This is I on the Ball with Steve Rivera and Jaken Zalez on Fox Sports fourteen fifteen powered by Nova Insurance Services. Make sure your most prized possessions Katz R two Son and i Heeart Radio Station. Hey, good afternoon, everybody. Welcome to I on the Ball here on Fox Sports fourteen fifty. I'm Steve. He's jagn Zalees. He's an older jagn Zalis today today only you know how that got put to me today Nobody said you're a year away from
medicaid. Someone you didn't punch. It's my brother. Oh, always a nice guy who's already on Yeah, he's been on it five years now. People, I know, I know somebody somebody said it's just numbers, and I'm says, you know, at this point, it's not just numbers. No, you feel the numbers. He's starting to feel the numbers. I feel the numbers. It sucks, thank you. Um um. It was something I was gonna say, oh sixty four, if someone someone said sent me a note today, how you're asking, how are you doing? I
said, I guess he's fine. He says, well, another year of no Rose Bowl and maybe no Rose Bowl at all. Ever, ever ever, we'll talk about all that. Well, you know, they got to get to the playoff at this point to get into the Rose Bowl, so we'll see. Well, you can always dream. That's a lot of big twelve talk today. Obviously, Hey, what was last time you worked an eight hour job? This is crazy. I got up, like I had to get up at seven o'clock. I had to take a shower and had
to be on campus by you know, quarter to nine. I haven't gone home yet. I had enough time to choke down a subway sandwich and then I'm here in the studio. It's been a crazy said this would be easy, but so christ is maybe the one of the first eight hour jobs we've had. We had the press commerce with the Hike and doctor Robbins at nine, like you said to put till about ten o'clock. Then we came. You did your your stuff here. I wrote my story for the website,
you did your clips here. We have Tommy Lloyd at one. I raced to see them practice just to briefly you came in again. Uh, and now we're here. Yeah, man, So it's uh, well, you know, all the all the official announcements came, you know, as our as as uh at the end of our show as we were getting out of here on Friday. Um, it's all happened, like uh, everybody thought it was going to but now it's the reality. We've had a whole weekend to kind of chew on it a little bit, um and uh, and
then we had this press conference this morning. We're gonna have John Wilner today because we you know, we had talked to him a number of times that when this thing, when this thing falls into place, you know, we
want to get you on the show. And John has actually said he thinks he can do half an hour to day, so okay, sofully, well, we'll be able to talk to John about you know, about what happened, and then you know, kind of a look forward to what's what's next, because that's that's the conversation now, it's what's next for a lot of people. Uh. Heke and Robins talked a lot about that today. I guess you'll have a few of a shoe clips into queue right for you.
Yeah, that you had said, let's kind of do a two or three? Are you here? Yeah, why don't you want to just start the hikey? So Dave Hekey introduced, you know, he started the press conference. Um, and some of these clips. You know, we had a comments at the beginning, then they went kind of back to the same subject later. So these are a little bit spliced together. So here are what I thought were introductory comments by both by both Heikey and Robbins at the top
of the press conference. It helps effectory on the microphone. Let me start that over. It's certainly been a challenging time, challenging decision, a lot of thoughtful consideration analysis. But UM, while we've appreciated and we certainly have, I want to say that we've appreciated and valued our partnership with the PAC twelve conference nearly five decades with the conference. Great people, um, great
rivalries, great friendships, great colleagues. It was about the future. It was about stability both financially and competitively, and again that was what was at the root of where we're headed to today. We wanted to continue a nationally competitive, nationally recognized, not only university but athletic program, and that's really important. I am very, very excited about this move to the Big twelve.
It's gonna be an exciting new direction for us Obviously, I've been a PAC twelve guy for a long long time, even growing up as an SEC guy watching PAC twelve games, and you know, my hope some way there's a way to keep the conference together. But without a TV deal and just a few schools left, then I think that it's gonna be a problem. But I am very excited about moving to the Big twelve. Yeah. It was one of those days where we already knew the news. It was more
about explanations. Right we got here, right, Um, I don't think anything surprised you now, you know, And but what I was surprised at how much of the detail we got Okay, right in the final moment, right yeah, as to how it how it came together, and it was it was pretty crazy. So um, you know, Robins was right right after this, right after the Dave Kicky um a comment was just asked, you know what, what was the key? And here's what he said.
I think the things that I've seen in the press reported are pretty accurate about the deal uh that Apple provided. I think the keys were, um, the twenty three million dollars a year per school and uh no games on linear access. I think those were the two things that were problematic for UH people when they were evaluating the um long long term sustainability of the contract, and
of course that it was subscription based. So parts of it were very very compelling and exciting and it was Apple, um and it was you know, in our backyard and UM. But I think the base price, the guaranteed price, the fact that there was no linear and that it was subscription base. None of us, you know, we were trying to think, well, it's going to be like selling uh, you know, candy bars for a Little League or you know, girl Scout cookies. I don't know,
of course Scout cookies or you can say that anymore. But um, you get my point. You got to convince three to five million people every year to sign up for one hundred dollars a year to watch on a streaming only out. I think, I think, you know, if you're asking Oregon and Washington, they came to the conclusion that that may not be the best deal, and when when they had opportunities for other deals, I think, again not blaming anybody, they made the best decision that they thought was in
the interests of their university. And I will never fault to anybody for doing that. Jay, Let me ask you this because I saw this in a couple of the news feeds I get. Did you take did you You were in the room, So was I? And did you think that because of the girl Scout cookies and the chocolate bars, that he was taking a shot? No, neither did I. But in those headlines they said that the the UA president takes shot at and I'm thinking you weren't in the room.
You weren't. And the context was more of an analogy, Yeah, which was in a perfect about gleaner. Yeah, yeah, me too. And I'm thinking I saw this headline, I'm thinking that's not right. That it
was not. It wasn't. It wasn't taking a cho He was just basically saying that you're gonna be able to trying to sell this thing every year, right, which if you grew up playing Little league baseball every year they gave you a boxing sugar bars, you had to go sell And he's saying it's not easy and you have to convert people to buy them, right, And it wasn't going to be easy. Um. Then there's just a lot of kind of little pieces of this, right, the ASU piece, what was
one? Yeah, I wanted. He asked about it. I thought, you, before you do this, I thought your question was was exactly what kind of not exactly what I wanted, but I thought was a great question, because because whether or not they had confidence that deal was going to get done. And I would have said your question and mine, Whyian the heck did it take so long? Yeah? Because it took thirteen months? It
did, and we got this is what we got. Okay, well we'll play that because I did ask him, you know, were you did you think this was gonna get done? Here's what he said. I was very confident um market forces, changes, the economy, change the media companies we were just talking about some of them went through some hard times. But all the while, I was confident that that we would get a deal that we
would all like and it would keep us together. Uh So, I think things didn't really change until right at the end, but it and it took long, longer than I thought. I mean, I'm famously infamously quoted as saying, well, I think we'll have something by tax day. I didn't say what year, but anyway, and so it took longer, and I think the longer it took I actually thought the longer it took, the the more that the media companies could turn their temporary bad fortunes around and come back
to the table. The economy would get better. So I thought the longer we waited, at least more recently, the better that would be. But there there's certainly came a time when we we had to do it because I kept saying, oh, we got another year, we got into the year. Well now we're inside a year, so I think and all of you, you know, you were ready to move on and close that chapter of writing about it and get onto writing about the upcoming season, which we are
very excited about. I think this ironically could be one of the greatest seasons in Pact twelve football, at least since I've been around. No, I agree with him. The funny thing about doctor Robbins, and you know him better than I do. I've spoken to him just a few times. Um, he's a smart dude. We all know that. But he's a simple smart dude. He is he talking him playing the English. He doesn't try to talk over your head. He doesn't. He's he's comfortable with how smart
he is so that he doesn't have to. Let you know, how smart he He kind of joked about, you know, going I could go scientific on you or what did you say about something? Yeah, I could go nuclear side whatever, but I don't think I will. Yeah, he comes out even how he speaks, it's more of a good old boy smart. Well he is kind of a good old boy from the South. It was a good thing today. We got a clarification how things will worked. There
was a deal possibly on Friday morning. Well I want to play that because you know there was all this, you know, so much speculation, uh you know, all over the place about this, and as it turns out, they came close. They can't close. I mean, you know we've heard people say that it was really close, and I'm like, I how close was it? Well here's what he had to say about how close it
was. Yeah, I think at the end of the day, Um, you know, look, we were we were I think we were all expecting Friday morning, we were showing up together to sign and blood our grand rights over to the to the PAC twelve conference, and um, you know we were notified. Uh by I guess they must have split us up. I got called by one of the presidents and said, look, this is tough, but we um, we came to an agreement with a big ten, uh you know, ten minutes ago, and I just wanted to give you
heads up before we get together us presidence and chancellors. That will be we'll be taking our talents to the Big ten. Yeah, that's that's crazy. I just had no idea that there was, because people were saying the pack was really going to do this, that they're not, and then they really were. And then all of a sudden, Oregon and Washington step out and say we're gone. And that was that. Sure. Um, but I
don't know they were gonna goes. I have a hard time of leaving they would have ever signed that deal going linear, going up streaming only right, You wouldn't think that would be possible. But but this this too. I wonder if if the presidents were all old dudes, yeah and they're all and women, Um, that if they were a younger group who know about streaming and things like that. Because Jay, the Arizona Bowl goes streaming more and more, it's going in that direction. It just might be too soon,
maybe not tomorrow, right five years from now. I'm screwed if that's a because I have no idea what I was doing. I'm pretty good with it. I feel, you know, I've got you know, I bought t I bought smart TV. It's like I've learned how to handle them. And here's the thing. And you're in trouble then, because even my wife knows how to handle them. So that's not that hard. It's not that hard because you come over and program no, because we I I couldn't program your
BCR anymore. All Right, UM, we're gonna get John Wilner up on the phone here in a in in a minute or so. But um, we got a whole lot more from the press conference today, um, talking about travel costs, talking about you know, uh the A s U and and and whether or not they were wanted to pull away from a SU or not. Um, you know, just uh how long this lasted, uh you know, and and then just in the end again why they did it? What we'll hear again from both the Bobby Robbins and Dave he Kiss to
sort of a look forward. This is why they had to do this. But I say, we give John Wilner collin and try and get him on and we'll again, I think we're gonna have him for two segments, so he's got a lot of knowledge, a lot of information. He's been on top of this from the beginning. Sol excuse me. We'll see what will
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on the My Heart Radio WAPP. This is I on the Ball with Steve Rivera and Jakin Salez on Fox Sports fourteen fifteen. Okay, welcome back to I on the Ball here on Fox Sports fourteen. Cookie, I'm Steve Rivera, He's Jaken Salis. Now on the phone. We have John Wilner from the PAC twelve hotline. John, how are you? I'm good? Thanks? How you guys? Oh? Good? Are you party for a lot?
Less good than you? Because because it's no, I don't know is it over even though that some decisions have been made or are you still going to follow the pack? Four? Oh yeah, Uh, there's a lot going on and I think, you know, maybe this week we'll have a sense for what's gonna The next step is going to be for Cale Stanford and then for Washington State Oregon State, but that is very much up in the air. So we had there was a news conference with with with uh Bobby
Robbins and Dave Hickey this morning. Um, it sounds like it came down just the way it had been it was getting reported, at least in terms of what happened Thursday night and Friday. Bobby Robin said, we're ready to sign the deal. We're ready to sign in blood. And then ten minutes, uh, you know, ten minutes later, I get a call from one of the he didn't say which president, from Oregon or Washington said they
were going to to the Big Ten. What was your understand was that your understanding of how it happened and how did that happen that the pac cub got so close to getting the getting this is done and then it blew up? Yeah, No, that's my understanding is Apple made a counter offer Thursday night, and everybody was satisfied with it, not happy with it, but satisfied
with it. And then overnight or early in the morning, the Big Ten basically and Fox worked Oregon and Washington got to the point where the numbers would work for those schools, and so at that point, right before the meeting at seven am, Oregon Washington said you know what, We're okay, we're out. So it was really the overnight dealings between those two schools and Fox and the Big Ten that that got them. They kind of blew the whole
thing up at the last second. Well, you're surprised that the PAC twelve was ready was going to sign the deal because I thought all along that the four Corner school so the three corner schools, you know, we're not going to leave. They weren't going to be the ones that would blow up the league. That as really wasn't going to want to leave, and so it all depended on the Big Ten. To me, the entire thirteen months was defined by the Big Ten threat. That was always the number one existential threat
for the PAC twelves future. The Big Ten and Fox. I mean I should probably just say Fox and not the Big tents. It's Fox calls the shots there. Fox was not interested in expanding, right because the adding organ in Washington has costing Fox like three hundred and fifty million dollars or something like that, because those schools are getting thirty two million each for six years, and so Fox was not willing to come up with the extra money for ten
eleven months. But the problem is the PAC twelve couldn't get a deal closed during that window when Fox in the Big Ten were kind of taking a snooze and so then by the time the deal happens, Fox and the Big Ten have Fox has come up with the money, and the Big ten has decided, the presidents have decided that they're willing to expand, and so the existential
threat kind of weird up and destroyed the Pac twelve. Had this deal been made or given or presented itself back in the day six months ago, five months ago, however, months ago, would it have been done then,
or is this just the right time to get it done? Well, I don't know for sure, but it sure seems like based on what the Big ten presidents and Fox has been saying for the last nine or ten months, it seems like if the Pack twelve had been able to get this deal done, you know, either in the winner or spring that there was that Fox was not gonna was not going to kind of come out of nowhere and decimated
by offering Organ and Washington the kind of money that they wanted. Now, the other piece that you know, there's also the strategic piece that you have to consider, which is that Fox may have wanted to blow up the deal because they don't want Apple getting into the college sports space because Apple Right is
streaming Fox is very Fox barely has a director consumer product. Fox is still all linear, right, and they may have wanted to keep Apple out of college sports or college football, and that's why they decided to get come out of nowhere and muster enough money to get organ in Washington to leave. You know. One of the things that Robbins again talked about this morning was the blame that there's blame can be all over the place, but there's got to
be some places where there's maybe more blame than others. Sounds like you're saying Fox may may bear the burden with some of that because they were protecting themselves. You know, you have Oregon in Washington had they stuck around, You have Colorado had they stuck around. You know, you have the PAC twelve administration because they didn't get a deal done. But there's levels of blame somewhere. But where's the biggest piece of blame go on this thing over the last
thirteen months. Well? Yeah, I mean, I don't know if you can portray Fox as to blame that they're kind of more like the villain, but they're making the business decisions for them that they think makes sense. I mean, if you're pretty blaming. I wouldn't blame Colorado because I think I think the conference was solid even after Colorado left. I mean, to me, the blame goes there's a triangle of blame, right It's the presidents for
all the stupid decisions that have been made for the last twelve years. It's Larry Scott, and it's George Clarkoff. They have all they all now And I would say, because the presidents ultimately run the conference, they are ultimately to blame right there, that at the very top of the organizational chart, they bear the greatest responsibility. But certainly the two commissioners have you know,
that have made a slew of strategic errors. You could argue, I mean, the way they formed the pactual networks was bad, But to be the biggest mistake was in twenty eighteen when ESPN went to Larry Scott and offered a lifeboat. They said they'd take over the PACTUAL networks and they'd signed the PACTUAL to a long term deal, and Larry Scott said, no, we're going to continue to go at it go alone here. That left the conference vulnerable to USC and UCLA getting poached by the Big ten. To me, that
was the biggest mistake. That said, everything else in motion that's occurred over the last fourteen months. Wow, that's that's not that, it's part that possibly. I mean, now, was Larry Scott doing that at the direction of the presidents? Did Larry Scott say no? And then when until the presidents I said no, Well, he has to get their approval to do on something like that. But he would advise them. He would say, I don't think we should do it, and here's why. And they don't
know enough about the media world. And this has been the problem from the start when the conference decided to form its own media company. The presidents don't know enough about the media world to make smart decisions. And so they hired a commissioner and put him in charge. And he kind of was able to do what he wanted with those issues, and they just they signed off on it and supported it. But they don't Yeah we're here. Yeah you're still
there, John. Okay, it sound like it sound like your phone clicked off. So John, let me ask you so. Oh, so Larry Scott's now gone. They wait a little while to get George in there, and I know I'm asking a tough question. Here is he the guy. Was he the right guy? Clearly? No, I mean there were signs that he wasn't the right guy for a while. My view was he was hired for one to do one thing, which was get a media rights deal that would keep the conference together, and he didn't do it. And so,
you know, I mean, that's that's pretty much the situation. You go back to the spring of twenty twenty one when they were looking for a commissioner and you thought, to yourself, they've just hired They've just been through this tough stretch with a guy who was a Tennis Women's Tennis Association commissioner, no background in college sports. He makes all these mistakes, and you thought, in the spring of twenty twenty one, they need to hire somebody that
has college sports experience. And they turn around and they hire a guy who had no college sports experience, who who was the president of MGM Sports and then entertainment, and so you think, all right, well, let's see if he can get it done. And then he doesn't get it done. He came close. I mean again, if Fox hadn't come up with the money for Washington Oregon, they'd have a deal and the nine would be together, and they would have added to Indego State already and they'd be moving forward.
He came razor close to getting this thing done and he didn't. And that was the one thing he's had to do. He's been in charge for two years, he's lost eight schools ouch putting that way. Yeah, So along the way, John and you talked about, you know, this thirteen month or deal that you know, it was like a massive coaching search, the worst coaching search you know ever. You know, dealing with this,
you know, day in day out, on vacations and whatnot. Along the way, where was your mind in terms of what was ultimately going to happen? I mean, were there times that you thought it's over, they're gone there, you know, the a bunch of teams going to the Big twelve in the Big ten? Were there times when it looked like they were going to stick together? Was there ever a time that you definitively thought this is just about done and then wasn't done? And then you know in which direction
it was going to go? You know, I'm just where what did you think was going to happen at different different points along the way? Well, I mean I could think back to a couple of different points. One is they when I had kind of thought they were working on parallel tracks last fall, basically putting a deal together if UCLA had stayed and a deal together. As there was no UCLA. We came out of the holidays and it was clear that they were not close to a deal, and to me, that
was a big warning sign. And I even wrote something about the risk that Kliukoff was taking with his lack of urgency. I then thought it was a good chance that they were going to get a deal done in March or April, because several presidents indicated that that was the case. Then I thought they were going to get a deal done before patrol of Media Day, and they
never did. But in terms of whether it was going to work or not, you know, I set up a point spread, right, And I know I don't need to explain to you guys, but you know I had for the last five months basically I had Survival as a four point favorite over Extinction. And if you think about what that means in a football game, right, if you see a four point spread, you figured that's gonna be a close game. And I thought this all along was going to be a
close game. And the two things that ultimately were framing my view was is the big tenh threat real or you know, dormant, and also that nobody was going to want to be the president that pulled the plug on the conference. So I'm assuming in the big winners big losers view of this, the big winners were the were the teams that left, the eventual teams that left, and the big loser is the conference. Well, the biggest winner spots which now has you know, Oregon, Washington, USC, UCLA, They're
the biggest They're the biggest winner. Certainly the teams that left are are winners in some regards, right, not all. I mean, I think you could have made a case for a lot of those schools that they will be better off in a pack twelve that had stuck together, you know, the clear the losers, I mean, I feel terrible for Oregon State, Washington State, especially in count Stanford in Oregon State. Washington State has been to
a Bowl game seven years in a row except for the COVID season. Nobody does a better job in the conference with what they have, with their resources, with their location, with their recruiting base. Nobody does a better job than Washington State, and here they are cast adrift in this whole realignment game, and it is going to cost their Olympic sport athletes, It's going to
cost their employees. I just feel terrible for those schools. Man. You know, when you think about you know, the one hundred years of the Pac twelve, and you know the greatness of the Rose Bowl and all those things. I mean, I just it's really hard for me to believe that we're sitting You're saying this thing is done, it's over, it's gone, it's it's disintegrated into thin air. Yep. And the other piece that I'm interested in, you know, competitively, We'll see how how these schools do.
I mean, how are the West Cood schools going to do in the Big ten, especially in football? How are the corner schools going to do in the Big twelve. I mean, you know, Arizona for regular season basketball, it's fantastic, But Arizona is also going to come out of the Big twelve season with a lot more losses, which will impact their NCAA tournament seating, which can impact your success. So there's a give and take.
Utah two. You know, Utah has got a much better chance going into the playoff football playoffs if they're in a ten team Pac twelve, right, it doesn't have USC then they have coming out of a sixteen team Big twelve. So there's always a competitive trade off something like this. But obviously the schools, certainly once Oregon washing A left the corner schools had no choice. So John, we're running out of time in this first segment. Can we
get you back for another segment? And then right after the commercial? Yeah? Sure, thanks, Okay, we'll come back with John. Yeah, we want to talk about going forward now, Okay, right, super, let's talk about what now? Right, So let's do that. Okay, all right, we'll take a break. We'll be right back. If you're an Arizona men's basketball fan, you know it's been successful for nearly forty years.
Now take a look back at the Ludolson era. In my new book, Lessons from Loot, It was a labor of love through the eyes of twenty five former players, coaches, and friends to give insight to the coach and the man who led them, competed against them, and inspired them twenty five chapters for his twenty five years as Arizona's beloved coach. Lessons from Loot is an insight to how he built the program into a national powerhouse. One
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apply online today at a team security dot Net. Breaking down all the exs and ols. It's Steve Rivera and Jaden Salvins. This is I on the Ball on Fox Sports fourteen fifty. Well, welcome back to Y on the Ball here Fox Sports fourteen fifty post Steve throughout, He's Jagen's Austen now on the phone? Are returning with the phone? Is God Wilner? So, John, you talked about Utah wouldn't be Packed Pac ten and Pack Big twelve? How how sexy would have been the Pac ten under the conditions that we
kind of saw them in. You mean if they had gotten a deal done? Yeah, yeah, well they would have. It would have been the nine schools, and they would have added San Diego States to replace Colorado, which I think would have been an upgrade. You know, it's certainly an upgrade basketball and also an upgrade in location and you know, recruiting footprint.
So that would have if they had been able to stick together, you know, Friday morning, then that's we would have a ten team conference moving forward for the next five years, and you know, it would have an automatic bid available to its football champion, and you know, I think it would have been a good conference. Yeah, been looking ahead. I mean I sit here, I feel like it would been fine. You know, they would have had a shot at the playoff and they would have still had a
conference. But the whole you know, uh section, the section, you know, the I mean, I mean they were ripping the Pac ten or the Pac twelve as a bad conference when USC and UCLA were in it. Now they were going to be out of it. So now you have all the you know, you've got Oregon, and I'm more concerned about, you know, for the corner schools going to the Big twelve, because that's what
we're going to talk about. But you know, I feel like, you know, Arizona and the other and the other schools have gone over there are now in a position where they're gonna get more visibility, more attention less of what has been acknowledged as an East Coast bias. I feel like in the end, they've landed in a better place than they would have been if they'd
have stuck in the PAC twelve. That's how I feel. I mean, don't you think that, you know, you're talking about from the tiefs, including the standpoint of the TV right, all things considered, you know that where the schools, how it ended up for and let's say specifically Arizona, they're in a better place overall than had the then had the PAC ten survived, you know, pack Night survived and added San Diego State, and then they'd been on Apple. I just feel like they're in the end, they're
in a better place. Well, we'll see. I agree with you based on what we know now. But what happens if Apple buys the ESPN in a few years, and what happens when all of ESPN is direct to consumer and Apple and Amazon or the premier distributors of sports and it's all on streaming, right, we don't know what the media world's going to look like in five years. So I don't know that you can necessarily say that at the end of this decade, the petul the Arizona will be in a better spot
because we just don't know what's going to happen. But certainly based on the present environment and you extrapolate from there with kind of a static view, Yeah, I think that there's a very good chance Arizona will come out of this in a better situationation, especially for uh, you know, it's basketball programs visibility during the regular season, there's no there's no doubt about that. Yeah,
that's why I wanted to go ahead. At the same time, you know, you got to think about I was on KMBR radio in San Francisco last last week with Tom Tolbert and and Tilbert is talking about how he always goes to watch the Cats when you're in the Bay Area, and he occasionally goes to watch football games, and now he can't see him anymore. And so you've got tens of thousands of alumni on the West Coast in California that
aren't going to be able to watch him play. So there's you know, there's drawbacks to it, right, and uh, That's one of the things that makes realignment so tough is that is driven by money and driven by TV. But it doesn't, you know, it doesn't necessarily account for all of the things that make college sports great. Yeah, no question. We talked about that last last week. Two fans, right, traveling, they're not traveling, So so John, who benefits most? And I'll stay with Arizona.
Arizona basketball looks to have a great, great conference to play in, right, and they'll come here, Kansas goes there, blah blah blah, Kansas come here, Arizona goes there. In football, Arizona's kind of like going to be middle of the road. We won't know until Jed gets this stuff going. Utah looks fantastic in the conference. So kind of like who benefits in each sport? Football? Basketball, Well, I mean again,
Arizona benefits because they're gonna have some really good regular season match us. But you know, I look at Arizona, who are not basketball, and I think they're gonna have to get a hell of a lot better and tougher if they're going to survive the Big twelve regular season with any kind of reasonable record. And NCAAC, I mean going through the Pac twelve on a week to week basis is nothing like going through the Big twelve. So we'll see.
And then, you know, it's a little bit like the good Zaga question, right, Are they better off in the WCC where they dominate and get a high seat in the NCAAs, or you better are they better off getting into a power conference whether they're gonna finish you know, fourth or fifth occasionally and go into the Nciblas as a seven seat And you know, we'll just
have to see how Arizona Arizona does in that regard. So I think you could make a case in football that it's going to be really hard for all four, for the Big ten, for all four of those West Coast schools, to deal with ten state, Ohio State, Michigan and all the travel
that's going to be involved. To me, it's a little bit unclear, but I do know this, the nil piece is going to be huge, and which of the Pack twelve schools besides Oregon is going to come up with a big time, an eye ol game that's going to allow them to compete for the recruits that they're going to need, you know, to thrive in these two two conferences. Interesting. Yeah, that's a piece that again we still don't know. So here's here's my story and I'm sticking to it.
John. I feel that assuming that Jetfish keeps the program going, you know, on an upswing, and you know, gets better and better to where it would have been competitive in the in the in the in the Pac twelve.
Because of the fact that there's no USC and no Oregon and to a degree, no Washington in the way in the Big twelve, I feel like there's a chance, a better chance for them to compete in the Big twelve than because from nineteen seventy eight until this year, USC has always been in the way over the last ten fifteen years, Oregon has been in the way for periods of time, Washington has been in the way where you thought Arizona
can't compete against those guys because they can't get those players. I know TCU was in the National Championship last year, but I don't think I TCU doesn't strike me as a team that is going to sustain a USC type of existence in the Big twelve. And then after that it's kind of like Oklahoma State, maybe some Baylor now and then Texts there's no button. There aren't a bunch of teams in the way for Arizona. I mean that's how I see it. No, that's true, and that's why the Big twelve is stable
because it doesn't have any premier football programs after Texas and Oklahoma left. That was the that was the Pack twelve's curse was that it had schools that the Big Ten wanted. The ACC's curse is that it's got schools that the SEC and Big Ten might want. In Clemson, Florida State, the Big Twelve had stability through mediocrity. Without any premier football brands, it wasn't going to get rated again. So yes, there aren't any of those kind of schools
and standing in Arizona's way. I mean, Utah is a pretty big obstacle slow and frankly, Utah is a pretty big obstacle for all of the existing Big twelve schools. But but no, there's no you know, there's no blue blood in football in the Big Twelve. It should be very interesting. So now you kind of could take a breather. I talked about this at the first segment with the Pack four. Something could break in the next day or two with the West. What are you hearing, Yeah, there's no
breathers man. With realignment, I think that well, Stanford and Cow are pushing to get into either the ACC or Big Ten, and I'm going to guess that that may be resolved this week one way or the other, one conference or the other, and that will determine the next step for the Pack
four or whatever you want to call it. If if Stanford and Cow don't get into either of those leagues, then I think the four schools will try to rebuild the Pack twelve and they'll add a few top tier Mountain West schools and they might even try to get a few schools from Texas and they will try to rebuild the thing. If Stanford and Cow leave, then I think Oregon State in Washington State are gonna you know, they're going in the mount
West. There's no there's no other options. As anybody said anything about what happens to the PAC twelve, you know, guaranteed playoff spot do they have to have a certain level of school or a certain level of programs? Can can the can the playoffs? Say? You know what Oregon State, Washington State, Stanford, Cal and you know Fresnel State and San Diegay that's not going to cut it. You guys are you guys are basically a group of five conference. Now you don't get an automatic bid? Can that happen?
Well? So there's two different pieces to that. The first is the playoff will the only recognize a conference than is certified by the NCAA, And in order to get certified, you have to have at least six members. So any conference that's got six members is technically eligible to send its champion to the
playoff. However, what's going to happen in a couple of years when they start the next playoff contract is that the current structure, which has six automatic bids and six at large bids, the SEC and Big ten are going to change that and it's going to go down to my guess is five automatic bids
and seven at large bids. So if the PAC twelve re builds itself and it becomes a Pack eight or PAC ten, it would be writable for the playoff if it's champion is like one of the top five ranked conference champions. But it's soon it's going to go from six to five automatic bids. The SEC and the Big ten want as many at large spots as they can I mean, the SEC is planning to send four teams out of the twelve. You know, they're gonna send their champion and they want three at large spots.
So and the Big ten is thinking the very same thing. So if you're the ACC or you're the Big twelve, you know, you're hoping to get your champion into the playoff and you're hoping to get one at large team in. But it's gonna be dicey. Yeah, okay, oh yeah, because I was thin at the champion bids aren't set or a conference. It's just assumed that the conference champions are going to get them. So it's just
a number. It's a number. The top right now, it's the top six ranked conference champions, and there are five Power five conferences and there are ten conferences total plus Notre Dame, so it will probably go down to five automatic qualifying spots, and it's going to be a battle loyal to get those seven at large births because Notre Dame also will be they count would count as an at large since they don't have a conference championship to win, So you
know, it's there's not going to be many spots for the Big twelve at large spots for the Big twelve in the ACC. All right, so does this this is what the billion dollars or two billion dollars or twenty billion dollar question? Is all of this making college football more and I'm seeing specifically football more or less interesting? Well? I think that the playoff expansion is the biggest thing that has happened to college football since the Supreme Court nineteen eighty four
gave the conferences control of their TV dollars. That changed, that changed everything. To me, the expanded playoff is bigger than the creation of the original four team playoff, bigger than the BCS Bowl Alliance, the Bowl Coalition. It is huge for the sport. But I also think that this realignment stuff is bad because to me, college football, when it's at its best,
is about tradition and regional rivalries. Right. All this stuff is just moving it closer to being a mini NFL and the postseason is going to be great. But you know, I don't know that it's necessarily the best thing for the health of the sport long term, just given what the how it's it's history. It's so much different than the NFL. The NFL is a propolis
sport. It's about the teams and the cities. College football is about the college towns and one hundred years of tradition and all these arch rivalries that you've got going on. So you know, in that regard, I think it's realignment generally is not good. Well, John, we appreciate your time. A lot of good stuff to get through. Ye keep busy, get some rest, get some rest. Never rested this stuff. I did have time. I did have time the other day to go play, to go play
golf. Wow, okay, yeah, you shot at two seventeen. Now was this on a regular golf course? Is that we are talking minutes? Your golf? What was Yeah? It was a par three course, So you've improved. Thank thanks John. Hey, John, we appreciate thanks for all the hard work you got. You guys did a great job. So thank you. Thank you calculator. Oh well so obviously, um yeah, thanks John. You know, I don't know that I I knew all along
I didn't want to be in his shoes. Remember how many times did we say I would hate to be covering this as a as a daily writer. No, of course, because it was like the coaching search, and we've all been through one of those a lot of stuff. A second hour, we're gonna have the breaking down. Well, let's I say we just you know, we got a lot of teams to continue the stuff with. You
know from the Robins press conference, Tommy Lloyd had some stuff today. So let's have mister Dunn and then uh, and then we're gonna have Ryan Dunn coming on at four or fifteen. We're gonna break away from this subject to talk a little bit about some after school sports for kids and stuff. So um, we'll do all that, So stick around.