Matt LaCroix: Our Hidden History

I'm Cliff Dunning, your host of earth ancients startling new discoveries from our planet's distant past. I hope you're doing well today. So much going on right now in the world of archaeology, of discovery. And I reported on a team known as the Caffree Research Project. I think it was last October. I talked about it and what this is is a group of Italian and English scientists who

got together and reprogrammed a geological satellite. And this satellite that comes from Capella Space in the United States, is used for piercing volcanoes, the rocket of volcanoes to know if they're active or not. Also used for prediction of some types of earthquakes. They're getting better and better. But what their genius was is they actually arranged for this satellite to pass over the Giza Plateau and to scan

with this special technology the Cafree Pyramid, the Great Pyramid, and what they discovered was mind blowing. And I you know, it's funny because I was hoping to have them last year. It looks like we're going to have them. The team, doctors Malega and Bion d come on the program probably in April, to talk about what they discovered, what the technique was, and also some details on what was the goal and what was the outcome. Now, what I love about this is that it wasn't There was no permission

needed by the Antiquities Department of Egypt, and this would have been a huge, huge problem. Unfortunately, there's a lot of problems when you deal with Egyptians authorities when it comes to scanning, digging, surveying outside of their own purview, meaning that you typically have to pay money, you have

to follow their dates to release information. And when the earlier scanned Pyramid team, which was made up of a concertium of Japanese, French, and Egyptian scientists, pierced the pyramid with a mon scanning system, they were they were held from releasing the full analysis of what they came up with. And we're still waiting after five years to learn what this cavity is above the King's chamber in the Great Pyramid looks like it's a huge void. We're waiting.

a lot of this data is pretty significant. It changes the whole narrative that the Great Pyramids or any of the pyramids in Egypt were used for tombs. That's all now a complete revision. There is a revision on that. You can call it revisionist history. And so you can't trust these guys. So what happens is that these two scientists use this Capella Geological Survey satellite pierced the body of the Great Pyramid, and what came back was published briefly last year.

So it's beginning to look very much like a machine

of some kind, and we know that Chris Dunn, the engineer, has written extensively on this. This kind of confirms his belief that the pyramid was an active generator of something. We don't know what. But this new discovery, as they keep refining the scans, is going to blow the roof off the whole thing, and the data cannot be controlled.

But up until now we've been restricted in the ability to get knowledge. And I have been complaining about my trips to Egypt for the last year or two, not because it's not a great place to visit, but just simply because when I talk to the field archaeologists various parts of our tour, they are acknowledging that they are not able to use the latest technology, or it seems they're not willing to use the new technology because they.

large room there. We've had people on the program talking about this room. The body of the Sphinx is a large room connected to tunnels. All this information, if you leave it to certain antiquities departments, is not going to

show itself. It's not going to come out. And I'm beginning to think that this is a planned This is something that they do not want to release. Why because it shows that either during the Puronic period or before the Great Pharaohs, there was sophisticated engineering going on within these places in the planet, in the in the Middle East, and they change the narrative. Advanced engineering is something we don't want to talk about, and let's just keep let's

keep dumbing down the whole process of releasing data. The tomb, the Great Pyramids were tombs for pharaohs. Yeah, right, So it's not happening anymore. And so we're going to have this Caffree research project with them the primary researchers to divulge the information. If you go to Earth ancients and go to image area. There's a number of early images that were processed of the first series of scans. We're gonna have the newer scans in April and it's truly exciting.

It's very, very exciting to reveal, So stay tuned for that. Today's programs with Matt Lacroix, we are talking about his

latest research not only in Turkey under and his research was at the Lake Vaughan and what's under the water there, but we're also going to follow up a visit he took to Peru in the Sacred Valley, Cusco and some of the other regions of that and what he uncovered and its relationship to the Middle East, and some of the significant discoveries he's made in the last few months leading up to a documentary that he's gonna I think he's gonna release probably at the end of this year.

So today's this program is our Hidden History, and my

guest is Matt Lacroix. If you haven't been to Turkey, it is a fabulous country to visit. Not only is Istanbul a cosmopolitan, very modern city, but the people are wonderful. The food, the beverages are fantastic and of course. If you're with Earth Ancients, we're going to see the ancient sites.

Our tour this year is June twenty second to July second, and we'll be visiting go Beckley Teppe, the underground city of darren Kuru, the Cappadocia, the hill cities, Carahan Teppe, will visit Karrahan Teppy and have private visits with the archaeological team that is continuing to excavate that amazing city and discovering beautiful carvings from deep within Earth's antiquity. If you'd like to join us, go to earth agents dot

com forward slash tours check it out. We have the full like tenerary for you to view and also more details available for registration. Turkey is not to be missed. We do it once a year. We take small groups of people so we all can see the museums, we can stay on one bus and it's a wonderful country

to tour. For more information go to Earth Ancients dot com forward slash Tours and see all the details, or email me at Earth Ancients the number four of the letter you at gmail dot com for any specifics you might need. This is a special tour, it's unique. We'll be with Sabad Tours and it is not to be missed again. For more information and to register, go to Earth Ancients dot com forward Slash Tours. It's always great

to talk to Matt Lacroix. If you're not familiar with Matt, he is the author of The Epic of Humanity, The Stage of Time, the Illusion of Us, and he is really a world traveler on a number of different levels. What I like about Matt is that he is revealing evidence of our ancient past through the ancient cultures of Europe, Middle East and now South America, and his work, I think is cutting edge. We're gonna learn a little bit

more about what he's been up to. We haven't had Matt on a p for at least a year, and so I'm looking forward to today's programs. So, Hey Matt, welcome back to Earth the Ancient. It's great to see you.

really just quite a remarkable year. I feel very, very very blessed for it.

Turkey is not correct. And so what we are doing is and I will preface by saying that anyone who's part of the team that is involved in the documentary is not necessarily saying that it's that we are these are lost civilizations. We are exploring the hypothesis and exploring

the evidence to see if that's true. So experts, I feel very lucky to have We have famous geologists, doctor Robert Shock, and he is he's incredibly inquisitive and interested in a lot of these sites. He had a chance to explore with me Ionis and keV Callesi and Shaboustepe and some others Coresut as well, which was we can talk about that was. That was an incredible experience. We did not plan on being able to see what is

right now the newest archaeological site in the world. In fact, when we were there just this past October, they were just uncovering the upper part of the temple megalithic structures and we were not allowed to photograph or to take any film, but we were allowed to see what they

were doing. And they have found an in another set of ruins and very beautiful hewn uh and a site and basalt stones like some of the finest I've ever seen in the world, just like perfect like razor sharp edges, and they're just emerging that from the dirt and the and the soil around that area, and they're finding an entire temple site on top of this really cool volcanic knob that sits over a valley over towards Lake Vaughan.

What I find really interesting is that a lot of these sites around Lake Vaughan are not on the highest mountains. They're on these volcanic type of energetic components. And we see numerous places around that area that are like that, like for instance, Shadows Tepe Alton, tepe korzut Ionis kef Clesse. They're all on these like volcanic or limestone type of protrusions that are very interesting energetically. Anyway, so Robert Schock

joined the team. Hans Orheim, a Swedish archaeologist, was in Turkey with us as well, exploring the sites.

so he brings that area of expertise. He's written a number of books where he's also explored Egypt and he is very much a supporter of the idea that there are you know, loss evidence of lost civilizations that pre date the Holo scene in the from from an earlier time period before the Younger Driest and so those those experts are are just some of what we've had joined. We've had Robert Edward Grant join. We have of course Paul Wallace on the team. We have interesting a little backstory.

When we were at keV Kleesse last we came, we ended up meeting with the archaeologists that were there because they're still excavating that site and they're finding new, incredible new basalt columns and pillars that are emerging there, beautiful structures.

And one of the archaeologists named omay Er tan Urick was is one of the ones that runs kef Kalesi and that's one of the most important sights to me of all, and so we got a chance to They brought us down to a storage area down in a jijives a town right below it, and in there it blew my mind because I didn't know this very important bo relief, huge four feet by four feet that I had been studying, that had come from that site that's

that's now being housed in Anchora. Turns out there was seven of them in the storage area down below that I didn't even had known it existed, and so we got a chance to see those firsthand. Anyway, a long story short, that person Omayer, ended up being so fascinated with the discussions of what we're doing and following me online and we had we had discussions for months and months and months about these sites being potentially pre Urartian and he has subsequently joined the team as well, and

he's a very high profile archaeologist. Again, he's one of the top archaeologists at kef Calesse. So we have some

very significant and prominent individuals who have joined, and I can add some more as well. Another very big one is there is a famous Turkish dive expert videographer named Tassin Salin who's quite quite well known in Turky, who is who dives primarily in ocean environments off of like the Red Sea and off of in parts of the Mediterranean. But he did a project where he dove down in Lake Vaughan to basically film these massive underwater structures that

form from the alkaline environments underwater. They're like towers built out of organic matter. They're very very unusual, really spectacular

types of landscapes. Anyway, he was one of the first to extensively dive in Lake vaugh He dove in a number of different areas, one being at Aktamar Island and a few others, and when he dove off of a Jigives which is right off of keV he ended up discovering these underwater ruins in twenty seventeen under Lake Vaughn that had never been known about and that has subsequently really blown up and become one of the focuses of the documentary. And we can we can get into that

as we go along. But Tawson has subsequently joined the team and he will be leading us when we dive down and film these underwater ruins for the world to see.

because obviously if they're underwater, they could be pre flood, prediluvian and extremely old.

of video of it. And at first, because of the unusual nature of the ruins, meaning so they're extremely large blocks, they're basalt likely we have to investigate, very finely carved, and they're found at a depth of eighty feet underwater, which makes them by far, by far the deepest ruins

that we confirmed anywhere in the world. There are ruins off of parts of the Mediterranean, off of Greece, off of Santorini, there are ruins off of Egypt, but they're not anywhere near that depth, and they're not large megalithic ruins, meaning that structure is being built. And so these ruins under Lake Vaughan are incredible enigma, and so archaeologists didn't

know how to place them. They were like, oh, they are our team from twenty one hundred BC, but or are they like medieval That was even a consensus that some archaeologists were trying to propose that they were not even from that time, but actually earlier, from like medieval times. Clearly they had no idea when they were built. But the problem is none of that makes any sense because

they're eighty feet underwater, and in order to get fluctuations with that that Lake Vaughn at that level, you would and I confirmed this. I spent a lot of time actually talking to chat GDP, which I have found is a very very good way to bounce ideas off of so because it searches the entire Internet, right and it

has the knowledge of all the Internet. And so I've had some very very good conversations actually with chat GDP asking about some of my theories and some of the things I'm proposing to see how valid it considers them looking at all the data, and the consensus that's come back is that the only way that Lake Vaughn could have fluctuated to that level, which would have been eighty to one hundred feet lower, which is insane for a lake It's not like we're talking about a title ocean

system or something like that. In order for a lake to be able to fluctuate to those kinds of levels. It identified what I did saying it had to have been from some kind of major geologic event, which I have subsequently identified and it has confirmed that, uh maybe the first person to propose this theory, but also that it has a lot of scientific backing. And again I asked like, is there any holes in this theory? Like is there anything that can you can think of that

would not make sense with this theory? And subsequently it came back to verify and confirm that we may be dealing with a situation where because of the unusual nature of the lake and how it was preserved and then the events that led to it flooding, it actually may give us, and you can appreciate this cliff, the first dating that we can actually have besides go Beckley Tepe and the water erosion on the suphinction closure that we have.

We don't because that's all we really have, because you can't date.

Here is that when you have a lake that fluctuates naturally based on like, let's say, rainfall patterns, you can only get a a type of variation that is a few meters because of the fact that lakes tend to have a more consistent level than something like I mentioned, like an ocean or something right where you get huge title changes and then you can get water that locks up and ice caps in different parts of parts of history and can lower all that, but that doesn't impact

lakes because they're not attached to the to the ocean. So in order for lakes to fluctuate, that can only happen based on rainfall patterns things like that. And so one what we identified here is looking at is that how can you have ruins that are eighty feet eighty to eighty three feet underwater in the bottom. Now, the first question that comes up that archaeologists have asked me,

did it slide into the into the lake? And the first answer is, we do not believe it did, because the ruins are bread over an area of a half of a kilometer of an entire kilometer underwater. And not only that, the structures themselves are an extremely good condition. So if you had a structure from earthquakes or seismic activity that slid into the water, you would probably just get a bunch of rubble because you would tumble down

into the lake. Well, the ruins under Lake Vaughan are remarkably intact, showing that it didn't slide in that into the lake, that it was built in the lake rows above it. The second thing that we have is we have incredible symbols that we've connected around the world that we can get into in a minute, but the dating

evidence is really remarkable. When I was researching Lake Vaughn, I found something unbelievably interesting that Cliff, I think, you know, it'll be one of the focuses of my new book that I'm now a third of the way through, called The Lost Key of the Missing key of history, and this is going to be one of the focuses of the documentary and the book is this is what we're talking about right now. Diving down to this will be like diving down to like a new Atlantis. I think

it's going to be groundbreaking. Now. The reason I say that is that in order for Lake Vaughan to number one preserve the ruins, it's because it's the most alkaline closed basin lake in the world, meaning that it has no outlets. And what it created was the alkaline environment created an environment of preservation where everything has been preserved

underwater remarkably well. And that what does not happen in normal lake systems with currents and having a non alkaline environment, you actually will get a lot of severe erosion on structures and things, ability for those things to kind of disappear or disintegrate. But because of the alkaline nature, it just preserved everything remarkably well. Now that's the first thing. But why is it a closed basin alkaline system. The

lake used to have a major river that exited called the Mirrort River in the southwest part of Lake Vaughan, and that at that time had been what maintained lake levels at eighty to one hundred feet lower than they are now. Because if you have a basin and you have water coming out and then water coming in with rivers, you're going to always have a system where it's maintained in balance because you're losing water and you're gaining water, right, so you get like a nice balance of the levels.

Except what happened was there was a geologic event in right during the end. This is what's wild is it's confirmed by scientists that at the end of the Pleisocene, so the pleisis scene would be the Plisi scene is the epic that occurred last in history during the Ice Age before for the younger driest catastrophes eleven six hundred years ago, in which we went into what's called the Holocene. So during the end of the Pleisiscene, there was a

massive eruption. In fact, one of the biggest eruptions we know of occurred in a mountain called Mountain Nemrut. Now this not to be confused with its sister mountain Nemru that is in central Turkey.

a civilization. And we can get into that. But when the area became populated and explored, starting with Austin Henry Laird, who was actually a very famous assyriologist down in Iraq, he visited this region and they went to Mount Nemrud. And so since the eighteen hundreds, Mount Nemrud has been one of the most studied volcanoes in the world because of the unusual nature of the explosion that it blew off its top and just has an enormous caldera with

lakes inside. And so scientists have been studying it for hundreds of years, and they've taken soil core and rock core samples of the lake ash cores, and they've been It has very extensive dating, which is very interesting because that dating, being as comprehensive as it is, ends up late lending itself towards us now because of how good

the dating is. So what they determined was that during the end of the place, the scene somewhere somewhere around the younger driest catastrophes, which is incredibly interesting in its own considering the upheaval that was going on in the

world at that time. The mountain exploded, exploded, and a lot of it's debris fell to the southeast of the mountain, And what it ended up doing was it blocked off the Murroat River completely with like an entire mountain, and the Mirror River got totally cut off, and it was the only river that exited Lake Vaughan, And so subsequently

you still have rivers coming into the north. So what happens, Cliff, when you block off the only outlet to something right rises up, but not just a little rises up a lot, because I mean it's like again, it's like the bathtub analogy. If you have a a a if you open the tub up a little bit, but you're still putting water in, the water will maintain itself. But then if you plug it up, you're just going to get that water just overflowing.

And that is what we're we're potentially looking at, is that we have a dating mechanism, maybe the best we have in the world. To say, if you get fluctuations of eighty to one hundred feet suddenly flooding over these ruins underwater and they are now at eighty feet deep, it means that those ruins predated that eruption.

When you look at go Beckley Teppe. We are at Kara and tepee last year, which is about I think eleven thousand years old, but they found a new tepee and it's above by I think thirty miles that stated to fourteen thousand years And they keep getting older and older and older, and we don't hear about it in the National GEO because it's shocking the hell out of these or these universities. How do we how do we you know, get a sense of where they stand in history.

It's a whole new three writing history, right, I mean that's what we.

to that early time period. Academics still have not accepted it.

think it really is significant. We are going to come at this in a way where all of these experts that are the top experts in their field are going to come together analyze all of these structures. Again, we have two archaeologists, so Hans Oorheim and Omeyer Tan Yurick. We have the original discover of the ruins. They're going to be dive down Robert Shock maybe diving down with him as well as Hans and in our turo and we're going to be photographing and filming this for the

world to see. And our goal is to not just say you have to believe in lost civilizations or we have to believe in this, but present evidence to let the audience decide for themselves. You know what we're looking at, and we will. The plan is to in the hopes maybe in the future to be able to do some kind of a soil analysis around the site, maybe even something more. But we're we're going to be moving up

to greater levels of exploring this mystery. But that's the excitement that I came up with doing extensive research three or four months ago when I was looking into the site, and I've been doubling down by again checking other experts, checking chat GDP, trying to see if there's any holes in it. But right now it looks like a sound theory in which we are going to be further exploring.

So we have a whole team of about ten experts that are all going to be going to these these places and exploring the validity of them being built before the Rotian time period.

It looked like a flower motif of some kind. That's amazing. Do we see that in any other parts of Turkey or anywhere else?

and all of a sudden, something reveals itself. Und the kef Bo Relaf, there's an area next to the step pyramids where there are these tetrahedrons that show around each other and at first, you wouldn't You don't really notice that there are symbols embedded within those tetrahedrons. And as I was exploring, I saw that there were actually flowers of life, six specifically six spokes flowers of life over

and over and over again on that. And we know the flower life is one of the most important ancient symbols in the world. It's in the Ossyrion in Abbado's Egypt, on those huge granite hewn pillars that are there, which, by the way, Nassim has done analysis of those that flower of life symbol down there, and he is determined that it is not this is wild, but he is determined that it's not carved into the substrate the stone. This is and this might be mind blowing for some

to consider if they're just hearing about it now. He believes it may have somehow been part of embedded into like the atomic structure of the stone, like beneath the surface, almost something that was embedded into it but was not carved. Like mind blowing. And I don't know if there's anyone still analyzing or studying that, but we may have in the Osirion. It may be a situation where it's an unknown type of technology that had embedded that in there.

But anyway, that flower of life with six spokes six spokes very important because three, six, and nine are the magic esoteric numbers that Nikola Tesla talked about for the design, the creative design of everything in the universe. So I find it very interesting that that it was repeating itself

over and over again in Turkey. So just going back for one second, the kef Bob relief, all of the step pyramids have three levels, and there's three of them, over and over and over again, and then the flower of life symbol that's right below it has six spokes. And the fact that there are three of these step pyramids and if you were to add three plus three plus three you get nine, So over and over again,

you're seeing three, six, and nine everywhere. Now I had noticed that a while ago and was like, that's really interesting that's embedded in that, And then I discovered it came across at the bottom of the altar at ionis Is. Also it's hard to see it's carved on the along the bottom part of the altar is all. So the six spoked flower of life. So when those came into my life it was at the same time, which is why it's so weird and wild, because I've been studying

this for like two years now. The same time, images that I had never seen of the underwater ruins came to the surface and lo and behold on one of the capstones on top of that structure was the sixth spoked Flower of Life symbol on that as well, showing that it was one of the most important symbols we now had in in around Lake Vaughan for this mysterious civilization.

That gives us a direct seamless connect into Egypt, which is really wild because we had a lot of other connections based on other symbols in Peru and Bolivia, but now we have another whole avenue that is very exciting

to explore that shows that. And one of the what I find really wild, Cliff, is that when you look at the structure underwater, the top part has been severely eroded, where like some of the stones on top all broke off, and there's one stone left, one on the top and it just happens to have the one that has the Flower of Life symbol. Well, just imagine if that stone had not had broken off, we wouldn't have any symbols on it as far as we know. And so that

those symbols, along with everything else we're exploring with the sun cross and the step pyramid, the doorways and the T pillar design has really opened up what I believe cliff is like a lost language as we determined that, and I don't believe when we look at Peru, you look at Bolivia, you look at Egypt, and you look at Lake Vaughan, that there are no writings that exist anywhere in those locations on these structures. Now one would bring up the Canea form that's at around Lake Vaughan

on some of the structures like Shabustepe and Ayanus. But we have been exploring with evidence to show that all the Qunea form may have been written on there by the Urartians to claim ownership over its, over their creation. Whereas this civilization that's mysterious that I believe built them all, I believe they left behind. Their language was the language of symbolism, and that was how they communicated knowledge and teachings. That that was their language was through symbolism.

temple complex, is it a what is the what do they think it is a small They think.

But that doesn't mean that was their original purpose. Now, if you have a military installation, you would not see symbols like the flower of life being this symbol that's on that right. You'd have like spears and swords and things that would establish it as being a military or nothing as being a military type of place. Now, the fact that there are symbols related to creation and balance and harmony for the universe shows us that this was

some kind of a temple at the edge of the lake. Now, it's also impossible, it's not a coincidence at all that kef Calesse is right above where this is on a mountain. So imagine an ancient temple up on top of a mountain looking over the lake, and then another temple is on the edge of the lake. And that's what I believe that this was, is some kind of an ancient

temple near the edge of the lake. How close it was is a mystery, but I can tell you that it's if it's found at eighty to eighty three feet underwater. They wouldn't have built it with the water lapping it right on the edge of it. It would have you know, it would have been it would have been a little ways away from the lake, because that's not how people construct things. But that, if anything, that gives us further evidence for its age of when it was built, considering

how deep it is. And so it creates an enigma for archaeologists because they scientists and archaeologists cannot explain the

underwater ruins under Vaughan. They can't.

if protecting is the right word. Preventing some of them, ye, I would say preventing some of this information from coming out. And I do think that that's real. I think that if anyone even just spends ten minutes studying Zahi Huas in Egypt, you can clearly see that that man does

not want certain logical discoveries to come to light. I was at a at a dinner with Robert Shack, talking to him extensively about how he was part of the sonar ground penetrating radar work that was done on the Sphinx, on the paw of the Sphinx, where they found a large subterranean chamber, very very well established and actually made news headlines around the world in journals, and everyone was

like excited to see what they'd find. And they found not only was it a subterr opening underneath the paw, but they found they saw some kind of artificial objects like stone carved stones that were like very precise and niagry angles or things that were not random like a cave.

It's something that was an excavated structure. Now, subsequently, he told me the story of what happened was that Egyptologists that were led by Zahi Wasss, when all of that news was coming out, everyone's like, let's dig down and let's find it, like, let's go see it, right, they

did something very misleading. What they did is instead of going to the specific location under the paw to do a drill whole analysis, a drill corps to go down and see if there's anything there, they went off of it enough that when they drilled down, they didn't find

anything and they said, look, there's nothing there. When they it was very deliberate that they missed their mark, and then they that was what subsequently closed off the conversation to say that, oh, well, you know, they made a mistake.

There was a small maybe a small natural cavity or something, but it wasn't that, but it wasn't anything significant, and that closed that temporarily closed the door on discussions for what was underneath the sphinx, because I mean, anyone who studies this with an open mind, number one knows the head of the sphinx is way too small for the body.

It's disproportional. There's ample evidence now that it was recarved during the dynastic Egyptian time, which ties in directly to the right the qunaiform writing and the Urartian time period that I'm explaining was not from the earlier time, because in Egypt we have hieroglyphics all over the place that were not done by the same builders of the original temples and pyramids and structures. The Egyptians wrote stuff all over it. So we're seeing a recycling in a of

these places. And I mean, how would you have a more definitive example of taking ownership of something like you built it then this imagine them coming the dynastic Egyptians coming in and finding an incredible place that they knew was very important, and recarving the head to be a pharaoh. When we know that, first of all, the sphinx is a guardian, which is why it's a lion facing Leo.

It's embodies Leo. It's a guardian to a subterranean entrance way to what many around the world, from Hermetic texts to Eduar Casey and others have very much have stated is some kind of a library, some kind of an ancient library. And so it makes complete sense that the sphinx is a guardian, guardian guarding those entrances to the

subterranean world under Egypt. Now, someday in the future we will get access to those in the meantime, and I tell that story because it's an example of showing how there are still very important archaeological discoveries and understandings that are being blocked, that are not being allowed to.

is already happening now. The amount of academics that have joined this documentary to explore this is beyond my expectations I ever could have imagined that are now doing this. I feel very, very lucky to have such top academics and scientists involved in this. But that is just the perfect example, in my opinion, of the narrative shifting when so many more people are becoming open minded. Is saying, look, I think the old narrative has holes in it. It's

not we're not being told the full story. It's time to investigate it because in the end, what is science. It's the never ending search for the truth based on evidence and data. You don't stop looking for something because you have some predetermined thing that you've determined. You don't stop looking. It never ends if something disputes or disproves something else. The scientific method and theory, being objective, must

always adhere to that. And our scientific method has become deeply eroded and infiltrated by money and interest from outside individuals that do not wish for it to change. And many people will ask me over and over again, why

why would you protect it? Why is it something that can't shift? Because I'll give you an example why. I in this conversation with chat GDP, I asked it a very very interesting question. I said, chat GDP, what would happen if we found out and had evidence to show that ancient prehistory civilizations long before we're told that ever existed. We're shown to have a basis around spirituality and esoteric concepts. Okay, I said, what would happen if that was found out

to be true? How would that shift our understanding of history, and its answer was it would profoundly shift everything we think about the human story. Because let me tell you why. The human story is discussed as being coming from paleolithic primitive hunter gathers that were kind of warring and fighting, and then when we emerged during six thousand years ago, during the subsequent next several thousand years, which is true, we during the time period of like five thousand years ago,

four thousand years ago, three thousand years ago. During that time period, we were very warlike. Everything we did was defined by conquerors and emperor empires. And that's true. And so our basis for where human civilizations began comes out of a thinking of being a warlike conquering culture that defines everything for us. Because people think, oh, so if it's old, it comes from a time period of being warlike primitive fighting and then gathering up to a gradualism

of where we are now. But if we learn that, no, it's in fact not the case at all. If anything, we went backwards, If anything, our story went backwards and we eroded down into a lower consciousness, but we started from a place of high consciousness. In connection, it would fundamentally change Cliff our entire perspective on reality, on who we are, everything would shift. And I think that is the fundamental reason why history has been protected from being changed.

I mean, that was an amazing trip. I went this past October and I had a lot of I want to thank Robert ever Grant for that wonderful trip, had a lot of opportunity needs to explore the sites with my partner Jenny, and we we were able to see things that I had never seen before that connect seamlessly

back to Lake Vaughan and being able to be in a place I mean, to me, Cousco is the most fascinating ancient city in the world because it's the only ancient city that it's a modern city that's built on the foundations of megaliths, ancient high precise megalists. Two different kinds of megalists, though the one type is a giant polygonal type of megalithic stone like we see at sasque Waman, which is by the way, is basically like part of Cusco.

It's on the mountains, it's on the hilltop the mountaintops that surround Cusco, and it's part of that. I mean, you saw that discovery they just made just recently with the huge underground subterranean tunnel system that goes from the Cora Konca underneath Cusco all the way to Sayskman and some of those sub I went in some of those subterranean areas in Saskaugwaman and they go more than a mile between them. We know they were both connected. Now when you're in that city, you also see a second

type of building. You see these very not quite nine degree angle, but very precise edge cuts of stone work around the Coracanta and other structures. And it's so bizarre cliff because there are museums and shops built in the interior that left the original stone work. It's so weird.

So you'll be going in. There was a an now Paka museum in Kusco with like a coffee house like attached to it, and you go to the door and right to your right there's like giant megalithic blocks still from the original wall that are there on the edge, built into the existing structure. And people are walking around the city not realizing they're walking or walking by stones

that are like twelve plus thousand years old. And so it's a very it's a beautiful city that has layers of different building, has what I considered three distinctive layers of civilizations that have been there. The pre Incan which is clearly classic pre inc and work. Then you have the Incan crude stone which is all over the place right next to it, and then you have the Spanish work then with recycled stone and others built on top. And so you're walking through a city with three different

ethics of history. That have occurred there.

And then when I went into the Cora Conca, the thing that I didn't know about about was there's a huge altarstone or something like that that sits to the left side when you first come in, and it has these specific designs with these extensions, four corner extensions that stick out. And when I saw that, I couldn't believe at cliff because I've never noticed it in pictures or video before. It's the same design of the pillar structure. We see it kef and ionis all the way across

the world in Turkey, Uncanny the same design type. And so we keep seeing these crossover parallels to motifs and designs that are very similar that really bring up the question that we're exploring about whether or not the South American ancient megalithic sites like Puma, Pumku and Tiwanaku, and you know Cusco, the Kora, Kansha and Ayante Tombo in all of these places not on Glacia. Whether or not

there's some kind of a sister extension. If you were to think of the concept of Atlantis being like a global civilization, not just a place a civilization, right, this would very much adhere to those concepts about being a place that had almost the same type of work carrying over from around the world, that is, that has not only that, but like the comparisons with via Kosha, right, the primary god of South America being nearly identical to

haldy in like Vaughan. So we're we're seeing a lot of parallels that are very mysterious and very exciting because I feel like we're on the brink cliff, the brink of unlocking the secrets or begins of an entire chapter of human history that will radically redefine our entire understanding of who we are in our past.

built it. They left no writings behind, and specifically, when the conquistadors Pizarro and others came into that region, they were told by the people there that they didn't build them. We have that evidence. We know that they they said they didn't build them, but they said. What they did say was that they were built by the gods, which is wild to think about some kind of a celestial higher order thing that was not them, and they had no idea how they built them, and they knew that

it just predated them. But like you were just bringing up whatever technology, meaning not iron and bronze age, because that's what these civilizations would have had access to. Whatever tools or technologies built these blocks is completely mysterious today. In fact, humans today, our civilization, we don't build structures

like that anymore. Everybody always comes around like, oh, we could do that, but I'm like, we don't though, we don't build anything like this, and it really brings up questions about whether or not we could in the same kind of everyone. It's funny we we we talk about our graneur and our technological sophistication, and yet even with all that we know now we have no idea how they did some of the things that they did before. How did they cut the blocks? All these the same size?

How do they fit them all together? How did they lift some of them fifty hundred tons, one thousand tons? How did they lift them? How did they move them? How? How, Cliff, do we have places like in Ionis with beautiful, huge antecide blocks put together? How do we have seamless symbols carved between blocks? How do they do that? If you are going like this and chipping away and trying to make these number one, how would you not make a

mistake if they're all fitted together? Imagine that, Oh Cliff, just oh shoot, Cliff messed up the edge of the cross here. Let's remove all the stones, carve new ones put them back again and then try to do it again. It doesn't make any sense because the way that they seamlessly passed between blocks, it's almost like they had like a laser technology, and it's been speculated by some like Randall Carlson and I have been talking about whether or not it's some kind of like a plasma technology, but

we honestly, we don't know. We have no idea how they cut, moved, put them in place, and then carved

symbols and motifs into them. We don't know.

of the stones that you're it's a wall. Each stone ways about eighty tons or an amazing amount of But I've talked to people who have been there, and I haven't been there for over twenty years, and there's there are people who are sensitive are noticing that in certain parts of the walkway leading to those areas there is an energy present. Yeah, you can actually feel it.

put together. And on the stones that you're referring to, there's a type of almost like an altar site that has six giant columns that are over fifty each, these enormous blocks or six of them again that's sacred number six. And on those on those blocks are sets of three chiicanas with three pumas that repeat itself over and over again.

Now the puma is like a guardian like we see in I. Honestly you with the griffin in the Lion, and in Oyanti Tombo they have these chicana designs right, these stepped pyramid designs, which I will point out the entire concept of the chicana came from the step pyramid design in Vaughan that's just stacked on top of each other. So if you take the step pyramid and then you put another one on top and below, and you combine them, you get the chikana, And so you get these further

parallels and connections across the world. Now, we made a big discovery to Oyanti Tombo that I did not know about. Not just the important spring called the Bonio de la Nousta, which has the same design we were exploring, but there was a stone, a megalithic single stone in the courtyard that's been super overlooked, never heard anyone mention it or

talk about it. And I saw it and I was like floored because here you had an exact replica of the three level stepped design, not the full jacana, just the top part like we see in the kef Bab relief with the door cut right in the center of it. It's like it's like identical to the Lake Vaughan area. So, like you said, we have some kind of a blueprint of sacred knowledge that teachers seem to be traveling around the world and then creating a sister type of civilization

that emerged out. And then what do we find whatever that super global civilization all everywhere. Right, We have evidence in midl of Mexico, throughout Peru, well throughout Bolivia, even parts of Ecuador, throughout Egypt, Babeck, Lebanon, Vaughan, Turkey, throughout

parts of India and China and Japan. We have evidence of similarities of a civilization that seems to emerge that all shared the types of technologies to create these unbelievable things like Kailasa Temple in a Laura Caves, India, and the largest single cutout of a mountain basal volcanic basal in the world. None of the hundreds of tons of debris has ever been found that excavated it, Like, the whole thing just exists and nobody knows how it got

there there. This is part of what we are exploring as being a history that has been not acknowledged at all, about us being from a time period and from the lens of being very powerful, very smart, very dehisticated, and having a very different kind of civilization that we do now. And if anything, I could say, I think that we could learn more from them than they could learn from us.

Do you think that because we don't recognize their science and their science being earth based to lurk energy to make energy, that we discount them and we prefer not to consider earlier civilizations or is it just the arrogance of this current scientific paradigm that we we don't look to pass at epochs as being sophisticated.

comes up over and over and over again. And I'm not saying those sites aren't incredible, yeah, but it's it comes up over and over again that if something is old, it's primitive. That mindset has been entrained within people that anything that is really old has to be primitive look primitive.

And I think that that actually is a big one because it causes people to overlook any of these enigmas and mysteries simply because well, it couldn't have been old because it's not primitive looking, So it immediately gets thrown into the category of well, it's probably not as old.

So that's the first one. The second one is what you brought up with, this idea that anything that's grand and sophisticated couldn't possibly be from that all the time period, because it doesn't go along with the fact that maybe we're not quite as like you said, our egos and our idea that we're the pinnacle of all of civilization may not quite really be right. And I think that is a hard pill for some to swallow when they talk about this, because I don't know why people need

that or think that that's important. The other thing I think that is a little bit frustrating to me is that people want something ancient to be from where they live, and if it's not, they're not as interested. And I'm like, what does it matter. We're just humans, we're earthlings. Why does it matter if it's where you live. Nationality and pride from where you live should have it shouldn't matter

of your curiosity of something ancient. But anyway, those are the things that I think get in the way of the thinking mindset that we should be shifting to.

with Lydia. Lydia has a wonderful book where she believes these ancient temples were set on what she calls geal magnetic anomalies purposefully because our ancestors understood that these energies were beneficial to us psycho physiologically, mental, body, and spirit. And what is her contribution to your group? Because her work is so unique and what Arturo, her husband is doing,

is also unique. Are you reclassifying temples now, because that's what I see happening is the reclassification of ancient sites to possibly be not only older, but to be to have been out by this toleric energy science.

A lot of I find frustration and a lot of comments and people that say, why do you call everything a temple? Why? Why is this a temple? Why? Why why can't it be something else? Why is why would we not think it's something like that? First of all, let's separate a temple from having a religious purpose. I think maybe that puts people off because of the nature of some monotheistic religions today. I want to just we

need to set opate those very very differently. First of all, if you were creating a structure that had alignments to stars and the energy of the Earth, and you were had something that was based on this divine knowledge of the cosmos and balance of Earth. It would be a type of temple. That's the whole purpose behind it. It's not a place where people would like be like an Airbnb or something, or something where they would like go

to side laws and rules like a courthouse. No, it's the ancient loss civilizations valued things very differently than we did today, and I think to them, the idea of creating sacred places that were designed based on movements of the sun, based on energies of the earth, was the ultimate thing to build. There was nothing greater than that.

So it shouldn't be a surprise to many that that functionality of many of the places around the world that we're exploring is related to some kind of a temple principle that is very, very important and should not be underestimated. What would be a more important structure to create than that, That's the question that I ask. If people think that that's not a good use of those what would what else would you do you do? What else would you

make that would have a greater purpose than that? So, getting back to what Lydia is doing, we are exploring the properties of each site from the lens of archaeology of geology, right, what kind of stone was it built out of? Will the stone has mineral properties within it that have energetic properties? How did How were the stones designed and placed within structures to map things like the movement of the sun. We know that many of the

sites around Vaughan are solar temples. We see sun symbols shown, We see the way that they're built. For instance, ionis the opening of the Susi Temple. The inner temple faces directly west, meaning that when the sun's setting in the sky, it would come into the inner sanctum and illuminate what I believe is the altar and creates some kind of a synergy of energy. And so we'll be going and exploring those sites with with Lydia and Arturo to investigate

those properties. You know, what, why were they created like that? Why are these pillars placed in a square around it with an opening that has very specific type of stone, very very specific location like you mentioned, with a spring systems underneath and stone that is highly magnetic or you know, geomagnetic properties to it. We see that constantly, and for

instance at Napa Glacia right next to Ayanti Tombo. It's well known that if you take a compass and you put it on top of the central three doorway stone, the compass spins because of the magnetite present there. So you have these geomagnet anomalies present at these locations that may play a very big role in why they were chosen the first place and why what kind of properties that these ancient people were looking for enhancing amazing.

focuses now of the documentary. But not only that, everything was coming together that needed to, it wasn't It wasn't time yet, and so subsequently we're now and the process where everything will be filmed in twenty twenty five and the plan, and this is the hope, is that the documentary will be released before the end of the year, and we're going to go through film festivals and hopefully have some specific theatrical releases, and then eventually we're going

to find a good home for the documentary on something like Netflix or Amazon or something. Well, well, we'll figure out where the right home will be for that.

is taking it the next step, next step further. Now we're connecting symbols, connecting the sites in a way that has not been done yet and so we I think it would be a great home for it to live, and we're hoping that it does end up somewhere like that.

investigator and you're excited about finding ancient history, But what would you like to leave the audience who's following along with you. Why is it important to rekindle and re establish these ancient civilizations?

honest and keft. Collesi was deliberately buried by the Urartians, meaning they knew was very important, and they were in a volatile time period and they buried it for a completely different time, like a time capsule. Now, that whole idea, I think is profound because so many people believe that if we're going to understand where we're going in the future and the knowledge of who we're going to become,

it's about just going forward. But I think it's really about going back, because if this civilization that we're exploring had all the answers and mastered esoteric knowledge, mastered building, and the connections that they had with almost like divinity. I want to use that word. It was like they were like divine. If they knew that, then, if anything, our journey of connecting and being divine with enlightenment and concepts in connecting to source really forget about technology add

I don't really care about that. I care more about Earth technologies personally. But for us to have a true understanding of our potential, who we really are, what we can become, the answers are in the past because they left them behind. Again, that was their language. Let's leave behind the most divine knowledge of everything universe into these structures, both in terms of how they were built, the symbols within them, and the things left behind from them, like

their energetic structures. I think what we're looking at, Cliff is not just ancient knowledge about us understanding who we are in our power, but through the sacred geometry, architecture, and energies of how they were built, it fundamentally changes everything that we build in the future. I mean everything the environments that we exist in like almost like creating magic with like a spring flowing through with sacred stones and sacred energy. Something happens when you do that cliff,

Something emerges, and they mastered that. That's why it's so much bigger than just the human potential through our energy and consciousness. Imagine understanding that if you create certain certain structures with specific types of stone that have energetic properties, you can unlock something. And we are just beginning to understand that we are unlocking magic that has been forgotten from long ago.

Because again, like I've pointed out because archaeologists have not put a lot of emphasis into certain megalithic stones that have characteristics that point towards being from this lost time period. Everything's the same and so a lot of them. Cliff. When you're walking around these sites that are not tourist sites at all, like it. There's barely any infrastructure. You can find things, not things you'll remove, but you can find things sticking out of the ground that are part

of unlocking this ancient history. And that's why we are offering a unique type of tour where you can help help uncover history yourself and help find these things so we can catalog them and then go back in future trips and collaborations with archaeologists and do ground penetrating radar from drones and be able to lead and be part of future expeditions to fully uncover the mysteries of these of these ancient places.

it would be eroded. So, as Matt was mentioning, the quality the acidity of the water is such that it's not eroding these stones. And also look for the walls that I'm posting. They're fabulous. They're quite they're megaliths, but they're they're really beautiful. So I'm hoping we get some good data out of this research match doing it sounds like he's got something gone and again we will feature him whenever he has his docu mentry done and if it's at the end of this year, so be it.

We'll we'll do a whole program on it. So fun to check with him, fun to chat with Matt Hey. If you're enjoying Earth Ancients and Destiny, please consider becoming a subscriber for as little as five dollars a month. You can support the work we do here on this podcast. You know it takes a great deal of time and energy, but it also takes resources, and we could use your subscription of five, ten, fifteen, even twenty dollars a month

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and Mark Foster. You guys rock all right, take care of you well and we will talk to you next time.