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All Right, guys, Welcome back, Episode thirty four thirty four thirty four Releasion Podcasts Monumental. Monumental. First and foremost, thank you guys for rocking with us. Thank you to the city of Houston. Yeah, ball out there, and then the whole city came out. Shout out to Texas. We we appreciate you. Love was definitely felt. Shout everybody. This is an exciting episode for us because we talk about, you know, business a lot, and we talk about a lot of
times and just not just us in general. Like you'll read stuff, you'll hear stuff about hard decisions that have to be made in business, right, But it's.
The one thing to read about something or to hear about something, but it's.
Another thing to actually get it from, you know, the actual sauce.
So this is this is what this is.
So we got Jabartie Johnson here and history is pretty legendary. He went viral because he wrote a very interesting article about why he turned down a million dollars. Yeah, so I'm gonna give the quick backstory. So Jabari, We're going to a lot of different things. But he's a Howard, the university alumni.
The red is the real.
Issue, right, the real one happen shop.
So he went to hotward, and then he started throwing these these R and B parties, right, and hip hop parties. At first hip hop Okay, he started throwing hip hop parties and then he noticed at the end of the party, said he would do R and B and then the R and B actually got a bigger crowd reaction than the hip hop's like the rap.
It's like, if you hear that that song.
The party, man, you hear that song the party, you know, I used to.
I went to school in Baltimore, So that was like a legendary, like one fifty five, like put that song on.
It's like that had to happen.
But all right, So he started to that and then he realized attraction with the R and B.
So then he started doing R and B only parties, right shows, show show that month.
Y R ANDV only shows, and then that just kind of just took off, and then he started doing like bigger and bigger venues.
Right.
And if you're familiar with like EDM, right where we're at now with DJs and DJs, some DJs get paid more than entertainments, right, Like these DM sets they'll have like fifty thousand people come with no performance. It's just a DJ kind of like a hype man situation, and they just play the music and it's just a vibe.
And he created that with the R and B.
Right, So then he started as they started a company called Colors Worldwide, and then he started R and B only, which is that the R and B kind of show. It's an R and B show, right, with no performance. Sometimes you have performance, but it's not built with performance. It's just build with just the music. And that blew.
Up you call it d M with a turned into music that.
Is yeah, exact exactly.
Yeah.
And then you started going on tour and then you got offered a million dollars and you turned it down. Now you're doing festival. That's a whole lot going on. First and foremost, thank you for joining us.
I'm a big fan of the podcast.
Like you were saying, you got not more four times.
Yeah, yeah, four times, got to uh, you know, the whole up statement.
So we're gonna talk about the business. But before we were talking about the details of the business, I want to talk about the beginning because a lot of times people have ideas, right, but the hardest part for me and for anybody is the first step, right, so you had an idea that you want to start doing the shows, right, and you're young when you first started. You're still young now, but like, what's the first step that you took to get this off the ground and up and running. Yeah, so.
I'll give you two first steps. I'll give you the first step of starting like just the company in general colors worldwide, and then I the step of R and B only. So I knew that I could start doing like small events because when I was at Howard, we did like a me and my friends, and I was kind of took the lead on it, but we did a party that was on a on a bus, like a like a party bus, right, And so it was like we had to get a bunch of people to
essentially buy tickets. It was really to chip in on the bus price, right, And then we took you know, we had a plan and we sort of took this route. And then I was like, because I was like a filmmaker, I was like videotaping everything and I wanted to make this like cool video and I want to do this like every time we would come back for like homecoming, because homecoming is like really big Howard. That didn't pan out, but like it was like two times and then we
finished it. But when I saw that, like that was like I could gather these people. I could get people to like give money to something, and at the end of the day, like it worked, and it had like that's how people they had a good time, and I had the proof to like because I made this little one minute video as like this is proof that it
actually happened. I realized, like I could start to congregate people and get people to buy into an experience of mine, right, and so that's how like you know, eventually that would lead to like colors and then R and B Only. The way that started was really playing the music at the end and being like whoa and I asked the crowd.
It was just that that moment I.
Had like I had the opportunity to legitimate market research, right because I stopped the music and I said, hey, guys, if I just did an R and B only event, would you guys come?
And the crowd erupted.
They just went you know what I mean, they went crazy, And that was the proof of concept. And then I did, you know, I said, Okay, here's here's the show that I'm you know, introducing it's called R and B only, and I made it free with RSVP. And that's important because I didn't just start charging people immediately, right, Like I gave people the opportunity to come for free, but it really wasn't free. It was them giving me their
email at the time. It was an opportunity for me to communicate with them in the future and let them know about my future events. And so I think that was the way to do it. And it's starting small, you know, like the first R and B only we did was in a venue that maybe held two hundred people. You know, it wasn't it wasn't like I didn't come out the gate like let's go for a thousand cap you know, a concert venue. I did it in a very very small bar, and then it grew rapidly shortly after that.
Yeah, So I was just saying, like a lot of that is commendable, right, just to go back. It's like a lot of times kids think like I have to be the front of the stage, right, Like I have to be the performer.
Right.
You flipped that and said, like I don't have to be the performer, I just have to be the curator of the crowd, like.
You are the MC on the stage.
Yeah, uh huh.
So my thing is like when when you realize that what type of demographics were you looking for to come to R and B only?
You know, at first, I was just like, whoever wants to come to this thing?
Right?
And so you know, I wasn't I didn't have a specific idea of the demographic of people that I wanted in mind. What ended up happening was after six months of sort of like doing it and like starting in three cities at first, then it expanding. I started to see, okay, these are the people that liked this show, and that was primarily young. I was just say millennial black and Latino women. It really depended on the makeup of the
city that we were in. But I quickly realized, like I thought that this was going to be something where, you know, men would love it because girls are coming here, and like, you know, a yeah, there's you know, if if there's a bunch of women here, men are gonna come.
And we have we have a male fan.
Base now, but our specific audience is definitely more female leaning, and so everything that we do within the show is with them in mind. You know what I mean, like, so now that we know who our audience is, we know how to talk to our audience. So a lot of times when you see like our voice on social media or our voice in an email, there are subtle, subtle things that make you feel like it's a woman talking to a woman. You know what I mean, because that's who the primary audience is.
Now, that's dope. And now I want to go back to what you said before.
It's a lot of times we over complicate things, right, business The key to business is keep it simple. So when you say, like market research, the best market research is to action market just as people. So you said, would you be interested? That's no different from going on Instagram putting a poll up in your stories. Hey if I did a live podcast, would you guys be interested? If we want to do a show about the music industry, is that a good idea?
Sound off into comments like this is perfect way right.
It's not a million dollars for people to do the a these analytics.
You have the audience, ask some question.
Yep, and you know what you know?
I think that another thing that people people miss is in terms of simplicity, right, And we were just talking about this with the name of your podcast, earn your leisure, right, Like you are talking about business moves and how to earn the ability to be able to relax. Right, it's from working, right, And when you know people now, R and B Only just like kind of rolls off the tongue and so when you say it, it sounds like a brand.
A lot of people know it.
You know, we reach a lot of people, and you know, people were well known at this point, right.
I always say like we're.
Well known unknowns because like the culture knows about us, but like we're not known on like a corporate level just yet. Right, Like there's a lot of people that are still within the music industry. It's because a lot of these people are dinosaurs. But you know, I digress. But who don't know about us? But but but in the beginning for for people to be able to know about us and know what it was and easily get people to come look at the name R and B Only, it's like we just play R and B music.
That's easy, no, you know what I mean?
Like now, now, granted we do have like hip hop sets every once in a while to like break the monotony of just you know, R and B music up. But but yeah, it's it's it's simple. It's like, I know what this is. You know what I mean, it's not called like you know, you know, slow dance, you know whatever, you know, you know, Yes, it's unnecessarily.
It's actually that's actually a really good point. You gotta give it to them where they can understand it immediately. R and B only don't actually what it is.
Because you're still you're still going to get people who don't underst and what it is because the concept is so new, right, So that's another thing. It's like, you know, in our culture, we haven't had something where it's a show but there's no performance essentially, right, Like when you say a show and it's at a venue that normal, you know, artists have concerts in people are just like what is this? Oh you you you don't know how many people ask us, well, what is this?
Is it a concert? Is it?
This?
Is it that?
And it's like we have tons of videos showing you what it is. You know, we explain that it is a DJ based experience, but still people are still like, you know, a lot of people just don't are lazy and don't want to do research and you know, a.
Lot of people don't have the brain because like even though our think like we put like we do events and we're like go to the event tab on our website, and people was like how.
Do I register?
Yo? Oh yeah, where do I go?
I just said it literally in the capture and you know where you're going to be.
Next, And it's it's it's to say this, it's to say, you know, people because we get those type of comments, right, So, like on our social media, you know, somebody will uh you know, they'll they'll they'll tag their friends in a comment and say like, hey, I want you to come with me to this, and then like you know, somebody will literally say like how much are tickets? And it's like you just need to click the buy tickets, you
know what I mean. So, but this is the day and age we're living in, right, where like people don't want to go an extra mile and an extra inch, right, yeah it's not a mile, but they don't want to click a button. But but you know they will be weeded out, right, So like those people that won't click on the events tab for you, those those are people that you probably.
Don't even want to do that anyways, you know what I mean, right.
And it's the same thing for us where it's like you know, push a t set at best, you know, if you know, you know, and that's kind of how we move.
You know.
It's like we always say our show, there's so much content about our go out there. There's so many videos, there's so many pictures. All you got to do is go to ig TV and look or go to YouTube, Facebook that there's there's media everywhere, and you know it's but but we still even say with that being said, we still say it's just better experience than explained, you know what I mean, Like if you if you can't get it from what we've already explained, then it's cool.
But you know, and then hopefully, hopefully you get there from the best marketing tool ever, which is word of mouth.
You know.
And the power is in the name once again. I mean, you go to LA, you tap in. The first thing you want to do is go to Rosco's Chicken and Waffles. You don't know to roscos Chicken and waffles, not knowing what they serve. They serve chicken and waffle, they serve all the stuff. But it's in the name, So all right, so now we're gonna go into We're gonna go in depth as far as the business model of where you guys are at now, because I think it's interesting. I
think it's something that people can really learn from. So that's what you're gonna go into in the next segment. All right, So now we're going to go into the second segment. We're going to this is what eyl is known for and why why he loves this.
We're going to go deep into the business side of things.
Right. So you have a booming operation right now, right, So can we talk about the inner workings of of how it looks? Because you said something interesting, you said, you know, you're integrated vertically. You know, sometimes you're always interested in so a lot of times, well people heard that, may have heard that for the first time with Lipsey when he said I'm integrated vertically, blew it and people
some people didn't fully understand what that means. So can you talk about what the vertical integration for you looks?
Like? Yeah, absolutely, I mean, so vertical integration is really just like owning the whole process of your relationship with your consumer. Right, So for us, I'll break down sort of like how an artist normally would get paid from like a live show or tour experience, and then I'll break down how we sort of attacked that model and how vertical integration applies in a live space. So typically a company, e let's just say first, an artist wants to go on a tour.
An artist has an agent.
That agent then says, hey, this artist is going on tour, and they reach out to promoters to essentially buy maybe the whole tour, and it's just like promoted by one company or individual promoters in certain markets, right, and they buy into a tour and they give that artist a guarantee that it would be like an age or live nation is the.
Two big examples of this.
And the agents are people like CIA ICM companies in that realm that represent the talent. So the agent says, this artist fee is let's just say twenty thousand dollars. So that artist shows up, performs, people buy tickets, and they get their twenty thousand dollars and they leave. Right now, that's normal. But the thing that the artist doesn't benefit from with that is the consumer data as well as things like the sales of concessions, and that's like food
and bar revenue. So how we flip that idea on its head is we don't ask for a guarantee for people to come to our shows. We just rent the venues, assume all the risk for the venue rental, and then we pay the venue whatever the fee is, and then we control the ticketing and when people buy the tickets from us, we retain that consumer data and we're able to remarket and talk to those people, you know, the
next time we come and do a show. The thing with an artist when they come in, you know, to a venue, if they want to come back, the only the only way that they can like stay in that same venue or move to a bigger venue is essentially if they're like hot, right, So you have to remain hot, you have to have songs on the radio, you have to you know, be doing all this stuff on Instagram and social media. And with us, we don't have to
have any of that. We just have to keep doing more shows essentially and build our consumer base and that just adds to the amount of people that we are able to then notify the next time that we come to the city.
That was like what you were saying earlier when you were getting the RSVPs. It was free, but the data was what you really wanted because you've been collected and tell people about the events that you're doing. Yep, right now on the what you're doing now is and you said this in your article, was like when an artist is high, it's easy to you know, get booked for a show, but the maybe five ten years when they're not, they don't have the clientele to even know who their audience.
They don't even know who their audience is, exactly, Like they're using all of these third party tools essentially, right, And you know we all know with Instagram, when you make a post, not every one of your followers is going to see that, right, And it's the same thing with an artist when you sell the But but it's even worse, right because like that's that's the most important people that you need to be able to communicate with.
Why because those are the people that are literally paying you, right, they are the ones that are that's an actual consumer versus just a follower, Right, somebody who's paid to go and see your show. You're telling me, like, if I'm an artist and I'm not able to talk to those people, that's insane to me. But but you give it up when you take a guarantee and you allow somebody else
to assume the risk. But the thing is that and and here's here's the real catches, where like, the more the more tickets that these large companies sell, right, their businesses, right,
they're just building their database. So now if they have three R and B artists that they've done shows with in the past, it's like they can just market the next R and B artist to because these people are interested in this, right and they and they're just huge troths of data essentially, these these large promoters and you know, but people just think that this is the only way that it can be done because for so many years it's been done like this, and people haven't like the
thing that's happened in the mus We've seen a influx of people taking a stand and becoming independent on the recorded music side, right, And so a lot of these artists that you see that they're saying like, I'm independent, you know, I don't want to sign a label deal, blah blah blah. Yes, they are independent on their maybe
maybe on their recorded music. But police believe that the new record label is just like you know, the live Nations and the AEG's of the world, and like they're still in these touring deals and they're not really independent when it comes to their live operation. And again there's nothing I'm not downplaying, you know, I'm not talking bad about the ags and the live nations of the world by any means. But I think that true independence is being independent in every single.
Especially especially if that's where most of the money is coming from. Like they're not taking as much money from the rest you're making it from when you tour, right, So thinking of the long term play where it's like, you know what, I could take this up for money now or long term. I can get the data and now I know my fan base going ten to fifteen, maybe twenty years, but I can still perform in these cities.
Absolutely the value is in it.
I don't think people I don't even want to brush over this because it's I don't think people fully understand how valuable data is. Facebook's just had the biggest settlement of fine in like the history of everything, and they'll take that because everybody knows what happened. They took it information. But that's how valuable your information is. It's a reason why when you sign up to all of these things. They act for your day of birth, to ask where
you live. They they this is like solid goal, right because now they can market to you forever.
They can market to you forever. They know your likes.
Now, they can figure out what kind of music you listen to, what kind of clothes you wear, every single thing that and it's like a lifetime as opposed to you go into a store and you buy candy. Right now, the only way of doing business is to say, okay, you brought that candy. I need you to come into the store every week, every day for me to make money off of you.
Right.
The new ways to say, okay, you brought that candy, but when you brought the candy, I made you fill out a form. So now I'm text messaging you pictures of chocolate bars.
And you know what.
Another point to make as as you know, if any marketers are listening to this, right, not not just consumers. But it's like, because data is so valuable, you need to treat it as such. You need to treat it as a precious thing. And you can't over extend. You know, you're welcome and your ability to market to people right, just because you have all this data. For instance, SMS with us is huge, right, Like being able to text our fan base and let them know when tickets are
seale are on sale, that's a huge thing. But we don't send many text messages because it's intrusive, you know what I mean. And if you send a text message to people you know too frequently, they will quickly unsubscribe from that, right, and and and the and the data that is so valuable and important will actually become meaningless if you abuse it. So you know, this is the thing that people need to understand, Like wild data is valuable, it's very important not to abuse that data.
Yeah, and you don't have to guess because like I said, now you can reach out to people and as opposed, they might not ever come back to your candy store. But that doesn't mean that they can't buy candy, right, They don't have to physically be there now. They can order it over the mail, or they can order it online. They can do a lot of different things. So this
is why data is so important. And if you think about it, it's something that you said to us off camera that made a lot of sense, Like even in iTunes, like you might sell you might stream a billion records, you don't know who's one of those persons that actually brought it, right, Like think about that, Like Drake probably, I think he broke the streaming record.
How many records of.
The stream he did a billion in the first week.
How many of those people does he actually have relationships with?
Right?
Right, that's a billion? Like that's crazy, right, use the computers.
Right yeah, yeah, Well that's a different conversation. So it's like I would rather actually have a million people or one hundred thousand people's information absolutely, then one hundred million people.
I don't know.
It's the same thing right with us, right, Like you know, I'm not going to share our like how many emails and phone numbers we have, right, but I will say it's it's multiple times how many followers we have on instagrams more, way, more, way more. We like this is why you know, when like I said, we're kind of like sleeping giants, right, because like we may have fifty something thousand followers on the R and B only Instagram page, but boy, when you look at that email and phone
number list, you know, you'd be surprised. And that's that's essentially how we build our consumer, our relationship, and that's how we'll continue to grow is by directly having a relationship versus having a relationships.
I think you coined the term on your audience.
Yeah, on your audience.
It was like you have that.
Direct line of communication with the people who are absolutely.
So all right.
And then as far as the monetary side, you guys put up all the financial so you can talk about that. You talk about that off camera two. That's a little different than the regular touring model. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely so.
I mean, and it's a lot of risk, right, so, like think about like I mean, certain venues that we play in. They may cost ten twenty thirty grand to rent these venues, right, so imagine if you're doing a tour, right, Like, that's a lot of upfront capital. And with a lot of these companies that own the rooms, you don't have to put the whole money up front, but sometimes it's half,
you know, or sometimes it's a quarter. And so when you're talking about thirty shows average of twenty to thirty thousand dollars rentals, you know what I mean, Like, this can get to be a lot of upfront capital that's going out and you have to plan these things way in advance, right, sometimes six months, sometimes eighteen months, depending on how big the show is and how the availability looks for something in a in a marketplace, because I'm not just competing with you know, people in like the
R and B space, right, these are the venues that everybody tours in. Right, So I'm competing with the rock acts that want to come and book shows there. I'm competing with the rap acts, the hip hop acts, the R and B X or anybody that's in the live space. That's who I'm competing with in terms of like holds on venues.
So you know, you.
Have to it's it's it's a it's a it's a capital upfront business that you don't really see the money until it comes back. Because then here's another thing that happens. A lot of people are wait last minute to buy a ticket to a show. Like think about the last time you all might have went to something, right, you might you might have said, oh, this thing is happening in this weekend, So I'm gonna get a ticket this weekend.
I mean here in New York, it's like these guys they know, like when I get tickets, I'm like the first guy in line, because I know they're gonna sell out fast, but that can't do it.
That that's interesting.
So as far as to say, okay, you're you're you're a promoter, right, you're promoting your own events, but you're a promoter.
I wouldn't say we're a promoter. But so I mean that's so that's another thing, right, Like in terms of the vertical integration, it's like we are the people that are actually like producing the event, where the talent for the event, we also market this show. So that's an aspect, you know what I.
Mean and what I was going with that as far as marketing, right, so promoting marketing, how do you want to phrase it? You you you put it out there for the public, right, what's the ratio that you look for?
Okay, the first week I need to have the tickets.
So that's a great question going into I need to like when do you start to like this is looking a little shaky, like yeah.
You know, you know, oh yeah, I mean there's been a few shows cancels man shout out to Myrtle Beats, South Carolina.
We love, we love everybody in South Carolina.
Yeah, but Yugus has got to buy tickets.
So essentially the way I can I can I can phrase it because everybod every place is different, right, some places you go to you might sell you know, in the in the in the first day when it goes on sale, which is the most important day, it might it might sell like you know, you might sell ten percent of the venue. You might sell five percent of the venue. But that show actually may be a sellout by the time doors open. You just you know, it
just depends. But I think if you do sell on an on sale, the term is on sale, right, like you have an announce. The way this works is you have an announce and you have an on sale. So typically we announce shows on a Monday, and then we actually go on sale on a Friday. So it gives people that window to sort of like register for a pre sale, and you incentivize people to buy tickets early.
So when a ticket goes on sale, that's typically the cheapest price that that that that that ticket will be and you're rewarding people for committing to the show early. And so the amount that you I feel like, you know, any event producer would want to be at maybe you're looking at Yeah, if you're at like fifty percent. That's great, you know what I mean. I feel like that's when we do numbers like that, we know that at what date the concet?
Yeah, or out? Yeah, like the first forty eight hours.
That's that's kind of how you know, like the show's on pace to sell out, you know what I mean. But yeah, then if you have a bad on sale, and we've had plenty of those before we got good at marketing, uh, you know, you might be at like ten percent, five percent, and then you're like, wow, it's going to be an uphill battle to sell the rest of.
These twenty sixteen right, R and B. Only that's when it launches, right, Yeah, that's what How many shows? How many venues were you guys looking at in that first year?
In that year we did, uh I think we did thirty something, maybe maybe thirty five, and then in two thousand, uh no, no, maybe we did. Know twenty sixteen we probably did twenty, and then the next year we probably did in the thirties, and then last year twenty eighteen.
We did sixty seven.
Yeah, so can we all right, So we talked about it as far as you guys, you put up the money yourself. Right, So obviously it's more of a risk, but you get more of reward also, right, definitely. So as far as the revenue, what is your revenue look like different from others? Like how like you get different parts that are regular person that's doing an event wouldn't get by not putting out.
Yeah, I mean, so you know, I got a shout out Live Nation. They're they're they're huge. Uh, they're they're not investors in our company, but we work with them a lot, and we have a very unique and incredible relationship with them, and so yeah, you know we we there's sometimes where we participate in bar revenue from certain venues.
Right.
Uh, there's certain times where uh, and that's just not just Live Nation. That's just across the board. Some some venues that uh that we're doing shows and some some sometimes we don't write.
Sometimes a venue might.
Be so in demand that they know there that they can sort of like offer this kind of deal and like give you anything from the bar. Some venues we participate in, uh parking, you know, concessions, which is food and beverage sales as well as tickets.
Right, Like that's something that artists don't get most of the.
King No, no, no, I mean you you the ones that do are probably like you know, they're so big, like the Taylor Swifts of the world, maybe the Beyonces of the world. Yeah, because it's something that a lot of artists. Here's the thing, there are not many artists that are producing their own shows. There are not many artists that are putting up the capital to do a show.
They're just getting a guarantee, you know what I mean, So like they're not their agents are not even asking for some of these things.
I remember a few years ago, I think, uh, Beyonce did a deal with Pepsi and they sponsored the entire tour. I think it was the title yea when when she was starting to do the baseball stadium. Yeah, I think she had just did the Super Bowl. They sponsored her Mars and then they did the tour. So like that's an example of where yeah, that's sponsorship. They're sponsoring the
entire tour. So maybe she's like I went to a few of their shows and it was like people, don't they forget about those calls like when you buy food at the venue, Yeah, when you pay forty dollars to park at the venue, all these things emerch at.
The merch at Yeah, and a lot of times when artists do do a merch.
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And and they're buying merch at a venue. Typically the venues taking some of that percentage, right, Usually it's anywhere between like thirty and ten percent that the venue is
getting just to allow you to sell merch in there. Yeah, which is another important reason why owning the data is important, right, because if you have a store that you can sell online, and you know, these people have came to your show, but you had the data to talk to them and say, hey, if you didn't get much of the show, you can get it online on my online store, and you're not having to pay a venue a certain cut of you know, that money.
Brian Leslie has something you're familiar with.
Yeah, of course with us. What's the phone app?
He actually reached out to me.
We had communicated in DM shout out to him, but yeah, he has superphone, right, Yeah, he has something similar to that. So do you think that this is what we're headed? As far as like you, everybody's on the wave of owning your masters and being independent. That's pretty much established now, even though a lot of people still don't own their masters. But at least that's kind of the narrative is out there, right, But not a lot of people are talking about this.
What you're talking about owning your information, owning your data. You think that's like the next wave.
I hope it is.
And I'm trying to be a person that champions that
right and that like helps people do that. I mean, one thing that I want to start doing is producing tours for other artists, but using this model that we have, right, so like maybe it's we come in with you know, or maybe it's not even a tour, right, maybe it's just a festival or one show that we help an artist do and so that they can see, like, hey, instead of letting, you know, some other person do it, like we can share the data, you know what I mean,
Like and you can actually own the data that you know, the five thousand tickets you sell. It would be nice to like talk to those people again, you know what I mean, And like you kind of have to do it in small steps to show people because like a lot of people don't realize the importance of it right now. But here's another thing that it takes. The reason why we've seen this movement towards independence in music and recorded music is because the cost of creating the music has
gone down so significantly right. It still costs a lot of money to produce a show for five thousand people or two thousand people or one thousand people. Right, there's a lot of upfront costs that you have to put out.
And and that's the thing, Like you can make a song for next to nothing right now, you can't produce a tour, let alone one event for next to nothing, right And so it's this is all a question of risk, right, Like I was just uh, really willing to risk all of my personal capital because what I I I knew that the idea I had was going to work out, and I was so I just believed in the idea so much, and I was so passionate about this thing.
But you know a lot of people are not willing to bet on themselves when it comes to money.
And that's that's what's gonna.
You know, and approach you to you just kept flipping, right, like, yeah, flip the profit, put it back in, put the profit back in.
Then you just get absolutely absolutely. I mean to this day, I still don't pay myself, you know, a salary. I pay my staff, you know, well before I take any money. And that's just that's just you know, I invest into office space. I invest into production, I invest into people, you know, I invest into yeah, like talent, you know
what I mean. And when I say talent, I don't mean just artists, right, I mean like employees and people who are going to help the operation grow because me taking money out and you know, buying myself something nice. You know, money is. I look at money as like a tool, right, Like money is. They're like workers. Every dollar is like a little small worker that can can build and turn into more dollars and turn into more opportunities.
But you have to put those dollars to work. If you just are buying something like you know, because you want to reward yourself, that doesn't necessarily it's that value is just gone the opportunity.
It's all about mindset. Once you start to realize, once you start to look at money like that, you will
never really want to buy nine. It's like it's like once you really start to look at it like that, when you start to understanding like that, right, because it's like, Okay, I can by this thirty thousand dollars rolex, but that thirty thousand dollars rolls is going to cost me one hundred and twenty thousand dollars, like you know what I'm saying, because because ultimately that thirty thousand could have got flipped four times in two years one year, So then you
become you got really got it. You gotta be careful because, like I say, now you can get to a point where you don't never want to spend money because it's like I'm putting everything back in but I wanted to. Actually I want to ask you one question. Also, have you did you ever get bank financing?
So I've a I've always taken out like loans and stuff, right, like bank loans. Yeah, well not from traditional banks but like more like startup company banks and stuff like that. And yeah, even now we have you know, various loans and stuff, and we have a we do have a deal with Live Nation that is not it's financing, but it's just essentially a loan.
It's like, let me actually, let me ask you a question because this is something that we ain't come I just thought about it. But at what point were you able to get a bank loan or a line of credit? This is something that entrepreneur It all comes down to funding money that we well a lot of businesses don't get off the ground, especially in our communities that they don't have money.
They absolutely they can't.
One probably we're gonna talk about funding the next episode, the next edition, I mean the next segment. But I want to talk about that right now. When were you able to secure a relationship with a bank to even get alan just I don't the first loan, so.
You know, it wasn't banks first, I was using I was using my American Express card.
Like a bank.
Yeah, like so so that is how you know, I was building my credit on there. And I was just like, you know, using that forty five day window to like
flip and make money, you know what I mean. So like once I once I started again to a point where I needed like serious capital, I was just like, okay, we got to use this American Express and like hopefully we have another event that happens, and then this money from this event will pay this American Express bill and then to move forward and keep putting holds on venues
like and that's it. And then the American Express, me being building the credit on there, was able to get me like other credit cards and that type of thing. So I the way that I funded the business initially was capital from credit cards and like paying those back as fast as I could, and then just.
The money that was being generated from the actual show.
Yeah, you went from I think five hundred thousand and twenty sixteen to one point two million in twenty seventeen, and then to two point one million in two thousand and eight.
Yeah.
Yeah, I mean that's just in revenues.
Revenue revenues. Yeah, that was one of your models.
It was like profit, we're going to anything, we're gonna we get right, We're reinvesting profit into product.
Yep.
Like that's a model that that is, like people should follow that, man.
Yeah, I think so. I think that, you know, especially when something's working. I always tell my team, like, if something's working, let's pour the gasoline on it, you know what I mean, Like let's let's let's make that little.
Spark into a wildfire.
All money in man, Yeah, for sure, for sure.
So now we're are going to the last segment, and when everybody's wenting to here, why you turn down a million.
Dollars sanity test? Pass it?
But all right, all right, so now we're going to go into everybody didn't wait in the air, right, So how could you? So you built the company and correct if the numbers is wrong. But this the research that we got in twenty sixteen, the gross revenue was one hundred and fifty thousand, right, but yeah, sixteen sixteen, yeah, okay, and then twenty seventeen we have five hundred thousand, yes, and then twenty eighteen we have two point one million.
Four hundred increase.
Yeah.
So then at that point and then at that point in time, you're blowing up and you need you need help, right, definitely need some financing outside of just flipping it and flipping it, So you seek the help of a venture capital right.
Well, yes, they they kind of reached out to me though. Well it was funny. I was talking to my agent and you know, he was just like, hey, you know, what do we want to do for next year and stuff like that. And this was in the early days with him, and he was just like I was telling him, I need some money, man, you know what I mean.
But you were putting a lot of the profit in.
I want to understand because people hate you like two point one million, and for the average person that doesn't understand business, they don't know the difference between gross and that. Oh yeah, and they think you're calling out of control, like why you need money? But two point one million, like you said, I mean that might mean a hundred thousand when it's all done, because you got to always put money back in this. You gotta pay your employees, you got book, So that doesn't mean or you might
even be a loss. Yeah, I mean there are billion dollar companies that there have.
Been plenty of shows where we've taken losses on like where there's been absolutely no profit exactly.
So all right, so okay, so can you talk us through this this VC experience?
Yeah, okay, So should we just start from the beginning, Yeah, okay. So, uh, basically, you know, I needed some capital, and I was I was going to banks and mainly traditional lenders, and I just wasn't getting enough, right, so maybe I could get from like you know, uh, a loan shark essentially like two hundred k here, one hundred k here, stuff like that.
But they were at crazy interest rates too, you know.
So uh, once the kind of word got out that I that I needed some capital, within you know a few people in the entertainment industry, people started to reach out and I talked to with this one company and at first, you know, they were they loved the business model, right because they were they were a music company as well, and so they loved the business model and they were like, this is something that you know.
We think we can you know, help finance.
And the initial offer they I had to give them my books, right, and they had to look into my financials and that type of stuff. So there all kinds of like agreement sign nda and stuff like that. But ultimately when they looked, they said, Okay, you know, we think a million dollars would help this guy's company out, but we want to take this large percent.
For a million dollars.
You own one hundred percent equity right now.
I currently own one hundred percent of Colors Worldwide. Yes, and the company was Their initial offer was for forty percent of the company at one million dollars, and that would have put me at like a two point one million dollar valuation and something like that. So initially I was just like, okay, you're telling me that the company is at a two point one million dollar valuation, and valuation just means how much your company is worth right now.
But I had I was that in that time parent frame, I was on paste or to make two point something million, right, So I was just like, usually to find the value of a company, there's a lot of different ways that it can be done, but usually you apply a multiple of revenues because in an early stage company, you know that you're doing exactly you know what you said, right,
which is you're putting moneies back in. So like revenue isn't important in the early stages because you're just trying to build audience, right, So you might apply a three or four times multiple.
So for me, I'm.
Looking like my company is at least worth six million dollars, and I really think it's worth like, you know, eight million dollars.
So those are the numbers. I was trying to get one point five.
Million at an eight million dollar valuation, right, That's what I was like really looking for.
And you know when they came in at.
The at the forty percent mark, I think that they just thought that I was like a young kid, you know what I mean, Who's just gonna like say, wow, here's a million dollars, this could help me out a lot, and just like give up that much ownership of my company. So then that's where the negotiation process started. But what you also don't realize when you're talking about equity investment is that there's so many terms that you're going to have to iron out, and this is going to be
a very long process. So from when they offered me that to when I ultimately turned it down, it was a five month process, you know what I mean, It took a really long time. And I'll just you know, I'll share some of the terms that you know, were unfavorable and that I didn't really like. Uh, you know, one of those was.
There were.
Thresholds essentially that that would you know, I could essentially not spend. In the early days of negotiation, I think it was like anything over fifty thousand dollars has to
get unanimous board approval. And for those that don't know, that's saying that, well, number one, we have to appoint a board to your company, right, and so the board would consist of me and then you know, representatives from their company, so like two other people, and to get any major decision done, you know, you would have to
everybody would have to say yes. Now, this is how normal companies work, right, Like, this is not anything that's weird or new, but we're talking about a small amount of money in the grand scheme of things to me, you know what I mean. So I'm not looking to have unanimous Bard approval over spending something as nominal as fifty thousand dollars when I've already built this company to make two point one in gross revelce.
Exactly.
Yeah, you know. So that was one of the the the issues that I had. Another another issue was divesting equity. Right, So like, uh, you know, there were stipulations in the agreement at certain points where it's like, my equity would have to vest in the company, right, So like I would have to uh, I would have to essentially earn back the equity that I already have, right, So I
already owned one hundred percent of the company. But let's say if my you know, equity went down to sixty percent, I would have to work.
I would have to agree to work at.
The company for a certain amount of time to get that equity back, right, and my equity would vest over years. But again, this is something that is not unusual, but it is unusual for somebody who has already this company's five years old, right, and I've already done this by myself. I'm not vesting equity and something that I've built from the ground up.
You know.
At one point they got the offer down to one million per.
Yeah, uh huh, and I mean huge jump, right, like huge jomp And that was because our revenues were literally coming in in real time, you know what I mean. This was this was happening at the end of twenty eighteen, and the revenues were going up, and they'll saw that. You know, we ended up being able to agree on that point. So then you know, the deal was starting to look a lit a little more favorable. But why I ultimately walked away from the deal was because the
threshold limits, right. So it was like I think I had to I think it was two hundred and fifty thousand dollars that if I spent any time anything over the two hundred and fifty thousand, I would have to
get unanimous board approval. And again, you know, I I haven't spent over two hundred fifty thousand dollars at one time yet, right, But that's that's how my company's revenues being two million, right, Like, but what happens with my company's revenues or ten million, you know, or twenty million at that the money that even now the amounts of money that I spend on things. You know, if you were have asked me last year, you know, would you have spent you know, over a million dollars in you know,
Facebook advertising in two years? I would have been like, yeah, right, you know what I mean, like on on paid ad campaigns. But those are the numbers we're talking about it, you know what I mean, like and and you know, in
in years spans. So now I'm just like, you know, I don't want to put myself in a position where when I want to do something, or let's say I want to buy a company, right like, let's say I want to get an equity stake in another company, and and and and the cost is going to be three hundred thousand, four hundred thousand whatever. You know, I don't want to be in a position where I'm having to ask for approval from other people that are a not
even a part of the culture. And know, you know, they might not know that this is an actual, real opportunity because they're not they're not a part of the culture.
You know what I mean.
In my head right now, like if an artist like Chris Brown is like, yeah, I'll do RB, only it's going to cost you three hundred and fifty in your head, on my head, it's like that's a no brainer.
Yeah, I gotta get him. But to ask people's approval, it's like.
It's like, yeah, they might not they might not know, they might not understand, you know, And and that that's the thing that really, you know, made me walk away. But why I was considering it so much was because I had real situations. I had real overhead. I have real employees that have to provide for themselves. They have, you know, themselves to feed. They might they might have families to feed, they might you know what I mean.
So these are this is this is why I was considering taking a deal like that, even though it sort of went against my principles, I knew that what was what was more important for me was that I need to pay my staff to be able to continue to make this thing move and operate. So I thought about it long and hard, and you know, they were still
trying to work out the deal. And then what happened was, you know, I just kind of I just knew that it wasn't right, and I just said, you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna walk away from this.
But what I want to do.
I don't I want to turn you know, I want to turn lemonade out of lemons and not just have this be something that is behind closed doors and that you know, only I know about, only my team knows about. And I want I wanted to help and share with other people. Look, this is something that you guys need to know, you know what I mean, Like, this is something that the up and coming entrepreneur needs to know when building a business and when running into a situation
where you feel like you're gonna need capital. Just know that these are things that you're gonna have to consider, right and and and and I wanted to really like explain to people, what, uh, you know that that these things are normal. But again, it just wasn't something that I was comfortable with because I had it would be normal if I was starting this company with these people, but I had already built this company, and then these
terms are coming into play. And then at the same time, you know, it was a way that like I wrote this article about my experience and that it kind of went, you know, semi viral, and and it was a way for the world to know that, hey, this is a company that maybe I didn't know about, but maybe this is a good investment opportunity, you know what I mean, Or maybe like I could I could open up another door with sponsorship or something like that and just let
people know about sort of like the business that we were doing. And yeah, you know, and and and the article kind of took off and we ended up we ended up getting getting alone actually from another company, and also in the midst of like a bunch of other you know, potential sponsorship things even right now, right like we actually just got our first sponsor for uh, for
an upcoming show. We we did a deal with a mobile banking app that actually helps you know, young people, uh with the banking system you know what I mean, that's like kind of broken right now and like charging a lot of fees for stuff.
Uh.
We've did a partnership with them where we're encouraging people in our audience to use this mobile banking system and they don't have to pay overdraft fees, you know, they don't. They can actually get paychecks if they're working in the gig economy, you know, uber lyft or at a restaurant where they're picking up shift. This company actually pays their their paychecks two days faster, stuff like that.
You know what I mean.
So now the one thing, the thing I like about the article that you wrote.
So you wrote the article when you decided, like you said, when you decided to turn down a million dollars. You wrote the article, but you wrote it right, and yeah, you put it on Twitter and the media just took it from there and they just made a different media outlets started to pick it up. So I say that to say because recently happened.
Shout out to I.
Think is the brother's name is Naje young, young gentleman from Philly, and he wrote he wrote something on Instagram. He wrote the article himself about himself and it was like four friends that like saved fifty dollars a week for two years and then they brought their first investment property.
They all like in their twenties.
And he wrote like a eye catching caption on it, like four friends saved money for two years and brought an investment property. And then like all of these blogs, social media started to pick it up. And then I posted it and it got like a lot of viewers that like, I think, I got like six thousand likes,
and he actually we actually spoke. So, but I said to say, a lot of times people complain about not getting pressed, but we in the day and age now where you could create your own press, right, So you made that article and that's really the reason why you're here now is because somebody sent me that and was like get them on the podcast and reached out. So
it's like, I think that that's brilliant. Whereas you had a story that's an interesting story, right, as opposed to trying to just pitch it to a million different publications and then waiting to see who picks it up, you put it out yourself. It went viral and then publications
picked it up from there. You got a whole bunch of opportunities because now it was great promotion, but it's also education as well, because, like you were saying to us, even with like you know, just you use an example of black women that graduate at higher rate than any right, but you know they starting businesses, but they may they get in funding at lower rate than anybody.
The lowest rate.
Let's be clear, black women are getting venture capital at the lowest rate. They're getting the smallest amount of venture capital of anybody getting venture capital in this country.
Right now.
But they are graduating. They are the most educated. They're graduating college in our country at the highest rate. That that's bananas to me. That doesn't make any sense. And it's like I wanted that article. And for those that that you know are listening, you can just google why I turned down a million dollars Jabbari or you know, just honestly, if you just google why I turned down a million dollars is the first thing that will pop up.
But I wrote it on Medium, and you know, I wanted like those people, those type of people to read this thing, right, like the up and coming entrepreneurs that look like us, to understand the pitfalls and the things that you should be like, even just if you are like some people, just needed to to get an introduction to what terms like valuation mean, or what terms like equity means, what a venture capitalist even is.
Right.
So it's just that you know, and it may take you twenty minutes to read the article, but I guarantee you that you will walk away from the article with some information that you that you might not have known before. And you know, I tried to make it entertaining. I put jokes in there and stuff like that. But it's just like it's informative, and I think that that's the
that's the main thing. It's like, right now, we are using so much of our time to entertain us, but how much of our time is actually informing us when we're when we're spending hours on these social media platforms, you know, And that was the whole goal with like what the article is just trying to inform us.
Yeah, I appreciate that. So all right, So what's next? What's next for colors.
In R and bl oh Man?
So huge, huge recent announcement is we just announced our first R and B only music festival, So for anybody that's in Orlando, Florida, honestly for everybody in America and you know fly in Man. So uh, you know, like we said, our our show is primarily a DJ based show, and sometimes we have guest artists pop out. We've had people like Jaqui, Kishako, Omarion, We've had a lot of R and B stars tank perform at our shows.
And now this is.
The first time where we've announced artists that are actually gonna be there and they're performing. It's an outdoor venue, We're gonna have food, trucks. We're gonna have actually I never haven't announced this yet, but this is a exclusive. We actually have two helicopters that are gonna be at this show where you can take helicopter rides and fly above the festival and like take pictures.
And stuff like that.
Yeah, it's gonna be you know, crazy. It's at the place, this place in Orlando called the Orlando Amphitheater, And yeah, I mean tickets are selling fast, so we really you know, hope you guys. Yeah, yeah, Ashanti, Queen Nija, and a new R and B artist by the name of y k O Cyrus who has like a top Billboard hit right now.
It's called worth It.
It's like I would get he's on a couple of Double XL. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Freshman.
You just gotta be worth it.
I'm not an R and B sit, but you know a lot of puns when when you sing the song people know what you're talking about. But yeah, he's a freshman this year on Double XL. The only R and B artist on the fresh of the list. And yeah, it's it's uh, that's gonna be huge for us. We also have another show with the Shanty and and another up and coming R and B artist by the name
of Keanu today this Friday. By the time they hear this, it might be over but in d C. But yeah, the music festival, it's the biggest, Yeah on two.
Gigs with us.
Yeah yeah, but but yeah, if you go to R and B only dot com, slash Orlando, or just find us on Instagram at our n B only the letter N you know, that's where all the info is man and you know, you can see past shows, what we have going on in the future. But yeah, so that's that's huge for us in terms of the show elements. We also have you know, a bunch of shows where we're DJing and just like our current team, like we
have Miami coming up, we have Sacramento. We have a big show in LA coming up that's kind of like a farewell to LA because we're taking a break until we do another music festival in Los Angeles. And then yeah, Merch new Merch is coming. We have media coming. We have a bunch of shows that we're working on that would be like digital shows in the R and B space. We're really trying to own R and B. So we want anybody who knows about R and B music in
the genre. We want R and B Only to be synonymous with that and not just a live event, but also content also you know audio content, you know music, like we eventually we want to start putting out compilations, right so remember back in the day, like Rough Riders Volume one, two and three. We want to do that for R and B, like R and B Only Volume one, two and three, Like the type of thing.
You have those commerci was where they had the R and B like the CDs. It would be like thirty songs.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah exactly, like yeah, yeah, yeah, uh huh, so like like that, but just like you know, not for for today's consumer, right, so like stuff that would be on Spotify, Apple Music, that type of stuff. But yeah, just really being the curators and purveyors of R and B music. We even signed the R and B artist you know, his name is Will Wildfire. So he's been like opening up shows for us. Go check him out too.
That's incredible, yeah for a new artist, right, like he's able to like get in front of this huge audience that we have around the around.
The nation, you know.
So yeah, there's a lot of stuff coming even even and that's just on the R and B only front, right, But as Colors grows, we're gonna start producing other events and live shows and other verticals that were underserved. We thought R and B was a huge underserved market, and so you know, we're we're looking in places where you know, there's other opportunities, right, So maybe it's food, maybe it's Latin music, maybe it's you know, certain things in the
beauty category. But with comedy, yep, yep, comedy, where we've got a lot more stuff happening in comedy in the
near future of twenty twenty. Yeah, So you know, uh, even even if if people have events right like, I'm even interested in if there are certain events that are happening right now and that need help and that are looking to grow and expand and you know, have the potential for a national footprint, I'm interested in potential partnerships, you know what I mean, and putting those events under the Colors umbrella and and and helping expand, you know, and and and do partnerships with.
People as well. So that's something that you know we're looking at as well.
What's your Instagram?
So my instagram is jabari is It's simple j A B A R. I is just my name.
Sometimes I say just your Bari and then people be like, oh, it's just like j Ust. No, it's it's just my name Jabbari. And then uh, the R and B only instagram is at R and B only, and the Colors Worldwide Instagram that the parent company that owns R and B only is just Colors Worldwide.
So pretty simple for all those.
Keep it simple, Keep it simple, right, busy man, Sure, yeah, yeah.
Shout out to everybody on patreon dot com Backslasher and a Leisure.
You know that is our private pay program.
We've had a lot of supporters, uh you know that have come on there, got advice from us, had conversations with us. I want to give a shout out to Terry. He's on one of our older patrons. He actually did a video shouting us out Alan Oakland, So shout out everybody in the Bay, shout out to Terry. And like I said, every every episode. It's a five tier program. You can join any at any level and we're gonna provide information to you either way. There's some bonus content
on there as well. You get a chance to get the podcast. You know a few days earlier obviously with no ads and yeah bonus features, So keep logging onto that. Our merch is up on earn leisure dot com. We have some new merchant that's coming up as long as as well as some few initiatives that we're gonna be launching in a very near future for sure.
And then once again, as I said previously, my calendar is on earn your leadire dot com as well. So a lot of time people ask me. Everybody knows I'm a financial advice at this point. So you have questions, you got inheritance, you want to roll over all four one K from a job, you want to invest, you can feel free to book a thirty minute free consultation. My calendar is on earn your leadire dot com and that choice that will also be rolling out some very
exciting things that we're excited about very soon. My book tip of the week is what's a gift from Jabbari to us? It's called Ego is the Enemy by Ryan Holliday. So we talked about it off camera as far as a lot of times ego, egos to the enemy and everything, business relationships, all kinds of stuff. Ego can lead you to make very bad decisions, and your pride can put you in very bad spots. So mastering your ego. Understanding your ego is extremely important. So that is a book
tip of the week. Check it out for and thank you guys for rock orders. Well see you next week.
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