I feel so moved by the situation with Sonia Massey, who called the police because she thought she had an intruder. First thing she said when the police arrived is don't hurt me. Their response was, why would we hurt you? And they sit in her living room have a calm conversation. Noticing that there is something on the stove, they instruct her to take it off the stove so the house does not burn. She reaches for potholders to make sure she didn't burn herself. When she moves it off the
stove and they drew their guns. She raises her hands with the potholders in her hands, and one of those police officers fires upon her four times, killing her. Another officer who was there renders aids to her, while the shooting officer does nothing. The reason that's on my mind so much is like, how can we as a black community not have vicarious trauma from seeing those things like
it is? It is incredible to me that we're supposed to like live in this country and feel safe as functioning citizens when too often someone will call the police for issues of safety, like related to their job, and that person ends up dead. I think that people in our community under we underappreciate the traumatic experience that it is just to be black and female in this culture and what it's like to just watch that, you know, Like I'm on social media Yesterday's kind of scrolling through
and I start seeing this name, Sonia Massey. I was like, I don't know what this is, and then I see the video and I'm like, I've seen too many videos of black people's lives.
Being taken in the past a few years.
So I don't know how to heal from that level of generational trauma. And I do believe it is generational trauma, but I do know it continues to happen. And we need to understand that when we're choosing politicians with ridiculous rhetoric, we are choosing more experiences like that or less, depending on how how you vote. Donald Trump has created an environment of unsafety that is so unsafe it is no longer even safe for him. We need to think about that.
We need to have larger conversations about that. I think any of that relevant to the Family Therapy podcast. I have no idea, but when I see that stuff going on, I'm like, you know, the Republicans have been very clear with their Project twenty twenty five, like this is our agenda, and one of those agenda items is police to have immunity for things they do in the line of duty up to an including killing citizens. If we were living in a Project twenty twenty five era today, that officer
would be he would not be arrested. And I saw Mugshott earlier today, so I believe he's been arrested. And that scares me, like that genuinely scares me that we could live in a world where someone could just walk to my house shoot me because they thought the podtholders they asked me to pick up We're somehow a weapon and they could take my life and then they could just go home and have dinner with their family that night.
That's scary to me in a way that I have a hard time articulating to people who don't look like me. And it's just like we live in a society of no justice. And I don't even mean justice in a legal sense. I mean like no honor, Like justice is not an equitably distributed thing. So it's perfectly okay to view this woman sitting in her house walking to her stove as a threat, but Dylan Ruth shooting up an entire Black church, somehow we think he deserves Burger King
and all this is on my mind right now. I just saw that Sonya video last night. You know, you follow the Angela Rise and the Tamika Valleies and the Ben Crump's and the Lee Merrits, and you see these things, and it's just like, how am I supposed to feel safe in this country? And if you if you don't feel safe, then the the larger question is how am I not supposed to feel traumaed? And connected to that? If I don't, if I'm if I'm feeling trauma, how am I supposed to live in this country and not
have my trauma is triggered? Like it's like a cascade of things that I don't I don't really know how to sort out all the time. But you know, you know, and I'm going to say something positive about what's on the news going on the news and in my heart. When Joe Biden announced I was kind of living my life on Sunday and I followed Joe Biden on Instagram and I saw he posted a letter and it felt like it felt like a like a kick in the stomach. I didn't even read I didn't have to read the letter.
I knew what it was. But I did eventually read it, of course, and like that was actually where I saw it. I didn't see it in the news outlet. I saw it six minutes after Joe Biden posted it. Then of course in the next few minutes it go super viral, and for the for the next couple hours, I was freaking out, Like the Democratic parties and shambles, what are they going to do now? This is unprecedented blah blah blah. The way the culture has rallied around Kamala Harris has
been a beautiful thing to see. Like to watch the rallying of the culture behind Kamala Harris and to watch the I don't know what to call it, but like the internal resilience of black women and black female culture get triggered in this moment and create a movement behind Kamala has actually been really beautiful to see. Welcome back
to Family Therapy. I'm your host, Elliott Connie, and as usual, I'm gonna ask the most common question I ask, which is what's been better since you listen to the previous episode and It's not just a question, it's training. The reason I keep asking is I want you to be to go through your life noticing the things that are pleasing you, because the more you can train your brain to notice those things, the more you can experience them.
I want all of you to realize that in every single day, in every single week, there are things happening that are very very good for you and things happening that are not. That is true for all of us, and the people who are the most happy, most satisfied, most fulfilled are the ones who can train their brain to notice the things that are happening that please them. So that's why I ask you that question. This week's
session highlights a conversation with Freddie and Jay. We dive into the layers of generational trauma that have created estrangement in their family. Jay shares her new observations of changes in her father and wants the other siblings to take the time to see them as well. Freddie desperately wants to prove Jay right and be the man he is for her and his other children as well, but he
has to keep showing up. The family value system for several generations has not been reinforced, thus making the effort to connect very challenging. Generational trauma, family curses, unhealed pain, estrangement, and inconsistency are a plague that runs through many, many families until someone steps up and says, I forgive you, I see you, and let's heal and move forward. So, Jay, the last time we talked together with dad, he said some things that you had never heard him say before.
What's been better between you and Dad since we had that conversation?
I think we have a better understanding of each other. I don't know that.
The way we interact with each other has changed necessarily, but I think we have a better understanding with each other.
How do you know that? Like, what's different about the understanding having one another?
I'm not sure I know what. I just feel it. Okay, I feel like I feel like he probably understands me better. I understand him better.
And what are you most pleased with about what you see your dad doing here in the last few weeks?
Help me fix my kitchen? So I'm pleased with that?
Did he really?
Oh?
Oh yeah, I'm.
Solid with projects all the time. He's very good at, you know, doing contractor work.
So I've heard that.
Yeah, yeah, some of things like that.
Now, one of the things, one of the things about the way he's been conducting himself in the past few weeks that has impressed me is the way he's continuing to put forth effort in reaching out to SIA. What do you think about watching him do that?
I think it's commendable.
I don't think he's gonna get the results that he would like, but I think, you know, it's always worth a try.
The reason why I think it's such a good sign is like earlier today, Freddy said, you know, he's been a runner all his life, and now he's facing this knowing that the potential outcome could be difficult, but he's still doing it. And I think that says something about him. What do you think?
Yeah, absolutely, I definitely feel like he's in a stage of his life where he's kind of planning his roots and he's kind of decided to be prevent and be you know, more consistent than he has in the past.
So I think that's a beautiful thing.
Okay, cool, And what are you guys hoping we can get accomplished in our conversation today?
I'm hoping that you can put us in the direction of a more positive direction, and for us to uh, for us to capitalize on building a stronger relationship between me and her and and and the rest of her brothers and sisters and and and to unify the family bond. I kind of I kind of like when she said that, Uh, she doesn't think it's gonna be favorable with Jason, and Jason could be sometimes And sometimes I'm a little stubborn too, I think, Uh, I think that kind of uh twinkled
down to all my kids, you know what I mean. Uh, in a way it's hard to like get them to bounce back in a different direction. But uh, no matter what the outcome is gonna be, He's he's always gonna be my son, and I'm always gonna be able to do anything in the world that I can to help him or in that fashion. But I don't think it could be no worse than what it is now, you know what I mean, for us not to be talking.
So if he's talking that to me and cursing me up of climbing one of the pegs on the ladder, you know what I mean, we have a conversation, you know what I mean. So that's that's I'm looking at the outcome like that he had to get in. We had, like I think, we had autiful friendship and sometimes therese of that nature. They don't. They don't never disappear, you know what I mean? Some love this don't never disappear. We just hold back on the love is always there,
you know. So hopefully that uh you know, I shattered that ice with him, not I just have to use different avenues. If I can't get through the directly to him, I just got to use a different avenue. So when when whenever that avenue meets with him, the topic of me will arise, you know what I'm saying, wherever he whoever, so that my name would be mentioned, so he ain't gonna be able to escape it, you know what I mean. So uh, sooner, ladies gonna have to come, you know, come around.
Okay, So if we can have a conversation today me, you and Jay that continues to bring the family back together, you'd be pleased extremely Yeah, okay, Jay, to ask you your favorite question, what do you what do you hope to get from talking today?
I'm just gonna piggyback off of that one.
Yeah, I think that would be a great, a great thing to achieve some you know, I'm being facetious, but seriously, I do because as the oldest girl, I feel like it's kind of my responsibility to try and connect with with all the kids in some way and somehow bring
them together. I do think that our parents across the board failed us in that aspect, as far as us knowing each other and making it their business to make sure that we have like had a relationship into our you know, as we got older teenagers, young adults.
But I get it.
You know, everybody's living their lives in different parts of the country and kind of doing their own thing. But now that you know, we're older, now it's our responsibility to decide if we want to have a relationship. And there's you know, the grandchildren at this point, our present, so they shouldn't have an opportunity to.
Know each other as well. I did reach out to me just at one point.
Asking her if we could all, you know, meet up connect in some way. She seemed open to it and kind of gently mention it to the other ones, but really get no response.
So I'll try again, you know, I'll.
See if there's a way that we can all see each other, see each other's faces. Like I saw Parrife a few years back, and I was like the first time I had seen him in I don't know how long. So I think it would be a beautiful thing if we could make that happen.
What do you think it would mean for the family? Jay, if you're able to make that happen. You said it's a beautiful thing, but like, how would that make a difference for the family, for you to be as one of the oldest children, to take the rein and connect all of that.
I mean, I don't know if it would make a difference for anybody else, but for me, there's a few few things there. So the four my siblings that are for my mother and my father same mother and father, are not.
A unified front at all.
So I think it would be very unlikely that my brothers would be involved.
I mean, you know, with slid being enough and.
Are like, I don't know, he's it's iffy, Nah, it's no relationship at all. So I feel like if I can at least have a relationship with my other siblings that it can kind of hopefully get us kind of have of the next generation having a relationship as well, and I think that, you know, we have to get to a point where families are not so disjointed, like nobody knows each other and nobody is you.
Know, has a relationship.
You know, there's like groups, like little mini groups, but at the end of the day, we all share the same the same bloodline.
And I think that I just I just feel it's important.
How come, because I've had a lot of friendships in my life, and at the end of the day, my family is what remains. And I still have friends and I have, you know, people that I feel like I always would be connected to, but you know, friendships can kind of come and go, but at the end of the day, it's family. You know that that same blood
is thicking on water, is right. It took me a really long time to believe that, but I do believe it now, and I do think it matters, and you know, there's an opportunity that we should try.
We should at least try now.
You have said now twice, at least twice, how important it was for the kids to know each other, like the grandkids, right, Like, yeah, why do you think that matters? Why is it so important to you that the next generation of kids don't have the estrangement that you that you're talking about you guys.
Having, because every generation before them is getting has got it wrong.
So at some point we got to break this. You know.
I know people throw around this generational curse you know phrase a lot, but for lack of a better phrase, that at some point that curse has to be broken. You know, every generation cannot be disconnected, and not not to say that everything's going to be perfect.
I don't expect that, but you know we can.
We can know each other, we can talk to each other. You know, my mother and her brother don't have a relationship.
I don't know.
I know my father has relationship with his siblings to a certain extent, but I don't know that is that tight. So I just feel like, you know, every generation prior has missed the ball in some way, and I think it's important that we teach our children that, you know, relationship, these relationships do have value and they are important. And if not one else in the world is there for you, the family will be.
And I think we can create that bond and teach.
That value system, then you know, our children won't ever feel alone, They'll never feel.
Like they have.
You know, they're always going to have their parents. But you know, it's not just about your parents. You know, there's the family is there. We come from a long line of people, and we should know who those people are and we should be connected to the truth of those people.
Jane, what would it be like for you two? And look, this stuff doesn't happen overnight, and I'm sure you've already figured that out, But what would it be like for you to contribute to breaking the family curse? What difference did that make for you?
You know, when I'm no longer here, I don't know that my kids have other people that they can, you know, feel connected to.
And what do you know about your father that you wish your siblings knew?
I wish they knew that he is not who he used to be. I wish they knew that that he has fought the good fight and he's been able to overcome a lot of obstacles, and that he he is someone that they can rely on, someone that he can they can talk to, and someone that you know, has a wealth of knowledge to share and funny stories. And you know, I think I think he's a He's he's a pretty solid guy, like.
You know what I mean, Like I don't hold.
Animosities towards him, so you know, I can see the goodness of him, and I would want them to have the opportunity to see that as well.
I think that's really special about you. By the way, Jay, how did you get to a point where you can see I just think you said something so incredibly powerful. He's not the man he used to be. How come you could get to the point where you can see that in him?
Because he's shown me he has consistently over the last four years. I would say, he's shown me that, you know.
He he's available, he's here, he's present, and that he you know, he wants to care.
He wants to show that he cares. And I can just see it, you know, And it's not, you know, some pie in the sky. He's shown it to me. He's already proven to me that that that's the thing, that's the thing for him. So I don't have to question it. I can see why his actions that you know, he's serious about knowing me and knowing my family.
Man Freddy, she just said something, really, she said, he's not the same man he used to be. You can depend on him. You can rely on him. He's a wealth of knowledge and information and you can talk to him. She just said all of that.
Wow, it's almost.
Like, uh, fill this bucket up about me right now, because you know some somethings that a hot woman uh uh that this this fills your soul up, you know what I mean?
And I feel that Uh. I think like a lot of people, that they remember the worst part about you, Yes, sir, you know, they remember the evil things that you did, you know what I mean. They don't They don't remember the things that you're trying to make a missions for or the things you're trying to to uh to correct or or or to say you're sorry for Please forgive me for all the things that I've done wrong to
you and you and your life, you know what I mean. Uh. They don't open up their heart, they don't open up their mind, they don't use They just hold on to the bitterness, you know what I mean. And I think that, uh, when you allow yourself to do that, you you could be eating up away inside, you know what I mean. All that this filters keep filtering out, and your whole and your whole relationship with everybody, you know what I mean.
So you you gotta give a chance for a room for forgiveness in your life for people, you know what I mean. So if you see somebody trying to make amends or trying to make a change in their life, or have made a change in their life, and you're not willing to accept them back or accept that, uh to forgive them, then you know you hurting your own self, you know what I mean? Because like life is too up, man,
life is way too short. The whole the whole animosity or whole vengeance or her whole uh built on inside you. You know what I mean. You got to release that, man. You just gotta let it just float up in the atmosphere. Man, you just gotta just let it go.
Yeah, you know what I mean. Look, one of the things I know about Jay is she's not very good at bsing like she's going to tell you how she feels about things. Would you say that's true about her?
Yeah, there's a lot of conversations that I had with her, uh that the things that she said said to me that would you know, hit the bullseye, you know what I mean. You'd be like, sometimes you need somebody to tell you the truth, man, you know what I mean, not to beat around the bush with stuff, You know what I mean, to be like straightforward like bang. You know that's you know, it's like that. It's like that,
you know what I'm saying. Sometimes you have a conversation with somebody and they just they just feeding back off what you're saying, you know what I'm saying, And they don't got they don't say nothing contradict you to what you're saying. You know what I'm saying. That it's such a show of agreement, you know what I mean. You don't want to have a conversation with a person that always gonna be yes, yes, yes, you know what I mean.
So when I when I talk to when I talk to Jay, and she said, if I say something that she thinks is wrong, she has no uh hesitation to say, pop that ain't right.
Right, she has no problem that ain't right.
Not commend her for that because the fact that sometime in your life, you know, you you you you don't want to sit down with somebody that's gonna be a you know, a yes man. Everything you said you got, you know what I mean, like just to please you, you know what I'm saying they don't. They don't mind hurting your feelings a little bit, you know what I mean, just just to put you in the right the right path, and sometimes you feeling God to be gotta be hurt
a little bit to like yo, damn. You know that's that's right, you know.
Well, the reason the reason I say that is for her to say what she said, He's not the same man he used to be. He is dependable, he is reliable, and he is someone you can talk to. You must have done something to make her think that, because I'm betting in your lowest worst moment, she would not have
said that. So for her to say that now, you must have done something or some things plural that would allow her to say that, Freddie, what do you think you've done that would allow Jay to say what she just said.
I believe that sometime, you know, far as just to be uh, being acceptable to the things in your life. That's you know, sometimes people they'll sit back and watch, you know what I mean, he gonna go right, he going all right back into real thing. He ain't changed, you know what I mean. So sometimes people don't don't don't help you change, you know, they wait for you to feel you know what I'm saying, They wait wait for you fall on your face. You know what I'm saying.
Like with her, she gives you that help man, that that helping the advice. You know what I'm saying. She don't She's not waiting for you for the disaster. She's trying to prevent the disaster. You know, I think a lot of people just wait for you, you know, for you, you know, for you to mess up. You know, they feel more comfortable watching you and misery and watching you being happy, you know what i mean. So that's her
whole heart. Her heart is so so so so developed and in a way where she she always gives you that helping hand. You know what I'm saying, Uh, helping advice, you know what I mean, That encouragement. Sometimes somebody just need a little bit of encouragement along the way of life, you know what I mean. And see this type of person will give you that when you're just about to tumble. You know what I'm saying, She don't hold your hands so you don't fall on your face.
Yeah, she is all of those things. And I'm gonna say something to her about that in a second. But how did you conduct What did you do that helped her start to view you in a different way.
Well, I think a lot of things that I don't I used to do in my life. I don't do that at all, you know I don't. I don't fall victim to a lot of things. Uh, I take a responsibility sometimes. You know what I'm saying. You look for their skate route, you know what I mean. And I'm not looking for that skate roum no more. I'm finding, you know, the right path to take in my life now, you know what I'm saying. I'm not always looking for the no longer looking for the way out or the quick, fast,
fixed way. You know what I mean. I'm in that fight, you know, fight and fight hard, you know what I mean.
And I.
Enjoy my life now, you know what I mean, Like when I see when I see my friends or I see somebody that you still and life is so such in a term oil, you know what I mean. You know I can I can say to him, I said, you know I was dead. I know how it is,
you know what I mean. I know, like that's just a miserable life man to be ripping and running that day, you know, after a dollar, after a drug or after you know, after you know, anything that's not gonna be uh favorable in your life, you know what I mean. Just this just destroying you? You know what I mean?
What allowed you to be the kind of person like I don't do the things I used to anymore and I can now live my life on on this other path. What allowed you to do that?
Well?
I think that you know, you gotta face yourself, you know what I mean. You gotta, you gotta, you gotta make sure that you you're right, you know what I mean? And life, because like, if you don't love yourself, nobody else gonna love you. You know what I'm saying. You don't care about the next day, if you live or die, Nobody else gonna care if you live or die. You know what I mean. If you don't care about your own well being, anybody else ain't gonna care about your
well being. You know what I'm saying. You know what I'm saying. So if you if you don't care, and they see that you don't care about ship or nothing to you know what, they be like, you don't have that same sentimental They're gonna be like if you don't care, to watch your care. You know what I mean. If you don't love me, watch you'll love him. You know
what I mean. If we don't put forth as far as like showing that initiative and life, well you care and you you you you are available to somebody for any thing in their life, you know what I'm saying. If it ain't just to walk to somebody, actually walk to the store time, somebody could ask you to walk to go to the store form you know what I mean.
You know.
It's not always the biggest thing in life that you could do with somebody. Might just be that little thing that to stay hard, you know what I mean. So, and I'm coming to terms with those things in life where I'm open. I'm acceptable to everybody else's well being, you know what I mean, not only mine.
We'll be right back with more family therapy. When did you realize you could do it? Freddie? When did you realize you could turn things around?
Well, it wasn't exactly an earth shadow, mean an event that happened in my life that made me change change myself. I just got down on my knees one day and asked God to give me the strength to be a better man. To serve not only him, but to serve mankind and a positive aspect of life.
Freddie, Freddie, hold on, I'm gonna stop you real quick. Did you just say, Jay, did you hear what your dad just said? Freddy? Did you just say it wasn't an earth shattering event. I just got down on my knees and asked God to give me the strength to change my life. Did you just say that that sounds like an earth shattering moment to me? You said it was an earth shatter event. I just got down on my knees and ask God to help me be a better man. And apparently, as evidenced by the things Jay
has said, God answered that prayer. And you're gonna tell me that's not an earth shattering event.
Yeah, you know, because like I'm not saying like as far as like it is, because you know, uh, his accomplishments is always you know, sometimes it could be the smallest thing, uh to you, and that's all you need is that's that's that that little touch of that little light at the end of the tunnel, you know what I mean. Ain't gotta be a big flash or big like a irene your atomic bomb going off. Could this be that little, that little touch of encouragement that he
filled me with. AND's like, yo, you know, because I you know, I you know, like I said, I ain't think I was gonna be twenty five years old, you know what I mean. The way the way my life was going, man, twenty five was it was it.
Uh.
I couldn't even foresee it, you know what I mean. I really couldn't foresee you because like my life had been taken away from me so many times, you know what I mean, by me being in the streets and by me doing silly, stupid things, you know what I mean. I used to I used to even do things that what caused me to die, you know what I mean, just to prove my manhood approved that you know, I ain't, I ain't scared, you know what I mean. And I look back at those things that I did. Man, what
the hell was wrong with you? You know what I mean? What was on your What in the world you was thinking about? You know what I mean? So you know, I thank God for me being here now, like reaching that, I mean, reach sixty five, you know what I mean. I want to have a have a have a party. I'm hoping that that that'll come to effect, you know
what I mean, and hopefully that everybody would attend. As far as my family and kids, cousins, you know, I really like more of like be a family thing a guy and than like more than a social work affair, you know what I mean. As far as like my uncle's aunts, you know, cousins, you know, especially you know, my grandkids. You know what I mean. I'm kind of looking forward to because like I didn't, I never look
forward to celebrating the birthday, you know what I mean. Uh, I was just like living minute to minute out out, you know what I mean, And what kind of life is that? The half of and and being that don't really value their own life, you know what I mean, So you gotta come to self, you know, preservation Like I'm him, I'm gonna be sixty five is a joyful event for me now, you know what I mean. You know,
it's monumental to me now, so it's accomplished. It's something I would never if I was twenty four years old and somebody asked me, what are you gonna do when you sixty five? I said, man, I'll be like I'll be blown away because I think I would never make it to sixty five?
When is your sixty fifth birthday actually in August? In August? Did you ever think, and I want you to think, really honestly, think back to your lowest moment. You're incarcerated, you ain't talk to any of your kids, and however long did you ever think that one of your kids would describe you as dependable, easy to talk to, a wealth and knowledge, and reliable. Do you ever think in that low moment, man, when did you do you ever
think one of your kids would say that? And not just one of your kids, but like one of your honest you know, Jay is not someone to just say random stuff. If she said one of the things I've learned about Jay, and Jay correct me if I'm wrong. But if Jay says it, she means it. That's how Jay is like. She doesn't just talk. If Jay spoke it, she meant what she said. And she described you in those four ways. Reliable, dependable, He's not the man who used to be wealth and knowledge, easy to talk to.
Did you, when you were in your lowest moment, did you ever think one of your children will describe you in that way?
Not at all, not one bit. I think in my lowest moment in my life that that would never have crossed my mind, you know what I mean, for as far as one of my kids to be let's say something like that, you know what I mean, because it would be extremely outrageous, you know what I mean. Sometimes you can't you can't buy love, You can't buy a verse, well spoken word about somebody. You can't buy that, you know what I'm saying. And you can't produce that from
somebody unless it's real, you know what I mean. If it ain't real, it's gonna it's never gonna be manufactured like that, you know what I mean.
So one of the things I'm thinking is Jay has this really big goal. I'm not sure she knows how big it is, but Jay's got this really big ambition to like and I think the way she phrased it was to break the family curse. Jay, Did I catch that right? And like bring the family back together so that the children can grow up knowing their family. How can you help Jay do that? Freddie? What could be your role in helping Jay to accomplish changing the legacy within the family.
Well, I believe my purpose in that or try to an influence or we'll share with uh the families and and and and make sure that they realize that it's time for the family to have the real capital f on it. You know what I mean, really spelled each and every everybody's heart. You know what I'm saying, because we, like she said, our family, we we Everybody is in their own world, you know what I mean. Everybody doing their own thing. You know what I mean, with their
own little clique, you know what I mean. And that's their family. You know what I'm saying, and what you know, it's it's not extremely wrong, but the family is much bigger than this one one son and one daughter, you know what I mean. His cousins is, his sisters and brothers and grandkids. You know what I mean. I don't think we ever had a family reunion where everybody went bought T shirts, you know what I mean, Like I don't I don't believe that we ever had one of
something like that. It's something that we should we should always should look forward to, you know what I mean, if somebody could just like initiate something like that and put forth an effort to make it happy, you know what I mean. I mean, like you know, to bite down on you know, you know, and make it happy. Twenty twenty people show it up. Maybe the next time
fifty people show up. Sometimes word of mouth carries a lot of weight, especially like while I was at the family re union and they said, woll you ain't come? Ain't you family? You know what I mean? Sometimes you know you got you know, hit below the bell.
When I talk to the two of you, I just feel so much love. And Jay, can I there's something I want to say to you about what you're trying to accomplish and said, all right, can I share something with you and give you a suggestion maybe even advice if I could use that word. You are capable of so much love and this is an act of love
to be able to bring the family together. And the way you're describing and Freddy just said something that really stuck out to me, Like, you know, maybe the first time you do something, maybe a few people show up.
And I'm thinking, like I think your job, as you reach out to your siblings like you would talking about earlier, is just to invite them into this space, like invite them into this dynamic that you have created with Freddie and help them experience him the way you experience him, and if they accept that invitation, great, but if not, just keep doing it because one of the things I know is love is a very powerful and contagious thing. Like eventually people are going to be like, hey, what's
going on over there? And they eventually kind of attract to it. But the dynamic you're creating between you and your children and your father's slash their grandfather is a very powerful thing. And I'm not I wonder if you were aware of its power. And you can't make all the siblings see it, but you can cultivate it and nurture it to the point where the siblings start asking
about it, like what's going on over there? And then before you know it, one or two of them show up, and before you know it, they bring their kids, and before you know what I mean, like, you create the environment where it flourishes. You can't make them come, but you can just cultivate it to the point where everybody wants to be a part of it. Does that make sense?
Yes? Absolutely? I think I guess we're not ready. We're not quite ready for like.
You know, the T shirts yet, you know what I'm saying.
I do think on a small scale.
We can certainly start, you know, with those who are willing and let it build from there.
For sure, absolutely, and I'm willing to do that.
You're the right person at the right time to change the whole family legacy.
Yeah, I think so.
I think I can do that, I guess for me though, for for Pops, I think the biggest part that you could play is to show up for them the way you show up for me, because and to continue to try, you know, because they're not going to see you the way I see you, and it may take some time to get there. It may take some time to get there, and that's okay, and we may never get there with everybody, but you know, we start with what we can and we take it from there.
I just want to go back to something you said. I want to make sure we hit this. You said, one of the ways he can help you is to show up for them the way he shows up for you. Now, right, some of your siblings may make it harder for him to show up than you did. How do you want your dad to respond to that? Like, if one of your siblings makes it, you know, just not easy for him, right, How would you like to see your father how would like to see him respond to it when it's not easy.
To be patient? You know, you just got to be patient and keep that fighting spirit. You know. I think that.
The way you describe your relationship with Jason, I don't it may be just as challenging with some of the other children. So you just got to keep trying and just keep trying and not like not let it go because I don't think it's going to be easy. But you know, it hasn't been easy for us to not have you present. So it's not you know, tit for tat, but it is what it is.
You know, you know what Jay like, it's not really fair for him to expect easy, is it? Like it wasn't easy for you guys. He's got to go through some hard too. And I don't and I don't mean like payback with t for TAT like you were saying, but like, it is what it is.
When you haven't been present or consistent, this is the result. And it's just like need any If water in the plant, it's gonna flourish, it's gonna it's gonna live, But if you start watering it, it's gonna die. And hopefully you know the relationships with each one is not dead to a point that it can't be revived. But it's gonna need some sun, it's gonna need some some attention. It's gonna need a little bit of care, and hopefully, you know,
you'll be able to get there. I would love for you to grow old knowing that we You know, when you're eighty ninety years old, you can sit back and be like, I tried.
My best with all of them. You know, once I once I changed, I allowed my children to know who I am now.
Yeah, yeah, that's that's I mean, that's beautiful. Jay Like and Freddy. I want you to hear her. They had to go through something hard, so damn it, you do too.
Already. No, the pining that I probably put them through is layered up, you know. So if I break that layer down today, I got a chance to break another layer down the mall. So by the time Tuesday come, I'm working on another layer. So I know, like it's not gonna just the minute, just that quickly, because it been built up for so many years, you know what I mean. I think with my daughter, and I think I was in there. I was in there with her to the point where my kids was calling me on FaceTime.
You know, they knew who they knew who their papa was. And then I think, I think I started lacking again, you know what I mean. I started off again, you know what I mean. I wasn't constant with it, you know, and then I go back into their life. Then I build back up again, then I lack again, you know what I mean. I gotta be more persistent at it all the time, you know, not just a spot there, a spot there. They gotta be in a and you
as basis, you know what I mean. And I think that's the problem with her, you know what I mean, because like once you you know, you make it, develop something with it with somebody, and you keep pulling back again. It's hard for them to let you, let you for them let you back in because they think they're gonna I'm gonna fall out again, you know what I mean.
That is so important because I know for me, like I don't I don't do like I'm at that point in my life. I don't do people who are inconsistent wet. We don't do that around here, right, So absolutely though, don't do that for my children. If you're gonna be a part of their lives. You're gonna be a part of their lives. If you're not gonna be it, then you know, go, you know, do your thing. But there's
no inconsistency there. And Diana, like me, I'm a mother and she's a mother, and she probably feels the same way, like, nah, you're gonna if you're gonna be here, you're gonna have to be here because you're not gonna be pop pops sometimes, you know what I mean, Like this is this is not just a title. There's responsibility that comes with that. So hopefully you know what I'm saying. She she'll be open as you know, as things move forward.
But there's definitely not gonna be easy. But you gotta be you.
Gotta be serious about that part. You know, you set a calendar thing. Maybe you just know that you got to go down the list and call every single.
Kid once a week, you know what I mean. He's let that two hours to the side. You got a lot of kids though, so you might need three hours. I don't know, but you know, you might.
Just have to set that time to the side where you say, this is what I do at this time every week, once a week, you know, what I'm saying, and I think that might help you know.
But Freddy, I asked Jay, if you would have asked me right now, is what is Jay's biggest ambition? I would think it would be to break this family curse? And I asked her what does she need from Freddy to help her? And she gave a three word answer. Do you know what that three word answer was? She said it a couple of times. Actually, do you know what it was? Did you catch it? Being consistent, keep
showing up, That's what she said. She said it a couple of times, being consistent, being consistent, keep showing up. That's what she needs from you, because then the other siblings are going to see in you what she sees in you. And that's how families heal. I genuinely believe that there's nothing families can't get through together. It just might take some time, but you have to keep showing up.
When I call somebody and they don't answer, or they don't pick up or go straight to voicemail, it used to bother me a great deal, you know what I meant. I used to get defensive about it, you know what I mean? But did I realize it was my own full you know what I mean. I was the one that established that feeling with that out or with that person, the only one who made the situation in the way it is, you know what I mean. So I don't I don't get I don't get like to turd by
it anymore. I mean, like, okay, it ain't go too favorble this time. You know, if I call you four or five times and you still have an answer, you know I caused you know what I mean? You know I made an attempt. You know what I mean. Then one day, definitely they're gonna pick up the phone and voice their opinion voice they are they way they feeling, and I gotta suck it up like a sponge, you know, because I caused it the way they feel.
One of the ways I want you to think about this is your children aren't mad at you. They're mad at who you used to be. They just don't know that that's now different. Jay knows. So if you the reason why Jay wants you to keep showing up is she knows something very important. She knows that who you are and who you used to be aren't the same person. And if you keep showing up, then everybody will see that, But right now, not all the kids see that. They don't all know that who he is and who he
used to be aren't the same. So I want you to remember that they're not mad at you today. They're mad at who you used to be. They just don't know that who you are today is different. And if you keep showing up, they will learn that in the same way that Jay has. Because Jay now describes you as reliable, dependable, a wealth of knowledge, who is good to talk to. That's how she talks about you today. I'll bet you fifteen years ago that's not what she said,
but that's what she says now. Let everyone else in the family recognize, Oh, this guy is different.
I think it's also.
You know, if they ever hear this, I would want to express to them you can't hold on to what you want your parents to be. You have to be able to see them for the human they are right now, right and not even.
Just as a father figure. You know what I'm saying.
I think a lot of the challenges I had when I was younger is like I had this expectation or what a dad should be, what a mom should be, and then as I got older, I just kind of let it go, and I just say, you know what, I'm gonna let them be who they are, and then I'm gonna understand take the moment to understand who they
are and adjust accordingly. So I just hope that they will have, you know, be able to get to a point where they just say, you know what, I'm going to let him be who he is and accept and be accepting of that and try to establish a relationship based on the truth.
Of who he is, not the image that I want him to be right.
And it turns out who he is is not so bad. Who he was was in by alcohol, drugs, the streets. Who he is is actually a pretty reliable, dependable, loving, caring guy. Ye but she but Jay can't show you off to the siblings unless you keep showing up so they get to see that. Freddy. Does that make sense?
Great deal?
Yeah? Do lie? Yo?
Listen, Freddy.
Show her that she's right, because she's right.
That's my first ambition and in my life is to show her she absolutely right.
Right.
Generational trauma is defined as trauma that is passed down from one generation to the next. This is very very relevant in the black community. The first trauma, being slavery, and all of the things that happen in coping with such trauma, drinking, Like, there are lots of things that happen in the context of that issue poverty. I mean, there's a lot of trauma that gets passed down. So
how do we recognize it? I think we all know kind of what's good for us and what we should be doing that that is in our best interest, and you've got to be willing to break the pattern. And breaking a pattern is really really hard because whether it's a good habit or a bad habit, whether it's a good pattern or a bad pattern, we all rely on the patterns. So when you do something that is outside of the pattern, even if good, the system will have a response to try to keep you in line with
the previously held pattern. So the pattern breaker has to be a very strong and resilient person and understand that they're going against the system and the system will push back. So the best way to know whether you're dealing with a generational trauma or not is to rely on your instincts that tell you what is good for you and what is not and follow the path of the things that are good for you. And understand the system is
going to push back, and you fight that pushing. The other really beautiful thing is you don't even have to fully understand the trauma. That's actually not the goal and it's not the point. Your job is to get fully committed to creating a new pattern and understanding it's going to be hard. Stay tuned for my final thoughts after
this as it relates to change. In how to recognize change, I read a quote in a book many many years ago that says a change is only a change if it's noticed whenever someone has caused you harm and someone close to you like a parent or a partner or something best friend. Change is also really scary because you also don't know if you can trust it. So the number one thing I would like to say about this topic is the way to notice change is to look
for it and understand it's going to take a risk. Now, I'm not asking you to experience harm while someone is changing, but I am saying if it's one of those relationships like we only get one mom and one dad, like some of these relationships are so close that they're worth the risk, and actually having those people out of your life causes even more harm. So with someone like Freddy who is trying, just take the opportunity to look and
see evidence of the change. Maybe you'll see something, maybe you won't, But if you look for it, then you give yourself the opportunity to experience something new, different in healing. If you don't see it, then continue to have a boundary against that person. But if you do see it, it'll change your life and change theirs in a monumental way. And I think that's worth it, worth it, worth it. It's important to ask yourself different questions on your healing journey.
For the next few weeks, I will ask you a question at the end of each episode to hopefully inspire your inner superhero. This week, I want you to ask yourself, given that forgiveness is the greatest gift that you will ever give yourself, who in your family's lineage needs the most forgiving, even if that person is no longer with us. I want you to look back, who in your family's lineage needs the most forgiving and if you are able to achieve that forgiveness, what difference would it make to
that person and to yourself. This is not just a podcast that I want you to consume and be entertained by I actually want you to be inspired. I want you to be impacted by this, and in fact, we can't help but be impacted by the content we consume. So what I would like for you to do is come on this healing journey with us. Come on this journey of change rediscovery with us. And the way to do that is to just pay attention to the things going on in your life as a consequence of listening
to this podcast. Pay attention to things in your life shifting in a more desirable way. Pay attention to your desirable outcome becoming your reality. Pay attention to evidence of your success, your resilience, and your strength. And let us know in the comments what you're noticing in your life as a result of listening to this podcast and as a result of paying attention to these things. I would love to hear from you about your healing journey, your family,
and your feedback. Leave a review, send a DM, connect me on socials at Elliott Speaks, and you can also send me a text message to nine seven two four two six two six four zero. Family Therapy is a production of iHeartRadio and The Black Effect Podcast Network. Special Thanks to our assistant, Glendale Seppe. It's produced by Jack Queish Thomas and the executive producer Dolly S.
S Fisher.
For more podcasts from The Black Effect, visit the iHeartRadio app or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. The content presented on The Family Therapy podcast serves solely for educational and informational purposes. It should not be considered a replacement for personalized medical or mental health guidance and does not constitute a provider patient relationship. It is advisable to consult with your healthcare provider or health team for any specific concerns or questions you may have.