Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics, where we discussed the top political headlines with some of today's best minds, and Justin Trudeau has a message to the American people that your government has chosen to do this to you, not just the government Donald Trump. We have such a great show for you today. The Washington Posts owned Dana Milbank talks us through Trump's trade wars and how badly they're going.
Emali, I have a real surprise for our listeners. We're going to play a whole segment from our YouTube channel where you and the Wicked Projects Rick Wilson react to Trump's address to Congress.
Then we'll talk to Justice Alison Riggs about the continued fuckery with the North Carolina Supreme Court denying her her seat on the court. But first the news.
So, Mollie, one of my favorite moments of hell that I've had to sit through yesterday was watching the Curb Your Enthusiasm theme play while Donald Trump spoke on tariffs at the stocks on Fox News is Ticker and Yeah, these tariffs are going great.
I was told by Donald Trump twenty seventeen the trade wars were good and easy to win.
Remember that I was told by him that any president that was a thousand points in the stock market of a day should resign.
Is he going to resign?
Hell?
No, Trade wars are good and easy to win. Let's talk about what's happening right now. Donald Trump really really, really wanted to do these tariffs, and everybody who was a rich business guy who loved him and wanted the tax cut told themselves that he wasn't actually going to do it. This is this cognitive dissonance of trump Ism, right, So, this is this idea that Trump says, I'm going to be your retribution. People say, yeah, but he means that
metaphysically and not literally. He means that technically but not remember that whole thing that reporter uote unquote from Pittsburgh Gazette Selena zto take him seriously but not literally literally but not technically, technologically but not faustianly. Well, he's gonna do it. So all of you wealthy people who voted for Trump because of the stock market, the stock market
would like a word. He's opposed a swath of tariffs because remember, he doesn't know how tariffs work on Canada, Mexico, China, sparking You'll be shocked to hear retaliation because what happens in trade wars is that a war happens. So Beijing has sent stocks lower as there's fear of a trade war because markets hate instability. And Donald Trump is presidenting very unstably, so he had had these tariffs twenty five
percent on Canada Mexico. You'll remember there are pieces of equipment like car parts that go back and forth between Canada and Mexico five times. So will they be tariffed in and now will they be tariffed once? Twice, three times. There's all sorts of like minutia that can be wildly expensive and kill small businesses. They're also imposing an extra ten percent. This is a white house tariff on Chinese imports on top of a ten percent levy imposed last month,
so that all get to twenty percent. Trump is accused of the three countries, by the way their crimes, are failing to clamp down on the trafficking of fentanol. Almost no fentinyl right the Canada. Fentanyl it's pretty tenuous.
Right, It's enough weight that a child could lift it a bench press it, right.
And also, and I think this is a really important thing to remember. Mexico gets most of its weapons. I know you're going to be shocked to hear this, but you know what country sends most of its weapons to Mexico?
The country that makes all the weapons.
Yeah, you know where that is.
I think it's called America.
I mean, like eighty percent of the weapons are made by Rick Wilson, but the other two twenty percent made by other people in America.
Yes, do we have to remind the listeners of the time you and I had to stop taping with him because he was filing one of his weapons.
Jesus, I was like, what are you doing, Rereck, He's like the silencer.
Do we have to remind listeners that this has happened more than once.
Yeah, he's got a real weapon problem. So Mexico they have stuff on us too, is what I'm saying. Claudia schean Baum said on Tuesday, the government will wait until Sunday We're going to go into a trade war. This is so stupid, This is so stupid. I just want to say, this is so stupid. Warren Buffett, who's very heavy in cash right now, do I need to explain who Warren Buffett is?
I think people know that he's not particularly the most woke economist.
He's just considered one of the realists.
Okay, he's said He offered a sharp rebuke on the stupid saying a twenty five percent tariff on goods from Mexico and Canada is very stupid. And he said I think he didn't say it's very stupid, but we all know it is very stupid. He told CBS. Woke CBS, this is an active war to some degree. Over time, they are tax on goods. I mean, the truth fairy doesn't pay them. And then what you have to ask that question in economics, and then what well, there's not
a lot of it. And then what in Trump world? Okay, well Trump plans to create an external revenue service.
Oh yes, that's going to be yeah, existed forever, so BALI. In addition to that, Trump is set to whack the US working class with his stork three thousand dollars tax hike.
Listen, those rich people need their tax cut, and if you and your family have to forego whatever to do it, so, this will be the largest tax increase that they have ever seen. I mean, the idea here is that these tariffs are actually a huge tax hike for the consumers.
That is correct.
And if you have to sell an organ since you refer to that whatever, that's what you're gonna have to do to pay those taxes.
So that's right, organs for everyone. So that'll be fun. And by the way, you know, Trump has a real problem, which is Trump loves to talk about how terrible the border is, but there are not a lot of people trying to come over the border. So now Trump has no one to go to war with because he was planning on doing horrible you know, camps and deportation squads, and you know that borders sounding pretty quiet, So that's a real problem.
Yeah, Somali.
One of the other fun things that always is going on in Trump world is them saying something that is a little bit toeing in jd vance. He sat down with Fox News is Sean Hannity, and well, the stupid came out.
He said that there's a crazy idea in the Democratic Party that if you repeat insane ideas enough, eventually the American people are going to believe them because every accusation is really a confession. Right. I have to say this may be part of the interview, but the part that
everyone in the world is talking about. Is jd Vance implying that England and France haven't fought any wars recently, when in fact, George W. Bush got these poor European countries involved in his war against the Access of Evil Iran, Iraq, and North Korea, and they also were involved in beyond the Access of Evil Cuba, Libya, and Syria. Poor Europe was also involved in this. And the phrase, of course, has been attributed to friend of the pod David from I mean, you know, I love that. One of the
commentators said, isn't that Trump's whole business model? Yes, of course Trump is always sort of work in the reps, coming up with insane ideas and they're trying to sell them to his supporters. And now we have a special reaction to Trump's address to Congress with the Lincoln Project's own rip that we've pulled from our brand new YouTube channel. You can get cool stuff like this, but only by following us on YouTube by looking for fast Politics with Molly John fast Rick Wilson.
Dear God, that took a long fucking time.
It was the longest one of those ever. It's not we're not calling it a state of the Union because why aren't we calling it that, because it's it's too close to He's only been president for six weeks, so you're not allowed to call it a State of the Union.
It's like the Joint Session of Congress.
Right, we'll just call it our crashed economy.
You know, it really is. I don't know if you've heard about these things. It's called tariffs. They're they're his favorite word. It's a big, beautiful word. And and they're already doing so great. They're making us so rich, and it's insane.
Trump hit one hour thirty minutes, making it the longest State of the Union address in Joint Address of Congress in history, Longer than people who are better orators.
You know, here's the thing. It was castro Esque in length, it was von Munchausen in content. And I think people are going to walk away from it going the fuck that I just listened to because I look an awful lot of it was like k Tell's Greatest Lies of the nineteen nineties and two thousands. It's like all the culture War stuff, the all the you know there are Social Security recipients were three hundred years old.
It's right, a lot of stuff that had been debunked.
Bucket of bullshit. And look, nobody, nobody walked out of that speech tonight. Nobody walked out of that speech tonight and said, Wow, that was a brilliant rhetorical construction. And I totally changed my mind about Donald Trump. No, most people watching that speech tonight were thinking, it's the same shit. And by the way, fuck, oh, Joe Biden's not president anymore and hasn't been for a few months now, and so you know it's on you now, Chief, You're not
you know, he's up. I think he mentioned Biden. I was initially keeping track of it. I think he talked about Biden six or seven times at least during the speech, maybe more, I don't know. But it struck me how weirdly defensive it was. In a lot of places.
I thought that sometimes with his speeches, I've thought, wow, this is really like remember the Fire and Fury speech of twenty sixteen, where I thought, oh, wow, this is really is to quote George W. Bush, some weird shites.
Weird shit.
With this, it was like the construction was very showman, right. So you'd have a person and you'd bring them out, He'd say this, child, this orchid has childhood cancer. Okay, and had been treated by the way at at that famous childhood cancer hospital that doesn't charge you, that takes.
Money from the NIH or whatever it.
Was, Saint Judes. So I've been Saint Judes will be cut under the new Elon Musk efficiency budget, so okay, and they're gonna work on childhood cancer, but they're cutting all the environmental regulations because they have to cut regulation
because of capitalism. So here's a So the idea here is that this kid has cancer, but we're going to cut the funding for research for cancer, and we're going to cut the funding for environmental regulations, and we're are going but please look at this kid, because we got him. He's gonna you know. I mean, it just was like there was so many instances of like, this is the freest speechiest free speechy speechified freely us.
He felt very free after.
Right, But then it was like, but don't look up any of this stuff about what we do when you say stuff we don't like, right, don't.
Don't don't conceive for a moment that we won't have you thrown out of the chamber if you if you act to very don't for a moment speech that he's not naughty, and winking several times to Cash Betel and Pam Bondy of you know you're gonna have you go get him, you know you You can see a lot of this entire structure tonight, I think came down to, look, this was not a speech writer speech. This is a Trump speech. He wrote this speech, or or at least told he when mellow in the speech, I don't but
let me let me rephrase. I don't think he wrote it. I think he told people what he wanted and and it it was a mess. The whole thing was just a mess.
But it was very, very.
Densely packed lies. If lies were like nuclear material, they would have been compressed so densely that they would have reached a criticality and exploded. It just it was I mean, look, saying it was Trump's most mendacious speech ever is a high bar. But it was up there.
Well, they're all, I mean, they're all like that the thing that I mean, you know, the real democracy, true democracy. I mean, there were a lot of like we're gonna, you know, redefine words, what do they mean? Real nineteen eighty four kind of stuff. I mean that's to be expected. I mean, you know, the guy feels very emboldened. But I what I was thought, what I sort of was surprised by, was he also seemed kind of tired.
Yeah, he was not super high energy tonight. He was not super high energy. And I think we've talked about this in the past. There is as certain cadence Trump gets when he's reading off the prompter. And we will pass a tax cut that will make millions of Americans so much more money, more money than you've ever seen before. It will be nothing, nothing anyone's ever seen ever because we will make so much, so much money, And it just was sort.
Of a get sort of bored.
I do think even for some of the Republicans in the audience who who were doing what I call the Saddam rule, which is, never be the first guy in the audience to stop clapping, Never be the first guy to stopped clapping. They were doing the Saddam rule. But there was also a there were some of the things he was saying that that that no one in that audience believe were true. Oh, the markets are doing great,
and intro streets are plunging, and everything's going fine. And we've done so much in such a small amount of time. That's so good. Any of these went for a town hall meeting, they were buying that ship. Any of these read a newspaper, they weren't buying any of it.
Well, if anyone who looks at the Dow Jones, which is Trump too right, knows that it's it's given back all its gains. So the I think the question really is sort of how long he can keep this kind of I don't know, is it Mussil? I mean, who is the who is the autocrat who says everything is it's sunny when it's raining?
I mean, who is the I mean like I mean I jokingly said this earlier. A lot of it was
sort of Baron von Munchhausen. He was almost testing people to see how many lies they would believe tonight because the speech was piled so hot, and my my staff folks were were following it and they're like, you know, we know you wanted us to fact check this, but we're all like one hundred and fifty lies an hour in to the seventeen hour speech, and it just it just it just struck me as even his own people, Yeah, they're clapping in the room, But the cognitive dissonance is
a pretty far gap. In this speech. There was a lot of a lot of I'm the best, time, the greatest. They all expect that from Trump. But there was also a lot of like outright lies, and they knew it and they couldn't. They know they can't sell.
A lot of these things, right, No, No, I mean they can't. And quite frankly, you know, I mean what is interesting is that he's sort of like he knows what he's supposed to pretend to care about, right, So clean air veterans, right, So as he's cutting these things, he's pretending he cares about them. And I would say that is in a way the most interesting part. Also the kind of showmanship we saw. So we had MTG in a maga hat. This is now her thing. She
wears a maga hat. We had the sort of the crew of you know, the Trump children, every sort of Melania. I mean, we had the whole sort of.
A different color. Tonight.
She has been tanning with him, or they've been bronzing together.
You know. The family that bronzes together stays together, is what they said.
That's right, it's they share a bronzer. They share one bronzer.
There, I will now use the tanning bed.
Yeah. I don't think any of that is occurring naturally. I think that's just all orange powder caked up. And actually one of my kids, who I was watching it was was we were like trying. He was like, maybe it is real, And I was like, if your skin in your scalp is one color and your face is radically different than it is not real.
That is not real. No, definitely not a real thing. But look, I mean I think I think you saw a lot of the performative as I said, like the Saddam rule, the clapping, the yelling, the you know, the raw rawer. Trump he he's watching. He expects all that. They know he expects all that. But I you know, even Trump was admitting tonight with things like the terrorists, like, oh,
there'll be some dislocation, there'll be some brief rob. I think those clips are going to come back to bite him so hard, because unless, as Howard Lutnik was hitting hitting today, he's going to bail on tomorrow.
Do you think that's possible? I mean, that was some Howard Lutnik is doing some three dimensional chests here we may do it, we may not do it, we might not do it at all.
Yeah, here's the thing. I think Trump doesn't give a shit about public opinion, but I think he cares a lot about what the market does. And the market has been crippling for the last two days. It's been punishing him for the last two days, rightly so. And I kind of thought like some of the speech tonight might have been calibrated a bit, like like threw in more like raw, raw, optimistic bullshit that you know, you and
I both know was crap. It's like things like, oh, so many new car factories are already being built, right?
No, I know there was tons of new car factories. That was pretty amazing. So I want you to sort of do a second or two on the Democratic pushback. Was it the right stuff that Democrats did? You had a couple of different things, you had Al Green? Yeah,
I want to. I want to remind everyone al Green tried to impeach Donald Trump on like I think it was like January thirty first, twenty seventeen, right, so he was remember Nancy was like no, and he was like yes, I think maybe February third, he was already doing impeachment, so it's been hot to try for a long time.
I always have this memory of of MTG and uh and Bobert screaming like a pair of hyaenas at Joe Biden, and I'm just like, so, like, if the decorum thing is the thing, then you don't wear a baseball hat on the floor of the house. You don't. You don't get to, you know, sit there as a screamer and a ranter once upon a time and now be sort of the picture of propriety. All those things are.
Let's just pause for a second. What worked? So al green didn't really work. People wearing pink didn't really work. What worked? I thought the little signs where they they held it up when he was lying yes, And then I thought.
I thought that was a really interesting message. But I think it actually works. Given some of the polling we're seeing, people do not like that guy. No people are showing happy about it.
The nefarious billionaire who models himself on a bond villain is not and is not even from here, is not more popular.
Imagine how imagine a South African bond villain who you know, uses his who.
Uses his schest man in the world.
Super powers to fire weathermen and veterans, suicide counselors, and.
Take money from children's cancer right. Yeah, so here, So the question is I also thought maybe Bernie just looking on and very displeased was a good I mean, I thought he did well. I mean the question is like do you go? Do you not go? Ultimately it was it better just not to go?
Yeah, you know, my my, I think sitting through the show was probably an yeah. And a lot of Trump's speech was built around like, oh, you won't cheer for America, right, A lot of that, yes, you know. So I think I think if I'd been counseling the Democrats, I think I would have sent a delegation of people. But but you know, look, I don't think the stunt stuff works anymore.
So Manu Raju White signs, I mean, Manu Raju, who works for CNN, said, I've been in the House chamber for speech, you know, for a lot of speeches. Have not seen an opposition party mount of protests like tonight, House and Senate Democratic leaders and I think we couldn't see this because we weren't in it. Didn't join the escort committee for the President. They turned their backs on him when he entered the chamber. They didn't shake his hand,
they didn't applaud virtually anything. Several walked out in the middle of the speech, lots of signs in the back being held up. DEMN members repeated shots of lies and your law lying. A DAMN member, Al Green was exported out. DEMN leaders endorsed the no applause strategy, but Jeffries and his deputies urged members against signs, props and loud outbursts.
Well, look, I think turning your back on someone as they entered the room is one of the oldest pieces of political symbolism you can engage in in a public forum, and that is that. I think that was a good move. I think it says something, and I think it also it may have actually rattled Trump. He was trying to work the Democrats.
Do you notice the same thing. Well, I just know what it's like to give a speech, and when you feel like they're not with you, even if you know it's a friendly group, it gets really rattling. So I wondered, and you and it makes more sense now all of his stuff where he kept being like, they're not gonna chap, They're not gonna applaud They're not gonna like I kept wondering why he was so stuck on that, and that would make a lot of sense.
I think that. I think I think we've sort of I think yeah, and I think that idea of Trump in his head of I'm president, They're gonna clap for me, no matter what. I deserve it. I own this, I'm the boss. I think all of that has a sort of for him. Not getting what he wants in that space is really hurtful to him. He's gonna stew on this. He's gonna hate this, he's gonna be mad about it. He's gonna be thinking to himself, you know, they disrespected me.
I deserve better. I'm gonna punish them, you know. But I do think that the best night of the moment mess moment of the night was I can't I don't know which member it was, but as Trump was walking down the aisle, someone held up aside and said, this is not normal.
Yeah, you know who that was.
And I thought that was really I liked that seeing that moment because it really this guy went in there with no intention of of of unification or communication with with the rest of America. It was just about he's gonna he was gonna go in there and and own the Libs, and he was gonna be a clown. He was gonna do his thing. And he did and and and some of it went on so long, like like like, this is not normal. Really spoke to me about this whole event.
So the woman who did who held up the this is not normal sign, is a woman called Melanie Stansbury. She is from New Mexico. She is the the ranking member on DOGE, which you'll remember the chair of DOGE is one maga hat wearing Marjorie Taylor Green. So one of the things that Stansbury has had to do, when I think she's done it actually quite well has she's had to sort of be the sane one on that committee while still and so I did. I did think that was absolutely the right tone to hit because it
was like trot, it was not. It was somewhat disrespectful, but it was not. It's still. I thought it struck me as more appropriate than a lot of the other stuff.
Yeah, yeah, I think I think that was That was my favorite moment. And look, I think I think that the temptation in all this is to overprocess it and overthink it, because very few people remember any response to a State of the Union or a joint address. Yeah, you remember the performance of the of the president, Republican or Democrat. And I think Trump's performance was I don't think it was a great When Trump has the ability to perform at a different level.
Yeah, yeah, and this was not that level. But you saw the P. T. Barnum, you saw the showman. But the most important thing about this is that we have now lost another hour and a half of our lives watching Donald Trump give a speech. And as I've said to so many of these speeches, I immediately thought to myself, here we go again.
Another Yes, another fucking death march through Donald Trump's weird brain. And it was I mean. And by the way, my favorite tweet of the night was a scientist who was involved in this study. He said, I wish I could explain to them that transgenic mice are not transsexual mice. But how could you?
Rick Wilson, transgenet Always, those are not transsexual mice.
These are transgenic, not transsexual.
Dana Milbank is a columnist at The Washington Post and the author of Fools on the Hill, The hooligans, saboteurs, conspiracy theorists, and duncis who burned down the House. Welcome back to Fast Politics. Your friend, my friend, Datambank.
Molly, it is always great to be with you, even as the world is falling apart.
Listen, he just as a constituent of mine, because I am a member of Congress now, so listen. It does seem as if and I don't live in the district of Columbia, so I'm allowed to vote in presidential campaigns, right, But it feels like things are quite leak in the federal government.
Discuss well, Congresswoman, I would be delighted to discuss this with you. Things are bleak in the federal government, but I think things have taken such a turn here that things are now bleak for the country as a whole, if not the world. I mean what we're seeing with this trade war, and make no mistake, this is the biggest trade war we've had in a century. We're about
to see the consequences. You know, elections have consequences, and yes, they've already had tremendous consequences for federal workers that will reverberate through the country in terms of services of America's expecting will no longer receive. We've seen the shock through the loss of freedom to liberties, but this is where Americans are really going to see it most. I mean, prices are now going to go up within a matter
of days. And even if Trump comes to his senses and withdraws these actions, it sort of story started us on a cycle of protectionism. And in history shows once you go down this road, there's almost no way back history.
Wait, what you bringing up history? Where the United States of amnesia? We know nothing, we remember nothing.
But even people who watch Ferris Bueller know about Smoot Hawley, right.
Smooth Halley. Well, actually only people will watch Fueler now about Smooth Holly. It does seem like the predictions. You know, we had this widen soft landing economy where everyone was like, yes, the economy is good, but voters don't feel it. They want cheaper eggs, so they voted for Donald Trump or eggs cheaper danam Bank.
I've been surveying the groceries and markets for you, and I can report that no egg prices are up substantially. And that's the thing. I mean, you know, and prices are up substantially across the board. We've seen various indicators and even out today, predictions of yet higher rates of inflation increase. We've seen forecasts for economic growth in this first in the first quarter which we're currently in, have gone from substantially positive to recession and a.
Half percent up to two and a half percent down.
That's quite a swing in GDP. And that's you know, by definition, that would mean that we are in or are entering a recession.
Is that a woke math?
Though?
Could that be woke math?
There's the Atlanta Fed practicing woke math?
Is the Atlanta Fed practicing wont math? Because it feels like woke math to may.
I guess so, And that's why it should be investigated by the FCC and possibly by the acting US Attorney for the District of Columbia.
He's pretty busy. You saw that piece of news that perhaps he was trying to panel a grand jury to go after Chuck for his Bello Coast language. In twenty twenty, Chuck.
Schuma right the Bello Cooast language, for which he immediately clarified going after a couple of other members of Congress threatening to go after reporters who break news and expose facts in the public domain about Doge.
Yes, that's not okay.
I'm working on a larger piece about this, but just the wholesale fuselage of assaults on freedom of the press. I was going to, you know, include them in the current column I'm working on. They are just too many. I did I need more column inches to keep track of it. It is just it is just breathaking.
Yeah, we're in a pretty insane moment.
We have no more aid to Ukraine, no more USA I D no more of a lot of the congressionally allocated funds because Trump thinks they're not going the way they should.
What happened now, Like courts have already ruled a lot of courts of rule this is illegal or we're in a constitutional crisis. Who stands up for the rule of law? That shouldn't be a trick question, by the way.
I mean, we're facing a series of slow moving the crises here. The Trump administration has been sort of slow walking its responses. You know, I don't think we can really say that they've flagrantly overtly violated a court order yet. I mean, it seems to be just a matter of time until that's coming you know, a lot of this is going to as we saw from the Chief Justice just recently, a lot of this is going to make
its way to the Supreme Court. The administration will almost certainly lose on most of these things, but they may win on some of them and be able to redefine the powers of the executive. But you know, so I don't want to minimize constitutional crises. I think what's going to happen in the very short term, though, is the stuff we've been talking about with the trade war. I mean, the government is supposed to shut down in ten days.
Republicans seem to have no clue as to how to keep it functioning, so they're relying on the minority Democrats to do it. But they've not given the minority Democrats anything. And why would the Democrats just vote to continue government funding the way it is, knowing that Donald Trump and Elon Musk are just going to spend money on the programs they want and kill the funding for all other programs.
I read the playbook today that the cr it's not going to be available until this weekend or next week, so it's not like they even have it right.
Well, no, I mean, you can guess what's in it. They have been by definition, we're talking about, you know, probably a clean cr as they call it, that continues the current levels of funding. Democrats have insisted on, and rightly so, some sort of assurance that the money that co Congress is approving is actually going to be spent by the executive branch.
Crazy talk, Yeah.
What a crazy idea. And of course the executive would probably ignore that language anyway, since he's not shown himself to be bound by the laws. But the Congressional Republicans are saying, no, we're not even going to put the language in there because we like what he's doing. So I just I'm having a hard time seeing what the incentive is for the Democrats to participate in this charade, to give their blessing to this charade. So we may
be looking at a government shutdown. We're looking at a rapidly accelerating the trade war with all kinds of recaliations underway. We're looking at an already overheating inflation environment and very shaken markets, the prospects for hitting a serious recession now. So that's what's happening right now in the short term, and then we can all sit back from our shantytowns and Hooverville's and watch these constitutional crises unfold.
Shanty towns and hoover rebels. I'm laughing to keep from crying here. So Trump has only been in office for six weeks.
Okay, isn't that incredible. I can't remember life before this.
This person has done so much to happened in such a short period of time. Democrats, on the other hand, the Great James Carvill said that he feels the Democrats should just bow out of the public forum and take a break, perhaps go to Aspen. Do you think this is something that the constituents who are getting arrested in front of Tesla? Do you think they want a Democratic party that is think tanking and perhaps doing a little scheme.
No, I don't think that's what they want. But I also don't sort of buy into this criticism that the Democrats have been silent. I mean, okay, they.
Have no power.
No, I don't think they have been either. But I'm just I want to talk about the carvel yet another anyway, continue right, So.
I mean, yes, there's a school of thought that says they should be, you know, setting their hair on fire over everything. Trump does. I'm kind of inclined to agree with that. There are others who say they should be picking their battles or I guess maybe going to Aspen. I think that's kind of a sideshow, because you know, the Democrats are not in control of their own destiny right here. They don't have a leader or you know, any obvious one, and they won't for a couple of years.
Their fortunes, the fortune of the party and I think of the country are going to rise and fall based on how Trump does. And if there is a backlash, and I think a very powerful one is already building and it's only going to get more powerful as people realize that it's actually affecting their lives and their pocketbooks. There's going to be a huge backlash, just as there was, you know, with the Tea Party in two thousand and nine and twenty ten. You know that's where the Democrats
will find their voice. Yeah, okay, so there, you know they managed to hold together a filibuster on trans rights in the Senate. Okay, well, that's well great, but that's not you know, I don't think that's where the Democrats need to be defined. They're going to be defined by the backlash to what Trump is is now doing, and it is unfortunately worth the country, but perhaps fortunately for the opposition, disastrous.
For the Democrats. Yeah, are you worried about like democratic forms and institutions aka like our ability to vote?
I am very worried, molly about the weekend of the institutions. I don't think anything like that drastic happens overnight. You know, we're going to have an election next year, We're going to have an election in three years. But the same thing I've been writing about, the attacks on the free press, it's not going to disappear overnight, although my employer seems to be doing its best to make it do that.
But day now hear the curd.
Oh, but it's going to take a long time to undermine freedoms that have been building up over decades. But you know, of course it's a danger and a threat. You know, we don't have to get up and say every single action is the end of free expression in America, but to know that combined, we are definitely chipping away and it's going to take a long time to fix and reverse these things.
Yes, correct, It's funny because it's like we did have Trump one blown out. So as much as all of this feels unprecedented, it's actually very much. You know, in some ways it rhymes, in some ways, it's a lot worse. But the reason why Trump wasn't able to permanently end a lot of our norms and institutions was because of democratic pushback. Is that correct and talk to me?
Well, yes, of course it's correct, But you know, I'm not sure that it was necessarily know what was happening in twenty seventeen. All signs indicate that Democrats will finally retake the House as they should have last time, and that'll be a bullwork. Part of the reason why Trump is destroying so many things so quickly is because he doesn't have a lot of time. Next year, the midterm
campaign is in earnest. This is the year when he has to get everything done in terms of reconciliation bills through Congress and also all these extra legal and unconstitutional executive actions and orders that he can do at a time when he's not getting oversight or scrutiny from Congress.
Yeah, I wonder if we could just spend minute or two talking about Elon mush Or as I like to think of him, Leon. He is the richest man in the world. He is meme. I don't know if you know that, but I'm not sure you saw him at Seaback, but he is meme. He is so powerful he no longer needs verbs. What do you make of this? Verbalis South African billionaire who has decided that his newest hobby is cutting the federal government. And just as a student of history, has this ever worked well? Jesse has a
fact check. He says that actually, and you know, we are very committed to the facts here. Jesse has an important fact check. He technically said, I become meme. Thank you, Jesse. Okay, he become meme. He become booner of the federal government.
Yeah.
Maybe I missed this during the campaign, but you know, I thought the president was coming into reduce prices and grow the economy, and instead we have a trade war that is increasing prices and trashing the economy. And we have the world's wealthiest man running the government, which is not at all contemplated during the campaign. But so no, it was not on my bingo card to have unelected megabillionaire, unaccountable to anybody, making decisions that will affect all of
our lives. I don't think that what Elon Musk is doing will endure.
Because it's not constitutional, right, I mean, this is a model will be undone.
But what he's doing but that will endure, is it's just sabotage, pure and simple. He's done the same sort of thing that his business to, you know, sort of burn things down for creative rebuilding. But the government doesn't work that way for good reason. It's not a competitive enterprise. It's providing services and protecting Americans. It's not a business. The damage to the brain drain, the loss morale, turning away really a generation of civic minded people who care
about government service and love their country. That stuff it's going to take a long long time, even if we're inclined to fix it, to fix it. So that's where his damage is. Do I think he's actually ending foreign aid for all time? No, of course not. That's going to need to be fixed in some way. But he sure is destroying our reputation around the world and hamstringing our government, and not to mention, making millions of people's lives miserable in the short term.
The most important part is he's doing it for a tax cut and So who among us would not ruin into our federal government to save a couple billion dollars?
Yeah?
Maybe, but I don't know what Tesla stock is down what thirty percent?
Yeah, they had the worst month in like five years.
I wonder how they're going to do now that they can't import any of their car parts. I mean, you know, we're looking at all automakers are about to take a big hit because of this trade war. So yeah, I can't imagine the trade war is good for Elon Musk, although he probably won't notice it less than your average mom and pop.
Yeah, those poor moms and pops. At the state level, we're seeing governors stand up more. Heally Chanet Mills from Maine, seventy seven year old very Spry did a really excellent job of speaking truth to power. Do you think about Democrats and should they embrace federalism?
Well, if by that you mean use the federal system to resist what's going on in Washington, well of course they should's that is one of the checks and balances that you know, that is one of the ways we preserve the republic and protect democracy. I mean, you know, the courts are one, the free press is one. And certainly our federal system is one, and it was used quite successfully to counter Biden at every term, and that
was without an actual constitutional crisis. So yeah, by all means, I mean this is the moment for state governors and state attorneys general to lead the fight exactly.
Data Mailbank, please come back soon.
Well, if we still have a country, I will be back with you anytime.
Justice Allison Riggs is a judge on the Supreme Court in North Carolina. Welcome back to fast Politics, Justice Riggs.
Thank you so much for having me.
Okay, what is happening.
So we are in the midst of an extended state court fight.
I'm going to get people up to speed here at North Carolina State Supreme Court. You won your seat. Republicans have decided that they don't want to give it to you despite the fact that you won. That's right.
I won in November. It was confirmed by a statewide count that the exact number that I won by seven hundred and thirty four. It was confirmed by a sample hand eye recount in late November early December, and then my opponent's challenges were rejected by the state Board of Elections in December.
So why won't they see you.
The North Carolina State Supreme Court after a highly unusual motion from my opponent, my opponent asks the state Supreme Court, on which I serve, but I'm recused in this matter. He asked them to stay the certification of my election. And your listeners will know that folks storms the capitol on January sixth to stay the certification of the twenty twenty presidential election. So I like to give that as analogy so people understand that these aren't just wonky terms.
Stay a certification of an election.
So they're not letting you take your seat even though you want, because they don't want to. Right.
So I am in my seat and I keep it. I was the incumbent, and in North Carolina, the incumbent it's called holds over until the election is settled and thirtified. I sit in my seat. The opponent won't concede. The State Supreme Court granted his request to put a hold on the certification of my election.
That's insane. For no reason.
Well they didn't really give a reason except their order said so that he can pursue his challenges throughout the state court proceeding. And so we went to federal courts because we think federal courts should decide these issues because they are questions of federal law and federal voting rights. The federal court said, yes, we will eventually hear this, but we're going to let the state courts go through
the process of answering any questions of state law. And so when the Federal court said that, it effectively meant that this whole thing was going to drag out six to twelve months. They said that at the beginning of February. We have five to eleven more months, I think, and obviously it's just a guess because court stuff is slow. And then in the state courts, you know, you go, you start at the trial court, then there's the Court of Appeals, and then there's the North Carolina Supreme Court.
So we've been to the trial court, We've won at the trial court. We have now just finished briefing at the North Carolina Court of Appeals. I think we'll have argument later this month and a decision maybe in April. Then it will go to the North Carolina Supreme Court.
The timing, you know, I'm not.
Certain of, but I think it's very realistic that it could be May or June before that's resolved, and if the state Supreme Court says toss any of these ballots that we believe are protected under federal law, because as a reminder, these are all eligible voters who cast lawful ballots. And my opponent has not been able to point to one single ineligible voter or a voter that he can prove or point out by name is actually an ineligible voter.
And my parents are on the list of the sixty eight thousand voters he's challenging, So I know these are eligible voters. And so we're already looking at you know, possibly June before we even move back to federal court if we need to, and then federal court processes take time too. So why I so appreciate you lifting up this story is because when election litigation or voting rights cases take a long time, it's very hard to maintain awareness of them because the legal stuff is wonky. Sometimes
people aren't as interested in it. But what's happening here in North Carolina is absolutely critical to the soul of democracy across this country because molly people in power can decide whether or not they acknowledge the results of an election, whether they can whether they respect the will of the voters based on if they like who won, then democracy dies. And so I need everyone across the country to understand that what's happening here, this fight is a continuation of
what failed in twenty twenty and twenty twenty two. They're still trying it. My guess is they figure, Hey, no one really follows state Supreme Court races, so this one will fly under the radar. And I refuse to allow voters to be disenfranchised in the dark. I will shed light on it because I believe it's my duty as
a constitutional officer. I put my hand on a Bible and swore and oath to God that I would defend the constitutional rights of everyone in North Carolina, and it certainly includes the sixty eight thousand voters whose votes are at stake here. But I need folks outside of North Carolina to understand just how insidious and threatening what is happening here is. Because I can't do this by myself. I need help from across the country.
Yeah, explain to us why this is insidious. It's insidious because you won and they are fighting a real election result, and this is opening the door to disputing election results. They don't like right.
That's right. So you can think of it as two different angles of thinking about why this is so inspidious. One is it creates the precedent or opens the door to people being able to anytime they don't like an election result, challenge it, say it was illegitimate, and overturn it. And you can also think of it as problematic from the perspective of all of these sixty eight thousand voters here in North Carolina followed the rules that were well
publicized and set before the election. If you can come in, whether it's a disappointed candidate or a political party, if you can come in and after the election and change the rules of the game after the game has been played, it's very toxic to how our democracy is supposed to work. And it's a really intuitive problem. Right second graders on a playground know that in a game of kickball, you can't change the rules after the game's over because you
don't like who won. And this is very problematic because there are fifty five hundred military voters, military and overseas voters who were told in advance to the election that they did not need to provide a photo ID to vote in part because military voters use an online portal, there's not a mechanism for submitting a copy of your picture ID. Also, if you think about folks serving on a submarine scanners an email, it's a little bit harder
to come by. Regardless of whether you like that policy or not, that was the rule, It was approved of by a rules committee, a full of appointees from our Republican legislature. No one fussed about it in advance of the election, and now after the election they say no, no, no, These overseas and military voters should have provided their photo ID, even though they were explicitly told by North Carolina government, the US government, the DoD that they did not have
to provide that ID. So this is a you know, it's a real question of fairness. You can't change the rules after the election because you think it will somehow help. And you know, these fifty five hundred military voters that my opponent is challenging, they're not statewide. They're in four of the most democratic counties in the state. There were thirty two thousand of these voters statewide, but he's only challenging those fifty five hundred, and those four heavily democratic counties,
so you can't change the rules like this. I also say it this way. Look, voters, when they leave the voting booth, they should have certainty that they're vote counted if they follow the rules that were told to them before they went in there. They should feel comfortable that their vote counts. If this strategy wins, then no voter here in North Carolina, and really no voter in the country will ever leave a ballot box feeling confident that
their vote counted. And I don't know how a participatory democracy ever works if that's the case.
Right, And that's the point I think. Tell us what people can do with your story and how they can support you.
If your listeners can, please visit my website. It's Rigs for our Courts dot Com. That's far not the number four Rigs for our Courts dot Com. You can sign up to get notifications so you can get emails that give you updates on what's happening, provide messaging on social media. It's actually really important that people share my updates on
social media because we need to essentially go viral. We need folks to understand there's a lot of frustrating, terrifying scary things happening across this country and across the world. I understand that, and we still need to break through some of that noise so that folks understand the threat. So if you can follow me on social media, I'm on all the social media. It's either at Rigs for our Courts or at Alison j Riggs. It varies, but if you search Alison Riggs you'll find me.
I'm on all the social.
Media's providing regular updates because transparency is important. I believe that people in North Carolina and people across the country deserve to understand what's happening in this legal process, and deserve to understand the implications for each of us and our fundamental right to vote and our voice. Thank you, thank you, thank you, Justice Right, thank you, Mollie, thank you so much.
And no more secretly, Jesse Cannon, So, my age, jug Fast, the Supreme Court has decided that your water doesn't actually need to be clean and the Clean Water Act is a bunch of bullshit.
And I think this is very very very very very very very bad.
Really tell me why, Jesse.
Just this weekend, I was listening to Sarah Hoover, who has a celebrated book on the podcast How Long Gone, And she was discussing the time that she would surfing and actually got just a mouthful of water surfing that had sewage in it. And what did that do to her? It put her in the hospital for a month.
What.
Yeah, And that's what this law will enable, is that, you know, North Carolina has particularly been prone to dumping tons of things in the water because they fuck with this act all the time.
And this is.
Exactly the type of implications that happened when the Supreme Court overturned regulation because they think regulation is always bad.
This is not good.
Yeah, yeah, nobody wants to drink sewage water. Big bad mistake. No, thank you.
Was shocking though. Who doesn't want to drink sewage water?
Who?
Justice Amy Cony Barrett really woke?
Justice Amy Comy Barrett. Welcome to the resistance. What happened?
She U said? The descent?
Wow?
So it was five to four mm hm, Yes, welcome to the resistance, Judge Amy too bad. Justice Roberts does not care. That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear the best minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend and keep the conversation going. Thanks for listening.