DRILLING AT THE KITCHEN TABLE Ep.9 | STANDPIPES

You're listening to the Getting Salty Experience Podcast. Yes, you are listening until the Getting Salty Experience Podcast. X producer Pete former producer Pete. Thank you. He did do a great job in that opening though, But that's a great uh opening st Yeah, we can never get rid of that. Nah, Nope, that thinks stuff. Yea, what's going on, fellas? Welcome back to The Getting Salty Experience, the only podcast that plays the kitchen table to you. We got to Canada. I'm about we getting more smoke

from I mean, what are they doing up there? I don't know, they don't notify fires. Where's the kid in the chat? What's his name? I mean, what are they doing? Uh? Send them a lot of smoke? Always what they're doing? I guess I don't know, you know what they're doing. They're doing this, I don't know. I think that's what they're doing. Let mean, come on, it's enough now. Yeah. I can't even see out my windows over here? Is it really that bad? Little smoky? Yeah? Come on, somebody was telling it's

fromalde Hyde, So I'm like, cursy guy. Yeah, it looks so young. Maybe, yeah, I'm actually dead? You are? You just don't know. You don't. Ah, you're talking to my guy all wrong. Well we gotta do that just for just for the ships and giggles. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he loves that. Hey, you're talking to my guy all wrong. It's wrong, tonge wrong again, it's a wrong tone in the chat. Look at that. I have to get I was looking Darren Phillips. Do something up there? Where'd you for got? Sex?

Put the thing out? Get a two and a half something, bros. Yeah, I think sure is full. Oh well, we got to tell you we're doing what commercials were doing tonight. We gotta do uh yes, that's later on. We'll do that all Just want to get out of the way now, whichever one we'll do all da, and we'll do that one that way. We can keep going and then do it. Here we go. We're gonna hear our guys. If you're looking for a gift for that special firefighter in your life, then head on over to get in Salty

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your premier consulting company. When I hear that, when I hear that area code nine one and seven, I can't help but think about bag. What is it from? How it's turned? Uh the nine one seven now totally skipped my mind. Fifty seven bag or something like that. Damn I headed in my mind as I was listening to it. No mind, all right now. I can't look at that guy when he's in the range of jersey. I can't look at the cheese. It's the mood. Just show

me that picture of that laughed my ass off. It's so funny. It's got them googly eyes working. I don't know what the hell he's doing in that picture. He wore that just for you, Luke, because he knows, all right, what else you got do? The First respond To for Excellence that when we get all up commercials out of the way, out of the way, here we go. The First Responders Center for Excellence is it not for profit organization dedicated to protecting the lives and livelihoods of first responders.

Their education or research initiatives aim to bring great your awareness and understanding the challenges to help safety and well being a firefighters, EMS, personnel, and other first responders too. They are an affiliate of the National Falling Firefighter Foundation. Sweet and Tonight's I'm gonna do my own tip tonight, throw do me a

favor, bro. If you're a guy who's going on a detail in the FDY or a volley goes back and forth to the job, don't put your buck to get in your car without putting it in some kind of bag, preferably something that keeps the contaminants out. Because you put your kids in the car, you know you put them in the in the cort seat where you had some contaminated geah, no boyanel bro clean it up, tightening and if it's a plastic bag, tired in a knot correct a balloon knot? Yeah

you go, oh yeah, whoa whoa show? Yeah yeah. I also want to I want to thank the guys last week man and the guys after the show who contributed to Cat Blue. Guys, what an immense turn out. You guys should be proud of yourself. I know we are fabulous, fabulous that we could help that young lady out unbelieving and you could keep if you keep doing what did that call, Ganza? I don't even know. It's super, Thanks the super because there's still we just got another like six

hundred or seven hundred dollars. You know, guys were watching the show afterwards, so I taught us every month we're just gonna add it up whatever we have there, if it keeps going or just keeps on there in a check once a month for whatever it is that month that we call the gift that keeps on giving. Sent to three thousand dollars this morning. Actually, oh sweet, excellent, and I'm blasting if you were on the show in the past year, I see fat Dowdy, right, do you mean a favor?

We're planning the boat cruise again around the Statue of Liberty on the fire Boat the John Jay Harvey, Uh, send me your email. I don't have everybody's email, or we just I have it probably somewhere. Would make a hell of a lot easy if he just sent it to me so I could finish up the E byte. Which which email do you want to send it to get sold? Experience Coops podcast at gmail dot com or text me if you have my number? Either or either or we got the Bobby Gallio

one who missed last year is a yes this year. I think Killed Duff is coming, your friend edut Tight. I think Freddie laff Amine is coming, Chief laf Amina and uh and the two guests tonight here getting an invite too, like the apples. Yeah, yes, that's it. That's it. Anything else, that's it just uh, just a reminder about the super chaff for tonight. Any questions related to stampipes or something like that, please you can ask him. There's a way to do it if you just want

to support us, like he did on Monday in previous shows. We greatly appreciate old support. You're getting smooth at this problem. He's like, what the heck cut is it? It's about a week oldbout a week old. I'm very jealous. He's buff from my shirt too. Did you see that especially? Yeah? Wow, So our one guest doesn't really need an introduction, Chief Norman. The guy is just like he's the guy. He's here, it is here, it is, let's bring him in here. He is no, no, no, wait, sucked up up. I'm just

giving you his credentials. I said, you don't even gotta give it. That's one guy. I gotta tell you, before he even knew who I was, Bro, I would no matter where I was going, I would see that guy at an airport. I'm like, I think, Chief Norman again, I swear to guy every time I went to the airport. There he was one of those guys. Now the other guy we got coming in. Oh, the other guy. You might know him as you might know him of the bro of h two. Oh, maybe the Sultan of the

Stampipe, maybe the hero of the of the host Line. I don't know. He's been said to walk around with a smooth boar in his pants. I can tell you that much. He's the superman with the two and a half in his hand. Bro. When the Chief calls for more of us, he may respond in the clipt Torus, right, yes, he'll call the proby. He'll call the proby of Vagina if he's caught using a fog

doll on his lineup. Because the straight stream is where it's at. And don't forget that brother here, he is here, they are, both of them. Bring me, brothers, all right? Here we go there, where's your one of them? We go? There's your falls nuns. You want to help me? I don't know. Guys for joining us again, I appreciate it. We're breaking. You had to go to the cletus, right, I fumbled on that one, brod. We want to go back and do it again. When the chief calls for more of us, he

may respond in the Clattorus, look at the chiefs face. That's why the chiefs in the sauna. He needs to be massage and got to sweat this one out a long night. No matter where I was going to the country. In the airport, I go, I think that's Chief Nomen over there walking around. Yeah, yeah, it never did offer to carrying my bags. Oh, chief, you probably wouldn't know who I was back then. Hey, Chief doughby By, who are you? I'm sorry? What who

the hell are you get away from? All right, let's get the patriotic guns before we go any the very patriotic show. Yeah, come on, man, let's get patriotic. Here we go. All right, here we go. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic, for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. All right, you know what, You're gonna have to take the lead here, because I was busy sitting in the

back coming up with these idiotic things. So I don't really know where you want to start. Well, we gotta figured we would start the chief. You wanted to go over some stuff. Obviously we're going to talk about standpipes, But did you want to talk about what they mean, what you guys

were talking about when we talked at the show? What was that? Well, yeah, basically, the premise was just that, you know, we've all seen problems with standpipe operations, and you know it's a It's not an everyday operation from most fired companies, even in you know, high rise areas. They don't stretch a line every single day unless you're forty two engine and you go into the training tower there. But most of the time it goes well, but every now and then it doesn't and it usually falls back und

you know, people doing things that they know they shouldn't have done. The problem is that guys don't understand the standpipe system itself. You know, it's not just a pipe that carries water. That's a simplistic view. But it's built to a standard, the NPA fourteen standard that determines how the system is going to perform. And just because your departments sop says, well, we do it this way, doesn't mean that that system is designed to work that

way. So I give you a little bit of background. I spent about eight years seven years as a fire protection engineer designing sprinkler and standpipe systems and high rise buildings, all kinds of buildings before I got on the fire apartment and standpipes are pretty simple. There's a code that tells you how far apart the outlets have to be. There's another code that tells you what the pressure is going to be at each outlet. And too often fire departments think that,

well, okay, this is a simple thing. It's just like pulling pre connect and it's not. It's a different, different environment that you're working in, just the fact that it's in a bigger building. You know, if it's a high rise, you go and you know ten stories, say twelve stories. That means all your logistics has to come with you, so it takes time to get water on the seat of the fire. If you

need extra air cylinders, I mean they're back down in the street. Everything that you didn't bring with you was down on the street, which means we got to go up there loaded for bear, which puts a lot of work on the guys who are houlding that stuff up, especially if the elevators are out of service that we see all the time and you're now humping or your gear up. You know, multiple flights of stairs, but you have to be prepared for when you get there, and shortcuts get us in trouble.

Timmy and I were talking and we've all seen it. You all have seen it where the best laid plans of mice and men get messed up because somebody does something that they shouldn't do. So guns, could we start with. They think it's slide thirteen. It's just an illustration of a standpipe riser. And as I say, it's a simple thing. You can have a couple of different sources of water supply, but the code requires that for a single riser system, all that system has to flow is five hundred gallons a minute

from the two most remote outlets, usually the top floor outlets. So that's all you can expect. If you don't put that fire out with those two lines, well you're in big trouble. If we go to a multi riser system Slide fourteen. There, guns you're gonna get an additional two hundred fIF gallons a minute one two and a half inch line, basically for every riser

in the building. Now it used to be in real big buildings. They might have four, five, six seven rises going up in that building, but you're only going to get two hundred and fifty gallons a minute off of each additional riser up to a maximum of about twelve hundred fifty gallons a minute. That's a lot of water, but it might not be everything you need, particularly if we're looking at something like a high rise commercial building. So

that's how we get into the discussion here. If it's within the capacity of your host line, that's fine. The problem some of the problems that i've seen. I spent you know a few years in Engine two ninety we did a lot of high rise work down in Starrett City or in the projects around us, and we had multi instances where there were problems. One issue that

we see. The code says, well, every floor, every part of the floor should be within reach of one hundred and fifty feet of hoes, but we know, like Louis, you know, in two ninety we used to take seven lengths of hopes because the federal projects had buildings that they reached. They cheated, if you will. The outlets were not in the stairways. They put outlets out in the hallway and met the code distance requirements with

being no more than one hundred and fifty feet away. But if you had to hook up on the floor below and then stretch up a flight of stairs and then down the hall because you didn't want to hook up to that outlet in the fire hallway, that took us seven lengths of hose. So each guy who carry everybody had to take two lengths, and a nozzleman carried one and the standpipe bag. So everybody just burdened down plus the old gear,

their masks and everything else. And now again, if you're hoofing it because the elevators are out, you'll beat up before you get to the firefloor. I don't know if it was Starrett, but it was. I don't know if that's me. It might be you, Lou. I'm not sure one of them. I forget which building it was. I was just telling the chief, like he was saying, we went to so many stampipe buildings.

It's like being out of the job now is like it's like I don't remember anything, but I remember each guy carried a roll up, and the control man carried two roll ups, and the officer carried the bag, right, So I remember looking in that bag and it was heavy, and I was telling the chief the guys used to break balls all the time every once in

a while. If you ever said, hey man, this bag is freaking heavy, you know, next time you went in, there be like two extra you know, ten pound weights in there, you know what I mean. So it was just pretty funny. But I remember looking in that bag a lot, obviously going through every scenario, and there were so many things in there, like the Chief was saying, because somewhere along the line over the years, that was the problem and that fixed for that particular problem for

that particular building was in that bag. So you had to know each scenario, you know, because each stampipe was totally different, each outlet was totally different. All this stuff was, you know different, So you know, we really took a lot of pride in that. But you know, if a detail came and he had control and we had to you know, go to a stampipe, a lot of times the doorman would take the extra length.

Obviously you don't want your detail carrying two lengths, but that extra length was to get to the last apartment, to get to the last room, right, So it was never going to be that we were dependent on the second two engine, right. I mean we could use their lengths, like the chief was saying, if you know, go for seven lengths or something like that, but we were going to have five lengths just to make sure that we're covering, you know, the last apartment to the last room,

which is important. I mean, bring three lengths of hose and it's a four length stretch. We're good eye you know. Again, that's the logistics that we're talking about. You've got to have everything that you a gonna possibility need when you get to the firefloor. So carried all that stuff, you

might be spent before you even start operating the life. That's so one of the things we talked about, and there was discussions about when we rewrote the engine manual, was you know I liked I liked the fact that the officer carried the bag. I mean, it was never going to be able to be written that way. But when the officer carries the bag, he'd just by dropping the bag, he decides what outlet he wants you to hook up to, you know, and it's like a nonverbal command. I don't need

my radio or anything else. I dropped the bag by this outlet. That's it. This is where I want you to hook up. And another thing about that one fifty one fifty gets you to the door of the apartment, you know, and so you know it doesn't that's that's the misnomer about that

one fifty. It gets you to the door of the apartment. And what we used to do we had the polo grounds and we would take rope, the search rope as the longest rope we had, and we would go and we we discovered that the e line of apartments that in the polo grounds would need an extra it was fifteen feet, we would come up fifteen feet short, so that immediately went out to the sids that the E line required four links because you know, you look at standpipe stuff and not the um take

over. But you know you look at engine stuff. You know, when you look at engine work, it's the hardest thing an engine has to do, you know. I mean, if you think of everything it needs to go right to get a line in operation at a standpipe building as opposed to pulling a preconnect off off an apparatus. You know, we've got to be able to carry all that stuff to the drop point, connect to the outlet, supply the outlet, find a hydrant that we can bring water to that

outlet. All these things need to go right. And I tend with me in the chief talk last night, and I'm a big guy about doing it by the numbers, you know, and have that checklist. If you do it by the numbers, you get this right. You get this right, You get this right, you get this right. Can it go wrong, sure, but you've kind of you know, you're playing a home game now and you've limited the amount of things that can go wrong if you simply just

do it by the numbers. And I'll tell you this, most engine officers don't understand NFPA fourteen. They they think it's just a pipe that that gives me water. They don't understand that there are limits to it. There, there are this to it. Um if you're an engine officer, it's a document that I wouldn't suggest reading everything, but the information about stand pipes within

that document is very very good used to it. If if you're an engine officer, if that's what your your goal is to be a good engine officer, you know there's things in there that are rule pert into what we do every day. Yeah, they set the parameters. I mean these rules were designed and developed. And you have to understand that the NPA fourteen standard was

first written in nineteen twelve, that was first publication. Why was that Well because the e before they killed one hundred and forty six people down at the ash building and the triangle shirtwaist fire. So that got a lot of attention, got rules created. But what was fire attack like in nineteen twelve? You know, two affanche hoes and an enginet, a solid tip nozzle. That's it. It wasn't a black nozzles. So the NPA standard was created

and for eighty years until nineteen ninety three. You got that slide seven I do. Oh yeah. February of ninety one, Philadelphia had a fire in one Meridian Plaza. The standpipe system there created havoc for the fire department. They could not get an effective fire stream in what was when they arrived a one office fire, relatively small fire that could have been controlled if they could

have gotten a working hose line in operation, but they couldn't. The standpipe system was improperly installed and their hose line required way too much pressure that just wasn't going to be available. Uh So, gons, if you go to slide twenty two, twenty three, twenty two to twenty two, here was the problem right there in Philadelphia. It was a pressure reducing valve that is

a complex mechanical valve, and they failed. They failed in Los Angeles City after the Philadelphia tragedy, Los Angeles City tested every single valve in the city and three quarters of them failed to deliver an effective fire street. So that

was a severe problem. But the fire department aspect is also part of it, all right, So if you're taking inchant three quarter hose and the fog nozzle that if you put If you put two hundred feet of inchant three quarter with a fog nozzle directly off your engine, you're pumping at it about two hundred psi. The standpipe system is designed so that at the top floor outlet you get no more than sixty five psi. Back in before nine, Yeah,

sixty five psi. That's it at the top floor outlet. Now at the bottom floor you might have one hundred one hundred and fifty, but you're not getting two hundred. Ever, so the nozzle and the hose that you used to fight that fire have to match the system designed. After ninety three, the standard was revised and they gave us a little more pressure. You can have one hundred psi. You should have one hundred psi at the top floor outlet, But what's one hundred psi when you got one hundred psi nozzle?

You need one hundred just for the nozzle. We get the frictional loss through the hose and everything. So we're still not at the pressure that people think that they're getting. Too. Often they think, well, okay, I can get more pressure. I'll just maybe pump into the fire department connection

and I should be able to build that up maybe and maybe not. The firepump may have a relief valve that's built in that it's going to dump the excess pressure that you put in. So there are all kinds of variables in the system that your best intentions in the world and your srps are just not going to overcome. So we have to be prepared for that. Bottom line, Okay, this is the most I'm gonna get, And most of the time the answer is still going back to nineteen twelve, especially in older buildings.

If you've got a building was built before ninety three, it's going to be the sixty five psi at the top floor, which means again three four lengths to two and a half and then into a solid tip nozzle, and that's all that system is going to work with anything. You try to do anything else and you're dropping your gallonage and or your pressure at the nozzle.

So well, that's that's that's a real key point because a lot of people don't understand n A PA fourteen and that's sixty five, Like you know what every says, hyy sixty five? Why the pre ninety one, why was it sixty five? And that was built around the attack package. If you do the math of the three links of two and a half with an inch and an h tip, it's sixty five p si. So so that that system is designed around the attack package. The attack package is not designed around

the system. The system is designed to supply. That's why it was sixty five originally. Now the one hundred, it's one hundred now since uh, you know the one medium plaza fier And you know, I've asked a lot of people, you know, why the hundred and you know, the best I could get it to compromise from the companies that are using the fog nozzles and the people that are still using the the smooth born nozzles. And to

me, that just doesn't work. I mean, if you're gonna if you're gonna increase it for a reason, you know, have a reason why. Because especially with standpipes, you know, you got to ask the why. You know, like we went to the two inch leagally and I don't want to get ahead of ourselves. And my question when we did that was the why why did we do that? You know, when the system is built around the attack package of three links of two and a half and a smooth

bore nozzle with an inch and eighth tip. So why did we go to a line that's going to sacrifice forty five gallons of water a minute? Um? You know, And and that was my question. So you know, to reiterate what the chief says about the the pre ninety one standard to sixty five if you understand where that comes from. That sixty five is built for the attack package of three links and the inch and an eighth tip. Just

system. Huh, you have to understand the system. Un Yeah. Now, you know, some of those new pressure reducing valves, a lot of people don't realize their their factory preset. So you'll see on some of them, you'll see they'll have an imboss number twenty three, and you'll be on the tenth floor of a building and I'll have a twenty three on it, and that was actually meant for the twenty third floor of building. The plumbers don't give a shit where they put them. But a lot of those things,

yeah, with math or factory not. The device is not a pie. I could be on the on the on the third floor, but it's set and the yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it happens a lot. That's crazy. Another thing a friend of mine I just talked to and not to get off, but they just came out with the fire Service just

won a big victory because had these other valves. There's some it's called an automatic breach uh for the last word, but it's a it's a valve that if if the system senses an exorbitant flow, it shuts the system down. But the valve couldn't um decide whether it was flow off an outlet or flow off a break, so they most play. And he said there's some installed in New York City. Said it's a automatic breach control and if it's all if the pipe breaks, it shuts it down. It doesn't flood the building,

but it couldn't distinguish whether you're falling off. How many times get it down? Though? We beat that and they can't use them anymore. That's very many times as a broken pipe, you know, in a stampipe system flooded a building. You know. No, maybe crazy vandalism opening valves. We used to get that a lot, you know, the kids opening valves on the upper floors of a high rise. But when we need it.

We need the water. Most times you break a pipe and it's gonna be a it'll be a dry system because you'll get rot with the dry system. If you have water in that system, you'll get some rot, but it won't it just can't really do it. You'll get you'll get the air will rot them out. So like in parking Garager, we pop them all the time because they're there. You know, they''ll always be a dry system because we don't want to freeze those systems. And the dry systems break a lot

more than the wet winds do. Is there breaks. The other pot that breaks is this line from the Siamese connection which is dry up to the visor and we've had you know, Siamese is bloody hyping from the Siamese connection blow out of the building. That's why it's so important. Like if you're an engine officer, wherever you were, whether it's New York City, whether it's Myrtle Beach, whether it's Charleston, you should understand the buildings within your district

because you know they're very they're a lot more complex than people. There's isolation valves, so if you have a break, you can isolate the break and still get water to the fire area. You know, I had a fire up in the BRONX. I showed up and Francis X was the chief, and I walked up and he said to me, goes, thank god your hair, you're the wizard. No, but he said, listen, we're

having real trouble at water. Can you figure out what's going on? So what I did was I told two guys listen, start a line and we'll supply to floor outlet. And then I realized underneath there was their cabinets, and you'll see on alten floors, underneath the cabinet there'll be another openable cabinet with a valve and Ali's and y valve in there, and those are section valves and we can isolate certain sections. So I knew if I had a problem, I could isolate it. So I go into basement and they were

there the day before testing the system. So there's a test plug that they unscrewed. The plug screwed into pressure grades and then they pressurize the system, you know, to test to pressure test it. But they never put the plug back in, so it was spitting out the whole. There was a foot and a half of water in the basement. So we were able to figure out what's going on and luckily they put the fire out. It didn't

have to supply and't have to do anything else. But if you understand a system and when you when you're troubleshooting, if you're not getting water, you got to start at the source. You don't know people will start from the outlet down wrong, throw up slide fifty four exactly what Timmy's talking about. Oh the valve on the bottom. That yeah, that's it, that's bottom.

It's required to be below the first floor hose outlet. Now this is a nice simple one where it is right below the hose outlet, but it could also be at the first at the sellers ceiling. So if you're having that problem again again, I've had two fires where the Siamese connection blew out of the wall and closing that valve and pumping into the first floor now put you back in business. Yes, you can isolate. Yes, I think in the Big six Louis we had we had those valves outside the buildings because

you could you could shut them building. They might have been post indicators, that's what they were, posted post indicators. If if you had a roof tank that served multiple buildings, or if you had one line and come in that branched off, you'd have post indicators valves outside the building, right, Yeah, we always check those. That was one thing we always looked at to make sure they were open. They were all open. Right. How often does do the buildings have to test, you know, the standpipes.

I'm not sure. Under FPA fourteen, it's got to be annually. I would think, yeah, well, i'm here it's annually. They have to do it annually. Down here. Part of the problem is not every bit of the system gets tested. Again, that check valve at the riser all the way back to the Siamese connection usually doesn't get tested, and that's one

of the weakest points. So yeah, it could be annually. Well, if they get tested, it gets tested to NFPA standards and not firepartment standards, right, you know, so you know we might be putting a little more stress on a system than the NFPA standard does. Yeah. Yeah, So these are, like I said, Dick, complex systems that you have to understand and then you have to do the right thing. All the time. We saw guys taking shortcuts again just because the building is designed that they

have that outlet out in the public hallway to meet the distance requirements. Doesn't mean you should use that. Think about that as a smoke. You go out into the public hall if the door to the fire apartment is open, what is that telling you? You're in the fire area, trying to make your connections under stress now and yeah it's banking down nothing and God forbid you get you know, like happened down Vandalia Avenue where the wind blows in.

Now you're out in the hallway with the fire and you're done. You know, the problem is that it works of the time, you know, And I don't like those odds, you know, especially when it you know, like we said earlier, you know, you know, when you ask the why why don't we do that? Well, if the fire answers that question for you, you're in frigging trouble, you know what I mean. There's

really always a reason. The reason why we don't do it that way is because people have died, right, Yeah, it only takes one time. If I if I have to explain the why, you know, I tell them if the fire is going to explain the why to you, you know, we're gonna get screwed up here, like do it by the numbers, go to flore Hey, listen, does it seem it's gonna be harder? Might be, but it's safer and it's more efficient. And at the end

of the day, you know you're gonna get your line in place. And you know, like two nine, you did a ton of project like we did up in harm and we we tried hooking up. We used took up in the polar grounds, uh, in the cabinets, in the hallways, and you know, we got caught one day and from that point forward, you know what seemed easy, and you know easy isn't always the best,

especially when it comes to stampoint just not happened. It happened once. I was the control man and it was a nursing home, and we can beat the first two engine in ninety nine point nine percent of the time, and we spanked him. We got in first, and I didn't have enough.

I did not have enough line to go because I was hooking. You know, it was I would have to drop two floors below, and I was calling for them to bring their line to help because we wouldn't have made distract and I don't know if they were pissed off that we beat him in. So I chose to hook up on the fire floor and Dennis Murphy's the only time he fucking yelled at me in a way. I was like, I have never don that again, man, you know. But they I didn't

think I had a choice. You know, we got in first, and they don't lose the job. I didn't want to lose the job. And then snowballs we were going to reach and I'm calling them on the radio to bring their lines and they just they didn't. But it's just it's just one of those roles that and we've all listened. We've all cut corners. I mean, I'm not saying you didn't. You you we've all done that.

But it's just, you know, you when you look at that animal of a standpipe fire, you know you can get away with it atenement, a Brownstone, But you know when when when a when a standpipe building fights back, it's bad, you know. And that's the problem with not doing it by the numbers, because when it goes bad, it goes bad in a hurry, you know, and there's really nowhere to go. Like in an atenement, you you can go somewhere in a project, you know, and

it's very hard to get out of that. And as unfortunately as as our job has proved, you know, when it goes bad, it's very hard to turn around and fix that. Yep. Well, that's why you need your avenue over retreat. You know, in the fireproof building, what's the only safe area. You got a staircase behind a closed door. Staircase, So that's where you need to be starting from. I mean, go back to that Vandalia Avenue fire again. You know two ninety tried three times to

get out into the public hall before the third time. Yeah, that's the back of the building and the windows with the smoke. It was the fire apartment. This is the front of the building, these smoke stained windows. That's one hundred about sixty feet down the hall and on the opposite side of the fire across the hall from it. That fire was venting down that hallway and that company tried to get out of that door. I think I got a picture of what is it, HRMDS twenty two the staircase. Yeah,

they tried to get out of that door three times. They had to get two eighty three and two nineties line opened them and then opened the door before they could get out into the hallway. It was that bad going down that staircase. They backed down a staircase twice because it was that bad. Fire blown into the staircase around them and drove them back down the stairs. That's

bad. Another company tried to hook up on that outlet right there on the tenth floor and was unable to connect because the door was open, and never did get their line charged. So these things happen. And like Timmy said, ninety nine percent at a time, you're gonna be fine. Can do that one percent, then I can do the O of the front of the fire building all black. It's you know, what's what I'm talking about. It's got fire stains. Now it go back. It's not that one.

Here we go there. It is so so you look at that picture and then you think back to the the Vandalia Avenue picture that he showed where the stains weren't even nearly that bad. So what's the difference in those two fires. So this fire they put out from the inside with no problem at all, none whatsoever. And so people would look at that and say, well, that was the worst fire but Van Daily Avenue, the smoke stains weren't even You look at that build and say, how bad that fire could it

be? That's because you know it was a win impact and fire and all that stuff. You see any outside of that building right there was being pushed back into the building. And that's why you know, you know these builds, that's why these fires are so deceiving because you look at that picture and you say, wow, that's a really good job. And it went out pretty quickly with the single two and a half where Van Daily Avenue took the

lights of three firefighters and it didn't even look that bad at all. And that's because the wind played a role on that and shit had gone wrong. And that's like, like we said, how bad they can go When it doesn't look bad for me outside, you know, it can go bad in a hurry. And that's like I said, I go back to that. If I can do the one percent that go bad, I can do the ninety nine that go right easily. So I'm gonna jump in there. I'm gonna jump in there early. I'm just gonna jump in there early. I

don't when you get a chance. So maybe I don't know for the audience as far as what you guys would carry in your bag, because I know we have a bag down here, we'll kind of just I don't want to totally change the momentum of the show, but if at some point maybe you could just touch on a case somebody wants to know what's in the bags. There's a lot of stuff that we mandate in the engine manual that you're supposed to bring, but a lot of companies that have made bastard tools to do

stuff. We we gotta bring a Stillson wrench, pipe wrench. You're supposed to bring the pressure gauge, but most companies are attaching that to the controlling already. I don't know what two ninety did, but most companies attached that there. Um, you're supposed to bring an extra wheel, you're supposed to bring adapters. Um, you're supposed to bring another nozzle, and then a lot of companies will carry extra caps. A lot of companies will carry hire

brushes. Some companies will make a two for a stuck wheel. But you can do the same thing with the Stilson wrench by opening up and putting the wheel and open it that way. So there's stuff that's mandated our job that we bring. But like a lot of times you know you'll have in that bag um that are building specific stuff. Also, like a lot of places now bring a one way gate with them so they can control the outlet a

little better. And I never really agreed with it because it adds a little bit extra weight, but now they're making them a little lightweight and they can control the opening and closing of that you're putting it basically, you're putting a gate on a gate. Yeah, that's what's gonna say. That's exactly what

we do. Is we not again just a little two cents, was that we actually pump the entire system and then we control the PSI at the at the at the the fire department gate and not the valvet's not and we have the pressures and that's how we control the entire way. And then you use the fire department gate to control and you find it it's more easy to control

the pressure that way. Getting more we have actually we haven't set and it's we carry two hundred feet to hose a two inch actually is what we're running now. Where we have the gauge, we have the valve and that's part of our system. They set everything up. They want if we have one hundred fifty fee to hose out, it's one hundred psi. If we want two hundred feet to hose out, they pump it up and running up two hundred and ten psi, So we get two sixty five with the tip.

Yeah, a lot of a lot of places say they carry that game. No, not totally against it. Um. A lot of people say if if you open that valve and it gets stuck open and you can't now you can't get it back close, And a lot of them are that way. At least you have that fire department gate where you can control the pressure is there because you are basically a pump operator. That's what that's actually the engine and operated gate though that key a screw operated gate. Yes, yeah,

we're not using a ball valve case sexual true gate valve. Yes, yeah, you're not using a ball valve. A ball valve is not. You don't use a ball valve there. Chief. I remember in Starrett they used to the guys used to if I have this right again, it's been a long time. It's uh, we didn't open up the valve all the way because the guys were afraid of a hammer, like they would get like,

I guess if the pump would turn on or something would happen. Right, we used to get this hammer, uh, and you would feel it on the nozzle would sometimes knock get out of your hand or something. I don't I don't remember what was. Yes, Start City had their own pumps and it was a good you know, you've got plenty of pressure there, so when that pump kicked in, you could you could get a you know,

pretty good. That's why I think they never the guys would say they wouldn't open the valve all the way because if they you know that, guess they operated like that, and then it would it was better to keep it cranked down a little bit. I don't remember all that stuff. I was just going to the fire They handled all that shit. But that's that's just knowing

your district building specific stuff Like Hey Starn had its own pump. We knew that we couldn't open it all the way because we didn't want the hammer, and we risked, you know, pop in a sweat and blowing a valve off somewhere. So and you know, that's that's a great example of Hey listen, these are the buildings we respond to. I want to know my systems. I don't like I said, I don't need I don't need to know how to stretch at a tenement. I need to know how my systems

are in my neighborhood. So that's that's a perfect example of that. Yeah, Tim, what about the Chauffe's that you guys have a chauffe stampipe kit too? Maybe you want to go what was in that we did? It's it's the Chauffez stamp pipe kit is kind of minimized a little bit now because they've made a um a appliance that it's a it's a single appliance to supply the first flower outlet. So if you get a bad Siamese or a lot of places have the storage connections to supply the riser. If it's bad and

you have to supply the first flower outlet. Um A lot of places made a Chauffe's kit that had all the and I try to figure it out. I think it's a a three and a half to two and a half reducer and then a two and a half dubber female you'd have to bring to make that connection before they came out with the double fe male swivel twin half, so it's a single you know, transgender fitting. Okay, ye see where l l g p qt lt yeah rst lpq Yeah, that's that's a transigent

transgender fitting. So um. But the one thing we added to that it wasn't in the the engine manual was that if you're supplying that first flower outlet, and a lot of people don't realize this is because because you know that Chauffur's gonna be running back and forth. So a lot of guys would go and make the connection to the first flower outlet, open the outlet, and then run back to the rig and charge that rig to supply the outlet.

But the problem with that is is once you open rimer's an outlet, so you're gonna you're on the first floor, you're gonna rob if if they're flowing water and they don't have adequate water, but they got enough to survive until the rig, So if you open that outlet, you're gonna rob them of their water. So the important thing, especially with that sofa's kit, whatever you bring, is you've got to bring water to the out the first and

then open it. That way you won't have an interruption of water on the fire floor. Good point. Hopefully, Yeah, that's in a new engine. Man we pick the hopefully gets just second due engine show for to get out of his cab and help put down the donut buddy. Now, most most engines, when you go to a standpipe building, that second doue chauffeur is making a bee line to help out that first due chauffeur, you know, because they know they're they're hands stretching the three you know, to supply

that Siamese. Even as a squad. When I came in, that's the first thing. I mean, I had a little leeway to where I was going. You touched hose, no stop, you might hurt my feelings. If I had I would feeling. I would Oh, I said, if I had something, I would always check on the first two chauffe It didn't even have to be a yeah, even if it was a step was make sure he had water because but that's a professional chauffeur. That's what a professional

chauffer does. Stay make sure the first new chauffeur is taken care of. You know, at any fire, you know that you show up a second tountion. You know it isn't you know picking up girls time, it's go up and make sure that's first. And that's what a professional show. If you see him going around the rig a few times as you pull themselves into the ground like hey you okay, guy, he's a guy throwing time, Like right, it's and it could be the simplest thing, but you just

get blinded because you're on the right. It doesn't listen. We've all been there at some point. You have to try and stay calm. But when you got guys getting burnt or whatever and you're trying to do something quick, sometimes yeah, the worst thing you can hear is a chauffer is where's my water? Yeah, you're looking, you're looking at your line coming off the rig looks good, and then you're you're tapping the gauge. I don't or you see the thing out to zero. So we have a problem. Everything

did in the squad. But I loved, you know, being first due chauffeur like that first seven eight minutes a few years so is all on you man. You know, once you get water to those guys, you're like, yeah, time's at by three at a stampipe pilling. Yeah, well it is all on you. Yeah, you know without over there. I'll bet your off yep. Yeah, he's not on his game. Man,

how many times dude, that left rack we get. We used to get to left rack pretty fast, and oh my goodness, gracious man, I've seen some bad You know, you've never been to the Polo grounds, I take Yeah, it's just tough, like the Chief of saying before, man,

those jobs. If you get a little delay or you know, you're not in sync with everything on the sixteenth floor, you know, and it's a good fire and it's you know, maybe it's snow out or whatever, and everythingbody's a little delayed, it just gets it could go ugly quick. Man. You know the Polo Grounds, the hallways were in a te so it was out in the hallway. It wasn't like a straight hallway. You had you had you had a couple of times find out where it was.

Yeah, it was no fun up there. The Polar Grounds what street with those on one, five, five, and eighth Avenue, and then we had the Wrangle houses north of there. We actually did more work up in the wranglehouses, but they were smaller. They were only about twelve stories where the polar grounds were thirty and there were four of them, all shaped in a tea. You could hear the howling and the road. Yeah, they were terrible. First job I worked up there too. First job I went

to was the high rise. Job was a project job. Uh sans stand Street down in Brooklyn. I had a funny story about a project job on We were at UM twenty four seventy five Southern Boulevard and it's it's like a thirty story building. Read at the end of Southern. It hits for them road and uh again, and we got a good fire somewhere. We're trying to find it. And so the guy in truck says to me, he

goes, hey, listen, fires in this room. So I said, I always wanted as the engine officer, I always want to control the door. I never you know, once they found a fire, if the door is closed, As the engine I want to control of the fire room or the fire ear itself. And uh. So I says, give me, give me, give me the door and you finish your search. So there's two doors side by side and they open both like this. So I reached up and I grabbed the wrong knob so my nozzle man shows up and I

tell him this, since you're ready, you got the room. It's right here. I opened the door. So we opened the door. He opens the line and he just douches the shit out of this room. I said, shut it down. I get in the room. I'm looking around like, that's funny. It's not a thing burned in this room. I'm looking around like right next door, ripping right here. I go out of that room. I go to I opened the door, and it's fucking rolling. But I had already told the chief chief I got the fire, I got

waterfire, got the fire knockdown. I already told him that. So I opened the next room and it's fucking run. I'm like, holy shit, I go, Mike, bring the line over here. So we knock it down. But the funny part I tell the chief. I says, you know, eight eight to one eight, and I think it was SOFTID goes go ahead. I go yeah, I says, we got the fire knocked down, and we got one room really clean. Who who was the engine boss? Was it David David Davidson? Who was the guy who passed away

f d n Y. I don't know if it was Davidson. I can't remember names anymore. He got killed. He was in the engine boss, I think, Uh, Martin mart what yeah, Martin Martinson, Martinson. No, no, Martinson from eighty engine. He was the fireman in eighty engine Martinson out, yes, Martinson. But he was in an attic,

wasn't he No, No, No, that's a different name. Was a project and al you're right, chief, So just uh it just because I went to to probi school at him and when I was in two ninety at the time, the chief knows right, John Martinson, John Martin Martinson, I said, david'son Martinson. Um, so just make a quick story because it's kind of to your point. You know. I took a lot of

pride. You know. We would turn out fast. The truck would have to close to close the doors right, so we would have a head start. And I don't remember where the heck it was, but it was a project job. It was on the tenth floor. At the time. I could run up the stairs. Literally, I was going to so many freaking projects I was. It was incredible. I get to the top of the stairs, I opened up the door right square. I tell the guys right here, you know, I close the door, go in, I'm by

myself. I'm four doors down. I find the apartment instead of saying I got the apartment. Next thing I know, I'm in the apartment. I'm doing a search, right, trying to get the fire. Now. I'm like, yeah, it's four doors down on the right, you know, bring the line where all you do? Then the trucks here, and then I'm fighting to on the radio to get him to bring the line to where I am, you know what I mean. So, and then I kind of felt like that's what happened to him, if I remember the story right,

Like he was kind of buy himself initially. So I was kind of like, you know what, I got to like pump the brakes a little bit because I'm not in the truck, right, I have to make sure that the line is getting here, right. I'm kind of doing this for me, right somewhat. You know, I'm trying to get in there, just make a grab whatever people, right, But I'm I'm I'm being a little bit. I should be. Really, that's not my job at that point, you know, so the priority to make it get light line.

So I kind of I have the same exact story it's it's hysterical, the same story exactly. I kind of pumped the brakes a little bit because I had to go back, get the guys right, bring him back. I mean, the fire went out, everything was great. I mean, but Lou, were you a boss at the time. I was, Yeah. So when I got promoted, a guy said to me, my case, remember my case, chief, right, He said, don't expect guys at places you go to operate the way you did. And you know, like,

I'm not saying eighty it was bad. I'm not saying that at all, because they were great. They were a great engine company. But we had My first job was a project fire. And we go in and I get up and there's three stairways. First time I'm ever in the building. I'm in the company a month so they started hooking up in the a stairway. I go down, I make a turn on the hallway. I'm like, oh, it's the Shining hallway. Remember the movie you Shining just kept

getting longer and longer and longer. I'm like, holy, two scary kids at the end. So I get on a radio and I tell them, I go listen, you're gonna have to use forty eight links. It doesn't even phase me that I'm beyond the one fifty. And I knew I knew stampips. But you get into that mode, you know. So I figured they're gonna show up at the line. I just tell them use forty eighth linked. I get the apartment doing the same thing. I'm making my search.

I find the fire, the doors burned through. So the truck shows up and I tell him, listen, I gotta go find a line. I don't know where it is. It's not here yet. And I tell a guy in a truck, I said, I get another door and put it over the bedroom. Right. You ever do that tonight? I'm sure they did that one out of three. So the guy in a truck comes back with a mattress. I go, you kidding me? Got to burn

the place down. But I had to go all the way back. They were waiting to the fire door, and we came up five feet short, five feet forty five. Engine walked right by me and put my fire on. I was never so embarrassed in my life. Now. First day woke up to a different different stair Yeah, two doors down from the fire apartment. Different Yeah, And it just you know, like I said, knowing your buildings, you know, keeping that perspective wide. I'm walking down a

holey and it didn't even phase me. Mother, There's gotta be another stairway here, it gotta be. It just didn't even phase me. I said, you know, use forty eights. And that's the perfect example of knowing the building in your district. Man, Timmy, why we'll talk about going to the floor below. We'll get there were districting out talking about going to the floor below, find an apartment ten ja yeah, yeah, you know, and see the staircase there in the clear air. Yeah, and then

pick the right attacks there. Well, you got to learn something from every fire, yo doing. I mean, that's one of the things I learned. I mean, like I just you got focused on getting there and and I you know, it was one of those things. And I'm the first one admit that, you know, I kind of screwed up that day. Luckily nobody got hurt. You know, the fire went out and the chiefs

didn't even know what happened. Really, yeah, I changed that, you know, just I could find an apartment, closed the door, but I wasn't, you know, four rooms deep on my engine was, you know, back here calling for me. And then there's now there's chat on the radio. Like you said, the truck's coming down. Everybody's banging it to each other. You know, it's just mayhem. Yeah, that's not my position, you know what I mean? So it is, it is,

It is. Sorry. This guy he's waiting for he's got his finger waiting for you to do it. Right there. When you came to booth, you were talking about some kind of controversial theories going back and form with the line. What what was that? Do we coming up the stairs or going down the stairs or something to flick out again? Difference of opinion. Uh, you know when your short staff, the temptation is you flick the line up the fire floor stair and back down again, and you'll get away with

it ninety nine times out of a hundred. Again. Uh, it's easier on the guys because once that line is filled with war, gravity helps pull it down the stairs as they advance. I'm in that one percent category again. When that fire comes out into that staircase and burns through the hose line, you're in deep ship. To me, it's work, But I have a place to retreat to and I'm not going to lose my hostline when things go bad. And again I've seen it go bad, and you don't want

to do that. So guys will. Guys will go ahead and take it up the stairs and back down. Everything has to work perfectly for that to go. As long as somebody is controlling the staircase door, you're good. But what happens when we start advancing out of that hallway The door's blocked open, It's blocked wide open most of the time, and now it gets bad in that hall where's it venting? It's venting up the staircase right past your hose line. Makes sense. That's just my two cents. Wasn't that in

the bookstot Chief? Well, they they did put that. That is in the books, Yes it is. It is in the new Engine Manual, part of that new Some of some of it. I agreed with, some of it. I didn't. Um. I'm not totally against flaking up the stairs, but I think when you do that, I think the engine officers got to really become that engine officer, uh, maintaining control of the door. Now, if the truck is out in that public haway and if they're

doing their jobs, they should be um. You know, you've got to You've got to have the discipline to you know, if if that line's not charged yet and they're out in that public hahway, you've got to you've got to kind of maintain the integrity the integrity that door, because you do risk you know, that fire venting out or very very just a heat coming out. But you know, once you get water and you have the ability to flow some water, I think a lot of that, a lot of that

danger of burning the burn through decreases. But I think that you know, it does help in that an initial push around the corner. But I think that we've got to be able to determine, Okay, what's the extent of that push. If it's a it's a thirty or forty foot push down that hallway, do you know what I mean? Maybe I want a slower approach

to that. If the fire's out in that public hallway and it's that bad, that's a key thing, you know, if they think that the engine officer really has got to take control of that situation and decide, hey, listen, you know what, it's too bad in the public hallway. We ain't flaking out upstairs, we're gonna do it down. It might slow us down, but you know what, right now, I want him more slow

and methodical approach, simply because the condition of the always such. If I open it and it's bad in the hallway but not horrible, I might tell him, hey, get that up there real quick. I'll make sure. And especially if a guy goes up there to do that, you've got to keep that door closed because fuck the line, you're gonna burn the guy. Yeah, you know, so if the guy's up there flaking out that line, I don't agree would turn in the corner if it's if it's a return

stare, I don't agree with that. I don't know if I like that either. You know, put it up and you know, use the landing, but you know, make sure that there's no there's no friction point up there. So once you do go, that's gonna run right down those stairs. But the bottom line goes to me, you gotta be the engine officer. You gotta be a smart engine officer who looks out into that public call. We don't do this as a matter of policy. This is this is

the way we do this every time. No, there're gonna be time when you open that door to that public call and it's charged to the floor, you might want to think twice about going up that stair well. There's a there's a big difference between pride and practical. I mean, listen, every engine company, you know that the goal of a good engine company is how we stretch os, will put out fires. That's it. You know, if they say they're a good engine, it's not because there's a much of

good guys. It's because they're good in the fire floor. But sometimes, you know, you got to look at practical, you know, as that engine and you know that's when you earn your money as the boss. You know, like those times I'm along for the frigging ride, do you know what I mean? The guys know what they do and I'm just along for the ride. But I get one of those standpipe fires that you know, it's in the public hallway. It's decision time now and you have to be

the boss. And you know it might be unpopular. Hey listen, I don't want I'm not flaking out. It might be a little bit more work, but that's why they give us an extra guy, do you know what I mean? To do that? But I don't. I'm not comfortable with flaking out above. I'm not against doing it, but if I'm not comfortable with it, I'll tell him not to do it. If I'm comfortable with it, go ahead, knock yourself out, bro, you know. Any

you know the other thing, the big thing. A lot of people realize about the um and Lou you'd said something that was that's extremely important, and you said it's so casually like, and you know, four doors down, fires four doors down. And I always counted doorways if the if the hallway was back, and it's it's a tidbit that most people don't take away from standpipes. It's like, you know, you're not doing it in a tenement, you're not doing in the private house, but you get into a like,

you know, a standpipe building. I always counted doorways. And one of the big reasons is, especially if I was in the truck, was the stairway door opened the same direction as an apartment door inward. So if I didn't know how far that door away, you know, if I was four doors away from the stairway door, I might think it's an apartment door and just go out right, you know, And and The other thing is about when it's in the public hallway, is you know, what are you

looking for? I tell guys, when you go out in that public hallway, what are you looking for? Everybody says, well, I'm looking for the hot door. I go, no, every door is gonna be hot. Bro, You're looking for the open door. You know, there's only gonna be one door open, and it's gonna be where the fire is, you know. And then I always say, so you go down in the hall and you find an outward opening door, what do you do with that?

I tell you, Well, the fire services you got two in the last ten years, Cincinnati, Ohio and Chicago, Illinois, where guys went down shafts they thought it was an apartment, you know. So you know, there's a lot of dynamics to to the standpipe buildings removed from the standpipe itself when you talk about fire operations. We were just we just went to uh last week to ninety one O three had a like a get together, you know, and Uh I never heard of him. Yeah, So across

all the stories are rolling right and coves. It's mondaying, all right, and he comes up to me and we're talking about something. You know, I've had so many jobs with him, and he's like, hey, Rough, you remember that job. I remember. It was so clear. As soon as he said it to me. I get to the top of the stairs at start. I opened the door. It's black, right, And I looked down to my ride a little bit and I see the fire out,

you know, into the hall. So I'm like, it's right here, we got we got there, you know, I can't see what it is. Right. It turns out they knock it down. We get in, they knock it down. We start going in and it was like the uh the trash. Shoot. Yeah, but it was like, you know what the room. Their rooms are pretty big, you know what I mean, but they had stuff like three mattresses in there, so it was like just straight black. Yeah, right, it was black and black. But

Monday always does this. He's like, he's like, Rough, I was like a mind. He was like like running into the walls, you know what I mean, because it was only like what the But it was just so funny. Do you guys want to chat a little bit about charge stairwells and some of the complications with that. You weren't with any of that kind of stuff. Some somebody evacuating leaves the doorway open and charged the stairwell you're in. I mean, I know it's complicated. I mean we've had it.

That was the attacks stare. I mean compared to when I first got on to when I got out right the attack stare and uh, the evacuation stead that really became like there was no screwing around with that really. You know, at a job, I remember guys getting pointed out if they if

they were in the evacuation stare, you know what I mean. Well, I'm pretty I'm pretty sure you don't quote me on it, but um, it used to be where the truck officer decided which was the attack, and that's since been changed and now the engine officer decides the attack stairway after he talks to the truck officer, right, it used to be that was one of the changes in the in the new engine man or that the engine officer

now decides the attack stairway. We used to chief, you remember when I first got on, we were having the paint fires in the stairs all right, and um, you know those things were I don't know if you had one at you know, but we had one up by By seventy six engine, and there was a guy ten floors above the fire, dead in the stairway, still small like this. Cigarettes that's how fast it came on him,

right, wow, yeah, yeah, crazy crazy. And that's when when you see that, you think, Okay, now I realized why they want that, you know, evacuation stairway. You know, at the very least. I mean, you've got to have one way for not just the people to get down, how about us getting up above to get this somebody.

You've got to have one that you know was gonna stay unaffected. You know, a lot of people a confused because they guy asked me one time, he goes, how do you control all the doorways into the evacuation stairway? I go, I only got to control one, right, just one. He goes, what do you mean? I go, I'm just worried about the firefloor. Everything else I don't care about. Just keep the one door closed. And then he goes, well, why hasn't anybody ever told

me that? I go, I don't know why they haven't. Just one door. That's why I gotta worry about. In Chicago, they had a fatal fire. Civilians up above the fire and somebody opened the door to the attacks there to get the line in there, even though there were people coming down and they died in that staircase. You know, when we open that door, we're not doing good things for that staircase. So you gotta make

sure you keep keep it closed until you get that clearers civilians. Anyway, we look at the Twain Parts, how many they find the stair way there? Yeah, yeah, most of them wearing stairways. I was just gonna bring that up. Yep. Yeah, we stayed in their apartments. They're better off all the time. But you know, they don't understand fire behavior. They get out into that staircase, want to get down and if we don't keep the door closed. But I believe in that case the door was

already blocked open prior to fire department arrival on the fire Twin Parts. Yeah, yeah, So what are some of the other what are some of the other dangers in these fires? I know, like, uh, you know, all the cable wires and everything in the ceilings come down, and so what are some of the other ones that we can share with these guys. Well, so from an engine standpoint, like you know, um, I never relied on a truck to chuck any door for me, you know,

I you know, people to say the truck will get it. I never relied on that. But you know, if we're gonna be able to stretch out in the public hallway drop and you know, one of the new procedures is bringing a roll up in the folded position into the public hall into the public hallway if if it's tenable, and I personally I don't agree with it. I think that if if we went back, I mean again I asked

the question why. But one of the things is if if that door is in chart leading from the stairway to the public hallway and it closes on a dry line that's subsequently charged, you know, there is it's almost impossible to free that doorway and and everything. What's so bad about that? What's bad about that is everybody on the other side of that door is trapped on the fire side of the doorway, whether it's in the hallway or not, is

in water. They're on the fireside with no water and no way to get water because it because if it's charged, it's pressure locked from the outlet to the doorway, and there's no way to bleed that off. There's no bleeder valve at the gate. The only way to do it is to bleed it the rig. That means you're going to beleeve the system, it's almost impossible. And not shutting down the buildings, gravity tank or firepump, it's almost

impossible. So chock if you're in the engine and you're stretching, and that's any fire, but even especially these, you know, because there's a couple of doorways the floor below doorway in the stairway and the and the floor you're operating on, you know, if either of those doors close, you might be in trouble. So you know, don't ever rely on anybody else.

And that's why you know eighty eight had three or four chocks in the standpipe bag also just for that reason, to make sure that those doors were chocked open. And you know, there's no reason that if you're going to use that if that's the fires attack stairway, that door can be chopped over. Don't let him me tell you. Once that line goes through there, that door can't be chocked open. It can be chocked open, and it should be. You know, that's a big, big time hazard for as as

looking at the engine standpoint pump. What about as far as the truck chief you have, oh for the truck, I mean just being out in the hole is the danger, you know, ahead of the hose line. Again, you've got to make a real conscious judgment. Am I going to be able to get to that apartment door and get it closed before the fire gets out? In that hallway? So you're part of that fire area, then yeah, I think that boss needs to talk to the ov too and find

out what the wind's doing in the floor above. Make sure nobody's taking windows, nobody's venting the bulkhead behind you, because if they vent that attack, stay in bulkhead. Now you just created that chimney there. Again, the fire doesn't know about not breaking the windows. You know why it doesn't deal that wants to do so. Basically, that hallway because part of the fire floor. It's the fire same as the fire area of the fire apartment. Yeah, if it's in the hallway, we charge in the stairway, I

mean, because you can consider it part of the fire area. Right, But if you turn into the fire area like that, even if it's not when you're first get in the hole, Yeah, and it's you know, the Park Avenue fire. I mean, all these wind driven fires they go like that. The Park Avenue fire, it's almost like the guy you were talking about in the stairwell tim Park Avenue where Mickey Conboy went over the edge. He yeah, you guys were there. Sixty nine was part of that.

But the guy in the fire apartment was in a wheelchair and he went out into the public hall. His door. Because he's in a wheelchair, he disabled the self closing device, which we see that a lot in old age homes and stuff like that. They don't want that door hitting him in the ass as they're trying to get out with their walker or or whatever, so those self closing devices are disabled. Now he's out there in the hall

banging on doors. Fire, fire, fire. He bangs on the door of an apartment and that's one hundred feet down the hall on the opposite side of the hall. The woman opens the door to see what's going on. Her windows were already open, and the fire blew that hundred feet down the hallway and killed both of them. Yeah, her body falls in front of the door and blocks the door open. Now, and it was another one of those horrible wind driven fires that we just it changed like that unable.

Yeah, so Gonzo, we had I sent you those pictures of the flaking out if you want to talk about that now. Yeah, so you have another one. You have that one showed the other one where the line doesn't go past that one. Okay, So I always look at the two like when when I'm flaking out my line. Um. I always used to tell the guy in the Guys in eighty eight, Like you know, I was never against when we when we could get into the public hallway we had control

of the fire apartment door. Or I didn't like when they stretched go back to the other one when they stretched beyond the apartment. Now the other one, that one when they stretched beyond the apartment like that and came back. Because I was always in the belief that if if it got real bad in that apartment, and we were going to follow that line, when we left the apartment, we were heading away from our exit, and then we would

have to cross in front of that open door again. And I always tell guys, I'm not against putting a big loop in to make that initial push into that apartment to get to the break point of the apartment, but anything more than a length down the hallway past the apartment. Again, you're rolling the dice. If something goes wrong when you leave the apartment, follow that line, you're gonna be heading away from from the fire, from your exit

itself. So if we can, we try to flake out our XS hose when we can get into that public hallway on our exit side of that doorway, if we can, with the exception of that ten ft fifteen foot loop to get make that initial push into the apartment. And I think that's important when when you talk about our operations of flat line out and getting to knee apart, I would say that's how I've seen it most of the time, exactly that right there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't like that.

And you know eighty eight didn't do that. We never really would beyond the fire apartment itself. Um only because if we if we got chased out, being proactive in my thinking, you know, we're gonna make the turn and head directly for my exit and not go away from it. You know, to think it was the at least by us, is just to have that hose right in front of the doorways to adsmidiable pinch points, you can

advance a little bit easier, you know. Yeah, I'm not against making a big, big loop, you know, like a ten foot loop to like I said, make that initial bush. But if you went farther down that hall, which a lot of companies do, and which if if we do it the under the new system of bringing the roll up there, you're forced to almost flake away from your exit. I just don't think it's a

safe practice. You can take that down if you want to copy that, you know, it's you know, and again we had said, you know, doing it by the numbers, and when it comes to standpipes, I was that I I you know, like, because so much can go wrong, and they go bad in a hurry, and it's very hard to turn that corner and go back. So, you know, the little things mattered, you know, at every fire, but those in you know, the little things matter because it's never one big thing that causes a problem. It's

a it's a multitude of a bunch of little things very wrong. Yeah, you know, And then screw you. If you're not going to react to these problems, I'm going to punch in the face. And then we're you know, we're standing in attention, all right, talking to my guy all wrong. I know what movie that you know, a movie that is one of my favorite movies. Joe is that's Joe Yeah man talking to a brandy Brandy from Joe Dirt Brandy. Yeah, the wrong, wrong in the face

for the sturing pictures. And we could talk about actually I do. I didn't want to touch on something if you didn't mind, was the your thoughts because I know we have some conversations on not relying on the FTC or even the riser, what's the how's ftny? Or some other areas. Are you into portable stampipes? Do you guys do any of those kind of things. It's a little bit of a conversation point. I do have another picture I wanted to ask about too. What is that? I don't even know what

that means? Can you know, my chief? You don't mind if I because after the Deutsche Bank fire, you know, I was perplexed and I'm like, you know, what took them so long? I know the stampipe was out there, but what took them so long to get water to the seventeenth floor? I mean like, so I said, you know what, we had a building on a seven thirty five garden. Chief, you know where I'm talking about. They've had a couple of real good fires here.

It's just it's like an eighteen nineteen story building. I said, you know what, let me go to that building. I'll go to the roof and see if I can build a portable standpipe. Because to me, it was like, this is easy. How could you not be able to do this? So, you know, I figured out the firehouse and there's no way we're gonna drop a rope and raise it because it's just too high to pull. So we brought all our rollups, made the connections, and we were

lowered it down off the roof. I'm like, I'm like, this is like a bunt. I got about halfway down and the wind took control of my line and I didn't I didn't plan on that, and I broke like four windows and a fully occupied watch. I'm streaming at the guy drop dropped the roll ups. So we throw three rollops off a seventeen story building. So I go back to the firehouse. I'm like, holy shit, I

can't believe we failed at this. So I worked it out. We went back on the next mud and we took the search rope, tied it to the first coupling, throw the search through through the search rope over the roof. The chauffeur was able to grab it and he was able to guide that first coupling the first butt down. Oh, I understand what you're saying, now, okay, And then he had already stretched the line with the Siamese so we could augment. So it's going like clockwork. So then we were

going to tie it off. We tied it off in two places, at the top and at the midpoint, so we secured both of them before charged to the roof to the anchor points. Once we charged it, it relaxed at the midpoint and kinked and we couldn't pull it out, so I failed my second attempt. We finally got it right. What we did was we tied the top one, secured the middle, but we didn't tied it off. When the kink formed, we lowered the kink out of it and then

tied it off, and then we finally got water. But there's no there's really it's in the new Engine manual how to do it, but there's no real written thing on how to do it. Back in the thirties they used to drill on supplying the Empire State Building. And the plan was you'd take a length every three or four floors and drop it to a guy at the window below you. Three floors below you, they'd take their coupling and inside.

The idea was the coupling would always be inside the building, behind a wall or a window mullion, so that the weight was off of the couplings. And they went up the entire height of the building. Holy shit, Yeah, because why because shit happened, Something's gonna happen. We're gonna need to do it. I'm understand that you go in the one window, come out another, go in one wind, don't come out another. Yeah, just dropped down and it was like a z up and fast. Time I

ever heard that. Yeah, I remember seeing that. We would want to be the guy only at the top reaching out to grab that thing. He probably got that job. We did that. And what was the thing that just went by the window? What the hell was that? We dropped the line? I think we're on the ninth floor. We dropped a line.

It had plexiglass, heavy plexiglass, I remember, and they ended up cutting with the saw and we dropped the line and tied tried the host to it and we pulled it up and they hooked it to the stampipe somewhere, and it turned out that there was a valve that was shot somewhere. They were working on the system or something. Somebody forgot to open the valve and there was It wasn't much fire. I do remember that I was. I was a fireman in one seventeen, so that's way back. It was on Roosevelt

Island. It was I have a video of that, do you really? I do? Yeah, I didn't send it to you. I wish I had known. Yeah, but they actually I think they lowered their their lengths down and the chauffeur had stretched over to how many floors was it? Do you remember? I believe it's on the ninth or tenth floor. I think because the aerial reached Wow. You know, like that's funny because you talk about again, like I said, doing it by the numbers. I had.

I had a run over on Clinton Avenue twenty seventy Clinton, Um and it was it was an elderly housing place that was about fifteen stories and it was a food and a turnout be a food in a stove, you know, and but eighty eight was very good at going out and going doing it by the numbers. Whether it was food, whether it was an older gas. We always went up. We always led the system. We're always ready to hook up. And so you know, I got up. I said, hey, guys, it's food, don't worry about it. And they

said, oh, we're just gonna check the system. You know, we're just gonna go through it because we had a probe, so the proby wanted to go through it. And so they go to hook up and we don't get a drop of water out of this system, not a drop. And I'm like, what he goes at there's no water. I go, okay, drop down to the floor below. Maybe that valve's broken, and see if you get water. No water on the floor below. So I said, okay, let's go to the first floor and we'll try to hook up

on the first floor in that stoy. No water there. So we go into basement and sure enough there's an o US and Y valve closed and the risers shut down, and you know, everybody says, wow, that was great. But if that had been a you know, if we hadn't done that, if we hadn't gone by the numbers. And you know, if it was you know, done what you'd done if it was a real fire, like checking the outlet, hooking up, bleeding it off. Just because it was a food, we never wouldn't know own that, you know what

I mean. And I said that a kid, I go, you know what, Kudos to you because you you went through and you did it. Even though I said it was food, you still went through it and try to bleed that line off. Good for you. And we we were in the right of summons and they got it fixed. And and but if we had a fire in that building, you know, you would have been reading on a nightly news. So do it by the numbers every time, whether it's a food and a stove, whether it's a gas leak, whether whatever

it is, you know, do it by the number. It's a great way to check those systems. Those all create training opportunities. Every time you're out at a firehouse. It's an opportunity to train on something that you are going to deal with at some point in the future. Yeah, like subsellers, so that in common that, Yeah, we're having a little trouble down, you know, three floors down, Yeah, sub subseller, don't check it out for me. All right, all right, you ever read about

the Times tower fire. No, yeah, it's another it's a w n y. Jeff Jonas have a newsletter on that. Oh man, I think he might have. Yes, I do believe he does. But you know, uh they had. It was three subsellers down and two firefighters that were killed were killed up on the nineteenth or twentieth floor. Somebody told me about this job. Yeah yeah, right. Was it CEO or something that killed those guys? Oh yeah, yeah, you know up upper floors. You're

just talking about that. I don't somehow, I just remember that somebody talking about that story. I don't remember that. I mean it's a classic case study, you know three I mean maybe talking about a hand stretch. I mean it was like eight lengths below grade. Holy should through a paint paint fire. You know, a paint room is tough, tough fire. Oh oh lord, I love So what did you think of a two inch lead

length? Uh? I actually we didn't have that. I wasn't I was in the squatter any yore ye Again, like I said, I my question was why we did that? Well, nobody, you know, it was always because it was easier that's all. You know. Well again, I hate to, you know, keep going back to the one fire, but you know Van Tellia Avenue two ninety three quarter stretched one incient three quarter length

as a lead length. We went back a week afterwards, and I have a picture of the flow testing, uh nineteen a nineteen eighty Let me find that one for you. Nineteen. We went back a week afterwards at five o'clock in the morning the same day of the week to reenact the fire. And that you know, when you put an inchantree quarter line on the end an inchantree quarter nozzle on the end of a two and a half inch nozzle,

what do you got? You got an inchantre quarters right life. You know that the two and a half the two eighty three stretched, we duplicated it also flowed them both the same exact time. The two and a half had two hundred and ninety gallons a minute out of the two and a half. That's how much pressure of the year they were pumping it at and the inchantree quarter was about one hundred and fifty, so you got almost double the water out of that two and a half. And yeah, it's work,

I get it. But man, water. So I don't know if I said it earlier. We're sacrificing, you know, with the two with the two inch lead length with the one inch tip or flowing about two twenty And with the with the two and a half with the inch and an eighth tip, we were two sixty five. That's the target flow. We're probably flowing more than that, but that's the package. That was the mobility and the guys there was the thing we're saying. But we over pumped the two and

a half anyway. We always did for some reason. The seventy eighty numbers were always too much. The friction losses were too much. You know, if you if you pumped it right and went back to the two fifty, you get a little more mobility with the two and a half, and really you're looking to get to the break point. That's what you're looking to get to. And so we sacrificed forty five gallons permitted to flow for an eleven

eleven pounds of Nazzo reaction difference. So you're talking a gallon a half the weight of a gallon a half of water difference of Nazzo reaction. We're sacrificing forty five gallons a minute, and I just didn't you know, my question was the why, you know, why are we why are we sacrificed? Because we remember, like we started this this you know, the original NFPA fourteen sixty five. Uh, you know, the system was built for the host of what we can put out. You know when they design us,

when that first came out. You know what's the attack package. You're going to build a system to supply that package. And for some reason we want to change that package. Now, well you can change the package, you've got to be prepared to change the pressures. Yeah, and we don't always have control over that. No, that's part of the issue, you know.

Ninety Again, we're back to the same question, Tim ninety nine percent at a time, you're gonna get away with it in a residential fire, you know, one or two bedrooms, Yeah, that inch and three quarter or it's going to get it with them. You know, it's listen. Here's the bottom line is when wind is playing a role on the fire is when you want the two guns. It's as simple as that. I can have half the flat burning in a in a project building in the two and

a half way if the windows hold. I'm putting that fire out of the time, you know. But if I have a window that fails and the wind starts playing playing games with me, you know, I'm not I don't want to sacrifice forty five gallons a minute the flow. I just don't want to chief. What's your experience with the curtain? I love the curtain curtain? What's that? No attention to the man behind the curtain. Uh?

You know we've had guys saved by it. I mean when we first did the testing with it, we bought a hundred engine companies from all over the city to the rock, put a wind driven fire in that hallway and said, okay, who wants to go down that hall And now I wanted them wanted to go down that hallway. Okay, watch this home, And I said, okay, watch this and drop the curtain. And it's like somebody turns to switch you off to the fire. Really, that's how fast it

is, Timmy, were you at the Governor's Island tests. I tried to get out there, but there was a very close shop. Okay, okay, yeah, I would have gone. I didn't want to get paid. I just wanted to go out there. And watch. Yeah, us guys able to get it into position to quick chief. How's how is that work? It can be done? Now, that's the Chao curtains. So every truck has that. It's a you know, a one window blanket. The squads and the rescues carried the bigger version, the Love and Bye ten by

twelve version. The divisions carried them. You gotta have people dedicated to that mission. I mean, it's not the first two engine is going to do that. You know, that's the third or the fourth new engine or the rescue or the squad. And when I was in sock, you know, guys, I laid the policy out. If you go to a high rise, MD, you bring it to the command post and guys, well, I don't want to use it. I get me out onto the firefloor. I'll put it out. No, that's the most crucial thing you can do.

If you got fire out in that hall, you dropped that blanket, and it's like turning the fire off. So it's back to a routine apartment. What's that the fireman's turn that shit off? Fireman turned it off. Absolutely. How about the college stick, I mean the floor blown college stick? Yeah, is it something that we use it every fire. No, no, is it something that you've been beating your brains out. I mean

back to these fires. I mean the Lionel Hampton apartment fire. We put you know, send thirty guys to the burn center and the fire burnt itself out. Nobody put that fire out. Same thing, Park Avenue parself out. Yeah. So we have tried the initial attack. You've tried it and it ain't working. Okay, here's a plan B, here's a plan C. You know. So, I'm one of those guys that you gotta have options. You gotta know what the fires do. When you got to know

the building around you. You gotta know what you can have and pick the right option. So pat you they always with the towel ladder. Yeah yeah, but they only go so high, bro with a hip inch tip. Wait a minute, edged half, I thought I can go back to let me let me get you a second. Let's go here this eight tip that rig over. That's what you'll do, and you'll tip that rig over.

Funny options. That's all it's about is options. Yeah. Well, like I said, you know, that's that's that's the tip of the iceberg. As far as as as an engine as far as what we do. I mean, you know you want to be a good engine. You know you you master those fires. Uh, Like I said, as an officer, I'm along for the ride for and and Lou Lou. You'll know that too. We're going in two ninety one h three. You know that that engine

officers along for the ride ninety percent of the time. But at a stampipe, you've got you've got a lot of decisions, critical decisions to make. You know, you know where you're gonna hook up and why you're hooking up there. Like you know, we used to have now by L gardens.

We'd have the cabinets in the hallway and then you'd have a core construction with scissor stairs behind them, behind the elevator shafts, and you'd have to actually if you hooked up on a floor below, you'd stretch the opposite direction of the fire because it was easier to go this way and then come up the stairway and heading me. So you know, those are the decisions, that's true. I remember we used to do that. So you have to go

around the door. You'd have to go around and you come up and you'd come out of the stairway and a lot of guys, I mean that little decision there. If you think about the hose you eat up coming around and they're having to come all the way around like this, you're never going to reach the fire department. So you know, as an engine officer, you've got to be on your a game, know your buildings and be able to make those decisions, whether they're unpopular or not, you know, and say,

no, this is what we're doing. This is where we're looking up, and we're stretching this way and this and we're not going to stretch up the stairway because I'm not comfortable with the hallway. You know, it's game

daytime. And as an engine officer, for those fires off a standpipe, you that's where you really have to for me at least, you know, you've you've got to be at the top of your game, keep your perspective wide about what's happening, and like the chief said, nothing wrong with going to the floor below and really determining, hey, if they're staying in the gun deal every time, Yeah, you have to do that every time.

Man, Just see where the apartment is. If you don't know, you know, most of the time, you would know because you're if you were in those buildings all the time, you would probably have a pretty good idea where it was. But always take a quick peek. Did you ever tell a guy I always go to the floor below, and they're answered always was that takes too much time? I'm like, really, let's let's time.

Let's go to a real fire. I'll go to the floor below, find out where the fire is, run upstairs and know exactly where it is, and you go look for it so you gets there first. Yeah, you know what I mean. You know that whole thing about time go go screw yourself, Like I'm gonna get on a floor below, I'm gonna find out exactly where that E line, F line, G line, whatever it is, and I'm I get the four down. You want to know something.

This was the truth too. Again, Like I told you before, most of the time I was running those stairs, if it was on eight or set, whatever it was, I was not waiting around. I didn't know who was in the elevator it was I was up the stairs. I would get to the floor below. It was a chance for me to catch my breath because if I ran all the way up to the top floor or to the fire floor, you know, open a door or whatever, start to

put my mask on, then go in. After I just ran up the stairs, I would be like in my face piece, I'll be like, you know, stopping for a second just to get an idea what was going on and where the apartment was. Gave me a chance now to walk up the stairs right and I would control my breathing a little bit better and then I would able to put the mask on and then go. You know, so I did the same thing, except that I only walked to the second

floor. Adam Broc guy good ship back then roof. Oh my god, Hey guys, want to know, maybe you should use your blankets bahagia instead of the fire got we got we got these fire curtains here. It didn't work for the curtains for hide and fat chicks. Uh. What was I gonna say? You want to talk about that? Uh your outlet there, Tim and you want to talk about that the uh the I show them that, Yeah, because that's a building specific thing. Yeah, so you know

this isn't a standard thing up in uh in the FDNY. But um uh you know, if you have certain buildings in your district. We had what they called, I believe, Sandwich style where it was a twenty seven story building and it had nine elevator stops, and each elevator stop would serve three floors, one above, one below, and the fire and that floor itself. And so if you need it, if if you needed a second line, realistically, the stairway would only come out on those floors also, and

you'd have to go three floors below to get the second line. So um, and it's written in the books that six floors yeah, the first yeah, yeah, yeah. So you know, we modified this one a little bit because we actually, with the pressure gauges on it, the gates didn't open all the way. So all we did was take the set screw and move the gates a little bit so you can control the opening and closing without flipping the face of the pressure gauge around underneath, if that makes any sense.

And the other thing, if you're gonna use something like this, and I'm not against it, and you will be able to supply the two hand lines, that the riser will be able to do that, because we've already said at the most remote outlet under NFPA fourteen it's got to have the ability to supply five hundred gpms. So if I'm on the third floor, I'm

gonna get five hundred gpms out of this. You know. If it's a twenty seven story building and I'm on the twenty seventh floor, NFBA code says, I've got to be able to get five hundred gpms out of this, so we'll supply that. But I don't know if you look at the handles, if you're gonna use something like this, at least mark those handles. I don't know if you see the tape on them. So if I say, hey, shut down eightound, yeah right, you know, hey shut

down the red or shut down the white. So red was always for us, was our line. We you know, the red was the first line. You know, the fire was you know the guys that came in after that. So but it's something you can do. And if you're afraid you're not going to be able to supply it, NFPA code says that you can, you know, and what should you do? Huh, take it out and test it. Take it out and test it, you know, and

it's a building specific appliance. You know, you may have to there may be some um, there may be some friction loss differences because of the gated y, but nothing that's going to be catastrophic and put the line out of service. You know, if you if you get twenty pounds difference for appliance, and I believe the FDNY uses twenty pounds per appliance, uh for the for the Siamese any outlet itself. So but building specific, and you can do this so so you know, if you want to get two line off

the floor below, you can do that. It's not out of the question, right. So yeah, and that we had two thousand Valentine three sixty five Forward Street, another building on one eight three Street. There was a bunch of them within the nineteenth Battalion and all those engines that responded to those buildings had one of those, and it was the responsibility of every engine to bring that with them to those buildings. That goes back to knowing your buildings,

you know, knowing the systems. So I was going to ask you just standard two and a half to two and a half obviously to your siames here standard right now, I don't know you have this one in here. I don't know if you have a specific reason why you want to talk about it. I just you know, I put up there. You know it

says automatic sprinkler, but it's just a starts fitting. A lot of new places are putting these things in. I don't we don't see him in New York City, but a lot of places outside the city are using that Stuart's quick connect for the supply the biggest line you have. I don't know why people think that, you know, you know, not a good idea. Tim what's that supply it with the five inch line? Well, well, we don't have a five inch line, but those departments that do, they

better make sure they using it as a tack hose. Very often the supply hose is limited to two hundred psi. If you need more than two hundred psi for an upper floor like you go to twenty seven stories. Yeah, but five supply line ain't. But I believe most hoses that have the storts because um, the storch is ready to do to supply those and seas talk about the hose. The hose has a pressure hose got two hundred and fifty is pressures fifty. We have someone that's four hundred. Forget the wei a

lot of municipalities that have the stortch connections that supply the standpipes. Most of those have the the ability of that larger diameter to supply that with the starts fittings. Don't think the damage got to be you know, rated for it. So much of it is. It's posted right on and painted all over it. You know, it's supply line hoes to PSI max. So make sure you know what you you know the whole system, just like us trying

to supply high pressure pumper. That's why we have that high pressure three inchoes. It's got to be capable of meeting the entire system pressure. Remember studding, what color coupling? I was just white? White kids, don't got it cool on the only thing I knew about that high pressure you captain right, and it used to shake shitryout anything else. Boys, Oh great job, they say, it's just a it's not your everyday operations, so you gotta get out and do it. Yeah. You know what amazes me about

these two guys. You save out a while and the amount of information that they still retained is amazing. I don't know that I think you could have been We just don't have minds. That's what he'd been looking at, hieroglyphics the way they were talking about. Oh yeah, an't it with the with the coupling the stoughts like this what it's like Peedy with the seventeen with the

fourteen slide. But listen, like like, here's the thing is, if you're a truck guy, you walk up to a door and you're go, oh, yeah, this is this, this is that, this is a mortist this is and I'm like, what do you just say? You know what I mean? Like, you're just you're you're an expert at what you know. That's all we get though, man my son's and boy scouts.

He said that you just show me how to time. It's not like I'm like through the hole around the track, you know, not information, come and pull it the hope not tie and hope and holes you got any shout out rough No, but the chief of Sammy, we've had a couple of uh guys passed with twenty guy for twenty one truck just passed away off duty and our guy from ninety one engine just passed away. Yeah yeah, Jimmy,

not Jimmy. What Jack marriage is? I don't know if you knew that Jack Mirror forty one years twenty six just retired, right, just retired the other night. I was gonna try to get up for that. Uh forty six and twenty seven. From what I understand, game a great send off, well deserved. Jack Mirror is is the best of the best. Then he really did you know Jack maryor Chief? I can't he was. He was lieutenant forty six engine for twenty seven years. Yet a phone number,

Huh you got a phone number on the show? I don't know, for the New York Saints of the hockey team for you. Yeah, like what what? What? What? Yeah? I gotta give I gotta give my sons a shout out. Though they're both working tonight. You know Dan and Connor in Baltimore. You know Dan's in fourteen engine. I always did the best of the best of the West and honors working in thirty three engine, the Beast and the East. Baby. Yeah, I hope they're watching

tonight. I hope they are still surrounded down there. I'm surrounded. My poor kid got a car stolen in front of the fire house the other night. I don't believe it. Shocking Multible Well, Kia the Kia boys, guy, I guess on his birthday. No, less ya doesn't have that same doesn't really you know shit. I got one shout out coming from uh missus Procaccini's husband. It says, yoe, Bro, can you give my buddy Lieutenant Ricky. He's a guinea. I don't even gonna say it,

Mangamilia man JAMIAI a shout out. His retirement from the City of Bridgeport Fire Department after thirty six years of service, with over twenty years of that as a lieutenant on rescue five. Thanks well. Enjoy the retirement, bro, enjoy the retirement. Amaz We talked about and pipes for an hour and forty eight minutes. Oh my god, shoot me, saturan eye in my eyeball be all wrong? Man, Come on, you're talking to my guy all wrong. It's wrong Tom again. Face All right. For you guys that

don't know, we will be taking a break. We will be only doing one show week. That'll be Thursdays for the month of July. We need a little break. And August and August I know I'm leaving for so Louis will probably be going solo. I'll be in the Philippines. I'll be off in the Far East. Bro eat a lot of rice hanging out of the Asian race. Yeah, and all that stuff. So, I don't know. We have a Thursday month sandwiches. We have something on Thursday. I

think thay. No, this Thursday so far is open. We have every other weekend to take the care of it. We got some heavy hitters coming up. We got the guy who's ninety something is old. You said right from seventeen truck. Uh job laughy in twenty two truck. I think it was a laughy in twenty two truck. It could be. Yeah. We got Tim Kelly, retired FDNY Rescue Rescue one, Rescue four. He was out bous in the squab. I mean Louis got there. Yeah, Timmy

Kelly is coming, Craig's coming on rescue. A lot of good Thursdays coming up. We're gonna be taking Mondays off. Yes, it is correct, and that's all I got. I want to thank these two gentlemen with their heads full of knowledge, bringing it and sharing it with you guys. I hope a lot of young guys rewatched this and uh take all this information and hopefully learn a thing of two. Learn a thing two but he got me. Thank you, huns h. No, I just thankful for the super

chat and all the support from our Monday night show. That was uh, that was great. We got a great support system out there. We appreciate you guys, all right, and don't forget if you were on the show in the past eight months. It's last August or ten months now, I'm sorry. Send me your email please for the boat trip. Boat trip is

coming up. I sent you my time about you already on the evite list, so it was the Chief already punched it in wet on the boat to Chief, so like a last year so he knows last year too, right, No, I did great, nor so you make this. Yeah, it'll be a big the red carpet, rose petals and shit like yeah, yeah yeah, I'll pull up in the clip tour just so you can. Yeah. Yeah. We have the new outro too, by the way, version play it brother, Here we go. We'd like to thank you once

again for tuning into the Getting Salty experience as always. If you think we're out of good content, far from it, of course. By friends, you can find us on LinkedIn, you can find us on Instagram. You

can find us on Twitter and Facebook. The Getting Salty Fans and also Getting Salty Apparel is on too if you want to follow that page if you're not doing so already, audio wise, Itude, Spotify, Spreaker, and anywhere else that you may get your podcast YouTube to Getting Salty Experience where if if you subscribe to us, of course, you can click the bell to make sure you never miss a video of ours. Rather be a spotlight on, rather be a cock Lofts and Cocktails, or a brand new episode with a

heavy hitter from the fire Service. Be sure to do so. We thank you once again for tuning into the Getting Salty Experience. That's good, does good work. He does that. Mike's all right. I don't know where he's Uh, he's actually at City Field. He's uh, he's watching a ball game. Is the game I can't watch? I want to throw up every time I watch? Now, can't wait? Is it is? It? Is it football season? No? No, you can throw up that too. I'm a Jet fan. Baby. When the Super Bowls you have

heavy, we're going, Oh the way, you gotta get it. He's alone to come on that guy. Yeah, somebody knew him. I know Eddie very well. I went to his wedding. Well, why don't you call up the number, Brot. Eddie's a great dude. If you remember Eddie, so send, I'll send it to I'll send it. I'll send it to you. I don't know if he'll come on, but a smooth talker, he gets. Eddie's entertaining. I mean, it'll be a good show. He's a great dude. He's he's a great dude. Al Right,

guys, we'll see you not Monday, we'll see you Thursday. Thanks guys. All right, jents, good seeing y'all. Thank you, sir. I'll see you somewhere until then, stay low and go. Everybody will see it, the big one everyone, good night, Stay safe.