What's that at my bed? It's spooky.
I'm jooky.
I'm really sure it's dead. It's coming.
It's way Wait a minute, I said, I runs dressed ends.
P hey boo, it's me Runs. How are you me?
I'll be honest, I'm exhausted. I I just completed another weekend of eight performances, and I am you know, I went from doing pretty much nothing for a year and a half to being go go, go, go go.
And it's lovely.
I absolutely I'm in heaven, but I'm also like exhausted. My body's not used to it. But I had a really cool celebrity that came to the show, and you know, I'm always looking out from my babies. I had to say, hey, you got a ghost story? You believe in that stuff? And this particular celebrity was like, I love that stuff, and so I'm working it out. Actually we have it on the on the calendar to record an episode, so I never like to say who, what, when, where any
of that until it's been done. But I have a really fun one coming up soon, so look out for that. I also was talking to the Cavern Club Theater, where I've been performing the past few weekends. And that's also where I used to do my live shows, and I was taught talking to them about, hey, what's going on around Halloween time? Just curious, no reason in particular, just curious. And turns out, Uh, I might be able. I might be able to pull off doing maybe a live show.
I don't know, would you come here in Los Angeles a live show, guests, performances, ghosts.
Maybe. I don't know.
It's a possibility, so uh, stay tuned. I mean, if people want it, if you want it, I'll do it. How about that? Sorry, I don't know if you can hear Rocky. He is right by my side because I've been so busy that he's been locked up and away from me and he's not used to that. And we're still recording from home at this moment, so he is nestled here right beside me, and a lot of people have asked me thank you so much. He was very,
very sick for a while. I think it was Kennel Koff or something but old so it was like bad and now he's much much better, so cuter than ever. That's the good news.
Anyway.
Now today on the episode, I have one of my absolute favorites. Someone I am in awe of Katrina Widman. Now, Katrina Widman is a paranormal investigator TV pro. Okay, you know her from the TV show Paranormal State, which she did when she was in college, and then she went on over to a little show called Paranormal Lockdown where they would stay over night at haunted places. And if you listen to the show, you've already heard her on here talking about Portals to Hell, which just did its
second season on Discovery. Plus, she and Jack Osborne go to really grim dark, spooky places a lot of times of the demon variety. And if you haven't heard my conversations with her, go back and listen. This is her third time on the show, and she always has incredible insight, but this episode in particular, it gets like, especially this first part, we talked about some kind of grim dark shit, so trigger warning, we did talk about a murder site
that she went to. So I thought I would read some stories that have been submitted to me from listeners like you that are more spiritual and loving type stories. And if you want the real spooky shit, don't worry that I'll be coming at you later on.
In today's program.
So this first story comes from Margharita. Hi Roz, new listener here and honey, I I'm obsessed.
Ooh, welcome.
I've never shared my personal experience before, especially since it's such a touchy subject for many, but I feel safe here. Before I start my story, I need to give a little background. My stepdad raised us as his own since I was four or five years old, and I was his little girl. I wanted to be just like him in every sense of the word. For me, he was my father. When I was sixteen, he passed away before my seventeenth birthday, as expected. I was devastated and my
whole world was turned upside down. Throughout the year, several things happen that I know was his presence during his funeral services. Unexplained things happened when I was eighteen. I started working, so I would ride the bus. I would be terrified to ride alone. One morning, while it was pouring out, I looked out the window and a man that looked identical to my dad was sitting on the bench. He didn't get on the bus, and when I turned back,
he was gone. Fast forward to last year, April twenty twenty, I unfortunately tested positive for COVID. I immediately got worse and worse, to the point that I had to be rushed in an ambulance because I could no longer breathe on my own. Oh my god, the pain was excruciating and nothing that I can fully explain in words. By the fourth night, I was deteriorating. Oh my god, my oxygen had suddenly dropped under eighty and they were getting ready to intubate me if my oxygen didn't get better
with the oxygen tank. I tested positive with COVID at the very beginning, when the doctor still had no clue how to help us. I was slowly dying and was unable to physically eat for eight days. The nurse woke me up because I was not breathing on my own. I was taken downstairs to get more chest scans. When I came back to my hospital bed, I remember being
in unbearable pain that no medicine could take away. Within a few hours, I looked up and my dad and godfather were standing at the end of my hospital bed. I know I wasn't dreaming. My father at that point had been deceased for ten years and my godfather for at least fifteen. They were both smiling at me, and there was so much peace and I had no pain. I remember closing my eyes thinking, this is it. My time has come. I woke up the next morning and
my chest scans had came back clean. I was discharged within two days. I am still to this day healing from COVID so severely, but I know it was not a dream and my dad.
Was with me. Wow, Margarita, that is intense.
I am so glad to hear that you are, you know, doing better, but sorry you had to go through that. But wow, that is quite beautiful and powerful. Thanks for sending me that. Okay, here is another sweet one. I don't think I've ever read this one on the show. I got it a few months back. I apologize I haven't read it sooner. I mean I have read it, I just have. I don't think i've read it on
the show. This is from Vicky, who emailed me at ghosted by Raz at gmail dot com, and Vicky writes, my best friend passed away four years ago of melanoma. She was in her seventies and was a fourth generation Wickan. She and I I shared an interest in cats. We are slash were both all breed judges in the cat fancy. She had not shown cats for several years and really wanted to get back on the floor, so a friend and I got together and purchased a Persian kitten for her birthday.
She used to breed them. She was thrilled.
She showed him as a kitten and as an altar prior to getting sick, which is where this story becomes more in line with your show. My son and his family were staying at her house as they transitioned from Maine to New Hampshire. My husband and I stayed at our camp until they found a place to live. About four days after my friend died, my daughter in law called me and asked if my house was haunted, to which I said no, why And here's what she said quote.
The kids were napping and I was folding laundry upstairs when I heard someone walking up the stairs. Thinking it was one of the kids, I opened the bedroom door and there was no one there. Later in the day, Glenn, my four year old grandson at the time, was standing in the kitchen looking out the front door, laughing and waving and saying okay, I will bye bye, and he giggled and waved. Then he turned to me and said,
tell Nana to go get Cooky. Well my heart skipped a beat as my friend chose an elaborate, registered formal name for her kitten and no one knew this but me and her family. The kitten's nickname was Cookie. My friend was telling me to go and get the kitten. I'm convinced of it. A year later, I went to a group medium session just north of the town I live in. When I walked in, I felt her in the building and told my friend who was with me
that she was here. When the medium opened up to the room, the first person she described was my friend and I raised my hand. She walked right over to me and started to tell me what my friend was telling her. It was one hundred percent accurate. I could almost hear her voice. Wow, thank you Vicky for sending me that. Guys, today, we have got Katrina Weidman on the show. Now, if you haven't seen the TV show Portals to Hell. First of all, I highly endorse it
and recommend it, so you should go watch it. I mean, you know, Discovery Plus is like I think it's like five bucks a month or something, not too bad. Lots of paranormal content on there, and Portals to Hell is on there. There's two seasons. I really enjoy the star. I love it, and go watch it and then you'll know what we're talking about in this episode. But I will say this is a two part episode where we talk a lot about specifically episodes of Portals to Hell
this past season. And don't worry, I don't think that you need to have seen the show ahead of time to follow along. I think we explain what we're talking about, and there's still some other interesting spooky insights that Katrina has for us as well. So I hope you enjoy it and has always good to patron dot com slash Roz dress Flees for a bonus clip, and on this bonus clip, we are talking about Katrina's relationship to her
psychic abilities. That's on my second tier. Also on my second Tier, my brand new podcast that I'm doing for now with my friend Sam Pancake, the two of us just talking about all kinds of whatever we feel like talking about about. This week's episode is us talking about the two thousand's and the mid nineties. So it's a good it's a good time. Go check that out. And there's a video of me this week talking about my tattoos, which I very rarely ever do. I never show them,
I never talk about them. So you can see that on patreon dot com slash Roz Jess Feles. Okay, here is my third conversation with Katrina Widman on with the show.
Oh My God.
We are joined for our first ever three peat guest. One of my absolute favorites, one of your favorites, the best eyeshadow in the business.
Katrina is back.
Hello, Hello, I love that intro about the best eye shadowy shadow.
What is it? A primer? What's going on? It always just looks so smooth and blended.
I don't know. I do use a primer. What do I use right now? Smash box? Something by smash Box, I can't remember the doors. But I also blend a lot because I was really bad at blending, like a long time ago, and so I'm always like, blend, blend, blend.
Now it's a real skill, but it's I feel like it's.
Something that.
Thanks to YouTube videos you can certainly like, Like when I started to make up, I could not figure out how to do it. But yeah, anyway, we're not here to talk about makeup, and I want it to be clear that you're also just one of the best paranormal professionals in the biz. You're You're so much more than just amazing eyeshadow. It's just a cherry on top.
Thank you. How have you been, Oh Lordie? You know, kind of like what we were saying before we started recording, that it's been up and down a lot. I'm not going to sugarcoat it, like I don't think I'm special for this at all, but I think a lot of people probably went through the same stuff I did where it was really hard. And what's funny about it is that it was the last few months before like everything started to kind of simulate back into any kind of normalcy.
So it was it really hit me hard around the holidays because I love the holidays, and there were there just sort of felt like an emptiness to them this year.
And then it was like, you know, the winter. I live in the Northeast, so it can be kind of bleak sometimes, and we went on my husband and I went on vacation before everything really opened up, just to kind of get away and have some space, and I like completely broke down on vacation, like hyperventilating, crying, and it was and it was nothing that really, it was like, no, nothing to really set me off for that. It was like we were hanging out and then it just happened
and I was like, oh my god. And yeah, it was just one of those things, like I didn't even realize how stressed out I was until I took a moment to step away and then it sort of all came to the surface. But I, you know, definitely much
better now and feeling better. But it's kind of like what you were saying, like I don't want to go back to wearing normal clothes, you know what I mean, Like I like not having to worry about buttons, and personally, I don't mind the mask because you don't have to keep up with groomings so much.
So oh yeah, okay with that.
You know, absolutely I'm keeping mine for that reason. Like I'm all about like mask, hat down low with sunglasses, no one can see me, right, So I guess just getting back into that, you know, it's actually you know what's funny is that the last couple of months is when I've realized how depressed I was. Yeah, I knew, like, oh, Yeah, everything is like terrible right now throughout the past year.
But I guess I didn't realize until now that I'm back like in front of audiences and performing and doing things. I'm like, oh my god, this like a huge part of me was missing. Yeah, and I was just really really not doing great.
But now I am.
Now I'm it's better. But wait, I heard you say husbands.
Yeah.
I feel like in the past one we've talked it was fiance.
So did you get married during the pandemic or well, we got married right before the pandemic and yeah, so we like got back from our honey we went on our honeymoon right after.
And when we like, as we were on our honeymoon, everyone was talking about it and they were like a couple cases popping up in the US, and we were like, oh, well, gosh, this isn't good. You know, We're thousands of miles away from home, you know. And when we got back, I went back to work and as we were on the road, you know, it just kept coming back up, coming back up. And so it was probably we got married like two
months before wow pandemic hit. Yeah, so our wedding we actually just saw everybody yesterday in our families to celebrate Father's Day. And that was like really the first time I had seen a lot of people since our wedding. So yeah, it was crazy.
I feel like the last time I talked to you it was definitely when I was recording in the shower because I was trying to figure out how to do sound COVID, and I think it was probably like last summer and at that point portals to Hell Discovery Blush if you haven't, you guys were like taking that kind of mid season break due to COVID situation. I think I don't think you guys had no, I don't think you would have been back yet because it was probably June or July that we were recording together.
So can we talk about it?
Let's talk about it.
Oh my gosh.
Okay, So, I of course I watch every episode and so I I want to I want to go through some of these episodes and talk about them. Okay, So what was the first one that you guys did back?
The first one? Man, it was heavy. We did the McCormick Farm. Yeah, that was our first one on the on the road again after COVID started, and that one, that one was hard to be a part of. I it's weird. Like I I can enjoy reading and sometimes watching things about true crime, you know, I find it interesting sometimes, but it's a very different thing to be in the location, you know, to meet the people that
knew the murderers. It brings it really really close. And I had a hard time being there because there's still bodies missing. There's still people missing.
That episode had like a disclaimer before it that was like, we're going to talk about some murder. There's gonna be some photos. Yeah, because that was I mean, so what was the story. There was a father and a son and ye murdered a bunch of people.
Yeah, it was three generations are suspected to be involved, but only the youngest generation went to prison for everything, so they're the oldest generation. Built the house, bought the property in like late nineteen nineteens or early nineteen twenties, and started this farm on like three thousand acres. It's huge Colorado, right, Colorado, Eastern Colorado. And then his son, you know, obviously got involved in the family business. And then he had a son named Michael, who also got
involved in the business. So from what we had learned from people that knew them. There's more suspicion on the middle generation and the youngest generation instead of the oldest. But you know, people are like, well, where did they learn that? How did they start that business practice if they didn't learn it from the beginning. So it's kind
of hard to say who was really involved. But legally what happened was there was a murder that the youngest was involved in where he had stolen the victim's truck, and the victim had been missing for some time, but he had a very distinct truck, so when it was spotted, they obviously asked the youngest McCormick Michael McCormick, and I guess he at that point pretty much like confessed to all this stuff, including, hey, there's actually a lot of bodies on my family's farm and I can point you
to them.
So I actually episode you guys had like the confession video.
Yes, I watched that entire thing, and it is it is really crazy to watch somebody's confession of multiple murders. And so the really awful part is, I mean, besides just the murders obviously, but these were people who were you know, they they didn't really have a lot of
stable family. They didn't have stable friends or home, so they were just looking for, you know, a way to get by or a lot of times they would go to the mission to pick people up for work, so you know, possibly people who were looking for a second chance. And when the story that we got is basically when they would ask for their money or if there was some sort of conflict, that's when the McCormick or mccormicks
would take care of them in that way. And Michael pointed out he was able to help them recover three bodies, but there was still multiple missing he knew of at least like I think, what was it, twelve to fifteen others, but again it's like three thousand acres, so you know, it's almost impossible to do that. And the investigation team eventually ran out of funding, so you know, their main priority was to get them in jail, so they had enough to do that. Michael did go to jail for
a period of time. He got out in the mid auts and out he got out.
Yeah, and it was what was part of it. There was some really weird stuff going on where his wife knew one of the lawyers really well, or his girlfriend knew one of the lawyers really.
Well, and but he did end up getting out. And what he did was he was in business with a woman. He ended up kidnapping her and eventually killing her and himself. Yeah, during that kidnapping. So uh and very sadly she had a young child that she left behind because of that. So I mean just a really I mean chilling, chilling people and story.
Yeah, I mean great way to come back to work. Yeah, world wide pandemic.
Place.
It's it's you know, that's kind of the downside of working in the field is that you're always dealing with heavy storylines and history and sometimes it's sometimes it's like, you know, it's things to be expected when he go to a prisoner or something, but like literally spent a week on a murder farm.
And not the most fun I know.
I would much prefer like, Oh, we've got a happy ghost that he likes to wink at people if you see him in a mirror or like whatever, Like that's my kind of ghost. So okay, So the paranormal side of this thing. This couple bought the place.
And I loved it.
I think their last name was Clapper, isn't it. Yeah, Clapper, which I'm like, that would have. It made me think of like that the Clapper, like the to turn your lights on. I'm like, oh my god, they the Clapper of Fortune. So this nice couple, they lived there, and they've had like tons of stuff happening paranormally.
So.
But what I found interesting when they were telling their story was that they didn't get told about.
These murders when they purchased it, right.
Yeah, because it wasn't really the confessions hadn't happened at that point, so there was I think I think there was probably some whispers in town. You know, it's a small town. Everybody knew each other. So the current owner, he knew the mccormicks. Oh and yeah, because I mean
everybody knew each other. And when he originally took over, I think originally when he took over, it was only part of the farm, and because the mccormicks had left the farm before the confessions came out, like a couple of years prior, so he was like renting or releasing part of it, and then at some point he bought it. When the confessions happened, he owned the property. And when they were taking Michael around the property so he could
point out where he believed the bodies were. He was actually the owner of the farm currently was placed with him as sort of do you guys mind hanging out while we do some work, and Michael told him like all this stuff, and that was the first time that mister Clapper had like heard this. So you know, he's like having the FBI out on this property looking for bodies and then here is someone who was involved in the murders being like, yeah, this happened, and you know, confessing things to him.
Mm hmm.
Oh my god.
Yeah.
So having with you having so much experience going to different haunted places where horrific things have happened. The conversation that often comes up on this show and in paranormal conversations is like this idea of telling people, you know, should you tell people that people were murdered here? And I know some different states have different laws about that.
What are your thoughts on that, Like, if something if something horrific happens at a location, do you how do you feel about do you have any insight on on that from your oath?
Yeah, well, I mean just from a real estate standpoint, I think there should be laws where you have to tell that because that could affect resale, you know. And I think if you're making an investment, you need to know, you know, what's involved with that property you're building. I don't think it's any different from needing to know, Oh yeah, you know you need a new sump bump, or the roof was only replaced twenty years ago, so in ten years you might need a new one. I think it's the same thing.
Yeah, Like not even in a paranormal way.
It's like now you could be having camera crew show up to your house one day, or people might be doing documentaries, or people might be driving by taking pictures. Like I feel like that's a thing you need to know before you move in someplace.
Absolutely, I totally agree. And as far as the haunting, I you know, I don't know, it's hard to say. I think should there be a law, I'm not sure, but because I think there's you have houses like Amityville right where all the owners since the lotsus have never experienced anything. So just because the place or a family is experiencing activity doesn't mean that it's always going to be that way.
Right, But I know you are by purchasing this, you now have a responsibility to get asked constantly to do interviews, you know, like people are there, you're there's something, there's more than just living in a peaceful house, Like it comes with this stigma of this house, you know, like right, there is I feel like people should know that. But it's also like it's it's one of those weird things, like legally do you have to tell people if it's haunted?
Now?
I feel like saying it's haunted is different than like there's been murders and rightf like that, But.
I don't know.
I feel like the conclusion I always come to is like if it's super well known as being haunted to the point where people are going to be like bothering you about the fact that it's haunted, and I feel like you should know that, but like you also run the risk of talking.
To people that are like what what do you are?
You crazy telling me that there's ghosts in this I don't even believe in that. I don't want to buy from you, like right, like, I don't know, it's it's a weird thing. I mean, as believers and ghosts. Yeah, I see where it's like I would want to know that I would want to tell people that or whatever. But I feel like there's so many people don't even believe in that stuff, so it would be just be weird for them to know.
I don't know.
I feel like if I was a real estate person, i'd be like just say, you know, people.
Say yeah, yeah. And I think you bring up an excellent point about, you know, if you're going to be bothered by interviewers, camera crews, ghost hunters because there.
Are Irina Widemen and Jack Osborne knocking on your door.
And it's funny though, because that's happened a couple of times to me. I can think of one neighborhood where we were like screamed out of there. And this was almost ten years ago, and it's a haunting in New York. It's in Seaford, New York, and they had a haunting for six weeks. It was very intense. It was documented by police, psychologists, news reporters, and then it stopped. As mysteriously as it started, it stopped and we went to the neighborhood with a camera crew just to check it out.
And I mean, and you know this, you work in the entertainment industry. Legally, you can film from a sidewalk, but neighbors of the house we were looking at were screaming at us and they were very angry that we were there. So I mean, you do you know, I think there is something to be considered there that if you're going to purchase a house that has that kind of history to it, you know, maybe you should know.
Yeah.
Yeah, I mean that's like a whole thing that you'll have to deal with just by living there. Well, I want to get back to this farm episode you I think this is the episode. Maybe I'm wrong, but one of these episodes you like started like kind of laying down and taking a nap or something, which I know you've had like so much experience with like paranormal Lockdown and all your years of experience, but like, are you the kind of person that can just take a nap
any like at a haunted place? Like if I heard all those stories, I won't I won't sleep for weeks no matter where I am.
But like, can you just sleep during that?
Yeah?
I think now I can. After is after Lockdown, I can pretty much sleep anywhere.
Yeah, there was another thing I was thinking about with that episode. You were doing kind of like a role playing experiment to try to get some activity to happen. And I was curious about that, like, what is your experience with that does does it tend to work to trigger activity if you kind of recreate things or yeah.
There's I think I've had some experiences where there seems to be a response to it. Someone I worked with was really great at it. Her name was Debbie Constantino. Debbie has since passed away, unfortunately, but when I worked with her first off, she was like an EVP queen. You know, it doesn't matter where she went.
She would always get EVPs and they were always like class A, class B EVPs.
And I remember one of the times I worked with her. We were in Virginia City and she went into role playing and she got like all these crazy answers and she just pretended to be a prostitute and she was like, Hey, I really need money, I really need a job. I need to support myself. Who do I talk to? Can you help me get money? Like she would just repeat those things over and over again, and she would get these answers in an e VP form that would correlate
with her question. There's other people, you know, reenactors. When you go to historical places that will claim, uh, they were doing a reenactment and then activity got crazy afterwards. So you see a lot of things like that, So you know, what's the rhyme or reason for that. I can only speculate that maybe you're triggering something, you know, And there's a lot of people too that use music, so they'll use music for that time period to see if it triggers anything. And then you can go into
the hole. Well, music is vibration and does vibration have anything to do with the supernatural? And so I mean there's to answer your question more in a more concise way. I think there's there's some experiences that suggest that role playing or reenacting would lead to activity, would lead to a response, but it's definitely, you know, nothing conclusive.
Yeah, I just think it's like I guess with our theater background, you and I'm like this sounds like fun, Like, yeah, I want any opportunity I can just like put on a costume and pretend to do a little scene for the ghost.
That owner of the I guess Missus Clapper.
She she had such an interesting connection to the to the ghosts there, and it seemed you seem to come to the conclusion that she's.
Probably like a little psychic, which I thought was cool.
Yeah, Leslie is all heart, I mean, such a wonderfully warm person. You can tell she is the glue of that family, you know, she's I think she would be the glue anywhere she went. She is just very what's the word I'm looking for when you meet somebody that you're like, like, she's just light, you know what I mean, Like you're just like attracted to her energy. And I think she is a very because she's such an empathetic person.
I think part of what she was experiencing is just knowing what happened there and having a hard time accepting that there's people that their families never knew what happened to them, you know. I think that's part of it. But she'd absolutely had, you know, experiences that she couldn't explain. And what's interesting about that too, is a lot of times you meet empathetic people who are tend to have more paranormal experiences. So is that because they're more open
to it some way? You know, I, you know, I would tend to say yes, And it seemed like with Leslie, she had had these experiences prior to coming to the farm, not in a way of a haunting really, but in a way of like knowing things or having dreams that would come true.
Or.
You know, she just kind of always had that sixth sense about her.
Anyway, let's get back to episodes. Okay, So then where did you go? Was that?
Then?
The Hotel monte Vista?
We went right after that since you were in Colorado, we ended up going to the Grant hum Freeze Mansion.
Oh yes, which is the one where you really showed up your piano playing skills.
Yeah, yeah, I didn't know.
Oh, thank you. Yeah. That was its beautiful place and the only reason, I mean, funny enough, the only reason we were able to get in there is because of COVID because they normally do weddings and obviously so many
things were shut down so they couldn't do them. And uh that was that was a really interesting investigation too, because people have had been having experiences there for decades, and you know, they have so many people in and out that it's some sometimes that people don't know the stories or they're having the same experiences independently of each other, and they don't know each other. So the staff are constantly hearing you know this, the repeated patterns over and over again.
See, that's always That would be the fun part of working at a haunted place where you can where someone would be like, oh my god, something has happened, and then you say, was it the woman in the white dress? You know, like you have like the thing you have the line that you get to say yeah. But with that one, it was like something scary. It was like a man with like half his face hanging off or something.
Wasn't that it was yeah, because the guy historically the main guy was shot in the face, and there is a lot of nobody really knows if it was suicide, murder, or accident. And there you know, just as today, when a tragedy happens, there's a lot of talk and a lot of whisper down the lane, and sometimes people make things up. And so there were stories of people seeing
someone dressed in all black leaving the balcony afterwards. Uh, And you know, he was involved in some heavy legal stuff at the time, so a suicide made sense, but also a murder would make sense for that. And you know, so nobody really knew what happened to him, but they've been experiencing a lot of activity ever since it became a public or semi public location.
Yeah, but then you've got a psychic in there. You got Sandy Keaza, who's always really fun to watch, and she was like, oh, he didn't shoot himself, somebody shot him.
Yeah.
Cindy's interesting to watch too when she works, because she she'll be on like one She'll she'll be saying one thing and connected into some like one storyline, and then she'll be like, wait, nope, nope, no, nope, that's it, and then she'll turn on a dime. And that's what happened with the shooting. She was like, Okay, I'm getting something here. I need to go here. And as she's telling us something, she's like, wait a minute, somebody was shot. Somebody shot themselves.
What happened?
Something? Hold on? And so she went on this whole journey with it. She was she was very connected into that place. So that was that was particularly fascinating to watch her work.
I mean, do these places I'm curious about.
I don't know if we've ever talked about this together about like get the ghosts out of here kind of situation, cross them over or whatever I mean is that.
What you guys do you guys go to places.
That don't want that, or I know that's not really like what your show is, but like how does that come up with your location scouting and stuff.
Yeah, so it's not something I personally do, and as a team that, it's not something Jack and I do. If somebody wanted that, we would bring in someone else to do it, or if they wanted a blessing, we
would bring in somebody to do that. But because I think my job more than anything, like, yes, I'm researching these odd experiences and I want to document them, and of course you always show respect for the history and the people who have passed in connection to that, but my job is more about helping the living because these experiences can be really crazy and scary and isolating, and so I always go with whatever the current owner wants to do, you know, like do you want it clear?
Do you want like you know, I can, I'll tell you the ins and outs of that. I'm always really really honest with them that there's no guarantees and we don't really know what the stuff is or how it works. But if that makes you feel better, we can try it. And like with Leslie and the Clappers on the McCormick farm. We had a psychic come back to speak with them directly and to kind of I'm trying to remember if he did a blessing or if he just did a reading for them, but you know that was part of
the investigation because they Leslie wanted closure that way. So it all depends on the on the people. It's really whatever they want is what we'll we'll try to do to help them.
So then where did you guys go after that?
I think it was back to Pennsylvania. I think maybe was it Penhurst.
Or let's talk about that.
Yes, yeah, it was fun to see because you've you've been there a bunch of times and that place is an old asylum. Now having been there a lot of times and doing repead investigations at a lot of different places, do you ever have you encountered ghosts that are like, oh, Katrina's back, like.
Me with you on this podcast the third time.
There's been a couple times I've been places repeated and it will it's like they'll get my name on an EVP or yeah, like so weird things like that have happened in the past. Penhurst, I find well, I find more what happens is the more you go back, the more you realize that whatever is going on there isn't consistent in the way that maybe it's we think of
activity to be consistent, you know, we can't. I think we just sort of had this image of like paranormal activity to be this baseline of this always happens blah blah blah, and it doesn't really work like that. You can go into someplace that you've had a really crazy experience, and the next time you go in it's completely you know,
I mean a pun but dead, you know. So I think with something like Penhurst that it's been interesting because I've been they were like seven or eight times at this point, and it's different every single time.
Well, especially because there's probably just so many different energies there, and then people are going in there and they're doing their rituals that are maybe stirring things up, and there's just it just seems like there's like an open door or whatever. I don't know, there's just a lot of different energies. Yeah you're going to get yeah, exactly.
And I think a lot of it also has to do with the people you're with. And I was just talking about this with Rob Zaffi the other day, who was the director of photography, producer coep of Paranormal Lockdown, and we were saying, how it just sort of seems like the crazy experiences that we've had have been when we were on Lockdown, not that we haven't had other experiences, but just like the craziest of the craziest, you know,
happened on that show. And we were kind of just you know, chatting, what it doesn't have anything to do with the energy that was involved from us, And I've definitely been to some places where you know, owners will speak to that, Oh, it only happens if if Bobby's here, you know, it only happens if if Jimmy is with us. So I don't know. It's it's interesting.
So you know, it's it's an old asylum and it has a history that I appreciate that they acknowledge, you know, that was terrible conditions for the people that that were there. Yeah, I wonder since you've been to so many of these, you know, I guess there's a lot of different terms. I feel like a lot of terms for these places are like so outdated, Like some of these like lunatic asilence.
I don't even know if you would say that today, but like you know, you've been to so many of these asylums and places.
Do you notice patterns with that type of haunting?
Yeah? I mean, I know, I know I'm kind of going against what you just said, but I mean, do you notice like a different type of vibe in those kinds of places that's you know, seems to repeat it.
I think in those types of places what's interesting is the activity kind of turns on a dime. When it does, it turns very quickly, so it's a thing that you could feel fine, and then all of a sudden you know that the space is different. And I know that sounds kind of woo woo, but there I cannot think
of a better way to explain it. Like you just have to experience it and you'll know exactly what I'm talking about if you've had it's very Yeah, I would say asylums prisons maybe in the same way, where it's the energy can shift so dramatically and you just know that there's something off and something with you. Whatever that is,
the energy is changed. It's hard to say, because I think asylums especially they're normally ginormous locations, and so many people came in and out of there, and and not just during its life, but also now that ghost cops are really popular. So I think the challenging part is
keeping all those stories straight and documenting them. And I know, even the places that really pride themselves on doing that, some things kind of fall through the cracks just because it's so it's such a high volume of people experiencing things.
You know, I've asked this, I've asked people before, PARALLELM investigators before. You're a good person to answer this because of you know, producing these shows and stuff. Have you encountered any abandoned hospital, asylum or jail that is not haunted?
I don't know that I have, because we purposely seek out the ones that are. So we purposely seek out the one that have uh people witnesses, you know.
But like there can't be one like there is there one like that would feel like you're like the youngest child that never lives up to your expectations or.
Whatever like that.
I feel bad for one of those buildings if they're not haunted, because it's all like the writings on the wall.
Yeah, yeah, I don't know, because then you also have to we have to go into that becomes a much bigger conversation of what is a haunting? Is it because of tragedies that have happened? Is it because of the land? Is it because of our own perceptions, meaning we we know a tragedy happened there, so we think a haunting is happening. Is that all of the above? Is it not one of the above? You know? But I have to say, in my experience, I don't know of one
that claims not to be so. But you know, there's a lot of there's a lot of jails and asylums in the world, so you know, I could be could be wrong about that.
Oh my god.
Another thing about that episode that listeners of this show, I'm sure they've already seen it, but if you haven't, one of the biggest reasons you should watch it as a fan of this show is that one of our absolute favorites, Michelle Bell and Jay shows up with her leather trench coat and her blindfold and tells it like it is. And oh my god, Katrina, We've finally had her on this podcast and blew our minds.
Yeah, she's amazing and It's funny because I remember when I started working with Jack, I was like, you know, well, I have people that I know and trust that I work with, and I want to put their names in the hat for this. And of course one of the people was Michelle. And you know, I think some of the people on Portals had come from other paranormal shows.
Other people had never worked on one before. And I remember the first time we brought her out and she was doing her reading, like the one guy had tears in his eyes. He says like, I've never I've never seen anything like that before, and other people were like, how the is she doing this? She is, I mean, she's amazing the detail she gets with things and how accurate she is. It's incredible. It's incredible to watch her.
I was telling her about one of the craziest stories I've ever heard on the show was somebody that had like somebody got in their dream and it was like super real and not just a dream and blah blah blah.
And she's like, oh, yeah, I can do that. I read a book about that.
Yeah. She actually did something to me. A long time ago, we were investigating in North Carolina and we had her out and I mean this is like, you know, ten years ago, and I was actually in someone's bathroom investigating and I got into their tub, right because that's what you do. And I it was the strangest sensation where it felt like somebody was pressing down on me, like pressing down on my shoulders, in my head and like
bending me forward. And what I didn't know was that Michelle was in our We had a surveillance stand for that episode because the house was smaller, and she was in the van with our tech crew, like two or three guys at the time, and she was purposely attaching to me to see if she could And uh so I guess they knew what was happening. I'm not sure, but yeah, so that was that was really weird. God, yeah, crazy.
Thank you so much to Katrina Widman. Don't you worry.
There is a whole nother part of this episode coming at you next week. We'll get into EVPs, we'll talk about some more episodes and some more places that she has been to recently that are very spooky, unhaunted.
So make sure you're subscribed.
Also, if you want to hear a little extra this week, I'm Patreon, I'm talking to her about her relationship with her psychic abilities. And you can also hear my new podcast with Sam Pancake on there as well. Make sure you rate the show five stars if you like it. If you don't like it, then don't rate it anything. Just don't just stay away from that. You don't have to do that. But if you do like it, rate it five stars. You could leave a ghost story in a five star review, or you could email me at
ghosted by Roz at gmail dot com. Join the Facebook group it's called Ghosted by Roz dress Fales. I'm on Instagram at Roz Hernandez. I am on Cameo rozdres Fales. I love you all, both living and dead.
But if I didn't ask you to haunt me, don't haunt me. Heay bye.
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