Welcome to Destiny. Now here's your host, Cliff Dunning. I don't know what it is, but it seems like our modern society is out of touch with the cosmos, with the elements, with nature, and we're fighting it. And when we look at our ancestors, and also other communities, other cultures like the Maya and the pre dynastic and dynastic Egyptians, and the early ancient Chinese and other ancient cultures, or they were in harmony with nature and
they lived by the cycles. They built observatories to measure the seasons and look at the earth from an energetic point of view. And I've mentioned this before. It's coming to light that the at least in the Maya civilization, early Maya, they built their cities based on constellations and connections. And we can take that one step further. They actually have bits and pieces of data on
working with star people. Now we know the Hopee and the Zooni through different elders we've had on the program, describe their work, describe communicating and meeting with star people, and it just seems that this was very natural for them to connect with these off world beings because there was a connection an energetic connection that we've lost, and this is what we're dealing with today in our so called modern civilization or modern culture, is a lack of awareness for subtle energy,
for the energetics of the cosmos, constellations, the planets. I mean, we get a little bit of when we talk about astrology and we are walking among these megalists that are aligned with lay lines, geomagnetic t lyric fields that bubble up, and we connect with that. But why are we not having enough connection with UAPs UFOs the beings. Some suspect they are anthropologists who come and visit and view us and land in many places and in very rare
cases leave their ships to come out and meet with humanity. And unfortunately, we're just not getting enough of that because we probably scare the hell out of being that's a thousand or more years in advance of us, because we're dangerous. You know. The Americans are shoot first, ask questions later. This is how they approach the whole ufo phenomena. So how the hell can these
otherworldly beings leave their ships and want to meet with us? We do see this and we hear about it in Central America in some spots in Mexico and in South America. It hasn't been recent, but there's been cases documented of alien ship, alien ships landing, the occupants getting out, greeting the local individual here or there, and in some cases they are invited up into the
ship. Now it's becoming, like I said, very difficult to see this because this attitude of fear and violence against these aliens is very very much in our society. This is what we It's not that what we it's not what we preach, but we have a great fear of this, and we have to get over this. And we've had people on the program that have said, we will eventually get over it, and we will be in a state of mind where we can greet these space brothers, these these people that live
likely on neighboring planets. You know, you know, I wouldn't be surprised if Mars had a community of people. And it's been speculated that under the surface of Mars there is a civilization, so and who knows how sophisticated they are. Another thing that's very interesting, and we've hinted on it is under ocean craft or communities. Under our ocean, there's more water than there is land, and there are documented the events of ships flying out of the water,
ships plunging into the water and going who knows where. This is something to consider. So are they waiting for us to reveal ourselves to be more pleasant and accepting of their being here in their ships? Well, right now it's not happening. We're just not ready for it. So when that day comes, I will rejoice. I will rejoice. My guest today is Micah
Hanks. He is a research investigator who's written a number of books, and he is also the MC for the upcoming Cosmic Summit June fifteenth and sixteenth's going to be held at Greenboro, North Carolina, and this is not to be
missed. We're promoting this event and it's also we're promoting the streaming media so you can hear people like Randallcarlson, Robert Schock, Pravin Mohan, Scott Walter, and on and on and on. They've got a great lineup, and you know, it's really hard to get to these places, but you can now get all the information by going to Cosmicsummit dot com, Forward slash Earth Ancients. So we're gonna learn today about the latest details of the latest governmental
cover up of UAPs. They're alien occupants and some of the latest information. And my guest today is Micah Hanks, and the program is UAPs and First Contact. This is conference season, and of course we are a sponsor of Cosmic Summit, which is coming up June fifteenth and sixteenth, is going to be held in Greensboro, North Carolina. And not only do they have a superior quite a well connected the presenters, it is in a great location and
it is really quite a great deal. If you need more information about that, it's Cosmic Summit dot com Forward slash Earth Ancients. We'll get more into that in a minute. We have the MC for this conference. His name is Micah Hanks, and he is quite a interesting guy. I have to tell you he's written three books. I didn't know this he's noted. Books are The Ghost Rockets, The Complete Guide to Maverick Podcasting, and then Magic Mysticism and The Molecule. But when I have a Micah on the program,
not only to talk about the conference, but he is a ufologist. And whenever I can get somebody on the program who really has been doing deep dives, I do it because I am a bit of an interested individual myself. I'm not a ufologist, but I have had a lot of people on the program and also in conferences around San Francisco Bay area to know what's going on, what's the deal. My big issue is land your craft come out and say hi. But we're going to find out today why. It's not that
simple. So Mike, I welcome to Destiny. Great to see you. It's wonderful to be here. Cliff as always good to see you as well, Sir fantastic. I was looking at your podcast and you are really taking a deep dive into some of the latest and greatest material. What's your interest? Did you have you had a lifelong interest or is it something happened in your life where you said I have to know more about this. Well, I certainly have had a lifelong interest. And the other question everybody always asks
is have you seen one of these objects yourself? Have you seen something in our skies that you can't explain? And I got to tell you, when I was about five years old, I did see a mysterious light in the sky. I was convinced that it was a UFO, and I went to school the next day and I was talking to a friend of my Brandy, and she and I were sitting there, probably you know, working with construction
paper and doing stuff like kindergartner's do. And I said, I think I saw a UFO last night, and she said, oh, no, that was the pizza Huts sign. They were just you know, advertising to get people to come pick up pizza. Now, I asked my mom and dad, I said, did you see that light last it's not and they said, honey, it was an airplane. So in my mind's eye I remember it so vividly, but looking back and reflecting, you know, I agree
with mom and dad it was probably just my young imagination. But the more significant takeaway here is that, I mean, at that age, I knew a what a UFO was. B I was really intrigued about it, and I wanted, you know, to continue to study this, and so naturally I started checking out books from the library things like that. I even wrote a report at one point for the I think I was in third grade at this point, but I wrote a report on this and my teacher gave me
a b and said, you did a great job with the investigation. The problem is, this is a subject that science doesn't really accept as being part of our cumulative knowledge about the universe, and so you know, we're going to say you did a good job on the report, Micah, but we're taking off points for factual merit. And so at that point I kind of
said, challenge accepted, and no kidding. If I have stayed with this subject ever since, and being somebody who studied it for a long time, often trying to look at it with a critical mind and not leading with presumptions about what these things are where they're from, it was a real eye opener, I think for all of us back in twenty seventeen when we saw on the front page of the New York Times this article saying, guess what.
The US Department of Defense has maintained an interest in this, despite what their official statement on that on their website had been for years, and indeed they were continuing to evaluate these phenomena. And that remains true today with the recent establishment of the All Domain Anomaly Resolution Office. So again there's a lot happening in this field, and for someone who has studied this my entire life trying to understand the nuances of it in all aspects of what it could mean,
it's a really exciting time to be involved in this area. Yeah, would you say that the DoD, Department of Defense, and perhaps NASA, which I believe has been weaponized and is also working with the DoD, has greater knowledge than what they're leading on to. I certainly think that the DoD does well. You know, NASA was tasked recently with this this UAP study.
There was a UAP study group, and I think that they, you know, with taxpayer money, did very little more after several months, in about one hundred thousand dollars, they did very little more than just make some recommendations about well, going forward, here are some things we could do to improve UAP research. And NASA also officially designated a director of UAP Research within that
agency. They for years, of course, have said that they don't have any additional information, but that they have resources that might be useful if the DoD is trying to track these things. The DoD, on the other hand, and again there are some who maintain NASA does indeed no more. But I think that it's pretty evident that the intelligence community certainly knows more than what
the public is being told. There are certain things that are being studied right now by the DoD's arrow, as it's called, All Domain Anomaly Resolution Office, that probably are very good indicators that there are genuine unknowns and that this has really been what everybody is suspected for a long time. Unfortunately, they
tend to emphasize the things that they deem to be knowns. You know, they put out a new report, and in every instance the reports that they publish involve the things that they think that they can pretty well explain what they I think in journalism we would call this burying the lead. But I think what they like to state less obviously, is that at least two to five percent of the objects that they've been studying and collecting information about, they have
no idea what these things are. And so in addition to that being a national security concern, but a lot of long time researchers have said, well or not if some of these things might have off planet origins, if these things could be extraterrestrial craft, I mean, how's the DoD going to handle that? And if they make that determination, are they going to come forward and tell the public, Hey, guys, we found something in our sky, and you know, we got to tell you. We think that the
evidence points to these things being extraterrestrial. Can we really expect that they'll tell us that. I'm not so sure. You're familiar with the Brookings document where the military back in the nineteen sixties, I don't even would think through the CIA was around that it had just been launched. But they did this evaluation of the United States citizens and they came to the conclusion that we just can't handle it, that we would kill ourselves, and so forth and so on.
And it feels to me that there's still adherent they're still holding on to that problem given all the social media and the openness that our society is. What is It's a disconnect to me? Does it? Don't you feel like
it's a disconnect? Certainly? Do you know? The Brookings Institute report that you're referring to again basically concluded that without specific reference necessarily to a UFO revelation, they said, if it were learned by the American public or really the entire world, that extraterrestrials existed and that they were coming to planet Earth, that essentially there'd be societal collapse. You know, the major religions would all go to the wayside. It would be quite a system up set and or
reset for team civilization. And I do think that many people still hold that view. I'll tell you an interesting story one of the most recent times. I was visiting the West coast, out in your neck of the woods there, Cliff. I'd been at a wedding and two of the guests and attendants happened to be FBI agents. And so the couple who was getting married good friends of mine. They knew Mike is going to want to talk to these
FBI agents. And dinner they seat me at the table with them, and they were lovely, by the way, and so naturally the conversation veered off in the direction of UFOs and I asked these FBI agents, I said, you know, what's your take on all this? And you know, specifically, how would the bureau respond to this information? In other words, if you had access to information that unequivocally showed that there were extraterrestrial craft operating in
our atmosphere, how would the FBI respond to that? Would you tell the public about that? And I mean there was no hesitation, Cliff. They said absolutely not. They said, our job, You've got to keep in mind, is to know, first of all, protect the little guy. Right, we're tracking down people who are trying to scam people out of money and doing things like this, but we're also trying to preserve the American way
of life. And if ever we were aware of information that might cause severe concerns, distress, breakdowns of societal institutions, no, we would not explain to the public what that was. We would attempt to try and cover that up. So now that was just the opinion of those two agents, But I mean, it seemed to be very much in line with those past studies and some current views that you know, maybe people can't handle the truth.
And you know, I keep hearing that there are officials right now who keep saying that maybe the public, you know, shouldn't know exactly what's going on here. Tim Burchett, who's a representative in Tennessee, and he's a member of the fairly loosely knit group of people congressmen and women that call them sort
of the UAP Caucus. Burchette said that he had actually been approached by somebody up there on Capitol Hill who said, you know, Tim, really the truth is the American people they shouldn't know about this, because if they did, I don't think they'd be able to handle it. People would be losing their minds if they really knew what was going on. I think I'm more like the character played by Tom Cruise in the film A Few Good Men. I think we can handle the truth. But again, you know, a
lot of people seem to think maybe we don't. UAP Caucus in Congress. I haven't heard of them. Were they the ones that formed the committee that interviewed those ex intelligent Was it David Grusher or Grush? Were they part of that team? Yes, So a bit of background on this. Of course, since twenty seventeen, there's been the revelation that the DD has been involved
in investigations into all of this. In twenty twenty, we had the establishment, under the cognizance of the Department of the Navy, the UAP Task Force, and that only operated for a while, but it produced a significant report that was released by the Office of the Director of National Intelligence that said,
yes, there are unknowns that seem to display some pretty extraordinary capabilities. Then at the direction of Congress, because there was actually a bill that was included in the National Defense Authorization Act that was passed, I believe in twenty twenty two. Actually, there have been legislation in several subsequent NDAAs that had been passed over the last few years, but the bill in question is what directed
the establishment of the All Domain Anomaly Resolution Office. Now, last June, there was an article that was published by my team's publication, The Debrief dot or Guy. I'm a co founder and creator of the Debrief, and two authors who had previously written they were actually contributors to the New York Times piece in twenty seventeen, Leslie Kane and Ralph Blumenthal. They authored this piece that we published, and that was the piece that brought to public attention for the
first time the claims of David Grush. Why we thought that was significant was because, in addition to of course the extraordinary nature of the claims he was making, he was saying that there were craft of non human origin that the DoD had in its possession. There had been a Intelligence Community Inspector General complaint and this is absolutely fact. It was officially filed. And when this came
to the attention of members of Congress, indeed they called for hearings. And so yes, the UAP caucus that you were asking about, they rather quickly assembled a congressional hearing in which mister Grush and then also two former Navy pilots,
Dave Fraver and Ryan Graves. They all gave testimony under oath, stating not only that they had had these past experiences, as you know members of military, but also that the intelligence official present, mister Grush, had said, Yeah, I provided hundreds of pages of classified information to the intelligence community spector General that seems to support the idea that there is some kind of a
program and that the US has been collecting these craft. Yeah, and it was pretty groundbreaking what Grish had to say, simply because he's in the intelligence community. But I didn't feel that there was anything that came out of that. I mean, Congress moves very slowly, and it wasn't I wasn't feeling like, you know, what's the follow up. I didn't hear any of the congressmen and women say, Okay, we're gonna take this and we're going
to create another committee. We're gonna determine who these dark programs are, who's behind them? What do you have to say? What's your feeling on any follow up to that interview with Groose? So you're asking a really good question, Cliff, because the problem is the official office tasked with investigating UAP was also tasked with conducting a historical review, and so exactly what you're asking is what many people have been saying recently. It would really appropriately require a congressional
investigation to probably get to the bottom of what's going on. That has not happened yet. What ended up happening was a subordinate office, the ARROW that I've talked about, the altomin and Homaly Resolution Office, which has supposedly access to all information on UAP. Again, UAP is just the new term for UFOs that means unidentified anomalist phenomena. But when I say UAP or UFO were essentially talking about the same thing, and that's what the ded's been investigating.
When AERO was launched, they were tasked with conducting a historical review going all the way back to nineteen forty five to try and determine if there was evidence of a program like what David Grush has discussed. And the problem with their report which just came out the first volume. At least there is going to be a second volume issued probably later this year, if not early next year.
But the first volume was rife with errors. I mean, just to give you a few examples of some of the problems that we were seeing in this report. The first mainstream significant UFO siding by Pilot Kenneth Arnold back in nineteen forty seven. The date that they given the report, they're off by a day. They misstate the name of a program that was carried out by the Betel Memorial Institute to investigate the US Air Forces Project Blue Book cases that
were collected early on at the name of that program wrong. They got the name of one of the former directors of Project blue Book wrong. And there were myriad other issues in the report too. In fact, a former defense official, Christopher Mellen, authored a very lengthy article kind of going down very granular analysis that he did of all the problems in this report, and he
published that over at the debrief Our website. And so a lot of people have taken issue with this investigation, and they have further said, look, if Aero, I mean, did such a lackluster job on this historical report, I mean, how much faith can we really have in their broader investigations. So again to your point, many are saying, now appropriately Congress should
investigate this. They shouldn't leave this to an office that has already demonstrated that they aren't doing the best job that they possibly could investigating this, and thereby we can't really have a whole lot of faith in their ability to convey the meaningful information that the government may possess. I think it really will ultimately be up to Congress. I mean, were you happy on that congressional meeting with Grush? I mean, it was kind of an eye opener for many people.
But being an ufologist being in this, I know that I thought it was a nice start, but as you said, it could be buried almost instantly. If not currently, you know, we'll never hear any follow up again. Yeah, I think that again, it was a good beginning point because what we had there were some very extraordinary assertions made by mister Grush,
namely that indeed non human intelligences. He felt that there was good evidence that supported their existence and also an awareness by the God of their existence, and
he said this under oath. And I think that there's been a lot of confusion because there was a recent series of email communications between AERO leadership and the whistleblower, mister Grush that were released through a Freedom of Information Act request that was, you know, the documents were sent to a On Greenwald of the Black Vault, who's kind of legendary in terms of his investigations into this.
But these correspondences showed that Grush, after that congressional hearing, had been reached out to by AERO leadership numerous times and they tried to get him to come in and to do an interview and talk about what he found. Now, what he conveys in those emails, Cliff, is that he had serious concerns about whether ARO had the authorities that they needed to be able to receive this
classified information. And although they've tried to make it look like, well, he wouldn't come talk to us, so in truth, it seems like he doesn't you know, probably know anything, and he doesn't want to convey this information. Quite the contrary what these emails show, and this is exactly what
came out during those congressional hearings. To your question, Grush had said numerous times to members of Congress, Listen, I'll talk with you about this in a controlled in a you know, a skiff, right, a secure compartmented information facility. Right. He's saying, if we are in an appropriate environment, I can tell you certain things. I can't talk about that in a
public hearing being telecast across the world. And furthermore, to the Arrow instigators who kept saying, come talk to us, Come tell us what you know, he said, look, I need to know if you guys have the authority who received this information. The official terminology for this would be what's called Title fifty. It would essentially enable ERO to be able to obtain information that would be you know, for instance, from IC Intelligence community officials and what
have you. Now, AERO has repeatedly said that they have access to all the UAP information, so there shouldn't be a problem. But Gresh said, the problem is that there are other elements of this program that are not necessarily relative relative exclusivity exclusively to UAP, And you guys don't have the authority to be able to receive this classified information. I can't come talk to you. So he said, go to the Inspector General, see if they'll just give
you a copy of my complaint. And they wouldn't, which seems to suggest, indeed, that there were things in that complaint that AERO did not have the authority to receive, and so to me again it comes back to the question of, well, we've got a good start with Congress, but they're going to have to follow up on this, and there's going to have to be some kind of a formal investigation if we ever really want to get the bottom of this. I would love a non military committee to be formed with
perhaps scientists and anthropologists or other people who are studying different species. I think it would get more data. I think it would be a much better broader swipe at the whole phenomenon. What do you believe was the purpose of rebranding UFO to UAP And my thought initially was that they wanted to discover who the beans were that were operating these craft. Now I don't think it's that. I think it's more they're interested because there's a military view. They're more interested
in the propulsion systems and the technology. But what's your take on the rebranding. I think you're you're actually pretty spot on there, because when we go back to around two thousand and eight to twenty ten or so, when the original iteration of this program, what you might call the revitalization of the government's interest in this was running That program was called the Advanced Aerospace Weapons Systems Application
Program. It was run out of the Defense Intelligence Agency, which is a combat support agency of the DoD and the DIA essentially housed that program for two years. The people who were running that admittedly, and I've spoken to the deputy director of that program, Cullam kellerher PhD. He was previously associated with a civilian scientific organization called the National Institute for Discovery Science that was headed up
by Robert Bigelow, the real estate mogul out there in Nevada. Bob Bigelow was friends with former Senator, the late Senator Harry Reid Right, and it was with Reed's help and two other members of the Senate that they were able to appropriate some congressional funding where were some taxpayer dollars that was put toward the
funding of the ALLSET program. Now, those people who were running that, with their long history in this of involvement in this topic, like you said, they were certainly coming at this saying, Okay, we know that there are unknowns. We've studied these things for years. We don't dispute that. So what we're going to do is we're going to build a database Jacques Valet, in fact, who also lived right there in your general area on the
West coast. Doctor Valet's probably been involved in this as long or longer than most. He was the one tasked with the creation of this database, which they called Capella. And so indeed, one of the criticisms from some of the current DoD officials involved in the current investigation is, well, these people are longtime UFO believers, and they did probably think these things were all from off planet, and so they were biased in how they were looking at this.
But in truth, part of the whole focus of the OFFSET program had been really to evaluate evaluate what these technologies were, how they worked, you know, what kinds of technologies could potentially be derived from studying this, And
that was the way that they justified this being a DIA program. They essentially said, the DOOD is going to want to be able to understand what these capabilities are so that we might be able to exploit this, and we may be able to prepare ourselves in the event that these things ever end up showing hostility or anything along those lines. So even early on they had had an interest in that component of it. But right now I would say that it's
exclusively just okay, there are unknowns. We have no evidence of extraterrestrial technology. What we want to try and do is make sure that China or Russia
hasn't got some advanced capability and they're using that to spy on us. But again, most who are looking at this saying, if there is anything that advanced that the DoD with all the sensor capabilities, all the intelligence capabilities, you know, all the advanced weapons systems, all the fighter aircraft, all the visualization capabilities in infrared, you know it enhanced electro optical visual systems, all this stuff that the military has. If anybody else in the world has
something that exceeds that, we've got a real problem. But the likelihood of that is almost nil. So, I mean, the problem, Micah, with this whole mindset is that it's all like that we had to be first in a alert. We don't want them to shoot at us. It's like that the presumption is that they're going to hurt us in some manner. So we got to defend ourselves. We got to get weaponry up, we got to take those down ships, and we got to create a weapon system that
will you know, blow them out. Of the sky. It's like shoot first and ask questions later. It's like, that's an ass backwards philosophy, don't you they I agree, Yeah, absolutely. I mean, first of all, let me just say that as a person who has studied the major literature related to this subject, both from official channels and also from civilian researchers who have you know, chronicled this over the years, there's very little evidence
that there is a direct threat being posed by the so called UAP. Thank you, thank you for that. Yeah, the question had been the question you had asked earlier, was you know, why rebranded, why give it a new name. It is true that the DoD is looking at all potentials. I mean, there are some unknowns. There are some things they think that may point to, you know, foreign intelligence collection efforts. There may be some natural FINNA and so UAP or what it initially was was unidentified aerial
phenomena but now unidentified anomalist phenomena. It was meant to be kind of a larger umbrella or blanket term to encapsulate all these potentials. But again, the ones I think that interest us are the so called UFOs, the genuine unknowns. And again back to my earlier point. You look at the broad data
that's been collected about this, and sure there are some injury cases. There are some incidents where people, for instance, have been in close proximity to an exotic vehicle and they may have suffered the after effects of what could be exposure to nonionizing radiation. Yeah, things like that, but those are usual we call indirect incidents. In other words, this was an indirect means by which these people were injured. It wasn't like a laser beam that shot out
and injured somebody as if by intent. Now it's not to say it's never happened. There are some rare cases in the literature there are suggestive of intent, But again I would say that the majority of it suggests that this is probably a phenomena that is operating for some reason. We don't understand its intentions or reasoning, but it is attempting to do so without having to interact with us as much as possible. They try to kind of keep us at arms
distance if anything. Yeah, you know, to that point, everybody in the industry or who's interested in UFO knows about Bob Bazar, the physicist who makes this amazing claim of this location in Nevada called Area fifty one, and apparently we have five or six different downcraft that we're revers trying to reverse engineer. And he talks about trying to reverse what he thinks is some kind of a power system and that he got out of there before the thing blew up
and killed a bunch of people. But it makes me suspicious if the military has gone far enough and has actually created reverse engineered craft based on this advanced technology. Are we confusing these craft aft with the UAPs that are in the air right now? Also a good question. And you know, there were
some other whistleblowers other than Grush that came out last summer. In fact, the same week that mister Grush first came to public knowledge, we dropped the article on Monday, I believe June the fifth, there at the debrief dot Org. And then just a few days later there was a lengthy interview that
journalist Ross Cooltark conducted with him on News Nation. But in the days in between those two appearances by mister Grush, we also had an event in Washington where three other whistleblowers came forward and they also shared their own perspectives on government involvement, and one of those individuals I believe his name is Michael Herrera. He tells a very interesting and I would say a rather concerning story. He
was I believe in Sumatra back in the early two thousands. This was part of a military relief effort following the tsunami that it struck that region around that time. And as he tells the story, he and his company come up over hill and they see essentially what was like a kind of a large pyramidal or maybe what we would kind of like into a saucer shaped craft, and it's hovering over the ground. And he looks at this thing and they're going, wow, you know, what is that? And so he has a
camera and he pulls it out and starts filming it. And then he says that all of a sudden, out of the surrounding brush black ops guys, you know, guys in black military fatigues. They are unequivocally American. They have American accents, but they are arms to the teeth. They basically pulled
them at gunpoint and they take their weapons, they scan their identification. He says that they're kind of rough talking him and his company and everything, and Eventually they go from thinking that they're probably you know, their days are numbered and that they may be in serious danger to being released walk to the top of the hill and to turn around, leave and don't come back. And
so he and his company are released. A few days later, his camera is confiscated and he comes forward to tell this story because he said, these guys were loading you know, they had like pallettes and things and some military vehicles, and they were loading something onto this craft, this highly anomalous craft that he said as it left, it lifted off and then just kind of hovered and PAM just takes off in a blink. And so he says,
it seems pretty clear that some of this technology is ours. And interestingly, in the aero historical report that I mentioned earlier, Cliff, they absolutely say, you know, one individual claims that he saw Black ops personnel loading something into a UAP. So, I mean, Herrera's case is clearly listed in Arrow's appendix, and they obviously had interviewed him and spoken to him, and he was you know, deemed I guess, a credible witness and certainly a
former military official whose credentials can be verified. So if his story is indeed true and accurate as he has told this. Now in many instances, it seems pretty clear that some of this technology does belong to us. Now the question is did we just cook that up out of no where and we just created this stuff? Or is this the result of as Bob Lazar and some others have claimed. And again this doesn't necessarily verify what Bob Lazar says.
I know his claims are still kind of controversial, but what he had been saying for years is, you know, we have been reverse engineering things there and ask for this facility on the Area fifty one property, and he believes that some of our technologies have been derived from the so called NHI or anomaloust aerial vehicles. We've got to get a short commercial break to allow our sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly with my guest today, Micah
Hanks, coming to us from North Carolina. We'll be right back. My guest today is Micah Hanks. He is a research investigator and author who has a good focus on what is happening in the UFO alien genre that is really a great curiosity to many of us. We're getting a sense of just what's
going on in the world of unusual anomalists aerial phenomenon. Talk a little bit about your knowledge of Phil Corso because his book The Day After Roswell is a classic, and he basically says that most of our innovations come from down UFOs and are reverse engineering of that technology. A lot of people thought that Corso was a kook, but if you look at his credentials, he was fairly up there as an intelligence officer and had access to possible downcraft. What do
you feel about that? You can't call him a koop, that's for sure. I mean, his background is absolutely well known and certainly verified. I
mean, Philip Corso is an individual who certainly served. The story he tells in the book that came out, you know, co authored with William Burns, The Day After Roswell essentially says that while he was working with the Foreign Technology Division Right Patterson Air Force BACE that has a new name at this point, but at that time, essentially they would have collected and analyzed and potentially
reverse engineered any kind of foreign technologies that were acquired. This mostly presumably having relationship to the Soviet Union or other nations who are operating you know, aerospace capabilities and things. But what Corso claimed was that he was brought some of these technologies that he said came directly from the Roswell crash of nineteen forty seven.
Some of the examples of the technology that he described had been what we would like him being fiber opts today, fiber optics, yes, yeah. Kevlar was another one. He said that there was sort of like a like a headband or something along those lines that they also had. There was a little device that he said, we would liken it to like a laser pointer, and he said that for a long time they tried to figure out how it worked, and then they realized that this was a laser cutting device.
So he he says again again according to his claims, which have remained very controversial, but he never ever before his death, and again he died shortly after the publications, which is also kind of part of what makes this so
enigmatic. But he never stepped back from his claims. He maintained that he had had access to these technologies and that the idea had been that they were going to be quietly seeded into US industry so that there could be technological developments that the United States could make as opposed to our enemies, and this was a way to be able to get the information out and ensure that there would be public benefit from the you know, any technologies derived from the NHI technology.
Now, there are a lot of different interpretations of what was going on. There was mister Corso completely delusional. Now, look, Bliff, I've sat and I've watched interview after interview with him, And there was also a lesser known document that he wrote which was not co authored with someone else, and it's available in its entirety online where he kind of further expounds on what he thinks the real overarching truth of all this stuff is and what the government's
relationship to it is. My take on Corso is it's one of two things. Either he's completely telling the truth or there is a possibility, and this is one that we have to consider. There is a possibility that this was a very elaborate form of disinformation, because there is precedent for US government officials who have come forward presenting false information so as to steer a certain kind of a narrative. Now I don't claim to know which it is. I'm just
saying that those are the two. Well, I'm gonna ask Himikah, right now, what do you feel? I mean? Because if you went one step further than a lot of us. I saw one or two video interviews of Courso, but they were more vague, and you're suggesting there were maybe some more that had greater detail. Yeah, there are a lot of interviews that he gave. One, for instance, very interesting where he spoke with Bud Hopkins the la I love Bud. I know Bud. Yeah, his
past of course, but famous book he wrote, Intruders. Yeah, Bud had sat there in kind of grilled course. So there was another interview that I believe was made available online. You can find it on archive dot org, made available by doctor Stephen Greer of the Disclosure Project. As far as what I feel, this is a tricky one for me because I think I went into it really feeling like, in likelihood, Corso was telling a story that seemed extraordinary, but it was so detailed that there had to be some
element of truth to it. But there are some interesting conjectures that have been raised. For instance, a colleague of mine, Nick Redfern, wrote a very controversial book a number of years ago called Body Snatchers. In the desert, and he offers an alternative hypothesis for what may have happened at Roswell. In that book, he points out some very interesting connections between Philip Corso and other government officials that again, according to Nick, he would tell you it's
probable that Corso was involved in some kind of a disinformation effort. Now, the broader takeaway from me from all that though, would be this, it becomes very difficult for us to know at times what is true and what is
not because the government has not been true and forthcoming. We wouldn't even have a debate or have to have one about Courso or anybody else if there hadn't been instances with the government has lied to us about these things where for instance, Air Force Office of Special Investigation agents have leaked bad documents, they have misinformed people, they've made bogus promises and then reneged on those later, and
they've really made it difficult for UFO researchers to trust their government. So again, the bottom line and the real broad question for me is how do we know what we can actually take seriously? How do we know who we can trust when the government has lied to us time and time again. Yeah, and of course, of course Will being ex military, it's kind of in
his DNA a little bit, so it's kind of sad. One of the fascinating aspects of bazaars, so called visual inspection of various down craft that were in area fifty one hangars, is one specific craft that he and this is very interesting. I want to hear your take on it. He said that one of the crafts had been excavated from a very old site and he used, I believe he used, tens of thousands of years old, was the guests, because of the surrounding area that was in the age of the rocks,
and maybe there's some artifacts and things like that. It really shows us, if this is true, that we've been inspected or visited for thousands of years. And God, I'd love to see that craft because to make that assumption, obviously he was told this that it was an ancient craft, but to get a sense of what it looked like would just be I don't blow the doors off of everything. What do you think about that? I mean, listen, there's a very good possibility that if indeed some of the UFOs
are indeed off world technology. I mean, the implication would be if they are so advanced that they would have to have been around for far longer than we are, and that they are far ahead of us in every way. And if that's the case, they probably have been around longer than we have
been. And if that's the case, we could infer that perhaps Earth has had a much longer relationship with these phenomena, and that past observations by people of you know, luminous phenomenon, especially in the in the period before our own space program, and when we start putting objects into space that you know, again, even today some people may unknowingly misinterpret as being UFOs satellites, you know, things like that. Back before we had put those things in
space, people were still describing very unusual events in our skies. And these things have been again documented in the historical records. So there are some researchers who have looked back in time again the aforementioned Jacques Valet, his colleague, Chris Albeck, many others. Martin Show, I've done a little of this myself. But even the late NASA historian, oh gosh, what was his
name, He authored a really interesting paper on UFOs in antiquity. But there are a lot of researchers who have conducted investigations into whether we can harvest information about UFO sidings going much further back now. My take on it would be, again, if these phenomena are something that are off planet, they are not from here. It's certainly possible that they've been around longer, and therefore mister Lazar's claims of very interesting. I mean a lot of people have dismissed
them out of hand entirely. I don't. I have questions, but again, one thing we also have to recognize is I've probably gone back and listened to almost every interview that he has given since he initially came forward to investigative reporter George Knapp there at Klas and Las Vegas, and the remarkable consistency of the way he tells his story. Some would say that there are some minor deviations and things I think that would be expected with time, but for the
most part, the core story really remains very consistent. And so if he's a liar, he's a good on you. But that story he tells about this archaeological excavation, yeah, that's definitely interesting, and again I think that would be consistent with the view that these technologies that they've been around for a long time in are foreign advance of us. That these things have probably been here on Earth for various reasons for a long time, and people have certainly
been seeing them. Yeah, I think the biggest problem, and it's really a challenge, is that we can only speculate. There's so very little data. Lazaar is a rare case, but we know now that he's been hiding, he's been traumatized, and you know, he's probably had stunted emotional growth because he's looking over his shoulder all the time, you know, not knowing what's going to come to him next. Hey, I want to move on with a podcast you did called Project Moondust, the Secret Retrieval Program. This
is fascinating. I didn't get a chance to hear the whole podcast, but talk a little bit about that. That's fascinating. Well, certainly, I mean back in the Cold War, the US Air Force certainly did have the capability of being able to acquire anything that may have fallen from space, you know, anything that lands in US airspace. And actually, and to an extent, they were able to obtain things that had fallen from space in other
countries too. We have begun to hear about a couple of different programs getting back in the early days of the Freedom of Information Act, and that would have been back in the nineteen seventies researchers like Barry Greenwood and others who had been involved with a really neat organization back then called Cause or the Citizens Against
UFO Secrecy. I always loved that name. They were essentially legal scholars, people who were using the Freedom of Information Act, former NSA employees, constitutional lawyers, things like that. Longtime UFO researchers too, But they were using the Foyer request process to try and file requests to obtain government documents about UFOs, and they began to obtain some documents that made references to programs, including
Project Moondust. As you mentioned, there was another one to an adjacent program called Project blue Fly, and eventually it was confirmed to a researcher named Robert Todd I think maybe a decade later in the mid nineteen eighties, that indeed there had been such a program, but that effectively what had happened was that after these Foyer releases and after the name of the program was compromised, it ended up being moved into another agency at Apartment and it was given a different
name. Now I've also gotten some additional information recently that states that blue Fly would have really kind of been a code word for a kind of operation, rather than being any explicit program, although again it seemed to be inferred in the information that was provided to Robert Todd back in nineteen eighty six. I
believe that this was a program, and it effectively acted like one. What I find really interesting, though, is that in certain documentation that describes the operations of whatever operation Moondust would have entailed, they certainly say that they were aiming to acquire any kind of Soviet technology that fell from space, but that essentially any kind of UFOs, right, any kind of UFO technology, and again that could also entail a Soviet technology hypothetically, but they said that they
essentially would be acquiring these technologies whatever they were, if they fell on US soil. The reason I think that's interesting is because there's obvious relevance between Moondust, blue Fly and the UFO phenomenon. And yet again in the recent historical report that was produced by the dods Arrow there's no mention of Moondust or blue Fly. They mentioned everything from the Manhattan Project to all these other programs that really, in truth, have very little to any relevance at all to UFOs.
But they don't bring up Moondust and they don't bring up blue Fly. And I found that to be yet again one of the criticisms I would have with Arrow's current investigation. It didn't seem like they went deeply enough. They leave it up to you know, civilian historical researchers like myself and others to have to bring all these things to public light. And there's you know,
been a lot of other people who have commented on these programs too. There was an entire book titled Project Moondust written by researcher Kevin Randall, who again isn't just a long time really a legendary researcher himself. So again it's it's unfortunate that it's left to the civilian sector to have to do this historical research. The government doesn't seem to really have very much interest in kind of, you know, digging into these things and understanding the full scope of what all
these programs were and what they did. Are you suggesting that Project Moondust is done with that? It doesn't function anymore. Or and the other thing. A second question is the name said implies the moon, the lunar surface, So does that have anything to do with the moon or is that just part of a title. Yeah, I think it's just a code name. I
don't think that there is a Project Moondust by today's standards. I would say though, that if indeed what Robert Todd was told back in the eighties is accurate, that some kind of a similar program or initiative probably has continued. And it doesn't it's no longer called Moondust, And I would have to imagine that given all the current threats that we have with you know, China, with Russia again, that's to me where the quote unquote threat comes from quote
unquote UAP, not from the actual unknowns. And if indeed there's a potential that there are any kind of threatening surveillance systems, weapons systems, hypersonics, you know, any of these kind of things that are being developed by the world militaries, if there's a potential that those might be used against the US, or that we at some point may acquire one again, Project Moondust's stated objective was the acquisition of Soviet technologies during the Cold War, there would have
to be some equivalent still extant today. There'd have to be We don't have a lot of time, but I just want to cross you with a few or suggest a few themes and see what you have to say. I'm a big advocate of ancient civilizations on Mars. We've had some of the top people from doctor John Brandenburgh to Mark Carlotto and all threw down the line. Even Richard Hoglan at one point, who wrote a fabulous book called The Monuments of
Mars. And or NASA keeps throwing these drones and these rovers to pick up microbes and things like that. And I keep joking to my listeners and say, in one of these days, they're going to bump into the staircase of a temple looking for microbes, but they'll turn the camera away from it. What's gonna happen when the Chinese or SpaceX get there and they put boots on the ground and they begin seeing the stuff. Because it's not just Sidonia we're
talking about, which is where the face is located. It's scattered everywhere. And if the Chinese get an orbiter on there and they land either a human team or even a rover and start serveying Mars. The couts out of the bag. Yeah. Well, so again, there's a lot of really interesting imagery online that seems to show what appear to be structured objects on the surface surface of Mars. And of course, like you mentioned the famous you know,
implications about Sidonia, things along those lines. Even look at for instance, I think that there's this monolithic structure. Again, whether or not it's natural, don't know, but there is clearly something very large that casts a lengthy shadow I believe on the Martian moon. Phobos are a lot of There
are a lot of Martian anomalies and lunar anomalies. Now what I will say about those is this, there are a growing number of scientists who are not people who have been what we would call, you know, alternative theorists and things along those lines, scientists who are saying that we should use machine learning to try and discern whether or not there are you know, again, actual structured technological artifacts that could be found not only on Mars, butok, perhaps
on the Moon. I would think that most of the modern researchers who are becoming proponents of this, who for a long time probably would not have been. I think they're seeing some of the developments in the UAP area and they're saying, huh okay, maybe it seems like there's something here, But they also are looking at how you know, I mean, the most distant space
object built by humans that we know of today is Voyager one. It's about fifteen billion miles away and it takes two days for us to get radio communications to it and then back, and it went offline last November. But we were able to engineer a way that we can now get you again at least communications health status updates from the thing. We haven't got usable science yet,
but we're working toward that point. And this is with like i mean, decades old computer technology, kind of fascinating, But a lot of researchers are saying, well, listen, we send out probes into interstellar space like Voyager, surely other intelligences would do the same thing. And if one ever made its way into our planetary neighborhood, you know, it might have burnt up if it entered Earth's atmosphere. But if it happened to be caught by the
great big catchers met in the sky, I e. The Moon. You know, it may have come to rest on the lunar surface, and it could be that either on the Moon or maybe on Mars. Maybe one day we will find some evidence of another advanced civilization, whether or not they had
come from that location, their technology may have made its way there. So to your point, Cliff, I mean, can we risk the opportunity loss of another nation getting up there and finding that technology first, which, ultimately, for all we know, may end up being how we confirm that. Indeed, there are other intelligences out there say it's incumbent upon us to get
up there and start doing some serious research. And again this is part of why we are aiming in the next few decades to get people up their boots on the ground on Mars. But really I would hope that with the Artemis missions and things forthcoming in the next few decades that we could be doing more of that on the Moon. Who knows what we are yet to find up there. We had an Artemous space engineer aerospace engineer on the program a couple
of weeks ago, and she was refreshingly blunt about UFO contacts. In fact, she said that there is a documentation you probably already know this, but from the very beginning, all the way back to Mercury missions that these liftoff areas had craft all around them and that it is well known within the community, but the public doesn't know about it because they don't want to freak people out. So as we conclude, Micah, what do you think is going
to be the reaction to the first contact? What can we base the current Earth humans reaction to the knowledge that hey, you're not alone. We're not alone anymore, We're part of a collective in our cosmos from planet wherever, planet X or whatever. Yeah, well, I think that's a great question. First of all, I attended a scientific symposium last fall that was put
on by a new organization called the Soul Foundation. This launched by professors Peter Skayfish and Gary Nolan, And I mean, this was an academic symposium at Stanford University, and I have to say that it was kind of a who's who of this field of research, and it was really fascinating to see all
these people together at Stanford University talking about this. But one of the themes of that conference had been this idea of you know, how do we sort of soften the blow for when this information comes out, Because the military seems to be a tempting right now to evaluate a phenomenon. Some would say that the intelligence community components may already have a whole lot of information and that's the kind of stuff like you're alluding to that we don't want to get out.
But in any case, it may be up to academic researchers to start kind of promoting the idea that hey, look, there's a reality here, so that maybe by the time this information does come out of government, rather than people going, oh my god, you mean this stuff's true, they kind of respond and say, well, I sort of suspected there was something going on, and maybe indeed people at that point will truly be able to handle
the truth. I hope they will. I think we can. I think that humans tend to unite when we are faced with incredible revelations and sometimes threats. I don't think that there's as much of a threat to concern, just as there is ontological shock to the realization that we may not be alone in
the universe. But I think we can handle it. Is the Soul Foundation designed to begin releasing more data and making it a little of a soft land more of a soft landing to this content, I would say that as opposed to releasing information, because they aren't an official government organization, they are essentially a group of academics who are attempting to try and provide policy guidance and other information, academic research and studies, white papers, things along those lines.
They certainly do want to try and soften the blows, so to speak. In fact, one of the speakers at the event was the former Army Colonel Carl Nell, who had been the liaison to the UAP Task Force, and
I met and spoke with Carl Nill there. Carl gave an interesting conversation or presentation rather on what he called catastrophic disclosure, In other words, what would happen if another nation releases all this information before the US does, And the implications seemed to be coming from Carl's perspective that he was pretty confident, as a former military official with the United States Army, that there is a there
there that we do have information about these acquisitions, these NHI craft that David Grust, the whistlebower, came forward and talked about, and that he felt that it was incumbent upon us to have a plan for the release that information. So the Sole Foundation I think works in the furtherance of that objective, but they are not the ones releasing this information, although there are some former
government officials who are advisors who work with them. I would hope that something like the Soul Foundation would be a strong advisor on how to begin releasing the data to the public in a more general fashion. I mean, if you're going to go to the theologians of the world and ask them what their reaction, which is what the reaction was, and which is what NASA did a
couple of years ago, that's the wrong people to go after. We have a huge social media infrastructure in our country that is literally living and communicating about these things. Ask them, survey them, see what they say. They're going to get a whole different narrative about the United States public, don't you think. Oh? Certainly. And again it really has to be on all fronts. The Sole Foundation is also where with theologians and with religious studies,
you know, scholars like Diana Walsh, Basulka and others. But then there
are also the military officials. Then there are also the anthropologists like doctor Scayfish, who I've you know, Yeah, Lee, I've had numerous, really really i think, very rewarding conversations with him at the event and since, and again I think that everything I've seen from those individuals seems to indicate that they have the right idea that they are attempting to try and raise the bar on how we discuss this topic, but with the objective of when the information
eventually comes out, you know, we want to try and hope to present this in a in a logical way and in a way that humans, people really all around the world can deal with. Wow. Amazing, Michah Hanks, thank you, You've been very insightful on the material. Let's talk a little bit about the Cosmic Summit. You are there, it's going to be June fifteenth and sixteenth. What are you talking on? What's your topic about? Well as the evidenced or is evidenced by this conversation, you can imagine
my good pal George Howard, who's putting on the conference. I've known George for many years, you know, he and I have actually been out there in the field together and done some research. He in the Seven Ages team and I George always wants me to give a UAP update, but He also approached me recently and said, you know, Mike, I wondered we were on a video call, and he kind of almost sheepishly said, is there
any way that you'd also mc part of this for us? And I said, of course, said George is just delightful and again a good friend of many years. So Johanna and I will also be working in that capacity. But I believe she gave a lecture last year, probably will this year. I will certainly be giving a UAP update, and there's going to be a lot going on at the event against some excellent speakers, and I always look forward to this again, everything from you know, ancient archaeology to you know,
megafinal extinctions, that ever fascinating topic. Go back, Lee Tapy. I'm sure we'll come up and also other perspectives on both the ancient past but also how that applies to life today. So again, the Cosmic Summit this June fifteenth and sixteenth in beautiful Greensboro, North Carolina, not very far from me. I'm looking forward to getting down there, and Cliff, we've got to get you out there one year too, Okay, I can't get there.
I'm going to hopefully get there next year. I want to also mention that George is very open to the academic community. He has quite a few traditional archaeologists on the program. We'll have a few here on the program as well. But to have those experts available for questioning as well as to hear their material is really as a lot to the show, doesn't it. Oh,
it certainly does. You know. Last year we held the event right here in Asheville, North Carolina, which is where I live, And I mean, we had so many incredible lectures that were included in the event.
But again, like you said, it was a good blend of the you know, the theoretical and some of the more speculative and then the traditional, you know approach to archaeology, which is kind of where I've been more in, you know, in terms of my own involvement this, I have an AGES team and I Jason Pintrail, James Waldo and I we have assisted a lot of archaeological excavations. As again we're amateur, as we are avocationalists, so we go volunteer and work with the actual PhDs and we assist in those
excavations and try to further knowledge by basically blood sweat and tears. You know, you're out there with a shovel, digging in the dirt. I love that, and we've always supported the efforts of serious academic archaeologists, and George does too, and that's why he tries to get a blend of both so that all perspectives are covered. And I appreciate that. I didn't know you were picking up a shovel and digging with those guys. That's that's kind of
cool. Oh yeah, yeah. I've spent many, many years out there working with people, and several seasons down there at the White Pond site in a Greater Columbia, South Carolina, with doctor Chris Moore and some of the very folks who have been involved in the Comet Research Group and their efforts. You know, they're kind of looking at the younger, driest impact hypothesis, the idea that there was this, you know, this cataclysmic impact that occurred
right around maybe twenty seven or twelve seven hundred years ago. That's another conversation for another time. But again, that stuff all fascinates me, and you'll be hearing about that at the Cosmic Summit too. I want to remind our listeners that for more information on the Cosmic Summit June fifteenth and sixteenth. Go to Cosmicsummit dot com, Forward Slash Earth Ancients all the informations there. If you can't get out, check out the streaming media package. It is so
amazing. You get all the speakers and you get to keep all the people you can't see in a cloud program. So all the details are on Cosmicsemmit dot com, Forward Slash Earth Ancients. Micah Hanks Real Pleasure. How can people learn more about you? What's your website? Give us some details about what you're up to. Indeed, it's always easy to find me online. It's just my website is micah Hanks dot com. My name, So if you head over to Micahnks dot com you'll find all the podcasts I produce,
I mean every single week. I've got the Micah Hanks program my kind of flagship, but there are still the other podcasts I do as well. In one of those, the Seven Ages are your Journal that Jason and James really
have spearheaded over the last few years. Jason's always picking excellent guests and we try to get at least one of those, if not two, out every month that are covering archaeology, and then as far as this sort of topic, the UAP thing, I am pretty frequently reporting on that as well as you know, space, science, technology, all kinds of things over at
the debrief dot org. But again, anytime there's really significant breaking news involving UAP, I try to cover that just like we would cover any topic in science, so you can find all that information there as well. Excellent, and you're about to do for another book, don't you, fella. Oh yeah, yeah, clear, that's a whole other conversation. I know I shouldn't say anything. I'm behind on two books so well, when we get
them done, though, we'll have to have to reconvene. Definitely, definitely, Hey, Mike, real pleasure and looking forward to seeing you at the Cosmic Summit. Indeed always a pleasure, Cliff, great to see you. There's literally thousands of bits and pieces of literature that has generated on the ufou AP alien phenomenon that is currently surrounding our planet, and it's good to hear from Micah because he's really digging into the details, the stuff that most of
us just don't care to look into or don't have access to. It sounds like he had access to data that isn't typically released to the general public. But I have to say, not only was it good to hear from him and to touch base with his knowledge of things, but it kind of presents itself as a continual study. But you know, we're still being We're not We're still not privy to the details of landings, of interactions with off world
types. And I don't think that there'll ever really be full disclosure because it's just too much. It's too much, just probably and I think we heard from somebody I can't remember who it was. It's so overwhelming that they the government, you know, has lost its grip on it, and it's uh, you know, it really crosses over. If you've ever follow or watch doctor Steven Greer's work, he is very thick in it. I got to
get him on the program. He is talking about black ops groups that are creating alternative energy and vehicles and using technology and integrating the technology in society. But black ops groups doesn't want to do don't want to do that because it would mean the loss of petro chemicals and the petroleum industry, which is trillions of dollars. And it's too bad because you know, if we had a technology that eliminated carbon and carbon monoxide emissions, not only would we save our
environment, but we would probably be a lot better off health wise. So lots of questions. I keep at it. We drop a UFO UAP alien author on the program occasionally just to give us an update as to what's happening, what's going on, and if there's anything that's really important. So I'll drop a program like this occasionally just to keep us up to date. So hope you enjoyed that. Hey, we do a couple of tours every year. Actually it's around three now and we're going to be in Turkey August fourteenth
through the twenty fourth. We're about half full, and there's more and more data coming out of Turkey that not only is it one of the supporters of some of the most ancient people in the world, many like the go Beckley Tepee temple that we don't even know who the people were, but it's dated to what twelve thousand years ago, and it keeps confounding us as to what these temples were, that they were building, what they are used for.
We're going to be seeing go Beckley Teppy in this upcoming tour, we're going to see a lot of other sites that are close to go Beckley Tappy. We're also going to places like darren Kuru, Cappadocia, and a lot of ancient sites that are off the beaten path that general public doesn't really get the chance to see. If you want more information and to see our current banuary,
go to earth Ancients dot com Forward slash Tours. I want to also mention that our guide is going to be Mohammed Imbrahem, who has typically with us in Egypt, but he is also adept at tours in Turkey. He and I came up with his agenda and we think it's a good one. It's a good overview of Turkey and we're looking forward to it. We got spaces left, so if you're interested, come on out earth Ancients dot com, forward slash tours, and if you have any questions regarding any of our
tours, send me an email. Send it to Earth Ancients the number four of the letter you at gmail dot com and I'll get right back to you. I want to mention that our Sacred Temples of Mexico is filling up. That's going to be November eighth through the seventeenth that's going to be in Yucatan, and I'll tell you they have found a number of new ruins in and around this area where this new tour train is in Yucatan, so we're gonna
see most of these. And we also have made arrangements to climb the pyramids at ushmol Ekpa Loam, Mayapan and some of the smaller temples that are close to where we will be, which is Mareda. Come out and join us Earth Ancients dot Com, Forward Slash Tours and let's take a look at things together and see the ancient past to the eyes of the Maya. All right, that's it for today's program. I want to thank my guest Micah Hanks coming to us from North Carolina. As always, a team of Gael Tour,
Mark Foster, and everyone who makes this thing happen. You guys rock all right, take care of be well and we will talk to you next time. I did the b