The Path to Podcasting Success with Dave Jackson

We're going to talk about starting your very own podcast and what to do to make it a success. If you're a business owner, someone who has a passion about a topic, I truly believe you'll find profound value in today's show.

So why do you think small business owners should consider getting into the podcasting arena?

And the other really cool thing is how often do you have the opportunity? To talk directly to the CEO of a major company. And so what that does is when you can deliver value, so that was keeping their audience up to date, but also they were getting great feedback on, I wish it did this, or I wish it did that. And so when you can deliver value, they like you because you just helped them in some way or another.

When you can do it on whatever schedule you pick, you're seen as reliable because there you are every Tuesday or whatever it is. And then if you can ever explain a point with some sort of personal story, then they get to know you. And then you got the trifecta, the know, like, and trust, and you're off to the races.

I'm like, how do you spell this thing? And so at the time, podcasting was going to be huge and membership sites were going to be huge. And I'd seen so many things like, I don't know, MySpace and all this stuff come and go. And I was like, all right, well, I'm not going to sit here and just watch this one go by. So I launched it, but that was the thing I really was hoping to like fire this thing up and just watch the money come in. And this is back in 2005. So nobody even knew what a podcast was.

So it took about. At least three years for it to really start paying for, this and that. And that's why I was also in a band. I was designing websites for people. I was doing all sorts of stuff to make money, but, that's why I started it. And the big thing that really just hooked me in. Is I had taken my blog, I started putting it out as a podcast and a guy from Germany contacted me and I was like, wait a minute. He's on the other side of the world. He found my show and likes it.

And that's when I was like, Oh, this could be a huge, just game changer for the world. And it really has been.

And maybe do it, three, five times a week. If you want to get aggressive seven days a week, daily shows are a bit of a grind, but it's one of those things that it really does depend. So there's the, why are we doing this? And then who is it for? And that's where you want to get as precise as you can, because if you go, Oh, I'm doing it for, guys over 50, okay, well, you could actually add location. You could add race to that. You could add all sorts of different things.

And the reason most people don't do that is the more you kind of niche down, the smaller your audience gets. But. The more engaged they are because they're like, Oh my gosh, I'm they're talking to me.

just a quick example would be football. All right. Well, you're going to talk college and pro. No, no, we're just going to talk pro. Okay. Is it the east coast, west coast? I'm not a sports person. So whatever division they're in. Okay. We're going to do the northeast. Okay. Well, is that Pittsburgh? Is it Cleveland? Is it whatever? Oh, no, this is just for Cleveland. So every time you niche down, So You get less of an audience, but the people that are like, Oh, they're talking about my team.

And that's really what you want somebody to think wow, somebody made this right for me.

Those make great episodes. I had a friend of mine that was in real estate and he took all those like, how do I get my house appraised and all this other stuff. And he said when somebody would email him, he would still answer the question via email, but he would also see for more information. check out my podcast. Here's a link to that episode that answers this question. And he said, what would happen is they would get that question answered.

And he says, but while they were there, they see all those other questions that they were going to ask. And he said, so what happened? He goes, it wasn't the end of like cold calling. He goes, but I ended up with a much more educated, prospect. So I didn't have to do all that kind of handholding one on one stuff. I was more into the advanced stuff and really getting them to, you know, pull out their wallet and make a purchase.

You can see, is this working or not via downloads, but I always tell people, make sure on your website, you make it easy to contact people, but it's really a marketing arm and what it allows you to do. Is you build that relationship with your listeners so that when they do want to finally buy, or if they're already a customer, they feel like they know you. And so again, you typically do business with people, you know, and now they feel like they know you.

And then hosting, I usually tell people it's around 20 bucks a month. So again, I'm assuming you already have a website. So you're looking at, Probably three, 400 bucks to get up and going.

So then the next logical question is, can people really profit from a podcast and what options exist in that area? So if I'm going to do this podcast, first of all, can I profit from it? And what are my options related to that profiteering, if you

And if somebody clicks on that and buys, you earn a commission. So like Amazon has an affiliate program. So there's that. Then we get into a lot of people jump to ads. First things first. And it's really mostly one of the worst ways to monitor or monetize your show. You're going to get about, if you're lucky, 25 per 1000 downloads. And that's great. If you have, 60, 000 downloads or 100, 000 downloads, but less than 10 percent of podcasts get that kind of.

activity on their show because again, it's hyper niche So ads are an option, but there are also people that are absolutely killing it with premium podcasts so they basically You have your free version and then if you want more information It's x amount of money and there are people that are making hundreds of thousands of dollars with that now they have They didn't start last week, they've been doing it for six to ten years But over the years they've built up this giant audience.

There's that you can accept. You Donations. You have to kind of be careful with that because, I know you being an accountant, you like, you got to make sure when you say donations, a lot of people think it's a nonprofit. And if you're not, but people can via PayPal and things like that, donate money. And for me, the biggest. benefit is one, the relationships that you get with people.

I want to be that guy that if I'm a guest on somebody's show and somebody goes, yeah, we're thinking of starting a podcast that that host goes, I got a guy. I just talked to him, six months ago. There's that. And then just the opportunities because Because of the relationships, people then go, Oh, I got a guy. And that leads to speaking engagements. I got a book deal. there's all sorts of things that pop up because your podcast becomes this digital resume that never sleeps.

And so it was just kind of a brush of, fresh air to like, Oh, I don't have to talk about microphones and bandwidth and things like that. Not that I hate to talk about that, but it did stand out. I've done that. there are a few things like that where I've been pulled into Oh, you, you do this. So let's talk about this instead of podcasting.

And I'm like, that's a perfect, like it's measurable, it's specific. And then once you reach that goal, you're like, okay, now what's the next one. And because if you don't know your why and how you're measuring it, it's kind of like saying, well, I want to lose some weight. Okay. I lost two pounds. Is that good? I don't know. What was your goal? Like you might be halfway there, you might be that's a drop in the bucket. So having that clear goal of why you're going to do it, that helps.

And then the other one is when you get any kind of positive feedback, save that someplace, because there are going to be those days when you're like, time to do the podcast. And when you have that, kind of, positive reinforcement, you forget about those people. Sometimes you're like, Oh yeah, I got to, this one's for, Doug or Karen or whoever, and, do that.

But, and then the other one is just, if you're starting from nothing, one, if the goal is monetization and things like that, it takes some time to get the ball rolling. I always say it's not a Ferrari. It's more like a steam train because a steam train has a cow catcher on the front of that thing. Cause once it gets going, It's hard to stop. And so a podcast is a lot like that.

I know, in my book about monetization, I talked about legal zoom and they had done, they'd done this big advertising campaign and after a month they just got nothing. And so they went to the company and said, yeah, this isn't working. We're going to cancel this. And so they stopped it. And then after the first month. All of a sudden the traffic started coming in. They're like, okay, turn it back on, turn it back on.

So it's not something that like, I'm going to put this out two weeks later, manna from heaven is going to fall. It takes a while for it to get going.

Well, radio, if you look at actual or radio signals, just a squiggly line. And that squiggly line, when you put it into a radio, Hey, this is stuff I can understand and there's music and things like that, and the same thing in podcasting with a feed, it's just a bunch of code when you put that code into Apple podcast whatever you're using, Hey, there's words on the screen. And when I click this button. Something comes out. So part of it is going to be your budget.

So like Libsyn has a plan that starts at 5 a month. Libsyn's a great solid host, but there are other things like Buzzsprout, Buzzsprout has a feature where you can add pre and post role. Little pieces of audio. So if you want to, let's say I'm an author and I've been doing a show about my topic and now the book is out. Well, I could add one file. And at the beginning of every episode, it would say this, Hey, the new book is out. Go to my website. com.

So they have that, there's another host called captivate. They do that. And they allow you to also put ads in the middle. Now, again, if this is for a small business, these are ads for you. So you make your own stuff. So those there's that blueberry is another great host. They're really taken off. There's a technical kind of initiative right now.

it's about three years out, probably called podcasting 2. 0, where they're just adding more features like transcripts or something that just came in and that was a podcasting 2. 0 thing. So they all have their own little like Libsyn, for instance, if you really wanted to pinpoint, like if I was a politician. Libsyn has an enterprise solution where I can only run my own ad in a certain section of the country. So that's something that only Libsyn can do.

Blueberry right now has a ton of podcasting 2. 0 stuff. Captivate lets you put ads as many as you want throughout your episode. And Buzzsprout, their big thing is they make it easy and they do, they have a lot of really cool tools and it's a super simple interface.

We all get discouraged sometimes on the start a podcast. So if I'm the Joe, the plumber, I'm going to start a podcast. I do spend a lot of time. I buy the right equipment. I launched this podcast and I do, let's say I do a weekly podcast and I put out the first five or six episodes and man, I got 20 people that downloaded it. It gets discouraging. So how do you push past that and what encouragement do you give for those who are just starting out?

Cause I know a lot of the shows I do, I'm just doing it because I love to talk about this subject. And when I get any kind of feedback, that's always great. But if I don't get any feedback, I just love talking about this subject. So that's part of it. If you're trying to do something like the worst question is. What's the best subject I can talk about that takes the least amount of work that will make me the most amount of money in the shortest amount of time?

That's the direct opposite way to go. It's like, Hey, what I want to talk about that I just love talking about. That I know my audience will enjoy and that is close enough to what I want them to do, buy my product or whatever. So it's kind of tough and just realize that, if you think about anything you did, whether it's shooting a basketball, tying your shoes. I remember my dad teaching me how to tie my shoes and I just couldn't get it. when you first start off, it's a little rough.

I'm a guitar player. When you first start off, it actually hurts. You end up with dents in your fingertips. But if you push through those, you make it through to the other side, and then it starts to, it starts to roll. And that's the, the fun part. Once you can get your audience to start telling their friends, And as the old shampoo commercial for those of you remember that back in the 70s, they told two friends They told two friends and it starts to slowly snowball.

So in the same way, I always tell people if they go, well, I'm not sure how I should end my show. I go, ask your audience to tell a friend. hit that follow button or share button in your app and share this with somebody who would enjoy it. And that's always a call to action that you can have.

And that is there's this whole discussion now in the podcasting arena of audio. Video and I know that they're, true people, experts in the podcasting field would say, well, YouTube or rumble, that's not podcasting. But I think a lot of people, Dave are looking at this now and saying, yeah, but I see all these YouTube videos. I see all these, reels, all these types of things. Well, can I do that? Or what should I do? Should I do an audio only? Should I do video and audio?

Is that something you talk about? Is that an obstacle or is it should be, let me get on as many platforms as I can.

If you start with video, you can pull the audio out of that and do everything. Whereas if you just do audio, trying to turn your audio into a video is kind of now, I just heard, Rob Walsh from Libsyn just said. That audio is still outperforming video 15 to one, because there's more time to listen than there is to, I can't, watch your video while I'm driving to work or washing the dishes or walking the dog or things like that.

So audio is still more popular and keep in mind the people that are saying you have to have video right now is typically a company called YouTube. And so I'm not anti video. In fact, I've, we've got a holiday coming up and I plan on recording a few videos for my YouTube channel.

So I always say, if you've got the time and the, the space and the budget, cause a lot of times, if you want to export your editing to somebody and audio editor is not going to charge you, what somebody who's doing video and shorts and things like that, there's a lot of cool AI tools that are making this easy. But so I'm, I always say, if you've got the time and the budget, by all means, jump into the video side.

But on the other hand, I just heard another podcast because they were talking, they recorded like at nine in the morning and they're like, Hey, if this was a video show, it wouldn't be happening right now because, no, but they're all, in their pajamas and they're not ready to go. So that's another consideration to, to keep in mind.

And do I have to be perfect in my audio or video podcast, or can I be real? Can I be the real Ralph?

And they're taking out of somebody breathed or if they said, uh, I don't know, they're like, Oh, I got to take out that. Um, and so for me, I go for the low hanging fruit. If I go, I think it's, Uh, Tuesday? Okay. I'll take that out. Cause just like in Microsoft Word, you highlight the word, you press delete and it's gone. And when you're editing an audio, you just highlight the um, and press delete. But I don't get too crazy with that. So it's really up to you.

And there are people that some people want to swear. Some people don't want to swear. And I'm just like, okay, I just always present the facts. I'm like, if you swear in your podcast, that's your call. And there are about 10 countries in the Middle East that will block your show. So if you don't care about the Middle East, audience, then by, and you want to swear and do all that by all means, be yourself.

I'm shaping it with music and throwing in sound effects and things like that. But yeah, there are a ton of people and it's going to run you. If you're hiring somebody in the U S probably anywhere from. I don't know, 100 bucks, probably more likely 125 up to 200, 250, depending on all the things you want them to do. If they're just taking out ums and leveling the audio and maybe removing some hiss, you're in that ballpark. But when you throw in video, now it's going to go up even more.

But if you work with someone overseas, obviously that's going to be a lot less.

So for example, the AskRal podcast is generally around 10 to 15 minutes a day. What is your expectation as to the amount of time that somebody needs to spend to create that and have it distributed?

And I, if I'm playing sound clips and things like that, so there's that, there's the research, then I go to record it and I'm not perfect. So I'm going to do a little editing and then, Oh, wait, I want Google to find this. So I should probably type a paragraph or two. So I type that up. And then I upload it to my media host and we're done. And I'm a look over there like, yep, that 15 minute podcast just took you an hour. And that's the best. It might be five, six to one. If you're doing video.

again, now, if your computer is a little on the old side and you're doing video, exporting a video can take, you know, a half hour just on its own, depending on how long it is and things like that. So it's, that's the number one thing I hear is people go, wow, this took a whole lot more time than I thought, because they thought a 15 minute podcast was going to take 15 minutes. And I'm like, and if you're doing interviews.

I always enter, I always do research on my guests so I can ask good questions. And then when we do the interview, it ends up being, 20, 30 minutes, but I was on zoom with a person for close to an hour. So if you count up all that time, that's where I'm like, yeah, it's not just 15 minutes.

I know it's intelligence, artificial, artificial intelligence, and I say we should call it assisted intelligence. I use it more as a brainstorming tool. I know when I made a video once and it was a funnel thing and I was like, okay, I've got this all set. And I went to chat GPT and I said, what are all the steps in a funnel? And it spit out, like I had six and they had seven. I was like, Oh, you know what? Yeah, I could add that in there. So the biggest thing I see is number one, never.

And I mean, ever put out anything from any kind of AI tool that you didn't read. Because there's still a blog post out there that says there was a discovery problem with podcasting in the nineties. And I go, yeah, there sure was. It didn't exist yet. And so you can blow your accountability, your authority by having an obvious mistake in it.

So I always, anytime I use it, I always look at it and there are words now that are very AI, like therefore, and I don't end my blog posts with in conclusion, so you kind of go through and make sure, would I really say this?

Which it does a good job because especially if it's doing something off your transcript, which you said it should sound like you so just be careful that it's not saying something you would never say and, in the end, I write content for people and sometimes these AI tools are like, Oh, you need to insert this keyword 13 more times and that's where it's like, Today, we're going to talk about growing your podcast because when you want to grow your podcast, you really want to grow your podcast.

And I'm like, yeah, that's ridiculous. so, write for people. Remember it's going for people, not the algorithm and, you'll be okay.

To fill in and all three of them said, what about Dave Jackson? So again, that digital resume comes into play. when I was teaching, I was teaching in a college and I swear, the reason I got that is we get done with kind of the interview and they're like, what do you do for your hobbies? And I'm like, Oh, I like to. Ride my bike, I play the guitar, and I do podcasting. Like, wait, you do podcasting? Because this was, again, way back in the day.

And I said, oh yeah, I could see doing a podcast here for, to teach students how to maybe study better, and things like that, and keep them up to date with what's going on in the school. So I'm pretty sure I got that job.

Because I knew podcasting, I've been asked to speak all over the world, from all over the country, I got to go to Australia, that was a lot of fun, and do some speaking, so, there's that, I got a book deal, I mean I could go on and on, I work at Libsyn now, because again, of the relationships, I remember, I was still teaching, and I went over to a, what used to be called pod camps, just these little baby, industry events, And I met the Libsyn team and they knew me. I knew them.

And I had done a podcast with a vice president now of Libsyn. And I just asked them on the one day, because where I was working, we'd gone from 10 teachers down to five and we're down to three, and I was seeing the writing on the wall, And I go, do you guys ever hire anybody in support? And they're like, oh yeah, we're growing. And I'm like, why would you want to work? And I'm like, maybe. So I planted the seed so that when that day came, I got the job because of the relationship.

that's, I could go on for another 10 hours on. it's just amazing. the one that still blows me away is I will be asked to speak in, nowhere, America. And I will announce, Hey, I'm going to be in nowhere, America, out in the middle of nowhere, and someone will say, Oh man, I listened to your show. Is there any way I could take you to dinner? And I'm like, okay, sure. Why not?

And then I just tell my family that like, Hey, if for some reason I end up in a ditch somewhere dead, like his name is George and he took me to dinner. So, it's, it's a lot of fun.

And. care for chameleons and he, his audience came to him and said, we could buy these cages for less money and buy them overseas, but we want to buy them from you because you've given us all this value. So it's the whole, the law of reciprocity. I've scratched your back. So I want to scratch your back. So that was one that I was like, the, what is it about? And I'm like, Hey, you win. That's the most niche show I've ever heard. I used to joke about.

I'm sure there's a blah, blah, blah, Frisbee golf show. And then somebody said, Dave, there's about four shows about Frisbee golf. I'm like, well, there you go.

And when I started it, it was kind of, I just sounded like a grumpy old man going, I went into this place and this guy didn't, and I was like, this isn't really what I want to talk about all day. And so, yeah, it's that passion that really pushes you through.

I was going to start online dating and I thought, oh, there's going to be a ton of fun stories about this. And I actually was kind of blue, which is not my nature. We're, we're talking, I wasn't cussing and swearing, but it was a little, a little weird, a little on the blue side. And you never know who's listening to your podcast. And I get this call and it was, one of the Cleveland Browns players. And I'm in Akron, Ohio, where I'm a big Browns fan. And he's like, is this Dave Jackson?

I'm like, yeah, he's Oh, this is from the Cleveland Browns. And I was like, Oh, well, what's up? And he's like, yeah, I'm listening to your new show. He's like, why are you working blue, man? He goes, that's not you. And I'm like, I'm just trying to say, yeah, that's it goes. That's not good for your brand, man. He goes, just knock that stuff off. And I was like, okay.

So that was interesting, but yeah, it's, It's one of those things where I, the other thing is, it's weird when I listen back, you don't realize how much your voice changes. You think about as a man changing your voice when you're 13. And I listened to stuff from, 15 years ago and I, I sound like this. Hey, it's Dave Jackson. But yeah, it's just something I put out there that the thing I always mention is be careful talking about family members because podcast. So it's usually my perspective.

on life, what I think, what I feel. And so you don't want to, don't complain about your spouse or your kids or things like that. That'll come back to, to bite you.

So you sold me now on the idea of, I want to start a podcast. I'm really excited about it, but now I need help. How does someone get in touch with you and what does the school of podcasting offer me?

You don't have to take them all, but it might be what equipment do I need? And then if you don't have a website, how to build one, and then how do I get into Apple and Spotify? So everything is step by step along the way. one of my favorite things is our community. Cause I got awesome people like you and we mentioned Mark earlier and a bunch of other people. And we get together and do kind of group coaching and compare notes and what are you working on and things like that.

So there's that going on. And then my favorite part is I love teaching. So I offer unlimited one on one coaching and people looked at me and said, yeah, you can't do that. There's only one of you. And I said, let's jump off that bridge when we get to it. Because what I found was, I had my high ticket item. You can still hire me for consulting.

But I was spending so much time knocking on doors, answering a few questions for free, and then, Oh, we're not sure, and following up, and I was like, Okay, by the time I got paid, this really wasn't a high ticket item anymore, because I'd spent so much time, and I was like, Well, I've already got people that are giving me money. Why don't I just give them coaching for free? And so it's, so far I've not had a problem with people going, I can't book a time.

Your calendar is too full and so works out great and I'm having fun. So yeah, between the courses, the coaching and the community, and it comes with a 30 day money back guarantee. So if you hop in and you go, Dave, this is more time than I thought it was going to take, you can back out within those first 30 days. I'll be happy to give you your money back.

So just having an outside point of view. There are times you're like, Oh, I didn't see that. I just was helping somebody yesterday and on their about page, they didn't put their last name. And I go, sometimes I'll meet somebody and it's, it's Karen Smith. And I, she had a podcast. I don't remember what it was, but I remember her name was Karen Smith. And so I'll go to Google and I'll type in Karen Smith podcast. And it won't come up.

It might come up in Apple might come up in Spotify, but her website won't because she just put hi, I'm Karen. She didn't put her last name. And so, which I get it. We know what our last names are, but if you want to be found for your name, especially if you have a unique name. Then throw that on your about page and be found. And it's just, it's not usually this giant revelation. It's the little things that you're like, Oh, did you know that's not going to work?

Oh, I see your, you just have one page with all your podcasts in one player. There's no SEO to that. And it's just things I've picked up from doing this for 19 years that You had this little bit and that little bit this little bit and then it starts growing

I become like a life coach because sometimes they're trying to squeeze their podcast into stuff and I don't have enough time and I'm like, well, what's going on, and so I, and I've had people I've taken flack because I had a guest on once. Who is a giant flaming atheist. That is his show and people like, I can't believe you promoted his message.

And I was like, well, on the other hand, I said, how are we going to we have to be friends with these people, I said, it's, and it's interesting because I still know that guy is still a friend and he knows that. I know that he knows that, like he's not changing my mind. I'm not changing his. But I also know if I ever have a question, or if he has a question, we know where to, to go. So it's been fun. I did, I do a show, in fact, I'm going to be bringing it back called Feeding My Faith.

And I played a promo for that once in my, on my school of podcasting show. And I had somebody complain. They're like, Hey, I tuned in for podcasting. I didn't do want to hear about your invisible sky, buddy. And what was interesting is the next episode I came out and said, Hey, like this isn't feeding my faith. This is the school of podcasting. That was just a promo.

And what was interesting, it was all the atheists that came out and said, dude, you be you, if you want to do that faith thing, do it. We'll listen all day. We can always hit fast forward. And so that became like a running gag. Now, if I ever mentioned anything about my faith, I have a little like trailer I play. It's like, whoop, whoop, invisible sky, buddy alert. If if this is going to trigger you, you better fast forward. But, Yeah, it's been fun.

And, there's the old, boy, speaking of non, faith based, the, the secret, right? There's a thing out of the secret, like attracts like. And I, it's funny because I have probably three retired pastors at the school of podcasting. So it's one of those things that, I'll help anybody. And, that's just part of that relationship thing. How's it go? always preach the gospel when needed use words. And that's kind of how I try to do it.

When you see him at the women at the well, he didn't like, how dare you, you Scarlett, no, he was like, he just made friends with her. And then he told her about, his Dad in that case. And so I would say, follow that example, figure out who your audience is, go to where they are, make friends. Cause if you don't make friends and just start talking about your business, that's spam.

And once you make friends with people and you build that relationship, Then tell them about your company or business. They're much more likely to do it. And I go, that's just the way Jesus did it. and, I didn't get too much flack on that.

It's no lie when he says it's unlimited because i'm one of his students and I probably annoy him because I always have a question But as a teacher Dave's told me many times. I love it when you bring the questions Ralph So I always bring the questions but again Dave anything else you want to add?

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