Welcome to epicenter episode 392, today we have on with us goofy, true poles, who is the co-founder of alchemax. But before we talk to this creepy about alchemax, we'd like to tell you a bit about our sponsors this week, Exodus, Exodus is a easy to use wallet. Which supports hundreds of assets and has native apps for all platforms, including IOS, and Android. And as a fully non-custodial wallet, their firm Believers in the not your keys not are coins.
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per transaction. Scalability is perhaps the single biggest challenge preventing crypto from becoming the backbone to the world financial system. And today, Solana May well be the best solution. We have go to salon, a.com slash epicenter to learn more. All right, so Scooby it's super awesome to have you on you. And I have like, you know, I feel like we've like, chatted on like Twitter threads and stuff. For a long time.
I think I do this like thing where annually, I figure out I run a script at the end of the year to see whose Twitter accounts I've liked the most like the who's tweets. I've liked the most and I think in 2020 you were like number like seven or eight on my list and which is really cool because like this is the first time wherever talking in person. I think probably everyone else on the list. It's like people actually knew in person or something but it's
like you were. So this is really cool to finally get a chance to talk to you. So yeah. Can you tell us a little bit about Yourself and like, you know, I mean, okay. One thing that people can probably obviously tell us Koopa troopas is probably not your real name. So, tell us a little bit about how you got into crypto and why you use the name Scoopy, triples. Yeah, I mean, it's fun that we interact on Twitter, you know, I
always loved that. You have like, these random geography fact threads that this continual thread. It's always a highlight of my day to find to learn something new from you, but how did Why get into crypto? Yeah, so it was, I mean my journey like all the way started back in the I think it was in 2011. And when I heard about the, the Silk Road for the first time, there was like a giant expose. It was like I'm Gawker and all
sorts of Internet websites. And, you know, I got interested in it and I downloaded Tor Browser.
And I wanted the Pirate Bay and I found a website where I could buy Now there's like right about that buy button and then I was just like hmm I don't think I'm gonna do this, this is weird this internet money stuff you know it sounds dumb and then I backed out and then so I sort of knew about Bitcoin this entire time didn't pay it a ton of attention to it and then like in 2013 like a family member so I can do you got to get this Bitcoin thing? It just wanted to like a
thousand dollars. I'm like, wait, what? Last time I checked it was like a doll. Dollar and so I thought, you know, I just missed it, I thought it was a bubble and then I felt really Vindicated when it crashed, you know, it was in his bare Market in like, you know, 2015 and 2016. And my wife was like, Hey Scooby, we need to do some investing and, you know, start looking into that stuff. And this time I look, I don't know about this Bitcoin stuff. I know I was like following that
a while ago. How's that doing? And I, you know, I went down the rabbit hole and I More about it, you know, on a deeper level and I was like, you know what, let's do this. Like you know Screw stocks, let's go into Bitcoin and so late 2016. I got into Bitcoin and 2017. I did what everyone else did and they you know spend a lot of money on ico's and coins that have fancy infographics. That make it look like they have an ecosystem but they really don't have an ecosystem at all.
And then eventually I just kind of gravitated more and more towards a theory. Especially towards the end of 2017 and early 2018, when the app started becoming more and more popular ethereum. The crypto kitties was my first deep and then I played around with stupid Ponzi money games because that was the only thing out there in 2018.
There was no like D5. But at that time, like, you know, even though these were like kind of stupid money games, it kind of got my, you know, my brain going like, whoa, you can do a lot of stuff with programmable money, and at that. I'm I wasn't a developer, but I was like, you know what, let's go in, let's do this. And so I started learning how to code, I became a web developer at that time, sorry, getting some jobs for Web 2.0, stuff, using react, and then it was a
summer of twenty. Twenty one of my friends that I met in crypto discords, he's like, hey, I need a front end developer for this app I'm making and at the time it was called She's fi this is back in June before, Sushi. Before yam before? Any of the food token? Craze hit, we had cheese fi and it was actually very similar to what ended up becoming alchemic school. But it had some some pretty key differences that we decided that we realized that would make it like non-viable as a platform.
Essentially, what we would do for cheese fi, would you be? You would like lock up die for between? In 100 days and then you get this cheese token in exchange
for doing that. And then the yield from your die would then go to buying off the cheese token from the market from you to swap and then we were like we thought it was really cool model but then we would learn more about like Mev minor tractable value and sandwich attacks and we realized that a lot of value could be extracted from that system. So we had to go back to the drawing board and create something different. And Then through that process,
we came across. You know, what is now alchemax How did you kind of decide to go with the name like Scoopy? Triples, I think we actually were discussing this right before the show. I think would be really interesting to discuss with with viewers. Like, what, what got you excited about that name? Specifically? All right, so in Rick and Morty, there's an episode where they go to Pluto and because like a Jerry's adamant that it's a planet.
Even though everyone says, it's not planet and like the ruler of that Pluto's name was asked, rupee nipples. And then later on, I like that name so much. I was playing Dungeons and Dragons and I made this like silly character based off of screwby nipples and that character's name was called Skippy triples and then when it came time to make my Twitter account My normal handle that I use other places was gone and I was like, huh, what can I use? And it's like, oh Scooby triples.
That's that's a funny. Let's go with that one. That can be my new handle and the Scoobies triples was born and only blew up on Twitter recently, really like in defy summer. I was like, some nobody with like a hundred followers for, like, the longest time, So, what made you decide to go, like, build this whole project anonymously? Like, you know, for like five years of epicenter, surprisingly, we didn't have
like any Anon people. And then I think suddenly in the last, like, six months, we just have this, like, you know, I may be, I think we might be like, our third and On guest at this point and it's like, and obviously there's others like larger Trend in like, you know, Anon like building anonymously. I mean, it's arguably, it's not a new trend, are you believed was the first Trend in crypto as well from Satoshi.
But what? Did you decide to do that and what's been your like experience doing that? The only thing, like the ethos of crypto should be an honor, pseudo Anonymous. I mean, if you go back to the founder of it, all, yes, Toshi Nakamoto was.
But I mean the reason for that is that, you know, when you are holding crypto assets, you know, you're holding them like in your house, you know, you got your seat, phrase, maybe, you know, backed up on a piece of paper or, you know, maybe a metal card if you're really precautious and you know, somebody could easily just like break into your house and then rip off.
All of your, you know, all of your money, all your assets, you know, just by stealing some words on a piece of paper from you and with that in mind like I'm Anonymous for my own safety like I don't want to expose me or my family or anybody you know, who's close to me, you know to my dealings and crypto, you know if word got out that you know, my who I am in real life is Skippy triples, then you know, it might make people that I love and care about targets. Also, including myself.
And there's also the thing that like, I haven't told like anybody in my really, like, close family and friends about Scooby, triples, are all chemicals. Because I like to kind of separate that life from, you know, or that that from, you know, my normal life because I don't want people to treat me any different than they have treated me. My entire life, just because they think I've money. And so, you know, for safety and my own personal reasons I choose to be anonymous.
I mean, I'm surprised that there's not more Animus Founders out there because I think like, you know, putting your name out there and your face out there is kind of dangerous. One thing I wanted to kind of dive into was the mechanism design itself of alchemax. How would you describe to someone hearing for the first time? What L can mix is at a high level? And what the main kind of use case, it provides for Defy, is Okay. So at a basic level, the way.
All Comics works is that you deposit dye into the system, and then you can use that died as collateral to Mint are owned synthetic. Stable coin, Al USD and you can borrow up to 50% of the amount of collateral that you have. So if you put in a hundred, you can borrow 50. And then what happens is that the dye that you deposit gets deposited into urine that Finance. Into their diet Vault and that earns around around 15% interest
a year. And what happens is that the principal from your deposit is earning yield and that gradually pays off your Al USD debt over time. And then that harvested yield also goes to a module that we call the the transmitter which acts as a backstop to the peg. So if for some reason, a Leo's D is treating at under the peg on our curve. Market.
Then you can go to the transmitter module and guarantee a one-to-one conversion for from Ali, SD to die, other things for the transmitter that fill it up or when people repay their loans in die. So a lot of people have been with alchemic so you're not locked in at any time for any amount of time. So you can always repay your debt and then exit your collateral from the system.
So whenever anybody pays and die, whether that's through Direct. All payments, or if they liquidate their die collateral to pay their debt, that dye gets sent to the transmitter. And the cool thing about the transmitter is that it takes all of its die and puts it into urine. And then that yield from the transmitter is then passed along to the depositors in our vault.
So it boosts their apy because we have an effectively higher principle than then, just the deposits themselves because of the transmitter, so that's how we can get like 25% interest whereas urine is getting like 15% Let's go to our sponsor, Exodus Exodus is a fantastic crypto currency wallet, that strikes the right balance between ease-of-use security and great features. You can get Exodus on the iPhone desktop app. Web app, Android, whatever
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This is a little tricky since we have our own synthetic, stable coin, Al USD, when we harvest the yield from yearn, we reduce amount of everyone's debt like globally in the system when that happens. But we don't actually have to pay the dye to like the users at this point that the guy that died just ends up going straight to the transmitter. So all of it goes the transmitter and it decrements. Everyone's debt at the same time, there is a 10% fee.
Alchemic charges on yield harvests and that's kind of our rate. That's our take. That's our project fees that we take, and we have to do that. The bare minimum. We have to do that, just to pay for the fees for harvesting, because it's not cheap to run an app on ethereum. Gas is very expensive and some of the processes that we do is we don't have users call these functions. Instead of, we kind of batch it
all together and the people running the protocol. you know, that that team we, you know, pay that cost for the our users How do people learn from the transmuter is everyone who's has a USD, like learning from it or do people have to actually deposit into the transmitter. So the transmitter is not really a vehicle for for yield or earnings. It's just a like a guarantee that you can redeem your, a Leo's D4 die and we only really see usage of that.
When the curve pool, that we have gets a little bit. Bounced. And there's more, ALCS token are all USD tokens. Then the, the the curve tokens are the kind of curved metal pool tokens the three pull. So whenever there's like an inbounds there, we might see people use the transmitter which kind of access like the backstop of the peg, but that's like any event. Let like, aliens, deed falls off the peg like really badly.
Then people could like by Augustin off the market, then put it in the transmuter and that could be like a source of yield if you Treat all used as a bond but other than that, no, it's just a Redemption model, you know, method of way to
backstop the peg. So it's not really meant for healed, but the transmitter itself does deposit, it's over 200 million died in to yearned and then, you know, passes on that yield to our users, would you say it's safe to characterize the main use case, people are using alchemic for is getting extra yield. You mentioned 25. Five percent relative to fifteen percent or have there been like other really interesting use cases. That have surprised you that came off the protocol.
Yeah, so I mean, a lot of people what they're, you know, they're just depositing in there and just learning yield on it. But for the most part, people are taking on a Leo's D Loans and some people are using it for personal finance where they're selling the value of D for like, you know, TC then and then
exiting it off of coinbase. I know, I've confirmed that we've had some people do this, somebody bought a boat for their dad, using an alchemical own, you know, guy bought a Porsche I know somebody who's paid for their grad, school tuition, using an outcome X alone. Also, some of you pay their hospital bill for their newborn son by financing it through an alchemical loan and other than personal finance.
A lot of people what they're doing is they're either selling the audio CD and investing in speculating in the market, or they're taking their value of D, and then supplying like liquidity on curve, and then earning a lcx that way. So, Some people are, you know, using it for finance. Other people are speculating and other people are just trying to maximize their you'll farming even more.
So on that personal finance, use case was one thing I'm a little bit confused about is what's the use case of borrowing a stable coin against over collateralized stable coin. So like you know, people often will use like maker compound because to borrow USD, but, but they put down collateral in, you know, either PTC or something because they're trying to maintain, you know, exposure to the collateral. A And also that you know is often I tax benefits as well to
doing this. But why would I put down two hundred dollars of a stable coin just to borrow $100 of a stable coin? Instead of just selling or spending my original stable coin? So all times like when you have your own savings and stuff like that and then like an expense in life comes up, you have to make a choice between consumption and saving. Whereas without pemex, you can do both. You can both save and spend say then consume.
So let's say you have a thousand dollars saved up, that's your rainy day fund, and then you get into a car accident and it turns out the bill for this car accident is going to be five hundred dollars to fix it. If you were to pay that out of pocket. He left with five hundred dollars of savings and let's say, you go ahead and you put that $500 in D5 and you're making, you know, fifteen twenty percent a year on that. That's great, right?
But without chemicals, what you could do is you could put your thousand dollars in it. Take out that five hundred dollar loan and then you could be earning interest on the thousand dollars that you put in. So you'd have a larger principle that's earning yield paying off
your loan. So by the time that the loan has paid off, you will have a thousand dollars where if you paid out of pocket for that car accident and then you invested that $500 in defy and then it, you know, compounded over two years, you'd be looking at maybe like $700 750 but without coming to the ending up with a thousand dollars Example I said was like, you know, sometimes you want to maintain expose, the reason you would borrow against your ethos, you want to maintain exposure to
eat and you thing Keith is going to go up here. Kind of actually is somewhat similar but you're basically saying Hey I want to maintain exposure to it's not really a stable coin it's a yield earning stable coin because in defy at this moment even stable coins can like give you quite a high return. Alka mix helps you maintain exposure. This like high-yield earning stable coin, and you're borrowing this low yield earning stable coin, which is the AL USD.
Is that is that essentially What's Happening Here? Yeah, I like to think about Comics as like a savings technology and a lot of ways where you're encouraged to both save and spend Yours by Saving, it's giving you access to, you know, you're, you know, a greater and greater line of credit. So it's encouraging you to save and it's also kind of putting a limit because you can there's like a 200% collateralization ratio.
Let's say you save up a million bucks and then you go into Al pemex you can take out five hundred thousand dollars. So it's not like you're gonna be able to spend And all of your money this is important because let's say, you know, the yields on upcoming to dry up or you need your collateral back for something in real life and you want to get out, you can pay off
your loan. Let's say, like, if you, you still have your ally go State, I'll use dear, you convert it to die, you can pay off your loan from your wallet, or you can liquidate your collateral. So you can get out. It gives you a little bit more optionality in your spending. So if you wanted to, you could just have that debt repaid itself or you could. Repay it yourself manually.
If you repay yourself manually, yeah, you get a little extra gains from, you know, the extra principle but it would be pretty
similar to paying out of pocket. But the whole idea is that gives you that option ality, you can essentially get a line of credit that pays itself off and that, that lets you just like kind of take risks and do things and spend money, like, kind of in a guilt-free way because I know like I'm a saver naturally and I always like hate to take money out of my savings or out of Investments to, you know, to buy something, or to fund my real
life. And without coming tonight, I feel like I'm not forced to make that decision anymore. I can just be like, hey, I'm just going to take out a loan that's going to pay itself off it. In fact, what I do for my own personal finances, I have a decent amount of dye and help Amex, and I just draw some monthly and then that pays, like all my house and family bills and at the end of the month, I've almost no debt. And then I just take another loan out and then just repeat
the process. Process. So when you're looking for a flight, you go through a flight aggregator to see all the different places where you can buy the fly to get all the options and make sure you get the best price for your travel plans. And when you're making a defy swap, just do the same and use para swap. It beats the market prices across all the major indexes because it Aggregates them and thanks to their network of professional market makers.
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major stable? Alcoa in for defy like how do you see it being composed upon and what do you see its role in the like whole stable coin ecosystem that already exists in defy? Yeah. Yeah, we're working actively on. Trying to get more Integrations for a Leo's D. First up from that one is getting reliable price Feats for Alia. See right now, we're only on the curve and factory pools and they don't have like any sophisticated swaps or oracle's
associated with that. So we're trying to work with chain link to get a price feed for our ecosystem tokens. And once that happens, we're going to be able to get Al USD
on places. Like like Ave like a rare, he's fuse and other lending markets, like cream as well, but I think more interestingly than just having it being like, a collateral or Capital asset, is that you could, we could work with like margin protocols or options, protocols, and then you could use a Leo SD to fund those positions. And then if you if you're borrowing that and alone that repays itself, then you can go short.
You can go long. And be is DJing as you want to and know that you know, even if you lose even if you get wiped out you know you still have your collateral that you use to get your audio steel own and that debt will vanish over time so I think that's kind of cool. It's like a an idea of safe aping Could you clarify that got stuff, so you think people can put down die and then borrow alchemic 6-cell. That I'm Al can mix in exchange for what Burr Al USD.
I'll come mixes the RSI value SD so people can put down dye into alchemic, Sbarro Al USD against it and they can sell that out USD. And by with it, Options are some other kind of derivative instrument, that's as you said, like, kind of a guilt-free experience is that kind of what you're envisioning. Well, what we're trying to work
for is getting Al USD. So integrated in the defy that you wouldn't have to sell it for another stable coin is that you could go straight into that options contract or into that
margin position using out USD. That's, that's the goal right there is to get to that point where it can start to be used across D5 in different, use cases and stuff because right now I can go to like margins often go to dydx, I can go to, you know, various platforms and and lever, you know my my Coins, so I can do other things and D fight with them, right? And I'll use the does not have that just yet, you know, because it's still early in the days for it.
But once we get those Integrations and it'll, you know, start to drive more, the demand side for the currency itself, because it will have a lot more uses instead of just flipping for die or u.s. DC or tether some other staple coin. And I think that's an important part of having long-term Peg. Stability, is to, you know, take care of that. Inside. Essentially if that happens I'll USD is going to be competing than with things like die and u.s. DC and stuff for like usage than D Phi.
And isn't it actually going to drive down the the yields you can earn on like die? Because like you know right now let's say, you know, right now let's say on with with on yearned, let's say put depositing in curve is one of the highest sources of you. Old, right? And that's his like, you know, one of the most incentivize pools on curve is that like three pool with die, USD T and U s-- DC. But now, let's imagine a world where I'll USD becomes. Like, you know, the fourth big
stable coin and defy, right? What does that actually, then drive down yields on die. Now because it's only getting a quarter of the curve rewards rather than a third of them. And especially the question is, as Al USD becomes more popular does not. Drive down the yields from other stable coins. I think this is a really tough one to predict because like kind of what determines the the yield
of a stable coin. There's there's a ton of factors involved you know a lot of that because you learn uses seven different strategies and their dive Vault for you know for version 2 of their vaults. And one of the strategies is to LP into to that curve bowl that you just mentioned.
They also have a number of other strategies so I'm not really sure that we would you know if L USD became you know, a huge market cap that we would dilute that I mean that's sort of saying like you know there's a stable coin out there you sdn and that has like an insane amount of curve gauge weight is is you sdn taking yield away from die, you know.
Like I feel like the answer is yes and no because They might be taking some of the curve rewards away from that three, pool curve and dilute and lowering the yields for die, but the same time, then people also balance their positions based on the yield. So the market react to that. So the appropriate amount of capital will be allocated to places to get that yield. So if the desired yield is 10% and then you see it's 5% somewhere, you're not going to
put your stable coins in there. You're going to try to find somewhere else. So I think it'll balance itself out and I don't think Al USD would have a major impact on diet yields. I haven't given this a ton of thought, to be honest, I mean, I might want to come back and issue like, you know, a deeper thought on this on Twitter for you sometime soon, Sonny. But my gut feeling is I don't think we would have any significant impact on dies
yields. That said though on version 2 of alchemic so which is slated to come out in two to three months, we will be adding multiple collateral type so you'll be able to put in and I use the see it was the 80s. Cosd you name it any viable stale stable coin, that has some good on chain healed. They'll all be collateral assets for Al USD. So will be will be siphoning yield from all of the stable coins in the future someday.
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go down. So right now, let's just say as an example, the yield on die is 25% a year and you know, it'll take about two years for, you know, if let's say you bought you put down $100 of die, you borrow $50 a value is D. It'll take about approximately two years to pay off that entire loan. But now let's say the suddenly, you know, all your Like you know, the yields drop to from 25 percent to 5 percent and now this loan suddenly takes 10 years to pay off. How does that chain?
Where does that affect like you do get reflected in the alchemic system? Like I'm out, I imagine that has to propagate somewhere. The alchemic system is, does it affect the AL USD price? Does it affect? Yeah, where does that affect get seen? Does it change the collateralization ratio needed?
Hmm, at the most basic level, it'll mean that your debt repayment times will take longer, you know, the system should still work fine but because the debt repayments are taking longer, the amount of yield flowing into the transmitter will be lower. So in the event that we do destabilize, you know and we break our Peg and stuff like that and then let's say people use the transmuter and they use everything that's in the transmitter and it goes down to
zero. At that point, then, you know, a Leo's D then would become like a bond of sorts and it would still have value and it still trade at the market in the market. But you might take a discount when you sell it or you could then purchase it from the market and then, you know, put in the transmitter and it would gradually turn into to die over time. So that that's what we worst
case scenario. We see happening in the event, that yields collapse, but if yields claps for urine, they're probably going to collapse everywhere. Because they are incredibly flexible and they have a you know very competent team of top notch developers and strategist who are heavily incentivize to find the best yields because they earn profit off of them. I'm still confident that urine will have very competitive, you know, yields in relation to
other projects in defy. But that said, yeah, definitely lower yields would could negatively impact the peg. We're not sure exactly how much. Happen to their depends.
It really depends on if the pig itself breaks, if it doesn't and our liquidity incentives and the demand to supply liquidity to our curve pools and other markets that will have in the future, if that's good enough in the Pagan hold, then it'll just mean that debt repayment times will take longer, but, you know, if the peg does break, then we would be in a little bit of a precarious situation. So that is a risk just being straight up with you guys. Why is the peg holding today?
Why is from my understanding? It feels to me that it should be. I'll USD should actually probably be treated as a bond even right now. So and so, probably be trading at a slight discount, like, there's a Time Value to the money, right? And so like yes, you can convert it at 121 on the transmuter. But, you know, at some future time and why is that not reflected in the price of Al USD today?
So right now, Alias D, there's a supply of around 330, 340 million value of D out there and currently there's around 220 million die in the transmuter. So roughly two-thirds of the aliens T out. There is backed completely 121 that you can redeem it but the other part is that these are over collateralized loans to like at the end of the day. So just like maker Dow has over collateralized loans just like liquidy has over collateralized loans. And, you know, we kind of the same thing.
So it's not only like, you know, the the dying, the transmuter, this backing, it was also the, the die, that's collateral that's backing it as well. And the fact that people can, you know, repay their debt at any time. So, like, if you borrowed out USD and then you're, you know, you're trying to earn on it and then you see that, you know,
it's price goes down. You would just feel like I am going to take my Holly St and pay down my loan because these these tokens aren't is worth this much. And that, right there itself is is a pagan mechanism because when you pay off without your stay at destroys it, And then that takes it off the market. And, you know, will help it bring it back towards more towards equilibrium. So I hope that answers your question. The other part of why it's holding the, the dollar Peg.
So strong is. Yeah, we are incentivizing liquidity on curve. We, if you stake, the the value of T3 curve, LP tokens on our website. You can earn close to 40% apy on in the form of a lcx tokens. Our audit from certificate, just came back and that's going to allow us to get on curve that Phi and we'll be able to have access to the curve gauges as well, so that will add another source of yield for our stickers and depositors. I think it's it's like the magic of the transmuter.
Coupled with the fact that, you know, we have these liquid markets that are incentivized that is keeping this Peg up. So that makes sense that you could earn Alchemists tokens by like depositing into the curve pool. But in your curve heavily incentivizes things to be priced one to one but at the end of the day even on curve, things can still be you know the price of a Al USD could still be less than one dollar relative to the other tokens in the pool and as long
as all your checking is that. Hey, is there liquidity in the pool? So why why is no-one arbitraging and like kind of even moving the curve pool to be at whatever, like a properly price Bond should be I don't think there's
really any incentive to do that. There is no ARB there, you know, for right now and if you try to manipulate it in, bring the price of value of D down that would just completely get our big way because people would say, Hey, you know, I can, you know, buy you know, a Leo's deeper 98 cents and then transmute it, you know, and get, you know, a dollar for it, you know, for 98 cents and they can get some instant yield that way.
And we've actually seen that this week with the He's crashing in price since a lcx is tied to Ethan our Sushi swap market. We've also gone down with ether as well and because of that our yields have gone down. So we've seen people exit the liquidity pools we've seen maybe like, think we had like six hundred million liquidity there last week and now we have around 550 million and at the same token since a lot of people were pulling out their died or their three, cool curve tokens from
that pool. There was a bit of an imbalance in I'll USD went down to like 99.5 sense. Whereas, before it was roughly like, you know, I think it was trading at a slight premium to die at the time before that. And then, because there was that little, our people or then starting to use the transmuter and we lost, you know, transmitter had some funds taken from it during this, this period as well. So but the peg held, it's still
very strong. And things seem to be in an equilibrium right now and we're not seeing those outflows anymore. So I think that's just the system working as intended. How long does it take for transmutation, at least, like, in that case that you talked about with die Peg breaking to like you know, 95 cents or sorry, the AL USD Peg, breaking it, 95 cents relative to die. How long does it take to transmute like Al USD in to die?
At minimum, it's going to take 50 blocks because we put the distribution of the, the die, for a lie, OSD depositors in the transmitter to take a little bit longer. So that way people wouldn't be able to like grief it if they like called Harvest and then they could, you know, then immediately get that died. And, you know, so in order to stop that, yeah, we have that split spread over 50 blocks, but
usually, that happens. Means whenever somebody those that will start flowing to your account when we their Harvest field or somebody repay their debt and die. Now, there is another function that you can use to transmit faster, it's called forced transmute. It's kind of a bit of an advanced function and it's really only for ethers can Pro users. Basically, you'd have to query in a 30mm address that state
into the transmitter. It's possible that you can have too much dye allocated to a position. I put in 100, 000 USD. There's a little box in there that says amount of transmittable die. I have if I put in 100 Augustine and I've hundred transmittable die. It'll just, you know, burned 100 Al USD and give me 100 die when I hit the transmit button. But it's possible with our current design for the transmitter. For you to have 100 ounc,
deposited. And then have more than 100 000 USD that 100 more than 100 Immutable die. I could have a million transmittable die. In fact, like, en 100 position and what you can do is, you can force transmitted somebody who's over-allocated. And when that happens, all of their excess, allocated dye goes straight to your allocated die. So, it's sort of like an
incentivised Cron job. There's a handful of people we know in the ecosystem that kind of take care of this and they've been, you know, we don't know who they are, but they Figured out this this Force transmitted system and they have been carving the peg here and there which is actually a kind of a service for everybody in the ecosystem because you know they're helping you know bring stability to the price of value of D. We did try to implement that
into the UI but we're having some issues with our graph and it wasn't reliable. So we just like cut it from the UI but occasionally what we'll do. If we notice like people like my ties and transmitting well, All four strands meet a couple positions, and then transmit ourselves. And then that will disperse the, the yield even lie to everyone else in the system kind of immediately at that time. Sure what one question I didn't fully understand what is the situation?
How do you get yourself into a situation? Where the your died allocate it is greater than your value of D. How do you get into a situation? Where you can be Force
transmitted. So this was like, Kind of like a computer science problem is that imagine like you know the dye that's flowing into the transmitter is like rain falling from the sky and you're staking position your deposit for a Leo's D is like a bucket and of course, when the buckets full you would expect it to you know, not overflow or anything like that. It would just be full, right?
But because ethereum is the way that it is and you can't like have like, you know, kind of code like self-executing, you always have to like you know pay the gas and push that button. In to do it, we couldn't find a problem or a solution at the time for that term, a term mentality for ending the, you know, the distribution for people who are like overfilled and so we were kind of scratching our heads. We were playing around with an Epoch model and other things
like that. And then one of our deaths have made like a an app from like back in 2018. And it's like, hey, what if we repurpose this code? For the transmuter it's like if we do that then it's going to overfill. And like what if I we turn you know, an overfull position? Let somebody else be able to transmute that and we could just send the divs over or the allocation over to them and that would be like an incentivize
Cron job. And so we're trying to use crypto token on or economics to solve a computer science problem. Essentially, the good news is that in our version 2. We have figured out this problem and we're not going to have to do this this awkward for Transmute kind of like Pnina work around to get the system working in a little just it'll just work and it'll be simple and will be nice. That's pretty clever solution.
I like that. Now we can now I understand with the whole that's that's pretty cool. And you before the system we had it was it was untenable where you'd have to stake your ally USD weekly and then claim whatever got transmuted weekly then Reese take it and you know when we are kind of testing that before we launched like I just hated it I'm like no nobody's going to do this nobody's going to spend you know you know five hundred dollars in gas form.
Or, you know, an undetermined pay out every week. That's why we switched it. It's not perfect, but it works at the time and we have a much better solution going forward. So, I don't know if you might not this, not not be what you want to hear, what, what this somewhat almost reminded me of
was. So I'm very familiar with Fay in this like slightly reminded me of Fae in some ways, we're especially in the case, where Faye is over collateralized, where, you know, which it is currently, right? I currently in Faye, the price that the clock with collateral that it has is much higher than the Outstanding, like, stable coin liabilities that has. And their premise is that, you know, we can keep this Peg going as long as possible.
Because anyone who wants out can get out any time and we're able to do this and we can keep this going for as long as possible because the eith price is going to, as long as the eith price is going to keep going up. We're going to continuously keep having a way for the people who want out get out when they want to get out it. This is actually very similar in a lot of ways, but instead of depending on the eith price going up here, it's depending on the yearn yields, right?
As long as the urine yields are like earning money, we'll have enough money to protocol. Will have enough reserves to let the people who want to go out. Be able to go out and what's nice as opposed to in Faye. It's like this claw do is lower bounded at the hopefully the interest rates on the on urine
do Don't go - right. Like I mean, you know, in traditional Trad fire, we do actually have negative interest rates but you know, at least on hopefully when you're in the prices should never go - and it certainly increases lower bounded zero while in the PHA case, you know the price. There's a situation where the protocol can become under collateralized as well. I didn't really think about that
comparison. But yeah, yeah, I guess where they're backed by eith, you know, collateral and buying power to buy back, everything were powered by, you know, die yield being able to buy back everything. The cool thing about alchemic Siz that, like, you know, you know, you could use it by yourself, you could be the only participant in. It wouldn't make much sense, if that were the case, but you could because, you know, your die collateral is locked until either.
You read Your debt or the or, you know, the yield is a paid off itself or in the yield pays off the debt itself. So, like, you know, even if like, you know, takes 10 years for, you know, your loan to mature and nobody's using the system, and you're just holding this Al USD out there. You don't know what to do with it. Eventually, you will be able to redeem that for die. So there is always that guarantee that we're going to
build a make you whole. And now pemex it just might take a long time in the worst case scenario and that's actually something we really really care about. About you know a lot of us came from detent money games and we didn't like the fact that so many people were getting wrecked or the fact that if somebody had to if somebody one that meant somebody else had to lose in those games.
And so without chemicals we thought how can we make it so that we can make everybody whole again no matter what no matter what happens and other than a urine hack, you know, of the, The Vault that we're using, I don't see a scenario where anybody could actually lose money using our system. What's the long-term Vision that you have for alchemic 6, where do you see yourself in 5 years? 10 years.
As part of this, like, defy story are there like new products in that I can imagine like ethos collateral. Yeah. What's the the long-term vision for you? We're targeting this month, we might slip in the next month, we're going to be launching a leathe. It'll work very similar to Al USD where you deposit teeth and you can take out an ally Sloan. It might have some different parameters. Like you might have a different conversation ratio because ET
old is lower than die yield. So we don't want, you know, somebody to be in there and then have a loan, you know, be 15 years to take off pay off. So we might increase the collateralization ratio for that one and we're playing around with some other parameters as well.
But that should be Out. Relatively soon as Shand, the, a leaf is, I think, is a really cool one, because you can, you know, lever up on your wreath or you can even, you know, use it as a cashing out method or a way to shore teeth or to hedge it. So, I think it's gonna open up a lot of really interesting use cases. Then after we get a lethal or heads down focused on getting our version to out, which will open up a multi collateral, Al-Qaeda mix essentially.
So they'll be You know, for a Leo's D, multiple stable coins that can be used as to Collateral. And the cool thing is like you can like make a composite position of a lot of different stable coins.
And now Comics, imagine each stable coin as an ingredient and you can customize or you can make your own recipe using the different ingredients and different balances that you want to. So if you want like a position that's 30% die, 50% USD, see 20% tether, you could do that if you want to. And then as That you can see like, which stable coins are offering the best yields and stuff like that. You can Constructor your
position that way. So that that's one cool thing about version 2 and the same property will also be there for a late. And we're also going to be launching out Bitcoin as well and that'll take like various flavors of Bitcoin on ethereum. And then from there is right now, an alchemist V1 we launched on audited and we were unsure of any security Issues with economic exploits.
So we lock down smart contracts from interacting with Malcolm X. So, we would prevent like flash loans and things like that. Some unknown stuff. Good news is that we got our audit back and everything came back really good. No critical issues were found. So, you know, funds are safe, but going forward and not to mix V2, is we're going to remove that restriction, and it's going to be a lot more composable. And then, To be building modules.
On top of it, I can't get into detail about too much about those. I did say that I did leak on the bank list podcast earlier that one of the modules is going to be for delegated credit. So like when you deposit die then you have like a creditor value is D that you can take out. You know this new module are going to be working on is going to allow you to then. Let somebody else borrow that Al USD from you.
I don't want to go into too many details about the system, but but I think that's going to be something that's really powerful. We're also working on a handful of are a few other modules in the one that I am leading in designing is a alchemic style and that's going to bring a cash flow model to the ALCS tokens a for participants of the dowel.
It's we're going to be experimenting with conviction voting borrowing some of the security module from Ave so like Something happens to the protocol and we suffer a loss A lcx takers in the Dow could get slashed and their token sold at auction to make the protocol whole again. So they'll be, you know, security and insurance model baked into it down and it's going to be executing code, you
know? So the doubt self right now we have a multisig community and developer multisig with the time lock and governance be a snapshot but the the doubt self will you know? Execute the code. Unlike the semi trusted setup we have right now. And so, we're going to be borrowing heavily from the governor Alpha contract from compound. So we're going to be mixing all those things together to make
something new. And also the goal is to to gamify it and turn it into something kind of cool and unique that hasn't been done before. So please look forward to that when it comes out after V2, later this year, in to 2022, we're going to be expanding the Cases of alchemic, by adding more modules, trying to secure more Integrations and defy. The Holy Grail is to get an outcome. It's credit card where you could, you know, it'll take your stable coin deposits.
And then all, you'll just have access to this, you know, line of credit that you can use for spending that actually might be in the cards. I don't want to say too much now, but yeah. We know some people that went might be able to get this to get it going and a lot of the members of the The team are also really into in a peas and gaming and stuff like that. And that's something that I think our team as they all come expressed.
You know, platform matures is an area that we might start branching off into one area that we're really excited about is flipping the model paying for games on its head a little bit and doing a form of steak to pay to play where you can leverage the actual outcome exist. Mm to finance, paint for games without actually having to, you know, purchase a game or, you know, Having to unleash a pay for all these like you know, microtransactions and stuff like that.
Instead, you would just say hey I deposit a couple hundred die and then I get to play this game as long as I have my deposit in there instead. So that's a something that we're pretty excited about. But that's down the line as far as stuff like that goes. And then you know, long, long term goals is, you know, for values D. We hope that we can become one of The top decentralized stable coin out there, it's sort of like a metastable point to in
the future. It will be when we have multi collateral Alias D so it'll be like a composite of all the the stable coins. Right now we have around three hundred and three hundred thirty million, I'll use the out there. I think it'd be really cool if we can get over a billion. So that's, you know, one of our goals is to get over a billion dollars of value of D out there, if not more, that could be cool if we could take maker Dallas. The top decentralized able Now
they're really cool. I don't know if I can get that far, but you know, that would be cool. And what do you see? As some of the biggest risks facing you guys, especially from, you know what can competition do right, as well. Like what happens if maker says, hey, we're going to start taking why assets so like, you know, like a derivative of, what about your deposit and like accept that as collateral. How does that change the Dynamics of the alchemic system? Yeah, we're already starting to
see that a little bit. I know cream was playing around with the idea of allowing, why assets as collateral I think unit protocol is also playing around with that as well, but they still would be different from alchemic because when you borrow their, their stable coins, that you're still getting charged interest. If I borrow usdp, I'm going to be getting charged 12%. If I borrowed, I think it's something like five or six percent right now.
I'm not entirely sure. Whereas, with us you you're not gonna have to pay interest on the LAUSD. Instead your collateral is going to be paying off that debt over time. So I think that's something unique for our pemex and the way that we constructed our system that other people, you know, they would either have to clone us to replicate it for their own apps. Isn't this interest important in these systems? Because it's what helps bring the price back to a Peg.
And it's like or because if people like, you know, you want to let kind of incentivize people to pay off their debt and like, having this interest is kind of what does that without requiring people to pay off their debt and like, have an interest. How do you kind of get people to want to pay off their debt? Yeah, so if Al USD is off the Peg and it's a cheaper, you know, in let's say like you borrowed it at one point and you sold it for a dollar and then
later on, it's like 97 cents. You could be like, hey, I'm going to, you know, by this out USD off the market because it's at a discount right now and I can pay off my debt for cheap like for cheaper than I would have been able to otherwise. So that is a paying module or mechanism right there. And then it's just like, you know, Arbitrage to the transmitter is the Aspect right there, that helps balance the
peg out. And the fact that like we, you know, instead of like, people paying 12%, you know, for interest, you know, we're having that 12% paid by your essentially and that's going into the transmitter.
So that that's the transmitter of the money in their sort of like this buffer that says like hey if you know the pig is you know you know at risk then people are going to go in the transmitter and then you know, use that as the method to You know, convert their earliest either they're going to orbit from the curve pool and stuff like that and make money off of it. And those those together they all, you know, so far, everything seems to be
indicating that those those mechanisms are working to maintain the peg for it. I think one of the other things that makes die Peg. So strong and S USD always have a premium, is the fact that, you know, they are in demand assets and defy whether that's through yield farming or, you know, Using them as assets and other things are in other protocols.
I think that's what you know is driving the, the high price for, you know, the premium for died in the premium 4S USD is the fact that they're useful and they are used everywhere. And I think if we can get that going for Alias D, then, you know, we'll have we'll take care of the demand side of it, even stronger. So is this going to be enough to incentivize and keep the peg strong long-term?
I I'm leaning towards yes but I guess we won't really know until the bear Market hits and we'll see what happens to the yields on chains. Like My worry is, if yields go up like under 5% I think we would still be fine at around 5% but under 5% is where I might start getting my start to worry about the effectiveness of the system and the safety of it. So I'm not the safety but more the stability of it.
But I think if we take care of the demand side, then all the other fears about the pegging are going To you know, be diminished significantly. Doesn't this also creates like a free. You can leverage on like your urine yields. So like because if you let's say I take it, I take my die, put it in Alka, mix 40, 50 % of all USD. But now if the value is D is trading at 121 with die, I could go trade that for more die. Put that in, alchemy mix again and take out.
I'll USD and I can keep doing this process again and again and I'm essentially going to be In. I basically got a free 2x leverage on my die and this means I just doubled my yearn earnings, right? Yes, that would mean the same thing. Yes, you can lever up to 2x the efficiency gets down every single step. Imagine that you start at 100, you're trying to get the 200.
So your next step is 150. Then from 115, go to 175 and you can go to 187. Evan and then, you know, they're so like, you know, depends on your size and how efficient that's going to be, but yes, that is something you can do.
That's also why we have a 200% collateralization ratio if it were any less than this recursive, you know, borrowing strategy could easily go up to like five, six, seven, eight, X. And that would be, you know, I think unfair for other users in the system because essentially they would be You can yield from other people if that makes sense. How does the equilibrium of this workout? Like, it is the rational thing for everyone to do is that everyone should be doing this, right?
And then what happens, if everyone does this do there's the there's the urine earnings per die, just half. What's the equilibrium of this scenario? Seems like it's something that everyone should be doing by default, in fact, you're in itself, should be doing, I disagree with that. I don't think everyone should be doing that by default. But anyway, let me like, let me get to that. So if Like the you're involved with, I think what makes them special and different from
other. Your aggregators is that they're scalable because they can add any arbitrary amount of strategies to their vault and that allows it to like you know no one you'll provider gets overwhelmed by the yourens TV, all coming into it and you know, we've seen like when we first started, the yv Dy V had like, I think, like 20 or 30 million in it and now it has over 600 million in it.
And yet the yields have still held up very very, very well and And I attribute, yearns, Brilliance and engineering, and their strategist for making that happen. So I don't think the yield of the year, the yields from urine would collapse in that scenario. But what would happen is the yields in our pemex would go down.
Because right now, there is we have the transmitter in the, the die that that's holding in the yield, that that's passing on to it. And right now there's about, you know, similar amount of dye In the transmitter that's in the Alchemists vaults and because of that it's basically doubling yearns apy because we have like twice the amount of principal and if a lot of people were doing this, leveraged recursive, leverage to strategy than it, would throw that balance out and
beat make it a little bit more heavier towards the Vault side instead of the transmitter side. And because of that, that would lower the relative amount of principle that the transmitter has a relation to the Vault, which would lower yields for everybody in the system, but it wouldn't lower the income of the
system. In fact, that would probably go up if there was more in the, you know, more aggregate die in the system, and you know, that that died that they're borrowing and that they're leveraging and everything like that, that's still locked as collateral. So that's going to be sending email to the transmuter this whole while and everything like that. So that should work out.
As long as like, the collateralization ratio isn't too low, then I don't think this recursive strategy is, is is damaging to the system, but if everyone were to do it, it could have some unintended consequences and maybe destabilize the peg temporarily at times. In my opinion, I think long term you might actually be healthier for the paint because that means there's more die locked in the system and more guaranteed you know yield coming into it.
So it's not quite a new Neutral thing, it's slightly negative, but not that negative for the for people to be using the strategy. My opinion. And I also think that like you know, speculating on altcoins, you know, or trying to farm and other stable coins using the the stuff that you borrow is is also, you know, really popular, and viable strategy. So I don't see a lot of people doing the recursive strategy. One question I had was about Community obviously having a token, a lcx token.
So quickly kind of community is one of the most important things for alchemic, slang term success. How do you think about like attracting a community? Keeping people very engaged and you've mentioned the team, a few times. How do you see like the team as distinct from the community and what's yours? Long-term plans for for decentralization and governance
for alcoholics. So we love our community, we have a Discord and we try to make our Discord a lightly moderated place, so people can have fun, and they can, you know, shitpost and enjoy in there. And we have lots of funny and silly emojis and there that people use and stuff like that. So we are communities, really good? Are we have a community manager gorby who set up our Discord and we engage with them like daily I get in there answer questions and post along with everyone
else. We actually even have a sub community that was created inside and out Comics. They're called the Young shoots and they just theorize like all these DJ and stuff that you can do without chemicals and other apps in court in connection without chemicals and stuff like that. And they just do the they post about it in a degenerate channel in our Discord.
One way that we engage them is that you know like us in the core team like we might come up with like a plan or an outline of some things I'm going to do or some changes that we make. But then will will go to the community and our Discord in our forum and well, what will ask for comments and then, you know, we'll launch into a big debate and then we'll try to find
consensus among everybody. And then, you know, once we have some good options or we have consensus, will take it to the snapshot, to make it official and then we'll execute, you know, in accordance with the communities, which is at that time. It's a little bit centralized, but I think we're doing a pretty good job of involving Our community and keeping them in the loop and keeping them involved with, you know, making decisions.
And I think that's good for, you know, getting them involved in keeping them sticky and our community occasionally, I'll go in there and I'll we have a tip Bott and I'll Make It Rain is if I'm feeling generous, especially like, if somebody's contributing a by notice somebody has been like in our support Channel and like you know been helping out a bunch of newcomers like you know I'll throw him a tip or something.
Makes it really dank meme. I'll throw The tip things like that, and I think stuff like that. And people seeing like, just like kind of random acts of generosity Inspire other people to do that. So like what I've seen now is like, people I've tipped for their work in the protocol or not tipping other people.
So it's like this sort of like generous or this virtuous cycle going on and I think that's helping our community a lot going forward for academics and how we're going to decentralize is later this year, we're going to be launching out coming style and that's going to basically Remove the dev Stranglehold on power as we're going to ditch the, the multisig, you know, and snapshot format. And it's going to go straight to like on chain governance and everything like that.
And at that point, anything we want to do, like, we're not gonna be able to force anything. Everything's going to have to go through the Dow for better or worse, and we're going to go into that right now. We're still like an early phase in our growth phase and I think having the the multi sake of time lock and the flexibility of that is better.
It allows us to move a little bit faster and you know, conduct deals Things like that and help us get started, but we're planning to grow up and get our community, becoming the owners of the protocol itself and the Dow. Hopefully, the down designing is going to be highly engaging and get everybody in there and inactive and give them reason to
to be active as well. So tell us a bit about your exiting news, and I'm a type of machine stuff that my exiting these, my what I'm excited about or what I'm exiting about. Yeah, distressed to learn about like, you know what show, you know, you guys did a raise after sort of the launch of the token
and protocol and stuff. So you know really interested to learn about like how that process goes and like you know, it is you know most teams And do you usually do like, raise money from investors pre-launch of a token. So, how did that process? Differ a specially. When, you know, you guys are all. So like, you know, mostly Anon and stuff. And so what was the fund? What it was just like very unique fundraising process like, Yeah.
So this all started because before we launched all Comics, I needed it to have like a job done to help us get the everything ready before launch. And so I contracted another developer and said, hey can you get this done for me? It's urgent and it's a little bit beyond my skill level. And it said, sure, it's like, yeah, I told him at the time back. When before we launch, when I thought the price of a nail CX token was like 15 bucks.
Yeah, I'll pay 100. Am You actually get this job done and then we after we launched, we Moon. And at the time I sent this guy, his hundred lcx lcx was worth, I think like eight hundred dollars. So what I thought was gonna be like a fifteen hundred dollar payment turned into like an eighty thousand dollar payment, and then the guy sent it to, he cashed it out like immediately and sold it for for, I think, Keith and then people were
walking. Monitoring the dev wallets, and like the devs are really getting, the devs are rocking and I'm like, no nose. I just promised somebody a payment before we launch them just making good on my word and because of that, we realize that we were like, under a microscope. Every single thing that we were doing any movement of our funds, everything was going to be heavily scrutinized. And we thought like if we're going to, you know, like in our a lot of our team was still
working a day job. At the time, we we've been developing this in our spare time since, you know, midsummer So, for the team to quit their day, jobs, I'd have to cash out some males Yaks in order to have enough funds to, you know, support them and their families and stuff and seeing the reaction to the market and the community. When, you know, I sent this tokens to the other deaf who
cash them out. And they thought that we were rocking like we have to have it, we have to find a different way. Luckily, I mean a girl capital and they were one of our like they contributed to her. Initial liquidity pool. On Sushi Swap and there's they have a lot of people in there that are traitors and developers are really, really well connected into the ecosystem. And I ask them is like, hey, do you think he could help us try to find some OTC partners?
Because we thought if we want OT see, you know, we wouldn't have these problems with people freaking out thinking that we were rocking and stuff like that and dumping on sushi. So they hooked us up with a number of players in the space that we're all interested in getting a lcx anyway. And we struck out A deal at the time the the price of Ale CX is like 750 or $800 and we you know we settled on a price of $700 for the OTC so overall pretty good investors.
They got in a slight discount and we didn't you know jump the market. So I think it was a pretty good win-win situation and those funds allowed the team to quit their day jobs completely so you go full time so that was really important for us and then during those negotiations In some other investors jumped in and said, hey, we'd also like to lead a strategic round without chemists. And so we work out a deal with them and that was using the, the
douse funds itself. So that seeded our dowel with over three million dollars of capital. So it's giving us a lot of flexibility for, you know, paying for Audits and other expenses that are coming up as well, between those two deals, the team is taken care of. And the the protocol is in good shape, going forward. I think if our app wasn't compelling and novel and something new, we probably would not have ever been offered this
these deals. So I think that that's, you know, you know is very flattering and very nice, you know, for our protocol that they would consider to invest in Anonymous Deb's. I also think that maybe because I have a little bit of clout reputation in the space and I'm connected to people like equal Capital that that also probably made investors a little bit more comfortable investing So, you know, I don't know if other anons could pull this off.
They might not be as, you know, as connected as Scoopy triple say Can you tell us a little bit about what you girl? Capital is? Yeah, we're just a it's just a group of anions and and people who we have a couple docs members as well. And so we are like we together. We form like, we're all our own individual, LPS and together. We form our own little kind of like ad. Hoc decentralized VC, not really decentralized.
We're not a dowel or anything like that per se, but we try to find ecosystem projects that are Seemed to us that are cool. We're not just like there to you know invest in things and flip it and take profits and stuff like that. But we want to find projects that we think are cooler moves of the space forward and then we pull our funds together and we invest and so far, we've done radical. I'll can mix. You know, socks. That was more of a liquid token investment and Arbitron.
And yet, Yes, so those are the the Investments that we have a z girl. Right now we've actually turned down a lot of things just because you know, we wanted to kind of distinguish ourselves as people, you know, who are more allies of the ecosystem. Instead of people were just out there to, you know, make a quick buck in flip tokens and stuff like that. That's a very eclectic set of investment, I guess it fits for a very eclectic set of LPS.
It's very, very collected, like the E girl chat is just a really wild and random place where we go from talking to defy to talking to two women and girls. And then we talk about when we talk about like the Chen's trading and then, you know, Insider news, like all sorts of stuff just gets talked about there and it's like you know, because there's a few devs in there, there's myself included we have professional Traders people, you know, like CL. You know, and Jeff Wang.
And we also have just like D5 power users, like dhn Spartan is in there as well. So like it's just a very good eclectic mix. We actually have some girls, any girl, shout out to Ava Baylin. She's really helped us organize and turn it into a reality before her. We were just e-girls and now we re Queens. So it's a really fun place. It's really cool.
It's exciting. And it's definitely been something that's no helped out pemex because, you know, they've been able to connect us with a lot of good people that have helped us as well. Yeah, and I think we're coming up to near the end of our time so is anything, you know, I guess you already talked a little bit about the future of Malcolm X, but is there anything else you want? You know, the listeners to know about and what's coming up next
for a alchemax? Yeah, so there's actually a lot of stuff coming up right now, our audit just got back. We're just sending it back to our auditor real quick to get it finalized and everything. Like that, everything came back looking good and that's going to give us the green light to get onto curved out Phi. Also, getting Insurance options
for alchemic. So so those are some developments are going to coming in sometime over the next week or so. And then shortly thereafter, we're going to be launching a leathe. So, you know, towards the end of May There's going to be a decent amount of stuff coming going on without pemex. Then we'll probably have a little bit of a quiet period. As we are going heads down on getting V2, ready for launch, you know, sometime towards the end of July or early, August, is
what we're aiming for. So, yeah, that's, that's a, the next few months of alkynes right there. There's any more developments will be sure to tweet them very loudly from our Twitter. Yeah, thanks so much Scoopy. How can users get started? If they want to interact with all chemists? Yeah, so you can go to alchemic that fight, that's our homepage, they can there's links to the app there and you know, the app is a I think pretty
straightforward to use. There's tutorial videos linked on the website itself and if that's too hard and find us on Discord and get involved or ask questions on there and you know, be plenty of people there willing to help you out. All right, cool. Thanks so much. Thank you for joining us on this week's episode. We release new episodes every week. You can find And subscribe to the show on iTunes Spotify, YouTube SoundCloud or wherever you listen to podcast.
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