Episode 48: Sanctity of Life

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Brenton
This is further a weekly show for the people of Harmony Bible Church, where we seek to revisit and expand on Sunday sermons with the goal of growing deeper in biblical truth that transforms our lives. Welcome back to Further. I am Brenton Grimm. I'm here again with Chris Carr and I think he's feeling better this week. Right. How are you doing?

00;00;24;26 - 00;00;29;16
Chris
And finally, I'm freezing cold, but other than that, I'm.

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Brenton
A lot better. Miserable outside. Yeah, it's good, though. Yeah, we're loving it. This is Iowa. so I wanted to mention these next two weeks, I'm actually going to be out, and we're going to have one week. Chris and Matt Mitchell are going to be here going over Matt Mitchell sermon, and then this next week we're going to have a different host.

00;00;55;15 - 00;01;04;18
Brenton
Tim's for Boulder, so we're excited about that. So yeah, don't replace me. I, I still want this gig.

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Chris
You are irreplaceable. Perfect. So only temporarily we can.

00;01;08;06 - 00;01;31;01
Brenton
Perfect. so what we're going to talk about this week, since we kind of had an off week last week with the services getting canceled, is Chris had come to me yesterday and suggested that we just talk about the holiday. It's coming up on Sunday, and you may ask what holiday? And it is the sanctity of life Sunday.

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Brenton
And so, Chris, do you want to kind of explain to us what what this holiday is signifying?

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Chris
Yeah. So it originated back in 1984, which would have been quite a while before you were born, I believe? Three years. Yeah. So I would have been 12 years old at the time, but it was actually the established by Ronald Reagan. And basically he made a proclamation where he designated January 22nd as a sanctity of human life Sunday.

00;02;11;05 - 00;02;46;01
Chris
And so and basically that was to remember the 11 million babies that had been aborted since Roe v Wade back in 1973, and then also to affirm the sanctity of human life. And so now, over the last I guess, what are we at now, 40 years here? Actually this week, 40 years. So it's now every Sunday that is the closest to January the 22nd, which will be the Sunday will be the 21st.

00;02;46;01 - 00;03;19;01
Chris
And so 40 years later and and our country actually, our country is not always since 1984, actually celebrated this this day and didn't do so during the Clinton years, in fact. But for for most years, it certainly has been something that has been recognized nationally and just as a time to emphasize the the value and worth and dignity of every individual from the womb to the tomb.

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Chris
And so I think that's an important distinction to make here. We're not just talking about unborn babies or we're talking about life from the moment of conception until the moment of death is it's a time for us to just focus on that and to remember that and to uphold that.

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Brenton
Yeah, I was going to ask that. So originally, though, I mean, the intent of it was to, you know, it was purely abortion. Right? And then, you know, it's kind of morphed over that time. Yeah. Okay.

00;03;54;18 - 00;04;15;16
Chris
So that was the primary emphasis. I will note. I can just read what Reagan wrote here just a little bit. He says and he's talking about the babies who were aborted, says, We are poor, not simply for our lives, not let him for contributions, not me, but also for the erosion of our sense of the worth and dignity of every individual.

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Chris
To diminish the value of one category of human life is to diminish us all. And so he he was primarily speaking in regards to the abortion issue, but I think he had a a big bigger picture view of it than that. And and he was looking not only to the unborn babies, but I think he was looking probably as well to the disabled.

00;04;37;26 - 00;05;01;27
Chris
He was looking to those who are who are older. And I think he probably had a lot of different groups, if not every different group in view there. Yeah. And we and we even if he didn't, that's certainly what the church does or at least should affirm that that is true. Sure.

00;05;02;00 - 00;05;28;15
Brenton
Okay. So let's let's start at a basic level here. So I think we all kind of take it for granted and I think overall, everyone would agree with this, that the fact that life is sacred, why why do we accept that? Why? Why how do we get to that point where we admit that that life is sacred and even human life over other creatures?

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Brenton
Why why do we think that?

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Chris
Yeah, and this is pretty fundamental, but absolutely essential. I can't stress how important it is and how often I go back to Genesis one and two. But if you go and this is one in the creation narrative, you go through all the days of creation and after God is creat, created everything and says that it was, it was good.

00;05;55;21 - 00;06;13;13
Chris
Everything. It was good. It was good. It was good. But then verse 26, Let us make man in our image after our likeness and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea. You know, the birds of the heavens and over the livestock and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.

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Chris
So God created man in his own image. In the image of God, he created him male and female. He created them. And then if you go down at the end in verse 31 and it says, and God saw everything that he had made and behold it was very good. So a number of different things there. First of all, it's only good until God creates mankind, and then it's very good.

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Chris
Only mankind is said to be created in God's image. And to be created in God's image means to be to be made like Him and to represent him. So. So everything else is created good, but only mankind is created like God. And to represent God, only mankind is said to be made in in his image. And so I think we should value every every life form to some degree.

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Chris
But but it's clear that that humanity has a another level of dignity and value and and worth simply from the fact that that we are made like God. There are things about us that when people see us, they can see in some ways what God is like. Now, obviously the fall has distorted that. Our ability to be able to image God.

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Chris
We were if you think about it this way, we were created as a kind of as a mirror. Yeah, but now that mirrors cracked and so it's distorted and sometimes horribly. So the great thing about the gospel, I'm getting a little off track here, but I can't not that the great thing about the gospel is that that then that mirrors being put back together again.

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Chris
And so we're broken. But now we're, we're in the process of becoming beautiful again. And so all of that to say is that that the Bible clearly from the very beginning makes a significant distinction between mankind and.

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Brenton
Every other.

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Chris
Life form.

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Brenton
Yeah, it is this doctrine of the of men being made in the image of God. Is that is that ever gotten wrong by by other belief systems? Has that ever been misunderstood?

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Chris
Yeah, I mean, it can be misunderstood to think that we're gods.

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Brenton
Sure. Right? Yes.

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Chris
For sure. And that we're divine in some way. And that's certainly an error that's still being made today. So there's at least one way of thinking about any other.

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Brenton
No, I just I was I was wondering if there if there was I was trying to think of if there was any heresies around this, but I can't. Sure. Yeah, yeah.

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Chris
Yeah. Is this, this idea okay that that means that we, we are, you know, God is in us. We're in God and okay, so we are in Christ crises in us. But that that's not what the heresy is. Meaning like we, we ourselves, apart from the Son of God or there's this a divine spark in all of us.

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Chris
You hear, hear those things?

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Brenton
Well, yeah. I mean, what you were talking about earlier, that's that's. I mean, the Mormon belief that as as you are, God was and, you know, as God is, you will be so. Okay, that's helpful. So Harmony has been celebrating this for quite some time now, right?

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Chris
Yeah, Well, it dates back certainly as far as long as I've been here. But I'm quite sure that it was the my guess would be it's from the very beginning. This is something that our church has been very strong in, in our affirming our belief and even in our practice, because it's not simply something that we just subscribe to and say like this sometimes is used as a political tool, so to speak, that that's not the case when it comes to our church at all.

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Chris
It's something that we believe very strongly and even live in Minister out of.

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Brenton
Yeah. So what what's the goal with, you know, us on a Sunday day acknowledging this? What does that do for the body? What does it do for the cause?

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Chris
Well, I think that the the culture well, we'll think about it this way. You know, this is a somewhat significant issue for me, is the fact that I was born less than a month before Roe v Wade was the court decision came through. So this has been my in my entire life. Abortion has been except for a month.

00;11;11;09 - 00;11;47;13
Chris
Abortion has been legal in a country in over 50 million babies had been aborted in that time. And I mean, that's just a major cultural issue where we we see the image of God being being destroyed, life being destroyed. And so that should you know, it should be just a huge issue for us If we we see that and believe that each individual is made in the image of God, is valuable, has a lot of dignity and worth.

00;11;47;13 - 00;12;24;06
Chris
And we go to Psalm 139, He knits us together and our mother's womb. And just the the preciousness from which we see Jesus in particular viewing children. And so he values children. We should have the children, the God values life. We should value life. I think it's also a major issue because it's you know, our culture is is more and more devaluing life and not just in the the the pre-born, but but all the way through.

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Chris
And it's not just in our culture. It's it's it's it's around around the world. And this is whether it's children like with Down's syndrome there are many less Down syndrome children today than there used to be. And that's because of things like genetic testing and and genetic selection. And then you could go all the way to the to the elderly.

00;12;50;01 - 00;13;25;16
Chris
We could talk about things like euthanasia and on and on. You go. And and then I would talk about our young people who've just been raised with this mentality that that abortion is a right and and like, it's a it's like almost like a God given right is is as crazy as that may sound. One might say that is but is the view and that woman's body is is her body and she gets the side nobody should be able to tell her what to do with her body.

00;13;25;19 - 00;14;11;09
Chris
And these are just clearly unbiblical philosophies that people are holding to. And as is normal, what is accepted in the culture and when then when the culture begins to promulgate these ideas and they become cultural values, they see their way into the church. And so we we even saw this with a recent Dobbs Division. I was really, really concerned about what I was seeing online social media from young Christians when that came out and just how they were opposed to this.

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Chris
And virulently and at times and just this what they were spouting was what the culture was, you know, spouting and what the culture believed. And it was it was just, quite frankly, it was it was unbiblical. And I don't completely blame them in some ways that you can blame, whether it's the church or education or our failure to disciple.

00;14;39;29 - 00;15;11;15
Chris
And yet it's a you know, it's a major issue. And another reason this is an issue is that abortion harms women. Yeah. Okay. So there's this you know, it saddens me and concerns me not just because of the unbiblical nature of it, not just because of what it's doing to life, but also what it's doing to the women who who who have abortions.

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Chris
Right. And if we're really willing to look at the research and it it's hard to because there's there's a lot of you know, false information out there. But if you if you really, really look at it, abortion is is is devastating to women physically, emotionally, mentally and spiritually. And that's in every case. And I'm not saying that's in every case or where every woman would say that that's her experience.

00;15;39;22 - 00;16;07;17
Chris
But but but by and large, that that is whether it's guilt and shame, whether it's physical issues of not being able to have had children or struggling with infertility, then whether it's relational issues and of course, it's not just women, then the men involved in their lives, would there be a husband or a boyfriend? And it affects them.

00;16;07;19 - 00;16;29;14
Chris
And just on, on and on and on down the line. And then here's what we also have. We're getting to the point where we are a population is not is not growing. We're not there yet. But you can look in places like Japan where there's negative population growth and that has that has real effects in in all kinds of things.

00;16;29;14 - 00;16;58;09
Chris
Economic effects and and economic effects have a lot of different impact over time. And it's really hard to correct that. You may think, well, you just start having more babies. But it takes a while. Yeah, it takes a while in. Japan is actually like it's one of the countries recognized they get it, you get a problem. China's recognized they have years and years of a one child policy and they've actually began to to change that because they see the negative impacts of that.

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Chris
And so we should we should recognize and we should wake up and see that there's devastating consequences from this all the way around. Yeah.

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Brenton
Yeah. I want to go back to something you were talking about, about how the, you know, the the worth of human life has been devalued. And then I remember, you know, not that long ago, 20 years or so, it seemed like politicians and there was a common saying of safe, legal and rare. Right. We need to keep abortion safe, legal and rare, which I think is silly in the first place.

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Brenton
But, you know, has and we've seen that shift from from there to now, where we have people that are like kind of bragging about their abortions that are, you know, we're we're excited to keep this right. This is our human right. Do you think that the culture has continued to swing that way And like even, you know, let's look back further in the history of humankind, Do you think that that life is is more or less valued now than it was before?

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Brenton
Like, is it are we on a trajectory of of this getting worse or what would you say?

00;18;18;04 - 00;18;43;26
Chris
Yeah, well, I think we value our own lives more now, like individualism, like that. But I think there's there there's no doubt that life is valued overall is valued less today than than it's ever been, I guess. Well, it's easy to say than it's ever been. I mean, that that's kind of chronological snobbery, maybe a little bit there.

00;18;43;28 - 00;19;12;09
Chris
But it's definitely, I would say in my lifetime is is absolutely for for sure the case. And I think that you know, if you even go like the Bible, the Bible upholds the the gray head, you know, being been an elder was something that they were value. They were cherished because for their wisdom and they had they had a lot to contribute.

00;19;12;09 - 00;19;40;20
Chris
And we we tend to more value the twenties and thirties, maybe the forties a little bit. And and the older people are just like, was put them over and over here and let them kind of live out their days. Hopefully not causes too much problem. Yeah. And yeah so I think that's certainly the case. I do want to hit on something that you you brought up though.

00;19;40;20 - 00;19;43;19
Chris
I think that when you talk about like what do you say safe.

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Brenton
Safe, legal and.

00;19;44;17 - 00;20;06;19
Chris
Safe, legal and rare, I think that that in some ways you even hear political candidates now and there's a big argument over you know, six weeks and, you know, or what to think. I think that when we start having those kind of conversations, we've actually ceded the ground that all life is life begins at conception and all life is valuable.

00;20;06;19 - 00;20;32;19
Chris
And like we want to have a six week, we want no abortions after six week. Well, that's kind of we're we're we're actually already losing the argument because now we're like where there is acceptable abortions. I know that. Right. And, you know, and so like safe, legal and rare, they yeah, they're not a they're not safe, but.

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Brenton
Well and if if you're arguing that it's okay why where what right. If you if you compare this to a mall getting removed off of you like many do. Right. Why rare why, why can't we do this every day. Yeah.

00;20;45;10 - 00;21;13;04
Chris
I would. I would love to see one of our, one of our politicians in these debates and arguments just say, you know, life, life begins at conception. We value them. And so we're not going to you know, we're not going to be satisfied until there are no abortions. And that's my that's my position. They can't do that.

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Brenton
There's a few, but not many.

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Chris
Well, they they because you know where the where the culture is and they don't care. They'll get those.

00;21;19;17 - 00;21;38;11
Brenton
So yes, so much of this conversation has just moved to the political side of things. And it's it's really perverted the issue of thinking. And it's it's moved to this tiny little incrementalism. We can get eight weeks or we get six weeks or. Yeah, yeah, I, I totally agree.

00;21;38;17 - 00;22;05;03
Chris
Yeah. I mean, I think it's different and it's different if we are trying to I think the incremental approach actually like it and we're we're not if if we're working working politically okay likes to think that we're going to be able to ban all, all abortions like we gotta to recognize that's not that's not going to happen.

00;22;05;05 - 00;22;38;12
Chris
Like in one fell swoop. But but incrementally, if we we're going to work in that direction and we may have to make strides, which we actually have, we mean the decision was a result of an incremental approach for literally like 40 years. But I'm talking about like in these debates about like abortion, like let let's not, you know, say, okay, like we're doing a great deed by saying nothing after six weeks.

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Brenton
Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Well, I mean, with the Dobbs decision, though, I think we have a lot better chance of states being able to to do that. And we've seen that in some states. And I'm sure, you know, I think I think who knows what what the end result of all that's going to be sure but I think yeah some some steps have definitely been made in the right direction.

00;23;00;04 - 00;23;24;08
Brenton
So that kind of brings me back around to the question from earlier of why we're doing this. And I think one one of the important answers is that it gets it out in front of people. And and maybe abortion isn't really something we that's in our face in Burlington, Iowa, or Danville, Iowa, as much. And not that it's not here because it is, but we don't have any clinics here.

00;23;24;08 - 00;23;35;12
Brenton
And and so this is another opportunity to just get it out in front of people and remind them of the of the issue and remind them of what's actually going on.

00;23;35;15 - 00;24;06;23
Chris
Yeah. And it's really important, I think, here to to recognize that this is it's not simply about, you know, limiting access to to abortion. It's it's also about how do we address the issues that lead women to get abortions and I, I, I think that in in a majority of cases, it's not like women do not want to they don't want to get an abortion.

00;24;06;23 - 00;24;36;06
Chris
They they feel right or wrong, that that's really their only choice. A lot of times they're they're pressured into it. A lot of times they are economically or are in a place where they do not think that they can afford to have another child. A lot of this is, you know, people who are ladies who are in really kind of difficult circumstances.

00;24;36;06 - 00;25;07;22
Chris
And I have to be honest with you, I think that for middle class and upper middle class people, it's really hard for us to understand what it's like to be a young woman who is maybe unmarried and who's being pressured by a by a boyfriend. And she, you know, has little economic opportunity. Maybe the background that she comes from, she doesn't have family support.

00;25;07;24 - 00;25;40;29
Chris
It's, you know, it's really easy from our ivory tower to say, you know, you shouldn't have an abortion, you shouldn't have an abortion, and we're anti-abortion and all that kind of stuff. And yet to recognize that there are a lot of other factors that go into it. And if we really care about this issue that we're going to pray and we're going to work not only on the political end of it and voting and and, you know, and lobbying our, you know, our lawmakers and all that things.

00;25;40;29 - 00;26;09;22
Chris
But we're also going to put boots on the ground and we're going to try to figure out, like, how do we minister to women in difficult circumstances so that the so suits that they're felt need to have an abortion is is a race or a limited as much as possible? How are we going to and how are we going to care for you know and well maybe say this way, people in the pro-life movement have been accused of only caring about babies before they're born.

00;26;09;25 - 00;26;41;00
Chris
And then once they're born, we don't, you know, not really care. And I think that that's in many ways unfair. But I do think that there is some sliver of truth, and that is that, yeah, like now once these ladies may have so we want them to have their babies are pregnant, so how are we going to come alongside them and help them, whether it be financially, whether it be through, you know, child care or whether it be through helping them get jobs and everything like that.

00;26;41;00 - 00;26;58;29
Chris
And those are all things we're trying to, you know, to wrestle with. And in some ways, the meant to minister through City Hope and through other other things that we try to do. But I think it's, you know, and then you go on from that about, you know, how are we valuing people at every stage of life.

00;26;59;01 - 00;27;21;14
Brenton
Yeah. Yeah I agree that I think that is a is an unfair argument because I don't think it logically follows that we just because we say we don't want someone murdered doesn't mean that we now bear the responsibility for them. However, like that, we still do have a call right, to to take care of widows and orphans and and those who are in need.

00;27;21;14 - 00;27;23;13
Brenton
And so, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

00;27;23;15 - 00;27;52;07
Chris
I'm always struck by the stories of how the early church well, historians have have done studies about how did the early church grow so rapidly and consistently. They'll say one of the reasons is because, you know, they didn't have I mean, there was abortion in the Roman Empire, first century Roman Empire, but it was much more likely for people to have a baby and then expose expose the baby.

00;27;52;10 - 00;28;14;20
Chris
So instead of killing the baby in the womb, which was very, very unsafe, then, yeah, they would have the baby and then they would just they would just go to the garbage dump or they would leave it outside. And the historians will say that the that the early Christians would just they would go and they would they would adopt baby, take the babies home and adopt the babies and care for them.

00;28;14;23 - 00;28;43;08
Chris
And in one ways, the church groups, as they were bringing these babies in, were disciples in the coming though. And that's one of the ways, but it's also a testimony to the world. And so this is why we're big here on things like adoption and foster care. And that's those are major values for our church. And and we've got a lot of adopted a lot of the kids, a lot of foster kids that come to our church every every Sunday in our children's ministry.

00;28;43;09 - 00;28;45;17
Chris
It's fantastic. Yeah.

00;28;45;20 - 00;29;13;02
Brenton
Okay. So moving on from from abortion, I think I think everyone probably knows where we land on that. so you, you can use the term from room to tomb. So what else is involved in that? When we talked about when we talk about the the sanctity of human life, you had mentioned euthanasia, but what other what other things are there that you know, we need to be aware of?

00;29;13;02 - 00;29;22;19
Chris
Yeah, well, I think euthanasia is certainly it doesn't seem to be getting as much traction as I thought maybe it would be. It seems.

00;29;22;19 - 00;29;24;16
Brenton
Like every time I hear about it, it's in like Sweden or.

00;29;24;16 - 00;30;03;04
Chris
Something. Yeah, it's it doesn't, it doesn't have a ton of traction right now, which is a great thing. Yeah. I think that, you know, an issue here is just how do we, how do we. We care for and how do we value people who have disabilities, whether there be a physical disability or a mental disability and are we going to are we going provides a space for them, welcome them, care for them and and value them.

00;30;03;04 - 00;30;38;29
Chris
And I do actually. I think that our culture is actually in some ways made and made some progress on this and hopefully the churches in a good way in following along on that. So once I do think that once a person with a mental or physical disability is born, that our culture actually does a fairly decent job or at least is improving in how we we value those people and care for those people and provide resources for those people.

00;30;38;29 - 00;30;48;02
Chris
So that that's a positive thing. And I think that the church could probably and we're no exception could grow in in that.

00;30;48;04 - 00;31;01;25
Brenton
So yeah so Okay so I guess let's let's end this with how what's an action step for us? How how can we begin to try to move the needle on some of these things.

00;31;01;29 - 00;31;33;04
Chris
Yeah. So let me give you and I'll do this pretty rapidly. I'm going to give you a bunch of CS here. Okay. So true alliteration. Yeah, well, I am pastor, right? So, so carefulness. You need to be careful about how we talk about these issues and there's nuance that comes into play with with a lot of these things and especially in terms of the the abortion issue.

00;31;33;07 - 00;32;20;13
Chris
And so just, just being being careful, you know, let are that our speech always speaks with salt and gracious so that we always know how to answer everyone there. And along with carefulness, is civility. So then the second C is like when we have these conversations, we're not going to be. And when I came across as angry or hateful, that doesn't mean that we we shouldn't be angry about, you know, unborn babies being killed or, you know, older people being mistreated or handicapped people being, you know, mistreated.

00;32;20;15 - 00;32;59;25
Chris
There's a room for anger there. But how are we going to speak about these issues and relate to these people who maybe are being the offenders or we would view as the offenders And just having tried to, as best as we can, have civil conversations and that goes along with the third C would be charity. And so we're going to show love to people and I would say particularly to women who are in of difficult positions, maybe even more to the point, women who've had abortions, and that we have women in our church that have that have had abortions.

00;32;59;25 - 00;33;38;25
Chris
And so how do we show them love and care, knowing that God has either forgiven them or offers them forgiveness? And so that should be our same, you know, mentality or approach to them along with charity. I would say compassion. And this may be the the biggest one of all, let's have compassion for women who are in difficult circumstance as and who who are either economically or relationally.

00;33;38;25 - 00;34;06;06
Chris
Some they're being forced to. They don't think that they have a way out. They don't know what to do and or they have had the abortion and now they're living with the fallout of that is like, let's have compassion and mercy, the same kind of compassion and mercy that God has had to us. And then let's I don't have a C for this, but but let's certainly be praying about it.

00;34;06;06 - 00;34;26;01
Chris
But but but how how can we get involved beyond simply voting for people who claim to be pro-life? And maybe I'll just make a we'll talk about politics real quick here. I want to encourage everybody you got to be really careful and you need to look at people's voting records, not simply at what the platform they they subscribe to.

00;34;26;02 - 00;34;56;11
Chris
So there are a lot of people who subscribe to a pro-life platform, but they only do so in order to curry a certain voting bloc. And they they really have no interest in actually moving forward. The pro-life, what we might call an agenda. And so let's let's let's be careful about that and let's let's more look at how we're actually people actually, you know, are people who are running for office.

00;34;56;11 - 00;35;38;19
Chris
How are they actually putting boots on the ground to see that not only is abortion limited, but how also are we addressing the issues that that would maybe would lower women's needs for for for needing abortions? And then finally, I just think the more that we can do to support, whether it be crisis pregnancy centers or be involved in foster care adoption, whether it's personally or supporting people who can being involved in City Hope and a different ministries that are ministering to people in difficult circumstances.

00;35;38;21 - 00;35;55;12
Chris
You know, the Bible calls us to stand up for the oppressed. And so that's for for all of us. And so there's there's something that all of us can do. And I think we all need to wrestle with that and and pray about how a lot of us get involved.

00;35;55;15 - 00;36;25;09
Brenton
Yeah. As you're talking there at the end of that, I think I think we have the tendency to look at this issue from the macro and say like, how can we how can we fix this all? Like how can we as a culture fix all of this? And I think the like what you gave is, is it's one on one friendships and relationships and like us getting involved enough with the community to know these people and be able to speak into their lives.

00;36;25;11 - 00;36;43;16
Brenton
Like I think if the church is actually willing to do that, we're going to see a lot more fruit come of that then than what we'll see politically. Not that we shouldn't call for political end to this, we should share. But I think that what we what all of us can do is get involved with people who are who are here.

00;36;43;18 - 00;37;11;29
Chris
Yeah. And and, you know, very, very few of us, this would be me included or are going to be able to make massive change a bunch of people's lives. But we all can change one and two and and and if enough of us are changing one or two, then you like the early church, then you get a something going to get a movement going.

00;37;12;01 - 00;37;38;09
Chris
And I think I see that in a small way. Again, I would go back to there are literally dozens and dozens of kids in our church who come every Sunday with parents or people who are who are not their biological parents. Yeah. And they're they're hearing the gospel at home and at church. They're being saved. They're being baptized.

00;37;38;09 - 00;37;39;24
Chris
Their lives are being changed.

00;37;39;24 - 00;37;44;26
Unknown
And then they're changing lives of their own families. Yeah.

00;37;44;29 - 00;37;51;17
Brenton
Can we wrap it up there? I appreciate it, Chris. Yeah, and yeah, he will talk to you next week.