Mary Trump, Sen. Barbara Boxer & Rick Perlstein

Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics, where we discussed the top political headlines with some of today's best minds, and Donald Trump has lost his federal appeal on immunity in the Egene Carroll case. We have such a great show for you today. Former Senator Barbara Boxer stops by to tell us her big idea on how we can fix immigration in America. Then we'll talk to Nixonland author Rick Pearlstein about how hard it is to cover American politics right now.

But first we have the host of.

The Mary Trump Show, the one the Only Mary Trump. Welcome back too, Fast Politics, Mary Trump, Thank you, Molly, Doug Fast, you and I. You know, it's funny because when we were talking a minute ago, I was thinking about, like all of the many things that Trump tried during his administration that didn't work, from the Muslim band to the fact that he was going to create his his own Twitter, to his remember when he was going to create like a multi media empire.

Do you remember that I do it?

Deed?

It just strikes me that the only thing Trump has been able to really do well is intimidate Republican politicians.

And many in the corporate media as well.

Yeah, although I think that's more about money than intimidation.

But yes, there is not one Republican politician.

I'm aware of or we're you know, we're going to need a bigger microscope, that is, any spine left because they're either intimidated by him, or they're one hundred percent in lock step with him, or like somebody like Eli Stephanik. They are just the most grasping opportunists to believe that their power in the future laws was sticking with him.

On Saturday, at least, Topnik gave an interview to Christen Walker Press where she said she didn't think of the January sixth criminals, the people in jail for crimes, right, those people, She thought of them as hostages. It was important, I think because Trump had that weekend in Iowa shopped this way of interpreting normal reality right, that they were not criminals, they were hostages. And then Stefanik said the same. I see this helps the schism between the Republican base and reality grow.

But I'm curious what your take is.

Well, one of the things that we're talking about that statement is it was not the worst thing she said in this horrific.

We can't even call it an interview.

What was the worst thing? She said that.

She is willing not to certify the results of the twenty twenty four election. That's the next link in the chain that they're forging. Well as for the hostages thing, we've heard people like Marjorie Green and Fucker Carlson use similar language the past. Again, because it doesn't get pushed back and you don't have Republicans saying word to the contrary,

This is your uncle right, who has created this alternative reality, right, this Earth two situation or uncle right? I mean, obviously you have no responsibility here, but I mean you're just he I mean, you need not be sad. But the thing I always wonder about the Donald Trump origin story of which you are too familiar. Did this happen like when you knew him? I mean, did the man just happens into a perfect storm of Republican sycovancy or was he in some way as an evil genius?

Oh no, there's nothing genius about him.

I know.

You mean that in an idiot savant kind of way.

But even so, yes, he has his he has his skills. I still find the shocking. He's capable of finding people who are weaker than he is to do his bidding. And he does have a figure on the pulse of what motivates what negative things motivate people, you know, the hatred, the division, because he knows he can't win on a level playing field, so he needs those things. It's all in service to him, right, But think of it this way. If he had no support, if he had no enablers, if the media.

Weren't in his corner.

If the entire structure of the United States government work well in the tag for the visuous minority, right.

Donald wouldn't be able to get a job at a car walk.

No disrespect to people who work in car washes, because that's actually harder work than he's ever done in it life.

Right.

The tragedy here is that at every step along the way, there have been enough people with enough power and enough money to keep this myth going. There are a legitimate businessman out there who've been wildly successful. Obviously, nobody can come a billionaire with that government assistance and all sorts of breaks. But there are people out there who you know would be, if not as successful, still very very successful even without the perks and the help.

He is not one of most people.

It's funny because I think so much about.

This idea of why we're struggling so hard in the mainstream media to cover Trump.

Trump is the rise to authoritarianism.

And one of the things we suffer with when it comes to the mainstream media, and it's particularly true in print journalism.

It's really hard.

Is this framing that for years and years, hundreds of years we've used to great success, which is Party A says this, Party B says this. But the problem is when Party B says it's raining pink cotton candy. You can't repeat what Party B says because it's a lie. And that is fundamentally where we are right now.

Absolutely, and you could say the same thing about the Democratic Party. They continue to function within a paradigm that no longer exists, and I see that shifting a little bit. I think Joe Biden's recent speeches have been more direct. He's more willing to call Donald names, which I know that sounds absurd, but that's important. It's important that he called him a loser and things like that. The corporate media are woefully not prepared for this moment for that

It is a real, like fundamental problem of bad faith actors.

It's funny because it's like with Trump.

I come from the same town as him, right, not Long Island, but but Manhattan.

I lived in the city Queens this Queen's right, New York City, I mean, but not Manhattan, totally down Manhattan.

We called Manhattan the city even though Queen's is.

Yeah, but yeah, I grew up in that same you know, nineteen eighties New York. The thing that crafted Donald Trump was in some ways the thing that crafted me, though I was much younger, thank god. But I think a lot about this idea of like the kind of behavior, the kind of like I want to say, like nihilistic sort of killer instinct, you know, the way that people in New York steal each other's calves. Right, there is

Yes he was.

That's training. That was my family. There's no good faith. There's no assumption that because your family you're going to be treated well, or because your family you deserve to share in what everybody else shares in. It's you're the wrong kind of person. And think about words like kind, sensitive, generous, funny, sweet, words like that that if you have a child, do you want your child to be surrounded by people who could be described with those words. In my family, that

There is no place for you on this planet.

If you were a kind, generous, sensitive soul, you know, you may as well just walk right off.

Basically, this is the mentality.

And you know what's amazing about this is that Donald had to develop this veneer of toughness, this veneer of being a you know, a killer, which is what my grandfather required. But as we've seen over the last seven years, when he's been on the national stage in politics. That's really just window dressing, because he is the weakest, whiniest, most aggrieved person on the planet who only just goes on and on about how he's he's been treated badly.

He tests it. He tests the you know, he puts.

Stress on the joint, and if they don't break, they bend, then he stresses the more. And we've seen that right now in American politics, there is no such thing as tradition. There are no such things as norms. There are no such thing. And now he's trying to do the same thing with our actual rule of law because he's gotten so far with so much help.

It's such a weird thing to think that, like the dumbest member of your family, that's a question, could destroy American democracy because the other people were scared of his mean tweets.

Not to put too.

Fine a point on it, you know, it's a perfectly fine fine point. So, first of all, Donald is not the dumbest person in my family, and I'm sorry, well, you know it's it's we have so much to choose from. I mean, if we include past members.

Of my family, including to those current members, he's also not the worst person ever.

In my family, which is really really saying something.

He's the worst because of the power that he's been added. Right, it just shows you how.

If you if you convince somebody and it's in a weird way, like we see the same thing with White Priblet, if you convince somebody that their need for power is based on their needing to cheat liar steel, and you convince them that that power is the only thing ed is going to make them relevant as people, then you can manipulate them. Because there's no other explanation for this current Republican party. Clearly, power has become an end in itself.

The alternative is annihilation.

Right, The alternative is annihilation. But the problem is that winning is also annihilation.

Well for us, yes, violation for us.

Right, it's hilarious because it's terrifying.

You know, we didn't know each other before the first before twenty fifteen.

We didn't know each other before twenty twenty. Yeah really Yeah.

I book came out in July twenty twenty, and I'm pretty sure do you miss that?

I think of you as very much not a person.

Oh would be doing this if it weren't absolutely necessary.

It's almost impossible to imagine, quite honestly, to tell.

You the truth, twenty sixteen to twenty twenty were pretty freaking horrible, and I think given the circumstances, it's better to be able to have a voice and have community than just suffer silent, which is what I was doing, yeah, first four years, because it was so devastating and isolating in a particular way. So what I miss is the before times and not the before COVID times, before November twenty sixteen times.

Right when things were just so much lower stakes.

Yeah.

One of the many reasons why I really like you so much and respect you so much is because I know how uncomfortable. This is for you, and I know that you are really so committed to the cause of trying to keep American democracy going, which is so by the way, to have one only one party believe in it is how we got here.

Right, to have one party completely willing to throw everything away cynically. You know, if they were doing it for ideological reasons, it would still be terrible. But to know that that almost to a person, they have literally no convictions, that's somehow worse because I think it makes the project of rebuilding that much harder.

I hope I'm wrong about that.

It makes it almost impossible to trust in their ability to have integrity in the future.

You know, so what do we do? You know, who are we going to be dealing with assuming there is a post twenty twenty four?

Mary Trump, you are the greatest. I hope you'll come back.

Barbara Boxer is a former senator from the great state of California. Welcome to Fast Politics, Former Senator. I'm going to call you former Senator Barbara Boxer. Hi, I'm so glad to have you. And you know, one of the things I'm struck by in the pundit industrial complex, of which I am a member. Is that it feels like we forget very recent history all the time.

Yeah, it's because it's twenty four to seven.

It's of the moment, and there's something very exciting about that, but you also lose something in terms of the depth of looking at what happened before.

So one of the reasons why I wanted to have you on this podcast is that you know a lot of stuff. You and I met each other over the Christmas break and we were talking about immigration. You were senator from California for a long time in Congress before that, and Republicans are at least pretending that they want a solution to the immigration I don't even want to call it a crisis because where we are right now, we have a population that's declining and I think a labor force that needs people.

But it has been painted as a crisis.

You know, you can give it whatever name you want, and some days it feels like a crisis and some days it feels like it's okay.

But the situation is this.

You talk about of the moment and looking back after we had our little lovely meeting, and I enjoyed it so much.

Molly, I don't know.

I guess I was tweeting about immigration and somebody posted, listen to this a press conference from nineteen ninety three where I was at the border with Senator find Stein, my colleague, oh wow, and Janet Reno, the Attorney general, because we had quote a crisis at the border. We have always had issues at the border, and the last comprehensive immigration reform that we had was when Ronald Reagan was president.

And I sort of hate to admit it, but I was there. I was in the House, and that's good.

In nineteen old and six, can you imagine and bottom line we passed it and what was it and why did it work? Because as we took what Democrats wanted, what Republicans wanted, we married them up and we got a path of citizenship for those who've been here for a long time with clean records, and we also secured the border. That was nineteen eighty six. We know how to do this thing, and where we're at now is not too complicated to see. Republicans don't want a solution,

He says, I'm going to say Biden's.

An insurrectionist because there's an invasion at the border.

And he was so excited to say that. So this is where it's at.

And you know, when people say it's too complicated, I always get upset because we can solve this problem.

We need to surge our resource rus to the border.

Everyone has a right to a hearing if they meet certain provisions of our law, which says they have to be fearful for their lives. They have a right to have a hearing if that's the case. So if you move the resources to the border, which takes some money, bidens it. You can have the National Guard and do some of the administrative work and get more folks out there.

You can have the judges out there. This can be fixed. Period.

I want to pause and like rewind a little bit. The way we got here is there is right now almost no path to citizenship in this country.

Well, there is a path to citizenship.

It takes a long time, but yes, there's a definite path, and there's certain numbers of people who can qualify. Every year, it's a certain number it changes every year and don't know the exact number.

And that's all fine, and that's all working.

But it's very small. It's problematic, right.

It isn't producing the number of workers that you would need in order for the economy to grow.

That's the truth.

We do need more workers and that's a big plus of having immigration that works. So, as you know, a lot of our mayors and the big cities have said to the President, what will really help the cities who are taking the brunt of the illegal immigration right now because we don't have those resources at the border and people they just get a stamp and they can go stay with their relatives, so they're all over the country, but they can't work, most of them. So that takes

That makes sense.

The people who are in fear for their lives have a total right to a hearing to make their case. If they're just coming here because they can't get economic opportunity in their country, that's not allowed under the law.

Because the idea here is that asylum seekers are coming because they're in danger. So your idea is to move these courts to the border. Explain to us exactly how you envision this happening.

Yes, it's just like you move resources to where they're needed. For example, if God's forbid, there's an earthquake, and Lord knows, we've gone through that, FEMA sets up temporary living places for people while they get their homes fixed. We've done these things where we can shift resources to where they are needed. Natural disasters is one example. This is a situation that I believe means this kind of change, and it just takes some supplemental funding.

To do it.

And again use as a national guard to erect these new buildings in these places. It's going to make total difference because you'd be able to respond to people right now, it's taking literally years for people to get an answer.

Well, that's sort of a crazy system.

But they're here a few years and then they find out they need to go back I mean, that's crazy.

So the idea was immediately you would have a judge there. He would listen to the cases he or she. You know, you have people come over the border, they whatever change, get sort of medical help, and then they get lawyers. They would talk to the court immediately and you wouldn't get an answer within twenty four hours.

Maybe it would be a little longer, Molly, because we do have the ability right now to take care of people for in on months. But you move it up, they would not have to leave. They would get their answer and move on. And then point that we really do have a shortage of workers. There ought to be a worker program, which we've had in the past, and

It's just the will.

And right now the President's been answering for supplemental funding to serve some of these resources to the border, and of course there's said nothing coming from the other side. They say, well, we don't think it's about money. Really, do they ever have to send their kids to college and get them housing. Everything has a price. But if we can set this up in the right way and we married up with worker program, we're going to be

They know it.

The question is do the American people know it at this point, I don't know. And their whole thing. Look, one of them, said, one of the members of Congress, a gentleman I don't remember his name, is said out loud, I don't want to do anything because I don't want it to help Joe Biden.

Right, all right, I remember that.

These mega people.

The thing about them is they just blurt it out like their great orange leader.

Oh I'm going to be a dictator. But on day one and only day one.

Well, if you declare martial law on day one, democracy is over. They say it out loud.

One of the things that I'm struck by is just how much immigration really feels like the only thing Republicans have to run on right now, right because economy is getting much better. They no abortion. I mean a lot of their ideas have gotten so right wing. I mean, it's funny because it's like you were in the Senate at the time and in the House during Ronald Reagan. But Republicans seem like they've really moved to the right on a lot of things.

Well, that, my friend, Molly, is the biggest understatement I've heard all day. I mean, moved to the right. They're off the cliff. They have fallen off the cliff. You know how people say, and Biden said, you know, this is not my grandpa's Republican party. I remember, you know, I always hate when old people say I remember.

But I remember when Mahis.

Dad was for Eyes an Hour and my mother was Stevenson and my father went around with his I like button.

I said, Daddy tell me that, well, he's a hero.

And he said, we spent too much on the military and we need to invest in education.

That was Dwight eisen an Hour.

And again here's Ronald Reagan doing this amnesty build. That's what it was called, and that's what was if you were in this country, you got adamsty you got a clean record. Yeah, there is no relationship to this Maga crowd. And my hope is that the reasonable Republicans and we see a lot of them in your field of work.

In the media, we.

See a lot of them retiring from the house as quickly as possible.

There were tired.

But we also see very young people from my perspective, you know, in their thirties in their forties on television who used to be Republicans and say I can't do this anymore. To say that the party of hate, I mean they that's what they spew. It's all about division. It's very frightening because it's the politics of grievance, and everybody's got agreements, you know, everybody, So all of a sudden, you go, you're unhappy about this.

Here's who to blame.

Blame those people over there who do look like you, who don't love who you love.

So they'll keep that up.

So I think they have more than immigration, that's a big one. But they also have, you know, the culture wars that they will continue to perform.

Yeah, I mean, they'll try whatever they can.

Oh yeah.

What I think is interesting about your border solution is that there are problems in government that we can solve by looking at things in a slightly different way, you know, like the idea of setting up immigration courts on the border is something we just haven't done right. Part of the problem with immigration right now is that you have these people that they're not being given work visas, so they can't work, so they are then forced to be poor.

You've got it right, and these things can be curable if you have the resources where they go. And again repeat, we see that whenever there's a natural disaster, femus great at that they bring their offices right right to the people, even after you know, zooms and all of that, they bring their offices right to the people.

They have housing.

That's temper. They did it in Louisiana. They do so it's not like this is a born idea. And if we marry up what you're saying, which is we need workers with we need quicker decisions on asylum. Now you have a system, and also you have people that need to go back who don't meet any of that. And that's just sad, but that's just true. You know, you don't take every single person in.

You can't.

That's just the fact they have to wait in line if they don't qualify.

Just between you and I and the listeners of this podcast.

I think we should take everyone because I think our country has room for it, and I think that ultimately our country was built on this idea that we are that.

I don't agree with that.

I think you need numbers that are fair and just because you just if you went that way, it could be handled. It just could not be handled. Think about what's coming, climate change and everything else.

Though.

I think that's one place we don't agree. I think you need a system so that the people who need get out of their countries because of fear of retaliation and farm to their families, they should have a pathway in. People who can work should have a pathway in, and the others should.

Just sign up.

Because we do have a system that does allow you know, hundreds and hundreds of thousands of people and legally every year.

I think that works.

Yeah, if you had a solution where you had a real pathway, it's deflationary.

If nothing else.

If you have a system that is true to the law, which says people who have a legitimate fear of danger by going back to their country and they get their day quickly in front of a court, that's a blessing, and they don't have to wait for years and then be told they don't meet the requirements that have to leave. That's just wrong and that's the cause of a lot of the problems. So you need to have places for

And the numbers that come in every year.

If they're too low, they can always be adjusted. But I think you do have to have control over the border.

Barbera Boxer, Senator, thank.

You well, Thank you so much, Molly, and you know, keep on keeping on your very refreshing voice.

Rick Pearlstein is the author of Invisible Bridge and Regganland.

Welcome to Fast Politics, right.

Oh, it's great to be here, So I kind of want to talk about nixon Land, how we got here.

You know, you are a historian.

I feel like one of the things I can do with this podcast is talk to people who know history and explain to them a little bit about the president. You know, we are the United States of Amnesia, but we don't have to be right.

Yes, yes, that's a great framing. I kind of fell into this work in the middle of the nineteen nineties. I was kind of looking for a subject to pursue as a writer. I've been an editor and a magazine kind of intellectual magazine writer in New York, and I was obsessed with the sixties and fascinated by the sixties, and you know, the fact that social change just seemed to happen like every day, you know, just like some revolution.

Every week, you know.

And I grew up just being absolutely riveted by those stories. And then I kind of realized that, isn't it interesting that the hegemonic narrative about what the sixties were was was you know, I held it the minivan commercial version of the sixties, where you know, we were all marching out in the streets, and I burned by bra and Da Da Da da da. Now it's you know, great and important, but no one had really thought about the

Against the sixties, winning against the sixties. Do you think that that's why Republicans were so obsessed with this idea of Black Lives Matter and antifa like that they tried so hard to blow it up because they knew enough history to suspect that they could use those to win in a way that Nixon an.

Yeah, I mean, among you know, the further right free Sincs that say the quiet part out loud, the you know, bronze age pervert types. You know, they'll explicitly say, wow, if we can really stir up some real riots during this kind of Black Lives Matter protest, then we can get our Caesar right, pulling back the frame even bigger.

Right.

That's like the big story I've been telling. And it's a really hard story because all of our institutions of journalism, you know, all the tools that journalists use, all the structures, all the mental models, all the habits are all based in this idea that we have these kind of you know, kind of these sensible civil elections every four years, and the person who manages to persuade the most people gets to be president, and the other guys go home and

I have two questions here.

One is this is a growing schism right between what is true and what the base is told is true.

Right number one? And number two, I just.

Wonder how much of this is this idea of white privilege. Right that one of the things I've been struck by since Trump lost right in twenty twenty is at every point people in the Republican Party, and even like mainstream media people have said, well, just leave him, he's not going to do anything like just let him blow off some steam. Remember that Republican who said he's not overthrowing

Retic history really starts getting scary because the people who have been best a kind of really showing us clearly what's happening in America are not in American historians. They're European historians. And you know, it's a Tim Snyder's of the world. That's one of my favorite young writers. John gan So I interviewed for my column what has happened in Europe between World War One and World War Two? Or you know, kind of South America in the seventies.

Right.

Remember the joke we used to say that the media would always say this is the day Trump became president because he halfway read the telepropter straight right. So that is that's a very very strong pattern in how authoritarian gotnments happen because the people who should be the bulwarks, the garb rails, you know, out of fear, out of intimidation, out of maybe a little bit of seduction by the fascist melentality themselves let it go.

Part of it, though, is that they're covering unprecedented times and again I'm not giving anyone to cover here.

I wish more people recognized that and made the efforts right, right, So what.

Do you think though about this idea? That they can't meet the moment. The mainstream media does not have the kind of and especially right now, that doesn't have.

What it means mainstream journalists who are saying, holy cow, the twenty twenty four election isn't just about votes. It's about how many guns one side might have. Right, how do you even wrap your mind around that? And how do you go to the Iowa caucuses?

You know?

And that's a really hard question. And you know, I have this weekly column in the American Prospect called the Infernal Triangle, and one of the things I've started doing is just interviewing really smart people and asking them that question.

You know.

I interviewed Jeff Charlotte, you know, the guy chased around Wisconsin for two years, and he's like, I don't want to say that this is fascism. But then he's like, when I meet a guy who has tattoos, you know, to talk about how much he likes shooting people, you know, decides that, you know, Trump is the manifestation of the Godhead and that you know, brown people are taking over the country.

I have no other choice, right.

So how do you do that? And I'm not going to say it's easy and I'm not even going to like, you know, necessarily bash you know, mainstream journalists. I'll do a lot of that too. Here's what I would say, Basically, we have to open ourselves up because there have always been amazing, you know, alternative journalists who don't act this way, and they have to be kind of elevated.

Right.

It's like during the Iraq War, Right, It's like posts would say Satamusain has weapons of mass destruction, we must take them out. At the same day that's someone in you know, like Mother Jones or the Nation or some blog. Here's proof that he doesn't have weapons of mass destruction. And so, you know, we really have to open ourselves

Does that make sense, yes, for sure?

And what But one of the things that I'm struck by is like, you know, I wrote about this coverage staff Foo, this weekend. Part of the old school framing, right, that we have done as print journals. I mean, you and I are on the opinion side. That's a huge advantage, right, being on the opinion side.

It's kind of this funny thing.

You know.

It's like there became a certain time during the Trump administration whereas, okay, say this thing that Donald Trump is saying is false. The election wasn't stolen. There are a million things they could have done. They could have said, you know, like when they were reporting the Tea Party, you know, in two thousand and nine, and they said

Something like that.

Yeah, no, I think that's right.

The question I have for you is more about this idea that Republicans are being taken at their word.

Right.

So Byen has done something which is quite unusual if we were all normal, which were not because of nine years of Trump. But Biden has, like he gave this speech where he said, you know, Trump is an autocrat, this is authoritarianism. You know, he was right to do it, and I feel that he truly believed, and I think he does believe that this could be our last election.

I was talking to a ranking Democrat in the House. It was saying the same thing to me, and I believe it too.

I mean, this could be the end. Right, you think Trump is going to leave after four years? He barely left last time. I mean, there's very recent history that will show that there's no way Trump leaves again. But then the responses in this conventional political framing was Biden describes Trump as a danger to democracy.

Right. The tragic thing about that is, if there really is, you know, a fascist takeover in America, they're not going to say, Well, the New York Times, you know, MPR, they're political journalists. They played it pretty straight with us. They really kind of gave our side of the story. So we're not going to align them against the wall. We're not to say that they're part of the What did he say about the enemies of the people?

Right?

So, I mean the fact of the matter is these news organizations, whether they like it or not, in the broadest sense of the term of you know, kind of having an enlightenment proch to trying to uncover the truth without fear or favor wherever the chips may fall, are liberal institutions, and they're going to be eyed by these people and hated by these people in existential ways, whether they quote unquote are fair to them or not. I mean,

Or they look beyond the half line. Wait a sec.

There are all these people, you know, there are all these millions of Americans who have guns and say that they're too take themselves from tyrants. Oh and by the way, the Democratic Party represents tyranny for you know, upholding the idea that people should get vaccines was when there's an epidemic. Right,

You know, well, if there's a possible saving grace here, it's that a the economy is really good right in Germany with Hitler, I mean people, I mean again, I'm Jewish.

So they're filling wheelbarrows with cash. Yeah, the joke was Mussolini made the trains run on.

It is a very different America than it was Germany in the thirties.

The severing from reality, from our representation and reality can be very sm So the factor of metric. We want to have hope as Democrats that oh, people vote on the economy and they feel like their prospects are getting better. Well,

Of technical work.

But we're basically, you know, have learned not to really think of at least you know, the other side of the aisle. The government is something that's real or good or does stuff. So you basically just kind of see people to vote for as you know, personalities, right, and you know, basically these days kind of social media stars. I'm going to be writing about this. Chris Hayes before he was a you know, famous TV guy who's just

Yeah, it's a good point. Thank you so much.

Rick.

I hope you'll come back anytime.

No moment, perfectly, Jesse Cannon, We're back, my John Fast.

I want to say congratulations. While we were gone across two hundred episodes, this is somewhere around two thousand segments you and I have taped together.

That means congratulations to us both. And you just celebrated your birthday, so you are now officially older than I am. Again, thank god those eight months a year more importantly than anything.

But on to the moment of Fuckery Stone, that tricky little fellow. He tried to get a NYPD officer to murder Eric Swalwell, friend of the show and Jerry Nadler.

And boss of the producer's squaw friend. Yes, full disclosure.

I have a lot of questions about the story, none of which are is a true I think we all agree it's true. Even the denials are non denials. And you know so, I guess media I listen to the tape. It's time to do what Stone told Greco. Let's go find Swalwell. It's time to do it. Then we'll see how brave the rest of them are. It's time to do it. It's either Nadler or Swalwell has to die before the election. They need to get the message. Let's go find Swawell and get this over with. I'm just