic is this? And God is saying, Zeubebil, my king will do it. And all the people who have despised the day of small things shall rejoice when they see what this is going to be.
Oh wow.
And I read that one day and I thought, oh man, Lord, I'm the guy that has despised the day of small things for so long. I want big things. I want. I want instant results. I want things. I want things to look good and to look complete and build and grow, and I want platforms to grow, and I want everyone to go look at all the big things. And sometimes, in fact, a lot of times, God just works with the small things and he goes, this is the way I do it. Like earlier, he says, not by might
nor by power, but by my spirit. That's how I'm gonna do it. Sometimes I build things small, and the small things end up taking over everything.
So that's so good.
I spoke to the pastors, and I was talking. I was hopefully trying to encourage some of the pastors that might be thinking, I don't have this podcast, I don't have a thousand followers on Instagram. I don't have a big church. I don't I don't have the kind of personality that could hold a radio show in my local town. I don't have a lot of things. I guess I'm a failed pastor. I guess I'm insufficient for pastoring flock.
And I wanted to say I wanted to speak to those men, and I wanted to say God says, not necessarily because the reason I say it that way is because of course God can grow those kind of things, and it's incredible. With Moses, he gave him a voice like Moses like, I can't speak God, how could I do it? I don't speak God goes who made your mouth? So he can do it. But he also could build a small temple that looks puny compared to the old one,
and that's actually a big thing. So I kind of just want to I wanted to comfort people and say, look, wherever you are, where the wherever God has called you. It doesn't because you might not be big, doesn't That does not mean necessarily that it's insufficient at all. After I finished, and this is where I'm going with this, a pastor stands up, raises his hand. He says, I got a question because I opened it up for questions after whole Q and A yeah, And guy says, I
got a question. I have some people in my congregation that want to be famous in the Christian contemporary Christian industry. How do I counsel them as a pastor? And I said,
tell them it's not possible. And the whole room goes, oh you just like it felt like I punched everyone in the gut at the same time, and there were and it was almost like everyone knew that was the right answer, but no one ever wants to say it out loud because that's like hurting the American dream, and that's that's you know, that might be offensive to someone that actually wants to build up a big music career for the for the glory of God, because God gave
them a musical talent that should be shared with the masses. And to that, I say, not necessarily. He can, and he does and he will, but not always. It doesn't mean that we we if we're if our motivation is I want to be famous so that I give God glory, then that's the wrong motivation because he does it.
It's also in the wrong.
Order and in the wrong order.
Yeah, because it starts with you. If it has to be you being famous, and listen, I'll be honest, I'm talking myself through this right now.
I know you are. We've had this discussion. That's kind of why we're doing this on this podcast.
So if you start with you, it's already in the wrong order. I become famous then I can bring more glory to him.
Yeah, well that's backwards, and God says, oh, did you think I needed.
Glory, you know, in case you had had noticed, if you if he's already way bigger than you could ever imagine.
Yeah, he doesn't need No, he doesn't any glory. He doesn't need.
So trying to find a way to stick yourself into the plan that's out of order with how he has you in his plan.
Yes, God, and here in Zachariah, God doesn't need glory from a temple. He doesn't need any glory period from man. But in his providence, he invites us to join in on his plans for some strange reason that we can't even begin to understand why. The creator of the universe invites measley man to join in to share in his plan. And that's what he's doing here in Zachariah. And this is this is what he does with people that have talent.
This is what he does with pastors, This is what he does with the flock, This is what he does with with a lot of people, a lot of faithful people. He invites them in to join in on it. But by no means would we ever think that we are doing it so that we can bring him more glory or more money for a bigger charity. Oh, I'm gonna I'm gonna raise so much money for you God, And this is all this money is gonna be able to help your people so.
Much because you wouldn't be able to do it without.
Because God, you certainly can't do it without me. And God goes, I don't need your money, Yep, I got cattle on a thousand hills. I don't need your glory. I've got enough glory and some reason. We do this as ambitious humans. And so that's why I say to that pastor, you could counsel them by saying, I don't think it's possible to seek to be famous and be a faithful Christian. I could, and I could divide that in two different ways. And this is the same conversation
I had in that hallway with the girl. And this is the same conversation I had with the guys that were texting me that just signed the record deal, because I don't want to waste their time and sugarcoat it when this is what I have come up with in my own quiet time, and by no means in my saying this is right, but I'm saying I've divided this in my mind. Throw a lot of thought into two different categories. One is the practical and one is the spiritual.
The practical way that I believe you can't seek to be famous and be a faithful Christian. Practically, you need to be in church on Sunday morning with your family. You need to be connected to the body. And by being practically just gone on tour, you have broken away from the most practical side of being a Christian connected to the body, and you can't get that back by
just watching online. You can't get it back by starting a little worship group wherever in whatever city you're in, or you can't get it back by joining the local church service in the city you're in. You could do that occasionally, and that's say you take a vacation and you go to Florida with your family and you go check out the local church on a Sunday. Great. But if at least that's not the norm, that's a vacation.
But if it becomes the norm, which it would if you're a touring artist and most Sundays, most Saturday nights, you're out, and so most Sundays you're gone. Can't make up for this because church is not how we consume it. Otherwise it would all be online. Church is us consuming and participating. It's we're members of the body, so we function as a body. Like a hand can't say to the eye, why am I not an eye? Why can't I not see? And the eye says, I need a hand.
The body needs each other and all the members of the body. That's who we are in the Body of Christ.
Do me a favor real quick. Can you take me back to when you were playing your guitar on the edge of your bed, when you're a kid and you're thinking about could this turn into a career? Were you thinking about being famous? Then?
No, no, I never really thought about, man, it'd be cool to be famous. I did think, man, it'd be cool to play a song in front of a lot of people.
But I think it was more of a famous part didn't come in there.
It wasn't necessarily famous. Every I think everyone really knows deep down famous is bad because the more famous you are, the less freedom you have in this world. I think we recognize that at all levels like them. At the very end of Elvis's life, he couldn't even be around in the daylight, right, He had to travel it in the middle of.
The night because he'd be swamped.
And Michael Jackson, you know, you think of like the uber famous people. I don't think anyone actually wants that. But what we do want is, but I would like to play a song I just wrote in front of a whole lot of people and they sing it back. Yeah, because that's there's an energy to that that I want to be part of that energy. That's really neat to be able to to be able to do this not just once a month, but to do it every night.
That's cool that it takes a certain level of fame to be able to play the music every night, not just once a year. What's also interesting is that there's a great documentary and it's it's on the PBS channel on country music. It's kin Burns, which I love. I love kin Burns documentaries, but there's one on country music.
And you know, like being a famous musician, it's it's still maybe not even one hundred years old in the in the span of the life of humanity, that's true, being a famous musician is less than one hundred years old.
And think about who have you just mentioned? Elvis, yeah, Garth. Now today you've got you know, Luke Holmes and Morgan Wallen. Yeah, yeah, there's not.
We don't have a big housan. We don't have data points something exactly, but we do know that here's what we do, and we don't have data points on what's it like to be famous and how well does that? How well can you do? But we do know that for thousands of years before that, people were perfectly happy performing music on a front porch or in a small
setting under an oak tree. And everyone brought an instrument, a banjo, a mandolin, a guitar, and everyone's saying, and someone led it because someone was the better fiddle player, so that better fiddle player led the group. Yeah, And
people gathered around and brought their instruments. And we do know that there was no greater joy in a stadium than there was right under that oak tree playing the fiddle with the group of people, and they just thought, I love music, and this is everyone's in on this, and we're playing and we're singing. This feels great. That that is not better or worse than the stadium was it?
But so if it's not, If fame, if people are starting to recognize that fame is not necessarily a great thing, you can't you know, if you're really up there, you have to play in your trips and where you go and how you go, and if you want to go to Disney, you've got to have a personal less court or you have to rent out the whole place. Things like that. Is it money?
I didn't think about money either. Money No, as a kid, like getting into music, I didn't think about fame or money. I just thought playing music every night to a lot of people would be really cool, and a tour bus would be great. It takes money to get a tour bus, sure, but but there's a lot better ways to make money. There's a there's a lot more practical ways to make money. Like uh, I would say, go get a loan and
get a dump truck. There you go it start a concrete there's those concrete guys are crushing it, you know. So like if you if it's money, let me, let me talk different ways to do there's better, more reliable ways to make money. There is no other way to play music in front of a lot of people than if you are famous. There's there's no other way to do that. So so that's the practical side, right, You got to miss church, you're you're away from your family.
Even if you say no, my family travels with me, they can't go all the time. And if they do travel with you, you're taking them away from the local body church as well. So these are just the practical things. And then then there's the spiritual side. There's a whole different side to this, and that's the side that you have to suppress. The fleshly desire that starts creeping up
in you that says, I think they love me. I think I'm pretty good at this, and I think these people need me in their life because I'm providing a sense of joy. I am the source of joy for
these people. And you might hear this on the podcast and go, well, that's stupid, But that's a real thing that you have to suppress, because if you don't watch that weed that's growing in the garden, if you don't watch that weed as soon as it starts sprouting out of the dirt and you don't pluck it, it will grow and it will overpower every other little vegetable plant
in your garden. I promise you that thought that says I am a big deal and people need me, and I am their source of happiness, and joy look at me.
You can have that same thought and not be in front of people too.
Though, Absolutely you can, and that's not what this podcast is about. We could do tomorrow's podcast about the athlete that does the same thing true, or the CEO of the business that thinks the same thing.
Well, and I'm thinking not even the ceo. I'm thinking of like you could be and there's nothing wrong with this, but you could be a janitor thinking well, these toolts to be overflowing if it wasn't for me, and you know a lot of sense, you would be right. But because I don't think anybody else wants to do that. But the thought, that thought is the seed that is wrong, is that you need me. I am that important that I And it really goes back to the conversation you
have with God. You need me to do this to bring you the glory. Yeah, and it's the opposite in what you do, bring me the glory, and I'll raise you up and I'll tear you down.
Yeah, you know, I am going to the k Love Award Show. Did you know this?
I did. I didn't know what you were doing, but I knew that you were going.
So I'm going to the k Leve Award Show from when we record this podcast. I don't know. I might it might have already passed man from when we put that when we release the We pre record these podcasts like a river. The book is up for an award that day. But I will be around. I think I'm actually presenting a male vocalist or something like that, so I think or maybe female vocal Anyway, I'm I'm going to be brushing shoulders with all the Christian music industry.
I'll be with them, and and I don't I know for a fact that they, those guys and girls are not immune from the same problems that I saw in country music or rock music or pop music as far as making us becoming idols to other people and us liking it. So it might be shocking. And I'm going to stand by this, and I hope that this is
shocking to people listening. And I hope that you can't and I hope that you I hope that you wrestle with what I'm saying as if it's wrong, because I want people to I want constantly people to go I think Granger's wrong, but I don't want you to stop there. I want you to then dive in and wrestle with why you think I'm wrong, and wrestle with the topic. But I'm gonna say I don't think it's possible for men and women to be famous or to seek to
be famous in music and be a faithful Christian. I mean, I just called out a bunch of people that are my dear friends.
And either that you are going to be hanging out with or have already been hanging out with.
Yeah, a pastor friend of mine, and I have a lot of people around me that call me out and either tell me to shut up or tell me I'm wrong. And one of those pastors stood up during that Q and A and goes Granger, how does this radio show you do not do the same thing to you?
Interesting?
And that was a great question. Well, I feel like being on a radio show. I'm protected more so from it because I don't see the reaction from people I do the radio show, and I don't like it. We're in this room right now. I don't see people with their hands up crying. I don't see them at a meet and greet going my favorite, you're my favorite human, You're my idol. I heard that word all the time
in meet and greets. You're my idol. I don't see that hit you differently literal, Yeah, yeah, it did hit me differently later on, So I don't see that instant reaction. But I still don't get me wrong. I have to protect myself as an author, as a podcaster, as a radio host, I have to protect myself in so many as a speaker, as a preacher, Oh man, that might be the most dangerous space for me to go up on a stage and preach and start to think that
it's about me. So that's what I hate about preaching, and that's what I love about it, because the part I love is I'm going in with a word from the Bible. So it's this is the word. I'm going to use this word, and I'm the point of this word is the point of my message today, not my point, that's not my ideas. And so I love that. And what I hate about it is there's such a grave responsibility that I don't want to slip up and need
attention for myself. I usually pray almost every time in front of people, not just behind the stage, but in front of people. When I start my message, I usually pray something like Lord humble me. Don't let me seek the approval of these men and women that I so desperately want because I want them to like me. I feel it creeping up in my gut right now. I want. I want to say something or do something that they
go I like him because I crave people to like me. Lord, will you suppress that, You push that down where you let me resist that, so that your word comes through, Truth comes through, even if it contradicts the feeling that if I say this people won't like me anymore. Let me just tell him the truth, regardless of who likes me or not the approval of man. Will you suppress that so I make sure that that's my prayer and it needs to always be there because because I'm like
the guy this is a horrible example. Let me just use it right, This is a graphic example. But I'm like the guy that used to be in porn and now I struggle with intimacy with my wife. Okay, so that I used to be the entertainer that needed the fame, and so now I struggle with the intimacy of actually being on a stage in front of a lot of people and giving the word of God. So I need to constantly be thinking and protecting myself. Does that make sense?
Yeah, very much so.
So if I might have said some things, I realized that I might have said some like sound bites or little small clips that could be taken out of context. Please don't take Please don't take one sentence I said out of the last third forty minutes and say Granger says that he hates all Christian country artists and that they're all, you know, sinning or something like that. That's not what I'm saying. Let me finalize this by saying I couldn't do it. I don't see a way necessarily.
I'm gonna use that word for the third time. I don't see away necessarily because I couldn't do it, that anyone else can be successful with it. But there might be maybe someone is stronger, has a stronger will and a deeper devotion that they can resist all of that fame and say no, I'm only doing this because the Lord gave me a talent.
Yeah, yeah, and I think that that. I know we need to need to jump here pretty quick, but the at least on this topic. But I think that that's the key is the order, the order of how you present this. It's me being famous so I can do more for you, and that is and I think we probably just talked through that game realization the longer we talked. But if your order and he appoints you to that,
that's different. If you're doing it, you're already working in your church and you're already doing that, and you're getting these opportunities pray about those. Hey, if it takes me away from this, I'm not sure that that's right for me. If I can do that but still be everything that he's asked me to be locally, that's a different story. I'm in a different conversation.
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my url is songfinch dot com slash granger. Don't forget to share your song with us too, songfinch dot com slash granger. We're gonna answer your questions here. If you have one for me, email podcast at grangersmith dot com. Have you read these amend I did read these, I haven't touched them real quick, there's got to be a part two to the fame first half.
Yeah, things we talked about before. I think we touched on half of one of them. Yeah, this is a whole old slimbit these They had great emails that continue to come in, So.
Let's see what they said for reading those. Subject line here says I declared my intentions and asked her out on a date. She gave me a vague response. Hey Granger, I'm twenty nine years old. She is thirty two years old. We're both in the same local church and the same ministry team. I declared my intentions to her and asked her out for a coffee date. She gave me a vague response, no clear no on that response or rejection, but at the same time, no clear yes from her either.
After I declared my intentions, I love how he keeps saying that to her and asked her out. After two weeks, we had a conversation, a casual conversation. It's just me initiating a conversation with her and how she's been basically small talk. She was friendly in a response and not really the best conversation I've had with her, but overall it went well. She did not like scene zone with me.
What does that mean I do? I even explained there that I have no I left it in there. Sometimes I edit them just to make them flow and still get the gist of it. I had to leave this in here just to see if you could understand what.
I don't know. She did not like scene zone me, scene zone me.
I want to say, maybe friend zone me.
Yeah, maybe, And so we had and so then he continues on, I'm still continuing on praying to God about this about what my next action is. But yeah, I don't know what to do next. If I should wait on her to make a decision about how she really feels about me, or if I should pursue her still or just move on. We will need biblical and godly advice on this. I appreciate your thoughts and advice on this situation. Thanks, Hans. All Right, Hans, let me recap
for my own brain here twenty nine. She's thirty two. Interesting, she's three years older. Ministry team. That's kind of sounds a little Fleetwood macish to me. What do you mean the same band?
Okay, got it?
Yeah, everybody in Fleetwood Mac like had a relationship with each other. It's not what I mean, buddy, it's sorry, Hans, bad bad music joke. So buddy that this is a long email, which is great, detailed email, which is great. But it's just a simple thing. If you're not getting it, it's one of only one of two things. It's one she's just not into you, man, or two she's very shy and doesn't really know how to react. And I could solve both of those for you. You just got
to be direct and just go. Look. Let me be straight up. I like you when I ask you for coffee. It is not just because I think I want to be your friend, and so sometimes it's guys, we have to be very clear, we have to we have to you said, declare intentions, but I wonder if you have clarity in your declaration of your intentions when you say, can we go out for coffee? I hope you're saying not as a friend. I want this actually to be a date. I want to take you out. I want
to have some coffee. But it's because I like you. I'm actually attracted to you. And then give her a chance to respond to that. Because you're not eighteen, you're in your late twenties. She's in her early thirties. This is time, you know, things are happening in your lives right now, there's really not You're not going to waste your time with vagueness. And so it's like, hey, I'm interested in you. Are you interested in me? Just ask
her that. And if she says, you know, Hans, I think you're great, and okay, right there, you're like, okay, I get it, I get it. We'll continue on in the same ministry team, which is going to be awkward, but we got to keep doing that. But the only other scenario is she goes yes, but I don't I've never been in a relationship before. I don't know what to go about, but I do like you. Okay, now we could work with that.
Yeah, I agree.
But either way, Hans, this is just very simple.
I want to know what stating your intentions are.
I don't know. That's kind of I don't think it was enough because I think if it was enough, he wouldn't have asked us the question.
Well, and there's some confidence that should come, not because of experience, just because of age. At some point, at twenty nine thirty two, you can have a direct conversation of hey, I mean twenty nine thirty t to find you attractive and not be offended if they say no, Yeah.
It's a total thing for someone to go, Hey, can you have coffee? It's a thing for the girl to go. I had no idea you meant that way, right, And le's what tell them? We got to tell them A next question, says Hey Granger. My name is Haven, twenty nine year old. Another twenty nine year old grew up in Georgetown, Texas and still live in the area. I had the pleasure of speaking to you a couple of occasions during my few years working in the country radio scene.
I haven't had a chance to speak to ant Man yet. I left the radio world, but still very much a part of the country music industry since I started my own event production company that focuses on country music festivals. What advice do you have for me as I work in the entertainment industry and live a life that is Christ focused. I already will will not work with any
other acts that are not family friendly. I'm curious if you felt that you had to leave the entertainment scene because you view it as too much of a distraction from the life you want to live as a Christian. Also, if you have ever thought that you could spread God's word to a larger audience audience if you had stayed in the music scene. Personally, I think what you're doing now is amazing and inspiring. Love the podcast, appreciate you
taking the time to read this. Thank you, Haven. Yeah, great question, Haven, And look, this is critical in so many areas. We have to remember when when you're a Christian and you want to you want to live a christ focused life, that doesn't mean you need to surround yourself by only Christians. That would be a huge mistake and Nowhere in the New Testament do we see this is the disciples go out and the apostles go out
and they start discipling people. By nowhere do we see them say and by the way, only hang out with Christians, and only do Christian things, and only do if you're gonna make pottery, make sure it's pottery with with the cross on it.
Or who would get saved if the only people you hung out with we're Christians.
Yeah, so look, Heven, the answer really is is go out and you work in the entertainment industry, great, do it with honesty, do all your workings with integrity, with respect, in honoring other image bearers of God. It doesn't necessarily mean you have to cut out work from anyone that's not family friendly. Not necessarily that. It depends on the environment. If you're inviting some comedian and all he does is drop f bombs and you've got kids in the audience,
have good discernment about that. But that you don't have to be a Christian to do that. You could just be a level headed human being that goes is their kid. There's kids out here. Let's not drop the F bomb. But you don't have to preach the gospel. Hey, I only want to bring comedians that preach the gospel would be a mistake. And so if it's a guy and you're bringing in acts that aren't necessarily family friendly, let's just have good discernment on that and not think so
spiritual about it. You don't have to over spiritualize everything you do. Instead, you just work as someone with integrity, with honor, loving serving, sharing the gospel for anyone that asks for a reason for the hope that is in you, and and make that money and then distribute that money back out in the areas that you should be serving in well.
And that could also tie back to the first half of this podcast too, is that you ask how you can be a Christian and do this work?
Well?
First, is it taking you away? Yeah? You know, look at that too, if you more so than working with this artist, that is this or that? Look at hey, am I doing all this stuff? So?
Sorry?
Am I doing all this stuff? In it? Is it taking me away from my church? Taking me away?
Exactly? By the way, Haven, will you join us at a Mais church east of East View High School? Join us at a mass that is where we are members and in Georgetown, Texas. I would love to have you and we could have this conversation actually in person. There you go on a Sunday morning, uh with with Marshall or anybody else that's been on this podcast. Let's do that.
That's awesome.
Moving on here, do we got?
Yeah?
We got we got all kinds of time. I love that. Hey, Grangeer, this is Donita. I'm watching from Rudy, Arkansas. I have really been enjoying your videos from you and Amber's trip to Israel. If you choose to do a trip like that again, where would y'all choose to go? God bless you and your family. Don't need it, Hey, Rudy, Hey don't need it. From Rudy, thank you so much. I appreciate that I sometimes put out videos like that and wonder if anyone watches. So I'm glad you watched. Ant
Man went with me. That was an incredible trip to Israel. We will do you say a trip like that, I think you mean like a mission leaning London and I will be going. Maybe even by the time this podcast comes out, we might already be gone to Latin America for another trip London and I. But yeah, I'm happy to be able to post stuff so that you could see it. Donat us, So thank you for those kind words.
Anyone that has watched those two and remembers Romy, I've been talking to Romy a little bit and pretty much tourism has stopped. Yeah, and ask him any practically obviously you're going to get our prayers. Romi, any practical way I can help you, and he goes, just pray, just pray.
That's good.
Yeah.
Next question comes from Corey says, Hey Grange, I recently found your podcast. I've been writing music since I was about thirteen. From the time I wake up to the time I go to sleep, I can't get music off my mind. I've released eight singles and a music video, completely independent, and I'm moving to Nashville to chase this dream. Oh, you asked the question on the wrong podcast, didn't you?
Sorry?
Corey, Sorry about the everything I've said so far. Do you have any advice for juggling family, getting a new job, tipporarily in Nashville, I'll be attending dark Horse Institute for Songwriting and Composition. I'm twenty nine and I've done blue collar work since I was a freshman in high school. How do I know if this is the path God wants me on. I know if I put Him first in every aspect of my life, he will light the way for me on my journey. I'm just so nervous
that I was I'm going to crash and burn. Thank you for being an inspiration for me for so long. Thank you God, bless brother Corey. Hey, Corey Man, interesting podcast for this mon Yeah, man, I got it. Now I got to say something different than I've said this whole time. So Romans twelve twelve is a good go to for you, Corey, And it's often just kind of missed in life when people are starting to wonder. I'd hope I don't crash and burn. How do I know
if I'm putting God first? Because you're right, I put Him first in every aspect. But what does that mean practically? And so Romans twelve to twelve do not conform to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind. How that by testing you can discern the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect? That's interesting, right? So go read that Romans twelve two? Did I say twelve twelve? Romans twelve to two? Go read that and
think about this. Do not be conformed with this world. That's one thing. But be transformed by the renewal of your mind. That's another thing. That means you don't go with your gut, you know your art, go in my heart, my heart, but use your mind, use your brain. Okay, Grangeer, how do I use my brain? Or Paul Apostle, Paul, how do I use my brain? He says, by testing, you could test so that you can discern the will of God for you, what is good and acceptable and perfect.
That's crazy. And I lived this out and and I've lived this out in very specific ways. One was when I was in the music business and I started feeling outside of the will of God because I how you and I talked about this earlier. An unsettled spirit is one way, and Corey, I think you have that, that's why you're emailing. But when you feel this unsettling in the spirit and you're like, uh, oh, I don't know if this is, like Corey said, the path God wants me on. So you go, let me test it. Let
me test my life right now? How do you test it? Well, put it up against the word of God. So you're consistently reading the word of God, and you start testing. And so this is what I did specifically in music. I go, I think this is weird for me. Let me test it. So I went up on stage and tested my heart with my mind, with my brain. So my brain is monitoring. It's like I've put my monitor on my heart, and I go, Okay, I'm gonna watch you, mister heart, and see how you act during this concert.
And so my brain's going okay, monitoring started. Dude, dude. My heart goes out there, and my heart goes, why are those people in the front row not cheering with their hands up? What's wrong with those people? My brain goes, gotcha, yep, just you just failed to test. Five minutes later, my heart goes, oh, there's a bunch of seats in the back. Last time we came to this city, we sold this place out. What's wrong with these people? And my brain goes, dude,
gotcha yep. And this continued to happen, and I got off and I analyzed the data that by testing, I can discern the will of God, and I go, oh, I failed. I'm in sin this whole concert. My heart was in sin because I tested it against the Word of God because I had pride, because I had these fleshly desires. So you see what I'm trying to say, Corey, is that I'm not It's not magic written in the sky, doesn't have to be like the will of God for
our lives doesn't have to be a mystery. We could just look at the Word of God and then test it with our heart, with our brains, with our mind and go, oh, that's not lining up. I'm not in the will of God.
Well, I think I think you're Also you're putting something there that people will talk about but not do. Yeah, and that is again pointing at myself, is that it's just been more recent. Well, I didn't hear it at church. I didn't read it in somebody's book. Well, I didn't see it. Did you read it in the Word of God. I don't know. I haven't read it.
Yeah, that's usually the answer, I.
Don't know, I haven't read it.
And then then the flip side of this is when people are struggling to make a decision, like say they want to change jobs, like I'm in this job and I don't really like this job, and there's another job and it's more uncertain, and I just don't know if God wants me on that path or not. So the same thing I would say to that is their sin involved? Is there morality involved in the job change? No? Does it require more of my time? Would I be leaving like having less time in church?
No?
Well, I still get a good amount of time as a father and a husband. Yeah. Is the is the industry that I'm moving into sinful in any way? Is it? Is it like hurting people? Right? No? Okay, then just do what you want. If there's no morality involved, there's no sin involved, then at that point we get so paralyzed by these spiritual things and go.
I don't know.
There is the will of God. At that point you can go, well, the will of God's working through my desires, and I want to do it. I don't want to do the old job. I want to do the new job.
We want the burning bush. So yeah, yeah, speak to me in the burning bush.
And you've also analyzed and said, I'm not the kind of person that jumps around. It's not a matter of contentment. I'm just not ever settled. So I it's like I've worked at this job for eight year. It's not a contentment issue. I'm pretty settled and I'm actually very excited about the opportunity of this other job. Do it yep, so, Corey, I hope that helps you. I didn't really. I didn't
address your specific issue. But I think that's kind of the point because I don't need to address your specific issue. I need to get to your heart. And and the more more important question to all this is, you're sentenced right here in the middle. How do I know if this is the path God wants me on. I'm nervous that I'm going to crash and burn. Read his word. Be in church. Have good counsel around you. You gotta have other men around you, Corey that go you say, hey, guys,
is this a good idea? And they go, bro, I don't think I know you, and I don't think that's a good idea. Or I know you man, and I think this is a great opportunity, good wise counsel around you. If you've got all that, then you're you're protecting yourself by testing Romans twelve two. Let's said another question, got another question? Got when we got time? Hey Grange, I live in Canada and I'm looking for a church I work at a hospital, so that includes every second weekend.
I have a church walking distance from me, and I went there on Sunday. No one welcomed me or even said high. I didn't feel welcomed. The sermon was good, but I was wondering should I keep looking for another church or give it another chance. I love all your platforms. London needs to do more.
Lol.
Sandra or Sandra? Do you think it's Sandra or Sandra. I think it's Sandra, Sandra from Canada. I think so it would be the further south, it would be Sondra maybe, but regardless, she said, Sandy ye yee, Sandy, Okay, Sandy, this is a this is a very complicated question that I don't I just don't have enough data. I don't have enough data with you saying the sermon was good and I didn't feel welcomed. I need more or the walking distance thing is cool, but I need more information.
Was the pastor preaching expositionally? Was he preaching from the No, A lot of people say from preaching from the word. That's not what I mean. What I mean was was he using scripture and the point of the scripture was the point of the text That's what I mean. Was he doing that? If it's a solid church, it's close to you. The preacher is preaching good doctrine, and that the point of the text is the point of the message, then what they're lacking you should be able to serve
and go, Hey, this church is lacking good greeters. So I want to join this church and be a good greeterer because I immediately noticed they don't have good people welcoming. So I'm gonna be that. Like we talked earlier about members of the body, be that member of the body.
It's not a restaurant. You know, a church is not a restaurant. You're going well, man, my waiter was terrible. It might be justifiable not to go back. Was the food good? The food's food, you know, it's what you need the moment. That's not necessarily what church is. Church is like, that's one point of all. But it's not the meat potatoes on your plate. Yes, So the word is is the word there?
It's all about that. It's all about the word.
Man. I was blessed with the church that we're members at now that the very first time I'll use this analogy is that it was the right kind of welcome. And what I mean by that is it wasn't overbearing, and it wasn't twelve people, it wasn't three hundred questions. It was I don't I know everybody here and I don't know you.
Oh that's good because.
You could tell. And there were a few people that you know, would walk by and see us and wave or say hi. But there was one person you could tell that that was their passion and that she just came and said, you guys are new here, like, yes, this is our first time here. Okay, well welcome. This is how we do our service here, the whole families together, and so your kids, your daughter's welcome. She'll be in
the main service with you. If you just want to check it out today and just do the service, you can, But we do have Sunday school afterwards if you would like to do that too. There was no pressure. Again, there wasn't like, okay, fill this out and scan this and do that. They were like, if you'd like to fill it out, we'd like to connect with you. If you don't, you just want to check out, that's completely fine too.
You didn't have the guy in the front like spinning the sign you know, like juggling the big sign that says welcome your home.
Yes, but he was the nail salon across the street, that's what it was. Yeah, No, we didn't do that.
That's a good point that, Yeah, sometimes the welcome team could be a little yes.
Yeah, And that is kind of kind of me like, if I'm checking it out, I just kind of want to slip in and then just people just smile and be nice. And that's really hard to find too. That's absolutely the other It's either experience that Sandra had or the experience that we had.
I get it. And you have one more question on this this little sheet here, let me try to get it. It's from Riley says, Hey Grange, I'm twenty three years old from Chilliwack, be another Canada. I don't have any male role models to talk to as as my church is distant and very reformed, no small groups. My dad left me when I was a kid and it's not safe to reconnect with him. Parentheses alcoholic and abusive. I've struggled with doubt and belief, but know that Jesus has
saved me. But I never experienced a radical moment of bleeding of believing I can recall. I just know that the change has happened and is happening. Can you explain more in conversion and also how yours happened? Thanks, Riley? And why did you put this question at the end. It was only if you had time you realized, he realizes I started it. Oh no, he's got ye.
Forgot it was well, I didn't know it till about three lines. Oh yeah, that's right, it's he doesn't.
Yeah, no, Ma, Riley, this this could actual episode, this could be its own episode. Really, the doctrine of conversion, my story, my testimony, your your experience at church with no small groups, which let's just go there real quick, Riley, that's not necessarily a bad thing. We live in a world in twenty twenty four that it's like small group driven. It's like you said, this bird just hit the window. When that was you said it just now you said the meat and potatoes is the preaching is the word.
Let's say that again and say it's not small groups. And so many churches say, well, that's what small groups are for, right. I didn't feel like I got any meat and potatoes. That's what small groups are for. No, they're not that's dangerous.
But so many.
Churches pawn off small groups. They say, our Sunday mornings are for attracting.
People, so invite everyone you can connecting, and small groups.
Are for connecting and learning the word. That's not ever, how it's been and and it's there's a thousand reasons we can get into why that is not a good system, because one and one of a thousand reasons is the pastors can't monitor every small group going on, and that's a that's a lot of work to keep track, especially in a big church with you know what's going on and what group and what group is growing, and what group is not and and are are the leaders of
these groups properly discipling? So that that's why the meat and potatoes, like you said, is always the preaching on Sunday morning. So that doesn't make your church, this specific church good, uh. In fact, it might be a horrible church. It sounds like it might be. Or this could be a matter of you you've been a recluse and you
haven't connected. I think it's a little both. I think it would be a problem, especially if it's a smaller church that they don't come to you and say, brother, how could we how can we serve you, how could we walk with you? Are you struggling with doubt? And how could we talk through these things so that you don't have to email your friend on a podcast and ask him a question that really should go to an elder.
And so if you're not in a church, and I hesitate with this because I don't have enough data points, but if you're not in a church where you can't willingly approach an elder or if he doesn't approach you, and you could have a conversation about the same question you're asking me. My dad's an alcoholic. I'm concerned while there's no small groups, I struggle with doubt and belief. I like Granger Smith and his podcast. I like ye yee.
If you can't have that kind of conversation with an elder, then I would say, let's think about another church where that is something that's cultivated, where the soil is cultivating in a way, where you walk in like ant Man just said, and they go, here's what we do. Are you in a connect Let's do this, and here's the people to talk to. If you're kind of like a ghost in this place and it's distant, like you said, then that could be a problem, and very reformed also
could be a problem. I just don't know. I don't have enough data points besides the fact that say to say, Riley, ask some questions. Ask these questions to church leadership, and you'll know quickly if they're just blowing you off, are they genuinely want to disciple you. And if they don't, then let's go to another place in chili wack BC.
Yep. Yeah, I think that's great advice. And he's addressing something there as well that's very, very prominent in twenty twenty four is no male role models, no male pouring into and if that's not happening, find a place that is, and then make sure that you're becoming one of those people that are.
Yeah, I'll give you the one minute talk here, Riley on conversion. Do you understand and believe that Jesus came from God to reconcile you to himself and become the substitute for the sin, your sin that put him on the cross, and that he paid the price for your sin so that you could be in a right relationship with God. And you have evidence of that moving forward in your life. That manifest in a way that says I want to be part of a good church. I want to know more of him, I want to know
his word. I want to be around other people that understand these kind of things that if that's you, then you are converted. And it doesn't mean you have to have a big radical moment of believing. It doesn't mean you have to all of a sudden act like your Billy Graham or something that you see on the TV. It could be a very very slow moving process, but it all revolves around you knowing the facts that I just said. And if that's you, then you are a saint, you are a brother, and we need to get you
into a good church. Yeah yeah, would you claught up with that at the end. Now, I'm glad. We'll see you guys next Monday. Thanks for joining me on the Grangersmith podcast. I appreciate all of you guys. You could help me out by rating this podcast on iTunes. If you're on YouTube, subscribe to this channel, hit that little like button and notification spell so that you never miss anytime I upload a video. Yi