Danica Patrick on Racing, Nutrition, and Napa Valley

podcast host. She developed her own successful venued in Napa Valley. She's the most successful woman in the history of indie car racing, and she might even love fitness and nutrition more than I do. Without further delay, please enjoy my insightful conversation with a very special Danica Patrick. Danica, thank you so much for doing this for me. I know your day is busy, Oh, no problem. I'm happy to do it for you, No problem. Are you in l A.

Where are you in Scottsdale? In Scottsdale, Love Scottsdale. Do you play golf? Not really? But when I do play, I play horribly. I would think that you would be an incredibly good golfer because no one else but yourself to mess up. I mean, I think that because of that reason, there's a highlight teled accountability and blame I place on myself. So it's hard for me to shut

that off. So I say that what I do is I play golf for smiley faces, And by that I just mean that on the scorecard, I don't put a score. I just put whether or not I had a good attitude on the whole. And that way, I you know, if I have to pick my ball up to smile, then I just picked my ball up for our first course. Dannika tells me about her childhood background, from working as a barista at her family's coffee shop in Wisconsin to moving to England as a teenager to pursue her racing career.

So it's really nice down here, but you grew up in is it? Elloit is that the way you say it? Yeah, Belloy, Wisconsin? Okay, what's your favorite cheese? What's your favorite Wisconsin cheddar? I don't eat cheese anymore, but of course I have. I have had cheese plenty of times in my life. I would say that I really love goat cheese. Wow, yeah, I love goat cheese. My favorite goat cheese. So Wisconsin

cheddar was not on your radar. There's like eight kinds. Yeah, I mean they don't make that, but I'm sure they make it somewhere. But if I were to pick up more Wisconsin based cheese, I'd probably say, like a five year aged cheddar. Now we're getting somewhere five year aged cheddar. Very nice. I love the ages on cheddars. I think it makes the cheddar so much better. That's not a rhyme. So your parents, like, we're sort of in the hospitality business in a way, right. They had a coffee shop,

what should I say, a java hut? How many did they have? Do they have one or was it a franchise? No, they just had one. Like my mom just truly loves coffee so much. So your dad just said, I'm gonna buy you a job. I guess, keep her busy, keep mom happy, you know, happy wife, happy life. I worked there for a little bit. You had to make the froth yourself and everything. It's all about that high quality,

like small, bubble thick, peaky foam. Baby. They would come in and they'd be like, can I get a vanilla cappuccino? And I was like sure, And if I was feeling really, you know, frisky, that's what I would say. I'd make them their vanilla capuccino and they'd get it and they'd pick it up and they'd be like, oh, why is this a light. I'm like, well, you ordered a cappuccino

which is mostly foam. Did you want a latte? And they're like yeah, And I just knew that they wanted like gas station vanilla cappuccino, Like when you push the button, I can be such a dick. How long did you work there? I've worked there for you a couple of years, I'm sure. Like I feel like it was probably around like two thousand one ish. Your dad bought that. But that was just passionate. That was like something just a mom. They're just very entrepreneurial, so I guess that was kind

of for mom. But also it's just you know, a potential money maker. Well, it's really good money if you sell. I don't know what Jaba charges. There's a lot of them actually outside New York, but like if you tried two bucks for a cup of coffee, I think it costs twelve cents for six ounces something like that. But it's a very very good profit margin. That's why Starbucks does so well. They sure do. And then your dad he was in the glass business. Yeah, what kind of glass?

Explained glass? He was a glazer. So he put in like commercial windows, so nothing over like three stories, but he put in like storefronts and stuff like that. When we were really young. He worked for a company called, I think Cardinal Glass. Oh, I know a Cardinal Glass. That's a big company. Oh, it's huge. It's he makes all those thick glass is like almost litting ut Libby, but like that kind of glass. It's a she's a

gigantic company. M hmm. So he worked there for a while and then he quit and started his own glass company and started in the garage and then it went from there and so you know, it got him to a point where he was able to, you know, help pay for my racing career to get going. Wow. So I was reading where you and your sister were sort of racing go carts and things like that. But then

your sister went a different path. Is there a reason why she went in a different path or was it because you were so much better and so much more driven, or she just didn't care and you you were like autio mind in love with racing. She didn't like getting bumped around. I know that. She was like she was getting driven over and like literally driven over. Yeah, she just didn't like that. She didn't like that roughness of it.

But then there there, I was on the other side of things like taking people out and you know, so I was totally fine with it, but she just didn't like it. She's got a little bit more of a mama's side to her. So she has three kids now. She went into she got her PhD in physical therapy, so she and she works in pediatrics. So tell me why England is a place that trains formula style race

How why England? Why not? Like Arizona racing is just really popular in Europe and England, you know, like F one's really big over there, and they can drive all year long pretty much too, because it doesn't really snow over there, so that's part of it. But really I guess it ends up boiling down to when I was fourteen, I went to the Indie five Dred and I went to this suite of this you know, wealthy guy and

in the suite was a guy who was British. And I sat at the bar drinking my kitty cocktail and asking lots of questions about racing, and I guess I asked all the right ones. I remember he said I could learn more in England in one year, then five years in America. Like I just remember that, and I

was like wow. So anyway, fast forward two years, so when I'm sixteen years old and this family, the guy that I spoke to that was British worked with this family that owned the suite, and they said, we've been following your career for the last couple of years and we'd really like to sit down and talk to you. And so my dad and I almost didn't go to this meeting because we lived in northern Illinois. They wanted

us to come down to Indianapolis. It was during May, during and we almost didn't go, and we decided to go, and it was like one of those crappy, rainy days, and anyway, I alos ended up doing the right thing. So we went down had this meeting and they said we want to take it England. That was May of that year, and then by that fall, like that winter, I went to England for a month or two. I did a race out there, like a Winter Series race

they called it. Anyway, that led to moving back there again at the very beginning of the year for the full season. And so how old were you? It was that lonely? I mean, what was that like? So I really didn't go past junie. I didn't really barely go to junior year. Yeah, I was there for the first month, gone for two months, and then back for the last month before winter break, and then after winter break I

never went back. I got my g e D. Actually graduated before my my friends did, because I took my g e D, which I failed the first time. My goodness, don't tell anyone that. Well, you just did. I did, and it was I failed in the constitution the Constitution test. Yeah, I don't get it. It's all a bunch of the same words. It's probably why I still don't pay attention to that stuff. So I had to take it again to pass the constitution test, which I think I barely passed.

I only had to get half right in the first place, and I didn't get that right the first time. And I'm pretty sure I just slithered on through the second time. But yeah, I mean I went over there when I was sixteen years old, and I lived with a couple of girls, and I slept on the couch underneath stairs, you know, sort of that whole sort of like struggling artists.

But I was a race car driver. For our second course, I had to ask Annaka all about what it takes to become a top performer in her field of racing. So what kind of work is it to learn how to drive a car at that speed? I mean, what's the homework is there? Like, Okay, here's the practical. You're gonna go out here and spend six hours doing hairpoint turns. But when you're home, you need to know aery dynamics. You need to know engine. I don't know whatever. I

don't either know use a engine whatever. I'm like, I don't know whatever is either, So what it is? How do you practice? I mean it sounds like a stupid question, but how do you practice driving at that level? I mean you go out to a track and you just make laps? You know, it's so expensive and compared to so many other sports. You need tires and fuel and engines and cars and then and who's paying for all this? I mean this family that met with me, they paid for a lot of it. My parents paid for a

little bit. I mean they paid for my living, which you know, they paid for a little bit of the racing at the end, because you know, I got in some trouble and so the management people the family didn't want to help me anymore. So you've got in some trouble I did. Yeah, the word had gotten out that I was out too much and partying and having too much fun. You know, was I out and having fun at seventeen eighteen years old? Yeah? Was I having more fun than anyone else? No? Was having less fun than

everyone else? Probably, but it didn't matter. This is the whole thing about not giving anyone a reason, Like, no matter what phase of your life or no matter what it is that you're doing, is not giving anyone a reason. And you know there was a reason, so you know whether or not it was like how they truly felt, and if they didn't want they didn't want to be a part like they believed that and didn't want to be a part of it, or if they just look, we're looking for an exit. Either way, well that you

must you must have done extra ordinary for them. I mean they saw something in you. What do you think it was? I mean, was it you're a talent or you're just like so ambitious and so driven, no pun intended. I did really well in go karting especially, and you know, and I'm a girl, so you know, when you're doing really well and then you're also unique, that's pretty cool for someone who's looking for something unique to be a part of. So the family was loved, loved racing, and

was into racing. So yeah, so what what car did you When you first got there, they say, okay, this is you're you're gonna start driving X and then you're gonna graduate. You know, it's like a horse, you start small and you get up to thorbirds. How do they teach you how to do that? And what did you start with? So I started with go carts and then from there I went to formula cars. But the formula

cars that I drove were without wings. The wings push you into the ground aerodynamically, So I did that for a couple of years and then after that you would go into winged cars. And then at that point when I got into that level of driving, I was back in the States by that point, and then I came back to the States and I did a couple of different kinds of cars over here, and then I went to IndyCar. So formula what does that mean when you

say formula? Good question. I guess it just implies open wheel. Open wheel just literally means that the wheels are exposed and open, and a stock car has like it looks like a sedan, it looks like closed you can't see the tires. Is that cooler or is it? Is it harder to drive a formula car than a stock car?

Or of course it's cooler, but they look so much different. Look, it's probably a little harder to drive an open wheel car because the potentiality of an open wheel car is so high because they have down force, so it's beyond your sort of fathom ability of what it can do. And also the faster you go, the more the wings are working some degree. So I'd say it's probably Indie

cars are harder. They also didn't have power steering. Now I'd say, like racing a stock car, me I mean, there's there's parts about stock car racing that are harder than an Indy car. But I'd say just drive wise, indy cars harder, Who is the I mean, I have like four chefs that I look up to, who like your gods, Like these are my three gods that I copy every move or I want to copy every move, or I wish I could copy every move, or I

just want that I always wanted to be. I always say I want to be the first meet, not the next somebody else. So I didn't have anyone that I wanted to be like really or like role model or an idol, I mean one of them. Funny story, I really thought that Jacques Villeneuve was like a really great driver. He raced indie cars, did really well it like second his first year, and won the next year at the in and then he went to F one and one and f one and I just thought, wow, that's so

cool that someone can do that. And so he really was the only one that I kind of used as a benchmark of being like someone I thought was really amazing. So fast forward to two thousand and twelve and I'm racing in the step right below cup our stock cars.

So we were racing in road American in Wisconsin, and there's probably I think there's were on the last lap and I'm running fourth and he's fifth, and come down this really long straightaway to a hard breaking zone downhill and he just punts me off the track and crashes me. And so anyway, I finished the race, and obviously I lost a lot of positions, and but he he looks like the bad guy right Like everybody afterwards is like, what a dick? You know, I can't believe you'd do that?

How you know? He totally took you out? And I thought, how cool is it actually if I could create any scenario to look good like, look like the cool, good, responsible, respectful good driver compared to the only person that I ever really looked up to. The next time that we raced against each other was in Montreal, and in Montreal

we qualified inevitably right next to each other. And you have to do a ride around on the track to wave to the fans before you start the race, and we have to ride on this truck together and like waved the fans. Not much was said, what are you most proud of as far as your thirteen year career? Would tell me? Like, I know there's many moments, but you're saying yourself, I made a difference, and this is what I'm most proud of, and this is how I

want to be thought of. I mean, I think the statistic that I feel most proud of is of the small amount of drivers that have led both the Indie I think maybe it's it's under fifteen and I like that because it's also a generalist sort of title that's that's really cool. And of course having one an Indy car was awesome. I really wanted to win a NASCAR but but didn't, and so that that, as far as

an accomplishment goes, feels like the best. But but then from a more broad, sweeping, overall perspective, I'd say it's showing people that you can do anything. From the last couple of years of my career into the things that I transitioned into, it was all about how do I know inspire Like I have this platform, I want to use it as long as I can, or or I really just felt like I have a responsibility to use it.

And then when I retired, all of my businesses are rooted in and somehow inspiring people to whether it's be healthier or you know, how to be happier, how to be self reflective, how to be more present that's kind of the purpose of all of the companies that I have now after racing is to inspire for our third course. Danek and I talked all things wine. Danek has been developing and vine from the ground up and Napper Valley for more than ten years. The result is Somnium, her

delicious and renowned wine brand. You're now renowned wine, you're owner, you have your own wine. We're gonna talk about Somnium and how Mountain is one of the greatest wine producing areas in the world. I mean, it's spectacular. So, I mean, of all the things that you went from, you did why wine well, I mean people ask why I make wine. I'm like, well, I like to drink it. I mean,

it's really that simple. But when I went to Nappa Valley in two thousand and six and had this idea to have a winery, it was really just sort of the romance of the environment. It was you know, the people, the stories, and until you really do like a private wine tasting and hear how it goes, you don't understand what goes into that vintage. You don't understand what happened weatherwise, what what had to be done, how like quick on your feet. You have to be whether it be you know, watering,

making changes, how much fruit to drop. Shoot. I mean, of course, then there's the beginning, which is picking the varietals, picking clones, picking the rootstock, which is not my job. But then after that with the farmers and the winemaker and you know, into what day exactly to pick and looking at the weather and seeing if there's rain coming.

Are you going to tough it out and brave it out and get through the next wave of rain to like hopefully let the fruit hang a little longer on the vine before you pick it, or do you play it safe and get it off. So, I mean, there's just so much that goes into it. And then of course there's like the really meticulous process of of the

of the making of the wine after that. I mean, you know, I've gone to some wineries where they're like they're barreling stuff that's come into the winery in separate barrels based on the time that it came in, not even just the block, like the block is broken down at times because like everything matters, and so you know, there's so many levels of like find you know, being more and more and more detailed and high end with your pro cests that can be done, and so it

really makes you value the wine so much more. So. One of the things that's really important with wine making is that there's a story, because there's a lot of great wine out there, and even if there isn't great wine, people don't always know the difference. In fact, most people don't know the difference. So what are you gonna do to sell your wine? That's going to set it apart? And you have to have a story. And I was like, well,

that's the easy part. Like the easy part is you know how much I love wine, and I've traveled lots of wine regions all over the world. I've done wine tastings in South Africa and Australia and New Zealand obviously the States, and you know, I love taking trips for that. So I've got a few more on the list, Like obviously, now that I'm done racing, I want to get to Italy and France because I never want to go in the winter and I was always working in the summer.

So but then of course Argentina and Chile. I have lots of trips still on the docket, but I just truly have a passion for it. I love it. I love the romance of it, of the process and hearing the stories and it's great. What do you grow? What are you growing pinot? Are you growing cab franc? What is it? I grow mostly Cabernet, a little bit of cab fronc, and a little bit of petite or dough Wow, so that those three only only red yep, yep. So

I make two different reds on property. One is the full fully all estate grapes, and then there's another one that we came out with a year and a half ago. It has a red label on it. It's still a cab but it's the red label Insomnium. And that one is it's still about like a state wine, so it's still very high estate wine. But we purchased just a little bit of merlot to blend into it, to make it a little bit softer and more approachable. And that's the first one that we brought in at a lower

price point from a red perspective. There's still plans to sort of on special years, take the cab fronc block and make just a barrel out of that and and make that a really, really higher price point, like exclusive offering. And then we make rose, so we sanna that. So we bleed off from the Cabernet grapes and make the rose, and then we have a seveniel Blanc and so we purchased grapes for the sevenion blanc just got bottled. I just had some just the other day. It was great. Yeah,

it's really good. You know, I would love sevenel blanc. I love white. I mean, White's such an social, such an easy drink and goes with so much food. And then I also launched a French rose last year, so that one's called Danika Rose. So it's funny people think that I've I've like just started making wine. I'm like, no, it's it's been a long time, which is what helped lead into this Danika Rose project. It's just there's some partners in this and they ended up saying we'd like

to name it Danica and I said, okay. So that's grown and made in Provence, France, So that's really fun. Where do you buy this whine? Do you do online only or is it just local? Mostly with Ssomniamt's online at samnia and wine dot com. Um we have in

a few restaurants in places here and there. But it's honestly, we it's such a high, it's so high and made that and we make so little that I just don't like taking a hit, to be honest of like chopping the price of wine in half because it's so expensive to make per bottle because I don't have economies of scale on my side that it's like you almost make no money when I go wholesale with it. So I like to get it out to people and have it

accessible in places. That's nice. I think it's kind of almost a form of advertising, but definitely not smart business. So the direct to consumer side of Sosomnium is where I wanted to reside. Yeah, it's I mean, it's just people understand that you it's a it's a sea of red for the first four or five years and we own something. It's just this nothing's producing and it's just you're just paying bills and burning cash. Basically, it's really

hard business. It's like restaurants. You just it's very tough to get to a break even where you feel like, Okay, I can forward the people I have around me. I agree the Dannika Rose will be much more distributed. That's going to be much more mass produced and distributed. So that's already. I mean, my friends send me messages when they're like showing me, send me a picture of it in their store, grocery store, So that has a bunch of much bigger reach. But Zomnium is much more boutique

and small. I'm going to go look for some Danika Rose the next time I go. Really good. You know in Florida. It's great about Florida as they sell booze and food right next to each other. For our fourth and final course, I couldn't let Danika go without talking food and fitness. Danica takes her nutrition very seriously and brings a scientific mindset to finding the perfect diet to

fuel herself for top performance. Let's talk fitness. Your book pretty intense, is pretty tense, My executive assistant said, I'm just telling you I do her workouts in there. Insane. I'm like, okay, good to know. Let's talk about food. I mean, you're drinking wine, which is food, and you're eating, So tell me your day and how you balance. There's no such word, its balance doesn't exist. But tell me, like, how you like to eat so you feel at least

like you're ahead of the game. I've been goofing around a little bit with trying to intermitt and fast, and I'm just just garbage at it. It's like I can kind of do it here and there, but it is

not my not my jam. So I've been trying to learn more about that because I've also read that women and men are different from that perspective, and you know, sometimes it can have the opposite effect that you desire, which is always essentially like hell, be healthy, but then also you know, achieve whatever physiological goals you have and have lean muscle mass, and so I don't know, I don't know. I just don't like being hungry really, and I never really eat too much at one meal. I

try not to. I try and kind of push on the oding on vegetables, but I eat a paleo diet. In the morning, I'll eat things like I do I cook ground up bison, and I'll do like ground bison, spinach, maybe some tomatoes or avocado. My favorite breakfast is I take sweet potato and I just put it on the cheese grater and then I take that and put it in the pan to make like hash browns, but it's beyond hash browns. It's really just dried up crispy potatoes. And so I just dry the crap out of them.

And I love to have my bison and spinach with super dried up sweet potato. And then you gotta be patient though, and then avocado, and I take the avocado and I smash it into the super crunchy, crispy, uh sweet potato, and then I eat it and it's crunchy and creamy. It's a dense, sophisticated carbohydrate as well as what you get in the right card. So, so did you do do you do b M? I eat taking b M I, and you know, you strictly know what how many calories you just do? You just go for it.

I've tracked before. It takes like a few days of tracking, and I'm I'm totally cool with like the same meals. So you know what the crappiest thing is is like when you're trying to hit a macro number, is it's

less than you think. Like That's really what I try and tell myself when it comes to like eating is I'm like, if I'm trying to like lean out or anything, I'm like, Okay, it's less than you think, right, and you gotta you gotta leave room for wine because you know you need at least three calories in there for wine somewhere, because you're gonna have a glass of wine. That's right. It's a trade off. I mean that those calories go, but I mean I eat that for breakfast,

and then I eat lots of vegetables. I also another kind of breakfast. I'll do like a table swing of cheese seeds and I'll put that in a in a little little pan with some water and just they'll plump up really quick. And then I just put a scoop of plant protein with that, mix it up, and I throw in some adaptations too, because I like taking adaptations. And then I maybe top at with some nuts or a little bit of some berries, kind of like oatmeal, but paleo version. I eat lots of vegetables. I eat

lots of fish. And I've gotten I've spun around so many times on whether or not the vegan route, the you know, animal do we really need it? Is there to crop crap? You know, like did your body do you already get enough of it from plants? And at the end of the day I have finally landed on that I need it. It makes me feel better and I do enjoy I mean, I feel best on higher fat animal protein. But it's really comes down to quality.

So I was just saying the other day, I want to find somewhere where I can I know that I'm getting like the highest quality animal proteins possible, you know, sustainable and all that's fine, but I think that's kind of built in once you find the highest quality because it's not going to be farmed. And I know there are some farmed fish and things like that that are you know, still pretty decent. You know, I've even heard there's place is that have animals that are like sharpshooter,

like they literally are like eating grass. And then that's it. Anyway, I think the quality and then also I try and not eat animal fat at like every meal. Well you're describing is pretty much Grandma living in Italy would feed her. You know, they don't have a lot of money, so they don't have a lot of protein, so you have

a lot of vegetables. There would be pasta, but it would be pure so it wouldn't have all the the nasty stuff in it and you would eat fish and things available in season because that's what it would be cheaper. So it sounds like your paleo diet is basically a normal human diet with a lot of common sense. A lot of common sense, and like you have knowledge of food, but it's not like you need to have knowledge eating grilled piece of fish, it's like it's just great. It

tastes good and feel better. So I definitely agree with you. When I eat a great piece of fish or like a grass fed steak, I feel fantastic and it's fun and I feel like I'm doing something good for myself. Yeah, I've been saying, like if I had to kill animals to eat them, I'm not sure I could. So I understand the dichotomy I'm in, but I also know how

I feel when I have certain things. So I also don't want to go like build my fridge, but I use that too, right, So you know, I mean there's lots of stuff that we have that we wouldn't necessarily know how or be able to do on our own. So some people just it's just in their wheelhouse and they're comfortable with with that stuff, so I'll let them do it and I'll try and choose the best products possible. You know, all the big farming animal farming with you know,

mass production of it's not good. It's not good at all. I think we could all still have the ability to consume animal protein in a far more ethical We could still have plenty to go around without the system being in that way. So I eat probably the same as you. I'm not so careful as you are. You know, I'm blessed that that's what I do for a living. So for me to like whip something up is very easy.

But I try to keep as paleo as possible. But let's be real, A beautiful fresh contactically to tell with the white truffles once in a while, you know, four into grams of that at lunch. I try to eat at lunch versus dinner, so I try to like, I don't eat late. I drink half of what I used to drink, and I still drink too much. So I mean as chefs, so you know, we we we don't say no to anything. It's one of the things I tell people every day. The most important thing is portion control.

If you ate the just the right amount of portion, you wouldn't have the issues you have. I eat everything in the under the sun. I just don't eat a lot of it. But I think that that's what the lesson needs to be taught. But I think people are coming around because a lot of information now that you can't ignore, and there's a lot of fitness information now.

You cannot ignore fitness. It's everywhere. It's coming on strong, and I'm very very hopeful that we're going to be able to be fit and lead lifestyles that makes some sense. And it's all about going almost backwards to what you know, your grandmother and your in laws and your relatives long ago used to eat. They could not eat giant portions because they were not They couldn't afford sirloin, you know they had They may do with what they had, but

it was also less portions. The portions were like normal portions. Yeah, and your body gets used to it, just like when you eat a bigger meal than you normally eat and you're like, oh my god, I'm stuffed. When you eat a smaller meal than you're used to, you feel hungry, but you orient to whichever one you didn't tend to do the most. And so I totally agree it's you know, you you have to have enough self respect, and I

don't know. I also think this goes into more of an emotional and psychological layer where when you treat yourself while you also start treating people around you better too, because it's just how you How you feel about yourself is how you feel about others, and so, you know, it's like a perpetuating problem. You can see it in families when someone you know a parent, you can see they don't take care of themselves. They also don't take care of the child. You know, like it's medicine. Food

is medicine. I truly believe that. And you know when you look at how it affects everything from you know, your cognitive abilities, to your energy levels, hormones, blood sugar, all of that stuff, and then overall just the way you feel. Because look, when you eat something that is dense and not nutritious, which, by the way, when you're hungry, you kind of want nutrients and you don't really realize it,

but you're looking for it. So when you eat something that's not nutrient dense, you have to eat a lot of it because you're not really being satiated. You then also have the spiral effect of now you've ate poorly, and you also don't want to do something because you feel bad. It's just awful. Yeah. Yeah, I'm so grateful that you're such a healthy chef. I think that's such you're setting such a good example that it's possible because

they think that also. I mean, there's a lot of chefs out there, and I think that, you know, even if we're just talking about those folks, like you're geting a really good example for them, because it would be easy to make the excuse and just say I'm a chef, like what am I supposed to do? But I think you set a really good role. You're a really good role model for how to do it and then also how to take care of yourself outside of the kitchen. Well,

thank you for that. I really, I really appreciate that, and I appreciate the time you've given to me today. And I hope you're gonna go and have a nice dinner with a glass of wine because you deserve it. You've had a very very nice chat. I really appreciate your spending time with me. I love talking to you. You're like we're such homies in the like food and fitness sort of World of Things. So thank you for asking me to come on. I always love talking to you.

Thank you so much. Have a great day, all right you too, alright fabulous, Thanks, thank you, thanks very much for listening to Four Courses with Jeffreys and Carrion, a production of I Heart Radio and Corner Table Entertainment. Four Courses is created by Jeffrey Carrion, Margaret Scarrion, Jared Keller, and Tara Helper. Our executive producer is Christopher Hasiotis. Four Courses is produced by Jonathan Haws Dressler. Our research is

conducted by Jesselyn Shields. This episode was engineered by Molly Swanson and edited and mixed by Joe Tisdall. Our talent booking is by Pamela Bauer at Dogtown Talent. For more podcasts from My Heart Radio, please visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,