Hello and welcome to Ernie Ball's Striking A Chord podcast. I'm Evan Paul. Today I'll be speaking with System of a Down-Basist Shavo Odadjian. It's a different remake ofety-cordning off the recording aspect of The Band while continuing to tour together and maintain strong friendships and dealing with the public obsession with a new system record.
Shavo also discusses the albums that have had the greatest impact on him and his new band, North Kingsley. They've been busy writing lots of material and have begun releasing some of the songs. Without further ado, ladies and gentlemen, Shavo Odagean. Shavo Odagean, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for having me, brother. Yeah, our pleasure. All right, I have a quick series of true or false questions for you. Bring it.
True or false, one of the reasons you're called system of a down instead of victims of a down, you see your CDs would be closer to slayers CDs and recorders. That's not why, but because when that, but when it did, when we did change the system, I realized that, hey, it's even better here because now we're next to slayers. Okay, and now to added bonus. It was an added bonus.
It was the real reason was because I didn't want to be, because I thought if we ever got big, victims of a down would be known as victim. And I was like, I never want to be called victim. Like, no, right now they go system, system at the shows, right? Right. What I want to be called victim, victim, not so much. Yeah, good foresight. All right. And true or false, you were standing next to Arnold Schwarzenegger and ACDC's Big Gun video. Big ass true. Big through. How did that come about?
That's me. It was college days and one kid that I was friends with worked at Kinkos and Kinkos, you know, Kinkos? Yeah. Yeah, copies. I don't know if it's still around. Yeah, copies. And I guess ACDC's management was making the little passes for the big gun video shoot for all the fans to kind of be in the audience. Shoot the video. It was at the Van Nij's airport. They were shooting. So he goes, yeah, man, I made some extra copies. So we can all go, right? So I was like, fuck yeah, let's go.
Now it's like a 10 of us. We all went to the airport and we were like in the group of people. There was at least 1,800 people. And we were in that crew and then they rushed us into a hangar and there was this big ass cannon in a stage set up like fuck yeah, ACDC. And then all of a sudden they bring Arnold Schwarzenegger. I'm like, what the fuck? And then I just made a joke. I was like, here, put him here, put him here, where I was standing. And I was just kind of was loud.
Yeah. It brought him right next to me next to me. No way. Yeah. So there I am next to Arnold. And I'm kind of cracking jokes to him. And it's shit. And it was hilarious. And he's looking back at who's this kid. And then when they shot the scenes, the light from the on stage hit me more than it hit him. So I'm sure that you can, I'm glowing next to Arnold. It's like there's two of us in the scene instead of him in a bunch of kids. It's him and I in a bunch of kids. So it's kind of funny.
That's funny. Yeah. When that came out, people tripped out there and kept calling me, like, man, did I just see you on the ACDC video? Well, I was wondering out of a sea of people, how did you get right there? But it sounds like you kind of lobbied for the position. I did a little bit, but I didn't think it would work. It was a joke. Like, hey, come here. Yeah, look, that's going to work. And it really worked out. Oh, shit. They really like, they must have heard me or it was a coincidence.
I don't know, man. That's cool. Right place at the right time. That's what it was. All right, true or false, chop sui has almost one billion views on YouTube. It had that a while back. This is the second time it's going to one billion. Okay. Yeah. That's pretty amazing. I mean, there's only so many videos that that I know it turned one billion. I remember when it was turning one billion a while back. There were like, okay. And then I think something happens in the back one. Yeah, old news.
Okay. All right. I always like to get a guest history on this show. And then we can talk about what you're doing now, which I know includes a new project called North Kingsley, looking forward to that. But first, when did you start playing guitar or bass? I started when I was about 12, 13. My grandma bought me a Kramer XL to back in the day. And it became my best friend. So your grandma, did she just, did you ask for it or something she just thought, I bet Shav would be a good guitar player.
No, no, no, no. I've been, I've been a fan of music since I was born. It's kind of an in me for more media. You know, they've been listening to music and they've always had music around. And they had all the old Beatles records, all in like Russian print and stuff. So I listened to music for a long time, Bony M after the assignment, Alba, a bunch of other artists that we had in Armenia. And then when we got to America when I was five years, golden 79, I saw KISS on solid gold.
And then I would see like KISS murals all over LA. And funny enough, I lived on North Kingsley Drive. That's where the name comes from, by the way. So yeah, so I saw KISS and I was just a fan of it. I was just taken by it, you know? And so I always wanted a musical instrument. I've been asking my parents for years after that, just started asking every year, every day.
And they just wouldn't do it for me, they, I think it was the old Armenian mentality of like, you know, if you're an artist, you're gonna be a starving artist so they didn't want that for me. They wanted me to go to school, study, go to your, whatever, doctor, you know, the way the old country, the old customs are. But because I was relentless, I kept on asking, kept on asking, I never let it go. My grandma just said, let's get this kid a freaking guitar. I never thought, yeah.
So she on the side kind of like, got it for me, didn't really tell anybody that she did that and once it was over here. My house, it was in my house, right? So I'm not gonna give it back. And with a little practice amp and I put it up in my room and I just went at it. And actually the funny story is they gave me, they had the sky, one of my, I guess, my dad's uncle or something, my dad's cousin. He's a full-mingo guitar player, like all professional, and he was supposed to give me lessons.
And second lesson in, he was already like teaching me like, say, the third chord and I was already like six chord. I was like, I had already gotten this chord book and I was already all over it, you know? So he was teaching me things I already knew. It was just been two weeks. And I kind of surpassed that, you know, and I didn't take lessons anymore. It was two lessons and that's it. And after that, I just, you were so self-motivated, you probably didn't need it. That's what it was, bro.
I just, I love doing it so many. That's the thing, bro. If you love doing something in your life, you're gonna do it good, right? Exactly. So that's what it was, bro. I just did it. I stayed home. I also skateboarded. The time it was a skateboarding guitar. That was my life. Yeah. Well, yeah. Let me back up real quick. So I know you were born in Armenia, which was part of the Soviet Union back then, I believe. Yeah, it was. You said you were five. Do you, do you speak Armenian?
Yes, I do, fluently. Okay. Very cool. And so do you, do you write it and read it too? I know it has its own alphabet. It does. We have to have 37 letters. It's crazy. Yeah, my parents sent me to an Armenian private school for the first 10 years of my life. So I learned to read and write. They just wanted me to keep my culture, you know? Yeah. And it was the best thing that they could have done, man. At the time I was pissed off, I wanted to be normal.
I wanted to go to regular school with the kids on my street, you know what I mean? In Hollywood. But, you know, in the long run when you look back, it's like the best thing they could have done, you know? For sure. It gave me an identity. It gave me some like cultural culture, you know? All sorts of things. So you already spoke it though before going to school because you spoke it as a kid, right? Exactly. Yeah. My mom was a language major.
So she, she knew a bunch of languages, like five, six languages. So she knew we were going to come to America. She, this was all planned, of course. Because it wasn't just me and my mom and dad came, you know? It was like, I don't know, like cousins and uncles. Everyone just kind of got to go. Really? Okay. You want to eat there and people and like move together as a team, you know, a group of people.
Yeah. Yeah. So I kind of had, I kind of knew English too a little bit, like just, like words and like phrases and stuff. So it wasn't like I came here and I was like nothing, you know? But it was kind of hard, man. It was kind of hard. Actually the first, I didn't write away about Armenian school. My kindergarten, I went to a public kindergarten in Hollywood called Ramona Elementary. And there I was at culture shock, you know? It's like, fuck. Yeah. I'd never been away from my folks.
Yeah. So I kind of had like separation anxiety. I just remember crying a lot and not wanting them to leave me there. And you know, there was a bunch of different cultures and races and stuff. And I, so it was a big culture shock. You're five years old, yeah. Five years old. But now all of a sudden I have to be like, you know, go to school. I never had school in Armenia. Hey, I'm curious. So Serge and John Singer and drummer of System of a Downed, I know they were born in Beirut.
Was it kind of a diaspora community where they also spoke Armenian? We all spoke Armenian. Okay. They're born in 11 of their Armenian. They're just, you know, up genocide. All of that in 1915, all like majority of the Armenians scattered across the world. So hence we have Armenians from all over the place. Like we have Iraqi Armenians. That means, right. So they were still in a community in Beirut, right? Yeah, they were in an Armenian community in Beirut.
You know, a lot of people came to America. A lot of people went to the UK. Originally when we moved to America, we moved to New York. And I lived in Queens for a few months. I, we were gonna just stay there. So my life was gonna be totally different. But my dad's side decided to move to West Coast while my mom's was when it stayed on the East Coast. But my mom decided to of course move with my dad and my dad's side so I can have a family and a dad and stuff. You know what I mean? A father.
So because of that one move, I became an LA kid and grew up on North Kingsley and saw skateboarding and saw, you know, music and chose that as my life. I could have gone completely different. Was it an Armenian neighborhood? Okay. At the moment, North Kingsley is in, it's funny because they call it little Armenian now. And at the time, that's not what it was. It was just a neighborhood in LA. There was people in Armenian was, you know what I mean?
And Armenian was like this like exotic race, you know? Like what's an Armenian, is it Albanian? Is it Romanian? You know, it was like anything in the IA and they put it all together. Well, after I think system, we kind of like opened the world up to more Armenians and Armenians started like speaking more and being more like. Yeah, that's, that's amazing. You guys became such strong cultural ambassadors. Crazy, right? Yeah. Yeah. And so all you guys went to that same Armenian school, right?
We're, we're creating a must-tot bilingual. Yeah, three of us did. Darren, Sarah, and I. Did you know each other while you're in high school? Or actually, was, was this high school? I don't know how many grades it went to. It goes 12 grades. Well, okay, we knew of each other, but we weren't friends. Like we weren't, but he's, we were in, Sarah was many years above Darren and I and Darren was one year younger than me.
So he was like, if I was in six videos in fifth grade, but Serge was like five, six years, maybe more ahead of us. So they have like a picture of you guys in the cafeteria. That's cool. Money, right? That'd be great. All right. So moving forward to music. So initially, Darren and Serge are in a band together called Soil and you became the band manager, right? Yeah, that's kind of how it happened. Okay. It was more like, okay, so I used to always like try myself out.
This is when I moved to the bass. I was a guitar player for the first 12 to like 17, five, six years of my life of music. I was a guitar player, but I got better and I wanted to start bands. The bass players were one of two. One was like they were either virtue, trying to be virtue also is like a less playful, you know what I mean? Right. Or they just weren't picking the bass up. They weren't like meeting potatoes. I always saw bass players like the rock, the steady, the keep the groove.
You know, you don't have to you don't have to battle the guitar player. You have to do what you do. So the guitar player has this open place to do whatever they do. And so both of you can shine. Right. Right. What I, what I started seeing was a lot of people competition with the guitar player. Bass players had like this chip on their shoulder going, well, since I'm the bass and I'm behind, I have to do more, which is the wrong way to go, right?
So I kind of at some point decided, I'm going to have to do this. So I traded in my, I had a Randall half stack, the big dime bag amp, which I swore by. It was had the greatest crunch, greatest sound. I traded that in for an Ibanez bass at guitar center when I was like 17, 18. And my new thing started and I bought this like off the recycler, which was this some, I don't know if it's still around, it was like a Craigslist, you know? But in print, you know, not online.
And I bought this PD amp, which soon became an ash, amp egg. Anyway, so I practiced and I kind of took what I had for the guitar and with the mentality that I thought that the bass player should do in my own head, whatever that was. I kind of did that. And I found some bands to play with in jam with. So this is, I'm just leading out to how I even remit. Yes. So I was in Burbank's at a studio down in like the off ramp of the five freeway.
I rehearsed with this band called Roswell in that complex, an old friend of mine was also jamming. He had this band. It was like a 80s vibe like band. And he was like, I have this guitar player coming in, stick around. I want to hear what you have to say about this person, right? And I was like, okay, sure, you know, he wanted my opinion because we played together. He liked my suggestions, my opinions. In Wax Daren. And I'm like, I remember this kid from somewhere, you know?
Yeah. And he went to school with us and people, oh, well, okay. So he did this. He started, he put his guitar on and they jam like songs like ain't talking about love and like rush and all these like it covers, right? And I was like, did this kid jam the guitar and sang? He sang too. I was like seriously? Oh, actually he was going to come in I think to be a singer. I think they were trying him out as a singer. Okay. So we weren't here as a singer, but he also played guitar.
They had two guitar players, right? One was the guy's brother and one was this other strange guy that I guess was in for maybe a couple of weeks or months. And what my suggestion at the end of the night was I said, I go, Dave, dude, watch. This guy is so bad ass. I said, you should hold on to him as a singer and as a guitar player. Get rid of that one guy because he doesn't fit in the band. And I go, it could be a great unit without having an extra member, you know?
So you'll still be four members, you know? And but if the singer will play guitar and it'll be awesome. So that's what happened. That's what they did. Eventually that band broke up and the bass player, my friend, Darren and Serge. Serge was in another band playing in the same complex. So I say, now it's three units mixing, you know what I mean? Yeah. They got Serge to sing for this new unit they started called Soil. And this music was coming out with the drummer.
It was this Hawaiian kid drumming. It was really bad ass drummer. He had these like huge, his drum set was huge. Like the tombs were huge. The kid was huge. Like this big ass, he would hide behind it. A lot of symbols, you know what I mean? Like symbol, crash, you know what I mean? But the dude knew you had to write songs. So I think he developed also Darren and Serge writing.
They were writing songs and I would play with my band and then I would run in their place and I would hang out with them when we took breaks. You know, because these are my old friends all day. They became friends more. You know, we got closer and closer and closer. And as we bonded, you know, there was no room for me to join the band. So it was like, you know, you talk well, you know, you know, you know, things, you know, why don't you be our manager?
I'm like, fuck, you know, I'm down, you know, I'll do that. And so that's what it was going to be. I was going to be. I was going to be. Okay. So that's how it started. So they got one gig at a club called Faith Doe Doe. I remember this like it was yesterday. And I was there of course, like trying to get it all ready and stuff. And then after that, I was going to get him gigs. I even like made my way, found my way to Zach that the La Roca's house from rage against a machine I found.
I was seeing this girl with a time like friend who told me, yeah, you know, in this area of LA Silver Lake, I think it was or out water or something, Zach's there from rage. And he throws parties every Friday. You should go to the party and he has bands play. You could get your band to play at his house. And I'm like, oh, fuck yeah, let's do this. So I even showed up with Serge. So rate is already fairly big at this point, right? I think so. It was a really nice. It was early. It was early.
Yeah, they were like 90. It was probably like 93, 94. I didn't get a hold of Zach. I was at a site. We made it to his house. I got his address somehow. I don't know what happened. We got there and it was like a regular party, five bucks to get in. And I saw Stafford Prison Experiment there. I discovered that. I was like, whoa, great band there. They're out now again. They're back. Stafford Prison Experiment. Amazing. And I saw Tom Morello and I kind of talked to him.
I was like, hey, man, he didn't know who I was. Nothing. I was like, I got to spend. I want them to play here. What do I do? He was like, talk to Zach. I just never got a chance to talk to Zach, but I was going to make it happen. You know what I mean? Around the same time, I get a call from the bass player at like maybe like a couple of weeks after he's like, he was not in a great place. He was like, I'm not going to play in soil anymore. I think they want you to play bass for them.
And I'm like, what are you saying? I was like, it's like saying, I'm not with my girlfriend anymore. But my girlfriend wants you. You know, and I'm like, fuck, I'm not doing that. You know, I crazy. You know, I'm not going to do that. Dude, that's like, that's like, that's for bidden shit. You know what I mean? So anyways, so I just kind of like blew it off. He hits me back. He's like, bro, listen, you do bond really well with these guys. I'm not, I don't want to do it.
If anyone's going to do it, you should do it because you're already managing them. Why not? You know what I mean? Like, you should do it. I'm, you have my blessing. I'm like, fuck bro, you're making this hard for me. But it was becoming like easier to listen to. And then all of a sudden, Darren hits me up and Darren would, I mean, we never really talked outside of in the studio with them, you know. Yeah. Obviously, he hits me up.
He's like, yo, man, I want you to consider just how I want to talk to you about something. Oh my god, here it is. So I go and they say, hey, man, we have good news and bad news. I'm like, boy, good news is I want you to play the, you know, play bass and soil and stuff. Bad news is our drummer just left. I'm like, wait a second. I thought your bass plays the music. Yeah, the drummer just left too. He's having a baby. He's going to Hawaii with you guys to move back to Hawaii.
So anyway, we can develop together. I said, okay, cool, man, I think this is better because now we get to develop together. It's not like I'm taking the place of someone, you know, and as we talked and like shared ideas, we thought it was better to just break that band up. So not be soil anymore and start something fresh with new music and with a new breath, with new me, find a new drummer, and that's when system was more.
Gotcha. Okay. So you joined, the plan was to join soil, but officially you joined at the very inception of system of a down. We accepted, yeah, we made that happen. It was part of what we did together. It wasn't, instead of, I was going to join soil, but soil broke up. And you guys ditched the old songs, the soil songs. We ditched the arrangement of the old songs. We actually used, like there's a song we have a song called Soil. There's a, the riff in Soil is a riff that was in the band's soil.
So we use that riff. For example, the song Sugar, the ending of Sugar. Like it was a middle part of the Soil song. And I wrote that the riff for Sugar, but don, don, don, don't, I did that. And then I thought of how rag would it be if this little jazz part happened and that part came in. And that's how Sugar was born. And so we used little parts here and there. Yeah, yeah. But we didn't like use the arrangement or anything, but that was only for the first record.
Yeah. So mid 90s, I assume this is like mid 90s when you get to start. It's around 94, 95 now, 90. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So there's, I know there's a lot of new things happening in metal and heavier music. It's kind of a historical marker. I always think of death tones of adrenaline coming out in 95, just as a marker in my head. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's, that's roughly where we're talking about.
Not that you guys sound like them, but just to point out that it was a time when metal was kind of branching out. And I don't know. Did you guys feel change in the air during this era? Yeah, see, there's no things. So I also took on the role of management, right, for the new band system. So I just had to like know what was going on out there. So it was hard for us to get a gig. So we, once we had, we had a drummer, once we kind of rehearsed and wrote songs.
So now that's fast forward, we have like about eight songs, six to eight songs. And we're like, okay, now we can play live. I start calling clubs. I wasn't familiar with LAC, and you know, what was going on in the LAC was everything was going on. I mean, the shit was popping at that point. Yeah, yeah.
So when I was in the corner, deaf tones, there was bands like Manhole and Human Waste Project and Mind Heavy Mustard and so many to know, Colch Chamber, Suffer, all these bands that were like static, like, static came a little after. But so all these bands were coming out and like playing and I started going to shows, you know, just to see where we were going to belong. You know, how are we going to do shows? We have to be, I have to know the climate, you know, yeah.
So I started going to the Roxy, it was Xaris for a second. Roxy, whiskey and all those. So I started calling the clubs up to get a show and they wouldn't give me a show because we don't have a demo. We didn't have enough money to make a demo at the time. It wasn't like now where you have a computer and you can make it, you can make a demo on your phone, you know what I mean? So it was hard. It was like a catch 22. We didn't have money to make to get a demo.
We didn't have enough demo to get a show. So which comes first chicken or the egg, right? So we, I just kind of like bombarded. I was working in a bank at the time also. So I would do phone calls doing, I was doing wire transfers. I was answering calls for wire transfers for our specific bank. And between every call, I said the story before, between every call I would call the Roxy or the whiskey or someone and I was like, yo, we're the span system of now.
Yeah, you called the second to go, I know, we're on a keep call, you're on a demo. Yeah, I know, I know, I know, but I need a show. Click, fuck you. Okay. So you're not going to be a boss supportive? He didn't know, bro. He was on the headphones. You know, like I had the things going on in the, you know, the headpiece, you know, but he was supportive because he knew I was in a band and he knew that's what I was going to do.
And he always used to like, he was this very eccentric dude, the boss of that area, that department. So he was really cool with me. So I was, I was someone that was like, you know, not, not a bad seed, you know, so I was doing well. So if I did, if he did, no, he let me go do it. So he was very supportive. Yeah. I got the main guy from the rock see who ended up being our tour manager on a first tour. The guy that would hang up on me the most.
He gave me a phone number of promoter Brian Markovich, that was his name. And they do that. I called the dude up. He's like, this is a blue cell tickets. I'm like, yeah, of course with it's cell tickets. And we had friends and stuff that were already supporting us. They would come to our practice and they would watch rehearse and we have like 20, 30 people come out and play. We would play to them like a show, but at our warehouse, this area, you know, in North Hollywood.
So finally, he gave me 75 tickets to sell. And it was May 28, 1995. That was our first show. And we sold over 140, 150 tickets, bro. We had to go back and ask for more tickets. Yeah. So is this supportive friends? Are you already getting a following from word of mouth friends and friends of friends? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we were Armenian and there was no other like there. There were a couple of Armenian bands that came around before us, you know, in the LAC, but nothing like us.
So it was like, we had a lot of support and remember, we had a lot of friends and we used to do this all the time. So everyone was just excited for us to like do this so they can all go to a club and be happy and go crazy. Yeah. So it was like a, it was really like support. We had a lot of support, bro. It was great. And since we didn't have a demo, he had no clue where to book us, you know, how to bill us. So he put us in on a sconeite. It was like seven, we were one of seven bands.
There was like three before us, three after us. We were right in the middle sandwiched between checkers, black and white checkers. Yeah. And so, and it was a quiet night. It was like a free night on a Tuesday, three hours to get in if you're under 21, above 21 it's free. You could go drink.
And it was like 30, 40 people in the crowd during the first three bands we get on and the like, like 100 people show 150 people and they start a pit and it gets crazy and we had this banner about the Armenian genocide. We made a statement, it was like political and shit. Yeah, yeah. Going on here, dude. And luckily there was a writer at the show from a local paper, a rock city news who wrote about us the next day of publishing, put something came out and rock city would come out Thursdays.
And this was a Tuesday. So he wrote last minute Wednesday, boom. May the day. Wow. So something went down in LA this week and I was a witness and it was a band. Yeah. The down called us the down. And it was like people started noticing like whoa, he was like, and I still have the public the public. So man, I just took that and ran and then I already booked that night of the first show. I booked the second show a month after at the whiskey and we sold the same amount of tickets.
And after that, we never had to sell tickets again. So I was up over to North Kingsley real quick. So if people haven't heard it, but they know system of a down, how do you describe North Kingsley's music? It's not like system of a down. I don't have, I mean, there's the DNA of the riffs and stuff because I've written riffs for system, you know, like that. So it's still me writing riffs and I've really progressed throughout the years. I think I have, I think I'm a lot better at it.
I know how to arrange better. I know, I'm like doing in North Kingsley what I saw Rick do to us. You know, I'm also producing it. Yeah. I'm accompanied by two amazing people, Sorrow and Ray. Sorrow's the sickest producer. He keeps amazing me with his beats and his sounds and shit that he's doing. Yeah, what's his background? His background is he came in, okay, like I met him at my friend's studio and I just was like intrigued by the fact that he knew how to run like logic pro so well.
That's the program that's on the max, you know, to make use of it. And I was like, man, teach me what you know, you know, he's like, fuck yeah, I'll teach you. And he was in this little side project, not separate, a little band with Ray. And they had, they had songs and they were cool, politically charged and shit like socially charged and out aware. And I was like, it's good shit. But I had this other thing in mind, you know? And I was like, at that point I was kind of frustrated.
I wasn't finding people to make new music with and I was like, I'm going to do this myself. I'm just going to learn the program and just do it, right? And as he came along to the studio once or twice a second time, we already kind of wrote something together like with his with his talent of like beat making, he comes from an old school of like production, you know? He's like, does he have a hip hop background? Yeah, straight up.
But a lot of our median vibes too, like he samples old music that I don't even know exists, you know, like he takes it. Right, a couple of your songs have that, right? Well, you've only released three. We've only released three. You haven't heard nothing yet. Like we just released the basic three that like we wrote first. There's like so much more. And the reason why I'm breaking it up in three is because we're such a new act and people are used to from me hearing system.
So I kind of wanted to give them food to digest, take his into it, ease into it, instead of dropping a whole record on you and then you're just like not knowing where to go with it. One thing that's similar to system, I think. The one thing that is like that, if this, if all the 12 songs, all 12 songs that we have at the moment, we're put into a record. It's like system where not one song sounds like the other, but they all fit the DNA of the band.
It's like on our first album, we had a sweet people, spiders, none of those songs. If you think it's the same band, but it is, right? That's what we do. We don't sound the same. None of the songs sound the same as the formula is there. The band, you can know, you, you hear the vocals, you know it's the same band. You hear the sound of the drums, you know it's the same band. You hear the sound of the guitar in the bass, you know it's that band.
So it's like I'm creating something where it's original again. It's just a different genre, bro. I couldn't do what we did already. I don't want to do that. I can't do that. That, that happens when the four of us get together, a system of a down. I would never, ever try to step on that toes, you know those toes because that's big toes to step on. You know, I had to do it. I'm natural at and what these guys are natural at. It took two years to develop.
It wasn't like we got together, boom, there was the first song, like a shotguns or whatever. It was more like we wrote beats and beats and I played over beats and in all of a sudden that developed it to put them together and then vocals came in and we had to range because he was, he was crazy. Like his vocals were like one long verse from beginning of the song to the end. The song was like, yeah and the vocalist, is it Ray Hawthorne? Is that his name? Ray Hawthorne, man. He's amazing.
He's original man and I'm really, I'm really lucky to have him, bro. I kind of helped him develop just like, you know I've been through this, this is not my first rodeo and like I've seen Rick Rubin mold the serge, you know what I mean? Serge is vocals and like cut this up, same over here, say less here.
Kind of that inspiration I took and I just naturally it happened because I know when I hear something I'm like, okay, yeah let's break this down to a verse of course, a middle part of another chorus. So it's like I have it in my head, the formula and then I take what we make and then I kind of chop it up like that with the guys of course and eventually in the last two years we develop the formula where we all know where we stand and what we do.
So it's like we go into the studio and it's like we bang it out. It's like I have a riff I bring in, he already has a beat at throat over that beat and we cut up the beat and we have vocals come in, maybe the vocals already there and I write a riff towards the vocal pattern and so it's so fun, it's like it's liberating bro, it's liberating to do this again because I really love writing music with system of down.
I loved creating, I know there in wrote a lot of music, serge brought a lot of stuff in, I brought stuff in, that was so special, you know, and then it stopped.
In 15 years ago it stopped and I miss it man, I miss making music, I did this for a living not to become famous, I did this just so I can keep on playing music, you know, and it sucks that after fame we kind of stopped, you know, and so this was really like I said the word is liberating to like be able to make music again with people that I bond with.
And you know, 30 years younger than me man, they're like 31, 31, 31 and it's like I connect with the musically like like we've always been doing this, you know, and that's a great feeling and it's like when you have that you got to take it and run. So he's not even just a rapper, the guy he raped because he's so bad at it, he doesn't, he's a singer really, but I didn't make it rap rock, you know, I didn't want to do that.
But there's songs coming out where it's full singing with a little bit of hip hop, but it's we have a lot of angles. So I feel like there's a lot of places we can still go. So it's very interesting to me, exciting to me because it's like if you like what you've heard, I think you're going to love what you're about to hear and then you're going to love you more what we're coming with because we're building and it keeps getting better. Like we did one yesterday.
There's a song where we're going to get a feature from one of my favorite hip hop groups, Cypress, you know, we're going to this. I'm a bit too busy with anyone else listening. It was an older song that we had written, we just went in and like the way he saw represented it to me last night, I was taking man, it was like so bad ass that I can't wait to play that for beat and have him drop his words on there. It's going to be amazing.
So like there's things that are coming that are, is very exciting for me. Do words come pretty easily to Ray? Oh my God. Yeah. Okay. He even like helps me, you know, I got 22 red, my brand. Yeah, yeah. So I have, we do like cool things, I love like putting messages inside like boxes and inside the t-shirts like under hoodies, like if you wear it inside out, there's like words written in there.
Like people don't even know until they start washing their stuff inside out and like, oh shit, there was writing in there. We didn't know about right? I love like that. So he helped me write some of those phrases. He's just really good with words, man. It's like I tell him a direction, I give him a direction, he goes. Not to say he doesn't have direction himself. He's like all over, bro. He has songs for days.
We can have three albums now if it was up to Ray because you're sort of corralling all the creative energy and putting it into the right format and arrangements. Yes, yes. That's the thing I do away from writing the riffs and putting songs together. I'm also doing that because, and that's what they trust me. That's what we do. Like listen, it takes the three of us to make what we do. I couldn't do that without them, you know what I mean?
So since I have amazing things from them, I'm able to do that. I'm able to corrall it, you know what I mean? So like I said, man, it is a unit. It's not, it's start off as a side project, but it's becoming something that I feel like could be something on its own without even using the Shavo system of a down name. Like not trying to use the system name so much because you know people expect different things and also using this name. A lot of people, it's turned into a meme.
This whole like, where's the new album? You know, it's been 15 years when I'm putting, when I'm posting something political and you're asking me where the new album is or if I'm posting something about the new band and you're putting, you're saying, where's the new album? You know, it's like that's not fun to hear.
You know, if I can make a new album on my own with, you know, I would, stop breathing me with it, you know, we're sorry that we weren't, we haven't come up with a new album for you guys. You know what I mean? I would love, I'm the guy. Let's go bro. Let's get in that studio and make a record. We have music. It just hasn't happened yet. So I probably stockpiles of music I would think. I'll have you. Imagine, imagine, right? And so I wish it would happen.
So I'm kind of at this point wishing it would happen. So I wouldn't have anyone tell me anymore and ask me for anymore. It's become a storm in my side, you know, it's like, fuck, I'm not ramming that in my side, you know, like stop shanking me. You know, I mean, yeah, yeah. It's what it feels like, man, as much as I adore it, I also like, it's like, fuck, man, like I'm trying to do something new because I can't do the old thing because it takes more than one person to tangle, right?
So let me do what I can right now. And then if that comes around again to me, I'm going to take that and run, you know, but right now this is what's in front of me. So this is what I'm going to write, you know, that's great. You've got this outlet with people you're creatively compatible with and, bro, perfect. Yeah. What part of LA is North Kingsley? I mean, you said you, you named it after your street that you grew up on. It's East Hollywood. It's, I lived between Fountain and sunset.
And that's the perimeter is like Western and Vermont in the middle of that. Okay. So it's like Hollywood east of Western, west of Vermont, right? That's where our old school was to a net area. The army that we went to was in that area. Okay. So all the kids from the army school that, uh, follow me on, on Instagram and stuff, like anyone that like still, you know, follows my ass and like, oh, that's shovel from the new year. They're like, is that the North Kingsley you grew up on?
I'm like, yeah, bro. That's what it is. It's like people trip up. Yeah. Some of my friends from the street have hit me up. Like, dude, that's our street's name. I'm like, I know. Yeah. Are you going to have a guitar on when you play live? I am. Okay. You have a guitar and then vocalist obviously. And then is it sorrow, sorrow, sorrow? Yes. So he will basically have being charged with the beats, right? He'll, the electronic component, electronic component.
But we might take on two new members, uh, just for live. Uh, if I play the, if I decide to play the bass on a song, I'm going to have him play the guitar. If I decide to play the guitar on a song, he's going to play the bass. I also have a drummer in mind to come in just for live. It'll make him more exciting. But I don't want to take away that beat savvy that he has, that sorrow has that like element of like, like the low tones and the sounds. I don't want to change that.
I don't want to turn into new metal. That's what we're not. That's something we're way on another platform, you know? But sometimes it's in line, you know, because you have a drummer and you have a rapper and you have a guitar and bass, it turns to that. I don't want that. So we're still figuring that out. If we're just going to go to three of us and just tend to do programs and live, that might be the way to go. Yeah. All right. So next year we should look out for you. 100%.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If we could do all the venues at once, we're going to do it. You know what I mean? Like if we can like teleport and we would be doing that. And then does system of a down have any gigs lined up or tours? Yeah. We do. We do. We what we had last year, we have half of what we had last year. We kind of broke it down in half because of what's going on. So we have the two L.A. shows with corn, faith no more coming up in May.
And then in June, we're doing Europe. We have I think 11 shows. Not sure. Okay. So that's an interesting dynamic from the outside that you guys can still play all these shows together and sort of cordon off the recording new material part. Sucks, right? Well, it's cool that you guys can still do it and sort of section it off, I guess, better than nothing. I mean, dude, it's better than nothing in a beggar's campy choosers. I always say that.
So dude, I'll take whatever I can get because I love, I love my units. You know, I love system. I love the guys. They're, you know, they're my friends over anything, you know, even if I don't see them or talk to them for months, where we were on the phone with best friends. Yeah. That's how I am with them. Nothing has gone down so terrible that we can never, that's why I'm always optimistic. And whenever I say that, it becomes headlines. Oh, Shabble is optimistic.
Well, yeah, but I'm optimistic about a lot of things. I mean, it's going to happen. But the reason why I'm optimistic is because nothing's been done that can't be undone. It's not like someone said or did something that's end all. It's not like God forbid anyone's passed away. We're still all here. We still can talk. We still could play. We're still alive here. I mean, so I mean, dude, you know, it's just such a, it seems like a unique dynamic.
I mean, the reason it's an issue, I'm sure, is because you guys all care so much. Yes. And so I could see it getting heated in certain environments, but it's admirable that everyone can remain friends and separate band bizz from friendship. If we can just like agree, you know, like if there wasn't, if people weren't so adamant about their views, you know, it would be nice to just kind of like back up a little and say, you know, let's just do it and do it.
Like I'll listen to you if you listen to me instead of like, I think it should be this way. I think it should be that way. Okay, well, then that's not going to work because if you both, you know, it's like it should be, I don't know, man. So is it band direction or more business of songwriting credit or, you know, plead the fifth if you want? I don't want to plead the fifth. Yeah. Okay. Well, they're like, the live show is so sub putting their love on a specific occasion.
And we're gonna be like, um, we don't want to be tied for love. Please, we certainly just want to fight for tension. We've been even fake. But that's a lot of, I mean, I think something that we've been saying right now. Oh, live shows, please hold on and maybe we could be taking a whore and we're gonna such — we're gonna make one — as purpose that would a lot of work, except a whole business. does something, where's the new record? I'm posting no things like, where's the new record?
I'm posting cannabis, where's the new record? It's like, it's always there now because it became this thing that's like, we're like, fuck this, you know, fuck the new record. It's going to make me say, fuck the new record because there's so much, you know? But you know what? The flip side is, we should be fucking honored that people still care and want the new record, you know what I mean? Right, right, right. That's sort of this added pressure is the fact that you
haven't released an album so long. So it's so highly anticipated, you know, everyone feels very strong about not disappointing the public. I mean, is that part of it? I don't think so because I feel like there's, do we got some shit, bro? I don't think there's a point anybody, you know? I really have faith in all our songwriting abilities and what we could do in the studio together, it's really, you know, I mean, if we just do it the way we know how to do it and we don't switch up
the way we do it, then I think it'll be fine. I think it's just that some members might want to switch it up at this point and when you switch it up after all this time, it might not, you know, it's my first cool opinion. Who knows? Is there a process you'd have to sift through the
well of song ideas that are built up? It's crazy to process, bro. Um, everyone kind of throws it in the pot and like, you know, Darren's got all so much material, Sarah had a bunch of songs that he had brought in and it's just a matter of taste and a matter of what should be, you know, the way we used to do it is we used to all bring songs and put them all, make them all happen, work on them together, we're going to separately, bring them in, record them all.
And then the four of us, our manager and Rick would uh, vote on each song without anyone knowing who voted, you know what I mean? Uh, it looks like, you know, it would be democratic as fuck. And that way that A, the songs that were A made the record, the song that would be could be on the record, the songs that C waited for another record or waited or just went away, you know what I mean? Yeah. And uh, that was the process. If we can take that process and go, we'd be fucking making
records every year. Are those like like riffs or more like fully fledged songs? Well developed afterwards. Like we're toxicity, we had 33 songs and uh, we recorded all 33, listen to them and then voted on the 13 or 14 that went on toxicity. And then there was, steel this album was, was the other songs that we redid and made it steel. Yeah. So. Gotcha. I just, I just know like even personally, like my phone recordings just build up so fast, I don't even end up looking at my old
ideas. I'm with you. I have that in my, I was about to go through mine after this podcast. Yeah. What I have in there, dude, there's so much stuff that is put in there that you forget, you know? Yeah. It's always so fun to come up with new stuff and then you think I probably have really cool stuff. I've already written it. It's just buried. Yeah. Yeah. That's the case. I have, uh, I do this thing with my phone. I started doing it a couple of years ago where when I grab a guitar,
I just press record on the video section and I just record riffs. All everything that comes out of me, I recorded it then I would cut them up and like the good one stayed. There were all the ones that, the ones I didn't like after listening to it twice would get deleted. And I still have those folders, you know, and they were, I was doing it for system. I was like anything that would resemble system of a down vibe that we could take and put into a song I would just keep and keep.
And I just kept them all. I still have them all. None of them have been used yet. You know, so. Yeah. Is it pretty clear now if you make up something whether it would go in the system folder or the north things? Pretty much. I kind of know because I know how the other guys write. Like I know Darren and I know Serge. I know John. So it's like I would, I'd say there's a certain amount that would go to them and I think they would make that riffs, those riffs together shine and be what they are
need to be. And then there's a certain vibe I've been bringing to north Kingsley that is really, really working at the moment. Yeah, I would know. I wouldn't know for sure. Hence I haven't used any of the system stuff with north Kingsley. You know, like Serge says like, oh, I wrote these songs for system and since that didn't happen, I'm going to release this album. Well, it's not that this. I'm not, I'm keeping those. I'm just holding onto this. There's more coming out of my head that I can
give to north Kingsley that there's no lack of materials. Yeah, I'm not using what I made for system on north Kingsley in that era. Can you name three albums that have most influenced you? I would go through 100. Yeah, I did something the other day where I had some albums written down. I was doing my favorite albums of all time. I'll go through a bunch. Okay. I'll go through a bunch. I have it here. So, uh, Compton's in the house by NW. Okay. Rain in blood. Yeah. Walk among us, misfits.
Bleach, Nirvana. Arise from Sepulttura. 36 chambers from Wu Tang. Volga display of power. I mean, Sabbath, bloody Sabbath. Oh, it takes a nation of millions to hold us back. That public enemy record fucked me up when I listen to that like on repeat and I'll end it with revolver from the Beatles. That's great. You had this list accessible. It sounds like it was on my phone notes because I had a cool. I did this one feature for a magazine where they were like, name us the 10 records that like
you started with listening to in the past that made a change in your life. And these are ones that I when I got those records and I when I discovered I should say those records, something happened in my head where it was like fuck, dude. I was touched by them and those are there's more but those ones really touched me. So we know you're an Ernie Ball string player. What what Gage are you using? The last few times I switched to one I was using. So I would go for oh, did you guys have done
some great shit for me? Some experimental shit. I remember we gold played at some of my right, some of my strings. So I would take a five strings that I played four strings. So I would take a five string set, use the low string for my C string. So I tune it. So instead of tuning it down E goes to a C. So my E goes to a C. So now I would use a B string and I would tune it up to a C. Now I'm saying. Right. Yeah. Yeah. B string on a five string. So I would use that for a C string.
So I would tune it up to a C. So it was a tighter, tighter than it was. So I would into and we have to intonate the base all the time re-intonate because it's really tight on that's a big fourth string. Yeah, dude. So and then I would use three two one four three two one that the I would leave the fourth string out of the five string set. So that was how I did it for a while. So then I was thinking the time I was I used to play a lot with Wu Tang. I had this I toured with
Wu Tang for a bunch playing bass for them and I didn't even make it news. I just did it, you know, and whoever you ever saw it saw it. Yeah. And I kind of was in this whole rap game thing. And so I asked you guys if you could dip my, because I know gold gold is a really soft metal, right? So gold plated strings. I used to use gold plated strings, actual gold. And it would make the sound so fucking warm. So every time I played with Wu Tang, first of all, I looked bad as I had gold
strings, right? And secondly, and I was using your bongo bass too at the time. I was on stage with Wu Tang. Yeah, yeah. And and yeah, I would use gold plated strings, bro. And then you know who I gave my last bass to was Jizza's little son, Justice. We I he was learning how to play the bass and it was really inspired by me and he was on tour. So it was the last day of the tour and I took it off my neck off stage and I handed it to the kid. He cried. He had teared in the United. It's so
beautiful. Oh, good to hear. He probably still has it. I hope you know. All right. Well, Shabo Dajian. Thanks for being on the podcast. Now thank you for having me, man. This was good. It went down memory lane. Thanks for tuning in to striking a chord and Ernie Ball podcast. Be on the lookout for new North Kingsley songs. And if you like the podcast, why not give it a kind review on your favorite podcast app? If you'd like to contact us, please email strikingaccord at Ernie Ball.com.
I'm a collaborator. I'm not like the solo artist that sits there and like, go and rewrite the riff. Let me write the vocals. Even though I can hold notes and I can totally do background and I can maybe sing even I just that's not my four cable. It's not something that comes natural to me. What comes natural is what I want to do. And I think that's where North
Kingsley is. It's like the stuff that I don't do they do really well. So it's really a way of me being able to like put that into the package, you know.