Thanks A Lot

That's the eighties are overflowing with extravagance and excess power suits, mcmansion's and Wall Street brokers, with slick back hair and cell phones the size of a dictionary. I want you to sit back in your chairs for this next song, and all of you close your eyes and you can just hear my voice singing this song for you. I'll wait till all of you are ready. And Raffie, he's in his thirties. He's become the sought after children's musician Thanks so Long. His first three albums were huge hits.

He has a national distribution deal his own record label, and he's packing out concert halls thanks for the clouds. So he's making real money. He buys a comfortable house with a big yard for his dog bundles fancy restaurants and fine wine become part of his daily life. Raffie has it all. Thanks so Lord, ands for all, Thanks for all come. So why does he feel like something's missing?

I'm Chris Garcia and this is Finding Raffie, a ten part series from My Heart Radio and Fatherly in partnership with Rococo Punch about the life, philosophy, and the work of Raffie, the man behind the music. I was brought to a place of wonderment. I mean I had everything I've ever wanted in life, including being married to the the cheerleader from Arrival High School. I had a successful career now. Ralphie wrote Thanks a Lot in ninety at a time when he and his wife deb were literally

living the dream. And listening to the song, you can hear so many emotions. Rafie is reflective and vulnerable, maybe even a little sad. I didn't want to just keep doing more of the same, because I'm not that kind of person. I'm not a well, let's do more of the same now. I'm not like that. I'm a person who grows with experience and then wonders what's next. So I remember in meditation, praying to the divine saying, You've given me everything I've ever wanted. What can I do

for you? How might I proceed in a way that feels like service? I remember that moment and then, as if in an answer, I was guided towards writing a little song about a wee white whale on the goal and all the goodness that came from that song and that album, And I still listen to that album on

occasion I'm blown away, how beautiful. I'd like to sing, Davy bluego with you, hump bam ba ba ba ba ba ba baaa, Baby Baluga in the deep blue sea, you swim so wild, and you swim so free heaven above and see below, and a little white whale along the gold, Baby Blue got Oh, Baby Baluga is the water. Baby Belugat was an overnight sensation. It's still one of Raphae's most famous songs. He wrote it as a tribute to Cavna, a beluga whale he'd seen at the Vancouver

Public Aquarium. I remember doing a my first cross Canada promotion tour of an album. Was was for Baby Blue Gut. I remember being in Edmonton, Alberta uh and I had eight interviews and one day that was whoa. That was a lot. So I have sensed that there was something special, but you couldn't know until the years passed how big it was going to be. You couldn't imagine. Then you curl up, snug in your water, b the moon is shine.

That song fast forwarded Raffie stardom. It connected with parents and their kids, an audience who was craving really good music. Suddenly everyone wanted a piece of Raffie, and advertisers wanted a piece of his fans and a little white way along the gold. You're just a little white way along the gold. Ralphie says. He was asked to play some famous venues, places like Madison Square Garden. It was a

sign he'd hit the big time. But rather than join the likes of Bruce Springsteen and the Rolling Stones, Ralphie said no because the audience would be full of very very young children in a very huge environment, not the best environment for them, let alone me as a performer trying to reach them. Rapie couldn't stomach the fact that his face would be projected on massive screens just so

kids sitting in the nosebleeds could catch a glimpse of him. Well, I'm talking about a musical performance in a hockey rink in front of twenty people. Come on, I guess who was like, it's not my idea of a good time. Yeah, especially I feel like with a crowd that young, it might be it might be difficult for everyone. That's exactly. And Chris, it's not even a concert hall. I don't even have a good acoustics. Come on, you know everything about it would be a challenge. Why would I throw

myself into that? To me, my music for children and families has always been about the music, about the feelings, qualities and the songs that play in the minds and hearts of the very young. Raphie always put his fans first, and as his audience grew, he found that he needed to protect them even more. This is the rugged New g I Joe Adventure Team, Dane Joy Danger, Hide the Way Out. Here comes a Mathematics the Car with a Brain. Now make a much night? No. I remember they used

to be television shows on Saturday morning for kids. They're often cartoon shows or other you know, and often you couldn't tell the commercial from the show itself. Highly exploitative of the young child who is not old enough to know the pitch aimed at their innocent minds. The primary goal of advertising and marketing is to train kids to become consumers. Basically, the corporate world discovered children as not just a viable market, but a really big market. Susan

Lynn knows all about this. She teaches psychiatry at Harvard Medical School, and she spent her career researching the harmful effects marketing has on kids. Marketing to children is a factor in so many of the problems facing children today, childhood obesity, eating disorders for coach, sexuality, youth violence, family stress. Susan says children have always been marketed to through their televisions, but before the eighties, there were federal guidelines prohibiting how

kids were targeted with ads. They were considered too young to understand the difference between commercials and entertainment. But as Raphae was reaching peak success, that all changed. The GET administration deregulated children's television, and according to Susan, all hell broke loose and it became fine to create a program for the sole purpose of selling toys. So that just changed everything. That's how we got shows like g I. Joe and My Little pony half hour infomercials masquerading as

children's entertainment. Raphie had an audience of young kids, and

he couldn't stand marketing to them that way. When we think of a young child's impressionable mind, respecting that young child for the whole person that young children are, why would anyone who cares about this young audience, who treats them with respect, who holds them with respect for their dignity, Why would anyone seek to exploit their innocence, their naivete These were the beginning seeds of Ralphie would later call child honoring, a philosophy he would fully embrace years later.

He felt that kids should be respected as whole human beings and that they shouldn't be marketed to. You know, we who want to give young children our best in all our interactions, in all our capacities, are relationships with them. Our job is to do that with respect. It's just that simple. You would no longer exploit your own children from monetary gain than you what somebody else's. Isn't that right? In essence, the childhood years should be full of creativity

and exploration. Ralphie would later go on to author a book about this philosophy. It included a chapter written by Susan. This is gonna sound simplistic, but I believe the children are people, and they're not teeny tiny adults and little bodies. Their minds are growing and developing. They're deserving of dignity, and they're deserving of kindness. They're deserving of opportunities for self expression. And Raphi shares those beliefs, and consumerism ran

head on into those beliefs. Children are inundated, Our lives are intundated with commercials. We know that. But to try and take the most basic steps to minimize that exposure to commercial brands is a good thing. And we can all do it, especially those of us who are successful. Right, especially us, we're making enough money. If we don't say no, who will? I mean, really, all of us should. We shouldn't be in it for to to earn an income via exploitation. That is not okay, But soon Ralphie would

have to put his philosophy to work. Before him, children's music wasn't really seen as its own distinct genre. Ralphie felt like kids weren't taken seriously, and what passed for children's entertainment was just a bunch of noise. Children's entertainment in some circles used to be viewed as a magician who put on a magic show. And he would say, I'm going to count to three and you're gonna say aberca dabra, And he'd go one to three and then

people go abricadabra. He'd say louder, and then they'd say louder louder. Kind of said to myself, what the heck is that? I'm not doing that? You know? So, if I'm not doing that, what am I doing? Okay? I'm singing songs? Which songs? Am I singing songs that children can make their own that they can join me in? Ralphie stood out. His success put a spotlight on his young audience, new listeners who were hungry for good music, and advertisers were paying attention. As Ralphie's fame grew, he

held fast onto his values, even if there was a cost. Sure, I knew I was probably saying goodbye to millions of dollars of potential revenue, but so what, That's not what my music makings about. Rafie had a big Hollywood moment. His song Raining Like Magic was featured in the movie fern Gully, The Last Rainforest. It was an animated film starring Tim Curry and Robin Williams. The story is about a fairy who tries to save a rainforest from laggers. It was Raffi's first time singing in a film. The

movie spoke to Raffie. He thought anyone who saw the film would demand that rainforests be protected. It was a cause he'd grow to care about deeply. It felt like a no brainer. A few years later, Raffie says he got another call from Hollywood. This time the offer was more complicated. Dream Works, the powerhouse known for Shrek and Kung Fu Panda, had an idea. They wanted to make an animated movie about Baby Beluga, raff He's hit song. It was the kind of deal that would splash Raffie's

beloved whale on screens all over the world. It had the potential to turn him into an international star and make Raffie crazy rich. We asked two questions. Would the film be directly advertised two kids via fast food outlets in every other form of direct advertising? Well, the answer was yes. And would would there be a whole host of cheap plastic made characters from the show sold probably through fast food outlets. Again, yes, well, that's all we needed to hear. Turning down an offer of a Baby

Bluegot film from the makers of Shrek was easy. It took no time. But you said yes to the Fern Gully movie. How are those different? Well, only my song Reigning like Magic is in the Fern Gully movie. That's what I said yes to, So that's understandable. Um, the Baby Blue movie is entirely different in that that's that would be a film inspired by a song that I wrote.

And when I learned that the way the film would be marketed would be exploitative of young children and their families, I said no. Trying to understand what it means, um for you to exploit your audience for commercial gain, Like, what where is the line I don't do it for you? I don't. I don't do it. You don't do it never? How can you even ask that? Of course, I don't, I don't. I've never done it. I wasn't accusing you of it at all. Ever, you know, No, No, I don't,

I don't do it. I've never done it. I don't. That's not what I'm about. I can't and I will not participate in ventures that would do that. But you felt comfortable with providing a song to friend Gully that was okay, Well, yeah, why wouldn't it be, well you you wrote a great song for it. But and at the same time it was fern Gully was marketed directly to kids and had a pizza hut meal. Um, you know, no not. I wasn't aware of any of that at

the time. In fact, if you look at what year it was, I think you know that there wasn't even a conversation. So you know, if my understanding these things grew along the decades, then good for me. But no, no, those things weren't even discussed at the time. At the time, I was happy to be contributing a song to a film that was, you know, looking at the devastation of um forest ecologies and so on, and and if indeed it was marketed in ways that were not what I

would choose, I'm sorry about that. But I wasn't even aware of some of that at the time. Maybe it's hard to look back and have to dissect why you made the decisions you did, And I get it. I'm an entertainer. It's impossible to understand the ripple effects of every decision you make, and yet every decision you make is scrutinized by the public. But to the people around Raffie, he did live what he preached. Michael Kreeber is a

musician and composer and a longtime collaborator with Raffie. To you can say, it's integrity, you know, his message, what he believes in is what he does, and that's the best word for it. I can I can find he has integrity and he comes from a profound caring, you know, for kids and for the planet and the issues that are close to his heart. Psychologists Susan Lynn was also

paying attention to Raffie's decisions. Taking a stand against commercialism was actually it might have been in the best interests of his soul, but it wasn't in the best interest of his pocketbook. That's impressive to me. You know, he could have made a lot more money if he had, you know, done the Baby Bluga movie and commercialized it. There aren't a lot of artists who have done that. Raphie was trying to change the world by turning down

one movie or endorsement deal at a time. But it was kind of like David against Goliath because the advertising industry was busy teaching kids how to nag their parents more effectively. It's called pastor power. They found that it was helpful if kids had reasons why they wanted something, like one example they use is g Mom, I really want Barbie's dream house because Barbie and Ken want to

get married and raise the family. And then they identified persistence nagging, which is gimme, gimme, gimme, gim to give me. And one of an organization that worked around consumption did a study and found that there were ten and eleven year old kids who are nagging fifty times for one thing, and nagging is exhausting. All your parents listening right now, you know exactly what Susan is talking about. And Susan says, nagging effects how kids develop, undermining their critical thinking and

emotional stability. Starting a baby off when their brains are just beginning to make connections, and when we know that habits and behaviors can be formed in early childhood, and to start them off, turning to screens for stimulation and for soothing instead of learning how to self soothe or to turn to other people or or the the outside

world for a stimulation and for soothing. That works very well for the corporation, the toy industry, the media industry, and today the tech industry, but not so well for for babies and young children. It's the opposite of Raffi song, Thanks a lot, Thanks so long, Thanks for the sun and sky. That's a celebration of nature and the world

around us. It's about gratitude and wonderment. But Susan says, advertising not only interrupts children's development, but it also takes advantage of our human flaws, and marketers count on selfishness. They count on me first, they count on taking care of yourself, and then they count on being able to convince people that they need whatever product in order to take care of themselves. Altruism is not part of commercial culture. Thanks, thanks for them night, Thanks a lot, Thanks for the stars.

So what you're presenting when you present music or art to any audience is about the art. It's about the music and it's not to be confused or muddied by something else that you have no business associating with. It right for any audience of any age, especially for young children, because they're learning about how the world works, how the

adults in their lives are conducting themselves. Thanks for the people everywhere, Thanks a lot, Thanks for all and for One of Raffie's most beloved events was the International Children's Festival in Vancouver. It's the longest running kids arts festival in the world. At its height, nine children and their parents gathered for music, theater, and puppetry that highlighted kids creativity and exploration, and for years, Raffie was the headliner

of the event. They used to keep increasing the size of the tent that I would perform in the Raffi Tent, as they called it, because of the demand for shows. It was just amazing. I would do like eight shows in one week or ten sometimes. But all that changed in two thousands. Out of the blue, suddenly I was informed that oh yeah, uh, a car company was gonna have its cars on the lock of the festival. I thought, what the heck is this? I pulled out so fast.

I was really stunned and shocked, and well, I felt hurt. I felt personally hurt that they do this. He didn't want anything to do with that, so he wanted the music to speak for yourself and the messages to come through on their own without you know, commercialism attached to it. Musician Michael Creeper says he never saw Raffie waver from his beliefs, and together they played some impressive gigs like Broadway and Radio City Music Hall. Yeah, Broadway, it was

a big deal. That was thrilling. And to play all that beautiful music with these kids. He had a great choir, and the choir was assembled from the children of all these luminaries around New York like people he contacted. Everybody is super friendly. This was a pretty heavy time. They teamed up with Phil Ramone, a legendary producer who'd work

with Billy Joel, Paul Simon, and Elton John. But even with all the attention the Hollywood stars, the media, spotlight, and the pressures that come with it, Michael says, Rafie was never tempted to commercialize his music. He's shown that there's a respectful way to treat that audience. That's really the key word, you know, It's a respectful way. We're not trying to take advantage you to make them buy stuff. He's a man of principle that to me is a

very high principle. And when he talked about it. He's very passionate about it, and he says, you know, I just reaching not believed marketing two kids. It's not gonna happen with my stuff because it's you know, it's not fair. They're they're too vulnerable that they were exposed to millions of images as we know of day and night, day and night, most of it very shallow and commercial. It's people are selling you stuff, right, so why why give them more um and call it something to do with Rappi.

He didn't want anything to do with that. Michael admits that walking away from lucrative gigs, and especially ones that really mean something to you is not so simple. Of course, it's hard, and I think the entertainment energy is gigantic. You know, if people are going to offer you money to endorse their product, or they're going to say we'll put on a big concert, it's just that our logal will be there. It makes it harder, right, for sure, it's harder. But maybe this is where Ralph he had

an advantage. Michael says Rafi had built a loyal following before powerful advertisers came calling, and he gambled that his fans would show up at his concerts and buy his albums, even if he didn't commercialize his name. No, I don't know if those traces were easy for him, but he would know that I can sell records from their merit. I can do concerts because I'm a great entertainer. They will come, you know. So I think he knew that and therefore was able to resist some of the commercialism.

I understood that I had to protect this music. I did what I needed to do to protect the artistic integrity, which basically meant that I was going to be in charge of how that album got sold and how it got advertised. It would never be advertised to kids, and it never was. As the promo posted that I designed said a delightful new children's recording. That's all that's said in the front cover. All I Really Need is a

song in my heart. If you listen to enough of Raffie's music, you start to hear the messages the seeds Raffi was planting. Take Raffi song All I Really Need creen were drinking. Ralphie wrote it at a time when he had the big house in the flush bank account, a time when he was feeling uneasy with the pressure to make money off his audience by serving them up to advertisers. This was Ralphie's protest song, his way of pushing back against greed and commercialism. As Michael Creeper says,

Ralphie's music is sort of like an onion. Peel back each layer and you find deeper meaning. The song sounds simple, but the message is pretty um. They're very universal messages and they're they're actually very profound messages when you think about it. All I really need is well, what is it? You know? Okay, well I need to eat and I need I needed love. Kind of a paragon of integrity to do what he does, because if you slip up and it's sort of, well, probs, just another commercial guy,

but he's not. He cares about what he's talking about, what he's thinking about. Not everybody that has that kind of guts to do it. It's quite a bit of weight in your shoulders. You know. All of this is just an expression of love, respectful love. That's all it is, respectful love and action. We can all do it. Raphie's refusal to market two Kids was his first big awakening, but what came next would make him stop performing altogether. Next time. On Finding Raffie, we did our first program

for television on global warming. I realized that global warming, we called it then, was a real threat. I called it in my script a slow motion catastrophe. I knew that we had to get going on it immediately. And we heard about this meeting and thought, wow, you know there's going to be all of these old men sitting around talking about our future. Somebody should be there to

represent what's truly at stake. Finding Raffie is a production in My Heart Radio and Fatherly, in partnership with Rococo Punch. It's produced by Katherine Finalosa, Meredith Hannig, and James Trout. Productionists since from Charlotte Livingston. Alex French is our story consultant. Our senior producer is Andrea swahe Emily Foreman is our editor. Fact checking by Andrea Lopez Crusado. Raphae's music is courtesy of Troubadour Music Special thanks to Kim Layton at Troubadour.

Our executive producers are Jessica Albert and John Parotti at Rococo Punch, Ty Trimble, Mike Rothman and Jeff Eisenman at Fatherly and Me Chris Garcia, thank you for listening.