EYL #116 The Maverick feat. Mark Cuban

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Jacob for being in. Kudos to Mark as well, just being extremely efficient and no hassle, no issues, and this is quick, got it got it done, got it done. So serial entrepreneur, NBA team owner, investor, TV Star Media, Mogul, family man, philanthropists, and legend coach Icon. So you know, we've talked to a lot of great people.

So the tweet that I put up it was when you say, and something to the effect of I had zero dollars with my bank account when I was twenty seven years old, and that went viral because you know, I did the calculations based off of Wikipedia. It was like it was like ten years later you became a millionaire,

and fifteen years later you became a billionaire. So you know, that's that's inspiring to a lot of people because it's like, you know, they see a billionaire and it's like to know a billionaire at one point in time in his late twenties had zero dollars in his bank accounts. So can we can we start where it all begins? So I know you moved to Dallas when you were in eighteen eighty two and you was a bartender and then you worked at a software company where you got fired.

So can you can you start there?

Thought about Miami. My car wouldn't make it. But I could make the eight hours from Bloomington, Indiana, down to Dallas because I could calculate the amount of oil I was going to need every sixty miles and the amount of gas I was going to use. So I got down there and I moved in with my buddy and his five four roommates, so I made number six. So there were six to bucks living in a three bedroom apartment.

Obviously I had to get a job, and so I got a job working as a bar I say it was a bartender, but I was more bar back, and every now and then I would pour a drink, right, you know how it goes. And so did that at night, and then during the day I went looking for a job and got a job working for a computer store called Your Business Software. It was one of the first early computer stores. I remember being doing my intervie you because I had never taken computers in college. Nothing. I

took one class and I cheated at them. And so I remember the guy asking me. He goes, well, what do you know about computers? And I'm like, I know how to read the manuals, right, I know how to sit in front of a computer and do basic stuff. And so he's like, well, all right, if you're willing to learn all this software programs by reading the manuals, I'll give you a shot. And so I got that job, paid me enough to pay my share of the rent. It still had my shitty ass car. And I'll tell

you another story about that in a minute. You talk about being broke. And so I got that job, and so life is just going on, right, just trying to, you know, keep up with everything and pay my bills. Then my car dies and so now I got no car. I mean it had to hole on the floorboard, you know where I could see the road while I was driving, so I knew it was just a matter of time. And I didn't have any money to get a new car. So probably two weeks later and I'm getting rides to

work in there everything. Two weeks later, we're driving along with my buddts and we're driving along and there's a car on the side of the road. I'm like, stop. He's like what He's like, somebody had to abandon that car. It was like a nineteen eighty Transam or nineteen seventy something Transam. I'm like, someone had to abandon that car, and I need a car, and so no, Lie, I had my buddy pull over. I open up the car door.

It's open, right, and there's papers. And anybody who's ever missed a car payment right or had a car repossessed knows exactly what I'm talking about. Right, you got all the papers and everything, and you're trying to figure out how to pay the bills, and then when you just can't pay it, and they're going to come get it. You just leave it right, You're just done with it and have it, you know. And so I knew what was going on, and so I opened the car, pulled

out and saw the papers on the seat. Called the bank right, got got back to our apartment. This is before cell phones. Got back to the apartment, called the bank and said, I found this car on the side of the road. I know you guys are going to try to repossess it, and you do me a favor. I'll pick up the payments on it because I had my software job at that point. I'll pick up the

payments on it because I lousey credit, awful credit. Like I had gone to radio Shack to try to buy a computer to help teach myself to learn, and I tried to do it on credit and they turned me down. Radio Shack turned me down, and so I called the bank. They gave me the okay to take over the payments. And that's when I started getting my life back on

track and started building my credit up. But even then, I was like twenty four at the time and working at that job, and things started to go good for me. And then about nine months into that job. I had an opportunity to close the deal, and this deal would have got me a fifteen hundred dollars commission, which meant I could have moved out of we called it the Hill Hotel where I lived. It was in an apartment complex called the Village, and a little part of me

called the Hill. And so I can move out of the Hill Hotel, which was a shithold if I got this fifteen hundred dollars commission. And so I go to my boss, who and I normally have to sweep the floor, open up the store and all that, and I'm like, look, I want to close this deal and he's like, no, you got to be there to open up the store. Made the executive decision to go pick up the check, thinking when I bring him a fifteen thousand dollars check, fifteen hundred of which is going to be mine, life

is good. Right, fired me on the spot. I realized I was a shitty employee. At that point in time, it wasn't the first time I've been fired or quit a job, right, And so started my own business called micro Solutions, and that you know, I was taking a step back financially because I had no income coming in, begged somebody who was one of my prospects at the software store to load me five hundred bucks to be my first customer. So they gave me five hundred bucks

so I can buy the software that they needed. And I took that and I just kept on growing from there, and so that three years later, you know, when I went to the ATM, I had my business going, but everything that I had was going into the business, right, And I thought, you know, it wasn't a normal paycheck, right, It wasn't a regular paycheck for me, and so you think sometimes you know, in your head, I've got a hundred bucks or two hundred bucks and you go there

thinking you're going to take out some cash and it's all gone. And so that was that was my moment, and it was just like, Okay, this has got to be you know, it wasn't a low point because I had my company, but this was like the point where you know, I got to pay attention to the details and really start building this thing, and then it just blew up from there. I really put the effort in and it went big.

books around here. I mean just about you know, learning new technology, learning about AI, learning about you know, personalized medicine, all these things. So yeah, I still will read the manual, you know, only now it's like a download instead of a book. But yeah, because you got to. Because if I'm going to be out there saying I'm a tech guy and I don't know shit about tech man, I don't want to be that guy. I'll pass that fake

it till you make it. I want to be that guy who really knows the stuff.

technology and really business going forward. So if I'm going to be an effective investor, an effective mentor, and an effective you know, operator of businesses, you know, even with the maths, I got to understand AI because you know, like with the Mavericks, when you know, when you talk about analytics, it's changed so dramatically even over the last five years, going from you know, different types of things per and you know, advanced RPM and all these different

metrics for basketball to how do you implement artificial intelligence and pose estimation and computer vision and how do you understand all that stuff to make the right decisions for the maps and so if I want to be in a position to make those decisions and not just ask somebody else to do it, I got to learn it. And so I put in hours, I do tutorials, I take little online classes, and it doesn't make me an expert.

It's not like I'm going to say, you know, I could get a job if I needed to running AI or any tech for a big company. I couldn't. But I understand all the concepts and understand the issues and how to apply them to business. So if you're going to be good at anything, you got to stay ahead of the game. And business is the ultimate sport, you know. I used to say it to Dirk and I always say it to Luca. You know, it's like, dude, you know, you play forty eight minutes. You know, a forty eight

minute game. You practice a couple hours, you go home and you relax and you play. You know, you play Call of Duty. You know, business is twenty four x seven. I'm going every day because there's some sixteen year old kid out there trying to kick my ass in one of my companies and it ain't going to happen, right, And so I'm that competitive and I'm that, you know, I work that hard at learning to try to stay ahead of the game.

seven years with no vacation, right my saying. I didn't go out and had fun. I did a lot of it, but everybody else was taken off to go to Mexico for a weekend or whatever. I had to stay back and work, and so, you know, I put in all this time, and my goal was always to retire, right. My goal wasn't to start this company and run it till I was seventy five years old, and grow it

to be just a big, enormous company. My goal was retired by the time of I was thirty five and when I got the opportunity to sell the company, and what happened was I just got a letter from some dude who said he was interested in buying the company. He represented H and R block and I was like, come on, I've been waiting for you. Yeah, right, you know, I'm not messing around, and so, you know, and the offera was good enough at that point in time where I could say, you know what, if I'm willing to

live like a student, I could retire. And so we went through the whole process. I went to Kansas City and met with the H and R Block Board told them when I was you know what I thought we would do. As it turns out, they had other plans. They just wanted to buy the company and have somebody else running. And I was like, fine, you take it. I'm good with that. You know, pay me a little

salary to answer questions when you need me. And I bought a lifetime pass on American Airlines for one hundred and twenty five thousand dollars, which meant I could take me and anybody else anywhere I wanted to go in the world at a moment's notice. Man, I'm at a club in La. Let's go to Vegas. Come on, let's go. I'm in Vegas. You know you want to go to.

me and my guests. And so I walked in there and they're booting out magic John's I'm like, you don't know me from madam.

first streaming gay. You revolutionized the whole streaming process. So you sell that in the middle of the dot com boom to Yahoo for five point seven billion dollars. The reason why this is so crazy for anybody that's not really familiar with it is like the dot com boom was when a lot of companies was getting brought at very high valuations. But it was like perfect timing because from my end is Dan correct me if I'm wrong

the company it was. You got Yahoo stock which was at like an all time high peak after it split of five hundred and then they peaked. It was eight one hundred and eighteen dollars in nineteen ninety nine. Two years later that stock with at eight dollars ninety three percent drop in two thousand, you brought the Mavericks for two hundred and eighty five million. So what happened with that? Did you? Did you sell the stock?

If I said good stuff, the stocks will go over if I said I'm like and He's like, dude, you got to start trading these stocks because you know more than our analysts. And so I did, and I was crushing it, right. And so for the next four or five years, I was making eighty ninety one hundred percent a year of my money in the stock market. My

bank just kept on going straight up. And so by the time we sold Broadcast dot Com to Yahoo, I'd already seen these you know, bubbles come and go, the PC bubble, right, the PC software bubble, you know, and all these different companies go up and down. I'm like, you know, I got to be next to my name. I want to keep that being next to my name.

I don't need to be greedy. And so I went to my broker and I said, I want to do something called hedging, and I wanted to hedge it right, which meant that I bought puts against the stock, which means if it goes down, I make money, and I sold calls against it, which means if it could if it goes up, I made some money, but I don't make as much. Right. It forces those people who I sold the calls to to buy it from me at that price, and so the stock ended up going down,

and I may ended up mak I made. I kept all my net worth, you know, from the stock they got because I got it converted to cash because of the puts. But I actually actually made more from it than I got originally because of the value of the puts when they came when it when they came to their exploration date, and it was called one of the top ten trades on Wall Street of all time when I paid, because I ended up making more money instead

of losing all that money. And it was crazy because I bought the MAVs in January of two thousand, so twenty one years ago, yes, two days ago, right and so, and the hedge hadn't really fully taken place yet because it wasn't the hedge didn't really expire until two thousand and one and two thousand and two. So I remember sitting in sitting in the team bus with Don Nelson and Del Harris, who was our one of our coaches

in our yeah. Yeah, And so I'm sitting there with him like you paid two hundred eighty five million dollars. That's crazy. That's like the most ever paid for any sports team ever. And I'm like, dude, look see this Yahoo stock that I got for audio neet for broadcast dot com. It just went up seventy dollars today. That paid for all the Mavericks, right, I mean, I was living large, man, it was. It was. It was a good time.

lose that mount, you sleep good at night. And if the market craters, whether it's tomorrow or next year, I may have lost a little bit, but I protected the next day, you know, and the money I've got in the stock market. So you know, you got to you got to always remember you can't predict where the stock market's going, even though like right now, bit coin's going straight up, the stock market's going straight up. Everybody thinks they're a genius, right, everybody's a genius in a bull market,

until you're not. And so even though you know, I might think one way or expect one thing to happen, I'm always hatching.

You know, these guys took me under their wing. Damon Jones even you know, just all giving me feedback on you know, what it's like to be a ballplayer, what you got to deal with as an NBA player and things they need.

in with new note roop service. And so you got a whole team of your whole Mavericks team walking down the street in Oakland California, sometimes three in the morning looking for us seven to eleven to give food. You think that's safe. I'm like, okay, you money, I got you. And so we upgraded it to stay at Rich Carlton's. And then once we started doing it, everybody, all the teams started doing it. We started bringing Like when I first got there, we spent more money on computer repair

and computer training than we did on player development. I'm like, this is crazy. We're spending millions of dollars. I mean we had Juwan Howard with a.

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Everybody basically had their own player development coach, and I paid the guys like twenty five brand a year because they all just wanted to coaches twenty five brand a year because they just want to get back in the game, right, Kiki vandaway, And so they all have jobs now, which all put them in the NBA. A lot of them are still NBA player development guys and so, but all the other NBA teams just torched me. What are you doing? I mean people were writing articles. You know, how dumb

is this guy? He's got fifteen players and fifteen coaches, right, because there were no development coaches. You know, you had three coaches on the bench. You had your lead you had your head coach, your lead assistant, and then maybe one other assistant, maybe two, right, and one of them will helped, you know, guys rebound and you you know, coaches were supposed to work to develop guys. I'm like, that's crazy. You know, coaching is a hard enough job as it is. Playing is hard. You want to get

people who work to develop your players. And we started doing it, and now all those player development staffs where teams have three, four or five ten guys working that had all started back from when I'm started, and now like we got sham sham guy. We even have you know, all handling coaches right in New York. Legend you see the sham come out on the.

to activate it, right. I hadn't done that yet, and I was so out of it, right, I didn't even say twice. And so I give him my card and fifteen minutes Dirk's like, Yo, where's it at Jets like, where's it at? You know all Tyson Chandler, where is it at? They want to see this big bottle of champagne. And I get the tap on the shoulder, right, mister Cuban, can you come back in the back before. It's been a long time since I've got one of those cut off all that, and so I'll go in the back.

They're like, your credit card got the client. I'm like, some black AMX. It's not supposed to get the client. And so they call I had to call up American Express, no lie, and I get the first line person. I'm sorry, sir. I'm like, can you put your manager on? And he's like, you know, how can we be sure this is mister Cuban. I'm like, did you watch TV tonight? You know you would happen at the game. So finally I got it approved and we got our bottle champaigne.

eight percent. Of the revenue, and it seemed like the NBA is way more player friendly and the players get more money and it's a much stronger relationship between the owners guarantee contract the owners and the players, where the NFL it's no, it's not really guaranteed contracts. The owners and the players don't seem to have a good relationship.

So what are your thoughts on the CBA? And also, I know you you have plans on being an NFL owner as well, So what is your what are your what are your thoughts on the difference between the league and in the NBA, how it's structured with the CBA and the relationship between the owners.

You know, in the NFL, where it's very it's variable in the NBA. But in any event, the biggest difference is, you know, in the NFL, NFL players talk about the league promoting the shield, right that it's all about you know what's on the you know the NFL logo, and you know they promote the NFL Whereas in the NBA, it's all about the players. But you know, the talent tribe. We're a talent driven league. Our players have huge social

media presence. You know, we're we're big, you know in social media, not just Beliegue, but more importantly the players, you know, And so that's the biggest difference. You know, if you looked at you know, I grew up in Pittsburgh, I'm a big Steelers fan or the Cowboys and a big Cowboys fan. You're gonna know Dak Dak Prescott, and you might know Zeke Elliott, but you're not going to know the other fifty one guys on the team if

they walk in the room, right. And I might know Ben Roethlisberger if I see him, but I'm not you know, James Conner but maybe not. You know, the other fifty one guys either basketball, you're playing two k right, you know one through fifteen who most of the guys are, maybe even the two way players, and that leads them to having big social media presence. And when you see a big highlight in the NBA or the NFL or any other sport, you're not going to see the face, right,

there's no expression. They're in the helmets, you know, they can't take their helmets off, and that's intentional, right, that kind of keeps the visibility of the players down. And on the NBA, you see a highlight from Luca, You see Luca smiling, you see it ripping his jersey, you know, you see Lebron doing the same thing. You see kd right,

you see the expression, the emotion. And then these guys are taking those highlights and the walkings even when they come into their arena and showing what they're wearing or what their kicks are. You know, you're seeing those on their social media and that's being picked up. You know on overtime you know, ball is life, you know dunk demics.

You're seeing all these things over and over again, and that leads to their brands being bigger than the league, you know, and that gives a lot of leverage to the players if the NFL players don't.

going to do it. I was just talking to Dwight Powell and MAXI Cleveland today and Luca and when I was down to practice and you know, they were asking about it, and I'm like, look, it's not so much, and I don't think I can keep you know, the fans safe. But what happens is, out of five thousand people,

somebody's going to happen, right, somebody's going to happen. And you know, when you let people in the players and staff, you're gonna let in their friends and family, and so all it takes is one person who's a girlfriend, a parent, you know, a niece and nephew, whatever it is, talking to the wrong person, you know, in the concourse, and all of a sudden, that then makes them sick, and

that makes the player sick. Or with our protocols, you don't even have to be sick if one of those people in that chain right there turns out to be sick, even if it doesn't make the player sick, we got to shut you down because of the protocols and so all that stuff together, I've decided not to have fans. I'm walking away. Probably We've got thirty four home games but still to go for this season, and you know how much money is that going to be twenty thirty

million dollars. I'd rather have a healthy squad and give us a better chances to win.

kind of stuff that they like to buy growth. Right, So you can raise a lot of money, and if you show a growth curve that's really good like Ring did, then they you know, there's a good chance you can get acquired. And as it turns out, Ring got acquired by Amazon. But what ends up happening to the early investors is because you have to raise so much money, you keep on getting diluted down and down and down

and down. And so if I would have made that Shark Tank investment of seven hundred thousand dollars, I think it was to get ten percent of the company by the time it got sold for a billion dollars, I would have been lucky if I owned one percent, because and probably not even that. Now one percent of a billion is still ten million. That's not bad, but it probably would have been less because what happens is because

those companies are losing so much money. When the newer investors come on and they give you one hundred million dollars, they're not saying Mark, you know, just keep what you have. They're saying, I want better terms than you even gave

your first investors. And so you know, when someone's given you one hundred million or two hundred million dollars, the terms get really onerous and they don't aren't really friendly to the initial investors unless you keep on investing a lot of money at the you know, in the hundreds of Like if I would have put up a hundred million dollars at that point in time, then I could have kept it. It might have been good, but that's just not what I'm going to do with a shark

tank company. So it's not a bad thing for him. It's a great thing. But at the same time, you know, I don't feel like I missed anything.

had done is it's called comfy comfy clothes. I think it's called where there's just these huge, oversized not even I don't even know what you call it, Like these big oversized comfy comfy things you wear right, you know whatever. And so anyways, they're like forty nine bucks apiece and they've sold millions, millions.

but I love Barbara, I'm thrilled for her. But thirty seven million dollars from less than one hundred grand investment, that's great. What do you also mean that the dudes that came on with that company? If she made thirty seven million for one fourth of the company, multiply that time three and that's what they made.

just going because that that's what it takes. Because these aren't companies that are at the top of the food chain killing it right. They need us for a reason and that's why they're there. And so if you're not willing to be a learner and grinding all the time, then it's not going to work. And what happens is having done the show so long, you know, you you realize that there are gonna be people who think that if I get in to deal with the shark, I'm going to do all the work right or whoever the

shark is. It's got to be the exact opposite. And then, you know, grinding learning selling because There's never been a company in the history of companies that was ever successful without selling. And what happens is a lot of entrepreneurs think, well, I'll get somebody else to do the selling. And you can't do that if you don't love your product enough to always want to make it available to people and let people know why it's great. It's not a good product.

That's what I look for. Like, I'll give you one example. I had Noel this dude, and now you guys don't have naturals. You guys are missing upstairs.

it where you wanted to look at. And Noel sells them online now crushing it, crushing it. I mean he sold millions upon millions of dollars. It's one of my better investments. And now Noel is out there investing in other startup companies. And what you know, the lesson from Noel dirty It twisted up is that you can start with an idea that meets the need in your community, right you don't It doesn't have to be some big idea that you're selling to people you don't know. You

don't have to go out there and raise money. All he did was take the money from his job, make some prototypes and go to some barbershops that he knew and say, look, can you try this? And once they started asking for more and more and more and wanting to buy them and sell them to their customers, then he took that and just kept on building it and building it, and now he's making you know, million dollars

plus a year. I'm doing really well from it too, And so you know, it doesn't matter where you started, where you come from. If you've got an idea that can help people around you, you don't need to go out and raise money. You just got to go out and do it.

do you think about that? Because you had that so much about the seven streams of income, but then it's like twenty four streams. That's a lot more than seven. So do you think that that's too far to diversify? If you're focused on wealth, you should focus on a few things or like what's your thoughts on that?

not going anywhere. They need the money, and so you always have to ask yourself why is somebody on the other side of the deal doing what they're doing, and just being good at one thing is really hard. And so what I always tell people, if you can get really really good at something. If you want to trade stocks, learn everything about the stocks you're trading, right, don't just guess. If you want to get into cryptocurrency, learn everything you can.

Once you have some success, then you can start peeling off some of that money that you've made and put it into other things and diversify your portfolio. But each thing that you add, don't do it unless you know what you're doing. And don't assume that somebody else, because they have money or because they call themselves in a financial advisor, knows what they're doing. Always check your whole card. Always make sure you know what you're doing, because you know,

go back to the inner that bubble. There are a whole lot of people just paying any price, and they thought I was crazy. I went on CMBC and told people I had hedge and every time y'allhoo stock one up, they said, don't you feel really bad that you left us money on the table, And I'm like, no, I'm good. I sleep really good at that, and so don't get greedy. Right, So when you talk about seven or twenty four different forms of income, really what it comes down to is

what are you good at? And stick to those things and if there's you know, most people can't be good at more than one thing. It's hard, right, And I can have multiple streams of income because I've got enough cash where I can take different chances. If you're a millionaire, you know, and you've got a million dollars in cash, that's not going to last you your whole life. So you've got to treat it with a lot of respect

and make sure you know exactly what you're doing. It's always a thrill when you hit that platform, right when you say a million dollars, man, I've made it. How good does that feel? And you get all excited, you know, and everything, But you also have to be realistic and remember that, you know, being a millionaire doesn't mean you can go out and blow that cash. It means you've

got to protect it. And why would you invest in something just to get seven different you know, streams of income if you're not sure, and if you divide a million dollars up seven ways, you're going to lose some of them. Right, it's going to be hard to have, you know, one hundred and fifty thousand dollars all making you money and doing well. Some of it's going to crap out, and so you've got to be really careful.

You know, what I tell people is have at least six months of expense money sitting in the bank, if not more, because like we learned with the pandemic, she can go bad really fast. You know, twelve years ago we had the Great Recession. Now we have, you know, the pandemic. And so if you have six months of expenses in cash just sitting in the bank, even though you're pissed, it's not earning anything being able to write that check to cover your rent if you lose your

job or so god forbid, something worse happens. Right, you want to have that cushion. It's not twelve months. To me, that's not necessarily another form of income. But being able to sleep good at night, that's another form of income, being stressed about all that shit all the time because

you're into things you're not quite sure about. I mean, anybody who's made a little money has always looked at investments and there's no worse feeling than you're calling your guy, calling your woman, whatever it is, the lady that's working with you, and saying, how are we doing, And always at the beginning it's, oh, it's great, exactly like we said, Oh it's great. Then there's that one day and one of those investments where they don't call you back, Oh

it's just busy. Sorry, Then they don't call you back again. Then they don't call you back again. Right, that's because you did something you didn't fully understand. And so not that every investment can't go wrong, even with the best intentions, but you're going to limit your risk. You want to limit your risk until you get to the point where you can say, fuck it. If father's fifty grand, I'm fine,

father's one hundred grand, I'm fine. When you get to that point, then you can start making investments that get you to those seven different screams of income. You know what, invite be back on. If you want to come on, I'll come on the stock show and we can pick it up from here. You guys are amazing.

I tried a lot of different things, a lot of jobs that didn't work out, until I got to something that did work out when I was twenty four, you know, twenty five. And then once I got there and realized I could be good at it, I just ramped it up, and I just kept on levering up. And that's the hard part. When you're young, if you're you know, in college or in school or out of school for that matter,

try different things. You don't have to have all those answers when you're young, Try all the different things, because you know what, if you're broke, now's the time to try it, right, because what's the worst that you're at. It's gonna happen, right, You're gonna stay broke. But if you keep on trying different things, when you find that one great thing, then amazing things happen. And when you find something you're good at, go for it. Go for it.

Don't take any prisoners, man, Just do everything you can to be great at it. And that's when you really make money. That's that's how the money to make pleasure.

Secretary of Homeland Security. Under President Trump, attempted illegal border crossings are at the lowest levels ever recorded, and over one hundred thousand illegal aliens have been arrested. If you are here illegally, your next you will be find nearly one thousand dollars a day, imprisoned and deported. You will never return. But if you register using our CBP home app and leave now, you could be allowed to return legally.

Do what's right, leave now. Under President Trump, America's laws, border and families will be protected.