What Boise Can Do Better: Real Talk on Policy, Growth, and Community with Luci Willits | Ever Onward Ep. 79

Now is in her second term . We're really excited to talk to Lucy , talk about her leadership she's one of the tremendous leaders we do have here in the Valley and excited to have her on our podcast . Lucy Willits Lucy , welcome to the podcast .

I kept telling them thank you for taking your time to do this on a holiday .

Yes , there's a bunch of touching stuff that's out there and you know , even the baseball games had the poppy on it yesterday , which was really cool . Anyway , we live in an incredibly patriotic place and it's awesome that we do .

I can't imagine living somewhere in the United States where people didn't love , respect and revere what has happened for this to become a country . And listen , it's not perfect . I mean , you can go through each war and we have lots of warts .

There's a lot of warts on everything , but what's underlying is a bunch of people that were willing to give their lives for this country .

He was like I'm going to go fight with them . He brought money and guns and changed our lives forever .

You're right in the middle of it all , but before we get blazing into that , can you just tell us a little bit about yourself and for those people that listen to this a lot of business people listen to this , but people who may not know you . Give a little intro for us

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We had school released for two weeks as children to work in the fields .

He had all the good ideas before they could take off and was a small business person and I really learned the value of money . He had all the good ideas before they could take off and was a small business person and I really learned the value of money and that when you are a small business owner and a business owner you get paid last .

And so that has really instilled in me a real focus on why the economy matters . And then also because I think it's important that the people have the opportunity to succeed and that there isn't artificial barriers to do that and we really need to focus on making sure that people have that opportunity and drive and ambition .

So grew up on , you know , 50 acres down a dirt road , you know , rural Idaho , very , very determined to go to college . I knew that that was my ticket out of poverty and did that Married my arch enemy from elementary school . I know no one could believe we were together when we showed up at the five-year reunion and we raised two beautiful daughters .

I'm now a grandma .

And when people say they've moved to Boise , I said welcome to paradise .

Oh yeah , what you said about small business , I think it was just really powerful because , seeing it as the daughter of an entrepreneur , this idea that we get paid last yeah , daughter of an entrepreneur , this idea that we get paid last First of all , entrepreneurial spirit .

Small businesses like the country's carried on the back of small businesses A lot of times . We , you know , you never have to worry about big business because they've got more lobbyists than I mean , they've got floors of lobbyists and they're tracking every little bill and every little thing , taking care of everything . But it's the small businesses in this country .

If you look at the tax base , if you look at who burdens it , it is small business , small business owners . And so I love that . When you said that that they get paid last . As a small business guy and I'm helping on a couple right now , but it's true I mean you don't even ask him the question how much am I going to make ?

The first question is am I going to survive and become profitable ?

And then , now that I am profitable , do I use that money to grow or what do I do , and it's so healthy to have to balance growth and what you take and what you don't , what you leave in the business , and so to have someone that understands that in politics is in leadership is a big deal .

And if we didn't invoice him we didn't get paid , and it was like you have to keep track of this and whether you get paid or not . And when you got , I mean it was such a great life lesson for accounting .

So I had Lucy's cleaning business and I cleaned the mill every Saturday and it took hours cause it's a mill and it's full of dust , but he was so good about making me understand that and that that had value . And then , if I was going to take that $2 that I earned that Saturday and spend it on something , was it worth that .

He was such an amazing person when it came to ideas and he just never thought about it failing , even though they all ended up having some challenges . But I'll tell you what I loved about my dad is he just constantly reinvented himself , and that's what I love about the American spirit . I used to tease him that he was a little bit like Madonna .

He was constantly reinventing himself . You know , he'd run cattle operations , he'd farmed , he'd owned a hardware store . He did He'd . When I was a kid we had a feed mill , so we roll and chop barley for dairy cows . And when the government came in and basically paid farmers to kill all their cows , dairy buyout , it decimated the business .

So I have seen what government can do to a family when it decides to take the market . Yeah , can do to a family when it decides to take the market , and so all of those things have played such an important part of who I am and how I look at things , because it's not only how I was raised , but it's my DNA .

family .

You know there's there's other parts of it that haven't been as rewarding , but it just reminds you of the goodness of the community and you see people who come to meetings when they could be doing lots of other things . I mean , there are cheap movies on Tuesday nights . They could be there and they show up because they care .

And it is so incredible to me I'm honored and I'm always just really humbled that people will take their time to help craft a government .

You know what's the best thing for business , but a lot of it is right .

Last city council I was the only one that worked for a for-profit company , the only city council person that worked for a for-profit company , and then now , with Meredith got appointed , she also works for a for-profit company , but I come from a very different perspective on that , because I know what it's like to do layoffs , I know what it's like to try to

figure out the P&L , and I think that is really important . I always joke that you know the mayor and I think about .

We wake up in the morning thinking about an E , the mayor thinks about the environment and I think about the economy , and that's just how we're wired , and so it's a good yin to the yang , because you know you have to have one to have the other yeah , yeah and um , so I've met , I think I've , I think I've spent time with every city council member you have

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You just said about government coming in and buying all the cows , I mean government interaction with business predictability . You know goalposts that are set and fixed for good reasons .

And then we like critical thinkers , like if you can go have an intelligent conversation with someone on a council and say , hey , we may see this differently , but can we talk about issue A right and you have a real healthy and you can listen to the other side of it and I can tell you , I've come out of those thinking , oh my gosh , I didn't understand that

other perspective of this other person that sees the world differently than I do . I've also come out of them like , oh my gosh , can you believe that they see the world that way ? But that's what makes America beautiful is we do have such varied opinions on so many different things . How has it been for you with this current council ?

I think it's incredibly important . Our system is based on it . If someone starts thinking that the system can't work without them , that's a problem . I would say that all the council members work really hard . They all pay a price for this . It's time , it's money , it's emotional bandwidth , and I really appreciate my council members .

I think they are genuinely good people who are trying to do the right thing .

And then these votes that happen and you get to vote every city council meeting .

What you've done is help propel change , because now you've told us what's not working and even if we , if , if we're not , you know voting the way you want us to do on this particular issue , because of whatever reason , you have given us that nugget that we can go back and we can change . And I think that's incredibly important .

When people stop showing up , we have a problem . People need to keep showing up .

But I think it's really important that people see that you can do that and you can walk into a place where you know you're probably going to get outvoted 90% of the time on the big stuff and you can still walk out of the room and be okay .

We also will have these times when we're not , where , hey , we're going to kind of be alone and we're going to be forced with hey .

And then I think for you , the other question I'd ask is not only do you have to stand up for voting a different way , but you have to justify that with an intelligent response and reason and realize that , even though you're justifying

and presenting a position that's against others , they're still not going to vote with you .

And you talked about going into a friendly crowd . So I worked with the Idaho legislature for years . That is the exact opposite of Boise . Boise has a super majority of Democrats . The Idaho legislature has a super majority of Republicans . When you testify at the Idaho legislature , when I used to like they were friendly faces .

Yeah , and you know I often go into city council not knowing if I'm going to get a friendly face . You know and and people are , people are are professional . Don't mean to to make any sort of judgment there , but I know I'm going to be an outsider and so I've really worked to .

It does feel like it's professional and civil and with you guys , and that's not always the case . Is that the truth ? Does feel like it's professional and civil and with you guys , and that's not always the case . Is that the truth ?

So I've gone to conferences where the city council people are having to make these decisions on very , very technical aspects of water treatment and I thought , oh my gosh , we don't have to do that . You need one expert to do that .

And there was one case where one of my council members said we were just arguing about that . I said no , we weren't , we were discussing . Discussing is different than arguing , but just to try to tamp down the emotion so that people can be people , I think is important .

I think the homelessness stuff , you know , I know there's a lot of people that are worried about that because they see what's happened in jurisdictions around and I frankly just can't be prouder of what you guys have been doing . I mean , it's been great and you look at it's combining public safety , investment in police , it's it's . That's a pillar of it .

Then it's creating housing . That's a pillar of it . And I think we're frankly a little lucky that Caleb Roop and Pacific Companies is like like like when God looked down upon us and said Hey , caleb , you know , put your company in Eagle Idaho . Caleb , you know , put your company in Eagle Idaho .

For those listening , caleb Rupp in Pacific Companies is probably the nation's number one affordable housing developer and he happens to be from Eagle , idaho , just purely so . He's done several great projects and I think that's been great because I think the whole housing you know , homelessness is a housing problem . I do believe that .

And then I think some of the campaigns to not treat all homeless people the same you know , as an old time night shift ER doc , I mean they're not right . You have the , those women , and mostly women , domestic violence with children that are homeless . A giant percentage of kind of the family homelessness population are somehow touched by that .

Then you have the mental illness . We're just not getting the treatment . You need to stay off the streets . And then you do have kind of the drug , alcohol abuse , right , still a disease , but they are different , right .

And then you have there's a lot of people , especially with our economy now and with the affordability crisis that we're experiencing , there are people that are paycheck to paycheck , the working poor , that asset , limited income , constrained , employed population that they're really you know .

So if you look at the number of people that are , of teenagers that are probably couch surfing , bouncing around or just , and a lot of these again are going to be kind of broken families . There's a lot of it . But my point is I think you guys have done a really , really , really good job on that .

One is you need housing , you need help and you also need rules , because , to your point , there's lots of different circumstances with homelessness .

Now , the person who is on the street with the cardboard sign is what people usually think of , but there's a hidden homelessness of families that is really devastating as well , and you've got kids who aren't able to have a safe place to sleep and then they go to school . So there's as different situations with homelessness as there are people .

For me , it's very important that we have rules , because I think that sets the standard , and so I was very supportive of Senator Galloway's bill that would make rules for our bigger cities when it came to homelessness , because I think if you set the standard , then you can move and attain that .

If you don't have a standard , which is people can sleep outside anywhere , then what are you working towards ? And so for me that's a very important piece . One of the things I think Boise does really well is coordinated care .

Another thing the city did two or three years ago because I helped on that campaign was one , create ways to get families off the streets by having units . And then , two , they did a nice job of redoing their triage system so that they could get the appropriate resources to the appropriate families at the appropriate time . It was a big big deal .

The other thing that I think when we think about homelessness that's really important I've said this over and over again is we have to have a nonprofit community that helps us do this , because that gives everyone an obligation and it also gives people a way to help , because what I've seen in this community is people want to help but they often don't know how .

So one of the things that I the campaign that you worked on is the ability for folks to to give personal money as a as a donation . That can also help people . And then you have catch and you have Jesse tree and you have interfaceuary . We need all these partners and we need more .

Yeah , I'm in Reno a lot and the project we're doing is downtown Reno and once these problems get unraveled , it is almost impossible to back up . So proactive , thoughtful leadership makes all the difference in the world .

And you see , when people are able to truly change their lives , which is so hard , it's miraculous , it really is .

. So there's some good news . There is good news , housing .

There's parts that we need to refine , but just really let the market be more of the driver than the government . When you have government that's telling you you should do things and you should do this way , and it's artificially raising costs , that will end up hurting people who are trying to get into homes .

So let me give you an example this electronic vehicle thing . So new zoning code , you have to have a parking garage . Great Parking garages now are about $45,000 to $50,000 a stall . Think about that for a minute $45,000 to $50,000 a stall . And now , because electronic vehicles are required , that's not the worst part .

That's not the worst part Now , because they catch on fire . So then the fire department makes you have a half a stall per electronic vehicle stall in case the car catches on fire . So for every electronic vehicle you put , it's $75,000 a stall , just like that . And now the city is saying , hey , we want 20% .

Then the other thing Lucy , no one uses these things .

But I use it as an example of because I think it's a real kind of crystal clear example , real life example of how government is saying , hey , here are the things we want , but then on the other hand they just almost can't get out of the way of themselves with really bad policy that they don't even realize .

You just jacked the price of a parking stall up by 50% and there's no way to get out of it . Then if you want to reduce it , you have to go do a CUP and you have to go in and , and , and now it's three more months . It's just . It's . It's just one example . On a zoning code , that that , but .

But I don't know how it ever changes , because I don't think that . I think what happens is like I don't think they're bad people , but they're just saying , oh yeah , we , we want this , so we're going to force this and you're going to like it and it makes sense because we're saving the environment by doing it .

You're not saving the environment , first of all . I mean I think there's enough stuff . I mean , if they ever truly looked at what it costs to create these batteries right now and and what we're actually doing , no one's using them and they don't ask the people that actually have the parking stalls to say , hey , are anyone using these things ?

And then , on top top of it , after all of that , there's no one to listen to you on costs , right ? You're just saying so anyway , I just Well , amen , and this came up with the county .

Forget that sprawl is happening and Forget that sprawl is happening and it will always happen , and it will always happen . And so my argument is if the city of Boise is not going to manage housing , then the valley will manage housing . And that's what's happening .

The county is doing it , the other cities are doing it and , honestly , there ought to be a field trip required just to go see what's going on . It's crazy , what's going on . So sprawl is happening . But then you go back to the city of Boise who's saying , hey , we need more homes and we need homes that people can afford .

That comes out of the lips , right , but now it's got to be structured . So there's lands too expensive . So we want to make it easier for you guys to do vertical construction , all types , but now we're going to put parking requirements on you that don't make any sense .

I mean , you see what I'm saying , like , like it , just the amount of it's like , do you really ? Do you really think that ? Because if you really thought that , you probably wouldn't be doing what you're doing on your policy .

I mean , there's entire land by micron that you can develop Southeast Boise . The sewer moratorium was a beater thing . Can we get over that ? Can we talk about that ? I think we have to . There's a lot of things that we can do that , I think , kind of make people shudder a little bit , but they have to be talked about .

Think about this loop We've now made housing more expensive because of our policy and now we're going to go get government housing subsidies so that we can afford You're not affording anything . Then the government gets involved . Every time the government gets involved , it gets out of whack the whole system .

Now you're subsidizing things that are only making everything more expensive . So housing's one . I don't know what happens , but what we should be doing of all our local governments is saying we need to reduce regulation , we need to improve . Let the free market get all housing types out there . Apartments condominiums starter homes , medium homes .

Lots of variety , lots of variety , and only if we do , only if we do . The other example I'll use is even if you go around Idaho . It was fun going around Idaho when I ran for governor because you can go around Idaho and find the places that are most liberal and most restricted . This is eight years ago . And now look at the cost . I mean you know those .

Go to Teton County , go to Blaine County , go to Boise , like everywhere you go that is most regulated , is most costly , it just is , and that always goes together . And yet it always . Then it's those same places trying to figure out workforce housing , trying to figure out housing costs , when it's like actually you kind of created the problem you're having .

And if they really look back at the data behind all this , I think it's not a hill to die on . I don't think it's a hill to die on .

That was the reasoning . So of course I voted no . I was like , no , they need their parking spaces , but that kind of attitude of like , at all costs we are going to force this philosophy , even when it doesn't make sense that doesn't even make sense .

It's out in the middle of nowhere and in order to improve their flow of their internal site on their 10 acres they wanted to have parking on one side of the building so that their trucks could come in for safety . It required a six-month CUP . It was hotly debated , and I'm thinking , months CUP .

It was hotly debated and I'm thinking what has this world become when a Idaho business taking their own dollars and building their place out in the middle of nowhere , and we're arguing over where ? And , by the way , safety . At some point somebody would say , okay , is this better for these big trucks to not be here ? But but it was it we .

I don't want a typo review , I want a real review and we need to do better . And I think that there is a view that if you , if you go too , the whole thing will fall apart , and I don't believe that I don't believe that . But I think that there is this natural criticism .

Oh no , and I think we have to because it will affect our economy for years to come . And here's my nightmare . My nightmare is that Boise becomes old and tired and 10 Mile becomes the center of the valley .

And then people are like I'm not going to deal with downtown Boise , it's not worth it , and they will go other places and we will suffer .

We were in a great little subdivision with lots of young families you know we're all in combat zone with little kids and that commute over time just became so hard and we were spending so much money and we just looked how close can we get to our jobs .

And we ended up in West Boise and we've been there ever since and we love it and it is our little pocket of paradise . But it is a different pocket of paradise than the North End .

And so I think that you can look around the country at cities that have done what Boise is doing and you're going to have an elite , expensive , not growing place and then you're going to have costs , right , I think Skip just put up his building , his apartment building , right , that's beautiful and you're going to have maybe some things happen like that , but like

buildings that people can afford , it's just going to be hard . And I do think I want to hear one other thing you said I think the valley is dynamic A lot of ways . This happened in Salt Lake , you don't have to go too far to see what happened to Salt Lake City proper . Yes same and you can look everywhere around it .

And luckily you do have super dynamic .

I'm gonna tell you this I think for a long time , the one , the one thing that allowed cities to to um , to dominate discussions on development , large developments , was sewer . Really , it's been sewer and water , but sewer was the biggie right .

Because I think what's going to happen is you're going to see that stranglehold on , hey , we're going to , and then there's all the other services that come along with it . I mean it's not easy , but it is going to force decisions to be made especially .

And if you're a free market person , the more homes you have , the price goes down .

really uncomfortable conversations . I think what makes a city and you think about wherever you go , it's the parks and the art , that is what , and the landscape . That is what changes your feel about a city , and it's something that we need more of and we need to preserve . And it's something that we need more of and we need to preserve .

And we have a goal for a 10-minute walk to a park , which is a phenomenal goal because we want to preserve some of these open spaces . That's where people gather and people need to gather .

And art is an important piece too , because that's why people travel all around the world is to see different art , because it represents your story , and we're very lucky because the river is our biggest art . We've got the river and we've got the foothills , so we have that already .

But these other services that aren't as visible but very important are , I think , what make a city , and part of it is libraries . So consider this 25 years ago , boise had one library and one at the mall , like a little outlet store at the mall , and now we have several libraries and we're trying to look at how we get more .

And this is an incredibly important issue for my district because we're in this donut hole . So you know , probably the vein of this conversation has been speak up , get involved . And the reason we are having this conversation in West Boise about libraries is because of one guy who looked at the map and said we're in a donut hole .

And why do I have to drive to Eagle or Garden City for a library when I'm in Boise ? Mark Salisbury , he has single-handedly driven this conversation . I had lunch with him January of 2022 . That's how long we've been working on this .

rewarding thing in your life is your relationships .

They're a place for you know , places for people to come , places for people to think , places for people to learn , and I think that the most important thing that we can do as a city other than police and fire , because they help drive individual change and our libraries do incredible things you probably wouldn't want to know that they do .

They go every week , sometimes twice a week and my grandkids just love it . And they go in and there's the storytime programming , there's the interactive things that happen , and they go to different libraries . They live in South Meridian but they go to different ones and it's like part of their routine and I just love that part of it .

Those are the things that really feed a neighborhood , and I went to many , many of the listening sessions on the library and what people kept saying is we like the staff here , they know our names , they're very helpful and that this is our place to go , where we can learn . And you know it is a 21st century world . Hey look , I use AI .

You know I use all of that stuff , but there is something meaningful about a library that we do need to hold on to .

dear .

But this year is also going to kick off something that I want every Idahoan to know about , and that's this 250th anniversary of our country . So think about that . So , if you just do the math , if you're 50 , you have been alive for one fifthfifth of this country .

There's going to be so many fun things that we can really take upon and just enjoy this moment because it is historical . And I've got to give one more plug .

So I've been trying to become a member of the Daughters of the American Revolution and it has been fascinating to find where my ancestors have gone and where they've served and when you look at the courage that people had .

I mean I was reading last night about one of my ancestors who was in the middle of nowhere , New Hampshire , who basically , when the declaration came out , people signed their own declaration , said we're out , we're Americans .

That takes courage and we need to bottle that up and move it forward , and the best way to do it is to look at what's happened in the past , take those lessons and move forward .

This is like so amazing and such a part , like you think , of the next generation teaching them about patriotism in our country .

They're running businesses , they're raising families , all the things that we expect people to do and we want them to do , and we want people to be their , you know , be their best , live their best lives , so to speak . People can change the system .

Their voices are massively important and when people stop thinking that we will no longer have a government run by people and so , as frustrated as people get and there is a notion in politics that if you get tired and you leave the building , then other people win and it's true .

I always say if you leave the arena , you've lost the game , and sometimes you might need to go sit in the stands for a while and then you can get back on the field . But we have to stay involved about what we care about , because these things , the things that we've created , didn't happen by accident . Someone's blood , sweat , tears , ideas made this valley .

So how do we keep it and keep moving forward ? We only do that with the people that are here now doing the work for the people that will come tomorrow . So , keep at it .

And listen , these challenges are great challenges to have . The fact that we're talking about all these things that are challenging and hard for cities . It's because we have such a great place . Everyone wants to live here . So thank you for your efforts , thank you for your service . It is a calling in a lot of ways , the number of hours you put into this .