Claire Danes

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Hi everyone, Amy here. I'm recording this the day before our new episode with the great Claire Danes comes out, and it's an episode we recorded a few weeks ago. And since then so much has been happening in our country, and honestly, it felt strange not to address it.

The intention of Good Hang has always been to bring levity and joy and laughs in these tough times, and we're gonna keep doing that. But before we start this episode, I just wanna send much love to the best people in the world, also known as Minnesotans. What we are all witnessing is terrifying and enraging and illegal, but we are also seeing neighbors helping neighbors. And if you want to help, there is a directory of local organizations and mutual aid groups that you can check out.

At standwithminnesota.com. Minnesota, you're in our hearts. Okay, on with the show. Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of Good Hang. Very excited about our guest today. It is the incredible Claire Danes. I cannot wait to talk to Claire today. Such a pro. She's so good at so many things. And I know she's gonna be a good hang. And we are gonna get into it today. We're gonna talk about her big brain. We are gonna talk about uh the lasting effect.

of my so-called life and how people still love it even to this day. We're gonna talk about her stint on law and order and what that was like. And we're gonna hear about how she met Basquiat in an elevator when she was a New York kid. So much to talk about before we do. We always like to speak to somebody who knows our guest, who has a question for me to ask our guest. And we talk well behind their back. And we have a great one today. The incredible Mandy Potinkin. Mandy.

Actor, singer, activist, now podcaster. Um, you can check out his podcast, Don't Listen to Us, out now with his wonderful wife Catherine and his son Gideon and um Mandy. Um, hi. Can you hear me?

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Hi Mandy. Don't look, Amy. I'm eating something again. Yum, what are you eating? Murray's tuna. Oh, perfect. And vegetarian chopped liver. On Ezekiel cinnamon raisin toast. Wow, that's a lot of flavors. Well, I love the cinnamon raisin and And uh I I eat that'cause my uh my trainer tells me not to eat this other bread that this is the one he wants me to eat and I'm feeling good and so I do what he says. You're a podcaster now. Yes, I'm uh I'm a podcaster.

Do you only talk to podcasters? Is that the deal? I can't stand talking to someone who doesn't have a podcast. Oh trust me, Amy, I know. Right? When you see someone, you're like, what are you doing with your life? It's unconscionable to even think. Yeah. It's horrible. So I wouldn't even I I uh even hearing you say it ups upsets me. Well that that's not an option. You do a show with um uh don't listen to us with Catherine, your wife and your son Gideon.

And um congratulations on that. And they and they don't listen to me, so it always the title is always in operation. How how has it been? Wha what have you been uh learning about yourself and uh in in the process of meeting? It's great, Amy. It's just great being with your family twenty four seven, never a break. You know, just like you know, my son, you know, just can't get enough of his parents. It's just it's just total joy twenty-four-seven. It's just like being in paradise.

Oh just in the uh the podcast to to describe the podcast is uh just uh it's a podcast. It's indescribable. It's just extraordinary podcast. Um it uh has uh my wife who I love I've been with her for seven Forty seven years. If I can stay with her for forty seven years, you can tune in and stay with her for forty seven minutes. And my son, my glorious son Gideon, he it's all his. And then the one mistake is having me at the table as well.

I am such a humongous fan of your work, Mandy. It meant so much to me that I was talking to you today. And we're talking today to Claire Danes, who I know you absolutely love. I adore her. If if I if I had a daughter, it would be Claire. Uh can you tell me where you two first met? We first met In the rehearsal room in Winston Salem, North Carolina.

met. I think that's where we were, where we had the first re through of homeland. And I think that's where I think that was the name of the town where we shot the first three seasons. Pretty sure it was Winston Salem, but I could be wrong. I'm at that age. I don't just look at it's the same thing inside my brain. It's just just wiry gray white mess up there. And uh I'm pretty sure I know it was North Carolina.

So you Charlotte. No, no, it was Charlotte, North Carolina. So that's interesting. So you met in rehearsal for the first time and obviously you were um familiar with each other's work. Um what was your first impression of her? Well, I knew uh she was of the highest pedigree and so I just uh was thrilled to be with her. And um I knew that I wanted more than anything for her, both as Mandy and the character Saul.

Uh I wanted her to feel safe with me. And I wanted her to feel protected by me, and I wanted her to trust me. And I knew that was a tall order, uh, but we sat down uh w with our director to just have our first read through. And she finished the first scene and she said something that I never forgot and I just left. She said, Well, that was some of the worst schmack thing I've ever done.

And I never I never heard that word schmackding. And I loved it. And uh I never heard her say it again because uh I think she's brilliant. I even thought she was brilliant when she thought she was schmackeding. And so um She is uh she's as good as they come. Yeah, you know, in the arena she's uh thoroughbred.

Uh which leads me to my second thought that I had to offer you. Would you like that or do you want to run this? No, I love I l well I don't think with you and I that I'm ever gonna run anything. I think Mandy, whenever we're you're gonna be running it. But I can I can shut up. I I know I love I love I I heard that you wrote down a bunch of questions for her, which I love because I too have so many questions for her. How many do you have on that page? I have I wrote down uh one one.

two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine. Okay. Great. No, no. Eight. Perfect. I I I I I understand why you can you can buy these questions from me. Just go to your website. But I understand why you have all these questions for her because she is to your point, thoroughbred is a perfect word. Like so incredibly gifted. And also your story tells.

uh tells me that she also does not take herself too seriously. It's that combination that's incredible to be around. She was a kid actor, you know? And and the thing is is you've known from working with kids The the magic of them, it's literally magic. They sit there, they play, they play with the other kids, and then the director goes action and they're there with a believability that if you worked at this craft till the day you die, you would never get to be that good the way these kids are.

And she's one of the rare ones that took it into adulthood. And uh and she has that she just believes. She just believes in a way that is I'm transfixed. I I had to do the least work in my life.

Uh because all I would do is just sit and listen to her. You can really feel the love between you two. So let's get to those eight eight or nine questions. You got it. So the next one that I wrote down. Wait, what was the first one again? Uh oh God. Yeah, I I didn't know it was gonna be a challenge. The first one. I have no idea what the first one was. What did I say? Okay, okay, forget it. Look at me, will you, Amy? Look at that. You start you start in the middle.

Don't even ask me my name anymore. Just please have a little, you know, uh sorry, okay. In Yiddish it's called Rahmonas. Have some Rahmanas for what you're dealing with here. R regarding uh her children. Mm-hmm. I'm very curious uh because she's married to an exceptional uh young man, uh uh young in my book and um young in everybody's book. Um I would like to know who is better.

in the family at setting boundaries for the children. Ooh. Is it is it Claire or Hugh? Hugh or Claire, her great actor husband, Hugh Dancy. Now I would like you to ask her something that only she would know. Uh what is Mandy's father's favorite chewing gum? That does that question seems like what you have to answer to get into an exclusive private club. It you are right on the money, and how did she commemorate

The answer to that gift to me. Excellent. Which was one of the great gifts that I've ever been given. Wow. Uh oh, here's a good one. How often uh does she feel she pees, she needs to pee before every take or every scene? Love that. It's it's not a downside. It gives everyone a chance to breathe. We all know that, you know, there's a rest period coming up everything. So okay. Um that was it. Okay, these are great.

These are great questions. And they all speak to what I'm learning about her. And, you know, I I I've known Claire over the years through friends and loved my time spending my spending time with her. But what I've learned about her is Um, she's a really considerate person. She's a very considerate person. She really considers other people. I think it's what makes her a good actress.

and human in the world. You know, the gift of the one of the great gifts of the television series in my humble opinion is that you get to be there for a long time and you really get to know each other and you get to know each other's str strengths and also each other's fragility.

And she learned mine. I sort of wear them on my sleeve, but she learned them quickly and she she just took care of me. She knew how to take care of me when I needed holding and when I needed You know, and and and she knew how to leave me alone.

when I need it to leave me alone time. Beautiful. I know she's gonna be so excited that we talked. I don't know if if she knows. This is might be a surprise to her. I I didn't tell her. I I saw her recently at a political event for uh momdani, which I was thrilled that she was there. Uh and uh but I did mention I I hadn't known about this at that point. Oh that's great. I think she's gonna be so no idea from me. So happy that we talked. Please

Uh take my phone number. I'm gonna take your phone number and I'm gonna call you for advice on a lot uh basically on most things in life. And you're welcome. Well I w And you're just the dumbest fucking person on the planet. Thanks, Mandy. Take care. Bye. Have fun. Bye bye.

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And you do talk about this this being a number eight. business a lot. The and and Enneagram. Wait, you're pretending you don't know what the Enneagram is? I know now because of you but Do you know what your number is? I did it last night. Yes and I don't tell me what it is, I want to guess. I too. You're an eight? I'm an eight. I'm an eight. I screamed. Oh my god. I yelled out loud. Freaking out. Yes. Claire Danes just walked in with a balloon.

With the be by the way, thank you these are beautiful. Yeah, you're welcome. Um, a beautiful eight balloons. Yeah. I'm gonna bring it into frame. Look at that. A gorgeous eight balloon. In in reference to the fact that we are the same enneagram number. Well I didn't know that when I bought the balloon. I just I just knew that you were an eight Girl.

you do talk about it a pretty consensus. This is an intervention and everyone's like, and now you've got the balloon and now shut shut up about it. It's a it's an intervention. Oh my gosh. Um but I Yeah, you're so welcome. But I was so excited that I got to be your your twin eight sister. Listen, if you're gonna start with Enneagram, we're gonna go because I'm very pleased that you're an Enneagram eight. Okay. It makes perfect sense to me.

Does it? I don't I'm very new to this business. Did you learn about Did you read the descriptions of it and feel like it was you? Sure. But I also worry that I might just be a little impressionable and you know, kind of absorb and accept and make it work. Interesting. Well that That's not very eight-like, is it? It's not, but perhaps you've got a wing, you know?

Get a wink. I don't know. I don't know what my own. I'd love to see what your pie chart looked like. Okay. Like what you actually what were your big I wish you had told me you were taking the test because I've I would have sent a text that said, Send me your pie chart, send me your Okay, I'm sure I can find it again. What's your sign? Virgo. Okay. What are you? I'm

Aries Virgo rising. Oh my god. Like Claire, run all of the things. Run all the things. Do all the things. Be in charge of all of the things. I mean, do you find yourself to be like a I mean we know each other, but we don't know know each other. And I've had the pleasure of being around you a lot a lot and a humongous fan of your work, of course. Thank you. And um we were very excited that you said yes today. And Uh

Do you think you're a organized person? Like are you an organized I've gotten much more organized over time. But I do love the container store. I love a container store. So much. A good container will change your life. Jenna, why are you laughing, Jenna? Why are you laughing so hard? Um but uh and what I love about the when when I love the idea of figuring out what Things What are what do things mean to you in your life? Because they actually

It's a paradox. Yeah. They don't mean anything and they m mean a lot. They can be really valuable tools and I think they do carry energy. Like I really do believe that. And they can transport you. They can be little tiny time machines.

Yes. But okay, of course you're an organizer. Of course you're Virgo. Of course you're Ares. Of course you're an eight. Claire Danes is here. I mean, Claire, if I did not love you already, I mean the theme of I feel like the theme of today is um I've always felt like you and your work

were ahead of its time. That's very nice. That's very, very nice. You've always brought me as an artist into worlds that I didn't know I was ready for. You're an intellectually curious person who's interested in interesting things and therefore you kind of you're drawn to those things. Almost like, you know, like the cartoon character when the pie's on the windowsill. Like I feel that with you. You're drawn to interesting things. I am.

True. Thank you for saying that. That's actually very, very touching and meaningful that you say that, really. Well, I can sense it from the choices you made as an artist and um You know, it is like my so called life and homeland and Temple Grandin and um the Beast in Meat, like all these projects and the way you you're kind of leading us into some New territory always, it feels like and new territory for you.

two, which is very exciting. Of course you're an Enneagram eight, you're a challenger, you're incredible. Um but um we're I'm sorry that we're the best, but we are and I'm sorry to all the other numbers. Um but but like it And and I just wanna say this as we like or as we get this this thing started finally, which is you have the ability to as an actor

To stay in your body and be in your brain. Those are two very hard things to mind. This is so. Claire, you're so smart. This is so nice. This is so nice. Um it's hard to balance those two things, body and brain. And I that's why I'm obsessed with the fact that you love to dance. I do love to dance. I love to dance and for me it gets me out of my brain. Out of my brain. Yeah. Yeah. Change. Yes. Um and I don't dance as much as I I don't dance enough anymore. I had a good

wiggle the other night all by myself in my bathroom. I really needed it. Um it was And that's where I've seen you probably the most is on the dance floor. Yeah. Well where our friend Rashida is a pretty great She's had some parties and we've danced in our pajamas together. Yes. And I feel like there's been some awards shows where we've been on the floor, like where dancing regulates what does it do for you? How does it what does it do for your body?

Oh God, it's so funny. I well,'cause it's my son's birthday today. My eldest son, he's turned thirteen and it's like a superpower I have. I uh to I I just like a little tiny wiggle. In public. Like it's just but yes, I I can mortify him within a A millisecond. And even worse is you stop and go, I'm a good dancer. People think I'm a good dancer, and they're like, Mom, please. Oh my god.

Um yeah. Uh but what does it do for me? Well, I mean the best is when you enter that like flow state. Um when you yeah. when it's there's no thought and you're just totally synchronized with whatever sound is coming into, you know, e through your ears. I love watching toddlers dance. The c you know when they jump, they do that thing, they do the bouncing thing. So true. Shay, my my baby, she ha she's very kind of in her head and dreamy and sometimes she'll do this kind of dance. I'm like

Fabulous. Anyway. How old is she? She's two and a half. Okay, I heard something that's amazing, which is that kids from three on like from three to four or three to five are consider them like on mushrooms. Like Hallucinic mushrooms because they're like, the floor is lava, and like I'm feeling the music. And they're like, why do we die? And you're like, whoa, you are tripping. And it's so true that age. She's really fun. You're a real dance.

Well, but never not like a formally trained one. I had this amazing teacher here in the city, a woman named Ellen Robbins, and she was great. Um and like from I from the age of four on, I worked with her. I say that like intentionally. It sounds ridiculous'cause I was a tiny human, but she really took every kid very seriously and over the course of the year you would work towards choreographing your own piece and you would choose the theme and and the music and

I was a moth to flame one year. Yes I was. There was a lot of a lot of that. Closing up and opening again and finding your light.

Little Claire in dance class at four. You are a New York kid. Yes. Um I'm really always interested in kids that grew up in New York. Yeah. What was Soho, what was your version of little kid in New York? Uh you know, a little rough. Yeah. Um I was born in seventy-nine. My parents were artists, they moved to the Bowery in the late 60s, and my dad my dad's

uh mom Claire, whom I'm named after, um, died when he was a kid. And then I guess he he kind of had this money finally that uh and they bought a loft building with another couple that they still own on Crosby Street where I was growing up. So it was you know, we had a swing, we had a trapeze, I would roller skate uh you know, it was it's kind of how we picture it. It was like a roller ring to be living. I had some shame about it too and I had cousins who lived in

the suburbs and all I wanted was to be in a cul-de-sac and have like a basement and carpet on the floor and forget that when we're little we don't want to be different interesting. We wanna be exactly the same. Um but It you know, it was It was... It was also very cool and, you know Basquiat lived in our building and you know, like Yes. Like Did you meet him? I d I remember him. I remember being really little and he you know,

I he was kind he was very sweet. Like he was very Charming Charming and kind of tender. That's what I remember about him in the elevator. Wow. Wow, wow, wow. You know, Keith Herring was just around and Uh yeah, but there was it was also violent and the mafia still existed. So we were on Crosby and Prince, so just on the other side of Lafayette. the different world and felt quite active and did you become a vigilant

Are you a vigilant person or a vigilant kid because On the street? Oh no, in life. Like d yeah. Was there some hyper vigilance that c was created because of that? Yes. Because of New York and also I have very like Funky. Groovy artist parent. Totally. So I there was a rigidity that developed. And uh speaking my language. Yes. And uh like a hyper observance, yes, for sure. And so you go and

Speaking of vigilance and hyper observance, you were on Law and Order as a young person. I was. How old were you? I was twelve. Can you tell me about it Sure. I played Yeah, it was amazing. It was amazing. And I played a teenage murderer. Yeah, my mom was a prostitute, like high end, and her, like Pimp was grooming me to basically do the same thing, but he was kind of presenting himself as a an modeling agent and he was you know, and I took these photos of me.

And my mom found out about it and she inter you know, intercepted and I was Furious. And I took the Scissors from the dark room and stabbed him. I think that's what it was. by another guy a kid, another kid actor, we met an audition who also had been a teen. murderer on law on order. Um that was like our cute Story. Um and now Hugh is on Law and Order. I know. Which is wild. I know. And we have so much good um like gear, like swag, Law and Order swag. We have a giant button that goes

Dun dun that w that the kids really, really like and we do have to hide sometimes. But It's just incr first of all, it just employed so many actors. So and still does. It's a total break. I I was also very sure the day after it aired, there was like a screening party. It was sweeping that like it was gonna be a problem for me to ride the subway. Like'cause I was gonna be so famous. Um and um it was fine. Everybody was fine. Everybody No, it was it was pretty comfortable, uh still.

For me. Now you brought up my so called life when how old were you when you auditioned for that? I was thirteen when I did the pilot. And I was and then it didn't get picked up. Yeah. Um, and I'd gone to public school my whole life, but then like had made money from these acting jobs. and uh could afford to send myself to private school so I went to Dalton and but yeah, then but in

Like the very start of my freshman year we got this call saying, Oh no, they are going to pick it up. So I was only physically there for a semester and then we were off to LA. Wow. And was kind of tutored from that point on. Now, I mean, I know you've talked ad nauseum about the experience you had making that show, and it is still so zeitgeisty, that show. It's really it was a very special

exp thing. When you were making it it felt like a special sparkly thing? I rem I rem I remember reading the pilot, um, I guess before the audition and and and and just having a very profound, you know, experience. And it was really powerful to have some woman, some writer person so perfectly articulate my internal life. Um, yeah.

Who's still a dear, dear friend and just a wildly inspired, hilarious Andrew? Wicked. Yes. Just this little indie called Wicked. Yeah. Yeah. Which is basically about like teenage girls, you know, and and their their intimacies and and their their friendships. Um yeah. She's and Winnie was Winnie was the creator of the show. She was yes, she was the creator of the show. And uh

And we were both working so hard. We barely saw each other. But we were, you know, in this very deep relationship. Um in our imaginations, you know. Uh yeah. Did you chemistry read with Jared Leto for No, no, no, no. He just got hired and then you guys had to kind of get find find the chemistry there. He was like in the Noxima commercial. That was very exciting. Yeah.

He was so hot. Oh my god. Oh my god. It was ridiculous. J you know, Jordan Catalano is like become one of those names that's always incredible. The full name. Yeah. Um Jordan Cal and there was also a character on the show called Tino that you never saw. Um anyway. There are so many But I but do you have a theory? Because you know now with perspective, like what what do you think resonates still with with Angela's like

Well it's still radical. Yes, I don't think I think and it remains ahead of this time. Like I it shouldn't have been made. It no it it w almost wasn't made many times and um and it just willed it wills itself into existence. I don't know, it's not very often that we spend that much time Intimate time. with a a a teenage girl. Yeah. Not really. Yeah. We're seeing the world from her from inside of her. Um and really through her vantage point when she's

And she's so earnestly wrestling with big stuff, you know? Um and sh and it's I yeah, it's just so well balanced and it's so it's so of her, you know, but it's You know, I was rewatching that moment, the like beautiful moment where that w is played over and over again on TikTok every day of my life'cause it's on my FYP, but of um

of when Jordan comes over to Angela and says, Can we go somewhere? And you say, Sure. And he you walk off with him and he takes your hand in front of everybody. And that feeling of being chosen publicly is a big major major deal for a young woman and and young man. But why the show I think separates itself from others is Also, editorially, we know what all the other characters are feeling like. Like we cut to everyone else's. feeling about not being chosen or

the wrong person being chosen. Like everyone's having a feeling like we're we're feeling everybody's pain, psychic pain or joy in that moment. It's so that's that's a very well stated Uh yeah. It's well well analyzed scene. Um I've watched about times. Um no it wa and it w yes, it was it was I feel wildly fortunate that that was my entry point.

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And you've worked with the right. what I imagine only imagine are really some very interesting, complicated, and maybe at times difficult people at a young age. I I project on you that you have to like figure out how to be self possessed and be your own artist and your own, you know, like protect yourself and also be among these like Really

complicated adults. Do you feel like there was some inner Claire thing that helped you navigate all that early stuff? Do you feel like kids are doing that all the time anyway? Not every kid. Okay You know, I think this is um, I don't know. I also I remember people I never felt like a kid.

And now now that I am a parent and I have actual children, I'm like, Yeah, no, I for sure was a kid. There's no way Do you think you were gonna r I sometimes think I f I never felt like a kid either. I I when I was about eight or nine I was like, I'm in charge here. I did. I was like these people were like I just remember being like, No, I'm in charge. My first memory I don't know if it's real or not, obviously no idea. But was Pre verbal.

I rem I was an infant. I remember where I where I was, I was uh by my the windows on our in our loft on Crosby Street, I overlooking Lafayette Street. and I had been handed to some other adults that I didn't know very well and they didn't know how to hold a baby. And I remember having I'm just like okay.

This is one of those grown ups who don't know how to do this. They're uncomfortable. Wow. There's nothing I can do about it. I'm just gonna have to wait it out. Um yeah. Yeah and then I remember my blue reading. Louie. Um and then my second memory was being on the a kitchen island and I was just about I just was starting to w have some language, but not quite enough. And I was kind of playing charades with my mom and I wanted to get to the uh to the counter, like the other side of the kitchen.

And she was really frustrated and she and I and I felt such empathy for both of us and I was like this we c uh this cannot continue. Like I really, really need to crack this language thing because I mean poor us. This is too hard. Amazing. So yeah, it was like that always. And people would say like how, you know, I I you know Uh it's so remarkable that you can deliver performances at such a young age, I was like

Like, what are you talking about? I feel like I've been here for this has been an eternity. Like eleven years is so many years. And it felt very rich. I was like, I've got enough material.

For four lifetimes. It makes total sense to me because when you're in Little Women and you're dying. I was like, she's been here before. You had to reshoot that scene. I can't even just my side. Oh. Because apparently. I got too excited about the death rattle.'Cause of course I read like five stages of dying. I like and really studied whatever illness Beth had. Sure. And I got a little carried away. Um I told a little story to Matthew Reese and he calls me um Death Rattle Danes.

But Jillian Anderson, the director, lied to me. I only learned this like last year. Oh literally. Then said that that Coke had spilled on the negatives of the film and that we needed to reshoot. Well, that's a nice thing. Like calm the death rattle down a little bit. Yes. So that's a factoid. By the time you were twenty, you were already in thirteen movies. Yeah.

And you went I did not know that. Okay. Went to school, went to Yale. What did you study there? I thought I was gonna be a psychology major and then it ended there ended up being like a lot of lab work involved with that. Um That's not what I meant. Uh um eventually I think I would have been I didn't f complete my time, um, and I never had to declare a major, but if I

had, I think I would have been an English major, which is what I meant. You know, I d I I didn't yeah. Um I didn't want it to be I the si I the science part was less interesting to me than the character studies. Slidey Doors fantasy that you would be a therapist in another way? Well, my best friend in the whole wide world from the age of nine on is a therapist. Um thank you.

I did pretty well. Best for another church. I chose well at nine. Um and and and actually it's really fun. We do kind of play Barbies together with my characters. Like if I'm starting a project will think about it in those kind of formal terms and she'll diagnose her and Yeah, cool. It is c it's actually very handy. Yeah. Um And occasionally at lunch, like uh I'll see her kind of it'll be do-do-do-do I see her shift from Ariel, you know, into therapy and she'll ask. She'll say

Is it okay if I, you know, go into actual formal therapy mode with you now? Yes, please. A dream. Um so so y yeah, I I I mean that So okay. So I'd wanted to be an actor from the age of five onwards. and then People would tell me, you know, most actors actually don't make that much money. It's a fairly insecure career choice. And continues to be And I had a pr practical side and I thought, okay. All right, fine. I'm gonna be a therapist and I'm gonna

live in the suburbs. I was gonna live next door to Ariel. We were gonna share a pool and we would have two slides in our respective yards that would go into the same pool. I would be a therapist and do acting workshops, yes, to like f nourish the soul. And that was my plan for a good year and I made an actual announcement one night at the dinner table and I said

Look, guys, like who am I kidding? There is no plan B. I am an actor. Money or no money, this is this is my calling. And my parents like, uh-huh, sure. Um I was so serious. It's ridiculous. Um and I love that person because that person's d making a declaration. Yeah, I r and I really meant it. And I went to, you know, I took

Saturday acting classes at Lee Strasberg, which is in my neighborhood, and I pass almost every day and it's a total trip. But yeah. Anyway um, so yes, but actually my favorite class

Was a graphic design class. Ooh. My very favorite class. And then I thought, oh, maybe if I weren't an actor, I would be a uh that kind of person. I can see I I can see all these things. Like what I what I Like love about your work is that It feels and again, uh it just feels like when you're watching you work.

that there's just real life that exists in your life. Like you have a real life. You're a real person. A sane a sane real person. I'm trying. And then so then when we're watching you play people, when you're w they feel like real people. There's just a little bit uh you just kind of can't explain it. People have it or they don't, where they feel like they've actually existed on the earth and had a real life. And people that are kind of um in a just a different

sphere of s I don't know. And there's something that feels uh Like you have taken care of other parts of your life. It was g it was good for me to do that. I really needed a timeout. Yeah. I needed to not have so much responsibility. Uh And I needed to like fuck around a little bit and like get stoned and play Mario Kart, you know. Um Uh That doesn't need to go away. That was That doesn't need to go away. As important as, you know

the the work I was doing in class, which was also really, really wonderful. And um And I also felt like validated as a thinking person. Um I feel like you've spoken about like the kind of wonderful things about perspective and getting older. What's the best thing about being the age you are? That it's perfectly okay to have the same breakfast every morning. Mm-hmm. To exercise for 45 minutes to an hour. Um How's your bone density? I don't know and I should know and I don't lift enough weight.

Nobody everything. I like lifting my own body weight. I really like yoga these days, but it's not enough. Apparently you have to lift actual iron. And you run. You're a big runner. I used to run more. The third pregnancy really kind of dent. So for people who don't know you had a pregnancy uh a c few years ago, uh kind of a surprise. Ooh Whoa Out of the blue. That whoa. Did you

Um burst into tears like oh no I have to get pregnant again? Totally. I called my my OBGYN in convulsive tears. Yeah. Um I it was it it was a pure like it was all meltdown. Oh no. Because you had what a what like a twelve year old or or like a ten year old and a six year old or something? Yes. I mean, he must have been around eleven, twelve, yeah. I I they're five years apart, each kid, n none of this was by design. Um but Yeah, I didn't know it was physically possible. I was forty four and

Um and actually Rowan was very hard earned. I had to do two rounds of IVF. Like it just was so unlikely. So this is a funny story that I'm gonna share about my best friend. Okay. So um And this is Ariel? This is Ariel. Okay, Ariel. She gets name checked a lot in these things. Well, she is your therapist. And she's other people's therapist too. And I would like her to be my just ruined her career. I'd like her to be But uh yes, so We we had this like uh spa day scheduled.

And and I admitted to her and I wasn't I wasn't coping very well with the heat. I kept I was like, I'm sorry I'm such a pussy. I gotta get out of here. Anyway, and so I wasn't gonna say anything and finally I admitted. I was like You know, I c I totally lost my mind last night and just decided that I was pregnant. I went down this crazy rabbit hole.

And finally, like looked up, what are the odds of naturally conceiving at forty four? And they're like less than one percent. And and I was like, So that obviously is ridiculous and she said Whoa. That's really weird. Because I had this dream last week. She said it was really vivid. And I told people about it. I mean, I didn't say it was you, but I had this dream where I was pregnant and I looked down and I saw my distended belly and I said, Oh, I'm wait, but this is a really

This isn't my torso. This is a long torso this is Claire's torso. You have a great torso. Thank you. But um yeah. And she was in she was She had this dream where she looked down and saw that she was pregnant but she wasn't pregnant. She was in my pregnant body. And then the you know, I had two strong cocktails when we had dinner. And then first thing in the morning hit the CVS and it was just like bowl cap locks, you know. Yeah.

Pregnant and I burst into tears. Because for for me the thing would just be like You know what you know now. You know what you're in. I well that was that was fair deeply humbling. Yeah. Because I realized, oh I am not authoring this thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. This is really this is the illusion that I am

like driving this thing. Yes. So you had to surrender. I really did. Yeah. And then this beautiful girl emerged and she's the best and none of it was up to me and I'm just delighted. Yeah. But

But she was disruptive. We had to move. It was a thing. It was a lot of work. Well, it's interesting. Like her origin story will be I bet, we'll just like naturally be like, you really wanted to be here. She did. And she's psyched. Like she is all about it. She's having a great time. Um unequivocally like into this living business. Um Yeah. Yeah. I mean I I it it is that's the thing about I I think about the best and worst thing about late forties for me mid fifties is

You kind of know the deal. So it's like, okay. That's gonna be this. Uh-huh. And okay, this one's gonna hurt. Yeah. Or you know, there's still stuff to discover, certainly, but there is a sense of It's amazing to have so much of your life like established and you know Yeah. Um i i i i realized, like and set. Well you've experien it's basically you've uh You've come through things and you've and you've made it. Made it through something. Yeah, and there's a lot of um I don't know power in

Sad.'Cause I'm really, really aware of time now. Me too. It's really like the big thing I I crave. I crave time is my time is a thief. Yeah. And it's and it's it's it's actually and I'm sure you're this way too. more and more with work or with any project, it's the thing I care about the most. How much T and you know, it makes me think about your work on Homeland, which was a ten year

Commitments. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of time. A lot of time. Hard work. Yeah, it was. Hard work. It was and and we were all over the planet. Like we were in so many different countries. Um and I had two kids. Yes. And I was like fighting terrorists while deeply pregnant. It was weird. Did you have a um a thing like you liked to do on that show when you saw on the call sheet were like, ooh, today I get to do this.

You know, because like it was like today oh and you know, maybe it was like today I get to what's cool that after a while like you know, a few seasons in people knew Carrie Matheson and and every it was almost like an anthology series, like we would reimagine ourselves every year. But you know, so a new set of actors, you know, I'd walk into a room and they would

like get quiet and be chastened and I like had this power that, you know, I I had earned over seasons, you know. And that was pretty fun. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And never have I ever had that experience in my life, nor will I ever again, even in a fictional realm, you know. But that was like amazing to have that kind of Swagger? Yes. Yeah. And And what was that what was hard to shoot? Like was it like

I mean just the like balancing life I'm sure and traveling all over'cause it shot everywhere. It shot here especially when Brody died. Spoiler alert, Claire. I remember so we sh it was also like really rough, just really graphic. Like they really went there over like Come on. Intense. It was so intense. But like he dies on a crane. I know. But then the crane when we were filming broke. Oh no. So like we were really hung up by that. Um but uh I don't know. It was like

Landing in a new because that was in where did we shoot that? That was in Morocco. But yeah, so uh the first three seasons we were mostly in Charlotte, North Carolina, which was standing in for DC, and then we would make these jackets like a we would shoot a month in Israel or Morocco or something. Yeah. But then when we when we had to really redefine the show in a more met uh you know, macro way, we then became this traveling, you know, enterprise. So we were shooting in

in Cape Town for half a year, which was standing in for Palestine and Afghanistan. The next year we were where were we? There was a year in Berlin, then a year in New York, which Yeah. that was actually very strange to be home and weirdly stressful because like people expected me to go to dinner. Like my friends were like, You're here, let's hang out and I was like, I am working so I have to get uh tied up and beat up

tomorrow. And then I can't tie it. I can't do this and live my life. There was something nice about being on location and just being allowed to like give myself entirely to it because I didn't have any energy to spare. Yeah. That was actually weird. That was the weird Almost the hardest season because I kept like I I I you know There was this illusion that I was living my life and I c I couldn't. Yes. Yes. And then where were we? Then we were

I don't even Then it was a full year in Morocco. Wow. What was what's Morocco like? Um pretty great. I was nervous about spending so much time there and I I I grew to really love it. Cyrus went to school in all these places too. So he he still can't eat couscous because he ate it at every meal every day for six months at this school. Um Um That must be very cool for him to have his memories of traveling. Yeah, I wonder what he

You know, what can what he can consciously recall? I think that he was s like five or six. Six. So that six that he could. Yeah. He also his first school that he went to was in Berlin and he was he was around three. And uh and he started to have temper tantrums like Half in German. And he would scream, Nine, Nine

Whoa. Suddenly this like sounds this is a lot scarier in this language. Um and and he would around that time, like when we would come home and we'd be at the playground at Washington Square Park, you know, he would toddle over to other tiny people and say, Hi, my name is Sywes. I speak English because it was like not a given that another. Does he speak does he speak another language? Nine. If I could, you know

put a chip in my brain and be able to speak in a different language. Same. Bat and fly. Yeah, fly. I mean Yeah. Yeah. But the langu almost feels like it has the same th thrill level. And you know what I love about speaking other languages is you have to do like a version like a funny you almost have you have to move your body and your face. In a version that feels insulting. It feels stereotypical. But you have to to get the language right. Well, there is that kind of

Uh and you ha or if you're Italian you have to gesticulate or like there's all these different things like there's a reason why people move the way they do, getting back to movement. Yes. I love learning dialects for this reason. Oh I look I think humans are humans and y you know, it is mostly a universally shared experience, whatever that is. But it's also true that there are real differences and we go we do like see the world through these slightly different these different filters.

And it does shape us and inform us and that is also kind of amazing. I'm really into that those kinds of differences again without appropriating them or getting them wrong. But because we are in a monoculture now, everything is the same now. So now it's like oh my Whoa, th the way you express this thing or the way you like language still feels sometimes like a way taking

of getting into some new little world. Yes. And it's so k like it's I I'm I delight in the ways that we're not the same anymore. Because everything is the same. Every Fucking stores in the sink. Yeah. Do you and I do. And I think a lot of them I don't I don't do. Well, you do. You totally do. You imagine yourself and a d you know, as being a different person. True, but dialects are their own real I mean, that's a real that's real acting. No, look at the Players. If I have a good

Coach. I'm all about it. Do you like to improvise when you act or I haven't had that many opportunities to I don't I guess in I guess in more dramatic stuff it's hard to do. They don't let you because they're on the crane. They're like He's up on the crane, you can't and you're like, just give me uh I just want a riff.

Yeah. Uh crane work is pretty strict. Um uh but no, I don't know. I I would be really intimidated by that actually if I'm not sure. I feel like you'd be so good. I feel like That seems scary. And um they did give me pages and then they disappeared. They were like, don't look at those. Yeah. And I was like, but wait, I learned them. And they were like,

Like, oh, sorry. Um should have known better. Um uh and they were like, you know what? We're just gonna like do it as we wanna do it in the moment and I wanted to vomit. Um I have no I I worked in at S N L and it's where I realized like, oh, preparation is This this thing that people do. No. Um it's this thing it's this thing that when people bring it to the process and someone says like, and also let's try this, it's hard to not feel like, wait. Wait.

What what are we doing? Like it's a it's it is a learned skill to just assume that things aren't wrong if We are not doing what we prepared.

I mean I am I mean I'm ridiculous. I mean, I'll go to the writer and say, is it okay if I like put the comma here rather than there? And they're like, don't come to me with this bullshit. Like, I'm sorry. But I and I think actually because I started as such a young age, my socks are still up to my knees a little bit. You know, like there's still that like

little girl who's just wanting to do a good job. Um, I don't know if that's because I was actually a little like a literal, literal little girl, say that five times fast. Um, when I began or maybe that's just in me and wouldn't have been if I started at thirty, but I don't know. Yeah, you uh you do such a good job. Thank you. You're so you're easy. You're so good at your job. You are so thank you good at your job. Thank you

And you are so good at your show. I love listening to your show. I listen to it a lot. Thanks. I heard that you love podcasts. I love podcasts. Me too. But you have one of the very best ones. Oh my god. Thanks. And it's it's um it's it's really wonderful. Thanks. Really. Speaking of wonderful, we do a thing on this podcast where we talk to someone who knows our guests. Okay. We talk to Mandy Potanka. Mandy Mandy who I

I saw the other night. I hadn't seen him for a long time. I mean he is his I mean It you could tell in the show, but I also loved knowing that outside of the show the relationship you two had. Yeah. It was it felt very paternal, very respectful. There was a lot of love there. I Love him madly, truly, deeply. And also he's just an amazing person to act with. Um and How come? Okay.

He's very musical. Um but that this was a weird thing. In the first read through, we barely met each other and it Just like the music work. You know, my cadence and his cadence were in really good harmony with each other. And that was like can't can't nobody can take.

credit for that. That was just really good fortune. And you know, I played this manic person. I'm almost like getting into it now that you're saying that I'm thinking about it. So she's like a stone skipping, you know, on the water. And he's you know, has a much you know, he has this like low pulse rate as Saul and is so steady and is her ballast and, you know, this counterpoint. Um yeah. Well he adores you. He calls you a thoroughbred. Oh.

Well, thanks. He's just a really, really, really good performer. Um I don't quite know how he does what he does, but it was also always fun to see him. At the gym, the hotel gym, or whatever weird apartment complex we were living in, like singing his Yiddish songs, prepping for his tour, like on a stairmaster. Right.

I also I just love a big man. Yes. I do. Yes. I love a big man. Um I sometimes I love feeling small. Like in relationship. Do you know the like the idea of like big and small? No. Which is v basically like

Some days you wanna feel big and some days you wanna feel small. So some days you wanna be like, I'm gonna take us get us to the airport, I'm in charge of whatever, I'm big today. And other times you're like, I wanna be small today. And it's like being taken care of, but also can just kind of feel physical, like sometimes

When you're like at you know, I don't know, you're bossing it up all day at work, you wanna come home and feel small and vice versa and being able to have someone kind of do that with you. It's like CEOs who go to the DOMs. Exactly. It's a subdom thing. Um so those are all Mandy's questions. No, I'm just kidding. Um so Mandy wants to know are you no.

Um okay, so he had ten questions for for us. That's a lot of questions. We're not gonna we can't get that's a lot of questions. This is Mandy had ten questions. Yeah, he really over prepared, which is very nice, but also he couldn't get on the zoom and he was eating when he was on the zoom too. So it was it was like mixed messages, but Um but he was so eating the lackers that he had made. He was eating a delicious ru uh cinnamon raisin bagel, I believe. Okay. Um

And it looked delicious. He likes peanut butter and an apple too. Oh, that's a great snack. That's a great set snack. Um, okay. So you had a couple questions. Okay. Who is better at setting boundaries for the kids? You or Hugh? Oh. Goes back and forth. Okay, that's good. Um so Cyrus wants to wear shorts. He's like a gaffer.

All the time. There's a whole thing uh do you you're not on TikTok, I'm sure. No. Oh congratulations. But um there's a whole thing about middle school kids always wearing shorts. It's r it it makes me so upset. Let it go. I'm here to tell you my boys are older. Let them freeze their buneroonies off. Don't say one thing, don't ep, don't mention a coat. Okay. So Uh I've said Fifty or below you have to wear shorts. Hugh is more team fire so fifty or below you have to wear pants. Sorry, pants.

And sudden now he was like kind of being more permissive and that number uh uh w went down to forty. Yeah. Middle school kids waiting for the bus in short and by scientific I mean it's on TikTok. Um about kids waiting for the bus with shorts. They boys love shorts in middle school. Yeah. It's a whole thing. What okay, whatever. And they run hot.

And they're not gonna get a cold from the cold, you know that. And just let'em do it. Okay. They will grow out of it, I promise. Then they'll become obsessed with like sweats and sleeping and being warm and they'll always be freezing. Uh yeah. Okay. All right. My family thanks you. Okay. Um but but I actually think that Hugh and I are pretty we're very lucky, like we're well matched humans. And I think our n in na our parenting styles are pr are pretty

level and equal as well. Love that. It's good. You guys are a really, really special couple. Thank you. Uh he's a very he's a swell dude. Yeah, you can tell. And you can tell you have a lot, like a lot of love and a lot of like for each other. Both those things are important. And so many children now. Yeah. So many. They're outnumbered. They're out numbered. Um anymore. Okay, Mandy's next question. And this now now Mandy's referring to himself in the third person. Oh um it's the uh black

l licorice. Oh, I embroidered something for him. That's what he was asking. How did you commemorate Um Because he he us he would chew it as salt. Because and I think he mentioned at one point that but I'm I'm forgetting the name of the book. Did it come like in a tin? Blackjack. Blackjack. Blackjack was the gum. Was the kind of gum. Okay. And um and you made and you embroidered something. I went I went hard on the embroidery for a while. Let's talk about this embroidery. You embroider do you

Uh uh I don't really know. There was a point when I embroidered everything around me. I embroidered an umbrella. That was weird. Um I so my mom taught me and you know it started because in my 30s I was away from my friends and we were at the everybody was having babies. And I was really missing them. And so I embroidered onesies from my friend's babies that w I embroidered their name and then an image that related to the name somehow. Um but it was really more about just

Communing with them. Embroidery by hand. Yes. Okay. Um and and it we started with the onesies and then it just then it went haywire. It's a great onset activity. Yes. And I c did it a lot more before I had children. Mm-hmm. Um and I also found the contrast amusing. And enjoyable. Like that I would be fighting terrorists as Carrie and then I would go back to my seat and embroider. Knitting or crocheting, do you do that? I went on a knitting jag to then that didn't

Take. So I I embroider once these for, of course, all of my kids, and I have one for Shay. This is their child. She's all she she's a it's not she doesn't wear onesies anymore. I've missed that. It's okay. I'm confessing. I'm I'm actually confessing to you. You know, I mean it's by my what we're supposed to do. Anyway. We've done it all. Okay. I mean, no no more. You gotta start. I don't know. Um uh that's what I tell every woman. And then um I wanna talk about the beast in me. Okay. Um because

I love the fact that you are producing on this and I wanna know what that experience has been like producing I loved it. It was just really fun. Yeah. Like hire people who I admired and trusted and you have a I mean you've like you said, you've been producing

Probably you've been producing without credit for a long time. And you've been producing and seeing you've been on sets for a long time. And you're realizing like, Oh, I wanna I want I wanna bring my system here. Yeah. And that first week I was just I was that just had a blast. I was really like, I like everybody here. And I realized, all right,'cause, you know, I asked them to the dinner party, right? And um right. Yeah. And it was so nice to like

I don't know, not be surprised by the home that suddenly I was discovering on the first day of filming. Like I got to have a say on what that house would actually be. And um yeah, I've I really enjoyed it and it was just like a lot of Zoom calls. That's okay. Yeah. Um but they were conversations I wanted to have and be a part of. And yeah. So it's on this next gig, I'm c more of an actor for hire. So you're playing a neurosurgeon and can we talk about the pit?

Sure.'Cause you love it. I do love it. What do you love about it? Well, Noah Wiley. I mean Noah Wiley. Okay. Did you watch ER when it was on? No. But I would think I was a little too little. Yep. It was on maybe while I was shooting my soul called Life, is that right? I don't know. Maybe maybe I'm getting that timing wrong. But um Yeah, I was aware aware of it, but I didn't watch it. But no, he feels so credible.

But and I really think all those hours he put in as a T V doctor have accrued. Totally. And he has a kind of gravitational, you know, gravity now. Yeah, he does this. He he it feels like he's doing f he's doing his blocking without the floor. I feel so convinced. Totally. Um and uh no and I just think it's

It's also like feels a little throwbacky. Like it's so nice to watch excellent TV. Love. Love. You've made excellent TV. Thank you. But I enjoy watching excellent T V. It's my favorite thing to watch. T V are better than movies, sorry.

TV's better than movies. I love movies. I'm a little worried about movies. I really am a little bit worried about it. Well they gotta get their shit together. Don't kidding me. I love movies. I love movies. I love it all. Is there anything that you watch I know you are a big pot listen to podcasts, is there anything you watch like just for like kind of Brain checkout fine. I know you ask this sometimes. So I had a prepared answer.

Um there is You're the only person that's ever prepared. I want you to know this. Of course, Claire. T okay, Tim Robinson. Yes. So he's he has this there's this one sketch from the show of focus group. Incredible. Look, you just gotta owe. You just gotta o. We watch this all the time in our family. Do your kids watch it? Well uh so so all the kids are allowed to watch this. So Cyrus So we tuck the little guys in and then then we have like special mature viewing hour.

And it started with like the Simpsons and and then The Simpsons is always the gateway. Mur only murderers in the building. Omib, which is basically Scooby-Doo for grown-ups. And um and it's great. And and then and it's and then Hugh English husband introduced him to Monty Python stuff. He got really into that. Yes. Um but Now we've been watching mostly because of this focus group, um, his latest show, which is uh The Chair Company. Yeah, which there was a So

Safe for works moment. I mean the whole genius of the show is that it takes you in very quickly to places that you are not prepared for. Totally. We're we're all like cuddling in bed. Totally. And then there is this giant erect penis. And Hugh says, Close your eyes. Everybody close your eyes. Cold up is your eyes! We all we yeah, it was intense. We're still recovering. It was intense. Yeah, but it was great. So we do love that show. I think that like

What Claire, what I understand why you would like this, because number one, I think you are like I I've known you to be a very fun, funny and like comedy you love comedy. I do. And you have good taste. Thanks. And there's a tiny bit of a disruptor in you that I imagine is fun to watch. Yes. I think you're right. Speak and we the other thing that we've been watching is the latest South Park.

Oh we should talk about. Wild. What? No they are just saying the thing. Just a chicken in a hen house. A fox no, it's a fox in a hen house. Didn't get that right. That makes me head out. Thank you for that. Um Well, thank you. This is this was

Amazing. This was so n this was really nice. This is so fun. Um birthday present to me. No one's ever brought me a balloon. Thank you for bringing a balloon. And again, for people that are sick of me talking about the entigram, I don't know what to say. I but let me just read you this as we wrap up. Up and see if any of these land. These are things that annoy an Enneagram eight. Are you ready? Sure. People who talk just to talk.

very annoying. That is deeply annoying. And I have a podcast. But um yes. People who talk just to talk. Fake people. Oh beyond. I mean I'm like I literally if someone's like I'm a I I'm a piece of shit or whatever, I'm like, okay, great. But fake? No way, babe. Uh people who aren't on time. Uh I have to have some tolerance for that because I am not the same. I was late today. The Jenna's always on the most punctual person. And then this one really scratches an itch for me.

Others asserting power in a situation where they have none. So I went through a period in junior high where I became like a vigilante and I I would like rough I would like confront the bullies. For eight hate bullies. Yeah. Really. And and I went to the principal's office one time because I like sla like I hit a bully. And It's exciting. And we've talked through it, the bully and I. And um and actually we made some progress.

And then he was so deferential to me and so and he would open doors like he was really you know. But um I I had to stop that because It was like going on my record. Um But yes, I mean so I think I Yes. Yes, uh that that r that I that makes sense that that would be anything. Like that's that's that's my like embarrassing fantasy that I stick up for people in public. When I so there was a there was a bully in elementary school.

And I admitted to my mother at one point that like my self soothing um fantasy it would And this boy and I would were at the center of it, and I was just beating the shit out of him. And I was like, is that okay to have that van? And she was like, your thoughts are your own. Enjoy them. Which was a nice um a nice bit of mothering there. Yeah, really. We've come full circle back to New York, back to the apartment. It did help. It was nice. Yeah.

I could talk to you forever, Claire. I could too. Thank you. Thank you so much. It was so fun. Thank you so much, Claire Danes. That was so fun. I could have talked to you forever and ugh. You're so interesting and smart and funny. Um, so thanks so much for that time. And for for uh the polar plunge today. I guess I just wanna remind everybody how good law and order is, especially the first ten seasons.

Okay, just go back and watch find Claire as the young, you know, child maniac. And um just go back and and here's a little tip. Whoever you recognize, they did it. So it's a young actor just starting out, they're the murderer. So take that tip with you and go check out a little show called Law and Order. I can't get enough of it. And you know, it's these kind of new things that I'm gonna fill you in on when you uh take the time to listen to the polar plunge. So

Thanks so much for listening and um see you soon. Bye. You've been listening to good The executive producers for this show are Bill Simmons, Jenna Weiss Berman. The show is produced by The Ringer and Paper Kite. For The Ringer, production by Jack Wilson. Spalane, Kyah McMahon. And Aleia Zanaris. For paperkite. Production by Sam Green, Joel Lovell, and Jenna Weiss Berman. Original music by Amy Miles.

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