Welcome to Destiny. Now here's your host, Cliff Dunning.
Hey, this is Cliff, your host of Destiny. How you doing. Come on in, let's talk chat about good stuff. Hey, I want to remind you that if you haven't had a chance to listen to the best of Eric van Dankin's interview, I posted it recently. I also did something that I hadn't thought about. I did something for the first time. I used chat GBT to generate a graphic.
I had this picture of Rish from Los Angeles, and I uploaded it into the AI system and I wrote a few and some specifics, and it came back with this amazing graphic of Eric looking down at us from heaven, along with some ets and some spaceships and some ancient sites that kind of supports this interview that I series of interviews over ten years that I pieced together in a best of program. So check that out. You should have it on your feed. And it's almost two hours
and I edited it down. It could have easily been Jesus four or five hours, but I took the best of from him. And one of the early parts of that interview is Eric actually talking about growing up and how he was influenced by the Bible, but not just the religious part of it, more from an anthropological look and early man and how in his belief the the Bible describes how early man evolved and was created by aliens.
So now, and one of the things that I appreciate about Eric's work is the fact that he was an explorer over anything else. I think what happened was he just got caught up, which a lot of people do when you go to places like bellbuck Lebanon, or you go to Egypt, the Giza Plateau that we talk about all the time, and seeing these pyramids up close and personal or any place else that has megalis how did they do it? How was the technology? I mean he
even discusses in one interview Pumapuku and Tiwanaku, Bolivia. I mean, if you've ever been to that place, the stonework is cut with some form of technology we don't understand. So when you're observing this and he started going down in the late nineteen sixties to to South America, and he
left his home in Switzerland to begin exploring. He was a research investigator, and he took great pride in his note taking and his belief in alien intervention was huge, huge, Now today we know that that's probably a little over emphasis on the alien side of it. And my belief and I've worked with elders and you've we've had people on the show who are indigenous individuals, Native Americans who believe that their ancestors worked with alien intervention. But I
don't believe that the aliens. When I look at ancient aliens, it's between one and ten percent of one hundred percent. I think Arish was looking at it, but overdid it. He's looking at it from ninety percent to one hundred percent. That there's alien intervention in Earth's history. I think it's closer to two to ten percent, ten percent being the
absolute most. And this is where you get these spinoffs and ancient Aliens, and it's fun, it's great fun to see these huge productions, which is not what ancient Aliens is now and in sixteenth or eighteenth season, eighteen years of that, and it's an industry. But really, if we're serious about it, it's not that aliens came down and were influencing us in that manner. It's more that we
have lost part of our history. There is an advanced Earth human development that we only get bits and pieces of like the great if you ever go to Green come with us, by the way, come with us to our Sammath Daniel Grant Egyptian tour. We go and we not only walk around and interact with these pyramids, we actually go inside one of the great pyramids. We go
inside of the Cufu Pyramid. And once you're in there and you're looking at these megalithic stones placed together in precision manner, in a precision manner, then you're like, Wow, those guys were amazing. It's not Aliens. It's just that we had another culture. Some say it's pre dynastic. It's not Aliens. It's just that we have a lost part of our history and we're doing we're working as fast as we can to unveil these people, unveil their science,
and we're getting pieces of it. And it's really the most amazing challenge is that as our current science evolves and developed up, it allows us to discover these early people. And these early people were so sophisticated they were able to tap Earth's gravity, tap these tolleric energy sites, and over hundreds of perhaps thousands of years, develop a science around it and that science was able to create cutting tools,
machines of some kind. There's actual wars like the Maha Barata War that were fought in Vomanas, which is the flying craft. So there's a history that were slowly unveiling. But I want to honor and I urge you to listen to arischvon Donegan's Life and Time series just came out look on your feed because he was an explorer. He was a research investigator who opened the door and influenced my self and many other people into wanting to know more about our past. So there you go. Hope
you enjoy that program. Today's program is with a researcher. Her name is Linda shield Or. She's a psychotherapist. She
has written a fascinating book called Ancestral Dreaming. And what makes this book very, very important is the fact that our ancestors, according to her, are trying to reach out to give us heads up on our own behaviors, our own tendencies that are not always positive, but also provide data about our history as a as a humanity, but also personally, how to heal the trauma that could be ours, but could be our grandparents and their great grandparents is and so forth and so on, and this is a
way through dreaming and through meditation to connect with our ancestors. It's very very inspirational but also very cool to become more fulfilled as a human, as a as an individual, flesh and blood in this lifetime, so that we're more more fulfilled. And that's a big issue every year. We want to be more healthy, we want to be more fulfilled, we want to be more positive and successful. So today's program is ancestral dreaming, healed generational wounds through dream work.
And my guest is Linda Yale Schiller. Hey, the semath annual Grand Egyptian Tour is coming up. We have Mohammad and Nohah e Braham with us. We're going to be visiting Tennis, Egypt, which is very very old. We don't know what happened there. It looks like a catastrophic event happened. It has megalithic structures, statues, and some large pieces strewed around. Muhammad. What do we know about Tennis? What makes it so unique?
What we know about tennis unfortunately so little, but it is so little incoonveniar with the importance and the greatness of Tennis. But for us it is very high level of information. Number One, what we know that Tennis was a great center of knowledge in Incia Egypt. It was the big city receiving all the travelers and immigrants and visitors to Egypt from the northeast part of Egypt, they come across Sinai. The second thing about Tennis that there was a massive size timbil or I can call it
big town. We call it Temble, dedicated to Amonra. This is Timble. This village, if I can call it this way, was completely pilt out of rose granite.
From us one.
You know what people don't know that there was more than twelve obelisks in Tennis, maybe more, but the remains some of them still in good condition, but all of them are laying on the ground. The one they took it to the Grand Museum, the one in front of the main gate of the Grand Museum is from Tennis, and the one in Tarrrisquare now is from Tennis. So there are about ten obelisks or eight obelisks still there
at Tennis. So the story is very strange because we expected, even if the Temble was in bad condition, we expected more ruins to see more cat ORed blocks, but we found only few, but we found the biggest. By the way, there are remains of blocks weighing more than two hundred ton, and three hundred ton we found of a statue. According to the dimension of the foot, the statue would be more than fifteen hundred ton. The foot is like a car size.
Wow.
Okay, so we don't know what happened exactly. It must be something very strong hit tennis and hit that temple and it it caused great damage, like great exublusion happened inside the temple and caused that. All the pieces are scattered on a distance maybe like three or four kilometers wide.
Amazing.
When people go to tennis, they're going to feel the magic and they feel the dips of the history of tennis.
Come on and join us. It's going to be April twenty eight through May tenth. For all the details and the itinerary, go to Earth Agents dot com Forward Slash Tours. We're introducing a new book today. It's called Ancestral Dreaming Healed Generational Wounds through dream Work. And my guest today is Linda Schieler. I enjoyed this book and I had to tell you that I don't always remember my dreams. But we're having Linda on today because we want to know.
We want to find out how important it is to connect with our ancestors and how we can heal and how we can help them hill too. So let me tell you a little bit about Linda. She is a psychotherapist consultant. She wrote a She's written two other books, Modern dream Work and PSTD Dreams or PST Dreams. Actually kind yeah, it's kind of funny, and this is all excellent because we want to find out just how to contact the past and why it's important. So, Linda, welcome to Destiny.
Great to have you, Thank you very much. Nice to be here, Cliff.
Okay, the big question, how did you get involved in this? Because this is not typical And I have to say this that I although think that dreams are important. I know they're important. I can't remember my dreams because I don't pay enough attention. But so talk about how you launched into this.
Sure, I'm going to lot pop right into that, but I want to just tell you, Cliff that you're in a very very good company for not remembering you And the thing you said right after that is one of the primary reasons why people don't remember their dreams, which is they don't pay enough attention to them, or it doesn't matter to them, because you know that added that
will addage. We see what we're looking for. If something's important to us, we look for it and we pay attention to it, and if it's not, then we pay less attention to it unless it hits us over the head, as some dreams or nightmares do when they've decided that they've had enough of us not paying attention. So the best way, well two things. One is in our culture,
dreams are not given the respect that they deserve. And as a matter of fact, in pretty much every native of an indigenous culture throughout the world, respect and attention is given to dreams as able to help us solve problems, heal medical issues, for tell future, have precognitive experiences connect with the spirit world, and the wise men and women and the shamans and the medicine people of pretty much every culture are those who are the best dreamers. And
that's not by coincidence. And I'm just now reading an article about the Maori culture in New Zealand, and I'm reading because I'm actually I'm very excited. I'm going to be in New Zealand teaching dream work in the first weekend in March. So if anyone out there wants to go to New Zealand and live your dream and learn dreamwork at the same time, first weekend in March, I'll give you the links. But they talk about how important dreaming is in the Maoric culture and what they say,
let mean if I can remember the acronym. They say, most of the research on dreams is done by what he calls it's an acronym in the acronym that uses weird Western European what's the eye? I can't remember the eyes for rich democracies. So and they the researchers said, this represents about twelve percent of the world's population, but most of the attention to dreams are only given by people who live in these Western, non indigenous, wealthier cultures,
and they miss all the nuance of dreams. Hence, we're not taught about the importance of dreams. And as a therapist, I and none of my colleagues were taught how to do dream work in our schools of psychology or schools of social worker, schools of counseling and we should be because this is the best way and the fastest, most direct access to our deepest self, to our soul, to our unconscious and to the things that we almost but
don't quite know in our conscious mind. So I recommend paying attention to dreams for the ability to access nonlinear ways of knowing. Right, we have our left brain linear waking mentality of what's out there in our quote unquote waking life, but there are worlds that we don't have access to with that left brain linear logic. And ironically, or maybe not ironically, the most scientific of science is
catching up with indigenous folks. Quantum physics is all about knowing things in unusual ways that defy logic.
So when you say indigenous cultures have traditions of working in the dreams state, is that noted? Is that, like, you know, documented in a way?
Oh yeah, tons and tons and tons of research with Native American, with New Zealand, with Australia, with the Far East, with Middle Eastern. Pretty much every spiritual tradition and native tradition, including our Western spiritual traditions talk about the importance of dream work and have a place in Judaeo Christian and
Muslim cultures. In sort of the Western world cultures of spirituality, dreams are given a lot of importance and attention, but they're sort of a subgroup and they're not the mainstream practice for most people.
Right So, in the early parts of your book you give suggestions, which is classic, but have a notepad or a journal or some form of written paper and pen standing by so that when you have your dream, you wake up a little bit and write a couple of sentences down, or what is your suggestion for dream memory?
The very best way to remember your dreams is to write them down. And mostly we only remember the dreams that we have at the end of a ram cycle, right so, and we also probably only mostly remember the dreams we have when we first wake up in the morning. But we know we have between five and seven ram cycles every night, which means we all have approximately five to seven dreams every night. We just don't remember them unless we happen to wake up them.
Five to seven dreams, Yeah, are these must be significant dreams that just get buried in some kind of database.
Well, we don't know exactly what they are if we don't remember them. Most of us remember if we're lucky one or two. I have one colleague who's been in my dream circle for twenty years, and she is amazing. She has this dream practice which somehow she manages to capture like between four and seven dreams almost every night, and she goes through a journal like every couple of months filling it with her dreams. She's an outlier. That's
not the norm for most of us. Yeah, but when but when you wake up in the morning or in the middle of the night, if you can jump down everything you can think of that you remember from your dream, capture as much as you can because and the reason I say write it as opposed to like dictated into your machine, whatever your devices, is that as we write, we're activating our physical somatic body as well, and we trigger remembering of our unconscious self when we are using
our physical body as opposed to just talking. And often I'll find in this and everybody reports us that as we're writing things down, we remember more than we thought we did before we started writing. So if you can't write for whatever reason, by all means at least dictated into your into your phone or whatever, but then later go back and transcribe it, and you'll probably find there's more detail than when you first spoke it.
Talk about primers or starting sets that will help us remember our dreams. Now, I've heard that if we use intention as we're in bed, I would like to remember my dreams Tonight I need to dream about I have the feeling that this person is contacting me or whatever. I don't know. What are your suggestions for launching a dream work?
Sure, so to have a dreamwork practice for starters, be aware that this is possibility and climb on board that it's important. If you say, ah, just a dream, you're going to be less likely to remember. But if you say, oh, dreams can really connect me with my higher self, with spiritual realm, with other people, with knowledge they're worthwhile remembering, you're going to be more likely to remember. That's that's
for starters. And then what you're talking about, Cliff, is a practice called dream incubation, which is an yeah, which is an ancient practice of preparing before you go to sleep at night to put your mind and intention on what it is you'd like to dream about. And you can spend a few minutes or half an hour whatever
you want, writing in your journal. What the dilemma or issue or question or desire is that you'd like to get more information about, to get some direction about from your dreams, and end that writing with as specific a question as you can, And the more specific your question, the greater likelihood that you will easily understand the message
the dream has come to tell you. Because dreams come couched in layers of symbol and metaphor, and that's why we do dream work to peel back the layers so we understand sort of the symbolic and metaphoric meanings of the dreams. So the gift of doing good dream work is a gift of associations. So if you have a question you'd like to ask, or a departed relative in the case of talking about ancestors you'd like to hear from,
be real specific about what it is. Rather than saying, oh, i'd like to connect with my ancestors, say my mom died last year and I miss her. I'd really like to have her visit me and invite her. So Mom will come and give me a hellout tonight while I'm sleeping, and your chances are going to be much higher that the exact question you've asked will be answered in a way you can understand it.
I like that before we get into what you call the six calls from our ancestors, I want you to describe why it's important to reach out and what is ancestral healing in communication. I mean, I've talked to people who say, this is our history. Our ancestors did this quite regularly. The indigenous cultures are all about this. But why is it important to have this communication with ancestors.
So some of us have ancestral lines that were pretty easy and happy and successful and well cared for. And if we were lucky enough to primarily have ancestors, parents, grandparents, great grandparents as far back as we can go, well basically had pretty good lives. They're probably at peace. On the other side, they might come to visit us with
some blessings, with some gifts, with some wisdoms. But for many and I don't know if I can say most of us, but certainly many of us have in ancestors in our ancestral line who died in great pain, who died because of trauma, who died with unresolved wounds, And if that was the case, they are still stuck in the pain of the wound or the trauma that happened in their lives because they didn't have an opportunity while
they were embodied to do the healing. So the gift that gives both ways in doing ancestral dream work is when we can contact or be contacted by our relatives who died with pain. And these are the ones who come through and say, please help me, I'm still suffering.
The book is full of many, many stories of this, and many many exercises and things that we can do in our sleep, in our sleep or dream adjacent states like meditation or hypnotic states or trans or in our waking lives to create and send healing to those spiritual spirits who are still suffering and send the healing back into time and space so they can receive the healing they never got a chance to have when they were alive, finish their journey and pass over in peace to live
with the one. However, you understand what happens when you die, and then what happens that's so beautiful is that that healing that we gave to our grandparents passes down the line to our parents and passes down the line to us. So rather than the message of pain and trauma and
suffering being what's passed down from generation to generation. We can pass down the message of healing, resilience and hope, and then we pass that on to our children and our students and the people whose lives we touch.
So this generation is embodied. And so you're saying, we have the power to reach in and heal our ancestors. I mean, how do we know that there's a problem with our ancestors? Is this the dream work someone's coming through and saying I'm in pain, I'm emotionally upset still, I mean.
So there's a lot of different ways we might know that there is a problem that's happened in our family line and our family tree. And one of the best ways to have knowledge about your family is to make a family tree, to create what's called a genogram, and there are lots of templates online. There's a template in the book for making a family tree.
I saw that.
Yeah, And to ask your parents and your grandparents sooner rather than later, before the information dies and you can't get it. Who's who in the family, who has married to who, who has children? Where does everybody come from, and what were their lives like? And if you simply start asking your parents and your grandparents, and if you're lucky enough to have great parents grandparents who are still alive,
they'd be usually more than happy to tell you. And if they're not more than happy, sometimes they'll still tell you anyway. If you can convince them how important it is to tell their stories before they're lost, you will learn things about your family history that you would never have known had you not asked, or you might already know or suspect, like you know that dad's mom died of a heart attack at forty seven years of age.
I'm just making up a scenario. And there's a history of heart problems in the family, right, So it's like, oh aha, genetic history heart problems in a family. That's one thing we can track sort of the medical history, but then also what's the emotional and life lived history connected with heart attacks?
Right?
So, just for example, I'll just to share a personal story. My dad died of his third heart attack when he was forty seven. Forty Yeah, he.
Was very very good young.
Right, right, he was very very young, and my parents were divorced when I was about twelve years old, and my dad cheated on my mom, so he had a history of pain of the heart from an emotional standpoint and not being true to his heart for years and years before he had a physical symptom. So that's just one example of where the emotional story and the physical story come together. But you also will find as you go through family history it's like, Oh, you know Grandma's brother,
how come we never see great Uncle Jack? What's wrong with him? Oh, we don't see uncle Jack, we don't talk to him. Well, why what happened? What's the story with great Uncle Jack? And how is that still relevant in our family? The question then is what are we still carrying in our lives today? It's actually not ours to carre it. We're carrying old stuff that belongs to generations past. And until we know if we're carrying stuff
that isn't ours, we can't easily separate from it. So awareness then gives us the option of choice and of doing healing work. So that's why it's so important to trace this history. You can do it alive with your parents and grandparents. You can do it by incubating dreams. You can do it with automatic writing to see what comes through. Like many ways to do it.
Yeah, I almost have a situation where most of my relatives of my grandparents have passed many years ago. My father passed away. I think my mother's she's ninety five. I don't think she remember. But you just said the key word. If they're not alive, you can use your dreams, you can use automatic writing and talking like that. I really like that. And you're saying some very important make it, some very important point to Linda, which is that this
isn't just to heal the ancestors. This is to heal you. That's right, which I have not thought about. But that's the critical point. Where are the physical beings? And we should, you know, instill this knowledge to allow us.
To heal right in the same way we inherit physical characteristics our selves and our personalities and the way we live. Our lives is affected by the environments we grew up in and how we were parented, and how our parents parented us is affected by who parented them and the environments they grew up in. So things can get repeated from generations past that are no longer actually relevant to our lives today, but we get parented and therefore internalize
and act as if they were. Because this is what's getting passed along the family line.
Wow. We're going to take a short commercial break to allow our sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly with my guests today, Linda Sheeler discussing her new release Ancestral Dreaming, will be right back. This podcast is sponsored by squarespace. Hey, have you ever had an idea for a product that you wanted to sell? Perhaps you're an artist or a writer, or you want to get
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ten percent off your first purchase of a website or domain. Again, that is squarespace dot Com forward slash Ancients. This is the best way to build a quick, professional looking website. Psychotherapist Linda Yale Schiller she has written a new book on ancestral healing. This is a look at reaching out beyond our known parentage, our known ancestors into the deep past and working with the gifts and the trauma that
they suffered as well. So should we obviously be paying attention to physical health issues, mental emotional, spiritual issues that are bogging us down and may have an ancestral trail to focus on.
Right whatever it is that you are blessed to do well with and have success within your life and have peace within your life, look and see if there are other people in the family who you know of who also have these gifts. If you're struggling with depression, or with anxiety, or with the after effects of trauma, how much of that is because of what actually happened to you that affected you in your life and your then
emotional response to that. And of course somatic and soma and psyche are hand in hand, so semitic and physical effects. But look to see anybody else in the family have a history of fill in the blank? Is this pattern being passed along from generation to generation? And as a therapist, I can tell you most of the people I work with, and this is not blaming the parents by any mean.
I'm a parent, so I'm not blaming the parents, can find connections between things that brought them into into counseling or therapy and things that their parents and grandparents also struggled with or went through.
I love that. I want to talk about what you call the six calls from your ancestors, which is what you open the book in and I'm going to read him off and if you could explain him a little with a little more depth, I think it would be very helpful. The first one is I am here, you are not alone, which I thought. I have a very favorite grandfather who was almost reherrent to me, who passed
away over twenty years ago. And when you say you are not alone, I could kind of feel that sense of him being around, But how do we work with that?
Well, you know, I'm looking for something and I'm not going to find the quote I'm looking for, but I found a different quote. I'm holding the book here. Grief is a very powerful experience to have, and when we lose someone that we love, we mean we grieve and that's normal and it's natural, and we go through a lot of different stages of grieving, from the first week where in some traditions we sit shival for a week.
The first month is called slow shehim, and then there's the first year, and what Western culture forgets to pay attention to is there's a second year two where things are not, you know, back to status quo yet. So we learn how to live with loss one way, shape or form. It becomes a way to help be a bomb or a salve for our grief. To know, even though the body and the physicality of the person we loved isn't here anymore, their essence and their soul is
still with us. So if you connect with your grandfather and this might come through to you, and maybe it has, maybe it hasn't. If he's visited you in a dream as opposed to just having a dream about him. I think it's fifty three percent. The pure research, you know, study said fifty three percent of Americans said they had visitations from their departed loved ones in their dreams. And that's just the people who recognized that they were having
a visit. So chances are probably even higher. But the knowledge that they're not really gone, they're still available is so comforting and so powerful. And there's that you're not alone, I'm still with you peace.
How do we work with that, Linda? How do we work with a relative that you want to communicate with more? How does that? How do we launch into that.
Several different ways? First is have the intention, have the desire. There's a wonderful fray a word in Hebrew. It's called coveanda and kavanaugh means intention and it comes from the root of the word le coven and kivun means direction. So a covena or an intention is pointing yourself in the direction that you want to go in. So you start with pointing yourself in the direction of wanting to be in touch with them, and then you can incubate a dream, inviting them to show up and capture whatever
dream comes through. Even if you're not sure they showed up, keep trying until it becomes clear, or work with someone else or with a group to help unpack the dream, to find out the hidden places that we need help discovering that we can do on our own and in waking life. Have that intention of connection and look for it when you're in a quiet, peaceful place. Look for it when you're taking a walk down by the river, look for when you're listening to the birds singing in
the trees. Look for it when you're swimming in the ocean. Look for it in a place, these liminal places right between earth and air and water, where spirit and matter are less clear cut, and often you'll find the voice or a sign or a synchronicity that lets you know, Oh, here they are, Here they are.
Are they supposed to be our ancestors, supposed to be our counselors, are advice givers? Or are they there just to nurture?
Depends on the ancestor. I think, just as in our lives, right there are people who are supposed to be accountants, and there's people who are supposed to be professors, and there's people who are supposed to be podcasters and not other people, right. I think it's the same with our ancestors. YEA, So my stepdad, Bud. All I have to do is say his name or think of him, and he's right here in the room with me. Nobody else in my life does that. He was the father of my adult life,
is what my mentor. He read my first professional papers when I was a professor at Boston University and was writing for publication, because he was a professor as well. So in my life he was a mentor for me. And after his death he's been gone, I don't know twenty years now. Oh he's still here.
Anytime I call him into place, consciously, not unconsciously when you're asleep. Is that what you're suggesting?
In this particular case, he shows up in three different ways. One is he sometimes comes through in dreams on his own, well actually four. Two is when I'm awake sometimes I'll say, hey, Bud, what do you think of this? Three is he'll just show up. I can just steal his essence. And right now, for example, I can hear him like laughing, this great, great laugh that he has because he's sort of delighted
that we're referencing him this way. Four is I we My daughter grew up thinking that dreams were very normal and talking to dead relatives was a really normal thing. Ah, So when she was little, and you know, all of us who are our parents, you know, there are things where we can get into power struggles with our kids if we're not careful. One of the best techniques I ever found was to tell my daughter, you know, ask Grandma and Grandpa what they think about this. You go,
ask them now they're already dead, right. So she goes and I don't know if she dreams it or if she channels them or what she does, but she comes back the next morning with advice that I am totally behind. That I agree with. I Grandma said that I should do this or that, or Grandpa said that I should do this or that. I said, all right, what do you think She said that sounds good? I said, yeah, I agree with grandma.
You know, I love to hear that, because I think some people might think you're crazy. You're asking dead people advice. You know, our Western morals are bleeding through, you know whatever that means. Or fundamentalism of religion may think you're working with the devil.
Yeah, you know, if you had parents or grandparents who passed who were cruel or abusive, or really challenged or addicts or just didn't treat you well. I wouldn't send my kid to ask them for advice, So you know, you use your common.
Sense too, exactly exactly.
Unless they've done their healing work, and then that's a different story than you know. As Peter Levine, who wrote Waking the Tiger and as in Somatic Experiencing, talked about that a trauma healed is an earned blessing. So trauma healed is a great blessing for us, but trauma on healed continues to repeat itself.
Yeah, I want to complete this sixth Jauls because I think they are so unique and really there is diverse as our listeners. So the next one is take these gifts. I like to hear about that.
Yeah. So sometimes our ancestors come in the first one saying I'm here, You're not alone, right. They can also come through saying I have some gifts or some blessings for you that I'd like to offer you in your life.
And those are always so special. They can be something concrete, they can be something with words, They can be an essence or felt sense it can also be in this category that sometimes our ancestor will come through here and say, you know, I have an apology to make to you that I did get a chance to make when we were alive. So I really want to say sorry for this X thing that happened between us. And that's a gifted blessing too.
Yes, that's a huge gift, especially if you were devastated by them, whatever they said to you or the behavior that they presented.
Yeah. One of my clients who had been struggling with her mom, who was sort of the epitome of not a good mom when she was growing up, and her mom would say things to her like I never should have been a mother, I'm a terrible mother. You know, you should have been born to someone else, like things like that. When she worked with her mother in spirit, her mother said to her, I'm really sorry I said those things to you.
Oh my god.
Yeah, And her mother said, here's what happened in my life. Her mother was orphaned when she was two years old and was brought up by sort of like a wicked stepmother kind of thing, like an aunt who really never wanted to have this additional child join her household. So she was brought up as an unwanted child and passed that message on to her daughter. But she didn't mean to, but she did because that's what she had known. But after she died, she said, I'm so sorry. Here's why
I would say those things to you. Didn't really mean them. I really still love you and I always did.
I mean that is for a child they have a parent berate them or whatever and then apologize. It's such a relief. That's a trauma for a child, right, and that's a relief too. So you're describing, yeah, a trauma release with a parent who is or a relative who's deceased, or a loved one who's deceased. That's powerful.
And my client who I worked with around this, she was not a child. She was in her fifties when we did this work. But she was able to then bring that apology and healing message back to her younger self internally as a child, and pass it on to her daughter too.
That's a fantastic story. Let's move on because we have a little bit of time. Let's see gifts and then let me help you heal.
Right.
Yeah, so the third one is number one. I'm still here. Number two, I have a blessing for you. Number three is I can send some over here where I am that you're struggling with something. You might have asked for help and they come through and say, I got some advice for you, or I got some help for you, I got some idea to you. I'm going to help you. That in a nutshell is it's like when I tell my kid, you know, ask Grandma what she thinks about this.
It's usually something we've been, you know, struggling with, so ask Grandma for help kind of thing.
Yeah, that's great. We already covered number four, which is please help me heal. Yeah. So they're reaching out from wherever they are, what dimension or after life or whatever, and saying I could use your help, and they must pick up that you are at a place where you maybe can offer some words of healing or some advice. Is that what you're thinking.
That's a wonderful way of putting it, and a wonderful perspective. I think that if you're in a place where you hear them ask for help, or see or sense or feel whatever sense it's sensory modality it comes through for you, then probably they've picked you at the right time in your life to be able to offer some assistance.
Yeah.
I like that, right, Because someone came to us as when we were teenagers, or when we were sewing our wild oats in our twenties, or struggling with making a living in our thirties, or whatever it was, and we didn't have much leftover to extend to the other side, that might not have been the right time for them to come.
Yeah. And I haven't had a chance to look thoroughly through the book, but I would imagine you have case studies of people who are dealing with these calls in their own away. That's right, Yeah, which was really really impactful. Number five is this I'm looking at my trying to read my hand right here.
I can help you think that read your hand ready. I remember it's.
Old pain has not been healed. Well.
Number five is a little different. That one's still connected to Number four. This old pain and this old trauma hasn't been healed. Number five is when the ancestors come through and they had a lot of conflict, enmity, hatred arguments in their waking life, and they're still holding the grudge and they want you to continue the grudge.
Oh, they want you to be as angry and unhappy.
As you kick up the ball, like the hat Fields and the McCoys, or the Montagues and the Capculates in Romeo and Juliet, like from generation to generation the Montagues and the Capitulates always fight each other, or the Hatfields and the mcgoys always shoot each other to ample in the book of something that happened along these lines, and in this circumstance, if you've got an ancestor coming here and say, you know, that side of the family, they're really garbage, and I want you to just own them.
You know, they could come through and say something like that or I'm you know, paraphrasing. Of course, your job is not to say, oh, sweetie, you know, let me help you necessarily. I mean, they might not be amenable to help anyway. But here you need to have some boundaries. You need to say, wait a minute, no, the buck has stopped here. I'm not going to perpetuate ill will or enmity or hatred. And as a matter of fact, not only I'm not going to perpetuate it, I'm going
to surround myself with light. I'm going to surround you with light, and I talk in the book about the sepher light, sapphire light of healing and protection. But I'm going to send you back to the source so you can finish your healing and get past this place where you're stuck in a grudge. So it's a slightly different relationship here with this type of ancestral visit.
I mean, that's a powerful but very negative influence that you're the person who's dealing with. It's kind of hairy.
Some families have people that they just don't talk to or are like, you know, the black Seeds of the family. They may or may not even know why if it was not from their like generation or lifestyles. Oh, in this family, you know, the Smiths of the black Seeds side of the family. Why, well, we don't know. They just always have them right. But we don't need to continue there. This could heal not only our own family lines, but potentially the world if everyone got behind this, because.
That's so big here, We're going to take a short commercial break to allow our sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly with my guests today, Linda Schieler discussing her new book Ancestral Dreaming, will be right back.
I guess it is Linda Schiller. She has written a new book on our ancestors called Ancestral Dreaming, how to communicate with them and how to work with them for our own betterment, but also to understand what they are going through and have been going through in a traumatic fashion. It's so interesting to speak with you, Linda, because this is so natural for you to be communicating with these ancestors and having these clients that you're counseling to open
to connect with the ancestors to get this data. It's so matter of fact, and I just I love it because it's so freeing for me to kind of think about my relationships and my non communication because I'm you know, maybe on a subtle level, I'm communicating with my ancestors, but I'm really not paying attention.
Well, I'll tell you something, Cliff. The fact that you invited me to come here today and that you had enough interest in this topic to engage in a conversation about.
It means you are on some level.
And maybe this is you know, a foot in the door to wedge it open even further for you.
I tell you right, Well, the dream part, I I really like the dream part because I I think I can get a lot out of it. The last calling is carry on my name. Yeah. Now that's and I'd like you to find that what that means.
These are the ancestors that come to us and say, remember me. Tell your children, tell your grandchildren, tell your students, tell your other people in your life about my life, my struggles, my gifts in a spiritual and an intellectual in an emotional sense, and literally remember me. You know, use my dishes at Thanksgiving and tell your family these
were Grandma, you know, Sylvie as dishes. You know this piece, this saw that I've inherited from My grandfather used to saw wood with this saw and still works and I keep it sharp in honor of his woodworking abilities. So we're instilling a remembrance and a continuity from generation to
generation to generation. And that's part of what makes us strong, is feeling these connections we suffer from, particularly since COVID, but for even longer before that, what the Surgeon General called an epidemic of loneliness and being cut off from each other in our world. And we need to as best as we can create and re establish connection and affiliation and ties both with our families, our birth families and our families of origin, and with the broader community
friends as family groups, as family. This is how we stay together in it as community. And we need community, whether it's related community or not related community in the world. So part of having community is remembering what our family gifts are physically and emotionally and passing those along so that we remember where we came from and where we want to go.
That's great for recently departed and memories of you know, the family treat But what about ancient ancestors, right, how do we connect with them and carry on their existence?
So do you have grandparents or great grandparents who were deceased who have anything that is a concrete memory or artifact from their lives.
Yeah, my grandfather was a physician and he collected. His practice was during the Great Depression, Wow, And so they would trade. He's from part of Central California, so there were immigrants from China, India, and he would barter or they would barter very family heirlooms and things like that for treatment. So he I have all this stuff, but you know, I remember him. I was in his life,
he was in my life. I wonder how much further back, I mean one hundred years, one thousand years, and how I can connect with them and perhaps they're reaching out, but I don't know them, you know what I mean.
So a comment and then a question. The comment is, what a wonderful legacy from your grandfather of healing and making healthcare available to all, right, whether you can pay you or not. And how valuable these artifacts from China or India are, way beyond whatever their actual worth is. That's a symbol of your grandfather's compassion and goodwill and desire to help, and what a beautiful thing they have.
And remember and to tell other people in your life, if you have kids, if you have partner, if you have cousins, whoever in your life is here saying this was your great what your grandfather got for taking care of people who didn't have money. What a nice thing to remember him by. Yeah, yeah, And then the other pieces. Do you know where your family comes from? You know, generations ago?
What part of the world, Well, I mean he immigrated from Germany, Okay, and my mother's said on my father's side they're English, Okay, you know, but I mean I've on the test the family tree, but it only goes so far you know what I mean?
Right, Well, depending on what you want, there's a couple of things you can do. One is you can do DNA testing. Right. You can go on ancestry dot com. You can go I okay, and you can go on twenty three in me and that'll take you as far as far as you can. And then if that doesn't give you the ancest the answers to the questions that
go far enough for you incubate a dream. Yeah, do some writing about I'm really curious about the German side of my family or the English side of my family, and I really want to know more about who they were, and write that and dream on it night after night until you get a dream, and then peel back the layers of the dream. If it's not absolutely clear to tell you, Oh, from the English side of my face family, we had people who were carpenters. I'm just making this up.
And you know some of the women on this side of the family were midwives and that you didn't know, but it came through somehow in the dream. We have time to tell you a quick story about that.
Yeah, no, we got plenty of time.
Oh okay, I know, so my daughter, Our daughter was born in China, right, so she's not biologically I read that iteah, yeah, and so And this is something a shout out for everyone who has adoption in their family anywhere, whether it's your kids or you, yourself, or another part of your family. So when you're doing ancestry, we're paying attention to the biological ancestry of wherever your child or relative was from, whether it's domestic or foreign adoption, as
well as the ancestry from your family. So my daughter, he often will say things like I inherited this from my dad or I inherit this from you, and she'll say things, oh, yeah, I have a therapist for a mom, so that's why I know this. So that's why I do that, right, But she literally means inherited. She's not being metaphoric. She's now a young adult too, so but
she knows enough to know. She was brought up. She was a year old when we brought her home from China, and so some of her likes and dislikes, her behaviors, the environment she grew up in is colored by who her parents are, the punts who raised her, my husband and I. So that's literally true. And in addition, we made sure we stayed connected with her Chinese heritage and her Chinese culture and did all sorts of things while she was growing up with an ongoing group of other
girls who were adopted from China. We went back when she was ten years old, he visited. We even went back to her orphanage where she was before she was brought home to us. And I sort of joke and I say, that trip was worth ten years of therapy. Man. She got so much out of connecting with those part of her roots as well, and the connection with doing these like blood tests or saliva tests, twenty three and me.
When she was eighteen, we gave her the gift of twenty three and ME for her birthday because she was really curious and interested. And she got a little bit here and there, you know, nothing too found. But then a few years later, she gets a Facebook message from this woman who says, I'm the mom of an adopted girl from China and I think you might be her cousin. Oh my god, right, And so what happened is they she's somewhat because there's a Facebook group for adoptees from
China and they were on the same Facebook group. So long story short, it turns out that this girl and my daughter their grandmothers, they're Chinese grandmothers, were sisters.
Oh wow, small world.
Yeah, so there's another There's several layers of what it means to inherit and to remember and to pass on the memory of someone that last piece remember me, right? How do we remember and honor and honor the people who we learned from?
And so I guess I'm just entuiting this right now. So if you're having some bleed through of somebody in crisis or trauma or wanting to communicate that isn't recognizable, that's where dream work would come in and you reach out and go, hey, hi, I'll have an intention to see who this person is in my in my past. I mean, I'm just making this up there, going if you had any cases like that, Linda, where you had client that could not discern who this person was that was trying to reach.
Out, Yeah, so we want to say something and then answer that question with an example. If someone is having dreams of a dream figure who's in pain or suffering or trauma and they don't know who it is before going in to work on the dream and finding out more about who that person is and what aspect of themselves or their family, if an aspect that is, do
take care to do the self protection. And there's a whole lot of exercises in the book about how to set your own boundaries, how to surround yourself with healing light, how to make sure that you don't get quote unquote contaminated by somebody else's stuff if you're working with pain
and trauma, so make sure you do that first. But yes, I have an example of someone who I worked with who we've been working together for a while, and she had a family history of Holocaust survivors and people who did not survive the Holocaust as well, and we did a lot of work with her family history in that line.
But then she had in addition, a dream where she said, I feel like there's a great deal of pressure on my chest and it's hard to breathe in the dream, and I don't know why, and it doesn't feel connected with any of the known family history that I have.
So we did some dream work, some waking dream work with the dream, letting her kind of go back inside the dream while awake and seeing what she can discover through this process of dream work called the guy a method guided active imagination approach, which is a Jungian style of working. And what she came up with was, I think I was buried alive. I think I was a witch in a former life. Was that true? We don't know, but her felt sense was that this could have been true.
And here in Boston, Massachusetts, were just a hop, skip and a jump from Salem, right where the witch Chials were, And we know that that's a true part of our history, particularly in eastern Massachusetts, but I'm sure many other places in the country as well. So we did the work as if this had been a lifetime of hers, whether or not we knew if it was. And after we did the work for a while, she never had those dreams of feeling hard to breathe, pressure on her chest, or being buried underground.
Again.
This opens up so many possibilities, this work that you're outlining in your book for healing, and I think people need to understand that just because we say trauma, it could be anything. It could be any type of issue that you're having. It could be a particular attitude that you need to clean up a little bit. And so you're being very direct by designing the book and calling an ancestral dreaming. But I think that there and you're writing in this book, there's a lot of work that
should be considered. Is what you're suggesting in this work than just fantastic? I want to ask you another question, and then I want to get a couple of case studies that people can hear about that you can choose as we can complete our time together in the book you write. The original title of the book was bringing Home My Bones. Yeah, and I thought that was fascinating because you know, when you leave the planet, all you have left.
Is the bones exactly.
But talk about that a little bit, will you.
Yeah, well, that was the title that came through to me, and I actually wrote a long poem with that as the title. And my publisher, though, in their wisdom, said no one will know what your book is about. If that's the title, you can put that in the chapter title, but we can't. We have to name the books so
people know what it's about. So I, in their wisdom, you know, since this is the third book that Lil Webbon has published, I said, okay, I'll go with that, but exactly what you said, our bones are the scaffolding of our physical body, which then hold the container of our soul and spirit. Our bones have marrow inside of that and marrow holds literally our lifeblood. The stem cells that are used for healing and now with modern science can used to heal both ourselves and others are found
in the marrow of our bones. So in many, many traditions, both Western and non Western, bones are revered. Bones are appreciated as holding life and spirit, and in the Hawaiian tradition it's called mana, which is the spirit of the person. One story that I told a friend of mine had been to Portugal and she went to a monastery, and the monastery was built on land. Something else was had
to be re purposed. That was the cemetery, and they dug up the bones of the cemetery, and then monastery took them and used them to build the artifice of the monastery. So when you walk in, you walk into an archway full of bones, literally of bones, and the sign I guess over the the entrance says, you know, these bones are here, We're waiting for yours.
That sounds kind of morbid, but there it is.
But it's also these bones are part of the eternity of us and the title chapter of Ring Home My Bones that comes directly from the Judeo Christian Bible. We're in Genesis when Jacob and there's famine in the land and they have to go down to Egypt to get relief from the family, and all the brothers go. Joseph is already there, Joseph of the Code of Many Colors,
He's already there. He's now sort of Pharaoh's right hand guy. He, by the way, is the most famous dreamer in the Bible because he the reason he's Pharaoh's right hand man is cle He interprets Pharaoh's dreams, which allows him to prepare for the famine. Right the seven Fat Sheep and the seven Lean Sheep. Probably some people are familiar with this, but anyway, when Jacob goes down with the rest of the family, he says, I'm going to die here, but bring all my bones back to Canan before you leave.
And then later Joseph says the same thing, if I die here, bring home my bones as well. So there is something about the veneration of the bones and the connection of bones with spiritual homeland that is very powerful. Now we don't all live in the lands that our ancestors lived in, or on the land our ancestors lived in or are buried in. But can we imagine, can we do that metaphorically, if not literally, can we bring home the bones of our ancestors so that we are
maintaining that physical spiritual connection. I sort of use that as one word with this lifeblood of our bones and our answer.
I love that. It's funny because I think there's certain communities in Europe. These are Old World communities who bury their relatives under the house, yeah, or close by, so they had that connection. And we're talking, you know, about reaching out, and it might make it easier to reach our ancestors because they're so close and they're you know, their physical what's left of their physical formats nearby.
Right. It's a very concrete reminder if your ancestors bones are like in the backyard, right. And in modern ways of burial, there's there's what's called green burial now, and there's also cremation, and I think a lot of people when they choose cremation, keep a little container of the ashes, even if they bury the ashes or disperse them over the sas somewhere little little container of ashes stays on the mate piece is a reminder.
Yeah, yeah, amazing. As we close, Linda, can you give us a couple of samples, examples, i should say, or case studies of clients who were able to connect with relative and have a a healing, a solution or whatever communication of some form.
Yeah, let me just put my attention on that. Well, one is that I just I already told you about the woman whose mother said I should never have been a mother. I'm a terrible mother.
That's a wonderful example. Yeah, yeah, I love that. Yeah.
Let me think of another one of something a little bit of another flavor. Well, I'm going to give you two examples. One is my cat, right because cats are and our pets are are for babies too. Many people consider their their animals, you know, part of their family. Well, my cat, e Fie, was one of twins we brought home. This this sort of match that you actually can see them over my shoulder. I don't know if this is
live or not, but yeah, there's a picture. This is this is this is the boys Effie and Many there were two and Many died a couple of years ago, and we have a little cat cemetery in the backyard. So over the years cats who have passed away we buried them in the yard and have put a little stone there. And one day the one who still left, Fie. A couple of weeks after many died, Fie got out of the house. We don't let him out much, really, We only let him on the death which is fenced
because it's too much wildlife in the neighborhood. We get out one day and he made a beeline for his brother's grave and he started sniffing around and scratching at the dirt.
Amazing.
How did he know, I don't know, but it was so powerful.
So he came off the deck in went to the actual ground area where the body.
Well, he actually we opened the door to like bring in the newspaper or you know, take off the garbage is something, and he scooed it out so he didn't jump off the deck. He doesn't jump off the deck anymore than God he used to is he's all he's an old guy now.
Yeah. Yeah. The book's called Ancestral Dreaming. Heal generational wounds through dreamwork. I guess has been Linda Schieler. I I really enjoyed the work that you have done in this give our listeners a chance to learn more about you. What's your website and what's your social media contacts?
Right, So my website is Linda yel Schiller dot com and that's spelled l I n d A y a e l s c h I l l e R, so that's all one word dot com. And on the website, you know, with the drop down menu, you can learn lots about me, and there's a page for publications. So all three of my books are connected to this website
and you can click on. Each of them has their own website as well, so Modern Dreamwork, PTS Dreams, and Ancestral Dreaming, and the website for Ancestral Dreaming has a hyphen because that domain name was already taken, so Ancestral Hyphendreaming dot com. So you can learn more in detail about the books. I have Facebook page Linda Elschuler, I have LinkedIn. I show up on Instagram, even though I'm not sure how I do it sometimes.
Yeah, we must have a YouTube channel because you're very outgoing. You do like little online seminars or anything.
Oh, thank you well. I have things that have been taped and put on YouTube, so you can find me on YouTube. Not directly. My skill set doesn't extend to technological our media based things, so I'm very appreciative of people who can do the technical end of things. But I had a book talk a couple of two months ago when the book came out, and that's up on YouTube. They we've foun somebody in the audience filmed it, and a few other things. Other podcasts like yourself or up on YouTube as well.
Okay, well, we're we have a YouTube channel for Destiny and you'll be definitely showing up there.
So oh agreed, Benda.
It's been a real pleasure having you on the program. Thank you for your time and continue success with this. I think it's a real nice addition to our ancestral connection.
That's wonderful. Thank you. Well, I just thought of something. I have a substack.
You started writing on a substack.
Yeah, so you can find me on substack as well. I don't overwhelm people. It's the most. It's like once a month, but there's a bunch up here. If you want to take a look. You won't get an email like every you know, every week or anything from it.
Good to see fantastic. Hey, continue success and thank you, thank.
You same to you. A pleasure talking to you, Cliff.
You can get a copy of Ancestral Dreaming on Amazon. Spent out about four weeks. Oh, spent out two months, came out in November, more than two months. It came out in November and the and we didn't get a chance to really get into the case studies. But the exercises in the book are easy and I'm going to try a few of them because I need to remember
my dreams. I mean, dreams are away for your higher self, your soul, whatever you want to call, your your guides, whatever, to communicate, and sometimes they communicate in your waking hours. But it's much more challenging for me because we've got our minds on all kinds of things like work and kids and family, friends, things like that. You know. So
Ancestral Dreaming heal generational wounds through dreamwork. Fun interview. Hey, if you are thinking about spring getaways, come out and join us for the seventh annual Grand Egyptian Tour April twenty eighth through May tenth. This is a diplomatic tour and I keep using that term. People go what do you mean what do you mean by diplomatic, Well, it means that you are treated like royalty the minute you step off the plane into Cairo to the moment you
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this is a new tour for me as well. We're gonna see some ancient sites like Tunis Abydos and other sites that have ancient ancient locations, pyramids, temples, and just sites that we can walk up to and interact with. For all the details, go to Earth Ancients dot com forward slash Tours, look for the banner, click on it. It'll give you the twelve day itinerary and it includes a five star cruise on the Nile. And I gotta tell you the Nile cruise by itself is worth the price
of admission. For all the details go to earth Agents dot com, Forward slatch Tours. Come on board. We don't have that many spaces left. We only think about twenty to twenty five max. So join us Earthasients dot Com, Forward slash Tours. All right, that's it for this program. I want to think my guest today, Linda Sheiler, has always the team of Gail Tour, Mark Foster and Fair Pavar. You guys rock all right, Take care every well and we will talk to you next time.