Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Let me tell you we have a new star.
A star is born Elon mars Juthan Kennemy.
He is the Thomas Edison plus plus plus of our age.
Probably his whole life is from a position of insecurity. I feel for the guy. I would say ninety eight percent really appreciate what he does. But those two percent that are nasty, they are I'll pay in four post. We were meant for great things in the United States of America, and Elon reminds us of that we don't have a fourth branch of governments called Elon Musk. Welcome to Elon Ink, Bloomberg's weekly podcast about Elon Musk. It's Tuesday,
June third. I'm your host, David Papadopolis. So Elon got his farewell from the President last week. Today it's about a man named Elon and he's one of the greatest business leaders and innovators the world has ever produced. And he is now sort of kind of back with his company's twenty four to seven so right on c Reports emerged of him raising billions of dollars from investors, making babies and apparently, according to the New York Times doing Lots and lots of drugs. To talk about Elon's big
week back in business. I'm sitting here with two of our stalwarts, Sarah Friar, team leader for Big Tech coverge here at Bloomberg Sarah, Hello, Hello, And Max Chafkin BusinessWeek superstar Max.
Hello, Hey, David, Hey Sarah.
Max. I saw the other day that your Mets are winning baseball games.
Oh my god, I'm so happy.
That explains a smile.
Yeah, yeah, they're They're looking great.
Okay, nice, And you know, Elon may be leaving DC behind Max, but the story keeps following him. Just one day after that big sendoff in the Oval Office, Trump abruptly pulled the NASA nomination. A Musk business associate and close allied, Jared Isaacman to me, it is exhibit a of the defeat of Elon Musk and Washington and illustrates the greatly diminished state he's left it in. I suspect I will get some pushback on this point though, from
Max and Sarah. We'll start, though, with the drug allegations, the money and the babies. Max. The New York Times splashed a big report last week on Elon's drug use, including ketamine. Give us some of the details.
Yeah, and we should say Elon Musk has now denied this report.
Denied it repeatedly, repeatedly.
I think he said the Times is making stuff up. The Times that stood by it. The report gives you a portrait essentially of Musk's behavior over the last year and connects it to what sources are describing to The Times as fairly extensive drug use.
Now, we of course knew.
That Elon Musk has smoked pot. We know that he's used ketamine.
The I mean, he's admitted to the ketamine use in the past.
Yerescribed I think anyone.
They are parts of this report suggesting, for instance, he'd use some party drugs on various occasions that I don't think was super surprising. But the most significant thing in this story on drug use is that Elon Musk was telling associates that he had what sounds like a was using ketamine pretty heavily, and that he was using, in fact so heavily that he was experiencing some side effects, including bladder proms, which is one of the one of
the common side effects from ketamine use. So that was in the story But then the other thing that is maybe more troubling was sort of a suggestion that his behavior that he was sort of using ketamine, using these drugs all trying to run his companies while trying to run the US government, and that he was impaired. And I'd say in that way, it was kind of the most serious allegations that we've seen about his drug use to date.
That said, there was not like, I don't know if I missed it in the story, but there was not like a specific instance of you know, we know Musk was on drugs when he did this thing.
That's correct, Sarah, You are right. I mean, there's at some point they put, you know, a couple of things side by side, the drug use next to his odd behavior at that campaign event in Pennsylvania, which he was jumping around on stage, But at no point, you are right, do they say in the story that he was acting this way on this day because of drugs.
It's a portrait of a guy who seems to the outside world to be out of control in a whole bunch of ways, with reporting that suggests that the same time he was behaving erratically, he was talking to people.
About using drugs. Fairly heavily.
Now we should say a lot of the these drugs in the Time story are not illegal drugs, right Ketamine Musk has said he's using under a prescription. Now, of course you could have a prescription from ketamine and still be abusing it. The Times mentions this daily pill box containing some adderall. Now, of course a lot of people take adderall to manage you know, adult ADHD or whatever. So so none of this on its own, I think would be that concerning if you're like an investor or
even a close friend of Elon Musk. But it's the kind of just juxtaposition that that Sarah's bringing up that raises.
Question, And I think the piece says that there was at some point this blurry line between what was medically prescribed and what was just recreational use.
There was one one other note in the story that I found really interesting, which is that SpaceX, as a government contractor, has to run a drug free workplace, and there was sourcing in the story that Musk is getting heads up on those drug tests before they happen so that he can more easily pass them. So that was
another detail besides the bladder detail. The twenty pills in the pillbox detail that built a picture of ways in which this is becoming more routine for him, more integrated with his every day and like well known to his associates.
I just want to say on that point, the Times did reach out to SpaceX and SpaceX did not respond. When are the Times seeking comment?
Yeah?
And I guess the other thing there is that fact is important because Musk has repeatedly said that he's, you know, drug tested continuously. He's tested clean continuously.
And Kristin grind who who authored this one of the authors on this story. She also wrote the book on Tony Shea, who, as as is well known now died of an overdose and her book goes deeply into the history of ketamine abuse by that CEO of zaz And and his escalation into other drugs and how it how it changed thinking and and so one thing I've learned from from that is the side effects include a lot of amnesia, a lot of of distortion of reality, a lot of confusion over what has happened, a lot of
paranoia is common in ketamine abuse. So I think that that maybe why there was a lot of juxtaposition with with scenes in this story of Musk, you know, either attacking people or concerned about his companies, or having different versions of the same reality. And I think the most striking thing to me that was news to me I didn't I didn't hear about with Tony say, but the
bladder issues just seem so painful. And what I was reading the medical literature on that looks like irreversible if it gets to that point.
No, irreversible doesn't sound good.
There was a whole other dimension in this story that that kind of pertains to this because it's again sort of more behavior that seems kind of erratic. And it was about Elon Musk's love life, right, about Musk saying different things to different women.
Right.
So Grimes believe for a time that she was in a monogamous relationship with Elon Musk.
Mistake.
Ashley Sinclair also believed that she was in a monogamous relationship with Elon Musk. According to her, we also got some detail on the terms of the settlement.
At It was a lot of money her in order to keep it sifteen million dollars up front and one hundred thousand dollars per month. According to documents that the time says it saw and Ashley Saint Clair said, nograsias, and she said, I will no, I will see you. I believe in court. They are in court now.
Yeah.
And one thing, I mean, look, this is kind of a side alley or whatever. Maybe this is not the most important thing in this story, but it really did raise a question of how sincere he is in his pro natalism versus is he just sort of out of control?
And so maybe some combo of the two, right.
Yeah, some combo of the two, right, because it is not a portrait of somebody who is fully in control. I will say there is a potential number fifteen in this story, Sinclair saying that he told her that he had fathered children all over the world, including one with a Japanese FLT star, which would be a new baby, and that.
Apparently he was or is just offering his sperm to any woman out there that we knew. I thought we did.
I missed that in the journal story. I was in there sperm to somebody via direct message.
I guess I suppose I had blocked that out of my mind.
Now I went on a little bit of a rabbit hole trying to find the Japanese pop star to see if this had indeed happened.
Are there any did you fly to Tokyo for this?
No, this happened on the internet, but I.
Was not able to Finally, we should treat this as an unconfirmed report until we received further confirmation.
Got it?
I wrote.
The last thing on this subject I will note is The Times. Both in the story and then in their podcast in which they talked about it, they kept using the term brood, which a brood of kids, which to me, I mean usually broods like an animals. And I don't know that it was just struck me as odd. Max. I guess they suppose they figured once you get to a certain number, it's no longer just a conventional family of this now.
When you there just isn't a lot of precedent for having this many children, Like I think it's hard to come up with. I don't know that we have a term for a large amount of human children this low.
You know, this big was so apparently not. I think The Times is you know, working, but.
They have Sarah Fryar other things that happened in the last past few days. Elon Musk is raising a lot of money. It would seem tell us about it.
Yeah, so a few things are happening at once. Let me pull up my list here. So there is the five billion that he wants for Xai.
There is, by the way, five billion, to be clear, five billion via the debt market, not in.
Ex the debt market exactly.
So that's debt for Xai, which is a which is part of Xai Holdings, which is simultaneously in discussions to raise twenty billion in equity. And then he separately had a raise for Neuralink, his brain technology company. That that was the six hundred and fifty million round. And he's also, according to the Financial Time, selling three hundred million in Xai stock through a secondary offering. So lots of lots
of capital raises happening at once for his companies. Maybe trying to make the most of this return to his corporate life in what he says will be a full time manner and realizing that these companies that he needs more money to do the things he wants to do.
Important to differentiate between what has been announced, which is the right and these Xai numbers, which according to.
The reports are still in marketing stage.
They're they're just asking for it.
So like yeah, like you're asking for.
It also like five billion dollars, but it doesn't necessarily mean.
That I'm going to can I tell you something? Though much more likely to do usive billion than Max Schafflin. Yeah, I'll give you now when you.
Dang GPUs do you need that so many?
Yeah, when you dangle an interest rate of over ten percent on the debt, that certainly helps. And apparently the interest rate they're offering you somewhere around twelve Morgan Stanley time bank to mister Musk is handling the deal. I will say, Max, you know, it's funny because Morgan Stanley the other banks just finally finally got that godfor's sake, and Twitter dead off its books. Twitter now of course
x which is now of course part of Xai. And as soon as they finally managed to get it off their books after they were nursing it forever and couldn't pawn it off on anybody, bang, we hit the market with another five billion.
I mean, like, if you're a banker, working with Elon Musk is a good bet, even if you're not necessarily crazy about any particular deal.
Like he's got a lot of private equity to sell.
All right, Max. Last thing in this space another deal that happened or almost happened, kind of happened then didn't happen, is Groc and Telegram. This is the.
Second one of these.
So the Telegram CEO tweeted or East or whatever about a big deal with Groc that they were going to integrate Grock into into Telegram or something, and a bunch of news outlets wrote about it.
This is pretty similar to the story we.
Talked about two weeks ago about Calshi announcing a deal and then Elon Musk showed up on Twitter and said no deal has been signed. This kind of like weird public feuding with a potential partner. This is a potentially a large deal now. Look, Telegram, unlike Calshi, is a very controversial business. The founder, Pavel d'urrov I believe, is not an uncomplicated guy. There are regulators around the world who have problems with the way Telegram handles like illegal
content in going through its service. Look, we don't know the backstory, so who knows, But like, looking at this report in light of what we read in the Times.
Like it just it does seem it seems odd right.
Well, also just for us to reply publicly on X saying nothing is signed, and then for Pavel d'ov to reply to that saying, correct, we're just in late stage discussions Like those weren't his exact words, but he was like trying to keep the relationship it proceeding ahead with a steal, as opposed to taking Musk's very pointed statement that nothing was happening.
I'll tell you what I think is going on here.
Please do But and this is just speculation, but you know, Elon Musk, that's what this show is.
Max, He's a famous I got it, you know.
Just remember he's a famously hands on ceo his empire, especially now, especially with his kind of political engagement, which continues even with this White House event, and he's running more companies than he's ever run. Like, I think it's just gotten harder for all of these companies, especially these startups. You know, Grok is sort of like a startup to operate,
they need Elon musk sign off for everything. And and my supposition is some of these deals that are being announced have been announced without.
The underlings are getting out over their skis anything you didn't consult with the doge father first?
Exactly right, okay, or he made the deals and he's forgetting possible as well.
Possible does father the dose father, like all fathers, tend to forget a lot of that they do. And say, moving back to Washington for a second, Max, because over the weekend, just when you think Elon is leaving Washington and he's closing that chapter of his life, bang, big explosion reports start coming out. I believe it was initially reported anonymously with sources, then confirmed by the White House Trump truth that did it start with the truth.
There was a reporter Trump on Saturday.
That Musk Skuy Jared Isaac Man, close business associate has been up in SpaceX, you know, traveling across across space. Someone who's in put a lot of money into SpaceX. I believe, was suddenly out as Trump's pick to lead NASA. That's quite a parting gift, Max, on your way out the door.
Well, it's not a parting gift.
Like to stop this, Like, first of all, Trump said, Elon's sticking around. Elon said, Elon sticking around. We know there's tons of lobbying going on. Elon is lobbying for transportation rules around driverless cars. He's lobbying right now for the Senate to change the big beautiful bill to to keep these EV credits in place. This is an ongoing negotiation with two with allies, but allies in Elon Musk
and Donald Trump, who have somewhat different interests. I would say that beyond any kind of like anonymous report that we've seen out of Trump world, beyond anything that like Steve Bannon or any of the other kind of adversaries that Elon has connected to Trump have said, this is the single.
Most significant thing.
This is the like the one the biggest thing that has happened to get you to say, huh, I wonder if Elon Musk and Trump are good because this was like Elon's guy, as you said, he had also cleared his committee hearing, right, he was going to get confirmed.
And the explanation, yeah.
The replacement CEO for himself at his company exactly.
And the explanation is kind of thin.
The explanation is that Trump found out that he had made donations to Democratic politicians, which, of course, like that's a public record. There's also reporting to suggest that that Trump had already known about this, that said, like, I don't know that we know the whole story here.
Max, I think I'm curious what you think of just like sometimes I think when with Trump, the simplest answer is sometimes the right one. And I have seen no reporting to back me up on this.
You think he just forgot no, no, no, no no.
I think that that Trump was on the campaign trail talking about Elon Musk's big, beautiful rockets that are going to take us to Mars. I think that he really believed in that idea, and the rockets have been exploding on the launch pad. And so if I'm Trump, I'm looking at that and thinking, you know, do we really want to be all in on this direction? It's just it's just, you know, symbolism to Trump matters.
A lot our listeners. Another one did blow up last week. Actually, I don't rely reminder.
We forget anything to do with this.
This is the This is how many now in what period of time, like.
Three in a row, where they've had mishaps.
And they're not going to just argue that, Hey, we're just iterating these kind of explosions are all part of the learning process. Don't sweat at Chafkin. We're going there.
They are arguing that, and they.
Are that they're also exploding billions of dollars into Sinaire.
Yeah, and it's like Sarah saying, Trump would be on the campaign trail and he had this bit that people probably remember where we talked about the arms grabbing the rockets.
Like a baby.
He did a little version of it actually in the Oval office the other day during Elon's you know, farewell at and so, you know, whatever the argument is about, like oh, this was just a test launch or whatever, we did not get the beautiful arms, you know, cuddling the rocket like a baby or whatever Trump might have
liked to see. And on top of that, you have pushback, right of like you have you have senators, you have NASA folks, you have people who don't necessarily want to just like take a hard pivot with NASA, which is the what Jared Isaacman and Elon Muska want to do. I also do think it's possible that like Trump just kind of forgot about Jared Isaacman's donations to Democrats, or he kind of spaced when someone was telling him or or someone convinced him that actually, like this is a
this is a big issue. I mean, these were very recent donations. I mean as recent as the twenty twenty four election. It's not like he was a Democrat twenty years ago. And no fair, fair, but I think it's possible that the like face value explanation offered from Donald Trump is true.
Okay, I will just say in counterpoint here, hearing all that and appreciating all that and seeing your points of view, I will say that Musk himself was quoted in this very good Atlantic piece. And by the way, this Atlantic piece are just simply pulling in this case here from an old pressure he gave. He said, this whole doze thing I'm doing, this is a way to make a
lot of enemies and not that many friends. And I think it's also possible that some of those enemies, and it is a big, big, big list of enemies he has made in Washington, d C. It's distinctly possible that more and more and more of them are around the president and in his year saying hey, let's sandbag these Musk initiatives. Not in so many words, that's not how
they present it to Trump. I mean, I would say, when I think about how Washington, d C in some ways really roughed up elon Musk and the amount of enemies he made there. There is a very good piece that The Atlantic ran recently in which the opening scene is Scott Besson, the Secretary of the Treasury, in a fight with Musk. Also, by the way, about a pick in this case, who's going to run the IRS? And
to be clear, Musk also was defeated there. Bessen ultimately got his guy to head the IRS, and Musk guy out was ousted. The story opens with Bessn't shouting at the top of his lungs at Musk, g you, this is all happening right outside the Oval office, and it's going up and down the quarters of the White House. At what point, according to the piece, the two men
are their faces are just inches apart. And this, apparently, according to this piece and according to reporting we've done and others have done, is a window into I would argue, Max, the animosity that has been building there against us. Another interesting thing that the piece points out is, you remember that thing that Musk and the Doose team were demanding that bureaucrats do, where they had to like send a weekly email saying, hey, here's the three yeah, here the
three things we've done this week. Apparently everybody who was just ignored it, and the Atlantic, as someone quoted anonymously saying somebody close to Trump saying how many people were fired because they didn't send in their three things a week or whatever the it was. I think that everyone is ready to move on from this part of the administration.
Yeah, Look, there has been this has existed from the moment elon Musk like not to Washington, right, there has been a lot of skepticism from others in Trump world about whether he really knew what he was doing. You know, there's lots of questions, right, his connections to China. This is like he's had adversaries all along. And I think you're right that as he's become more politically unpopular, as it became clear, yes.
And his popularity, his approval ratings have been sinking.
Joge is not good for the Trump administration.
Like if the goal is just like maximizing for approval numbers or whatever, they would be running away from this as fast as they can, which I guess to somebody sent they.
Are now Sarah. He has been interestingly, Musk been doing suddenly lots and lots of interviews with the legacy media and super keen to talk about space and super keen not to talk about politics. Let's listen to a recent interview he did with CBS wondering what your thought is on the ban on foreign students the proposal. I mean you were one of those kids, right, Yeah, I.
Mean I think we want to stick to, you know, the subject of the day, which is like spaceships as opposed to you know, presidential policy.
Oh okay, I was sold anything is good.
But no, well no, it's funny hearing somebody discover in real time.
Yeah, you must sometimes changes his mind.
No, any event, Sarah, the it feels a little bit like the rebrand and after you know, Tesla and in general, the Musk brand was damaged quite a bit during his time in Washington. Perhaps the rebranding and.
Is a foot Yeah, I think it is.
I mean I think you saw Tesla stocks or after he declared that he was done with Washington. However true or not that will turn out to be. I think investors are looking forward to this. They see Musk really driven to prove everyone wrong, that he can turn around his companies and get driver lists, taxis on the road and get to Mars and build out the Colossus Data Center in Memphis. I think that there's like so many plates he's spinning with really big, high stakes things that
need to be accomplished. Neuralink is having a big year, as we've discussed, and wanting to put their chips and dozens of people. So it is kind of a crucial time at all of these businesses. But they all still need Washington's backing, like every single one of them. Neuralink needs the FDA. The driver his cars need a ton of government approval spasics. As we've talked about, this is
not going to be a clean break. And if Trump truly is disillusioned with Musk and ready to put him aside, which it doesn't look like that's you know, he still has really nice things to say about him. They had dinner recently.
Well, Sarah, he certainly likes he certainly likes Musk's money. I would say that, so, I mean I would.
But but it turns out there was that detail in that Whilester's journal story that the hundred million that he's committed to Trump's pack hasn't.
Come a little bit like the derived Wait a minute, it's just like the Calshi deal and the groc telegram deal.
I think, I mean, I like, I think I might have said this last week.
I mean, I think they are negotiating in public, and like Trump and Musk, Trump and Musk over you know, various asks that Musk has which are going to be, you know, not necessarily easy for Trump to deliver, which
is why he hasn't delivered them yet. And Musk, of course, is has this has a really important point of leverage over Trump, as you mentioned, David, which is that he can conceivably give hundreds of millions of dollars to Trump's pack, or to midterm candidates, or to jd Vance, or to anyone. And I think that's why you heard him in that excellent Bloomberg interview that we talked about a couple weeks ago, saying, I don't you know, I would give if I saw
a need, but I don't see a need yet. Like it was very much the kind of thing you would say, me, make me see it, agotiating, make me.
See that need, Help me see that need. Talk to me. Okay, Max, So, by the magic of editing, you and I were back here in the studio again, Pal, how you're doing. So we're here because Musk, shortly after we finished taping, went on a bit of a rant, an ex rant, max ripping the big beautiful bill that Donald Trump is pushing through Congress. Man.
It was hot, yeah, and he had criticized it to some extent earlier. Trump had even addressed that criticism during their press conference, but this took things up a notch. I'm gonna read from the Ekes that was posted at one thirty pm. As you said after we finished recording, I'm sorry, but I just can't stand it anymore. This massive, outrageous Porkfield Congressional spending bill is a disgusting abomination. Shame on those who voted for it. You know you did wrong.
You'd know it, I mean know it harsh.
I will say, not criticizing the president there, criticizing Republican congress people.
Yes, But if Trump calls it a big beautiful bill and Musk calls it a disgusting abomination, man, that puts him at pretty opposite end of the spectrum. And I also point out the very beginning, as you read so beautifully, maxim was beauty for rendering of the heks, but the very beginning, I'm sorry, but I just can't stand it anymore, implying clearly that he's been keeping a lot of this within. He had hinted in the past that he was against some of the some of this fiscal bill and some
of the pork that goes through. And to be clear, you know, as somebody who as the Doge Father, was trying to cut government spending, shrink the deficit, this big beautiful mill will only add to the deficit quite a bit.
Yeah, undeniably. It makes him look bad.
And we talked about this when we were talking about Doge way back when that all this talk about cutting deficits. Meanwhile, Trump, you know, is also talking about these you know, massive spending increases via these tax cuts.
This has kind of been simmering along.
To me, this is probably just a continuation of the negotiation that I mentioned.
When we record the show, the Grand Bargain.
He you know, there are.
Things that he wants in this bill. He has talked about what he wants in this bill publicly. He wants these ev tax credits. He also earlier in the day he was complaining that the US is falling behind on soular.
You know that that China. So so there are things he wants so he doesn't like he wants his own pork.
But I think clearly this is ideological for Elon Musk in addition to being practical.
Well, I think he does believe that the government and so so I think some of that.
So I think that's part of it.
You also, you know, there is a danger in a negotiation that it can turn into a fight, right that that like that what he's doing here is dice and puts Trump in a kind of a difficult position because Trump, because Musk is a big donor, because he has a huge footprint. We actually already saw Carolyn Levitt, the Press Secretary, respond to this, saying Trump is well aware of Elon's feelings about the buildings.
He thinks it's still big and it's still beautiful. So we're moving ahead.
But I suspect at some point, not necessarily today, but at some point in the near future, Trump himself will respond.
Just one last thing, David. You know, Musk has also been retweeting various Senators, Mike Lee as well as Thomas Massey. He is essentially allying himself with the kind of hawkish, the budget hawkish, the sort of Freedom Caucus, the hawks wing of the Republican Party. Not you shouldn't read this and thing. Oh Musk is about to like leave the Republican Party or something.
He is.
He is attacking Trump from the right. So that's just something to keep in mind as this negotiation goes on.
All right, thank you Max for coming back, racing back into the studio for this little segment. Now, can we please talk about the black eye? I can't wait. All right, I want to do one last thing here before we wrap, which is you know, Max, at that send off that Muscot in the White House, it was Trump and Musk, and Musk appeared to have something of a black eye, a shiner.
A literal black eye, not like political black guy, not a metaphorical.
Bat black guy.
Those two.
It was pretty unmissible. You could see it.
I was watching this on TV, and even kind of across the room you could kind of see there's something something on his face.
Yeah, Max, we have the tape, the clip in which Musk responds to a question about that black eye. Us, Well, it wasn't. I wasn't anywhere near friends, so but I didn't know.
So uh yeah, I was just watching around with Alex and I said, go ahead, punch me in the face and he did. It turns out even a five year old punching you in the in the face actually does.
So Little X knocked.
Oh my god. That is a rich text if there ever was one.
Right, I mean, you have the the sort of really awkward joke about the on and and uh and his wife uh. And then Trump's reaction to the news of Little X, say, Little X, he's got a right or whatever. You know, there were those lip reading videos. Have those come up on this of Trump and Little X talking in the Oval office where it seemed like maybe Little
X had had been somewhat rude to the president. There have been a lot of funny things written about this, and and you know, I've got little kids too, and and I have.
You ever gotten black eyes from your kids?
No? But I totally can see it. It's it's it's totally plausible that like that story.
I think, I'm sure Sarah.
You don't even have a brood of them.
Well, there have been some pretty amusing stories written sort of speculating on who it can who are so the Times pointed out right like like there are lots of Trump world folks. There are Tesla shareholders, there are and and and like.
Gotta be Scott Bessen in that list, right they.
I feel like it was kind of almost insulting because we on this podcast for over a year have maintained a feud watch. We have a ready list of suspects, and no one mentioned that. No one mentioned Bill Gates, no one mentioned Sam Altman, no one mentioned the guy that Elon Musk has specifically, you know, said he.
Was gonna fight Mark Zuckerberg.
We have talked about this stuff for hours. It feels anyway you think.
The investigations to start with those guys, I.
Mean, someone Buckerberg would be no that would happen. There was no they would They would have no octagon set up. It would be a whole thing.
You know.
It's also possible, of course that in that time story there are a lot of romantic entanglements.
Like I don't know, but.
That said, I think we should. I think we should.
Probably take Elon at his word until we until we hear otherwise.
Has anybody asked X Yeah, not that I know, Okay, Max, Sarah, thank you as always, thanks.
For having us.
Yeah, thank you, David.
This episode was produced by Stacy Wan Blake Maples Handles engineering and Dave per self fact checks. Anna Masa Raucis is our editor and our supervising producer is Magnus Henricson. The etl on ing theme is written and performed by Taka Yasuzawa and Alex Sugierra. Brendan Francis Newnham is our executive producer, and Sage Bauman is the head of Bloomberg Podcasts. A big thanks as always to our supporters Joe Weber
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