#121 S4 EP 31: Transforming Mistakes into Trust: Lessons from Matt Shoup

I don't want to mess up his last name because y'all know I will . But , uh , before we get into it , um , we will let you know that he is a award-winning , uh , entrepreneur , bilingual , uh , keynote speaker . He's a leadership facilitator .

He has founded six successful companies and been featured in Fox Business , the BBC , the US News and World Report and Entrepreneur Magazine . Another fun fact is he is a Brazilian jujitsu . Thank you . He is that of a black belt . So I'm excited about this conversation and I hope that you all are . Some more things I'm sure he'll share himself .

But before we do that , y'all know we got to have a word of prayer , so let's go honey .

We thank you for just forgiving us for the things that we do that's not pleasing to your sight . We pray in the name of Jesus . You will take those things that's not pleasing to your sight and cast them back into the hell where they came from . We pray in the name of Jesus for the ones that says pray for me .

We pray in the name of Jesus that you will get the glory from him . We counsel any assignment of the enemy that will be sent back into the pits of hell where it came from . For your word says it has no power over us .

What's your thought ?

But I had a lot of energy , a lot of creativity and I found marketing sales , knocking on doors , cutting grass , shoveling snow at a very young age . So business has kind of always been my thing and we started a company back in 2005 in the residential house painting industry . I graduated college , I got fired from a mortgage banking job that I hated .

They didn't like me , I didn't like them , I wasn't having a fun time there and all I knew how to do back then was run paint crews because I painted my way through college . So that was kind of my jump into . You know I was selling candy bars as a kid when I'm 12 years old , but not tons on the line , you know , I've still got a roof over my head .

But in 05 , I'm recently married , we just bought a home , had a car , had school loans , we had lots of debt and getting ready to start and raise a family , so really jumped right in with our first company and that's really led the way and paved the way for some other companies that we have here in Northern Colorado Paintings turned into painting and roofing .

We also have a real estate side . I help people buy and sell real estate , and then we've currently partnered with the Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Academy , so I get to teach little kids self-defense and just anti-bullying .

I get to work with a lot of kids that are going through what I went through as a kid and get to give them the tools that I didn't have at the time .

I know the answer , but I want our listeners to know how Painted Baby came about and what is it really speaking to ?

I was , you know , I was almost dead and overdosed from drugs and alcohol in a field like freezing cold January Colorado morning , and you know that that journey with Christ , while I've also been a business owner , leads to this , this book , Painted Baby .

So the premise of the story is , when we go out to do anything in life , whether it's life , business , our faith , like it's just people and people engaging , right , so humans and humans connecting . We have a goal , a common vision and we drive forward towards something .

But for me , to gain your trust and I think what a lot of people think and believe , especially in the business world , is oh , I need to be perfect , I need to paint this picture of perfection . Here's like the bio I just gave you successful entrepreneur , all of this stuff right . It's like , no , we've really screwed stuff up . You know , I've .

I've screwed stuff up personally , as a husband , as a father , as a business owner . But what happened in our painting company is back in 2007, . We were painting a home and we had a paint sprayer machine . A high pressured machine explode and throw paint all over a job site , all over a customer , all over her baby .

So we actually painted a baby and we were never planning to share that story with anybody and I kind of got forced into it . I explained it in the book when I was in a sales engagement with a customer and I was scared to death .

He had really forced me to share a moment when I had screwed up and I said , oh man , as I'm doing this , he's totally engaged . But I'm sitting here thinking I have this little record playing . I'm like I'm losing this sale . He's not going to hire me .

I'm letting my guard down , I'm being vulnerable , I'm sharing a mistake and all of a sudden he puts his hand across the table , shakes my hand and signs the biggest deal that we'd ever signed in my life and he goes . You know , you're the kind of guy that I can trust . You're the kind of guy I can do business with .

Not too many people would have shared that with me . So that experience led me on this journey of exploring back to what I had been taught in business that you know you've got to come across with the shiny marketing brochure , right ? Everything's put together , Everything's perfect and just not the truth , right ?

So when we go out and share our business or we share our faith , we need to be brave and vulnerable and share some of those worst moments , because within those moments is some of our most powerful tools to connect with other people .

And it's funny how we get into our moments that sometimes God has to put us in a predicament to even search for him .

from wanting to have anything to do with that . But then I had people that were just truly journeying alongside me . They were there for me , they were loving on me . Unfortunately , for a number of years , the first group , those voices , were just a lot louder , a lot more judgmental . So it was just a really interesting dichotomy louder , a lot more judgmental .

So it was just a really interesting dichotomy .

And I think it just goes to show that you know , if you claim to be a Christ follower and you are a Christ follower , when you anything from stepping into a subway sandwich shop right and ordering a sandwich and giving the person working there a smile like maybe , and this , this happened to me girls having a bad day making me a sandwich , I'm kind of busy ,

I'm probably going to be late , but I'm hungry . I got to grab a sandwich and I'm like this is taking forever . I just want to be impatient and go , come on , make me the turkey . And I just took a breath , I slowed down , I gave her a big smile and realized that she was trying to help a customer in front of me who didn't speak English .

Who didn't speak English , he spoke Spanish , so I'm fluent in Spanish . So all of a sudden I jump in , we start ordering his sandwich and , you know , everybody's smiling and it kind of turned the mood around . But it's like in every human interaction you have an opportunity to show love and kindness and grace and forgiveness .

Or , you know , you can maybe take it face value the thing that somebody else might be going through that's maybe rubbing you wrong , right , and you want to smack them with the Bible , or you know something like that , and it doesn't work . It didn't work for me , and that was a really interesting story .

I got handcuffed and thrown in the back of a police car .

I should have been taken to jail and that officer all of a sudden just started showing me love and grace and talking to me and , um , you know , took me home and I mean he had the control , power and authority to throw me in jail and at that moment , that was when those scales were like lifted off of my eyes of weight , like this guy had every reason and

opportunity just to take me where I deserve and he didn't . And then that's when , that's when that journey started . Really cool , deserve .

is humans come into this engagement with with kind of this general small talk ? So we all have this facade that we put out there . Right , we need to appear and look a certain way . So , hey , how are you guys doing ?

And you know , you start with a small talk , but what I find with with vulnerability and I talk about this in the book is like somebody has to go first . Have you ever been in a conversation where it's just small talk ? Hey , how's it going ? How's the family ? Things are good . How are the kids ? Sports , great work , all right , see you next week .

We should schedule a lunch . Okay , I'll call you and then nobody schedules a lunch . Right , I was sitting , you know , having a coffee with a guy the other day and he's kind of new to business and new , I wouldn't even say , to faith . He's exploring faith . He was really struggling and I could tell that , but he just didn't want to share .

He has a very tough outer shell and bravado . So he has a very tough outer shell and bravado . So we're having the small talk , and I just knew he wanted to talk more , but he didn't want to go first .

So I just said , hey , you know , can I roll you back about 10 years when I was first getting started in business and I had shared , you know some things about when our company almost ran out of money . And I mean that , right there he lit up , he leaned in , he's like oh , oh , my gosh , you're going through that too .

I didn't know , I thought we all had to be these perfect business owners . And then , boom , you know , he ups the Annie , and then , and then we just start talking and all of a sudden that that surface level relationship uh , starts to get a little bit deeper . So I think the you know , the step by step on that is hey , are you going to go first ?

If so , uh , find the right time , find the right moment , and just put a little , a little breadcrumb out there , you know , and , and you'll see like they they might come eat it up , and then all of a sudden , boom , boom , boom . Sometimes people aren't going to want to , they aren't going to want to hear that , you know .

And then you just pull it back , ok , that's cool .

Yes , because you don't want to , you know , throw everything on somebody that's dealing with some things that might be , that might seem unbearable for them , because you know it makes them steer more away from God than it does bring them closer to God .

When you do that small talk , even if it's just a smile , you know it sends a spark to that person to say hey , maybe there are people out here that's having compassion for other people , especially me , what I'm going through .

That makes my hope end up more better than just , like , like you said , hitting more across the hill for bible , I mean it's it's more of a take your time type of thing when it opened up somebody yeah .

So I'm drunk and I'm stumbling down the hall , I'm loud , I'm obnoxious and like they can hear me coming , and there's a guy right right across from my dorm room and he's on the Bible study , right .

So he's in there as a little cargo pants , little khaki shorts and t-shirt and they're playing the Jesus , Jesus music and they always had like Chipotle burritos , right .

So they're in there , you know , hanging out , fellowshipping , worshiping , all of this stuff , and I could hear the music down the hall and it was like this , this battle , we'd have every you know , every Friday , Saturday night . And right as I approached his door , oh , that must be Matt , Are you drunk again ?

And it was this real judgmental condescending we're in here following Jesus , You're out here and you're not . There's this wall , this barrier , and it was never like hey , Matt , happy Friday night , how are you ? How are you doing ? How was your week ? Maybe , hey , come in and eat some Chipotle , right ?

Like if that was Jesus , he would have invited all the drunk people in for Chipotle , right ? Like that's what the Bible shares . But no man , he had the door closed and was judgmental . So I'm like , hey , Brad , you doing that Jesus Bible study thing again ? So it was just this constant .

You know , we were ready for each other and I just thought like , huh , what , what would that have done to my faith walk If he said , hey , you know , instead of going out tomorrow night , why don't you come hang out and grab , grab some food and hang out ? You know , an invitation , so that . So that wasn't there .

And I and I see that a lot like , of course , guy , of course I needed Jesus , right , Like everybody could see that and know that . But that wasn't the guy that I turned to . The minute I got let go out of that police car and woke up the next day going okay , I think I'm ready for this . I didn't want to talk to that guy .

There was no mission , invitation or connection . Those three things are so huge Permission , invitation and connection to start and have a relationship with somebody to even talk about those things .

Have you seen that movie ? Matt ? Uh to say no , I haven't yes , the older movie . Well , um , he gets drunk or whatever . Have you , they party and do what they do .

Uh , but this one , young like a peer , he didn't know him personally but , um , he saw that he was always alone , always in dark , felt , seen in dark . He was , you know , keeping his eye on him , but because he was trying to be popular with everyone else , he never engaged with him .

Well , this particular night he could have went to jail as well , but a pastor had given him his card previously , a couple days before , and so he was drunk , his girlfriend took his car and everything to get out of the situation and left him by itself and in that moment the pastor comes to pick him up and he was saying all of what he was saying and he

was like , well , you know , I was at home enjoying my family , and now I'm here picking up a drunk kid , you know , because he called me or whatever , having it opened his eyes . So I can definitely that movie .

It just brings to light what you're talking about and I think that it's important for us to , especially when we get in predicaments , especially when we get in predicaments , diamonds that those of you have been , you know , kind of like not really paying attention to the grace of God and when you see it , know that that's like a sign , like Matt said , like the

scales are falling off or have fallen off , and he wants you to be able to see Amen , amen . So it's a portion in your book . It's a sentence in your in your book that I wanted you to speak to . You said we must listen , think and respond . Can you expand on that ? Think ? You said listen , think and respond .

And then as I start writing it , I'm like there's so much more to this , right , because you , as you progress through the book , it's like business and life and leadership and family , it's all this , it's all the same stuff . But as the book has been out and I've been sharing my my faith story more , it's just such a such a really cool tie-in .

But I think in in life and business and relationships , I talk a lot in the book about reacting versus responding . And you know , reaction somebody says something to you and maybe it rubs you wrong or it catches you off guard and the reaction is kind of that knee jerk , mouth opens brain kind of short circles . You don't think much and it just comes out .

But I talked about the difference between responding and reacting and in the book it was particular to feedback that people will give you about your story , right . So you know you go share with somebody . Hey , you know I was in prison , I've got a past and here's what happened and here's what I've learned for it . Here's how God used that .

And then somebody says to you oh so you're just , you're just another , you're another jail jailbird , right , or whatever ? Right , yeah , we want to . We want to go back there . This is what we do in prison , right ? One of these ? Versus like , hold on a minute , that that just says something about that person .

Take a minute , think about what they said , why they say it . How are they even credible to the conversation ? Does their feedback matter ? Take a breath and then and then respond in an appropriate way , cause you can't get your words back once you , once you say something .

So , as you put yourself out there , right in business faith leadership , people are going to have something to say about you , and I think working through that process of having some ways to filter feedback I think you're pulling it from that section is very important , because the more you put yourself out there , the more people will have to say about that and it

and you and it and you yeah , I was going to say , you know , thinking to me .

When we're engaging with people , we need to listen and we need to really think about what they're saying in order for us to be able to think . That means we've got to be quiet , to listen and respond , so that we can respond in a way that makes sense , like we're having a conversation right now .

You know , it's three people in the room and one person is talking and everybody is listening . And as I'm talking , I'm sure somebody is thinking about how they're going to respond . But if we're not thinking , if we don't wait a minute to respond , then the question becomes were you listening ?

Were you even listening to what I was saying before you were thinking about a response ?

Yeah , you know what I'm saying and I , you know , I think it's definitely pertinent to be able to be , um , to really be , to be able to be connected to somebody else , to build a relationship and I feel like , in reading the book thus far , I feel like really , that's what the ultimate message is about the painted baby .

Is that you know it's really about it's more than leadership , but more about relationship .

If you just pull out clients right , say , connect to your husband , connect to your spouse , connect to your kids , connect to your church , you can fill that in with whatever and follow the book , because I'm speaking about this in the faith community and men's groups and all kinds of places .

But one thing to kind of piggyback on what you said is there's always an intention behind somebody's communication , like what gets said isn't necessarily always what was meant to be said , right ? So if I go hey , why are you , why are you wearing that red shirt ? You know the way I said that versus hey , it's a cool shirt , why , why did you wear that red ?

There's a different , you know kind of that first one around a little bit . We need to slow down and not assume you don't assume anything about what I meant about the red shirt , the two ways I asked it . So , hey , what did ? What did you mean ? I noticed you . You asked me that in a way that seems to me as if you don't like my red shirt , right ?

Is that true ? You know any anything down to that ? But yeah , we're always thinking about what we want to say , talking and then not listening .

Well , we got to think of our heart first , because we got to be compassionate and sympathetic for the ones we're speaking to , because if we don't be sympathetic and kind and everything that goes around with it , that falls under Jesus is what ? If somebody say that very same thing that you said to them , wrong , in a wrong way , how would you take it ?

Yeah , you know , and that's that's what we got to think . We got to think of our heart as well as our mind before we speak it .

You know what I mean , because a whole lot of folk are thinking with their knowledge and thinking with their brain , but they're not thinking with their heart , and I believe that this book really challenges us to think with our heart versus thinking with our mind .

As you were telling the story in the book about the deal and how you were telling how he wanted more , you just like what you know . You know what I mean and it's like what in the world and that required you to reveal . You know something that was in your heart and a whole lot of folk don't want to do that .

Um , and then once you get used to doing this and you know , and opening up and again the the one thing you don't want to do , and I shared this . I don't know how far along you are in the book , but I don't want to do . And I shared this . I don't know how far along you are in the book , but I don't want to give it away .

I was so excited to be vulnerable and tell everybody about my mistakes as I went out and told all the customers next week and I didn't do it at the right time , with the right permission , and they were like whoa , you ever met somebody ? Hey , how you doing , it's just a small talk , how you doing ? Right , you say that's people . Oh , let me tell you .

And then , right , I shouldn't have asked this person just unloading , hold , hold , hold , the hold , hold on a minute . So there's , there's a process to doing that . You know , don't just go vomit your vulnerability all over somebody if they're not ready , because it can be very off putting-putting as well right , right .

Um , I've gotten , that's how , that's as far as I've gotten this framework , because I I'm a firm believer that you don't go into the next level before you complete the one you're at , and so I want to , you know , I've paused right there where I'm at so that I can actually work on this framework that you were talking about before I go any further in the book

, and I think that that's's just . That's just me . I don't . I feel like sometimes I can get ahead of myself just trying to read a book like this . I don't want , I'm intentional . When I read a book that's going to help me , I don't try to go too fast . I want to go slow enough where I can understand it .

To me , that's another thing that's lacking , with people , saved and unsaved , trying to hurry up through life , to slowing down , to get what God wants to give us . That's just me personally . But , matt , how can we get , how can others get your book ?

It's only like 9 o'clock , but yeah , I love just sharing that with the hosts of the podcast that I'm going to go on . So that was the special package that I sent .

Final thoughts from Matt , from Michael , from myself . Who wants to go first ?

Your story can become what connects you to somebody else , the thing that builds that relationship or starts that relationship , and so I just encourage you to not be ashamed of your story , but embrace it . See God , look for God , show him , ask him to show you who needs what you have , because it's not by accident that you went through what you went through .

It's not by accident that you came through what you came through . Use it to the glory of God . He's going to do what it is he desires to do . That is my word , matt .

So so so think about the contributions , right , the deposits that you're making as you interact with people , and you know there's a lot of things you can do to increase somebody here in the temporary .

But , you know , following the heart right , sharing your story , being vulnerable , sharing a piece of you with somebody in who you are , in Christ , share what Christ has given you and that has an opportunity to impact somebody for the kingdom , for their eternity , and that's a it's a crazy wild thing to think about .

That's the deep level of impact we can , we can have , and sometimes it's just a smile , it's , it's nothing big , it's buying somebody a cup of coffee , whatever , whatever that is . So just just make sure to follow that , that , that prompting and that and that voice from God as you're out there doing life .

Just listen to the voice of God , know what he's saying , what he's speaking in your heart , in your life , and when you get to that moment , when you might be reluctant or a little holding back to share and open up a piece of yourself , take that step in faith . Take that step with Jesus , to pour into somebody else's life , to lead them to you .

God , in Jesus' name , amen .