AI is literally inundating everything here in the United States. I don't know how it's affecting other countries, but I would imagine those with a Western tent are feeling the same impact. And I am so fascinated by it. But
I am using two systems, two applications. I'm using chet GPT and I'm using Venue AI, and I'm using Venice because chat GPT has certain restrictions on creating graphic photographs, photorealism, anything that hintset, nudity or whatever their guidance is inappropriate imagery is banned, and so Venice is open to that. And so I'm working with both of them right now. And I'm using chat gp for writing purposes because it can download vast amounts of data to pick and choose from. Now.
One of the big problems, and many of you who are using AI know what I'm talking about, is it's providing the information that may not be true. It may be manipulating the truth, it may be false. It may present it like it's an actual fact, when in truth it's not. It's a presumption, and so you got to be very careful when you add it to a document. And I have friends that write white papers, scientific white papers, archaeological references and papers, and they use AI for reference
material as well. But you have to be very careful. And I'm wondering, as I'm getting ready to publish another book and I need to talk to the editors about this, how do the editors determine what's real what's not, Because if they're sticking their neck out for a new author and the author is not being truthful, I don't know if they're in line to be reprimanded or even sued depending on the information. I would think that they could be sued if they're making statements that could cause harm.
And of course you have to write and present a statement at the head at the beginning of the book protecting yourself and that you're not responsible for anybody who uses a product or does something that could be dangerous. And so that's important. But I am really enjoying working with artificial intelligence. And I got to say that I have been asking some very hard questions regarding the discovery of an Ice age civilization. This is a prediluvian civilization,
and what the ramifications are. And in the very beginning, i'd say a year or two ago, you know, i'd say two years ago. When you ask the question like that, it would give you very straight answers like, well, there hasn't been any proof of a prediluvian civilization, Atlantis is a myth, and so forth and so on. But as you get better, and this is the key to working with artificial intelligence, When you pose very specific questions and you phrase it in such a way, it actually helps.
It helps you get the more quality answer with really really good data. And so I've been doing this off and on as an experient, and in our interview today with Mark doctor Mark Carlotto, Mark actually presents at the very beginning of his book a little paragraph that says supported by chat GPT for data analysis. And I thought to myself, well, that's that's a nice way to say that you've had help from AI. But he had the same problem that I did, and we'll hear about exactly
what that was. But I want to play a real short voice activated AI response to a question I pose, which is what would be the reaction and the impact of a discovery of a prediluvian advanced civilization that was not known? And I'm only going to play a little bit of this because it goes on for about twelve was about fifteen minutes because the U the artificial intelligence
reply is long winded. So I'm going to play just a few minutes of it here for you to listen to, and you'll get a sense you'll hear the question and then you'll hear the answer. So I'll just take a quick listen.
Discovering an advanced prehistoric civilization twenty five thousand years old question post to AI chat GPT. If archaeologists uncovered clear, repeatable, testable evidence of a technologically advanced civilization twenty five thousand years ago, around twenty three thousand BCE deep in the last Ice Age, the impact would be massive, but not in the way conspiracy culture imagines it would unfold in phases, Let's walk through it one E. What would actually have
to be found to overturn current models of prehistory? The discovery would need something like precision machined alloys dated securely to twenty five thousand years ago, semiconductor level materials embedded in undisturbed strata, complex energy systems, reactors, batteries, et cetera, written symbolic systems tied to engineered infrastructure, large scale urban planning beneath glacial layers, not mysterious stones, not carvings, not
ambiguous anomalies. It would have to be unmistakably industrial or post industrial technology. If that level of evidence were confirmed by multiple labs worldwide. History would not suppress it. It would detonate academia in a productive way. Pwore immediate impact on archaeology and anthropology. Current consensus agriculture about ten thousand, twelve thousand years ago, cities about six thousand, seven thousand years ago, Bronze Age about five thousand years ago, industrialization
about two hundred and fifty years ago. A twenty five zero zero zero year old advanced civilization would mean civilization predates agriculture. Complex societies emerged during the Ice Age. Our evolutionary timeline of social complexity is incomplete. Major population collapse events erased prior development. The field would pivot overnight. Universities would rewrite textbooks within a decade three What happens to human evolution theory. It wouldn't overturn evolution. It would force
reevaluation of cultural development models, not biology. Charles Darwin remains intact.
Now I'm going to be trying out some different tests on other artificial intelligence that have more archaeological data storage. And I'm not sure it'll make a difference, but it might. And I'm going to keep posing these questions about discovering a Prediluvian Ice Age civilization, Ice Age being the plesticne I think, what is it. It's over two million years to approximately eleven thousand years ago. That's a long long time.
And so and we're gonna hear about this today. These different epics epochs, I should say, these different epochs have Ice Ages in them. So we'll hear about that from Mark. And so this is interesting data, This is important data. And I you know, have archaeologists on the program all
the time, and it's important that they stay flexible. And I think that a lot of these civilizations that we recognize today, especially the old ones like Dynastic Egypt, some of the Peruvians, even the Maya, the Early Maya, will be continually redated as more artifacts are found. Plus, and
this is one to really get your mind around. If we are reusing temples, pyramids, and other buildings and artifacts left to us by earlier ages, we're not going to know that they were created by an early Predynastic people or a Ice Age people. Because they were reused. And this is a big deal that a lot of people
don't know about. When it comes to the Maya, different generations would modify and in some cases completely rebuild pyramids, temples and buildings and so and archaeologists pretty much know this, especially with Maya. I don't hear it so much in Egyptological terms. But these these buildings were repurposed. And so how are you going to know who the earlier people were that built the original temples or pyramids. The only way you're going to know is to dig into the pyramids,
and that's just not done a lot right now. So lots to consider and lots lots to really salivate over, because as we begin to discover these things, and this is what my my problem with archaeology is right now is if you've got to stretch, you're thinking, you've got to move beyond these predisposed dates, and if your books are saying we have to hard stop at four thousand years because before that time we were hundreds of gatherers.
You know what's go Beckley Tepio about that's twelve thousand years ago that place was put together, those subsurface temples. But the other thought is if we are repurposing or our ancestors repurposed existing buildings, that should be a whole different study, kind of like archaeo astronomy, where these buildings were aligned for certain equinoxes and solstices and star systems. And we're going to get into that today. And that's that's simply a mind blower because then you get into
some really ancient time time periods. So today's gonna be fun. So today's program is an inconvenient theory. This is a new book by doctor Mark Carloado, who is the guest today. Hey Earth Asients has some of the best tours that you could ever be a part of, simply because not only are they high quality, we call them the diplomatic tour because you're treated like a representative of your city, state, country,
and just wind and dine like royalty. But the price, the costs, the expense is half of looking normally charge for a twelve to thirteen day tour. Our upcoming Egyptian Grand Egyptian Tour is April twenty eight through May tenth. This is an opportunity to join me to see these massive stone structures up close and personal, interact with artifacts, see this new billion dollar museum, float on the Nile and Luxury and see some of the oldest megalithic sites
in the world. For all the details and more information, go to Earth Ancients dot com Forward slash Tours and you can see the itinerary for each day evolves a little bit. We add a few places like the Usirian was gonna be a part of a day tour, which is that out of place building that's in Abydos, And oh my god, we're gonna see that. We're gonna see
Luxor Karnak and just so much more. Again, we only have a few seats left because we want to just take a small group of people and this is your opportunity, your invitation to see ancient Egypt up close and personal with me and Saba Tours and go to Earthancients dot com Forward slash Tour. It's gonna be April twenty eighth through May tenth. It is not to be missed. Come out and join us. Mark Carlato is with us. If you don't know who he is, he is a former
aerospace engineer and also an author and a scientist. We have him on It seems like we have Mark ont on an annual basis to give us kind of a heads up on what's going on. And he is a perfect birth ancious candidate simply because not only does he deal with anomaloist topics, his work is based on science, which I really like because it kind of gives us a grounds to work with. His new book is called
an Inconvenient Theory Ages and Loss Civilizations. This is another look at not only Charles hapgood the crustal displacement theory, but also what has come out of that, some of the research that he has discovered, and some new ideas that I think are gonna be kind of fun to talk about. So, hey, Mark, Welcome to Earth Ancients.
How you doing good? Cliff? I'm good. How are you?
How's it? How's it going? You're in Virginia right?
I know in Boston.
Oh you're in Boston. Okay, So you're dealing with some pretty cold weather right now. I'm hearing so called sunny California. We're dealing with forty degree weather. Of course for you it's probably minus five or something, right.
It's it's been pretty cold. Yeah.
Yeah, you're building snowmen in snow women. Yes, yeah, amazing. What was the interest in this new book. Of course you're you're read visiting Charles Hapgood and that's a that's a big one right there. Talk about half Good? What what's a key for you that keeps driving your your needing to know. I mean he's talking about entire continents moving.
His idea was that the Earth's crust is like an orange peel, and through different tectonic shifts, land masses are moving and not a few feet, we're talking significant movement. But what is it about half Good's theories that are of great interest to you?
Well, his theories can explain a lot of things in a very simple way, and you know that's that's always appealing in science. He proposed that it was shifts of the Earth's crust moving different geographical regions, you know, into the polar zones that were responsible for the ice ages. I mean, even today, scientists have a hard time explaining
how the ice ages work. They explain, they have a hard time explaining how all this ice melted twenty thousand years ago, right during elast Glacial max when the Earth was the coldest. Somehow all this ice melted, and the explanations are not very satisfying, and you know, fifty years later, you know, Hapgood's theory I think still is in contention for being a candidate explanation for some of these phenomena.
During his lifetime he had the ear and brain of Albert Einstein, who acknowledged his work, and unfortunately he passed away before he could he could I don't know you could say validated. But what other important scientists believe that he's got something going here.
Well, you know, his work appeared around the time Wagner's theory, which was originally called continental drift that you mentioned earlier. It was finally sort of verified using paleomagnetic data, using some sensors that they had have become available in the nineteen sixties, and these data sort of supported or proved that, you know, continental drift, which is now known as plate tectonics,
is happening. And so this was when half Goods theory came out, and it was sort of the timing wasn't good because it was this new theory now in geology and earth science, plate tectonics, and you know, consensus is that explains everything that nothing else was needed, and so
it kind of fell by the wayside. But you know, Einstein did critically read half Good's work, and he actually did identify a problem with it, which was that he didn't think the ice, you know, a build up of the ice in the you know, polar zones could cause a crystal shift, and you know, actually I do analysis in the book, and so that was kind of there was a technical problem with Hapwood's theory, only in that
it was I think the wrong mechanism. And what I talk about in Inconvenient Theory is a different mechanism that I think is much more plausible and actually much more in line with what we know about the Earth and the Moon for that matter.
You opened the book with ice ages. The importance of ice ages? Why is it? Why is it critical that we understand the previous ice ages and how they were formed.
I think they're tied to our history. I think over the last hundred thousand years. I think crustal displacements, you know, and this was Hapwood's idea, crustal displacements were the cause of ice ages. And you know, my angle on this in Before Atlantis was that the crustal displacements where the changes in the direction of the North Pole that were responsible for you know, archaeological sites being aligned in different directions, and so the two are are they're you know, they're
they're two sides of the same coin. Well, actually there's really three sizes. Is also the idea of you know these animal extinctions, the you know what happened to the wily mammoth? You know, why has the climate change so in such extreme ways? And we can get into that later ways that really can't be explained using standard climate theory. So I think my interest is and the reason I wrote this book is that there were sort of three threads that needed to be tied together, and I wanted
to do it in a simple way. So it's not a big book. It really just sort of highlights the key points.
Yeah, but I like that. I like that you actually give us a taste of these various thoughts that you have. Yeah, talk about solar radia. This is something that I've heard from from other people. But how does that impact Earth specifically, and how does that develop into a ice age?
So the idea was introduced by a scientist by name of Milankovitch back in the twenties, and it's the term is Milankovitch cycles. And the idea is that as the Earth and it's well, the Earth, you know, changes the obliquity, the angle, you know, the tilt axis, you know about precession, the twenty four thousand year.
Cycle, procession of the equinox.
Yeah, right, Earth's eccentricity, it's orbit around the Sun. All these things change and they conspire to change the amount of solar radiation the Earth receives on average, say, over the course of the year. And Milankovitch proposed that it was these changes that caused ice ages. So in other words, when the Earth was not getting as much sunlight, it would cool down and you would get you would get an ice age. And so this is really still the
accepted theory nowadays, although it doesn't really work. And the first chapter in the book, I do a very simple analysis where I take the Melankovitch cycles, which is a function. It's like a bunch of sine waves, you know, you know Sinusoto waves, and you look at the climate cycles like sea level or earth you know, our average temperature, and you try to correlate them. So if the two were related, there would be a correlation, they would sort
of come into alignment. But they don't. And I think there's some very simple arguments that show Malankavage cycles aren't sufficient in themselves to cause the ice ages. And what I talk about in the book is the missing piece, which are the crustal placements.
Mm hmm.
That plus Malakavitch cycles I think can explain ice ages.
Well, give us a little more drilled down on Malakovich's theory, because how does solar radiation affect a planet to the point where they are having these mass freezes?
So so okay, so like right now we got, uh there's like still about two feet of snow outside. There were there were three feet. But if if we cooled down to the point that that snow didn't melt in the spring or even in the summer, you know, it was so cold that you know, it's it's stuck around, and then you know, next year we get more snow
on top of that, et cetera, et cetera. You know, you get a build up, and that's how you know, that's that's why glaciers and uh you know they why they form at high altitudes where it's cold, why they form in the polar zone where it's cold. So it's it's it's that as the Earth's the amount of radiation it gets gets less, these things will start, the snow will start to accumulate, and then as you get more snow, it's more reflective. It's white, so reflects more radiation back
into space, and so the earth cools even more. So it's like a positive feedback thing. And so that that was his theory, that that that explained It was these cycles that explained climate cycles, that they were correlated, but it turns out that they're not correlated. He didn't have access to the to the proxy data we have now uh sea levels, CO two concentration earth temperature, because when you correlate these with the malancaage cycles, they don't correlate.
Even with lags and other things. You know, you can do a very simple analysis, and that's that's always been my approach, to try to take a very simple model and see to what extent it explains or doesn't explain something. And it's called kiss keep it simple, stupid, right, Yeah. I was always taught that in my professional training. As you start with something simple and you see if the basic ideas are sound. If they're not, you know, you
have to move on. And so that's that's kind of what I've done.
Exactly one of the areas that we've talked about before is mass extinctions, and you give some very good examples. One of them is in Mexico where they found in nineteen oh three remains of mastodons. And then we come forward to maybe ten years ago where they were doing some building and they found some more master on any they saw, they found a kill site. What's unusual about this, and I think your your thinking is is that the landm asses moved at some place. And I talked about
this before we started. Were these actions of massive land movements immediate or did did they come in a slow period where we would see willie mammoths uh freezing in this area? How do we because this is like like a real freak action to have these massive landform movements, and it's hard to think of it as in and everyone's read about finding mammoths with green grasses in their gut in the throats. So the land that they were on was much more temperate. But can we explain what
what we is expected? How do we explain this mass landform movement?
Yeah, that that there's a lot to unpack on that question. Uh So, so you know the they they say that if mammoths existed, now they would they would lie within what's called the mammoth step, which is a sort of a temperate zone that runs, you know, over much of the much of the planet. It's in the temperate zone. But what you find are you find mammoth fossils in the in the polar zone in the Arctic, and you know,
they try to explain how that can be. And but now you know with Mexico you find mammoth bones in in a subtropical climate, which is equally hard to explain. So what crustal displacement says is that, Okay, take that that zone which goes from you know, up north to down south. Yeah, if the if the earth poles, if if the if the crust did in fact shipped, where would that zone have been back then? And it would have been in the temperate zone. And so again it's
it's another predictive. You say, Okay, so what can this theory of crustal displacement predict?
Well?
Can it can predict changes in climen zones? And these predictions actually match that match evidence, match data. So so there's that. But I want to address sort of the speed at which these things happen.
That was next point. Yeah, I mean, you know.
It doesn't the Earth. You know, the Earth doesn't turn on a dime. It can't. There's too much it's got too much mass. And and I don't know to what extent, We'll get into this later on, but the whole idea of crustal displacements can be explained in terms of an existing theory called lithospheric drift, and the idea and what that's all about is that the Earth's lithosphere, in other words, the crust is already moving over the mantle. It it moves at a rate of about ten to one hundred
kilometers every million years. Okay, so the Earth's crust is already displacing at a very very slow rate, but over a long period of time. So the I what I talked about in the book is what actually governs the rate at which it shifts, and it's based on what's called the low velocity zone. This is an area between the crusts and the mantle where the Earth where the
crust can slide. And I, you know, I don't want to get deep into this right now, but they basically, if you change the value of the viscosity of that how how you know much it can move. You can actually accelerate the rate of these displacements from a drift to a displacement. And I think the rate, to get to answer your question, is probably on the order of a thousand years for a crustal displacement to occur. So it doesn't happen overnight, happens over a period of time.
So over a period of time, the climate of say Mexico City goes from or went from being tropical to be or i'm sorry, from being temperate sort of the northern temperate zone to being subtropical over a period of about a thousand years. And with animal migrations, if they migrate into you know, these ecological into these biomes that are that get cut off, they could die, they could they could you know, survive for a period of tide,
but then eventually maybe they would freeze. Say so, I think it could explain some of the some of the anomalies. But not having happened overnight, so but you know, years.
There's examples of mammoth frozen almost in place. And and I wonder, because we haven't even brought up flooding yet, if they were caught in a huge flood and then the body is moved to it a more ice centric area and frozen. This is what they're finding in Siberia, is these animals, these plusticcene ice age animals frozen. What's your theory on that.
Yeah, I mean it's possible, you know. They they talk about these massive floods that that happened during the Younger driest and you know, things that that sort of could could you know, could have been responsible. I mean, that's that's going a little bit. It's a little bit out of my depth. You know, I'm not a palaeontologist, and I'm not you know, I'm just I'm just kind of try to identify certain points where you know, you can
begin to start and sort of drill down. I've done a little bit of that in the book, but it's by no means complete. I don't mean, I don't don't.
You tease us out the book. That's what I'm working you over right now. Mark, We're having you extract the uh, the DNA on some of these topics. Talk about the town of Pardon in Mexico, where they found remains of a massive wall and sixty foot deep deposits of human skeletons, and mammoth. I found that just amazing.
Well, we talked about that a year or two ago.
Isn't the same site that we talked about because I don't remember a wall that was uh uh it was it? What was the dating? Did they come up with the carbon date on that?
Uh so let me go, let me go back. What did I write here? I won't be able to find it. But it was the you know, it was that the Mexican anthropologist archaeologist that became head of the the ute What what is it?
I n h.
And it was a it was a report that he'd written. This was before he became head. It was an expedition, I guess. And it was published, but there was no no follow up to it, and he never commented on it or wrote anything further about it, uh, you know,
during his professional career. But you know it was he describes extensive ruins and the interesting thing were the bones of elephants that we were were probably mammoths, which you know again it is sort of supports the Mexico City bindings because it's you know, it's a little bit further north, but same you know, same general area.
Yeah, we're going to take a short commercial break to allow our spot answers to identify themselves, and will return shortly with my guest today, doctor Mark Carlotto, discussing his new book An Inconvenient Theory. Will be right back. My guest today is doctor Mark Carlotto, who is introducing a new book, Well and Inconvenient Theory. This is a look at ancient sites around the world, crustal displacement, and a
number of new theories on ancient civilizations. I remember vaguely that discussion, but I think what you were saying was that because of the extreme age of the location, is that maybe they decided to leave it alone because it brought up too many questions about uh, modern humans or civilized civilized humans at a very early period.
Actually, I think there was even a more practical the person that told me about this, he said that it would be a very dangerous area to to explore because of just just crime and just cartels and so forth in that in that particular, so it was like, from a practical point of view, you wouldn't want to go
down there and poke around too much. Not that it's something that necessarily do anyway, I mean there, you know, you have other people on the show that that you know, they love doing stuff like that, but I mean that would be fertile ground for sure to uh to do some excavation. I mean, based on his findings, Uh, they were quite extensive.
But there are artifacts that were discovered, like like true artifacts, not just uh flint and arrow kind of remains.
Well, he talked you know, he talked about stone walls and you know, massive megalithic structures uh that, but they were deeply buried, so.
You know you'd have to go, yeah, we're gonna we're gonna get into our chaeo astronomy and ancient civilizations here shortly. Uh, you list and show a place in Wyoming called uh a trap cave uh, and there's a number of out of place fossils that that you report on talk about that place. I've never heard of it before.
Yeah, so so actually hap cood. Uh. You know, he wrote a pretty thick book on this, and he had a lot of climate data to support his his uh, you know, his hypothesis at the time. And I actually went back to some of those sources and I found
some additional ones. And what these what some of these starts to talk about is like they in the ground in the different strata, you can record pollen, different kinds of you know, pollen from trees and so forth, and the types of pollen, the types of trees are correlated with your climate, with your climate zone. And these parts of the country, you know, they they never they were
never under the polar ice cap. I mean, they were always you know, they were far enough south that they they weren't in the polar zone during the last ice age, but their climate did change, and they changed in a way in a predictable, in a way that was really consistent with the changes that would have been that would
have occurred had the polls shifted. And so I basically talk about these sites as as sort of you know, proxies measuring different types of information that you can correlate with changes in climate zones, just to provide other points of reference to support, you know, the crustal displacement the changes, because basically, when the crust displaces, the climate zones change.
And so if you can you know, establish some kind of you know, you have some data to support that, it'll support you know, the whole idea of crustal displacement. That's really the that's really the method you know, and the reason why you want to do this.
So it was a pollen, wasn't that he had found other animals that are not unique to that area?
Yeah? No, there there there were, I mean there were you know, habitats changed, right, and there were there were some different different animals and I don't recall what they were, but but you know there I talk about him in the book and have could. Like I said, he goes into more detail on some of these, but I wanted to bring some of them out because again, in terms of the methodology, you want to be able to show correlations things that correlate. Yeah, you know that that doesn't
always imply causality. Things could just sort of randomly correlate. But the more stuff that correlates, the less likely it is that it's happening randomly and it's it and it's you know, and it's just serendipity.
So you know, I wanted to ask you how much help did chat gpt give you on these topics, because you did mention in the very book beginning of the book that you appreciate the help of AI. But I mean I just downloaded Venice and I have been using chat gpt. Did you find it helpful aid or was it more just kind of keeping things grounded for you and using that tool.
So I use chat to get me started so I can go deep in my areas. You know, image processing, you know geospatial analysis, stuff like that. You know statistics more, you know quantitative things. But you know, I don't know a lot about paleontology or anthropology. So if there's a topic that I need to get you know that I need to add that there's some aspect that I need to bring into the argument. I use chat to get me started. Gives me some references you know that I
can go. You know, it's a starting point for me, and so it's really useful in that regard. I don't really trust it though, I mean, it gives you information, but you really got to check it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, which is weird because you think it's like I trust everything AI gives me, but it could be pulling from sources that are not necessarily valid.
Yeah. I think I think there's less of that now than there was a year ago. But it's better a year ago or a couple of years ago. I remember, uh, getting a bunch of site, getting a bunch of references and bibliography, and a lot of them were fictitious. They didn't exist.
When you say fictitious, meaning that they aren't they were made up or really were.
Yeah they were at the time. It's it's it's much better now and the site, the references you get are are are pretty solid, so I do want to say, and it's so it's a very useful tool. It's it's kind of like I kind of think of it like the computer on Star Trek, you know, when they would ask the computer a question and you could you know, and then you can sort of ask it back in these chats so you can say, well, tell me more about this or it's it's a really good thing to
get started. But I mean it can't do your work for you. I mean there are people that try to use it to write books. You know, they don't do anything. It's just like, write me a book about something and it'll do it, but it'll be terrible garbage.
It's terrible. Yeah, I've seen it. It's a good tool though, is a useful tool. Yeah, thank you for that. The The real meat for me on this book is the archaeo astronomy, and you kind of get into the origins of it. I don't think archaeology is using it enough, and I think they've kind of stopped in some ways not taking it further. Talk about your interest in this, because this is where I think you really got something where you're having very early alignments for different North poles.
But what I want to talk to I want you to provide us with an overview of why it's important to study archaeo astronomy when it comes to civilization.
Start there, Okay, there is pretty good evidence that we've ass as human beings, we've always known about the motion
of the sun and the moon. At go Beeckley Tepe, there's evidence that in the alignment of some of these these t pillars that they knew about something called lunar standstills, which is the extreme motion of the moon, which is hard to recognize because it happens over an eighteen point six year period, and it's particularly you know, problematic when you consider the fact that it's assumed that the builders of these places in Turkey were just they were they
were kind of going from being hunter gatherers to farmers, so you know, they didn't really necessarily lead a subtle life, and you have to have a subtle life in order to observe the moon over you know, decades right to be able to understand its motion. But yet these alignments seem to exist, as well as solstice and other alignments in these very early structures. And you find this all. You find this all over the world. There was things
were not aligned randomly. They were aligned purposefully. It could have been astronomically, it could have been in certain sacred directions. It could have been to some you know sometimes but constellations or stars. They you know, that was a theory behind a lot of the temple alignments in Egypt.
But Mark, let me just ask you this, and I'm interrupting you. We don't do this today. No, why would our ancestors feel it so important to and what I mean, I've been to Mexico, you have too. There's entire civic centers that are aligned to star systems. It looks like we don't know for sure that they're aligned to constellations. But why did they place such great emphasis on correct alignment?
Let me get let me give you a visual. Because we're on our phones all the time, we're distracted. The there's a theory that humankind changed around the time of go back as as we came out, As we went from being hunter gatherers to farmers having a more sedentary lifestyle, we started to become focused on things on on the farm,
on the house, on the crops. When you're you know, when you're moving, when you're roaming around you you're not attached, you know, like the native people here in the United States say, they didn't have this concept of ownership of property was something that was foreign to them. They didn't they didn't know what that was. Everything was was was shared,
and so we changed fundamentally. So I don't think we could possibly relate to the motivations of these ancient builders, because I think we've gotten so seduced by by things, by our technology, that we've lost that appreciation and awareness of, you know, our role in it's sort of the bigger picture. I don't know if that's the answer you're looking for, but that's my my, my experiences. That's kind of the way things are headed right now.
You have it's called a section of your book called a global study, where you identify what is recognized as alignments to solstices, alignments to cycles, alignments to each monoxist and so forth. And it just blows me away that there's somebody there to be recognized. Doesn't it make sense that we are not paying attention to a natural part of our sensibilities that may recognize subtle energy from planetary systems like astrology. Astrologers believe that these planets influence us
in certain ways when we're born. I want you just to explain a little bit these influences and why you would build old a temple that has alignments for recognizing these things.
Well, see, you're you're asking me a question that I can't possibly know the answer to. I don't know the motivation. I think, you know, I think that they were definitely more in tune with with nature. Uh for what? For whatever reason? I mean, we could let's let's make a deal. We can speculate about that. But I just, you know, I think you asked these questions that take there's a lot of unpacking. Something I wanted to kind of go back to, which we skipped over, which was why archaeology
doesn't seem to pay much attention to this stuff anymore. No, the whole idea of alignments had in archaeostronomy has become quite diluted. I think in archaeology. What a lot of Egyptologists looking at temple alignments in you know, up in Upper Egypt, they totally because a lot of them are not aligned to solstices, are aligned in known directions. They say, well, they're they're aligning them to the Nile. They do the
same thing in Mexico, Tewakan. Yeah, these other sites, they're they're aligned to the Pleiades or to some mountain range or something or some They make up these explanations. And what's happening in archaeology is is that archaeo astronomy is becoming contextualized, meaning that it cannot stand on its own. It only can be interpreted if they know something about the society in which it's being used, which is kind of like uh, a chicken, chicken or an egg thing.
It's like, you want to use astronomy to gain some insight, but they're saying, well, we already have to know a lot about the society in order to understand how they're using archaeo astronomy. I believe it's fundamental, and I believe because they've in this global study you mentioned, Chris Cliff, you know, I looked at a thousand over a thousand sites and only forty percent of them are aligned in known directions? So what about the other sixty percent? And
we've you know, we've talked about this. These are sites sites you can cannot explain that. It include like Ballbeck, the Western Wall in Jerusalem, all the sacred sites in Peru, in the Sacred Valley, the majority of sites in Mexico.
Why is this? Why is this the case? And this is what Krussel displacement and changing the frame of reference explains that the North Pole when that changes, you know, when it's no longer in this direction but it's in another direction, it rotates everything and suddenly all these unexplained site alignments can be explained. And so if you're willing to say, okay, let's assume that there's another frame of
or other frames of reference. So there was a different frame of reference when the North Pole was in Hudson Bay during the Last is of Age, and a different one before that when it was in the Norwegian Sea, and so on and so forth. You can systematically show how all these sites come into alignment. So that's the fundamental problem. And I think if we I don't know how we can break through this logjam. Without something like this,
I think crustal displacement is a viable hypothesis. It may not be, but at least we need something like it. But if it's true, Okay, it says then that all these other sites we're being aligned astronomically in this way that you're suggesting. And so there's something about us now
that's different from all of our predecessors. Yeah, really lost this appreciation for the Earth and for maybe it's more of a spiritual appreciation of of our environment, of our existence, and we've lost that and it's you know, I think a lot because of our attachment to things, to devices.
Thank you for that, mark, I appreciate that was excellent. I wanted some details. I'm looking right now at your global study and it's double. The unknown alignments are double in number to what we understand. And in the book you do talk a bit about geomagnetic energies and things
like that. It's not a highlight, but I'm fascinated in this and I want you to talk a little bit about an early turn of the century scientists whose name was Tom who does bring that up a little bit when when he starts working at places like Stonehenge and other megalithic sites. He doesn't really talk about geomagnetic energies, but Alexander tom does talk about his belief that there is something to these sites and then we can come forward and talk about more present people. But if we
can't see something, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. And perhaps we need to develop scientific tools and instruments that can measure these energies more effectively, and that may that might be the solution to understanding what these unknown alignments might be. What do you say to that?
Yeah, And you know if you read because in the book before this, which was Beyond Atlantis, I go to twenty or thirty different I go all basically all over the world, and I look to see what's the earliest information on civilizations in that part of the world place, you know, from Peru to the Taklamakan Desert to Japan, you know, all over, and and I find that I
found that reading the earliest sources. Like nowadays, it's like in tech especially you have to have the latest references, but in I think in archaeology and anthropology, the earliest references the books that were written by the early explorers, you know, people like tom people like Pompeli in in in Central Asia. People that went to these sites for the sort of the like the first Westerners right to
have experience these sites, have the most poignant descriptions. They were they were moved by something that was beyond beyond science, beyond you know, architecture and archaeology, and and I think that may have something to do with, you know, with what you're alluding to, and and so, you know, I think going back and having that historical perspective is important, and you know, taking into account with some of these early observers what they saw and and their impressions, particularly
at ball Beck. And then you know this, our friend Marco has written an amazing uh article. It's yeah, it's a small book on ball Beck, and you know, it's I keep seeing more and more things about it. Of course, people are talking about, you know, the stone and the
pregnant woman. Uh, you know, just but it's it's there's so much more to it than that, but there, you know, and some of the early accounts of that site were of these layers upon layers of temples, even you know below the Roman you know, like six or seven layers of temples below the Roman, Yeah, the Temple of Jupiter and even talk now perhaps foundations going down even below what we see going down to bedrock. So this is I would it would be great to get to the bottom.
No pun intended of ball back in some of these other sites. But you know, we're going to.
Take a short commercial break to allow our sponsors to identify themselves, and will return shortly with my guest today, doctor Mark Carlotto, presenting his latest book, An Inconvenient Theory, will be right back with you. My guess today is doctor Mark Carlotto, who has written a new book called An Inconvenient Theory. This is a look at Earth's crustal displacement and how ice ages have been formed and passed
through Earth's geological history for thousands of years. You know, it's funny that you talk about energies and things we can't see. You have a photograph of a the ceiling of Hathor Temple in your book that is a it's the horoscope or the astrological signs of the of the horoscope, and Napoleon's people took it and they moved it to the to the Louver in Paris. I think the Egyptians
have been asking for it back for years. But our ancestors and these early civilizations seem to understand astrology, and today we think of it as a joke. But there's something too the planets and its influence on us. And you made a really good point that we just don't have that sensibility anymore. We are not trained on how to sense and how to feel these energies. And this is why this passage in your book where we have
these unknown alignments really are curious, you know. And I even think that the alignments for the solstices and the what you call zenith passages and lunar stands and things like that are also something that although we can recognize them, there's something missing in our ability to identify them that our ancestors had. And it's not even machineries that are
there are going. I think that we as vessels for the energy, human physiology was able to sense these things, and this is what the builders were following.
Yeah, I think we have all I think we have the DNA to appreciate that and to be at one with that. I think we I mean, we're you know, they say that as human beings, we haven't changed in three hundred thousand years. But I think we've been become covered over with shells, with with you know, layers that block all that stuff out exactly. It's the chatter of just twenty four to seven news and TV and entertainment and yah. And like I said, you know, we've got
to be able to watch something. We can't listen to it anymore. It's got to be you know, we need not just a picture, but the picture's got to be moving, even if it's it's stupid, it's got it's gotta be movies.
Yeah. So it's like, yeah, I want to jump into the early alignments of the North Pole alignments because this is some of your best work. So I wanted to cover some of these early North Poles that you've done an outstanding job of identifying and uh explain the archaeological ramifications of building alignments and what you discovered as in other words, the earliest North Poles and how uh the buildings aligned with them showing the age of that civilization.
So so it was really you, I mean, Hapcod got the ball rolling, so to speak. You know, he had identified three three previous North Poles and then rosen Rand flem app in their book when this When the Sky Fell, I think it was talks about how Tabo Khan appeared to be, you know, roughly aligned with with one of half Good's poles. And so for me that was kind
of the starting point. I kind of worked backwards and I said, okay, if these sites were aligned to the pole sort of by triangulation, if you took their alignments and you drew a circle like a meridian through it, you know, would they intersect? And doing that I was able to refine half Goods polls that actually found another one.
So the ideas is really you know, in reverse, it's really simple when you know, like now the pole is where it is, and you know north is north, and you know the directions are what they are, and the directions the sun rises on the solstice and the moon rises on the standstills. These are all pretty much established, and so sites that have been built over the last you know, say, twenty thousand years since the last pull
shift would be aligned in these directions. And about forty percent of all the sites seem to be aligned in in some some direction some of these directions.
So what we're saying is that these are pyramids, temples, buildings, and in some cases entire cities are aligned to the current North pole.
Yeah, like like the you know, the Pyramid, the Great Pyramid, Great Pyramid, Giza Pyramids and Giza and others in Lower Egypt aligned very precisely to the cardinal directions temples, Like I think it's I always get confused between Karnak and Luxor, but I think it's Karnak is aligned to solstices. You have Stonehenge aligned has alignments to soul and to lunar standstills. This is where you know you mentioned, uh, Alexander tom and and you mentioned and there were others Gerald, Hawkins
and so forth contributed to that. But then you have sites like Ballbeck we were talking about earlier, that have no uh, there's no reason for why it's a line in the direction that it is. It seems it seems arbitrary.
So can you explain real quickly how you made the jump of known times, frag factors and sites and then when you began to look at other sites, all of a sudden they don't follow the path of the current North.
Pole right right, So so so the Yeah, I wish I had had some prepared graphics here, but I can send them to you and we can.
I'll put them on the Facebook page.
Yeah yeah, So, like I said, about forty percent of the sites could be explained. So in looking at the others, it's like, okay, let's do this analysis and see, well, what could they have pointed towards if you were if there was something else, it was some other reference point. And that's actually how I came up with these other poles.
You were based on sort of triangulation. That a whole idea of taking a lot of data and triangulating to locate, you know, where something is, and you know, using mostly sites in uh in Mexico. But you know, in order to do a good job you have to triangulate from different places on Earth. So I had some sites in India and excuse me, and some other places, and so I could sort of take half goods pole location in Hudson Bay and refine it, and I did so, you know,
with all these other sites. So in other words, I would take you start with a bunch of sites. You can explain some with the current pole. Then you take the other and say, okay, well let's see can these predict where another pole was located? And you find that other pole, and that explains say another twenty or twenty five percent of the sites. So now you have sixty
you have sixty percent explained. So you keep going on and you're find different positions, and so with only four previous positions, I could explain pretty much all the other sites.
Okay, let me stop you real quick. Did you develop a software program to do this or did you have to do it manually?
Well? I started doing it manually.
Oh my god.
I was using Google Earth and I would be up at night. I was totally was. I was. I was a crazed lunatic using you know, the ruler tool, drawing lines. And at a certain point it was like, you know, I have to stop this and I have to figure out a better way. And so I wrote a program to do it.
Ah.
Okay, it's actually it's actually it's published. I was published at a difference back in twenty eighteen. It's it's on the for Atlantis the papers there.
Oh, I see, I thought, and we hadn't talked about this before that you had have written this software application for this alignment. Explain to our listeners the I mean, what you're basically saying is there's been crustal displacements for thousands and tens of thousands of years, hundreds hundreds of
thousands of years. Can you go, I think you've identified for Greenland, Hudson Bay, Norwegian, Barian Sea, and galact Oh no, yeah, that's four r. Can you give us the dates of the next of the next group so that we can hear about the significance of the age, because this is what blows me away is the extreme age of these civilizations that we don't recognize.
Okay, Right, So any aligned in known directions would have been built since the last poll shipped around twenty thousand years ago. Right, So that pole the previous poll was in Hudson Bay, and that pole would have been the north pole for Tewa Khan, some some temples in Upper Egypt. And there's bit I talked about in the in the book before that there was a pole in the Norwegian Sea about forty five thousand years ago, and some other sites in Mexico and the Yuka ten appeared to be
aligned to that pole. That's the Norwegian Sea pole.
And that that's that ends at the twenty thousand mark, which is the okay, which is Hudson Bay.
Yeah, so let me, let me I'm going backwards. It's sort of like if you ever tried to do the alphabet backwards. It's true, let me go, let me go the other way. So before one hundred and thirty thousand years ago, the North Pole was in the Bering Sea north of Lucian Islands. So with the pole there, all the sites in the p in Prouves Sacred Sacred Valley
would have been aligned cardinally to that pole. So I'm saying that the earliest sites in the Sacred Valley are one hundred and thirty thousand years ago.
That's Cusco and the Sacred Valley and uh yeah.
Oh yeah, Tambo and does that cover uh does that?
Uh you know, I want to ask you, does that cover Bolivia? And uh Pumu puku.
Uh Punku is probably the Greenland pole which came which would have come next.
I don't want to confuse people, so I'm not going to ask any more questions. You'll want you to.
Get Okay, So one hundred and thirty thousand years ago the oldest stuff, so stuff in Peru Sacred Valley. Also, the Bosnian Pyramid of the Sun is a line in that direction.
Wow.
Yeah, I've had some inches seeing correspondence on that. Then about one hundred and thirty thousand years ago the poll shifted began to shift to Greenland. So and it was, it was in Greenland until about seventy five thousand years ago, and sites a line to Greenland include ball Beeck, the Western Wall in Jerusalem, the Acropolis and Parthon, and Athens, Mexico city itself, the originally the red lay Mexico city around Teplar Mayar. Oh, right, so let's see, so that's too,
seventy five thousand years ago. Seventy five thousand years ago the poll shifted to the Norwegian Sea, which I talked about, and then from there to Hudson Bay and from there to the current Arctic Pole.
That's how how do we get more information on these shifts? Can we use core samples of ice? Can we use core samples of the earth. Is it gonna help to have sedimentary sedimentary layers?
Mm? Hm So so some that information actually in Antarctica was was uh hapgood actually had identified that, and you know it was a whole thing about the ancient the maps of the ancient sea kings. How you know these old maps had renderings of the coastline of Antarctic Antarctica without sea ice and so uh based on core samples. Uh, the I think it's western western Antarctica had was ice free during during the last ice Age, and so this this that you can this this, this is actually verified
in core samples. So yeah, that that information is there, you know, I'm sure you know there's information. Yeah. I mean I can go up on a lot of tangents here. We don't have a lot of time, but there's similar things up. For example, in Greenland, there's evidence that that Greenland itself has been ice covered for well over the last hundred thousand years. Wow.
And yeah, I mean my point is that man has started and stopped, you know, over one hundred and fifty thousand years or more a couple hundred thousand more years, if I'm following you correctly, and you think of and you've know about the Yugas, which is the cyclic start of the Golden Age, and then it gets darker and heavier and bleaker, and then it resurrects itself and goes back.
I just keep wondering, you know, where we begin supporting theories like yours, where we begin finding not just scientific evidence, but the ultimate was would be defined a codex or we'll be able to find some form of carving or something that says, you know, this is the last cycle. What do you say to that it would help you out a lot.
I think, you know, I think spiritual religious texts are an important sort of and as in myth and legend, they're all important sources of information, you know. I think I feel like they're the breadcrumbs that have sort of the key pieces of information that we need to fill in using science. Together. If you combine the two, I think you can get to the answer. I don't think we can get to it just with science. I think science is going to lead us often in its own direction.
And I think we need to bring in, you know, myth legend, some of the spiritual books that talk about you, you know, Yugo's, you know, Veda science in particular. Yep. Yeah, I think it's all It's all important.
I mean, I want to ask you this question, and I think we've talked about it before. Why is archaeology so resistant to uh earlier civilizations existing? I mean you could say easily, well, because we just don't have the artifacts my whole new theory is that a lot of these temples that we see in Egypt and New Mexico were there at those previous periods, but they fell into
disuse and they were discovered. I mean, Robert Schock now has a new theory that a lot of these temples in uh Egypt were discovered by the pre Dynastics and then repurposed. But we don't talk about that if you're an archaeologist, because they just can't see beyond the books that they are taught todhere to.
Yeah, I think it's I think it's part of human nature to uh, to erase the past. You you know, you you take over something, you co opt it, you make it your own, and then it's your own, and you you erase uh any knowledge, whether you do it deliberately or not, but you you know, you were where it's you know, Graham Hancock says that we're the species with amnesia. Well, it's it's it's self induced because of just our human behavior. And I think this is why
archaeologists do what they do. They want, you know, I think that that's part of the reinforcement of this behavior. Whether it's I don't want to get into whether it's subversive or you know, uh, you know, whether it's this un you know, uh, conspiracy or whatever. Its just I think a lot of it's just human nature. We're just part of our DNA is that we're kind of stupid.
Well, we forget things so easily, you know, a decade ago. There's all kinds of data that we just don't remember. We just don't think it's important history. The book's called an Inconvenient Theory. My guess today has been doctor Mark Carlotto. Mark, as we close, what are the signposts of environmental change that you see that you studied to determine when we're going to have another one of these shifts in our in our continental landforms.
So, you know, people would ask me this and I would say, you know, I don't know. But so there is a there is a section in the book where I actually do that. I predict approximately when and where and the next pull shift. You know, it's probably not going to happen anytime soon, probably in the you know,
the next ten thousand years. I forget exactly when, but in terms of where it's likely to take the north pole to uh to uh to move it such that northern Europe gets thrust into the polar zone again, northern Europe and possibly northern Russia and uh in. How I go about determining this is also talked about in the book, because I've developed a model for how it's happened in the past, and you can apply it for how it
will happen in the future. So I can't exactly say when, but I think it would be such that northern Europe would being in the polar age, Europe would have a much colder climate. Northern Europe and Russia would have a much colder climate.
MM. Always fun having you on the program. We could talk for another hour or two on this subject. The book's been out for a while. Give us your website, just yeah.
Go to before Atlantis dot com because that's really there's a lot of information there, a lot probably about how long have they been doing this, eight or nine years. There's a lot of posts, yeah, a lot of articles. Yeah yeah, So you can read about it, and there's links to books if you want to buy books, but you don't have.
To, okay, And do you have a YouTube channel? I can't remember.
Yeah, you know, I started doing that, but you know, I I look at any YouTube videos I made, and they're they're kind of stupid, and so I'd rather just leave that up to you guys. I'm not gonna do it anymore. I'm just gonna I'm just gonna do research and write papers and let other people do YouTube videos.
Okay, So we'll make sure to have you on your best any best, all out? All right? Hey, Mark, thanks again, I really appreciate you being on the program.
Thanks Cliff, Thanks as always.
Marks new books available on Amazon and it's also available on his website before Atlantis, and I don't think he does audible, so I don't know if you could get it in that format. But it's a quick read and it's a good one. He's got a lot of graphs which I will show on the Facebook page. You can check out Facebook go to Earth Ancients and I'll have it on the group and public site to check out. So always good to have Mark on the program. Informative
and great reference material. He does a thorough job with his graphs and his data, so it's good material. Hey, if you're enjoying Earth Ancients Destiny and the Special Edition, please consider becoming a subscriber for as little as five dollars a month. You can support the work we do on these podcasts, and we have bills that they pay. To become a subscriber, go to Patreon that's p A t R e o N dot com Forward Slash Earth
Ancients and subscribe. We've got a whole library of digital books that you can download as our thank you, many of them from well known authors, and that is our gift to you for subscribing. Again, that's Patreon dot com, Forward Slash Earth Ancients. All right, that's it for this program. I want to think my guest today, Mark Carlatto, coming to us from the East coast of the United States. As always, the team of Gueltor, Mark Foster and Feya Pravar.
You guys rock. All right, take care of be well, and we will talk to you next time.