It’s the word “pressure” for me

more important thing to mention, we're married. We are. We created this podcast to open dialogue about some of Live's most taboo topics, things most folks don't want to talk about. Do the lens of a millennium married couple? That ads is the term that we say every day. So when we say dead as, were actually saying facts, the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Were about to take billows off to our whole new level. Dead ass starts right now. All right, So this story time

is presented to you. In the year two thousand and nine, the recession hit. My father had lost his job, my brother just graduated from college, and I had got cut by the Cleveland Browns. At this point, this was the year after I got cut by the Detroit Lines. Kadina and I had moved back to Brooklyn officially, and we were trying to figure out what we're gonna do. So I remember my father, my brother, and I were in

the room. We were in my sister's tory room and the door was closed, and my father was just like, all right, listen, guys, things are gonna be tough, you know. Um. At this point, the three of us were not working, and this is the first time all three of us had not been working. My brother, like I said, just graduate from college. My father always kept two three jobs,

and I was in the NFL. So my father said, listen, I'm gonna take some money out of my phone one k I'm gonna make sure that you're comfortable with about your brother is comfortable, and I'm going to, you know, kind of provide us with this little bit of space so that we can kind of figure out what we're gonna do next. And I was like, all right, well, you know, are you guys good? You and mom? And he was just like, don't don't worry about your mother.

I was like, what you mean, you know, like mommy works. She was just like, don't he said, as a man, you don't discuss finances with your wife. Your job as a husband is to make sure that your wife is at peace at all times. Your mom is not to know what issues we have financially. You just work hard. I trust you, I trust your brother will figure it out. But don't disclose things to your mom. Let your mom do what she does, and we have to figure it

out as men. And it was at that point that I realized that there was a lot of pressure that comes with being the head of the household. Is gonna bless with the vote schools today. Me, me, me, me, I'm gonna get the before you already all right, hey mm hmmm, uh, tell me what you want from me. Take a look out what you see. Let me know if it's right here. Something you can't have full years. Tell me what you want from me. Take a look out what you see. Let me know if it's right here,

something you can't have. Now. Want to see you doing good. I don't want to get richly. In my eyes, you the bad reason why I love you, because my stad is you don't want to see me with a carriage living average. Nah, you know, never that you're trying to do the things, so we could be established trying to old bars bars bars. Nonetheless, I guess we should take it back the story time before we before I apply

this sure on you. Let me tell you how much that word, that word has been hot lately, that word. We've definitely put the word pressure back on the map. It's like one of the turning the number eight or so. Yes, so I hear, um, But but take us back to story time, real QUI, because I feel like this is perfect. This is the perfect segue for us to then unpack, uh, this topic of pressure and the pressure that was felt by you, um, the pressure applied by me, so to speak.

So take us from story time, and then I guess we can segue into how that then manifests itself in our soon to be married life back in our twenties. Well, I mean, it's it's actually pretty simple, right. Um. Two thousand and nine was the year that I had decided that I wasn't going to play football anymore, and we were going through the economic crisis. So, um, you and I collectively had and I said collectively because even though I was working, we were in this as a partnership. Oh,

we had lost a ton of money in the stock market. Um, the houses that we bought, the property value was down because the housing market burst, so all of the equity that we had in the property was gone. So we could now we couldn't even sell these properties to get cash because we were upside down on the mortgage and I wasn't working. So two thousand and nine, I'll never forget.

I woke up one morning. You were laying in the bed next to me and you had a plan where you had an appointment for us to go look at the venue. And at this time I was still with the Cleveland Browns. And I woke up that morning. It was July. And I woke up that morning and I got a phone call and I saw the Berea, Ohio area code, and I kind of knew what this was because I was expecting this. And I got a phone call from the from the officer, Hey, d Val, you know we're gonna have to let you go. We want

to sign some draft picks. So I said, cool, hung up the phone And You're like, who was that? I said, you know, it's um, it was the Browns. They just cut me, and you were like, oh, damn, baby, I know you didn't want to be there. I was, you know, I didn't, And she's like, all right, well, we have a venue to go look at, and I was like, damn, I just lost my job and you want to go

look at at venues for the wedding. But if I didn't say anything, I was like, all right, all right, cool, cool, like all right, let's let's go look at these venues. So I got my dumbass up and I went to go look at venues with you and your mom like everything was perfectly fine. Meanwhile, on the inside, I was kind of like I don't know how I'm going to make this happen because I wasn't working. And then I remember we got back home and you and I sat on your mom's couch and he was like, what do

you think about the venue? And I was just like, I don't know, Like I don't know, I don't I kind of feel, you know, I think I might want to wait, you know, I don't. I think I might want to wait a little bit, you know what I'm saying, to get married. And you were just kind of like, what you mean? And I was just like I don't know. I think I just want to wait a little bit. You don't want to wait. And then that's when you said I want to get married next year. That felt

like pressure to me. And it wasn't an ultimatum. You didn't say to me either we're getting married or next year, or we're not getting married. You never said that. But it was at this point that I realized, like gang, like I did ask her to marry me. So I made that that proposal, like I want to do this, and I did want to do this. So there was never the pressure to be married to me at all. No, I see this, It was time frame. See this is

the thing. The pressure didn't come in actual marriage. I had I bought a house for us to live in. You were living with me full time, so I had already said to you, you are the woman I want to spend the rest of my life with. The idea of marriage itself did not scare me as much as providing the type of wedding and then financial security for the rest of our life. Did that scared me? You know what I'm saying that the idea of marriage itself did scaring, But all of those other things and encompasses.

Being married scared me, and especially since I didn't have a job and I didn't know where the finance were going to come from. It was it was I was kind of nervous, right, and I get that. And it's funny because at the time, of course, like we've said now, there was an impressure to be married to me, it was just within the time constraints that you feel like

I gave you. So, you know, the things that I asked for in terms of moving forward in the relationship was that we'll be married, and we got engaged, and to me, I was thinking, Okay, I'm like rolling into

my late twenties now. So in this again, like I said previously, this timeline that I have in my head of like what's transpiring in my life and where I foresaw me being at these different points, it was rolling around time to be married and have a baby, because we had discussed that we've been together at that point for eight years, so it was like the next thing in succession should have been for us to be married and also being around you know, our friends who were

also at the point either married, already married with at least one child, engaged, you know, planning their wedding simultaneously. We had a lot of couples who were getting married around the same time, So for me, it just kind of seemed like a natural succession. That was the first thing.

Was there immaturity in that, I will admit absolutely, because in addition to the immaturity that I felt just being like a twenty something year old kind of spoiled girl, like, hey, my parents have afforded me a life that's been amazing so far, and then now I found this amazing man who I want to build a life with. There was a level of codeine being a spoiled brat saying like, listen, this is something that can happen, Like what do you mean. I was living kind of in my own bubble. That

was my reality at the time. That maybe was not your reality. Also too, the societal pressures, I would say to meaning that they came kind of indirectly, but like I said, having people around us who were married and things like that, or knowing like you hear this biological clock that ticks, which I know now years later that that's not necessarily a thing because women are having children, their first children, you know, well into their thirties. Some

people aspire not to have children. Like, there are many different things that now I look back on and I'm like, wow, Codeine, that was something that you just made up in your own mind, or that's something that you were just you know, looking at others around you doing that you felt like you were behind on time, you know. Um, so that was definitely something that I was looking into as well,

and I thought that that was like one of those things. Um. It was one of those things where I was just like, you know, I got to get it done now, um, question real quick. You don't feel like, well, I mean, you just admitted that it was you was kind of selfish and it was immature. Absolutely, But you can't see how that could feel like pressure to me. No, I understand how it felt like pressure because you felt like, wow, I've been now put all of this on my future husband,

my fiance to make it happen. But the crazy thing about it, it was that based on your personality, based on your work ethic, based on the type of person you were or are actually because you're still this way to this day, the relentlessness behind you, that unyielding work work ethic to just do whatever it is you to do, like you told me that you want to be in the NFL. You were in the NFL. You told me that you want to be an actor. You're an actor.

You were a full time working actor now. So having that faith in you and you being cut from the Browns, I actually just thought that was just part of the process. I'm like, all right, well, you're cut from the Browns today, but that's just the nature of the game. And if you're cut today, chances are your agent's gonna find you a place to be and you'll be signed somewhere tomorrow.

You know. There was even the perspective, I mean, the possibility of you being signed to Canada, and I was like, well, shoot, I guess I'm gonna be a Cannadian now, and we moved to Canada and we'll have a life out there. So I did not in that moment feel like, um, although you felt pressure, I didn't feel like it was pressure per se because you handled it so well. Um, but like, why did you feel the pressure? I guess, well, I mean for me, it's it's not just feeling the

pressure in that moment. There's pressure that exists in being a husband daily, you know. But um, my father just instilled in me from the time I was young that it was my responsibility to remove all stress from my wife, right and which I appreciate. I mean, I look at your mom and your dad and how they move, and it's just like your mom is. You know, she works her job. She doesn't really have to worry about anything

else because your dad he handles it. You know that he wasn't My grandfather was the same way like my my grandfather. When my grandmother told me that my pop used to come home when this check give her, she handled everything she needs to handle with the kids and herself, and whatever is left over he took for himself. So he came home, he provided, he was a provider, He made his money and took his family first. And so it was instilled in me that that is what I

have to do for the rest of my life. You know what I'm saying, Like, when you ask a woman to marry, you would have your kids. That is your responsibility. And people can say whatever they want to say about gender roles, and let's eliminate gender roles. There there's one thing that a man can never take off the hands

of a woman, and that's having a baby. My father said to me, if you're gonna ask the woman you to have your children, it is your responsibility to make sure that your finances cover everything, because what if she decides she doesn't want to go back to work anymore? What if she can't go back to work. So for me, it was like, Okay, this is what you know. This is what I'm at when I say I want to marry Kadine. This is what I take on. You understand

what I'm saying. And just to put things into context. When I got engaged, things were looking very different, you know what I'm saying. When I got in two thousand and eight, I had two hundred thousand dollars in my bank account. I just bought a house for us to live in. I moved you out there. We lived there together inch again for two years. Um. I was number three on the depth chart. So I was looking at I'm gonna play out this season and possibly get a

big contract next season. Let's the mindset I had as well too. I was like, oh kay, well, so when I proposed, I was doing things in a place and in order of financial consequence, I had put things in place to make sure that we were good. So then the next thing is to get married. Once all of the finances changed, it kind of changed my order. So it wasn't like I don't want to get married to this woman anymore. It was like, can I do this

because I don't care what people say. People gonna people get up here all day and be like, oh, it's men and women are equal and not if your marriage is messed up and y'all are suffering financially, you know who? They look at the husband, I would say the same thing I don't care for, dude is to stay at home dad. And a woman is out there bussing her tail right when things are not going well financially. They look at him and say, yo, you gotta you gotta

pick up, like you have to do something. And I embrace that because I can't have children, so I embraced that. So for me at the time, when I said to you, I think I might want to wait, and then you said, well, I want to get married next year, that felt like pressure, you know what I'm saying, Like on top of the pressure that I already put on myself to be a provider. And I don't necessarily think that pressure is a bad thing.

All the time, you know what I'm saying in sound about you know sometimes pressure will you know, breed diamonds and all sorts of good things, which it did in our relationship, because I feel like we're at a space now, I mean years later, of course we can reflect on it, but in that moment, it's like the sense of urgency that I have when I really think back on it now with a very clear hindsight view, which we tend to do with a lot of things in life. What

what was my rush? Ultimately, you know, that's what I was. That's what I was asking. Bought a house for you and moved you into Do I have what more I have to do to prove to you that I want to spend the rest of my life? Absolutely? The thing is too you know. You know people have said that, oh, well, Katine was just like telling you her standards and she had standard and expectations, and that's just what she She was letting you know that this is what she wanted.

I mean, it was to an extent it was me telling you where I foresaw things going. But I could have I could have also, I could have had the mindset and the foresight to say, you know what, maybe now it's at the right time. You could have you know, maybe I could have been like that, it's at the right time to just talk to this man about actual wedding until he finds a job. I'm glad you said that, now you know what I'm saying. I did not see

that in that time frame. Again, I'm coming from who that was my fault though, the reason why you felt like that that was my fault, I'll say, I'll say that that's that's my fault. You ever let me know that you felt that pressure. No, I didn't, And that's what I'm saying. It was my fault though, because my father instilled in me to remove the pressure from my wife. You have the conversation about it. We never because I felt like my role as a husband was to be

that sense of peace. So if we're going through financial hardships, I can't. I gotta figure that out on my own, like my father instilled that into in me, and I took that to heart and said, this is what I got to make sure my wife gets everything she wants and needs. That's my role, that's my job. So I don't blame you for feeling like we can move forward with doing things because I made you feel like it was I didn't say, and that was my fault. That was my fault. But I will say this though about

the bullshit thing. You know what's bullshit women saying all she did was provide her standards and you can walk away and not walk away. If I would have said to you, right, I want to get married and I want to have two kids right away, that's my standard. Either you do that or we walk away, those same women would be like she's pressuring on her to have a baby, would they not? They probably would be. That's so then you can't do that to people. You can't

say to people this is my standards. Accepted a walk away when it's convenient for you, and then if if he provides his standards, now what's all you're pressure on her? You gotta learn how to because that's that's to me, is where the bullshit sets in. Right. We have to learn how to not only present our standards, but give grace. You know what I'm saying. You have to communicate these things.

Had you told me you felt that way, I know you probably were, just like damn, I wish Kate could just see what's happening and then no, like have the the the ability or the capacity to say, you know what I think now, it's not the right time. I couldn't have known that because we didn't have the conversation about it, you know what I mean. I gotta I got to own that that was a mistake on my part that I got to own that, you know what

I'm saying. I I the same way you can sit here and own the fact that you have been a little selfish and and naive. I got to own the fact that I should have said something, but I didn't.

I was twenty five years old and you were just doing what I was trying to be the best version of the man, and I thought I was supposed to be as a husband, which is bearing the brunt of the finances like that, because because I did want to marry you, and I wanted you to be happy, like I just wanted you to be like when you walk in the door, I want you to like, oh, I'm home,

this is my piece. I don't want you to have to worry about anything when the light's gonna come on, when we have money for this, Because for the first five years of our marriage, when we were living paycheck to paycheck. I never brought these issues to you. I found ways. I took on another job I picked up when I was here. I did that because that's what it entailed. But those are the pressures that I took

on as a husband and I still take on today. Well, there was a point to after our wedding if we fast forward a bit you had told me about, like is either we're gonna get this wedding or we're gonna get this house in Brooklyn, like is what we're gonna do, and me again being in my own world and being

self saying like, well, we already owned two properties. If we wanted to get a house later, we can sell those properties by a house, So let's do the wedding now, because that was just on my to do list that had to check that box. And there was the excitement building around that, you know, um and then me too just being immature, not having the force ID to say

what comes after that. But there was the point after our wedding and after things set in for that first year where it was just like, Okay, I'm not playing football anymore, Cadine, Like I'm retiring, And I was like what that caught me off? Guard because I was like, I felt like you didn't barely you barely scratch the surface of your potential as an NFL player. So for you to say you were retiring from that to then pursue acting, I was like, but you didn't even finish

doing what you were doing over here, you know. So once that happened, you were like, Okay, so you're not going back to the NFL. That's that's out of the question. Now you want to become an actor, and you had said to me, Kay, I know I can't be a starving actor, So I'm going to start this mentorship business, this training business, and I'm going to build from the ground up so that way I have income coming in. And that's when the conversation started to happen about where

we were. Well at that point I had to I had to have those conversations because the money wasn't coming in. It really wasn't coming in. And at that point I was just like, well, damn, I'm sitting at home here.

You were just like, yo, I think you should go down to like the mac counter because you were working part time in Michigan, like, see if they're hiring, And I was like, you know, what you're right, absolutely, and that's when I, you know, picked up my brush belt, put on my all black beat my face, got on the bus and went down to the mall and was like, yo, I'm here to work because what I learned during that time was and this is what I didn't I didn't want to put it on you, but I realized that

I had a partner who was willing to jump in when needed. You understand what I'm saying, And it's easier to include your partner with making decisions because two heads are always better than one. Um. I tried my hardest in the very beginning to handle everything on my own, and that pressure, you know what I'm saying. That pressure became overwhelming at times, which is why you and I struggled a lot in the first part of my marriage.

But you helped out and I figured out the rest on my own, because, like you said, pressure doesn't only bust pipes, but pressure creates diamonds. Right. If you think about all of the elite athletes in the world, they're not defined by their ability to avoid pressure. They're defined by their ability to perform underneath pressure. Right. So for me, when you gave me the you're I'm not gonna say ultimatum. But when you gave me your standards, it created pressure

for me. I could either rise to the pressure, take it on and handle it, or I could say now I'm out and run. But I chose to deal with the pressure and make sh it happen. And I made it happen. And I handled the pressure very well for the first five years, and even better now because we made it ten years together. But I'm still not going to back down and say you didn't pressure me. I felt like it was pressure to get married when you wanted to get married. But it was the best decision

I made. And I said that before and I'll say it again. It was the best decision I made because it showed me that I can make things happen even when it's not on my timeline, and even in my own little timeline that I had back then. If we had had the candid discussion where you were like, hey, like, I'm trying to really juggle a couple of things here, I'm debating about not even playing football anymore. So if that's the case, we're going to have to scale our

lifestyle back. We're gonna have to do I mean though we weren't living a frivolous lifestyle to begin with, we had a lot of money invested that we lost in the stock market and whatnot. So if you had had the conversation with me early on, it was just like, yo, I know you're excited about this wedding. I proposed to you because I have every intention of being married to you, but I just don't feel like right now is the

time to have a wedding. Chances are I would have been able to say, all right, well I see where you're coming from, and then maybe pivot at that point. Can I be honest with you? You don't see your face when there's things that I say that I cannot do, and I hate looking at that. I hate looking at your face when you have that face, that disappointment, that disappointment you have when when you say when you say you want to do something that I'm like, well, we

can't do that. I don't want to see that. And that's not like a bat like your face is. It's just as a man, I want to be able to give you all the things that you you want and deserve a out of life. I don't want to look at that face I want to find that I didn't even know I have a face. Now I got to go look at the face that I make. You got, you gotta face, You gotta face. It's the same face you had when you and I started going through the itemized list of the American Express car and that was guilt.

That was the same It's the same face that you had. That is guilt. That's a kid being caught with their hand in the cookie job when they know they're not supposed to be having no cookies. Well, listen, that's that. That face is the face that as a man, I don't want. But listen, you taught me so much about finances and life in real estate, Like these are things that I wasn't privy too because my parents they pretty much worked together to handle those things, you know what

I mean. And my dad very much was the guy that was just like, all right, well, you know, I'm going to make sure my kids have a roof over their head and they have food on their table. My mom bust her tail to work to get, you know, to help with the finances, to be able to afford these different lifestyle luxuries, like just being involved in extracurricular activities, things like that. So my parents weren't really letting me know about like finances and real real estate and credit.

I remember when I turned parents talk about finances. Oh god, do they look quick? Do they talk about finances? Do they argue about finances? Do they discuss each other finances? No, my my parents. No. My dad handles it to my parents.

And I think that that's part of the that's part of the problem, the biggest disconnect, that's the biggest disconnect, and that that, to me is what I've learned with me and you and then finances caused so much residual stress because of the things that are not discussing people being on the same page, even within a relationship. See, and I can't I can't blame you, And this is

this is just me being honest. I can't blame you for telling me the things you want and the things you need and me saying all right, I got it, and then feeling the pressure of it. You know what I'm saying, I can't blame you for that, and I don't mind it. I'll take the pressure on, but I'm

not going to say to this not pressure. But I will say that you and not have grown since six year old immensely saying we've grown a lot, and now those discussions are a lot more of a collective discussion, no, for sure, And there's a comfort I feel like you feel and I hope I've made that um a space for you to feel comfortable saying Okay, like I know we want to do this, we have aspiration to do this, that or the third, but we can't right now. But

here's how we can do it. I think one thing that's been great about you is that you've been able to really You're everything is resolution based, you know what I mean. Like you don't go into anything saying like, well, here's the problem. I don't know, it's like, okay, here's how we can potentially solve it. And I've learned to, even me being a pessimist, I feel like for so long, like thinking about the thinking about the how things can go wrong, or thinking about the not so bright side,

you always usually come with a plan. It's like, all right, well, if you want to get this, then here's how we have to go about getting that, you know what I mean. So I think that's something that's right. So it now I feel like if we fast forward to the current time. Do you continue to still feel pressure? And do I make you? What kind of question is that? Okay my question? You all got to reframe it. Yes, so I still

you still feel pressure from me? Alright, middle middle of the middle of the podcast, storytime, middle of the podcast. We got a double story time to day. I'm gonna take you back three months. You and I go to look at a house. Right, you go to look at the house. You're like, baby, I love this house. This is the house. I want this house I want. Right, I call my financial advisor, I'm like, this is the house Kame wants. Can we make this happen? He says, well,

they already put an offer in. We would have to put in an offer. You would have to get pre approved. That's gonna take some time. You may not be able to get pre approved in twenty four hours, so you may not get this house. Right. And then I told you that, And what did you do for like a whole weekend? No, it was not a weekend. It was like an initial It was initially it was just like, damn, we're going to find another one, this perfect ship. Now

we gotta get our ship together. But what did I do? Though? You kept looking and we got our ship together. We got our ship together, but you pouted and you kept looking at the house, saying pending every day. And then finally once the household users like yep, up my house off the market now now my house now, I'm never gonna get out I did. I was like, it can go from penning to back on the market at any point and then we'll have our ship together. We can do this so that you do want a nice house

and the house I do. But and this is and this is my point. Does the pressure exist? Yes, because I feel like the pressure. The minute the pressure was gone and I feel like that I've got everything taken care of under control is when I've lost it. Same thing in football, The minute you think you've got everything done is when you start playing bad. There has to be a sense of urgency and a little bit of an anxiety to keep you on your game. You gotta

have that chip on your shoulder. So that pressure that existed in the beginning for me still exists here because I still want to create that lifestyle and sustain it. It's not candein inflicted, though, is it. That's that's the question, Like, is it codine inflicted or is it something that you No, no no, no, no, you didn't you didn't ask. No,

you didn't ask if you inflicted. You just asked. If there's still pressure, Yes, there's pressure, right, I guess it's a two part I want to know what pressure you feeling in from where, so you know how to control the pressure. I mean you, you you put some pressure, but you also relieve a lot of pressures. You do a good job of relieving the pressure. But no, the pressure comes from me wanting to be great at being a husband, like I want to be great at being

a husband father. So every day I wake up, I wake up saying, okay, well you know what what can I do? Like what I can't? There's no off days for me being a husband. You know what I'm saying, And not for nothing. That goes back to what we discussed before. When I hear you say what, I hear people say, Oh, she's just tired. Oh she's just tired, give her a break. I don't feel like I ever get a chance to say, you know what, babe, I'm tired. I'm I don't want to pay the mortgage for a

little bit. I'm tired. I don't I don't want to pay the car note for a little bit, Like I just I don't want to do that right now? Can I just can I get a break? Like I don't feel like I have that leniency or that latitude to make those decisions. And I feel like that's on me all the time. And I accept that. I wear it with a badge of honor because like I said before, I can't have children. You know what I'm saying. You were the vessel of life for our legacy, which is

out three boys. I get that. I get that, and I give you grace for that, but that doesn't but that doesn't try to make my workload a lot lighter so and and that doesn't that doesn't make it easier for me to deal with the fact that it still is a lot of pressure for me because that mortgages do the first of the month, the Cardinals do, the AMAX bill is due, Like those are things that are never gonna go away, and I can never at any point in our marriage. But you know what, I'm just tired.

I don't I don't feel like doing it. So it's pressure that comes with that. I do feel though, like if you ever said to me, K I need I need some time that I would totally just jump right in and be like, all right, well what I gotta do, and then I would just like pick up the slack, you know what I mean. I think that's that's what

the partnership is about. For sure. I want to make sure you feel comfortable being able to say that, because I know you want to be all of that and more and you know have things under control and you have things taken care of. But at the same time too, I would like for you to also let me know years ago if you were in a moment where you felt like, you know what, I just can't. I don't mind, I don't mind letting you know. But to be honest, you can't do what I do with consistency, especially with

all the other things you have to do. You know what I'm saying, It's right, like I admit that I ain't offering. I'm just saying. I'm like, I'm just being honest. It's true. I helped take care of Jackson, kyron Kas cook when I have to clean when I have to, I maintain all of the bills. I produce your content. I produce my content. I moved your mom in like I do all of these things. If I just one day said I just don't feel like doing it, you got to take over. There's no way you could do

all of that, you know what I'm saying. Like the same way, there's no way you can just say I'm tired of being a mom and a wife and take everything and step away. You can't do that. I can't and I can't. And the thing is we have to respect the fact that there that we can't do that. And that leads me to my question, like, do you feel that there are pressures you feel I'm about to say, do you feel like there's pressures you feel? As a wife? Me tell you my precious pressures. Um. No, I do

feel immense anounce of pressure. Um. A lot of it rooted around just trying to be or trying to be everything that you need me to be. And that's where sometimes I feel a level of, like I'll always say, a level of inadequacy or a level of falling short because I feel like I am not doing everything to

meet your needs set Um. Some of it is sexually, some of it is just like you know, sometimes you have your moments where you're like, man, I just miss like K from back in the day that dated me, you know, in college, Like think about the utopia that was college that we were existing in with no responsibilities really you know, minimal um and we had what we felt like was all the time in the world to just completely be you know, embedded in each other and

in bed with each other. Yea um. But we had so many moments like that where you know, I missed that. Sometimes you missed that sometimes where you're like, hey, I just missed my girlfriend K that was kind of just care free and didn't have a lot on her shoulders and her fate. But then again, you know, this is what life is. We've now grown three beautiful children, you know, grown our relationship. We have a beautiful life. I totally cannot, you know, ask for more when it comes to that.

But I do feel the pressure sometimes of trying to be what it is you need me to be sexually, what it is you need to be physically, what it is you need me to be emotionally sometimes like those are things that are are also on my plate on a day to day basis, and those are things that I kind of give myself a measure of, like where I am with it. Do I do get down on

myself sometimes about it. I do because I feel like, you know, if I'm falling short of being what you need and you're always an overdrive trying to give me everything that I need and more, then I'm falling short. And and there's an immense amount of pressure that comes with that too, you know. So let me answer a question. When it came time to get married, you didn't feel no pressure of being a wife like I felt the pressure of being a husband. I honestly, and this I'm

just gonna tell you what I feel. But I feel like you were so caught up in the wedding that you didn't even think about the pressures of being a wife until after the wedding and the honeymoon was Yeah, exactly, It's like, Okay, I'm gonna have this big, amazing, beautiful day and then we're gonna just live happily ever after. Like usually in fairy tales too, you see, like the big wedding day and then it says happily ever after, But what exactly is the happily ever after? Nobody goes

into that in detail. So when it was when I was twenty something, you know, looking to be married. I thought like certain things were just gonna happen because it's just how it happened. And now because nobody teld me.

Nobody told me, and I said that before in the monogamy episode, I'm like, I did not know a lot of the things that we're gonna we're gonna go into marriage, and how much it is like a day to day work, you know, waking up, making the commitment, making the decision to be there, Like, I did not know that that's what went into marriage, But that, to me, is where a lot of the discconnects started with us. I feel like when they came time to think about getting married,

you were focused on the wedding. I was focused on the marriage. So there was pressure because you were prepared for that, because that's something your father always told you. He was like, and because I had to pay for the weather, is it? Yeah, you were focused on having fun at a wedding, but I had to pay for it. Yeah, exactly. So my mom and dad too, but they helped, but they didn't pay the bulk of it. You know. I paid the bulk of it out of my my savings

from the NFL. But it's it's just like you and I came to this partnership focused on different things at that point. Absolutely, And it's funny when people say, particularly women, say how could he feel pressure? But it's like you didn't feel pressure because I didn't let you feel any pressure.

I handled everything. But while handling everything, including finances and stuff like that, the funniest thing was sex wasn't even on my radar at that point, you know what I'm saying, Like the pressure for me wasn't even coming from the idea of being monogamys. It wasn't turned on my dead and being broke. No, not at all, not at all. Because this is the thing. If I was that interesting, if I was that focused concerned about monogamy, I wouldn't have bought a home when I got to the league

and moved you out there to live with me. I would have let you stay in New York and I would have just been in in Detroit with my own space, living my life. But I had moved you out there because that I had already decided that monogamy was the best part for me, you know what I'm saying, Like, monogamy to me was great because of what we can do. We talked about this on another sex episode about how part of the reason why I love monogamy is because

I'm a freak and you were freak. The things I want to do with the woman that I'm sharing this intimate moment with, I can't just do with somebody I don't know, you know what I'm saying, Like, I just don't feel comfortable. Yeah, I don't. I don't like germs, at don't. I don't like germs, and I don't like contraceptive. So since I don't like contraceptive, it's better for me and it's better for you to be with one person.

So there are reasons why I chose monogamy. But the pressure on top of all of that was the fact that financially, marriage is a big step. And when you came thinking about the wedding and I was focused on the marriage, it brought pressure to me. That's the problem, and I will be the first to admit it. And I don't think a lot of people feel that way now.

I mean, think about the age that we're in now, even just for social media, every photo shoot, every event, every life event, it's almost like a contest to see who can now do the last person's viral post about a wedding. Imagine trying to get married now in this day and age. Think about this, not only just the wedding, right, even when you propose, what does the woman bring to the proposal herself? What does the man have to bring to the proposal? A ring and an event around the

ring to make the women feel special. So who has to put more energy into that moment? The woman of the man. So when it's time to make that decision, you don't just get the chances that I want to be engaged. Boom, I'm engaged. Like men don't have to do that, Like like women don't have to do that. Men have to do that. And you have to choose to step up to the plate a man who chooses to step up to the plate. You got to choose to step up to that plate every day after that.

Once you get on your knee, that same pressure you felt to get on your knee, because remember how nervous I was. Yeah, well, I didn't know how to see you because I don't know you were preparing for it. So I didn't really necessary you camouflage that really well too, because I didn't know what was happening. Bro I was capping. I was capping, and and the thing it was, I was capping because I was just afraid for what I was not going to be able to deliver. That's all

it was. I knew I met the woman I want to spend the us to my life. But I knew that, but it's just like, can I do this? So it was amazing though that you took like that. It meant that much to you to do it because you knew the kind of life that you wanted to then provide for me and yourself. You know, there may be people who are just like, well, I'm just you know, give it this engagement ring, because that's what she'd been wanting.

She's she's been racking with me. So we'll take it day by day or you know what I mean, Like I want a companion, So let me just you know, propose to this girl like I mean, you know, some and may feel like that. I don't know. Some do, some dude, that wasn't me. Some do. And I got to be honest too, some of it was my ego as well. As much as you wanted the big wedding, I wanted a big wedding too. Yeah, I was coming

out in the NFL. All the weddings I had been to at that time where my gods who were either in the NFL or on their way to the NFL getting mad, they had big, nice weddings. And then the show Platinum Wedding was out. Was super my, super sweet, you're right, um wedding? Is it? Anyway? There's a couple of Actually, how I found our wedding planner was shout out to the diary, So it is it was a show and my ego and me wanting to not only prove to myself but to prove to everybody else that

I was successful and I made it. I wanted to be able to deliver these things from my wife. And there goes another pressure that ultimately had nothing to do with you, and that usure that was a societal pressure

because I'm like, I'm NFL devout. So that means that my wife has to have the big wedding, she has to have the big ring, we have to move into the big house, like these are all of the things that I had to live up to that in the grand scheme of things, like no one is defined in their twenties, like you can have all of that and lose it and still make a comeback, or you don't really necessarily have to reach to try to get it at that moment because you can get it later. Let

that be a takeaway too. I guess maybe the younger folks or some of the single folks, the single folks were allowed y'all. Y'all werell out with that last monogamy episode with all the opinions. But if there's a takeaway, um, just know that you do not need to measure up what you're doing, your life, your Instagram profile to anyone. It's a facade for the most part. You think about all these events and stuff like that, it's cool, but what's going in behind the scenes, what's going into the

relationship behind the scenes. Like it sounds like something you've heard before, but it's true. Like there's certain things that people say over and over again and say it's a cliche for a reason, because it's the truth. It's the truth. Like that, if anything needs to be a major takeaway, like you cannot be out here measuring your life and

your relationship against what you see on social media. Especially, maybe we need to change the age of when people become an adult because let me tell you like I. When I turned eighteen, I was like, listen, okay. The United States of America said that I am an adult. Okay to an extent, there's certain things I can do. And then when I hit twenty one, it was a whole rep like you can tell me nothing. Like to this day, I feel like you still can't tell me

nothing to an extent. But you know what I mean, Like we figured, we thought we had it all figured out in our twins, then we're all here making bad decisions together, bad decisions. I mean, we were able to bounce back from it though, You and I work together because we learned how to communicate. But one thing I will say, and I learned this through through our marriage. How you get married and the decisions you make will define the first few years of your marriage. Yes, you

know what I'm saying. Yes, the first couple of years was rocky, a f but and now because we were able to make it through that storm, we can look back on it laugh. But like I can ask you what were you thinking? And you know we can have We're able to have conversations that had we had to have these conversations in the moment, I couldn't have those conversations the moment we couldn't have those conversations. We couldn't know, we couldn't. But what growth and reflection before we go

to break? What's one question you would ask young Devot and like say, we don't know all it is during that moment when I proposed to you, what's one question you would ask me that you thought it was kind of off that you would be like devout wild, like, what's the one question you asked? I don't think I get the question. So, for example, during that time, I would I what I would say it was. What I wanted to say was thinking, how how the funk could you ask me to go look at the venue when

I literally just found out that I'm not working. That's the question I would ask you, Like today, would have wanted to ask something. Year old candent year Devout wanted to ask them, but I didn't want to ask it because I didn't want to hurt your feelings. I didn't want to come across as not manly enough. I just figured out I had to I just figured out I had to find a way. You know what I'm saying.

So year old Devout wanted to say that, but didn't and I feel like there's a lot of young people who are having those moments and they're not saying it, and they end up in situations where they're like, then, I wish I would have just said something, because I feel like if I asked you that question, you would have told me this is what I think. I would have been like, why how could you go? Look at the venue? And you probably would have been like, I didn't think it was that big thing. I could you

be on another team? And then I would have been like, well, I don't want to play football no more that and you would have told me that, because my question would have been to you, but why aren't you exploring all the options with all the teams that potentially have interests. There's an offer potentially at Canada, let's move. Why would we not go to Canada? But I didn't say that in that moment because I'm like, this is not my body going on the line to to play these games

every day. This is not my dream per se, which turns out wasn't even your dream either. You were doing this as a means to it in so to me, I was just like, well, bro, you got places that you could potentially like like you're not done here playing football? Like, go ahead and play, and I'll be here to hold down the fort while you do that. Me asking that question would have brought together this conversation which would have

saved this a lot of money, a lot of heartache. Absolutely, name a moment year old Coadean had where you are saying I want to ask the Vallece question, but I don't because I either don't want to hurt his feelings or I don't want to come across as less of a woman. It would have probably would have been like, are you going to expect me to dress up every time we have a second role play? Because if that's the case, we might just might deal break right here,

because if I got to play a different character. I know I'm an actress. I know I'm an actress, but there's but so many characters that I can play. And are you going to make sure that the chandelier is bolted into the ceiling so when I swing off that ship like a circus monkey you will be able to support me. I think the best part of this whole thing is that my brother and my sister and I share Amazon account, so if they're ever looking at at my purchase history. They're gonna be like, where is this

bitch going? Is it Halloween? No, guys, it's not Halloween. I'm just trying to find a way to dress up as another character for that. All right, so don't judge me. So this is what we've learned. If I would have asked that question early on in our relationship, I would have got to answer. If you would have asked that question, I would have got to answer because not for nothing.

Remember when we talked about way more clarity, but with more clarity, because at that point I would have known, like, you know what, she really don't like doing it, so she don't feel comfortable as opposed to me expecting it because you said you was going to do it and then not getting it and being just And I would have known, Oh, this man, his heart is not in football.

He does not want to play anymore. So that's gonna mean if he wants to become an actor, which typically is a longer process to get yourself out there, then I'm gonna know, all right, Well, so we're gonna have to scale back on this wedding somehow. We're gonna have

to maybe wait on this wedding. Maybe we elope and then have a wedding later, like there would have to be in a discussion about what the other options would have been, because then you know what I mean, And I don't think I was that hardheaded in that moment. I might have gave you the face, I might have gave you the disappointed face, but we would have slipped the same face Jackson, the same face Jackson gives and Cairo gives, and cats. They don't get that all of

us inherited. They all inherited the face from me because the toddler face. And that's something qualified on the toddler face, like we raised car cry back in the day. Yes, here's here's one thing I'm going to say about that. Right. A lot of women have been saying, you know, if a man, if a woman gives you her standards, you have a right to walk away and not say nothing. Right. But if I were at this point now to say, Cadine, I want to have another baby or if not, I'm leaving,

those same women will be pissed at me. Somebody cut the valves, Mike. I'm just second. I'm just saying, y'all know I want another baby, So the pressure so you're giving your expectation is that you will have another baby with me, and if I don't accept that, you out no, no, no no, no, no, not at all, because babies are always anytime you bring life, that's the closest you get to death. And we've experienced that with Jackson. You you know, had to have almost a blood transfusion and that surgery.

So having babies is very very different. It's right, it's very different. Those are different places. I was joking about that. But we're gonna take some breaks right now. I'm gonna try to put this baby and Kate belly and we're gonna gonna listen to these ads. Sorry, Triple yea. All right, now we're back for some listener letters. Let's get into y'all's business, because y'all show us hell maybe in my business. I mean, it's all good though, it's all jokes. I

promise you. People sometimes be like I'm sorry to say, but don't be sorry, Like this is the purpose of the podcast. It out there so you guys can have these conversations and all that, you know what I mean, We all we do was just ask that you listen to it and its entirety. Yes, you know what I mean, and then you can have the conversation. You can't have a podcast without having people have conversation. Absolutely, that's the purpose. That's the purpose of a podcast. So we appreciate all

the conversations, any absolutely, any input you have. But like Dean said, if you're not going to listen to the podcast in this entirety, I really don't want to hear about your opinion. That's just it doesn't make any sense, right right, right, Absolutely, So that being said, we're gonna move on to some listen and let us I can get into helps business. Um, here's the first question or the first scenario. May y'all go went in. We get in some paragraphs in here, but we did ask for context,

so I'm hoping it's in there. I've been dating a guy for almost a year. Our dynamic is cool. We fell in love or I fell in love. You'll see what I mean. Um, we've met each other's family, I've met his daughter. We kicked it, we could it tough, so on and so forth, all that good stuff. He recently told me he didn't see us going any further than boyfriend and girlfriend. All he wants is a girl,

but not a future. He hit me with it has nothing to do with you, it's me basically, So I'm like in my head, oh, he's breaking up with me, and then he hits me with, I'm just telling you my truth. Then you can decide what you want to do, which is a little passive aggressive. But whatever my question is, should I stay go? Or can I change him? Oh? Can you change him? Lord? I know I can't change a man. Okay, you're corrected yourself. Um, And if I want a future, the only right answer is for me

to dip right. But my questions are, for one, what is a girlfriend without a future or progression? What does that even look like? I asked him. He doesn't know. If you don't want a future, why I have a girl? Right at my tripping, I just want to point out that he gave her his standard and told her she could leave a go and she question, no, not even that she was appalled by it. But she was appalled by it. So it was passive aggressive. It was passive aggressive.

But when you gave me your standards, he pulled me yes, when I said, well, this is what I'm looking forward to doing with my life, and then you said you feel the pressure. But he did it, and she said it was passive aggressive. It was passive aggressive. Now, I think he's been clear Hunt. I think he's been clear about what he wants, which is, I think what most people should want from people who they're dating or having the intention of potentially moving forward with. Yeah, but that's

the thing. She wants to be a wife. He doesn't want that. Yeah, So he just wants somebody to to kick it with, apparently. And I think you you've answered your question and then went back and the answered your question a couple of times within this paragraph. Um, and I get it. You may be into him, and you may potentially see a future with him, but you definitely can't get somebody male or female to see a future

with you if they don't see it for themselves. So yeah, And I think that she has every right to if she wants a future, to walk away. Absolutely. And I think and I think he has every right to say, I just want a girlfriend. And I've we've had these conversations with friends of ours who have gotten divorced, who have been in relations before. I said, if I if I ever get divorced, I'm never remarrying. I'll have somebody that I kick it with someone who occupies space and time.

But I don't. I don't want to be obligated to anyone or anything. And I think that that's okay, because sometimes marriage is not for every person. Some people don't want to be married. They just want to have a companion when they want that companion and not feel obligated to live with that person. His marriage does come with obligations. Obligations is the right word, but it does come with

a social certain responsibility. You are married to somebody, like there's certain things that just have to be done, whereas if you have a girl or somebody who you're kicking it with, it's like, you know, it is what it is. I think, I think this is. But these are two mature people who are being upfront and honest but have decisions to make. And the problem is, if you like someone, you want the person that you like to want you the same way you want them, and sometimes it's not.

It's like, sometimes that's just not the way it is. And maybe he had heart breaking It could be heartbreaking for he's to feel like, you know, it's definitely heartbreaking, but more than likely he seemed like he's probably been in a relationship or probably was married and don't want to do that again. That's what it seems like. And you can't fold someone for going through that, right, Yeah, it would be cool to know the age range. Here to home girl, I would say, um, just telling him like, well,

I appreciate you being honest, but I'm looking to bee. Yeah, I'm looking to be someone's wife. So I can't. I can't be your your girlfriend if there's no future for you, because then that's not what I'm doing for And you're well within your rights to do that. Homegod just got bounced exactly somewhere else. All Right, we got time for one more. I'm gonna read this second one. It's a long one too. Um. I'm a thirty five year old female.

My boyfriend or four years is forty three. We've lived together for two of the four years of our relationship. We both have good careers nursing engineer. Congratulations you guys. I am ready to get married. In bold bold letters, catlock. He is not. We never really, He never really gives me a reason why he is not. He just says it's a big step. I'm not sure what to do. Marriage has now become a touchy subject when it's discussed

amongst other couple's friends of family. I want to give him time to get ready and figure out, but how much time if marriage is an option for him. If marriage is not an option for him, I'm done with this relationship. I don't want to give an ultimatum, but I'm not waiting ten years for him to figure it out. We are not in our twenties anymore, and I feel it shouldn't take this long to know if I'm the one you want to spend the rest of your life with.

My plan was to wait until we hit the five year mark, have a real deep discussion about it, and to tell him that if we're not getting married soon, I'm done, even though he already knows that's how I feel. I'm constantly fighting myself because he is a really great man, father, provider, lover and friend. Our relationship is good, and we both say it's the best relationship we have ever been in.

If I leave, I will truly be missing out on a great black man but I but if I stay, I will constantly have to fight my heart with the fact that I'm not married, and I don't think I

can do that. How long do I wait? Help? Man, boyfriend or four years he's forty three m this is this is the one thing I will say, right, I believe conversations of paramount right, Like, if you're at a point now where you guys can't have conversations without it becoming hostile, that's a problem because Kadina and I have been there with with finances at one point. We were there with sex at one point where if someone even brought up the topic, it was met with so much

vitriol that you couldn't even discuss it. And that's an issue because there should be nothing that's off the table. There should be nothing that you can't discuss with the person you're spending the rest of your life with. So that to me is a red flag, the fact that

they can't even discuss it. And if he can't give you a reason, you know, then there must be something there that he may have to unpack within himself, something maybe with his childhood it or something with a previous relationship or I don't know, there's a fear of commitment for whatever reason. And I see the small area about, you know, the touchy subject when discussed amos, groups of friends and stuff like that, and that rewinds to twenty something.

You're a cadine who's then now looking at couples and friends who are around and naturally people, you know, it's it's almost like asking a woman like, oh, so when when you have a baby, when you have another baby, when you have another babies, like one of those things that people don't even know, the internal struggle that you may be having, you know, to have another baby, maybe an internal struggle you guys have in your relationship and not knowing it's a touchy, touchy subject. People are then

compiling more you know, um, disdaining about the topic. You know, Um, I can't give her a time frame on like when to wait, though, you know, I do feel like at thirty five, I don't know. He says he's a great father or is He's talk a little bit children bad, but talk a little bit about You said that part of your timeline was your your fertility clock, and you wanted to get married because you want to have kids. Yeah, because I wanted to start, and I know that you

wanted you wanted four children. I wanted three to work. They're like, all right, if we end up somewhere in the middle. I didn't want to start at a certain time frame too, because then you hear people saying like, oh, you don't want to be like you know that older mom, that you want to be able to grow with your kids and you want to be able to be there for your grandkids and things like that. Well, I mean, we can't end up somewhere in the middle of four

kids or three. We can't have three and a half kids. It's either we're gonna get four or three. So where do we round to that? No, I'm just saying you said we can end up. You said we can end up somewhere in the middle. It's like you want three, I want four, right, So it's like either somebody's gonna get what they Three sounds nice and round to me. If you make a number three, it's like the two sides don't work around with four kids. Everybody got a

partner on the roller coaster? How often are we going to roller coasts? We can't even go to all the time when we have four kids. But on an airplane, if it's a three row in a three row, that's gonna be six. Now taking myself, but yes, this um so yeah, that that is that. That's what I'm wondering if he said she's he's a great father. So I'm wondering if at thirty five she says, boy friend, I don't know if they have children together or if they're

his children or not. Um, So there's that's a hard one because there really is not like a law of time frame. But I feel like there needs to be a very very candid conversation between the two of you, not waiting necessarily for a five year mark to then have the conversation. But it's like, why wait and invest a couple more years if he's ultimately not going to

want to commit understand that? You know, we we know someone that we spoke with recently that was just like, yo, I might have to let my girl go because she wants to be married and have children and I don't Oh yeah, that's right. I just may have to just her well, And we thought like, oh my goodness, it don't gave me choose at how at peace he was with it and how like comfortable he was saying, you know what, she wants all of these things, and she's been vocal about it. So I cannot meet her there

and we have to let her go. You know what struck me. He said that he loved her so much seeing her happy getting what she want was more important to he being happy because I was like, yeah, I said, you're willing to let her go? When he was just like, bro, like, I just love her that much. I want to see her be happy. And you know what, sometimes it's people. We have to do a better job of loving people the way they want to be loved and not be selfish.

You know. There were times Astance, Yeah, there were there were times in our relationship where I was selfish. There were times that you were selfish, and if we were less selfish, we've been able to love each other better. And I think that this may be, you know, this may be one of those situations where you tell them exactly what you need, you know, and then it's up to him to live up to the pressure, rise to the pressure, off the pot. There's nothing wrong with being honest,

like this is this is my life. But that goes both ways. If a woman is going to be honest and say this is what I want on in my life, a man has every right to say this is what I want out of my life. You can't disregard what's important to me in my life and say I'm childish, but then say, all of these things that I want in my life have to be mad. I don't know.

Since when like being honest is now equated with like such like highly offended outcomes, you know what I mean, cancel culture because I mean, like, I mean, people just being honest and telling you how they feel, like I feel like that in turn just ends up with people just being so offended and I'm like, would you rather me just sell you the sugarcoated you know, sweet talk or do you want to actually hear what it is? Political correctness has become valued more than honesty because people

just want to feel better about themselves. They don't want to they don't want to be better, they don't want to be better, they just want to feel better. And it's easier to feel better when someone is telling you what you want to hear as opposed of telling you what you need to hear. That's just what And it started with giving everyone a trophy, you know, everyone to participation trophy. Everyone gets spirit. That That's when they started because now it's like you don't have to work towards

the things you want, You're just given it. It's that entitlement and it's it's affecting city is than like trying to be taken away the adversity, right, which was the sweetest part about the You know, it's affecting us, it's affecting us in our relationships. But good, ma'am, you have a right to ask you what you want. And if he doesn't want to adhere to it, move on. And he has the right expectations and standards, we flip it

back again, that's what. And if he feels like it's back is against the wall, if he feels like it's an ultimatum, at least you know where you stand and he does. All right, y'all. If you want to be featured as a listener letter on Dead Ass podcast, be sure to email us at dead Ass Advice at gmail dot com. That's right, that's D E A D A d V I C E at gmail dot com. All right, moment of truth time. Do you want to go first? Back? If it's on the tip of your tongue, No, this

is this is my moment of truth. My moment of truth is there's a certain level of pressure that exists anytime you see value in something, right, I see value in being a husband. I see value in being a father in order for me to meet the standard of which I want to perform being a husband or being a father. There's going to come pressure with that. And if you don't feel any pressure, then that means it doesn't matter enough. Like you said, pressure doesn't only bust

price where it creates diamonds. If you're willing to work through the pressure daily as a man and be a great husband and be a great father, you can build a fantastic life for your family. I'm up for the challenge. I'm willing to do it every day because I have an amazing wife that I love so much and I'm really to take over the world with her. That's my moment of truth. I love that take over the world together.

I love that my moment of truth is the moment that I no longer feel pressure when in my relationship. Is the moment I know that I might have clocked out and I need to constantly feel a level of pressure when it comes to being what I need to be in my relationship for my husband, because the moment I'm starting to kind of a waiver on that and feel like it's not that big of a deal. The moment that I feel complacent, like I'm doing a good job is the moment that I might have been just

f to coup as deep. I agree, yes, so, ley'all. I mean, if you like what we're doing over here, be sure to find us on social media. Um, we have Instagram page, dead asked the podcast, so be sure to go over there and follow and check us out. And of course you can find me on my usual handle Cadine I am and I am devout. And if you're listening on Apple Podcasts, be sure to rate, review

and subscribe. Dead Ass is a production of I Heart Media podcast Network and is produced by the Nora, Opinia and Triple Follow the podcast on social media at dead as the podcasts and never miss a Thing.