Innovative Concepts and Flavors with Abney Harper

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Today I am so excited because we don't only have someone who is a phenomenal operator , but someone who just has such an engaging social media presence and someone who you meet and you just cannot help but love . She's the CEO and founder of Prima Apre and a mutual pizza lover oh my gosh , of course , yeah .

And a mutual pizza lover oh my gosh , of course , yeah . And if you hit up her Instagram , you will find she's got a whole series of highlights just dedicated to pizza , as I do . But , abney , so great to have you on the podcast . How are you ?

I started in the restaurant business with I had not just a restaurant , but I had fashion and home retail , and so I would go to Milan and Paris on buying trips to buy for the fashion . And when I was in Paris , I kept seeing all of these meringue clouds and I was like they're nowhere in the United States . And so I came home .

I had a couple of fine dining restaurants in Georgia and I started making these meringue clouds , these pavlovas , and they took off in my restaurant and so they became my best-selling dessert . Well , so then I had all these residual , leftover , residual egg yolks and I'm like , well , what do I do with them ?

And so I was making souffles and some custards and things like that , and then I started making fresh pasta with the egg yolks . So , in my fine dining background , pasta with the egg yolks . So in my fine dining background . I had a very small , curated menu that changed monthly .

So I always had a pasta and I would just use sort of traditional sauces , but those became my best-selling entrees . And so when COVID hit and we closed my fine dining restaurants , then I was sort of in a massive identity crisis because I didn't know what to do with myself after that , and so I really was struggling with what to do next .

And my husband , who knows and loves you so much he's a restaurant growth guy and does scale and through franchising and corporate growth and he was like why don't we take some of this and like figure out a way to do something with what you did in your fine dining restaurant ?

Because I was burned out , I was tired , I didn't want to operate a restaurant like a one unit restaurant anymore . So we came up with this concept and like we just literally like held up in our apartment and like created the business plan for it and we have a chef-driven scratch kitchen where we produce fresh pastas and sauces .

We buy wheels of Parmigiano-Reggiano and Pecorino Romano and Empor Prosciutto and we use those as the toppings for our pastas and then we make pavlovas on the other side . So it's a counter service , quick service concept where you come in and what was a $40 entree and a fine dining concept , that was because of all the overhead that is associated .

I mean , it was a linen , full service , beautiful space , and now what was $40 is a $15 pasta dish and it's the same offering . That was fine dining but in a quick service concept .

So I love interior design and I love fashion , so I tried to incorporate a lot of that into this brand right . So when you come in , you kind of it's a quick service and you just walk in and you can take your pasta to go , you can take your pavlova to go , but I want people to want to sit and to want to stay .

So operationally it's so very , very simple . But the spaces that we have two locations and the spaces I've worked really hard to create beautiful spaces that make you want to linger . We have wine and that kind of thing . So it's a really unusual concept and people don't really understand it .

So there's like an educational component to it , to when they're like pasta and pavlova , that doesn't really make sense . But I think it's really special and I love it . It's a really beautiful concept to me .

It's a really unique , fun experience , and I think that that's really what I want to get to . Is , what do you think is the most important aspect of guest experience nowadays ? Creating such a unique one yourself .

We use semolina , flour and water and we buy the bronze dyes , which the bronze dyes are the like . They're very expensive but they make a real for a really delicious pasta . So they create a rough surface area so the pasta , the sauce , really clings to the pasta and so people don't really understand why it tastes better .

But it tastes better because A the quality of the flour and there's no preservatives or additives to it . But also we use that bronze dye that makes our delicious sauces cling to it , and so we bought dyes that were unconventional I mean , not in Italy , but to us . I wanted to do pastas that you couldn't buy in a grocery store .

We do have spaghetti , but even the spaghetti we bought a little bit of a different size and it's just delicious and we cut the strands long . So I feel like giving guests something that they can't have at home but that's still approachable and still easy for them to do without having to go and have a whole sit down experience .

Like Lucasfilm will send people to set of any show or any movie that they're doing about Star Wars , and like there's certain camera shots that they can't do because it doesn't have the Star Wars feel . There are no buttons allowed on any costumes in Star Wars . There's no paper allowed in the background on any Star Wars .

Like you can't have like a stack of paper on a desk , like in the Star Wars universe . There are no buttons , there is no paper , the camera angles are certain things . Now , when you watch a Star Wars show , you're not like , oh my gosh , look at that Velcro , that's amazing Velcro , but it's like there's something about it that's different than other shows .

And I's like there's something about it that's different than other shows and I think that what you're talking about with your pasta , it's like when you focus in on those details to care about the guest experience , not everyone is going to say , oh , wow , the texture of this pasta really allows the sauce to cling to it .

But they'll say , man , this is so much better than going to that restaurant or than buying this in the grocery store and making it at home , even though I'm doing the same exact thing quote unquote it's different and I think that that attention to detail really comes out . Even if people can't articulate it , they can feel it right .

But you know there's something so brilliant behind the creativity of it and I love that that you say about Star Wars and that's what I love about the creative process when people don't just they love something , but they just can't quite put their finger on what they love about it , that's how much you know you've done something special .

Let's go on a trip because I was really rude to you and so I'm going to buy you this trip . But when I asked my wife one time , how do you know that I love you ? She said because you fill up my water bottle at night . And I was like wait a second . I could have saved how much money .

A trip , a piece of jewelry , but those things are somewhat less sincere because they are the big things . The little things matter so much . And so , with that in mind , what are some tactics I know we're talking about kind of like the details ?

It was about their love story . And he said my wife and I have this thing where if somebody asks for a glass of water in the middle of the night , we always get it , because it was the privileges . Is that she asked me to get it , you know , and I think that's so true and so sweet .

Right , it's like I love the design of spaces and I love the food and I love the ambiance , and so I think that , for me , I measure seat heights of the benches that I had built . You know , I measure the table heights to make sure that they hit just where they should hit . I source glasses that , like , feel good in the hand and are nice to sip from .

We try to edit the wines that we offer , just so you even though it's , you know , you're buying a pasta in a takeaway container , you still want to sit and have a glass of wine while you eat it , and so those are the things and those are the details that I hope that , tactically , I feel like we have given to the guests to enhance their experience .

I think anything that you can do to make a guest comfortable from an ambiance standpoint , you know , as far as like hospitality and greeting and enhancing their experience , I think anything you can do to make a guest feel special when they walk in the door , that when they walk out they felt like , wow , I love that .

You know , it's really about the human connection and the restaurant experience and I feel like that's what gets lost , and so I think that the quality of the offering and the kindness and the hospitality that's shared with the guest is absolutely the most important thing .

I was talking to somebody yesterday and he was saying I come for the food , I come for the ambiance , he said , and I care the most about how I'm treated when I walk in the door . I think that's what we are . We're in the hospitality business and that's absolutely the most important thing .

And , as a Southerner who was raised on Southern hospitality , it's really about warmth and greeting and making everybody comfortable and greeting them at the door and walking them out the door and making them feel special .

But I love the way you just boil it down to like kindness , right , Just that human nature of interacting with someone on a bus or interacting with someone across the counter . It's like how can you be kind , how could you help them smile a little bit ?

And it leads this whole conversation and then the guest leaves feeling appreciated to your point , heard and understood , and they'll want to come back .

I think is so important , but it's about the human connection and we always say don't let the tech get in the way of the hospitality Right .

So I just kind of watch out world that brand's coming and I'm so happy for him and all he's done .

I want to be a part of this and then flash forward this many years later and Sucre has , like , sustained and weathered bad business decisions , the Me Too movement , lawsuits , bankruptcy , multiple ownerships , and it's like it's this brand that transcends ownership .

But what I am so amazed by with James is is he sees what it is , he sees what it can be and he's created this vision for how it can grow and how it's a brand that deserves to be shared with everyone , and he's got a vision for it and he's executing on it . And it's just a really special thing James and I did . We were introduced to Dave Query .

He has the Post , his chicken in Colorado , yeah , yeah , and he has some other restaurants and I love the guy . And the reason I love the guy is because I feel like he embodies so much of everything we've just talked about on this podcast . He lives in Colorado , but he loves to have a place in New Orleans .

He has a massive appreciation for the food culture in New Orleans . But he went to CIA and he is a tremendous chef , like he's so talented . But oftentimes when you find a chef that's that talented who's also a great restaurateur , it's tough Like I'm a terrible operator . I am so bad , I'm the worst . That's what James is like .

Stay at Lane , abney , I'll take over operations . I'm so because I don't ever want to do the same thing twice . I want to do it differently every time and that's terrible for operations . But Dave has .

You know , when we met him , he's done just what I feel like is important , right , he has basically a fine dining offering with fried chicken , right , but it's absolutely a fine dining offering . By that I mean the attention to detail with the ingredients . They have a gluten-free chicken sandwich where they use , I think , almond flour might be having .

I don't know exactly which flour they use , but they do the waffles with a pumpkin seed butter , maple syrup and I actually haven't been to the post , but I've just learned about it through him and then have , like , studied it online because it looks so good . But they have multiple locations .

But then he has a seafood restaurant in downtown Denver that we went this summer called Jack's , and it was incredible . Like the wine list was wonderful , the food was beautiful and as delicious as it was beautiful and it had such a vibe .

It was sort of that thing where you just wanted to sit and linger and not leave , and that's sort of what I like , truly value , and I think he's really talented and I think that he's doing some great things .

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