Autumn House

You guys, am so excited. Autumn houses in the house, you guys. Autumn is one of the most influential women in country music. Works at UMG in A and R, which is basically an A and R person, is one of the most crucial people the label. They find new artists, they discover new talent, get them signed. They work with artists on the label. They listen to songs for them,

they pitch songs of them. They have a close relationship with songwriters and publishers in town to hear the hottest hit song right when it's written, to get it to the act to the artist. It is such a creative and important job. And Autumn has been doing it for sixteen years. She is such a badass. Her story is amazing. I'm so excited here she is. Autumn Health the legend. Legend. Somebody sound old, Maybe you are a legend. Well, first off,

your royalty because you're born into it. Your dad's Jerry House. He is the voice of w s i X, the biggest radio show and Nashville forever. That's your father. So you grew up being around country music, being around artists, being in this industry. Did that make you want to run for the hills originally? Or stick around and do it? That's so funny? Asked that way. Um, I think like

any child, possibly, uh where you you know. I always joked that I never found my dad funny because he was my dad, but everyone always always and tell me how funny it was, and it was like, oh, he's not funny. And then of course as I got older, I appreciated how funny he was and is, and um, yeah, I went to college in Arizona, and I thought, I want to be in the entertainment business, probably not in radio. I want to leave Nashville, which is my hometown, and go out West and then I met a boy. Oh

those boys, man, I know. And the boys gone, but I stayed in Nashville. And so the boy brought you back to Nashville. The boy brought me back to Nashville. It was thankful for that boy. Yes in some ways, yes, and then some ways, but um, yes, the boy's gone. And then I ended up just laying on the couch for about three months. This is right after college. And my dad said, um, are you going to get a job.

You might want to get a job. And it occurred to me, Wait, I'm in Nashville and this town is amazing, and you know, my dad was also a songwriter, so it's like, well let me look into this, you know, music city, you know, just thriving of different opportunities. I started out in management. Oh how was management? Quickly decided that probably wasn't going to be my thing. What was the turning point? Well? Uh, I worked for mors Nannis and Stam Rst was my boss and mentor who I

just adore. Um. He had Katie Oslin, Donna's summer, David Lee Murphy, Minnie McCready, and Laurie Morrigan. It's a full roster. And this is of course early nine or mid nineties. Um. Yeah, and uh, somebody had FedEx a duck, alive duck to Lorie Morgan and something they want to do with the duck, and the poor thing came like a FedEx. It was in a crate, had been FedEx and it was just

covered and it was awful. So anyway, and they handed off to me, the new girl, like here, take care of this, and it was like, is this like normal? Was this what happens in management? I really don't think I want to take care of you know. So anyway I got to go duck to a farm. Duck is fine, and um, I just thought this is not my thing. So then I found a publishing job and hence that's

where I Okay, so we're like a song plugger. Originally I was an admin, which I feel like every a listening to start in the ad the administration division of a publishing company. So it was Reba McIntyre's publishing company, and um, I just ended up helping the guy that did all the paperwork. It was filing all the copyrights with the copyright office, processing demos and paying musicians and we had eighteen songwriters, so there was a lot of turnover.

In the nineties, we were just songs were flying up the charts and coming down. So we were continually releasing songs and having demo sessions and it was a different time. And that's all those listening at home. A demo session is so in order for the song to make the album. It's a very long process for a song to actually

be on an album. And a song is written in the songwriter session and then it's made into a demo, which is just like pretty much you hire great musicians to bring this song that you wrote, bring it to life. And so that's you're listening to demos all the time. But then they actually go beyond that and get cut

in a studio with a producer exactly. So it's kind of like a split for what you want it to sound like that then today flash fash fasting forward to my life in A and R. Now is that I listened to those demos and see if it fits the artists that I'm listening for, And and then the producer will some say copy uh some sort of uh say they tweak it to make it sound or fit the artists that they're recording the music for. But um, back

in the nineties and the demo process that was. We do it much differently now, but at the time it was very standard to have five songs in a demo

session and and uh we did those daily. So differently now because so many people are producing their own demos writers producer own demos, yeah, or their track guys that are just two tracks in their bedrooms and having co writers write lyrics if they don't write lyrics, and it's really cut those, you know, the middle guy out quite a bit in the in the session world in town which demo session players. Yeah, you know, it's hard. It's harder business than it used to be. Okay, So I

ask you a few questions. Just grab a fire on there. No, no, no rapid fire. The first thing that comes to mind when I say this radio my father truly. Yeah, not associate the two. Um what about country music? Love love love, um, happiness, Oh my family, and you have two twins, have twins yeah, yeah, boy girl, Holland and Willa, which I want to talk all about career, being a career mother. Um, celebrity crush m hmm. Oh God give me a minute. I've drawn

a blank. It's one of those I just thought picture had been affleck recently, and I kind of thought, good, I kind of would like to hang out with him. Me scenes, Yeah, you know, I probably would have said that a few years ago. But I don't know why something piqued my interest kind of. I don't know that a little ruged thing going on there. I like I've always like been off. Yeah Armageddon, that was for me. Yeah,

I don't know, welread answered. Probably my husband would be like really, but even like, that's not who I would for you anyway, Okay, okay, And then if you weren't in the music industry, what would you do? Oh, probably something in entertainment, but I would I would love to be a writer for a sitcom. Really, I know what kind of sitcom? Oh fan of the Office, you know, stuff like that sort of situation. Yeah, yeah, I just

thought it's so clever. I'm not that clever by any means, but I just think that humor just would be so fun. It would just be really like the mind Mindy Kaling kind of yeah, totally that it'd be fun. I always thought I'd end up in l A, Like I said, the boy brought me back here, but um, but I thought if I went to l A and that was the plan. I was gonna try to weasel my way into that sitcom world. I love that or hosting. You'd be a great host. Well, you know I interviewed with

Barbara Walters. Stop. I know. Well I was also Homecoming Queens, so let's talk about that first, of course. Yeah, but I did when they were interviewed with Barbara, who was gone the Motnopolis on the view for a job for a job. Yeah, they had let her go, and then they did an open calling for people to interview across across the nation to interview with you know, Barbara, So explain to me what that meaning. Oh my gosh. She her office was so high up I'd never seen. We

were like above the clouds. So you're like waving we were, yeah, I mean there were like clouds going by her office. Yeah, you can kind of feel the breeze and all these little women kind of like that Devil Wears product where the women are just coming in and out. And she never made contact serious business. I was just fearing. She said, did this you know one of these in the kind of set on the edge of my seat. And she

was very sweet, very gracious. What was that interview, Like, um, I was so nervous that I I didn't even know really what I said. What does she ask you? Um? Oh god, I came remember now, but remember her asking me something that would shock people? What is it about you that would shock people? What is it? I didn't even know at the time. I think I made it up. It was like, you're Barbara Walters. I'm talking you know. Even certain I had a pretty charmed life, nothing would

be that. You know, although I was arrested in college a few times, but a few times, I know, I didn't think of that at the time. I probably should have said that a few not just one fake I D come back from More. I can't go to Arizona State without a fake I D. And so yeah, you go to jail. Oh yeah, you have spent a night and then you know, but it's like that little college jail that just you know, they kind of sober you up. And that's kind of cool that you've been in jail

a few times, right, Yeah, you are so street. Yeah. The best part of that story, though, is that, um, that you're sitting in face to face in Barbara Walters. Oh, you know, Diane favorite walked by, and so you're talking to Barbara and here comes. I was waiting outside Barbara's office and Diane Storya walked by and she was like, hello with that voice that's just like butter And I was like, oh my god, Hi, So was this before you did A and R and all that? This is

before A and R. Yeah. I just left Reba McIntyre to work from an Anna at Maverick Music And so I was you Madonna? I met Madonna. She wouldn't know me if I fell on her now. But what was that like working for her company? Um, we were kind of a renegade company of publishers that guy Oseiri, who's been her longtime business partner, decided to open up in Nashville. So Whitney had opened up in Nashville. Who does bat

now right? Yes? Yeah, okay, So Whitney opened it and we just sort of siphoned off a budget out of l A to sign writers and just it was so fun. But they did fly us out for the Christmas party and I joked that, Um, being in the room with Madonna was like looking at the sun. I mean it was sort of like, I can't make so you can't look right like do you know who you are? Your Madonna? Yeah, so she got I think she called me Amber too, So I just went with it and we gotta say yes, right, yes,

you ever happy to be Madonna? Okay, yeah, so that was my brush with Madonna. Ya. Wow, you know your A and our life is so cool. But pre write all this stuff down, remember all the cool you do have to write a memoir because Okay, so now we're going to get into A and R, which is, to me, the most important job in the music business. Where it is because it's all about the song. And I love I was a song clagger for a couple of years

and I'd pitched songs to you. I always love coming to you because you really truly listen to everything and like you give it a very open ear. And I feel like A and R. It's it's such an artistry in itself because it's all about your ear. Like people are coming in and pitching you songs, which means they're playing you songs from their writers, like whether they work

at a publishing company or whether they're artists themselves. They're handing you these songs and you listen to them and decide if you're going to pass them on, like you're the gatekeeper in a lot of ways to like, is that song going to make it to a producer? Is it going to make it to a manager, to an artist, to be heard, to possibly make an album? And I told you this when we started. You're the first person the impacted me. Really. When I came to Nashville, I

heard you speak at it. When I went to Belmont, I was in school and you came and gave a some now and you're like, if you have a backup plan, you gotta get out of this business. It's not for you. I sounded so smart. I'm not even sure. Uh. And it's probably still true today, although I did think about that later when you mentioned that, and I thought, what would have possessed me to say that. I think, you know, I think you're turning, like welve years later, I don't

really know. I mean now, I think there's so many different ways to make a career in the business. But you can't go all in with you got to go all in. It's it's a hard business. I mean, certainly the rejection level is pretty uh, and you're gonna get it all different times. Yeah, And I get it just in the a r perspective, and that the songs that I pitched, I want Keith Urban to respect me. It's still mine. You know, I'm pitching those songs in my opinion um to him, and so you know the lots

of reputation that I have to preserve. Yeah, so I want to break that down to me. Start with the beginning, Like a song walks into your office from a song plugger, tell me about the process of listening to songs, and then how it actually makes it way to an artist like Keith Urban. Well, you work at um G, which there's tons of amazing artists there. Yep, we have a

huge roster um all of your favorites, the demos. I probably have about four or five song meetings today, so song pluggers representing different catalogs of music and songwriters come in. So how many songs are you listening to from each firs day? Everyone's kind of got it down to a science. Sounds about five or six songs, eight the most, but hopefully just five because I had that all day. Never mind all those songs that come in that are just emailed to me daily. But um, so you're listening to

what fifty songs a day? At least probably yeah, and then um, but you know, listen, I'm not going to through the whole song. You pretty much know in the first first, so maybe know just based on groove like Keith doesn't want it could be tempo Keith want. Do you know exactly what he's looking for? Hopefully what happens if the song walks in that knocks your socks off, that's not what they're looking for. I send it okay, Yeah, And sometimes they get mad at me, and sometimes they don't.

Most of the time they don't. You use your judgment. If it's so good to you, you're like, you got to hear this. Yeah. Um, So the people walk in and play you five listen to those songs. Probably for out of all those songs and the song meeting, I'm probably gonna like maybe two, maybe two a day, she is pretty good. And then try to send those too

who I think it's appropriate for. So if Luke is listening, or Dark's is listening, or Keith, um, I'll just figure out if it fits any of them and send it um. When I first started seventeen years ago an r for seventeen, believe that I would make a miracle in itself. That's cred how badass you are, or just I've been hiding and nobody knows I'm still there. Whatever, but I um I was joked that the difference between me and or A and R and publishers was that I had their

home address. I can mail them the music. Now in this day and age, everyone has everyone's email address. So I'm pitching the song. The same song could be sent from another publisher directly to Keith. So we're all just trying to get there first. I'm a glorified song plugger. I want songs cut um from my resume, you know, And I wanted for that relationship that I have a song plugger totally. I want them to bring me the best songs. So do you have close relationships with song pluggers?

I try to Yeah, yeah, do you kind of have? Do you form natural like just not? I've been here so long. I think just in general, I think in life in general. But I want to be friends and I want to be friendly, and it's a very friendly business if you want it to be. So for these people that come in, we talk about our lives and our families and what's going on, and then we talk about work. In business, and so I think because of that, you're gonna foster a relationship that they're going to want

to bring you those songs or their artists first. So um, hopefully that's working in my favor. I don't know, what is it like working with artists. Do you have different relationships with these artists? Do you have do each artists have a different way they like to receive songs or like, is there a way to maneuver it where you like this would be a more effective way to send it at this time and this way always? I think it's

just based on personality an art form. It is, what's just knowing they're yeah, who, how they like to listen, when they want to hear, how some people like to do send them too many songs. It's all based in and how long you're listening. So if they're going to cut in October and they started listening in April, what is the timing of that to make sure they're not sitting with the song's not sitting in their inbox too long? Right?

Do you kind of want to very busy people in it towards the cut date, Like say they're cutting in October possibly, but then the publisher may not want to wait that long, you know, they all want to get the song cut as quickly as possible. I feel like people always love a fresh song, something with my want to Oh yeah you have so you have like a

you have a span where people are cutting. But I feel like people always like hear the flashing one at the end and like go in and they'll have like their whole album done, and then here comes one song

like the week of cutting, and everything gets changed. Well, flashing back to my meager beginnings and publishing, we I really felt protected the copyright so an artist would write the song Head's Carolina Tales California changed my life, huge song, and I think we pitched that the first single, one of the first that was on that first first I'm all right, it was I Think Your w to the Pedal and the I Think It's Heads Caroline, and that was in her original launch. I can see her dancing

in the video with the bell bottom pants. Oh yes, she was so hot when she came out. I was gonna say, I think the art of protecting that song and getting it to the right place was fuch more important than it is now because of the revenue stream has changed so dramatically that it therefore has made we just need to get it cut. So if X is cutting it before even Luke Brian, we they definitely would love Louke Bran cut. My battle is to make sure that it doesn't go to X before it goes to

Luke Brian. Okay, because sometimes even the songwriter or the publishers like, listen, what if Luke doesn't end up cutting up but this person wants it who's not as big as Luke. So we're gonna take the gamble and just go with them. But you're like saying, let's hang on for Louke. They owned the song, so I can ultimately make that decision. Um, But I'm I don't get in too many fights that way because we have so many heavy hitters on our roster with Luke and Lady A

and Keith and Urban uh, Derek Spinaley. I mean, the list goes on and on that they usually come to us first, but there are still a huge artists at their labels to Kenny Chesney's and the Tim mccross and then you know those are the big copyrights. So is it competitive in the in our world? Um? Oh oh yeah, I mean there's probably monthly a song that I think has Maria Labett. Let that go yet, because if she's not gonna cut it, I want it because you and

that staying on top of it all the time. Do you know the hot songs around town that are on hold? Those songs go out so fast, and they usually go and hold so fast. And when I say go out, is that the plugger has sent that I'm in the inbox. It's like going It's going to everybody in A and R across the city. So when a plugger gets the gym opens it first? Who pitches it first? You know your song pluggers who have the gold mine writers. And when they send you a song, are you opening it

like right then? To I got one over the weekend. Actually okay, we've had a lot of cuts together and I thought, m I better stop everything I'm doing. It was my kid's birthday party, and I thought, want to miss it and this could be something. Yeah, you're on hold. And then I I was. I was sitting here to stop sign and going to the grocery store, and I thought, listening real quick, yep, yeah, and send it right there at the stop signed to Keith. So how it heard

he hasn't hurt it yet. But how do you know who you want to send it to? Like what if it could kind of go for a couple artists. Um, I think I think they actually said play this for Keith. They do try to cast okay, so they thought it was best for Keith. Um. If I thought it was better for Luke, I would at least email the publisher back and say let me place this blue first. And Luke probably is cutting first, so I think they would appreciate that. Um. But in this case, I sent it

to Keith. Oh my gosh, we'll see. And he's always great about getting back to me. He's just great and everything in life isn't he really is? He just wins. He's just so sweet and so cheerful every time he responds. You know, sometimes you just get like past I think, at least a smiling face. Nothing. But I loved it because it kind of becomes your baby in a way. There's a recently, Eric Passley was looking for songs and he said, send me all the songs that you have

loved that you can't get cut. And I thought, well, there in lies Maybe the problem with these songs is that no one else likes him but me. So there's like a whole like you know, file folder of songs that I love that no one else seems to love. And then I sent him to Eric, and of course he didn't like any of them either. So someone's gonna love that. Someone's gonna love those songs. I'm gonna get this cut. You got to hang on to him like files, the automn files. Well, I think it's like anytime you

listen to a song that resonates with you. Somehow, those songs resonate to me and they don't resonate anyone else. But maybe tell me your style, your A and R style, because I'm sure it's like an artist, you know, as an A and R person who's running a big operation here picking out songs for artists. Obviously you have your own touch. What is your style? What do you look for in a song? What do you have to have, What do you have to feel to say that song

is going on? Hold anything that just stops you in your tracks like anything, I mean, so many great ones like you can't build all always there there. We never hear a bad song, never, They're always because these are top of the line songwriters and filter them out, there's just the one that rises above the rest, which usually because of melody. These days, i'd say production, it's probably another reason for it to stand out because there's so many more. Um what's the word. I think we're taking

such liberties in country production now that that will stand out. Um. And I think the best songs are the ones that are so simply written totally, but they say it so differently. Yes, it's not a tongue twister, but it's My dad always joked, He's like, I know those words. I knew all of those words, but I didn't put them together that you know, in that way. And I think that's the brilliance of some of those songs that I think, I agree with you.

So simple but so profound. Yeah, exactly, with a great melody. Yeah. Just and if you go all those all the time, If I could just fill up my inbox with those songs, that would I just i'ld be a hero all the time. But I guess there's so hard to come by, right, Lightning in a ball. Yeah. Do you have songwriters that you gravitate towards. We're like, Okay, I hear this songwriter song, I know I'm probably at least gonna like it. It might not be one that I do know. No revelations here.

I mean anybody that's a hot songwriter in town. I mean you can hear why they're so good Josh Kire Yeah, Um, Ashley Gorely, Um, Nicole Claws and Galleon. Yeah, you know Ranney classon that that you know why they're so successful. Um. But there's a new crop that I'm always kind of trying to get in. So you are early on, you try to study who's coming up well, Marion Morris um, and kind of getting back to your point, Carla Wallace

and I are very close. She has her publisher, yes, a big yellow dog and sort of where the first rumblings of Marion. She had signed Maren just straight out of Texas and so um, I got to know Marin early on and really tried to room that and tried to sign her, but my bosses didn't want to sign her. So how does that make you feel? Because when another huge part of an RFY every new artists. Yeah. So,

and also it's so hard to have women. But there's a whole there's a whole revelations with the woman, the woman, the woman wave is coming. I feel like it's happening. So you see an artist like mir and Morris, you want to sign her? How do you know when you want to sign someone? And then what's that process like trying to sign them? And then to wrap up with

what you're talking about? Yeah, well Maren in particular, because she was yet I mean I think she moved here knowing that she was definitely gonna be a songwriter, and then the artist thing was people kept pushing her like, girl, you were so good, You've got to maybe think about this artist thing. And in that time I was talking to her thinking, Okay, if any moment that she makes this decision, I'm here, we're hanging out, we're getting to

know each other, building a relationship. She made that decision, I brought her into the label and no one quite had the vision that I had. And so does that feel so defeating? It is defeating? And um, you know, I have to have faith that she's going to end up where she needs to be. What everybody believes in, right, and so everybody has this and shares the same passion, and so she got that where she is. So that's what that's what's great. Um. But it's still like it's hard,

but I did my job. I brought her in. We could have had her um, you know, and it's a gamble every time we don't know. We don't have a crystal ball kind of brought others that have failed to Everyone turned Sam Hunt down and then he ended up getting signed at UMG and Kphanie Wright saw that and so brilliantly said, this guy's a star. And he is clearly. When I first met him, I thought, oh my gosh, this guy and the music so brilliant and us so different.

Though it's like he was too scary for people originally, I think. And there is this thing um where you can't the xs and o's of it, where you can't figure out why it works for some and not for others, where that would be too scary for some people. For him, it just turns into like Limmings where you're just like follow Sam Hunt because he's so original, yes, and so good. You can't are you with how good he is? Truly? Yeah, so that's why it works. How do you Okay? We

kind of talked about this earlier. This is the frustrating part to me because everyone's talented in Nashville and especially in and R with all of your history, you know talent, and you know when you get excited about someone. So say, for instance, you signed two artists at the same time and one really takes off, Like one of my favorite artists of all times, Kelly Bannon, was signed with you guys for a while and she has so much buzzed

so radio just never really accepted her songs. But then same like John Party kind of comes around the same time, so good, so talented and radio acceptance. Why does that happen? Like, why can't someone get pushed through when they have the same support thing happening on the same label and everything's the same. We asked that all the time. It makes me.

It's mad name I know, and I think obviously we'd all be geniuses if you knew the answer to that, because then we wouldn't let it happen again, right, Um. I think part of this job is not to lose sight of the fact that these are people's lives and these are their dreams, and you're sort of holding that

in the palm of your hand. So we joked earlier is that we never signed people without talent, so they're all clearly talented um and I don't know they either the stars aligned for some and not for others, because they're all I feel particularly at Universal getting just oodles amounts of attention and love so great PLC for what they need and to make their dream come true. And I don't know, some take off and some downt and

it the frustration on Mayan is so profound. I can only imagine how it feels for those artists that it doesn't work. And incidentally, one of those is Walker Hayes. And you know you have to have the persistence to keep coming because maybe it's doing. I know that it works. I talk to me about him, his story, he five kids, six kids, six kids, kids. Can you believe that? I think he was ahead of his time. I think we all saw how just talk about talent. I mean it

just oozes from him. He's so musical, UM, so cute, so cute, precious, His wife Laney's adorable, their kids, the whole thing. It was just this. His music is lifestyle music. I feel like he's like to me, it feels like it's Dave Matthews is Jack Johnson, where you know it's always going to be that same box of music different every time, where you just turn it on and you're like hands off, and he was doing that and I

think we made a great record. Um. He also had this funny side where he would write, uh, you know, a love song about a pencil, and you would start crying and you think, oh my god, how did he do that? And then he would write a song about pay in the pool, which we were just laughing just as hard. Maybe it was a children's album, you know, he certainly knows how to make them, so maybe he should write for his children. But he could do those two sides and I can I don't think he could

figure out which one to go for. And so somehow he's now with the current single I think sort of blended the two. Now he back with you us, he's not. He's now on monument Let's say, how sweet would that be to like divorce and then remarry. It was like an amlical. Well, it's so rare that you actual we get signed again. I know this town. And so he's

had a second shot, which is so great. It is so exciting, and you know, sometimes honestly, the stars just done a line like like you're saying, maybe the timing is not right, maybe they're too creative or too clever for their own good, or the songs are too deep or sucks because I always hate it when like that song is just too complicated for the listener, because it really does have to be. They were just sort of dumbing down and said, doesn't say much for our listener

if they can't understand it. But I think there is a fine line. I mean, our format has parameters, and I think at the time, I mean, honestly, he was sort of doing dare I make the comparison, but he was kind of doing a sam Hunt thing without the track and the slick part of sam Um where we were kind of like whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, you do this, and he was like, do that, but I also do this, And he eventually started going the other way and we were we were still signed up for the other brand

of music. All that to say that he took all this time and you know, UM to now finally and the formats changed. Yeah, the format is chang age and now he can do what he clearly what he wants to write. He never gave up, which is freaking He never gave up. And you know, in John Party, I think you know, he kind of was coming out um at the time of Broke Country UM, and to his credit, he weathered the Broke Country storm he did and stay true to who he is, which is honky tonk country.

He's so mean, just yeah, modern day honky talk. Do you think staying true to who you are ultimately pays off, because sometimes there's a lot of pressure to mold. You can smell it a mile away. I think if you're just chasing a fame, yeah, you know, if it's you know, John's case, he was playing in bars at fourteen, Um, this is he moved here to do this, and you could just sense it like this is the guy that's whether he gets a deal or not, he's going to be playing for the rest of his life. So does

A and R like you? As an R, do you encourage your artists stay true to themselves because sometimes in the label it gets a little you kind of are encouraged to mold a little bit within other part departments of the You know, how do you feel about that? You know, the styling of them, that stuff. I think they were pretty good at saying, okay, you you want to wear a purple cowboy hat every day? Okay, let's talk about that. Um okay, but that you're going to

now be branded, that will be your thing. That's where you know, because as we put you out there, this is this is what we're gonna say about you. So we've got to make sure that message is um clear. It's them, you know. I don't know if we change people as much as we help them to realize that what we're doing is creating hopefully a long career and a part of their authenticity and then help it spand upon that maybe yeah, fit into like something a little

more not polished, but like a little more accessible. I think so I think when you know, I signed Dirks a thousand years ago now, but he's still the same artist, So that means that's him, that's him. But musically he has taken some slight detours to stretch. You know, you've got to kind of I mean, as an artist, as you know, I'm sure do you kind of want to try different things. So he's done that, but he hasn't

gone too far. I mean, he's not doing adium music, but but he wants to kind of, you know, push his own boundaries a little bit. So, but anybody that comes in and I think, mm hmm, you just you just want to be you want to make videos, right, you want to do this because it's really hard. It is like a record deal is actually the easiest part, right,

that's probably the easiest part. And actually I think Sam I'm quoting Sam in an article I didn't even read, but somebody had told me that He had said that was the shock to the whole part of the business was how grueling it can be. So talk to me what it's like to be an artist out there, because you have firsthand experience it is grilling. Well, it's just

always joke. Some of my best friends are artists. So when we go to dinner, I'm talking about the people in my office, and you know, I've got all this stuff to talk about, and all they want to talk about is they are their office, they are their business. So it's a weird and I have a lot more empathy because you're being told what your business is all the time, all this I can't imagine what that's and your business yourself is yourself. I mean, I still have

a buffer to all that. It's not really me. But if you're the artist and you're being told that's why all these are so emotional, it's so sensitive because it's can you build walls up of your own? Yeah? You know, and I think too, with any amount of success, you start to you start to push away. And that makes sense, Yeah, it really does. Everyone's like, oh that artist stay in office. It's like no, people are trying to tell that guy do all the time. And then there's the fame level

of fame where everybody wants you. Everybody wants you, and I look at I was at the studio with Luke recently and I thought he couldn't be more gracious and sweet and gave me a bout bear hug. I get just as excited. Oh he's still Luke. He's still the good old you know Luke from you know, yeah, teen years ago. Um, I thought, like country music does really well and everyone's staying humble. Obviously, people become stars and change a little. You have to, like we have to.

But for the most part, yeah, it's you're not going to get above your raisin. No, you know, it's it's that's the beauty of this market. I think I love that. Yeah, it's good. People. Do you have an artist experience that you saw them, signed them, grew them, had their album come out, and it was a perfect experience where you're like, this is everything I could have dreamed of as an an rsage Dirks so he was your he was perfect. He was I mean, really can't go back. He was

my first baby. UM signed him, made the record, first single, went to number one, and then it just never stopped. It just went. Of course, then you expect every experience to be like that and then it doesn't anything. Oh okay, Uh, let me tell you. Brought Dirk Sin to sign. I did, yep. How good does that feel? That when I can claim is solely my own? I really that really was like jumped up and down and said, you have to give

me this. Um. I've done that before in other cases and it didn't pan out, but Dirk's has fanned out. I gotta be honest. But um, you know Larry Willoughby and I, oh yeah, Larry, Larry, Um who hired me Capital? You know I entered a capital when you were there? Yeah? Oh yeah, gosh, yes, I mean just following me around for and here we are. This is so strange. Um, I'm so proud of you. But Larry and I co signed, really, Luke and I think that one too, although it was

a little got a little kind of hazy there. And then he always had hit singles, but they never We just knew there was more to him. And then he didn't turn around dance move of Country Girls shake it for me. So once he busted out his moves and then everything change. I remember texting at the moment the game change, shaking it. I don't know if he would. I think several of us would say that was the

moment um. That's when it went from fairs and festivals and some definitely some headlining shows, but that's where we went when he date, when he debuted his dance moves, he went what was the c MT Awards, and he did country Girl and those girls and he did the dot dot dot dot dot dot. And he's so steak and cute when he does it, because shaking it. It doesn't feel like he would be someone that would just shake it all the time, But when he does it,

you're like, are you the cutest person in the entire world? Cute? And I think even guys have to go all right again, is he's so cool you can't be mad at for shaking it? Oh, he's all boy, He's just I love him, sweet adorable boy. Um. But yeah, I texted Carey Uwards at night and just said, girl, this is it, this is it, this is it's happening. The moves are never going away, and she was like, it did. That's so exciting. Yeah, that was probably those highlights. Yeah, so let's not talk

about the failures. But I know, I know I was gonna say, is there anyone that bums you out? But then I'm probably sad to they all do, the ones that don't make it to that place that Kelly Bannon's the because you can become friends and you want it for them as much and you're just thinking, you know, fire, Yeah, it's like why didn't we why didn't this happen? Um

for you? Um. And the thing is it's the it's the journey for everyone because obviously someone as talented as like a Kelly Bannon who didn't necessarily make it at that particular time in radio, it just makes you have to evolve into something else. You know, she's been evolving at just picking up by your bootstraps and sort of like rolling this into and she's so talented and she's so brilliant, so it has to hit and she's will hit, she will hit, she will she's going to continue making music.

She's doing all these other little facets, all these different things. And who runs the obviously you know that, but everyone listening. He's like one of the biggest booking agencies. So he said, if you stick around and you have talent, eventually you will make it. I think he's right. Eventually you might take twenty years. There's no I mean, Ryan Nunn, it took him. Might tell he's forty, you know, of course she tells somebody that's already left Nashville. But they're you know, luggage,

and it's never happened. I think we weren't here long enough exactly, right, so they gave up. But um, yeah, I think if you if you can just put it in. It's hard though, right, it is. I mean, it's it's it's defeating in so many ways. It is, particularly I think for a lot of those artists come in together, the whole other group of artists, and they all kind of know each other, right, and then start making it. Now they's start dropping back. Yeah, I know, yeah, there's

a lot of that. You don't want to compare, but you can't help that's have your blinders on, right, Oh, I guess yeah. I mean, you know, I'm just hiding in my little office at Universal, so no one knows, right, although most of us we're actually planning a reunion a group of us that we're in a pluggers group together, a song plugging group where we were all pitching songs, and we're all going to get together and just reminisce about what we're still in the business after all these years,

you know, doing it together. So what have you We're going to wrap up soon. But what have you noticed as some of the biggest changes in the music industry over the past decade? They stand out to you? Oh gosh, I think anybody would just the streaming services and what's that? What that's done? Do you think that's going to turn around for the better eventually income revenue? I think so.

I mean I think in some ways, um, where the single streams are, where album sales are down, the single streams are sort of picking up a little bit, and I think that's going to increase the country formats always

lags behind and those changes. Um, but I think we've all seen kind of seen a significance or a significant increase in the last year in particular, um, where some artists are having incredible album sales, but they've had huge number ones with recurrents that are just still streaming out the wazoo, and so those where we didn't have that before. You know, they may not be paying. Of course, the labels are making the money. The songwriters are. That's a

whole other time. How the labels are we're getting paid, but that that's changing for us, um any other changes. You know, I think there's still ways now to become an artist. Um. You know, the whole notion of going to Spotify first, like without a label, without a label, building on YouTube, their YouTube, there's you know, um ways to build if you have the know how and maybe some financing to figure that out. You know, maybe don't need the major record label. You know, it can be done.

It's been proven to be done in other ways. It has. Yeah, I mean, look at it's a chance the wrapper, right, so doing it without a label, um now, not to say everybody can do that, but yeah, once again at the stars, all line and all works. Ye, so much of its timing and honestly divine luck obviously having the talent, yeah, yeah,

and having somebody that believes in you. I mean, you know, there's several people at Spotify locally that UM are making careers because they're adding those artists to their playlisting and you know, building fans and that crazy. But you know, we didn't have that years ago, so UM it was just the record label that could make you rich or famous.

And now that that's not true, So probably the better changes for the artist, right and really in some ways for us because now it's sort of a research field for us. So if you're already out there, we can already kind of see which which ones are gonna listen to totally, totally Yeah. And Sam, you know, hunt Um had already been releasing so much music and was on the Spotify program before we signed him, so there was

already a fan base there though. There was already anticipation for him, so he used all that to his advantage, and of course Spotify put him on that UM they're sort of highlighted program and coursie here we are, here we are, and here Sam is right doing our stadium like our shows, headlining huge tour. Yeah. Okay, so I want to also ask you how do you juggle motherhood being a career woman in motherhood because you have two adorable twins. How and you make everything look so easy.

You're so beautiful, you're so talented, you juggle it all. I came here today. You're kicking ass in your work. Oh, raising family? How do you do it? How do you find balance? Well, I will say I don't work for monsters, and they're all family oriented themselves. And um, I think everybody realizes we're These aren't real jobs. I mean, come on, we're not you know, out there roof and houses, which I think is an actual real job. I can't imagine

how difficult that is. Um, So we we do have the luxury of uh, you know, if I need to do rescue the kids from de camp, you know I can. But it's it's a it's a you know, I have shows at night, my husband is taking over, we have a nanny, and my parents are here. It's like anybody that's working. So it's a puzzle. It's all every week, the different puzzles. Yeah, but I do have such h empathy for people that are in positions of work that can't just I'm sorry, I can't come in because of

my kids, blah blah, and you cannot like anybody. I'm no hero here, but you make it look easy. You do o. Well, it's just I'm exhausted all the time though, right, Actually I had to show the other night. I thought, okay, put the kids down, make dinner, put the you know, it's yeah, we're all doing it so every second, school, every much of pretty much. Yeah, And I was like, oh, hey, husband, okay, I'm going to bed now. Your husband, though, is so funny.

You guys are so cute together. Sweet, He's a riot, he is. And Johna's laugh all the time. Yeah, I think I'm funnier, but actually here it's funny and y'all's kids. I saw one Instagram video or something where they were doing a whole show and outfits singing with microphones, Like where they get that, Yeah, it's all about singing there in the making up jokes now which make no sense and we all have to fakela. That's hilarious. They make no sense, but they get the art of the joke,

which I think is hilarious that they understand. Like they'll say, mommy, why did the mailbox run away from the car. You're like, why did the mailbox right away from the car? And then they say something that's like, yeah, okay, okay, so these are four year old people, but yeah, yeah, but my nieces making jokes with no sense at all, and I was like, the shows there, it's so think, yeah,

hell does she she's six? Oh yeah, Well I think it's only got to go up from here, right, we're actually gonna say something really clever and funny one day. I love it, and my husband's encouraging it so well with y'all's he's a host and he's hysterical, and you're hysterical in town, and so you're bound to have some crazy talented kids. It's thrown up. We're just trying to

keep up with them. Yeah, it's been fine. So I like to wrap up with leave your light, So leave some inspiration of how you have been inspired or how you like to inspire people. Oh my god, all that you've seen and lived in your life. Oh my well. I think we sort of touched on it maybe, but um, I just think you can't let it go to your head. I think it's just these It's not we're not saving lives. When I have friends with real jol it does save lives. Well, I guess you know. It all speaks to us in

different ways. But um, and I'm more than thankful for it. It's been My mom used to joke that if school have been set to music, I would have made straight a's, But um, that's just been my thing. But um, yeah, I just think, you know, don't burn those bridges. Be nice. That's it's really I love that, not more. And be on time. It's if you can just be on time, then the rest of the day should be pretty easy

after that. Yeah, I'm more amazed than ever the people that just can't keep You've probably worked with a lot of them, created that creative they don't always follow, was it tin It's weird because my watch is ten twenty. But yeah, right, but I don't know how inspiring that is. But just some I love that in my little world. Those are the kind of the things that I think, Oh that really makes a difference, you know, those are those first impressions. Yeah, and I'm amazing. Thank you, it's

so far. Thank you so much for joining me. More about me. We're done the letter. I know I would talk forever. I really lose you to talk about. Yeah, I know, I think I was talking so fast in the beginning. Hope if anyone's slow it down really just to get kind of it's just so much information. You are a wealth of knowledge, like you're from. That's why I can have a lot to reflect on. You were not a hundred. I'll come back and read my journal nixt Thank you well, thank you all so much for

joining me today. I'm hyper killing Hobby podcast with the amazing, talented Autumn Ouse. Thank you. It was Autumn not fascinating. I love Autum Her story is amazing and her job is amazing. It is such a behind the scenes job that is so crucial to artists in the discovery of new artists, and she is just phenomenal. I loved that interview. Next week, you guys, I have the hottest celebrity interior

designer joining me, April Tomlin. She has done houses. She sent houses from Jay sin aal Dean to Florida, Georgia line. She does everyone's house in her style is amazing and she talks all about her life, her journey, what's like to be a celebrity interior design and all of the parts that go with it. Cannot wait for y'all to hear April Tomlin next week. Make sure to subscribe see you then bye