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Jeremy Relosa is usually a pretty punctual guy, even on early weekend mornings. He puts his slippers on on time, he brews his coffee on time, even when he gets out of the house, he does it on time. Usually. Earlier this year, Jeremy was supposed to meet his friend Matt at a pub in Manhattan. I watch soccer with my friends on the weekends at this pub and I was supposed to meet him there at nine A. M. and we made Yeah. Yeah, nine a.m. The Premier League games start early here.

Okay. Yeah. Jeremy and his buddy Matt had planned their early morning soccer viewing the night before. You're like, nine a.m., we'll see you tomorrow. I was like, great. But then, later that night, there was a huge snowstorm. In the morning, all the trains were massively delayed. Train delays in the city of New York? Shocking we know. Attention power. Passengers, we are experiencing delays on the following lines.

Jeremy ended up getting to the pub at 935, more than half an hour after the agreed upon time. I and Z. Sorry. Продолжение следует... And Matt? Matt wasn't there. And I'm like wow he He must have shown up and left because and like waited and then left because I didn't show up. You may be thinking, why did Jeremy not just text Matt to give him a heads up? Service isn't guaranteed, but it's getting better on the train. The reality is Jeremy hadn't used his cell phone in weeks.

It was dead in a drawer at home. When he'd made plans with Matt the night before, it was on a landline. Remember those? Landlines? Copper? Physically connecting our communication devices? Yeah, we all used to have those. Luckily Jeremy had Matt's number on him, because he'd written it down, again, because of the whole landline thing.

So Jeremy asked the bartender if he could use the bar's phone to call Matt, who apparently is one of the few millennials who will pick up a call from an unsaved number. And he's like, I'm so glad you called'cause I'm I'm running late too in the snowstorms. This is how it used to work. Once you left your house, you were unreachable. People had to leave a voicemail on an answering machine with a cassette tape in it. Or it was digital.

All you people who leave your voicemail boxes full so you don't ever get new voicemail, do you even remember what voicemail sounds like? Hey buddy. Amen. Jeremy, this is Grace. Red leader. This is blue leader. Yo, Jeremy. How about that game? Oh Oh my God. And if you weren't home when they called, you wouldn't get their message until hours later.

Hi Jeremy, it's Sydney. I have someone to set you up with, so you should call me back. Bye. Hi Jeremy. This is Andrea's sister who is good friends with Sydney and I know she's giving you a heads up. uh, but they have made it their life's mission to connect us. So I wanted to go ahead and call and leave my number.

Jeremy is friends with producer Grace Tatter. He is also an associate editor at New York magazine, and he wrote an article about this experiment to live without a cell phone for two weeks. At least he's not Jeremy wanted to live a dream many of us have had of being untethered to our smartphones, living a perhaps simpler life. Spending less time looking at a screen. So we talked to Jeremy about his experiment and how it's changed his friendships, his love life, also how it's changed him.

I'm Ben Brock Johnson. I'm Amory Sievertson and you're listening to Endless Thread. Coming to you from WBUR Boston's NPR, today's episode Leave a Message After the Cell phones had a huge impact in the 90s by making it easier to call each other on the go. But the advent of the smartphone, really in 2007, absolutely changed things. Because you could be on the internet all the time.

It took the Pew Research Center a few years after at least the iPhone came out for them to do their first survey about smartphone ownership. In 2011, they found that 35% of American adults at the time said they owned smartphones. And then just five years later, in 2016, that number had doubled to 70%. Fast forward to twenty twenty five and ninety-five percent of American adults had a smartphone.

We are now constantly jacked into the internet. The borders between the meat space and our pixel space have essentially collapsed. It is a pixelated meat mess. And despite all that connectivity, we're feeling pretty bleh. And we yearn for that time before. Nostalgia itself is booming. In a 2023 survey, 60% of Gen Z adults said that they wish they could return to a time before everyone was plugged in. More and more, they're searching out things that were before dialogue.

often, admittedly, with the help of the Internet. Millennials two. We're all feeling it, man. We want to go back. Including our landline lover, Jeremy, who loves watching TV shows and movies from the nineties. Hey Scully, it's me. I was born in the nineties. Hi Harry. Hello. Hi. Hi. So didn't really get to like kind of like live that lifestyle like fully as an adult.

I just tell friends at parties, it's like, oh how great would it be to just use a landline and not have to like text or use like be like on our phones like constantly. And his friends would be like, sure, sure, but life with a landline seemed like a fantasy. But then I don't know if you guys remember this, but there was a like a Verizon outage, kind of like a nationwide outage. In January. And here in New York, a lot of Verizon customers went without service for a few hours.

Jeremy was one of tens of thousands of Verizon customers who couldn't connect to local cellular networks at all for most of the day. And the next day at work we had like a pitch meeting and we were all talking about the outage. And it was clear that there were like two camps that formed. There was like people who were like, this was the worst thing because I couldn't get anything done on my phone. I

had the worst time. It was such an unproductive day. And then there was another camp of of folks in the meeting that were like, that was the best day I've ever had because I was completely off my phone. I didn't have to check it and how nice it was to just take a break from our screens. That gave Jeremy the idea of ditching his smartphone on purpose. His only phone would be a landline.

I thought, oh, this like goes hand in hand with my nineties fantasy to to to live a little bit more simply. So what was your relationship to your smartphone before this? What what were you spending your time doing on there? I think I was actually put off by the amount of texts I was getting from friends and group chats and that was like kind of the primary mode of communication. with like most of my life. I think the thesis for this was like I w like I don't think we were meant to have like

eighty open conversations going at once. And I wanted to like really simplify that. My group chat is sometimes it is blowing up so hard. And I just like, those are the times at which I most recede, you know, where I'm like, oh, 20 messages. I'm not catching up with this. Absolutely. It it almost felt the same way as I feel when I have a a lot in my inbox, like for For work. And I was like, I shouldn't be feeling this way about my friends reaching out to me.

And what about social media? Are you you know, are you someone who's spending time on TikTok, Instagram, all the things? The only app the social media I have is Instagram. I felt like I was like taking in so much information from people who I just didn't have any real relation to in person, like in my personal life. It was just like kind of like an overload of information that I felt like was just piling up in my brain.

So Jeremy texted his closest friends and family and made an Instagram story for everyone else to say, call my landline. He planned to run this experiment for two weeks. Of course, in today's world, Jeremy couldn't go totally offline. He works at a magazine. His job is to know what's going on. I set some rules. I was like, well, I do have to use my laptop and email for for work.

But he didn't download the desktop versions of smartphone apps like iMessage or WhatsApp, and he wouldn't log into apps like Instagram using a browser. He powered down his phone and put it in a drawer. The first few days were so exciting. It it it really felt like the days were longer'cause I was just like seeing so much more, just like on the train and like on my walks to to work and to the train station. I think it was the second day where I was like, oh, I can do this for a month.

So he decided to keep going, baby. Instead of getting regular updates from group chats, he talked to his friends on the phone at the end of the day. And that's it. Was there was there FOMO though in the sense of like like to not be on to not be reachable in all of the the group chats and the you know the Talking about the donut man when you get back and you're like, Who's the donut man? And they're like, Oh yeah, you weren't in the chat, man. I I don't know what to tell you. It's a whole

We replaced you. We replaced you with the donut man. Great. Thanks, guys. Yeah. This isn't the donut man. My friends would call me and then I'd ask, can any updates from the group chat? And they would just relay it to me uh on the phone. And that was really fun. You got the digest version. I got the digest version, yeah. My friends would just tell me over the phone the important like kind of like more concrete important things. Like You've been replaced by the donut man.

That's an example of an important thing. So it's so funny you you say Donut Man Ben because there's a our our senior art critic Jerry Saltz. I don't know if you've seen if you know him, but he comes around the office every time he's here and has a huge plate of donuts from Duncan. I love that. That he just passes around to everyone. And my mom it's so funny, my mom is like, Oh, is this the donut man in the office today? And I'm like

Mom, he's won a Pulitzer Prize. He's he's our senior art critic. He's not just the donut man. It's like, oh that's right. Am I in the group chat? We can add you now. How do I know? The donut man is a thing. Okay. Okay, so Jeremy was getting the landline digest. As for Instagram, he admits he probably missed some big life events from old friends, semi-randos, and somewhere in-betweens that he's followed on social media for years.

Yes. And no offense to those people, for the most part, he does not care. Yeah, it felt like a lot of my feed on Instagram and a lot of just people online were not the real people that were important to me in my personal life or my real life. Which is such a weird thing to say that like my real life is I guess I should say like more in person. But all the important things my friends would just like kind of catch up with me about. So staying in the loop wasn't hard for Jeremy.

In fact, it was in some ways easier, because without his iPhone and all of his apps, his loop was right-sized, circling around the people Jeremy actually cares about.

There was one thing that was a little more challenging though, dating. Smartphones have removed a lot of the friction from setting up a first date. I thought the whole point of dating was friction, but whatever. Without a smartphone you can't text your date as you're approaching to let them know what you are wearing so they don't go up to the wrong person. And if you arrive first, you can't pretend that you're nonchalantly absorbed in your phone while you wait.

These days, when you no longer even have to pick up a phone and talk to a real person to order pizza, people are kind of phone call phobic. So Jeremy wasn't sure how dating with just a landline was going to go, but he was optimistic. And it's just like nice to just be a person in New York and just experience it that way and kind of leave yourself open to like connections and maybe meeting someone um kind of randomly. And I think about two weeks in I got a voicemail from my friend.

Remember this? Hi Jeremy, it's Sydney. I have someone to set you up with, so you should call me back. Bye. Jeremy did call his friend back, and a few days later he came home to a voicemail from someone who He wasn't in his Rolodex. They have made it their life's mission to connect us. So I wanted to go ahead and call and leave my number.

It was actually really exciting to to to do s do something like that. But I could tell there was like maybe a little hesitation to to communicate solely via the landline, even from like from the get go. Jeremy realized that talking on the phone in real time is more vulnerable because you're not able to wait a few minutes to think about the perfect response, or ask friends to tone check text.

Leaving a voicemail was um the easier option. Especially when I would tell them like, Hey, I'm actually at the office most of the day, so if you call during the day I won't answer. So they would be a little bit more inclined to like leave a voicemail, um, knowing I wouldn't answer as like a little safeguard to that's kinda cool. It was no, it was interesting. Like, you know, we set up a date and uh you know, this time in place like two days from now, and then you just hope they show up.

I mean that is interesting these days, but also this is how it used to work all the time. Hey, meet me at the candy shop at six PM so we can hang. Cool. See ya there. Jeremy and the woman his friend set him up with had two good dates, but ultimately I know that sounds like like what an awful payoff. Sorry guys. You're like, oh, great. That was the worst story ever. Uh okay. Even in the Halcyon days before smartphones, not every example of setting someone up was a success.

So no era is perfect, but will Jeremy stay in the past? Or will he be sucked back into the suck of the present? In a second. Business leaders listen. Over half tune into podcasts daily. Reach them with Cityspace Productions, the creative studio from WBUR's business partnerships team. Cityspace Productions crafts custom podcasts for businesses that showcase expertise, deepen connections, and Engagement. Turn your vision into a podcast. Visit wbr.orgslash creative studio.

Emory, you know I love a cold call, and I love, love, love to leave a voicemail. I call you for no reason, right? Oh do you ever bench? Oh, dear me boys, I brought them up for calling. And I love that you love to leave a voicemail. I'm calling you, I'm calling you, I'm calling you to figure some stuff out. So do you though, so do you. Part of what I love about cold calls is that it involves a little chance. require like a calendar invite. It's not like a Zoom coffee. You know what I mean?

Right. You can't plan for it. It's just chance and magic. Jeremy Relosa, our man on the landline beat, felt the same way. Weirdly you'd think do not disturb mode would be a good idea. be something that I would really like, but because of like, oh, I I I want like an in I want like less text, but weirdly like, no, I want people to call me. Like I want like that more intentional, just like Yeah.

Yeah, like you said serendipity, like oh I am here by the phone, I am answering because you called. Like that's That was kind of a a secret goal, was just like more serendipity. Serendipity though. Has its drawbacks. Yeah. were out the out the door. I couldn't really make plans on the fly when I was um out like on a Friday or Saturday night. I just kinda had to stick to the one friend I was meeting and maybe we would go s go around town somewhere else.

Unless you start knocking on doors. Yeah. I actually did on like the last day of this experiment, I thought it'd be nice to just see if my friend would answer his buzzer at his apartment. And let's see if it is my last grasp at kind of like an analog life. So on my way home from work I just walked by his apartment and I rung

his buzzer. And then he answered and let me in. And he was there, him and his girlfriend were there just like making dinner and they had me in and I left with a piece of cake. And it was such a nice little like end to the experiment. They're like, oh this is like People it it it's people just have to This is your next experiment, Jeremy. No phones at all, just door knocks.

Just oh my gosh. Some friends were like, Oh, the next logical um step is just snail mail. You just have to send letters and I was like, Oh god Well, that might take Oh, it might, it would. And even with his apparent laid-back disposition, Jeremy has also had to admit, this grounded lifestyle is hard in 2026.

Jeremy ultimately made it fifty-one days without a smartphone, before being pulled back in by things like pictures of his baby nephew in the family group chat, or to be able to switch up plans on the spot. Can you kind of summarize what what role your smartphone plays in your life now? How do you when do you use it, when do you not use it? New Jeremy Phone policy. I use my phone I'd say probably about like fifty percent of how it I used to. So like I don't

check it as often. I get less texts than I than I used to because I've been removed from some of the group chats I wasn't replying in, I can tell. So I mainly use it almost like a dumb phone in some regards where I just just answer. Um I just I just use it as for the for the calling feature. Which is so funny to say I use the phone for the calling feature, but that's that's um yeah, I do that. And then I I I guess I text with intention and like with close friends um and my family group chat.

Of course, Jeremy knows it would be challenging for a lot of people to replicate his experiment. His workplace was actively supportive of his unreachability. He doesn't have kids or a pet. He lives in a densely populated area within biking distance of many of his friends. But he says there are ways to capture the magic of the landline life without actually getting a landline. I think it's really helpful to Think of our phones as tools because when I was just using my landline.

I was like, oh, well, how am I gonna get to this point? How am I gonna find this like restaurant um while I'm out? So I was like, oh, my phone, my cell phone functions like a GPS or a map. I found it helpful to to kind of split all of the use cases or the apps of the phone into like, oh, what am I really using my phone for? And kind of reframing like how I would use it. And I think once I did that, or once you do that, you it will feel less like this all-encompassing kind of like time suck.

Is it fair to say that you think we should cold call our friends more? Absolutely. I think I think we should be just just calling off the rip, just hey, what's up, man? I will say I will say one of the delights of having a landline. was getting really, really trivial voicemails. Basically like the text equivalent of a voicemail.

being left from my friend'cause it felt like I was kind of tapped into that world. So I think we should call our friends more and when they don't answer, leave a voicemail. Exactly. Right. I hope you have a great day. Peace. Oh my gosh. Where's my phone? Okay. Bye for real. Peace, brother. Well, catch you later. See ya. Come no. So have a good evening, and I'll talk to you again. Bye.

Hey, this is Jeremy. I can't make it to the phone right now. Just leave your name and number and I'll get back to you as soon as I can. Thanks. Hey Jeremy, this is Amory Sievertson from the podcast Endless Thread, and I'm gonna read some credits for you. It's your old buddy Ben Brock Johnson calling from WBUR. Endless Thread is a production of WBUR in Boston. This episode was written and produced by Grace Tatter and co-hosted by me, Amory Seavitz.

It was edited by Meg Kramer and Dave Shaw, mixed and sound designed by our production manager, Paul Vikus. The rest of our team is Dean Russell, Koyani Sixena, Emily Jaikowski, and our managing producer, Summitajoshi. Endless Thread is a show about the blurred lines between not getting a text back from that person you went on a date with because they're just not that into you. Or because they got rid of their cell phone to write a magazine article.

If you have an untold history, an unsolved mystery, some other wild story from the internet, or a voicemail you want us to leave for you, hit us up, endless thread at wr.org. Okay, goodbye. Okay, bye.