Welcome to First things First, I'm Blett in my pronounce a.
She my Maddie Mills, and my pronouns are he and him. And before we get started, we'd like to acknowledge the custodians of the land of which we record.
And today we are both in studio and we're in Roderi Country, part of the Pools Nation. Maddie, how don't feel like to be a mum?
It's cold, It's.
Always okay, So I feel a bit lighter today the last week, do you. I don't tell him my secret meadow mus metamucal we actually get that fiber intake. No, I'm feeling lighter, not for any particular reason other than I have cried a fuck load in the last couple of days. I've just finished my it's called SFA, which is a voice assessment. It's about finding your voice, which is amazing and it has been really like useful and helpful throughout you know, acting.
But that I didn't know.
Triggered No, well fuck them, I'm here bound my boys and it's here. But it made me think. And I'm not saying this in any disrespect to my teacher or my class or what we've achieved because it was the most amazing experience doing this this course. It was liberating, Like imagine, you know, singing in front of your class, or if you've never had the confidence to sing out loud or sing in front of people, getting the confidence or the ability to do that, and I think, so.
You did that on your Instagram. It was a great reaction.
Well thanks, But I've been starting to play with the idea of singing to an audience because if I can't even do that, I won't be able to perform, you know, So I've just got to do the thing. There's a whole thing about doing the thing. But it actually reminded me when I'm pulling myself out of it, how sucked in you get to environments and how much you're in it that it can seem a bit culty.
It's not.
My class is not a cult. But it had me thinking about different because I feel like, you know, we call it industries, institutions or institutions, yes, but how many there are out there that we don't know about that you're just so consumed by.
Environment that happens in institutions a lot like whether it's universities when you're you know, studying. You're so laser focused on this and committed to being a part of this. You drink the kool aid and you're a part of this like environment exactly. So I remember when I first got to Perth and I went to acting school. When I got to the institution, it was like nothing outside
of that bubble matted. You were creative the whole time, and when you weren't creative, you were you know, surrounded by your acting friends or your your classmates, and everyone spoke about the craft. So it does become a bit like overwhelming and a little bit culty because that's the that's the topic, that's the interest. And when you're speaking outside of that, I think that like it almost feels
foreign when you're in the environment. This happened with me and Basloman, So okay, I'm not saying that it was a cult, but when I was about.
Working for him is an environment in itself.
When we were film industry, that's right. When we're working on Elvis, we purely spoke about the film, and at times when we were eating and we were having a break in production, he would say, let's gossip, which meant that let's talk about something other than the film.
And so, but why is a gossip when it's just not.
It wasn't gossipled or it was political, but that was his terminology. You know, it was political stuff. It was like talking about what was happening in the current political climate. It was you know, the pop news that was happening in the media. But then you know, I understand why that's needed in those environments, otherwise people get distracted.
Well, it's project based, right, so most of you know, these institutions or I guess industries are led by you know, getting a project done. So like I guess, like the batch thorreat like you're in an environment you know, it's not a cult.
That's getting cold.
Well, to be fair, like that's all you're consumed.
By, like weeks of living in the same house and the same people doing the.
Same thing, and no wonder you get so you know, your rose colored glasses on because no, but quite literally and metaphorically as well, like you are so consumed by it. So I can understand how cults work in a sense because I've never been to a level of being a part of one, but I can imagine how easy it would be to get sucked into one.
Wouldn't it be fun to go under cover into.
It, right?
Would you do that?
I reckon, I would, I would, And I reckon I'm pretty like I'm easily persuaded in a way that i can pull myself out of it.
I sure, but I definitely think that you have the tendencies of being taken into a cult.
What are you saying to what you said, I just think.
That you're easily persuaded. You'd be thinking, you know, you would try and find the best in the environment and the opportunity, and you'll be like, you know, making you you would think.
That everyone has is that my red flag?
Like my people have good intentions?
Yeah, but I do believe I've been brought up to believe that everyone has good intentions.
Like obviously true.
I know that's what I'm slowly learning. But let my heart be my heart.
Okay, that's why you're going to be poured into a cult because you're just like, let me be I'm like, jump the fences.
No, my heart is big, it's raw sensity.
And you're the perfect candidate for.
Them to know I'm vulnerable. I'm gad get it.
But if it was a cult and you were you know, sucked into one. What do you think it would be.
Well, I feel like I'm already semi part of a acting cult because all I want to do is hang out with my acting friends and people in the industry and like my people. But also at the same time, maybe it's not really cult. It's just like feeling inspired and creative and all I want to do is hang out with great people. It's how you word things.
Well, that's what I heard when I watched the doco on Netflix from the Tit Top Dances the seven M doco.
Right, have you been dancing on TikTok?
Slately, girl, I'm a part of it. Look yeah, look I say, I'm gullible. Everyone has a price twenty dollars. Sound that absolutely give me the money. I was emoji, I'm there. The docar these you know, TikTok Christian dancers are a part of this seven M management company that have basically got them on board, created these blind faith within them that their money and their things that they're earning and the content they're creating is all going to
the greater good. Yet they're being sucked dry by the management and the guy who runs the church to the point where the content is have lost contact with their family. Their family don't even have access to them to communicate with them. And one of them is a twin sister who was brought up with her sister, danced on TikTok
and they had such an incredible relationship. This girl goes off to La becomes a part of this cult and loses all emotional connection and there's not in touch with her family, and the family go there and try and track it down and you know, get to the bottom of it. But that's a fucked up cult because they're using religion as the base.
Yeah, you know, which we that's kind of how we know about cults, right also on the religious base, yeah, you know, conversion and Christianity.
This is people weaponizing religion and Christianity.
I watched it, and the thing I find interesting, not the funny thing, is that the main girl that it's about, who's separated from her twin sister, she's just still doing
her normal life. And imagine, like this whole documentary is about you, and I don't know, like there hasn't really been a response from the Like she came out and said her family were wrong, and like none of what they're saying is true, Like, yeah, she did probably like disclose that, but it's like, what do you want to believe a documentary or like an Instagram story.
Well, the thing is she has absolutely been you know, brainwashed by the guy who leads I think his name is Robert Chakaina and.
That's the church.
The church, yeah, and.
The guy's name is Robert Robert Shin or something. Yeah.
But then they did dis and digging and they found that there was you know, other people before this girl who had experienced the exact same thing, and they left. Yeah they did.
Yeah, so they fully like unraveled whistle blower vibes.
Yeah, but how can you say that you go there, you have connection with your family and then you lose everyone excepting the tution that you're.
A part of isolating yourself.
So do you think that they realize that because it doesn't seem like they have any idea that that has.
Yeah, but like surely you would get to a point like I would think, like say, if I went and joined a cult now, like you guys would be like, Okay, that's bit odd that she's got no Like if you've just split off full communication with people, that you would see like every day or hang out with every day.
So yeah, but gods concerned, right, and you'd be probably trying to make me aware, of course, And I think surely you would have some like feeling or moral compass or something it's in you that's like this is this doesn't feel right? Yeah, or maybe again you're completely brainwashed and you're thinking, you know, you've got a higher value of what you want and what you want to achieve.
That's what they're giving you. So like if it's like someone was like, hey, like, if you work for me for ten years minimum and I'm going to give you this amount of money every year, would you do it?
Would I do it to the cost.
Of because maybe it's maybe.
It's been black man, I wouldn't.
It's so complex. That's the whole point of this is like it's cults are very complex.
I think the main thing about cults is that there's a psychological power that exactly that you don't have a control of. So you're you know, your you're brainwashed. You put into a position where you feel like whatever they say is right, whatever they say is the is the right way, even to the point where he said in the documentary, I remember him saying something about the fact that you need to cut off your family members, like
you don't need to have contact with them. If you want to be so spiritually connected and strengthened with God, you need to cut everyone else off except me. And this was his message from God.
It's like the Robert isn't God.
He thinks he doesn't he.
Yeah. See, that's that's where I have the issue. The issue it's like when people like this is a horror complex, yes, and when people blow up something and they're like, oh, well God made me do it. No, he fucking did it. No one makes you do anything you did that. I hate that whole God complex. Like I'm not really a religious base, but yeah, when someone says like, oh no, God made me do it, Like my dad is super religious, but he comes from a different place where he's like,
God makes me do all these good things. Well you know what I mean.
The mental teachings of Christianity, if we're going to use that as an example, is love right and not to be judgmental. Yet all I saw in this this documentary was Robert being judgmental everyone outside of that.
So it's like a power thing.
I want to ask, like if they you know, they realize they have that moment. Aham fucking a part of this institution. How do you get out? What do you do?
Run away?
Run away? But then the psychological damage true?
They yep.
I mean it's a good lawsuit. You could get some money, you could sue the institution.
I don't know what I would do in that situation, Like I don't know. Like I've also been a part of where in my life. When I was about eighteen, I looked to God or I looked to church to find some community and find some stability, which you know I could have been easily. I guess what did you take it down that environment? I just I didn't have many I didn't have much support. I was very isolated myself, and I didn't choose that that was just that suddening
just happened. So I was looking for support, and I was looking for stability, and I was looking for encouragement. And I got that to a certain degree in a level. But then I went and found it myself in other avenues because I looked to other avenues and I didn't rely heavily on like Christianity churches and God giving me that there was it was start and an exploration, but it wasn't my conclusion and my solution.
Yeah, totally. I think that what people seek within the church is you know, probably something that we get from our community anyway. Exactly. Yeah, I think that like black follows, I must say that, you know, I believe in God. I believe that there is a connection between me and a high power. I don't know what that looks like. I don't know in what form that that is, but for me, I definitely feel a connection to a divine being.
I don't know what. I don't know. If it's my ancestors, I don't know, if it's the people have come before me, if it's God, if it's I don't know, is it fucking one of the teletubbies. Who knows? But I feel it, and so it's it is a bit of a you know, faith based for that.
Yeah, and you can you have control over how you pick and choose how that relationship.
But I'm not blind, exactly, I'm not. I don't have blind trust or blind faith. Why does the church always come down to money as well?
That's what I concerned there. Yes, and if we look at also like historically the damage that institutions per se have had on people and that type of environment. It is a bit like not similar, but there is sort of a partly like a similarity to a Guess mission and stolen generation.
Well, speaking of that, let's have a look at this little case study. So the Family Cult is one of Australia's most popular and well known.
Cult that was here in Melbourne.
It was, Yeah, it was the notorious Dooms. They cult operated just outside Melbourne between nineteen sixty three and nineteen eighty nine. It was led by Anne Hamilton Byrne, who claimed she was the female reincarnation of Jesus Christ.
Yeah.
The two to collect kids and raise them on her own property and keep them away from the apocalypse. The members were brainwashed the kids. Their hair was dyed blonde and.
They're trying to make them the same, giving a similar.
It's getting assimilation in the stolen gin.
Right, and these are white people. This is in Melbourne. This is what year did you say?
It was in nineteen sixty three to nineteen eighty nine.
That's insane, So up to the nineteen eighties.
It's interesting that I was in Melbourne. This sounds like the Family from mulummimbi, you know, one of those hippie families.
What it's giving. Yeah, it feels like that, but that's a very like trying to twenty.
Eight kids were taken and raised identically.
So when people get outraged about that, why are they not outraged about the Stolen Generation?
Well, exactly, I mean because.
That happened in nineteen eighty and I'm sure there was probably protests or people angry about that situation where kids were taken not Aboriginal kids, but non Aboriginal and to austral Under kids.
But I wonder how many of these kids could have been Aboriginal as well.
Exactly. True, that is a study there, but this doesn't seem too different to what's happening in institutions like the Department of Child Protection, which is still taking kids to this day. And my sister is living proof of that, like as soon as she gave birth to her child, he was taken Adam. You know, like we talked about kinship on other episodes of how important it is to keep kids with family, like they've proven it. They're making it so difficult to remain contact with him, you know,
it's so frustrating. But anyways, like going back to I guess cults and the similarities of you know, between institutions and cults as well, Like.
It's at least you're getting something out of an institution, you know, a diploma, when.
You're what are you getting psychological distress from a cult?
But it's because it needs a focus. I suppose, you know, cults there's outside of an institution or like a university course, there's no real personal gain.
Like niche cults are out there other than the ones we're spoken about. If any black fellow cults, well, you know what it would you about the Black theater That would be kind of similar. Not not a cult, but like.
You know, what about the sovereign Black movement? Like you know, like not a cult, but like.
Even given those vibes, you know, maybe maybe I'll start a cult.
What would your cult be?
The crying club let your feelings out? Nah, I don't.
Laugh, you'll cry exactly. Don't cry your fart.
You don't let it out? Oh it will let out anyways.
That note on that note.
Yeah, this is no This has been a very interesting conversation. I think there's so many complexities to it. I think there would be some really niche cults like I feel like it's like I don't know, there'd be a cult like we only drink almond milk cult, or like the matcha cult. Yes, a part of that is the head of that one let me let me or.
The health and wellness girls.
Yeah, I'd easily be a part of a health and wellness cult for sure. Like sign me up.
You just have to slow your voice down and talk.
Talk and take teap breaths in on three one two three. Well that's all we have time today.
I'm so happy I joined your cult.
Thanks so much for listening to first things first, as always, if we've made you laugh today or we've made you cry, happy, fun, whatever you want, leave us a rating and a little review, and.
If you want to tell us anything, join our cult.
I'll reach out by our socials, which is also a cult. My hand was like Brooke doup Bton. Maddie's head was that it's Maddie Meals and we'll see you in the next episode. Bye bye. Can't somebody
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