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All right, guys, welcome back EYL Episode.
Twenty eight, twenty eight weeks and.
Twenty eight monumental. First and foremost, we have to think Black Enterprise sure for featuring us that that was a very that was a good, gracious article that they did for us.
It was a number one share story last week.
I saw that almost about that three thousand shiar So shout out to everybody for sharing it and all of the response that we've gotten for that. It's very encouraging, very encouraging. So thank you, Thank you for Black Enterprise. We appreciate you, Nicole Webb, thank you for writing the story.
We appreciate you. Well done.
And then we also have to shout out curl Fest amazing. Shout out to older girls, a curly Girl collective. We actually attended for the first time.
It definitely won't be our last time. Yeah, it was just beautiful to.
See melan and celebrated and everybody come and have a good time, and I was in all of it.
Yeah, for sure. Episode twenty five. If you haven't listened to episode twenty five, that's what Samone Marris. She's one of the co founders of curl Fest. Curl Fest is the largest natural heir festival in the world, So that check that episode out. It's a good one. She dropped a lot of gems on women here and also on the festival industry, so we actually went. This is our
first year actually going and attended. It was twenty thousand and thirty thousand people there and it was it was dope, just crazy, really good.
And they're not done that. They're gonna be doing Atlanta. So Atlanta, get ready they come in your way out to them.
For sure, for sure, but we're gonna jump right until. We got a very very special show. We actually we're doing a little different this week. We got so much information that we want to give out to the public that we're gonna release two shows this week. We're gonna do our show what you're listening to right now Tuesday, five pm, and then we're also going to drop on Friday.
We did that before episode twenty four.
We did episode twenty four, but this is just gonna be two different episodes. And we got some information for our international listeners as well on this on the episode that's coming out Friday, because we get a lot of feedback. We get a lot of positive feedback from from people all over, from Africa, from Europe, from Asia, and they're like, you know, we want to have a little bit more of an international field.
So they love the content, but sometimes it doesn't relate to their country.
Yeah, so we got some international information as well as information for the globe. And I always say even for people that live in America, don't limit yourself to America. Like the world is big, right, So the international information isn't just for international listeners, for you too, because we need to give money every single way in the world, and we need to educate ourselves everywhere in the world that the world is flat, not literally like Kyrie IRV.
It's flat as far as information information is the same. This is why we we can be on the charts in Dubai being the charts, in Botswana being in charts, and and Trinidad, Jamaica all of these different places, is because we receiving information at the same time right now. So it's a level playing field. So we need to educate ourselves on what's going on all over the world, not just what's happening in America, for sure. So a very special guest today, Fritz Charles, thank you for joining us.
Thanks a legend in his own right.
Appreciate that for sure, for sure. So he's going to tell the story, but very interesting story. You got a lot to talk about from Wall Street to Crypto and one of the things that we've been getting requested to cover the most is cryptocurrency.
Right, we got some stories.
Yeah, so we got our own personal story, but we wanted to bring an expert in the fielding as well. So he's an expert in the field as well as a bunch of other things as well. So we're going to get into crypto. But before we start, we want can we get a backstory on how you got here because your story is really interested as far as working
in Wall Street and you were with the infamous Lehman Brothers. Right, that's right, all right, so yeah, all right, can you explain that because that's that's that's an interesting story now for sure.
For sure, I try to make it as concise as it could be because it's it's pretty long. But I think, first off, thanks for having me. But yeah, like you said, you know, it's kind of the personal background is a group in Queens, born in Queens, New York. Ten college at Brew College in New York, study finance. And my first job out of school was at Leman Brothers. But is not common. Yeah, yeah, I went hard for that job. It was definitely a job that it's a dream job.
Leman Brothers at the time, this is two thousand and six. You know, I would say, you know, probably you know, it's Goldman Sacks and like Leman Brothers, Morgan Stanley wille On that next.
Level investment bank. Ifnybody's not familiar, Leanan Brothers was one of the biggest investment banks in the world. Yeap on Wall Street like Goldman Sacks, same.
Level as exactly. And so I got a job there as a as a trader. So I traded equity derivatives mean equity swaps, equity options, and my clients were hedge funds and crazy fun job, you know, really intense. I was twenty two years old, kind of doing transactions that were in the billions. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, the intention of billion six digits six digits as as a as a twenty two year old out of Queens is major.
And then I, you know, did my thing got you know, you kind of the way you're hired as an analyst. So you do two years as an analyst and they decide what to do with you, and I got promoted to associate. And this is two thousand and eight, you know,
two thousand and eight. Obviously the financial crisis happened and about three months after got promoted, we went bankrupt and so and then what happened was it was like three days where people didn't know what was going on as far as like whether it was a you know, whether the building will be open, whether we had insurance. You
were just basically working for bankrupt entity. And then we got word that Barcleys brought us, and then there was like a whole lot of hoopla as far as like who who's going to be left with Barkleys, Who's going to get laid off? And I was one of the fortunate people to keep my job, so I ended up working at Barcleys. This is before the Barking Center, so I didn't get any tickets.
So that's all right. So the financial crisis of two thousand and eight, when banks were closing left and right, Wall Street was in a mess, and you were trading very complicated swap derivatives. Can you give eleventh grade explanation on what swapped derivatives?
Yeah? Yeah, So basically what it is is basically it's a it's a contract that says I traded equity swaps on basically equity indexes. So the most popular equity index is the S and P five hundred. So you always hear about if you watch CNBC or even watch any news, they say, oh the market, we're up five percent nine
times out of ten. They're talking about the S and P five hundred, and so the s P five hundred is five hundred stocks, right, so to trade it, to trade five hundred stocks, especially if you you know, you're not the hugest hedge fune or hugest client, like that's really complicated. But what you can do with us is, all right, well, we'll give you a contract that gives you the same return of the five hundred stocks, will
take care of like buying all of them. And then what you have to do with us is you give us an interest rate. So we're going to say, all right, well you pay us three percent. What we used to quote it as is LIB or library is a London Interbig offering rate, which is basically like it's almost like the international Federal funds rate. It's like the set rate. Like sometimes you hear about people talking about all the Feds going to raise rates or whatever. This is like
the international version of that. So you so the hedge fund, says, I say, the hedge fund all right, Well you want the return on SMP over a year, I'll give you that, but you got to go and pay me, you know, five percent something like that for that. So if the SMP goes up above five percent, let's say the SMP goes up seven percent seven minus two seven seven minus
five is too they're doing well. The SMP is below five percent, then they're out of money, right, So it's kind of like this weird it's almost like a bet, so to speak.
How much money was being traded on that.
So yeah, I mean normal transaction with these clients would be five hundred million, one billion, Yeah, and so they'll call us up like I want to move five to move a billion dollars worth of investment B five hundred and we would take that trade for them. And you're doing that at twenty two years.
Old, yes, and you're doing that every every day, every day. So he was traded from thirty to four straight billion dollars every day basically.
Yeah.
So the reason why I say that is even if the average person probably will never invest in this type of investment, it's important to understand and know. Right, we had ashcash showing. It was a great interview for US, and he spoke about when he worked in a bank.
He used to be the CEO of a credit union, and he spoke about when he was on behind the scenes of a bank, and he started to see that wealthy people had a team of people that was working for him, right in so much stuff that the average person black, white, Chinese, the average person has no idea what happens. Right, But these things affect the world, right, and so it's like a small group of people that really affect the whole world. Right, So that ties into it,
the Lehman Brothers going bankrupt. So people I don't think people fully understand, or maybe they forgot because we have short term memories about two thous Right, how did how did two thousand and eight happen?
When?
If you're not familiar, if you're too young, that's when the financial crisis hit. We had the worst recession since the Great the Propression. Stock market was down like forty percent, the housing market crashed, Everything just fell apart, right, the perfect storm. And then the banks, big banks had to get bailed out, of course. So but this all started because it was in England. It was it was a trading block in England, right that was doing prime mortgages, some prime mortgage.
Now is US. It was England, Yeah, that was England. It was a US. So you know, the investment bank is split in between a couple of different divisions. So there's investment banks that kind of helps people go public like IPO and stuff like that. Then you have the capital market side, which was I was in and you split that between fixed income and equities. Equities just mean stock. So my style was talking about was doing stock. But the other side is where they focused on bonds, mortgages,
a bunch of other things. And so what they would so the way that mortgages happen, if I go get a mortgage from like Bank of America or something like that, or local credit Union, they give me a mortgage and then now they have they're basically accredited to me, right, and they take that, but they take like a thousand of me and they put the mortgages together and then they go to Lian Brothers or some other bank and they're like yo packages together and sell it for me.
And so what Leman Brothers does is they give you the upfront money. Let's say let's say he does a I'll give you a mortgage for a house that's like two hundred grand whatever, and over time people they pay interests and stuff like that. Maybe I don't want to wait thirty years to give my money back. I'll go to Lian Brothers. I was like, you know what, there's two hundred grand, there's two hundred grand mortgage. I'll sell it to you for like two hundred and ten grand.
And by the way, I got one hundred of those. Put it all together. And then what Lehman Brothers does, or all the investment banks, they take it, put it together, they chop it up, and they sell it to different people. Right, but if the mortgage it so, but the way that they price it is the risk. Right. So there's people that put five percent in their homes. These people got five to twenty credit you know credit scores. Some people
have seven hundred credit scores. Those things based the market says, you know what, I'll pay you a premium for the good credit people. I'll pay you a discount for the
bad credit people. But if the people in the middle are not communicating straight what the underlying assets are, right, or what was happening at the time you had you had a real estate market with that was going up for so long, so that people people that people with like five hundred six hundred credit scores and making only fifty ks stated income, Right, we're getting houses that were like half a million dollars.
We not to cut you off, but we covered stated incoming. We didn't really talk about stated income, so people might have the income. Stated income was a policy in the mid two thousands where you can state your income. So if anybody is familiar with the process to get a mortgage, you got to jump through hula hoops to get a mortgage, right, you got to like bring your tax documents for the last two years, and you gotta bring all kinds of stuff.
They gotta check your credit all at But in the mid two thousands, it was you just walking to the bank and you state your income and whatever you stated your income, that's what they said.
So you can say I made one hundred fifty thousand, You could say I made a half a million, half a million.
You can be a gardener and make fifteen dollars an hour and going to a bank and say I make five hundred thousand dollars a year. They take your word for it, and they give you a mortgage based on a million dollar home and people was doing that. It was crazy. Yeah, one hundred percent.
And that's and the only reason people were doing that is because they didn't have to hold the bag right like they were like, all right, because if you're a bank and I give you, I mean just thinking about anybody. If I give you, know that person my homeboy alone, and I know he doesn't have a job, No, he can't pay me back, but I have to wait for
that person to pay me back. I'm not gonna probably give my homeboyd a loan, right, But if I knew, I could take my homeboys loan and pass it to somebody else and they they are unhooked for and they got to worry about collecting from him. Somebody left holding the back. So that's what happened. Because of the cap of markets, you were able to do that super efficiently. And that worked for a few years because all the
real estate prices are going up and up. Right, Because even if if I have a loan against the house and a person can't pay and the house goes up, I'm good. So I'm okay with that, right, or that person is okay because they're more likely to pay me. But until that stops. It's like musical chairs, right. So anyway, Lian Brothers was a leader in that. Basically they took
those packaged mortgages and sold them out. But what happened was it's good when you could just pass them out, but then when you can't liquidate them as quickly, and then now you hold them the bag, and then real estate prices go down. Then people default, they're not paying their mortgages. The houses that are behind the mortgages are not as valuable. Right, it becomes this cycle. And then now Lien Brothers, now Lim Brothers has bad credit on their books from the people they give credit to. Then
people don't give Lian Brothers credit. Right then the stock market it's like yo, I heard Lim Bros can get credit. Then it becomes this spiral, and then Lim Brothers has a transaction with bes Terns and best Sterns a transact with Javin Morgan. Now people are like, oh, actually I know you. I know Lian Brothers, lim Brows can't pay the money, and I know Lim Brouh's owes you, so now you screw too, and now I'm not gonna buy your stock. And then everything kind of just went in a cycle so that you.
Know what it sounds like to cut you off. You know what it sounds like. So it almost a Ponzi scheme, right, And if you understand how Ponzi schemes work, you only really get screwed in the Ponzi scheme when things go bad. It's not a lot of people make money in the Ponzi scheme like Bernie Madoff.
Right.
If you invested early with Bernie maydof, you made a lot of money, right, because the thing about it is he's taking new money and he's paying the old investors, and then he's just kind of repeating the process. Right. It only goes bad when people ask for their money back in bulk. You don't have enough to cover it. But as long as nobody really acts for their money in bulk, you can keep that thing going. He kept it. He kept the scam going for thirty years because it's
nobody really asks for anything. You're giving people twelve percent a year, why would you ask for your money back.
You can kill a recession. Haapens.
Well, that's what I'm saying. So it's all good when you when you hedge these kind of bets, until it's not all good anymore.
It's all good till it's not. Exactly, it's like it's all good till it's not good. So then, so how how quickly did did these guys go under? Like?
How I could that happened like in a couple of months, right, Like.
Well, it happened a couple of months. But like I guess O seven is when things got a little bit hairy. But then like things stabilized in early O eight. So bear Stearns was the world want to go down? So bear Stearns going down probably like the first quarter of O eight, Lean Brothers was you know, people, the stock just started going down. So stock stock probably was trading in the one hundred and twenty and forties and like
throughout the year just kind of kept going down. And I don't know if you you guys covered this on your podcast previously, but basically there's these people that called short sellers. You could basically bet that the stock's going You haven't covered that, can you talk about it? So basically short selling is like it's weird, but basically what you do is you say, all right, I think this stock is gonna I think this company sucks, I think
this stock's gonna go down. I'm gonna go to my broker or to a bank and say, let me bow that stock. I'm gonna sell it, and then I'm gonna buy it back later on at lower price. So the stock is at fifty and you know, you know the company is not making money, or you think the company's not making money, you say, all right, I'm gonna buy it back later. I might buy it back at twenty five. I bought it, I barred, I sold it at fifty,
bought it back at twenty five. That's twenty five dollars profit, right, And so it's actually reversed because obviously usually what you do is you buy and you sell. In this case, you sell then you buy. And the way you're able to do it is because these firms will take other people's assets, like other people's stock, and lend it to you. It's similar to how people take people's savings account and use those as loans. Right. And the question is like, why would a bank do that? You actually pay an
interest rate on that money through while you have it short? Yeah, because that's the big short you ever read that book? Yep, big short movie that that movie's powerful, and that's what these guys.
Did they made a bunch of a bunch of money, a boatload of money from shortened.
Yeah, they were shortened. That there's shortened, there's mortgage access. They predicted that this happened. Yeah, exactly.
And you went to war in school of business, right, that's right after that, So.
That that comes because of what happens at Yes, I go to Leman and uh, you know, at the time, I thought I hadn't made.
I was gonna be working in that place till I was older, stacking bread and maybe investing on the side. But like I thought, I had my career made. But as that was happening, I was seeing what's going on. I was and also what I what I think about investing trading particularly, You're really like your skill set is
your skill set. You can't take anywhere else. Right, if I traded that one thing, I can't even go and straight bonds after that, Like the only jobs I could get was at another bank doing the same exact thing. And guess what, noneing we're hiring. And you know, like I said, I went to cunitybrew College and it was a great school, great education for the money, but I felt like that was a time where I really need a network, and also I need to kind of think
about where I want to take my career. I want to do something a little bit more I have more control over, and I decided to apply business school and I ended up getting to Warton and what they're Yeah, the other.
The third person who's coming You're the third person that's come from from Warren. That's during the podcast. Shout out to Brandon Copeland. Yeah, Derek Ferguson, Derek Ferguson, those are all both great episodes. They got a lot of pressure to lift up too. But so Warren, if anybody's not familiar, is one of the best, if not the best business school in the world, not just the country, the world. So we have our third Warren alumni here and he just gave you a very good, uh breakdown of very
complex trading. So you just got an Ivy League education in twenty minutes. The university once again, once again we provided free education for you guys. So you're welcome. So now we're going to go into the second segment where we're going to talk about cryptocurrency, bitcoin and everything you need to know about it. All right, So now we're going to go into what everybody's been waiting for. We're gonna break down cryptocurrency. Before we go into cryptocurrency, we
gotta tell a story. We'll tell our own personal story about crypto we avolved. Yeah, so if you know, if you, if you, if you listen to the podcast, you know that a our theme is transparency. We tell you know, our real stories in real life, and our guests tell their real stories. And we also have the slogan of all money in shout out to nip rest in peace. But it's real because we really tried everything at one point in time. We literally tried everything.
Exact.
We tried everything. So all right, so here's the story on cryptocurrency, right, so two thousand and seventeen, right the draft, we got to take it back to the draft of twenty seventeen. So Donovan Mitchell shout out to Donovan Mitchell, right, hometown hero. And we were at the Barclay Center because we're good friends with his family and they invited us, and we were at the sweep when he got drafted.
The mess Yeah.
Once again, the Knicks screwed that up and didn't draft.
Yeah, we were sitting there, like you know, the Knicks had a chance to do it. He worked out for them. Dad was like, I think they got a chance and nope.
Yeah that's frank.
They didn't drafting, but he got drafted by Utah. But anyway, we were there with his family and one of our good friends. So her kid went to a private school and one of his friends. This is why networking is so important, right, people that you meet. His friend was like a twenty year old kid, right, And I just met him and we were just talking randomly, like what do you do for living? On a financial advisors So we just started talking. Mind you, he's twenty years old
at this time. Think he's like a freshman or sophomore in college or something like that. And he's telling me, he's like, you know, I just bought this e theory. He's like, I put twenty thousand into ethereum. You know, I put ten thousand to ethereum like five months ago and it went to one hundred thousand. I cashed out. He said. My friend put one hundred thousand into Etheroreum. It went to a million. He cashed out. He started a hedge fund.
What is twenty years I don't even think he might have been twenty. I think he was eighteen ninety. I think something like that as a graduation gift.
Yeah, well you know that. And that's the power of family, of course, right, he wasn't from our community. That's for them.
Sure that story.
So when he told me that, I told you more. I'm like, well, we got like what's this? Like this because I heard about cryptocurrency. I heard about bitcoin, but I ain't really hit about Ethereum. I'm like, hold up, wait, like what's going on here? And that's when I started studying it, but I still was kind of apprehensive. I ain't really sure. And then I see bitcoin. I'm just studying it. I'm just a student of the game, and like October, I see bitcoin just start climbing. It went
from like six thousand to seven thousand. No, I went from like three thousand, yeah, like four thousand to like five thousand. So then I called my man shout to Jason Lewis. I called him and he's a bitcoin expert, and I'm like, okay, tell me everything I need to know about cryptocurrency. He educated me for two and a half hours, and I asked every single question that I could have asked, like a thousand questions. Every question I had. He educated on me on it, and I was like
around November. That was like November, actually late October. It was late October. No, no, it was like November. No, November, it was November. So I'm like, all right, cool. So I found out this app called coinbase where you can buy cryptocurrency. Right, So he educated me and he was telling me about like the three biggest currencies at that time, which is light coin, Bitcoin, and ethereum. So he's telling me about it. So I'm like, all right, you know what I'm gonna put my money in. I put six
thousand dollars and I told the group. I told the guys, I'm like, look, I put six thousand dollars and I spread it across the three coins. I'm like, I'm not telling y'all to do this. This is money that I feel comfortable losing because it's a it's a risk, Like I feel comfortable losing it if I lose it. But I don't know what's gonna happen. So then me and Jamaal we go to Asia for a month.
Right, this is now December.
Yeah, we went to Asia for twenty days in December. First we left for twenty days.
Don't let that go over your heads. Twenty days.
Now, I let a life you can write a book on. I'm gonna write a book down.
A life done.
But we went to Asia with a return ticket. We went with a ticket there and a ticket back and two nights in Bangkok. That's it for twenty days. We were gonna figure it out as we went. We just winged it. We went to five different countries. Was just winging it as we were literally winging it, like we were buying hotels at the airport. He was just figuring it out day to day. So I'm in Asia and it just so happened as fate would have it. I brought into the crypto space like one week before it
started to skyrocket. But if anybody's not familiar, No, December of twenty seventeen is legendary in crypto world. Like every think went up like a thousand percent, one hundred, like it was crazy. So long story short, I'm in Asia and I had six thousand dollars invested. Every single day I'm waking up and I'm just getting five hundred, six hundred more dollars is going up seven thousand, eight thousand.
It's just doping mean, yeah, yeah, I'm out and I'm out in Thailand, and I'm more focused on that than anything. I'm like, this is crazy. I'm like, I'm about to make a million dollars before summer. Son Troy starts, so I'm like, I'm telling the guys. I'm like, I'm sending them screenshots like I don't know what y'all doing. I'm getting money out here. So Troy is like he starts studying it, like he's start one thing about toys, good
with research. So he starts studying it like he's up all night, no sleep, and he starts telling me about all these other coins, Tron and all of these different things. And by meanwhile, I'm thinking I'm doing good because I'm going up like one hundred percent, three hundred percent, four hundred But he's like that's not enough. He's like, you earning, but that's not enough, these other coins going up a thousand percent, three thousand percent. He's you got to come home, Like I never forget.
I was in Hong Kong.
I was in Hong Kong, and he called me.
Like come home because this is like fact, right, So I heard about bitcoin prior to all this, right, because I was in the music downloading the services.
Right.
So at that time, the US had said early two thousand and they were like, yo, they're going to prohibit illegal downloads.
Right.
So the people started coming up with web sharing sites like mega upload, rapid shit, if anybody downloaded music, you know those sites. And one of the things as far as payment was bitcoin, right, and there's no way that the government.
Can track you.
So I'm like, all right, that sounds pretty cool. And then I never heard about it again. Right, people were using it. I kept seeing it. I never heard about it until like November, and I was like, yo, I'm putting money in.
Like he's like two weeks from leaving.
I'm like whatever. And then like he said, he started texting us. I'm like, yo, this he actually made some money. So now it's like nah, I gotta figure this out. So he leaves and I'm like still trying to figure this out. I'm studying and studying it, and like I
never forget. I read the this article on this dude, Justin's son who created troyn tr rex, and so I'm like, wow, this guy has a vision for currency, Like he's gonna do it through video games and right, I'm thinking, like wow, like Gods of War, like these are these games where it's like it's not real money anymore, Like people are actually using currency inside of games. It's like how before Fortnite, it was like, yo, we'll give you the game for free, but you'll buy things in it.
And I'm like, all right, well, how do I get this? Right?
So after I start studying it, right, I knew coin Base, and I'm like, this gotta be more to this, right because I can't even find t rex on Coinbase, right, And so I studied and then I hear this this this company called Binance. And when I went to I'm telling you, it was like three in the morning. I had to wait because they were on like yeah, twelve hours ahead. How many twelve hours I waited? I said, listen, get you on, y'all gotta come home. Like I'm like, yo,
book a flight back. I found something, I said, book a flight back. Fact, we found something. He kept talking about trying like this, trying. I'm like, I don't know, man, about Tron. I got like less than a cent.
You know, it's funny, literally, you know you were like in a home with Tron. Yeah yeah, right, spot he just had to find that community. It was crazy, I remember it was. It was a Hong Kong ko. Remember in the background was all these lights.
I was Hong Kong.
I was like them all almost died in that story for a different day, he almost died, But I was a Hong Kong by myself, and I had all these lights in the background.
You like, come home. I'm like, I'm in agient. I'm having the time of my life.
Come home right now.
So he So he came home, and when I got home, the first thing I did, I came to his house and he educated me on how to like buy buy coin. It's a whole process. We're gonna talk about that, but how to buy coins, how to put the money in.
All that stuff, right, market caps, all that.
So then I so, so anybody that knows me, you know that I kind of have an addictive personality. I've never done any drugs in my life, and I'm a light drinker, but I'm very compulsive. It's worked out a lot of times, and it's been very bad for me a lot of times. But I make very composed decisions. So when I started, I started making money, and I'm like, okay, so now educating myself on what we call all coins.
We'll explained that later too. So then I just started, I'm like, you know what, I just started rolling the dice. I started like buying coins and doing on and hour was it was crazy. So by like the first week in January, my six thousand grew to twenty eight thousand, yep, twenty eight thousand dollars in a month, six thousand and twenty eight in a month. And I'm feeling like Warren Buffett Vincent.
We said it to ourselves, We're like, yo, if we don't make one hundred thousand by June, we did something wrong.
Now I was feeling I told you I was playing on making eight hundred thousand in crypto for that year. We calculated calculation that did the whole thing.
So then everything, wait, everything fell apart, not yet, no.
No, no, no, early January it went, it went down, but then it came back like late January. Were like, all right, we're back, we're back right now.
I fell apart and I put more money in and I'm gonna buy the dip. And then it fell apart again and I put more money in. I said, I'm buy this dip. And then it just completely collapsed and.
He gave up on the space.
Yeah.
So but I said this, I said this. I said, look, if it was gonna die, I would have right. And one of the things I heard that was powerful to me is the CEO of Ripple said this. He was like, the reason that this is gonna work is because if you think about money, right, what's the fastest way to get one hundred thousand dollars from San Francisco to London?
What do you think this is? Its crypto?
He was like, the fastest way in today's society, right, twenty and eighteenth flight is to get on a plane to fly with that money to London. How is that work in the world of technology? Right, That's why Ripple and all these other old coins and bitcoins, that's why it's gonna work. And when he said that, I'm like, Nah, I don't care. This is gonna go down. This is
not going anywhere. And so like one of the things we did too, and for sure it was like we were like, look, we're not letting anybody get left on the boat, like if they missed it. This episode is brought to you by P and C Bank. A lot of people think podcasts about work are boring, and sure, they definitely can be, but understanding a professionals routine shows us how they achieve their success little by little, day after day. It's like banking with P and C Bank.
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The cyberbubble right in the nineteies, right, if that is this, we got to make sure that we get the Google. We got to make sure that we get Amazon, and we don't get stuck with excite dot com.
But we're not leaving anybody.
So I was like, yo, call everybody you know, Like, we're gonna call everybody we know so we can tell them how this works and teach them. And like we made mad phone calls and it was like, Yo, nobody wants to learn.
People ain't people ain't playing, Like, nah, I'm good. All right, So now we gave you my story. It's a tragic story, it's a learning so all right, So can we talk about crypto Lets start one on one, right, What is cryptocurrency?
So cryptocurrency is uh a digital asset that lives on the Internet that has value and where does the come from? It comes from people saying it has value, right, And it's that simple and so and it's that simple but also that fickle based on what you just said, right, And the question is like a lot of people say
or housing the currency, how's anything? The currency? Anything is the currency because currency back by anything is a belief, right, and it's a belief that it's If more people believe that it's going to go up in the future, then more people buy. It's a supply and demand thing and that's what kind of moves it. But yes, it's a digital asset that lives on the Internet and there's you could transfer it without any middle man, so you don't need uh. The experience is similar to like a Venmo
experience or zell experience or whatever cash hap experience. You don't have cash, you don't have cash up in the middle. What's in the middle is actually a community people that validate every transaction.
And right, so that's the definition of the blockchain. Yes, it's validated by the blockchain exactly.
So yeah, so crypto current But the name is little deceiving because it's not really being used as currency right now. It's more of an investment, right.
Right, So it's an investment because due to people, due to the way it's moved, and bitcoin, being the first cryptocurrency, it's moving up and down based on the story you just said. People don't want to use it as a currency, so it's it's made to be a currency. It's made to allow people to move money back and forth. But because of the way it's structured. So Bitcoin structure in
a way where there's a limited supply. Right, it was a seventeen million, it's seventeen million now, but the max is twenty one million, so people are anticipating at that point that it's going to be worth a lot, and so it's kind of transferred from a currency to more of a digital gold.
So it's like it's being viewed as a commodity and value. It is exactly right. So that's what Jason told me here. So all right, because this is something that's interesting. So people say, like, well, cryptocurrency is in thin air, it's not physical, it's not backed by anything, And I say, neither is the American dollar. Right, American dollar used to be backed by gold, but I think in Nixon he changed and he removed the gold Standarday, he removed the
gold standard. So now the American dollar, like most all dollars all over the world. There's only back by the faith went in America to talk at American American dollars, only back by the faith of the people people think that it's worth what it's worth. So at any point in time when the vast majority of people think the American dollar isn't worth anything, it's not worth anything.
Right because I mean, like you said, with bitcoin, there's a limited supplied. Once it gets to twenty one million, there's no more, right, so that the value of that will go up obviously, right, So that's why you get those projections like bitcoin will be worth five hundred thousand dollars for one coin, whereas a dollar they can make a million of those every second, exactly day.
So like what's the real value?
So bitcoin, that's what most people have heard about bitcoin. Bitcoin is the first crypto, the grand daddy of crypto currency, started by Shatoshi na Kamoto.
Anybody found him in Nobody's a lot of people claiming nobody knows this is the real Shatoshi knock Umoto.
Did I say that correctly?
Yeah?
Good, bro, I got I don't get you some credit.
That was good.
If anybody's not the whole crypto thing is crazy. Everybody's not familiar to Guy's a legend. Nobody even knows if he's if he a actually ever really existed, or if he's a group of people, or if he's one person, or if he's living, who knows, But he's the founder of crypto, right because he made bitcoin. Right. Then from Bitcoin, you have thousands of cryptocurrencies, over two thousands. You have a whole bunch of different from Ethereum to Ripple, and
they all kind of serve different purposes. So you have some that are like for just music. You have it's like all kinds of differences like websites now, like you have a website for everything, and you have a cryptocurrency for everything.
Well, and then you have so like from those right, the top three you named Bitcoin, Ethereum, those are like platforms, so people build on those platforms like Ethereum, like a bunch of platforms will get built on them.
Is like a digital computer, right, right, you can build on top of it. You could. The Ethereum introduced the concept of a smart contract, right. A smart contract is basically a digital contract that says, if then if this happens, then this happens, right, and uh, the way I like to illustrated is a Vendom machine, this smart contract, right, like I don't need like I go to corner store and get a Twizzler's or if I go to Vendom machine, I put a dollar in, there's cold inside a Venom
machine that gives me the Twizzlers immediately. And Ethereum takes that and makes it a whole another level. Right. If you think about the Internet, most of the interest, like most any website anything, the way it works is if then if this, then that If I like going to Gmail dot com and I put in my password, if the pastor is good, then it gives me access. If the past is not good, then it tells me you
got the gown pass. So Ethereum was the first time to take that that cold and put it on the blockchain, makes it makes it decentralized because like when I did, the Spain decentralized it, right, so Google centralized, like it lives like the way that the code works lives on Google servers and Mountain View in California obviously throughout the world, but like that is where the hub is that vending machine,
like that code is in that vendom machine. But the way that blockchain and crypto has done it actually distributes the code around the whole world or whoever wants to be a validator and then that's it. And so it decentralizes it. It makes it democratic, and it makes it limitless as well as borderless.
That was one of those those key words in that space, is decentralized. And it was like if you think about it, like a company like Google, right, like a lot of times, and it's coming up in the news now that that you know, the federal government is looking into them with that data that's being sold, right, they're like the middle man selling it right, right. That's one of the things with this space is like there is no middle guy.
There's no middle man, you know what I mean. So it makes it the middle man is everybody?
Right, Well, the one thing and that's one thing that I said. So when I first my first reservation before I started investing in cryptocurrency, I made a video on Instagram and it was my reservations on bitcoin, right, because everybody kept asking me my feelings about bitcoin, and I said this. What I said was I think it's a good idea in theory, and I think that is dope.
But my biggest fear is that governments control currency, and at any point in time, when governments feel that they don't have full control of the currency or it's not benefiting them, then they'll stop it. One of the reasons why cryptocurrencies really fell in twenty eighteen is because governments across the world cracked down on them.
Are China, South Korea, they just said it what not, you can't trade And then like if you were in the United States, like this was we ran into this problem too. It was like we couldn't buy on certain exchanges. So like one of those things like you said, like as far as like stocks, you can go to different exchanges.
Same thing with this space, right there was like.
Finance was the number one, but we had crypto, Cryptotopia, Cryptoia, Meta Doods, all these others. Some of them we couldn't buy because we were US citizens, right, so we had to try. You couldn't buy icos R especially, that was yeah that will yeah yeah, so icnothern IPL So like that's an initial coin offering. So when these companies are coming up with ideas, right, they need funding for it, they make an.
Ic I think it's important to illustrate why so many coins could exist. So it's over two thousand cryptocurrencies right now US. You could actually create an ey L token tomorrow. The reason why is because the currency is cold and the code is open source. So I could go and actually see how bigcoin works, and I could actually create big I could change the B to F and make it fit coin and fritz coin. That's the white paper. That's the white paper, right, So that's how it starts.
That's how it's social. Malkamoto, the group or whoever this individual is that bigcoin was introduced through the introduction of a white paper. And the white paper basic it was like this cold slash business plan that said how it works, how the colde works, and everybody could see that. Everybody could see exactly how it works, so anybody could pick it up and copy it. Right, But just because you pick it up and copy it doesn't mean that people
are going to follow you. So you need a community behind it too.
Yeah, So like that, that's how you get these other coins. Like if you look now on the on like coin market cap, you'll see like a bitcoin gold or a big gray like they'll say like, hey, we got that cold from the white paper. But we're gonna make it even better. Yeah, tweak it. That's why it's like different. And another thing that was she did was he he made it open sourced, so anybody can change the cold.
It's an ongoing process of bitcoin. It's changing. Anybody can. Really, you could change it, right, it's not something that's set in stone.
He did that. So his vision and how I see it is that his vision was to eliminate the world banks and government from like he wanted to make it peer to peer and also open source evolving where it's for the people.
It was actually funny enough, it goes back to my story,
like Leam Brothers, he's great. In two thousand and eight, he was these It derives out of a community of libertarians and archists, so people that didn't trust the government, and there was level of high high distrust amongst people from the financial system in general, just because we fellas went down and he had a community and he said, listen, I'm gonna create this thing that doesn't need banks, Like we could actually work without banks, we could work without
the government, and we could transact to each other trustless. And that's that's kind of what where the fervor came from.
Yeah, it's crazy still, all right, So we read a lot of white papers, man, we read a lot of white people.
So all right, so tax, right, because that's what you're doing now with the tax.
Right.
So that's another issue because everything is so new that the government is trying to like catch up to it. Right, So we know how like real estate is tax a certain way. Stocks a tax a certain way. It's called capital gains tax. So can you explain the taxes on that, because that's that's what you're working with now, right.
Right, right, So I'll work with a company go token tax and so the easy explanation is like TurboTax and crypto and so crypto, if you trade crypto, it's very hard to calculate your taxes. It's because the assumption is that, all right, I go from let's say you're from the US, I go from dollar to crypto, and then I go from back to crypto back to dollar. That's when I
have to pay taxes. But actually, when you're in the crypto world, like we said, it's about two thousand cryptos you could trade between from crypto to crypto, and you actually have to all those things are taxical transactions. It's as if you when you sell one for the other, the government actually looks at that as a sell and a buy. And also there's other things like you could actually work for crypto and get paid in crypto. That's taxable. You also buy things in crypto and you that's also
a taxable transaction. So all of that is pretty is complex to calculate. And so the company I work with, this software basically hooks into all the all the wallets, all the exchanges and pullsing your transactions and converts the dollar equipped. So an example is, all right, I go from dollar to bitcoin, and I trade bitcoin to ethereum.
Then I trade from ethereum back to maybe ripple. Right, I didn't go back to dollars, but all those three transactions are taxable because when I went from bitcoin to bitcoin to ether, there I have to actually look at the USD value of bitcoins from each time and convert it back even though I didn't go into dollars. So we allow that calculation.
Yeah, and the government, I mean, they just put out an article last week where they're going to start taxing. They sent out ten thousand letters to people.
Yeah, yeah, so going back to how crypto started. Obviously with uh, there's a lot of anarchist libertarians and a lot of these people are like anti taxes because they don't trust the government. They don't think the government is doing the right thing. And people were under the false belief that you don't have to pay taxes on crypto.
But one of the things, one of the one of the things that they created was transparency in the blockchain and so yes, the transparent, but arrests also see that those transactions too, right, so you actually are exposing yourself, so you actually have to pay taxes on that.
And what's what's coin coin Gamma. So coin Gamma is my own media platform.
So it started with an app that I built as a side project in twenty fifteen. Twenty seventeen, I expanded it to a blog as well as a podcast where I interview leaders in the space and just provide education. And so what we do is we write about the space, we offer educational content, we interview leaders in the space, and we're actually going to start coming up with digital
courses where people could kind of teach me. Teach me. Yeah, So I've taught some some in person classes, so I've taught in person classes in New York City and also I've taught at my alma Motors. So I've lectured at Warton as well as Brew College around crypto and blockchain. But I'll be doing some online courses over the next few weeks.
How do you invest in cryptocurrency?
All right? I mean it depends where you are, but if you're in the US, you take it. You have to take your dollars, you have to be you have to transact on the exchange that actually takes fiat, which is dollars and converts to crypto. Now, most exchanges actually do not do that. So you mentioned Binance earlier. Binance doesn't take dollars, right, most, but there are some major exchanges in the US that take dollars and convert for you. And it's similar to like buying something on PayPal. Right,
so coin Base is the most popular. Another one is is Robbins robber Hood, Right, that just happened in New York, Right, we just got Another one is the cash app, Right, So if you use if you used the cash app to pay friends or family for you know, dinner or something like that, you actually could buy biitcoin the same way. But if you want to buy another cryptocurrency, so if it's if it's a cryptocurrency, so not all cryptocurrencies on every exchange. So if there's a crypto, if it's so,
coin Base has a limited supply of crypto cryptos. Same thing as as the same thing with the other apps I mentioned, so the cash app, as well as the robin Hood app. But if you want to do some of the other cryptos, you actually have to basically buy the bitcoin or e theoreum or on coin Base, then move it to the other exchange, right, and then you could transact on those change And that's how people get caught up. It's extremely complicated.
Toorius Big had a legendary line. Let me say shictly for live man, not for freshmen cryptocurrency. Don't play around with it if you don't understand what you're doing.
Because there's been plenty of days where we got calls like yo, not money didn't go through.
What happened? What happened.
Actually, it's probably gotten more user friendly now. I don't even look at it anymore. I have my money invested, but I don't look at it. But at one point I was looking at it every day, but it was extremely complicated when we first got in because you had to, like you said, you can't buy cryptocurrency with American dollars. You can trade dollars for bitcoin or ethereum or ethereum or like coin and coin based at that time, and then you can buy the other coins. It was mainly bitcoin, ethereum.
Some of them you can buy with light coin, but most of them so you had so let's say you wanted to buy trying, right, you had to exchange American money for bitcoin on coin base. From coin Base, you had to send your bigcoin to Binance Exchange and it went now it's in Binance. Then now it's in Binance.
Now don't skip the stuff. Because that that the transaction speed was so slow, which is one of the things about bitcoin. So you had to So let's say you sent a thousand or five thousand dollars, right, it would take maybe a half hour before it even.
Got Bitcoin was o d I remember one kind of bitcoin took me five hours. I'm like, where's the customer service?
Like, I'm like, going on, it's crazy, but the crazy thing real because I mean if you if I was to if I was on the Venmo or cash app and I sent it to the wrong person. I could hit up cash app and say, yo, I sent it all, give me a charge back. If I said, if I Bigger America and I put wired the money in the wrong person America, it might mistake because this thing is decentralized, is owned by you, and it's owned you. Also mistakes literally in the black hole.
Now so then all right, so now it's in binance, and then from now you have to buy tron with the bitcoin and binance. So it's like a three part process. What happens is that and then you had so when you send it, they send you a cold It's a code that you have to put in to send it to one place to another. This is something that is extremely important. This happened to me. Happened to me on my birthday two years ago. I was I sent five hundred dollars. I was trying to buy bitcoin gold or
was it bitcoin cash. There's another bitcoin, bitcoin cash, bitcoin case. I was trying to buy bitcoin cash, but I put the code for bitcoin. Long story short, I sent the wrong code. After i said, I'm like, damn, so I go back. I'm like, I sent five hundred dollars, but I sent it to the wrong address. I'm going now it's going, it's it's no to track it. It's just
it's in the universe. Somebody that's gone. Somebody lost like twenty one bitcoins like that they lost twenty one bitcoins because they sent it to the wrong address or something, and just going.
It's crazy, man.
But like even like that, it was like there's so many steps to it, like this is not like we weren't sleeping, like legit weren't sleeping. It was like, you know what, I'm not eve gonna do this transaction to the morning, but by the time you wake up, the value could have gone up by like a thousand.
So because of that, you probably do moving so fast and frantic because you I gotta buy this, gotta bother us, and that leaves you open to making it was mistakes even if you are sharp.
Now it's moving like a fiend. Now it's moving like a fiend, like because it was like we gotta do this right now, or they just so I'm like halfway like awake, trying to do this on my phone, and it's like damn, like I didn't really have time to really think about it. But you become addicted. You can. It's very addictive, especially at that time because it was so much money being made and it was moving so fast. And anything with cryptoi is that it's only four hours.
It's like the stock market on steroids. Stock market they closed, they you know, it's it's way more structured. Cryptos like the wild wild West.
No sleep.
It's twenty four hours a day, and you have with these called whales, and these whales are like these are like the big dogs, like the marketos. Really it's really control. It's like all things. Even though it was made for the people, it's only controlled by like a handful of people that have millions, billions of dollars and they move it. They move the market so crazy and they sell their Bitcoin's gonna drop exactly right now. They know, they know what they're doing. So it's like it's hard to day
trade in that space because you get eating up. You get eating up.
That's what I'm saying.
Like even if you're sitting in front of your computer, it's like you can't watch them all like it.
I mean, this was like no sleep before like two months.
Like you get text message like a group chat, it would be like I remember what Tron went from less than a penny to like fifteen cents. Like to thank you text for just coming in. I'm like I woke up, like yo, what happened? Like I missed?
You know what I'm saying now because I brought trot at two cents and it went to thirty eight cents. I think the highest that it got to with thirty eight cents. So that's why, like I said, when I went to Swarm from six thousand to twenty eight thousand, I had a couple I brought Ripple at like ninety cents and I sold Ripple at like three dollars and fifteen cents. So it was like the good Times was rolling. The good Times was rolling. The good Times is rolling.
But all right, so can we talk about like you said, okay, so now we got established of how to actually buy it? How do you evaluate coins? Like, how do you know which coin to buy?
Like?
How did somebody do that?
Yeah, that's a hard one. I think the the space is early. None of a lot of these things are moving. A lot of these things are actually pre products, right, so people a lot of these coins out there are raising money on a hope they're going out there and they're pitching like a white paper, which is like their business plan, and they're saying, all right, well if you give us some money and you'll get a coin and you will be able to use it for x, y
and z. And you have to study that. You have to look at the technology, right, because sometimes a lot of these coins actually are like you said, you took a bigcoin goal, bigcoin cash. It's like a bunch of big coins. There's light coin. There's a bunch of coins that actually are trying to do exactly what the major ones are doing. And what they're doing is tweaking it and say all right, we're gonna be faster, we're gonna
be more secure, all that kind of stuff. And so you have to figure out whether that story resonates with you, right, So you have to study that. But most importantly you could believe that, but because of supply and demand is actually you need other people to believe it too, right, Like you could believe in that new Christian or Islamic
religion or that new whatever religion. Right, but you may be the only person at church or a mosque or the or the or whatever by yourself, right unless you bring it so it is very religious in certain spects because it's their community aspects. Because the value of these of these assets are them going up, so you need more people to buy it, or they're able to be
used amongst the community between each other. So if you're the only person that that, if you get into it and then people don't follow you, or a community doesn't follow you, then they're not gonna go up, no matter
how strong you believe it to be. So you not only have to analyze the fundamentals of it, you also have to read what other people think about So a lot of research is actually spending time on Twitter, spending time on Reddit, spending time on these apps like Telegram and discord where people are talking about it and seeing what the energy is like. And so it makes no sense to have to make your investment decisions based on what other people think. But in this space is just
the way it is now. They got they got the whole terminology like.
Hold total total hld hld L, hold on with their life.
Yeah, yeah, to the moon was like rocket. It was like when something was going up to the moon.
That's when the they call those all coins shit coins.
All coins with just any coin outside of the top three really.
Basically, yeah, it's a whole culture. Cryptocurrency was a whole culture. I mean we studied it down to the t.
Right when we started, I know Shoddy when he's amazing with numbers, so he started studying the market caps for each one. And then after we saw the market caps, we saw the coin supply. Right, Like we said that they have twenty one million, That means like, yo, in this space, that's pretty limited. But then you'll get a coin that that will come out as like there's only two thousand of it, right, whereas like Ripple was like was it something like crazy billion or something like that? Yeah,
it's crazy, you know what I'm saying. So like you can see like, hey, what's the growth on that? If it's sixty five billion and it's only at like right now, it's probably like fifty one cent, it's like, well, how high can this really go? This ain't going to be a twenty dollars, do you know what I'm saying.
It's too many of them. But here's the problem with show. You know, we talked about the the FIAT currencies like the dollar, year, et cetera, and how there's each they have like a Federal Reserve that could create unlimited supply. Bigcoin doesn't have like a group of people. All these other coins actually are centralized, so they're actually a little bit more like fiat money. So yes, they could go out with a white people says that we're gonna limit it.
But there's been coins that like they were out and like the they just the people that were behind it or the company behind it decided to just change the call. We're like, we're gonna do more, right, And there's no you know that it's it's a wild West because there's no sec to like stop them. There's like there's a lot of coin, you know in twenty seventeen, a lot of coins you know, raise all that money and they were supposed to come out with things and they bounced right.
Feel yeah, it's scary, but like I think one thing that you know ra Sean talked about earlier is like you put six k's like that was that was what you could lose. Like even to this day, like I don't put money you could lose like do not. At that time, I would get text with people like hey, like my retirement's not right about like putting money in the tirement retirement and like now, only play with what you could lose.
Now, I don't don't play with the big boys if you're not if you're not ready, man, because like I said, now it's real talk. We don't have control over this. It's very and we have control over anything, but especially crypto because it's very thin. It's very thin. And that's one of the things that actually got me involved. Once I saw the market cap. I saw the market cap, it was like one hundred what's the market cap.
Now, it's probably like two hundred and the two.
Hundred million, right, billion?
Billion?
Yeah, so we got a pretty hot to like nine hundred.
Yeah, it was a trillion.
Yeah, it was supposed hit a trillion by the time. I don't think it was even at a billion at that time. I think it's like nine hundred million something like that. But one story short, even where it's at now, a couple of hundred billion, that's not a lot of money. That sounds like a lot of money, but that's really not a lot.
Of It's really not a lot because if you look at traditional assets, I tell people a whole time, Yeah, the whole crypto market is two hundred and fifty billion dollars. But guess what Fidelity one investment shop has seven trillion of the assets fact but themselves seven trillion, right, So like this is this is a spect.
When I first got into, I'm like, look, it's a lot more room for it to grow because the market value is so low. And that's one of the things that made me get into And that's one of the reasons why I still actually hold out hope because I like, that's.
If it was gonna die, no, I would have died over the last year as exactly right, because like people people who gave it, people the bigcoin went down, people like it's over, like it's a wrap and it came back up and it's trading, kind of trading. We never know why. It's just people the belief, you said, it's the belief.
So yeah, all right, so now you got the education. But for people that want more information, how can they contact you? What's your podcast and your app? All your information?
Yeah, so the podcast app, Instagram as well as Twitter is all the same thing. Coin Gamma so c O I N G A M M A. Gamma is like a term that is in the options world that in my old world that I brought over but yeah, Cooin Gamma is it And uh, if you search my name, my name is relatively unique, so you'll find me. So Fritz Charles on LinkedIn. I kind of changed my last name on Twitter and Instagram it is frist chain. You'll follow me a frist chain on on on that like chain. Yeah, gotcha. Yeah,
So you can find me all those platforms. And I'm always putting out educational content. D m me ad me on LinkedIn and we could chat for sure, for sure. So Troy Patreon, Yeah, shout out to Patreon. It's our private paid program patreon dot com. Backslash on healsia every every week. It seems to be growing.
It's a community.
It's a community now, man.
So we got some new members' gonna shout them out Sean uh Branina Nicola Trip, Johnna, Tyris, and we got to give a huge shout out to Tony.
Shout out to Tony.
He was one of our members from a couple of months ago, but he made a video, like a testimonial video just about how great Patreon is. So he just did that out of love for us. So shout out to Tony and everybody that's been supporting on Patreon.
No, it's amazing. Patreon is amazing. It's like I said, it's a community and e Yo University is real. We're launching some stuff. Everything is top secret right now. But if you you can't get this level of information, even if you paid to go to school, you probably wouldn't be very difficult to get this this because it's real world. It's not just people just supply and demand. Charge is actually real world people that's actually in the field doing
it themselves. Like, you can't get that kind of information in college. Professors aren't. They don't do that, but most professors are.
If they do that, they study in one area.
Right, We're given everything.
No, it's different, it's it's a different level of education. Was going to land and somebody said that they got two master's degrees and they learned more from our podcast than they got from the masters.
Amazing.
So Patreon is a lot cheaper than any university in America.
There's different level tiers, like we said on every episode, so you can join at any level you like.
But we're just gonna keep on it, not for sure, for sure. And then book tip of this week is Bitcoin Billionaires from the Winkle von winkleon Winklevoss Twins and chronicles their journey. If anybody's not familiar, those are the guys that Facebook. They depending on how you look at they might have they might have got screw out of Facebook, but they got the last laugh at the end because they they made well. That but they became the first billionaires off of bitcoin. That was a fact. I don't know.
They probably lost some money now, but they made so much money. Doesn't matter.
We get that point. Doesn't change.
No, no, no, they're powerful players in the bitcoin market. So it's a good book. I highly recommend it. And we will see you guys in three days because we have as I said, this this week is different. We're going to put out two episodes this week, so we'll see you back on Friday at five pm. Keep spreading the word and peace, Sis