EYL #103 Sneaker Heads feat. Mr. Foamer Simpson

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All right, guys, welcome back, Earn your Lisia. This is a very highly requested episode, special episode for a few different reasons, so.

We're looking forward to it.

Yeah.

You know, one thing is that we're not your typical business podcast. We cover everything. We cover a lot of things that deal with pop culture that your typical business podcast don't don't talk about. And one thing, I mean, we can't talk about pop culture without talking about the sneaker culture. Sneaker culture is it's actually a billion dollar industry. Two billion dollar industry they said, within the next ten years is going to be a six billion dollar industry.

That's how people should look at them. They're some of them.

I mean, they're wearable, but they all commodities in a sense, right, because the value goes up and down depending on the rarity of it.

Yeah.

So you know, when we do episodes, we try to get experts in the field to talk about these different subject matters, and so we knew he's all right, We're going to do a sneaker episode on sneakers for all the sneakerheads out there, sneaker collectives, and you know, I was thinking, like who could we bring on? And then I'm like, you know what, I actually know one of the leaders in the field when it comes to to the whole sneaker culture.

And it's crazy. It's crazy how life works.

So I knew him for years that we actually went to high school together and went to prep school together, and Winshington Weinhington, Massachusetts, the winch So it's crazy, like we always talk about networking and the power networking and you never know. So me and Mike went to high

Oh, shout out to who else was there? My man from Australia, Mike, what.

Was we have? Martin Ed, Martin Edi to Mario.

Yeah, So it was like it was like twelve high level D one players and so it was crazy. So me, like, you know, coming from just a regular public school Westchester, Like you know what I'm saying, I definitely hadn't played on that level of competition before.

Like it was crazy for me to even be in that environment.

And I made friends with pretty much everybody, but a few of the guys was like really, really, I became close with and my man. Mike was one of my closest friends up there when I was in prep school. We always worked out. He had a tremendous work ethic. He always was shooting jump shots all the time. We used to go to the gym at like four o'clock in the morning, two o'clock in the morning, me and Andrew.

It's crazy because I said, Yo, I know this guy. I was watching this guy that you told me you knew.

Hi.

I'm like, oh, you know this dude followed him. I'm passionate about.

This, and then he had like at that time he had like one hundred two hundred thousand subscribers years ago, way before YouTube was really a wave. Like he was early on YouTube and I'm like, oh, he's doing his thing, and he was like making these videos about sneakers, and I still like, yo, why is he doing sneaker reviews? Like you know what I'm saying, Like I didn't really understand because I'm still not really a sneaker, had choice

I appreciate it, Man, thanks for having me.

I'm really excited. You know.

I've been following what you guys have been doing and love everything that you're doing.

So it's an honor to be here man.

So yeah, for sure. So all right, let's get in.

Let's get into it before we're gonna talk about the sneaker culture and business.

At what point because I didn't know you was a sneakerhead like that in school.

I know you had sneakers, but at one point, because like I said, you're early on and kind of like really on the cutting edge of like bringing a sneaker culture to YouTube and the web and all that, how did this develop into actually you building an online community a business like but that just like happened by accident. Like what was the point where you say, you know what, this is more than just me liking sneakers, I'm an build a community.

Yeah, so it kind of did happen on an accident a little bit.

So growing up, like I didn't say, oh, hey I'm a I'm a sneakerhead. I'm just I'm from New York City, and sneakers are part of the culture. You know, even at that prep school, right like when we had to wear, you know, a tie and a blazer, like we still

I was just at the crib and my brother was as well.

We were living together. We both had knee surgery. Just kind of the way it went. And I wasn't a YouTube guy at all. I didn't watch YouTube, and I forget what I was looking for on the internet or on YouTube, but I saw a sneaker video pop up, and I was like, wow, people kind of your reaction, like you said, when you saw what I was doing. I saw someone reviewing a sneaker and I was like, a sneaker. And then I'm looking to my left and I got a whole closet, a whole wall full of sneakers.

I'm like, yo.

So I told my brother. I was like, Yo, let's mess around. Let's make a couple of videos. We had nothing but time on our hands at that time, and we weren't looking at it like it was going to be a career. We weren't looking at it necessarily with an agenda or even goals in mind.

We kind of were just passing the time.

And it was more and so like a hobby thing, and I think a combination of a couple of different factors. It just started to pick up and pick up and pick up, and then we were like, wow, like maybe we got something here. And so then we started branching off a little bit and and and monetizing and looking at it from the business side of things too, and uh, and now we're here, So, you know, feel very fortunate to be able to work and make money with something that I kind of grew up on.

But yes, it's been dope, man.

Which like factor you said, there was some factors which factor contributed to the launch.

Was it like a shoot that you had it was the rarity of it.

Yeah, Well, I think the timing of it where we got into it at a certain time, Like YouTube had it had been around, and this was like seven years ago, so it had been a thing, but sneakers on YouTube were still it was still in its infancy, you know, like it wasn't it wasn't polished up.

It was mostly like you know, running gun.

Dude shooting on webcams or on their laptops and sitting in a bedroom and it wasn't really polished and so and we were far from polished too when we first started. But so I think the timing of it worked out well for us. I think the fact that I had

I just I don't really know how to do the in between things, like for me, if I'm in on something.

And even though we started as a hobby, it was right away we were like, yo, how do we make the quality better? You know, I'm thinking like, damn, how can I do the on screen thing better?

How do we create better content?

Even though it was only a hobby, I think just my natural personality kind of pushed us to really work hard at it. And so I think all of those things together put us in a pretty good spot.

Now. It's crazy you say that, because it's like a lot of stuff that I learned in basketball I still carry over in business, in life. And one of the biggest lessons I never really liked Burns. He was our coach, but shout out to him, you know, let after all these forgive it, but one thing that he really he really really taught me. And it was like, I don't know if you remember, but if you came fifteen minutes beforehand, anything after fifteen minutes early was late. Like you know

You was late.

And the reason I understand that now because it's like, you gotta prep. We can't start a podcast at four and get here at four, right, we gotta like, you know what I'm saying. So it's like little stuff like that really really carries over, and I understand what you're saying as far as like I feel like you know all of us, but especially for athletes, once you get it's hard to really halfway do anything because you still got that competitive spirit in you. You want to be

I'm not as lucky.

I told him.

I told him he's doing an episode today on sneakers and he's like, why are you doing an episode on sneakers? Nobody's gonna watch that. I'm like, wow, He's like, nobody cares about sneakers. I'm like, Oh, you don't know what you're talking about so, so sneakers a billion dollar industry and the highest sneaker ever sold actually was recently five

Like they have bid prices, act prices. You want to talk about it.

Yeah, so if you go to stock x and we're not promoted by it, but I have used the site. So we got to start looking at sneakers, ask him outits like we said earlier. So they have prices, they have an ask price, like you said, a big price, and then you can see the transactions of the past year or so. Like so when we watch a chart on the stock market, we can watch the chart of the value of a shoe. We can also see if it's the appreciated or if it's appreciating right, so it's

If it was on sale for sixty dollars, will you buy it?

Right?

You got to know your end price.

So like it is a stock exchange and the sensor, which which is why they call it stock x, And I mean it's a pretty good site. And it also does something that a lot of people weren't doing. And I was a victim of this, is they authenticate the shoe. So authenticating the shoe is extremely important, right because prior to this, and I'm sure you probably maybe you fell victim to it too, but it was eBay and Craigslist that was it.

It's it's people were definitely getting got And as time has passed, the fake pairs have gotten so much better. It used to be you could spot a fake from two blocks away, you could say yo. But now they've gotten so good that you, you know, you really do need something in place to kind of protect you in that regard.

So yeah, stock x does a great job.

With that, so to do people, because I've seen that the game is so there's like resellers who like buy a pair of sneakers four hundred dollars and then they resell it on the market for three hundred because it's a limited quality.

But so it's like two sneaker markets.

There's like the actual global sneaker market, and then there's a resale market. So I think when you said like the two billion dollar market, that's like the reselling market where people buy it and bulk and then they sell it for a markup.

You know what I'm saying.

So if that's pair of shoes was one hundred and ninety nine dollars, like a pair of Easies is two hundred dollars, right by the time it gets to stock X or one of these site stadium goods of flight Club, that same shoe is now going to be like five hundred minimum. So that person is going to make a three hundred dollars profit on the shoe.

Yeah, So can you talk about that, mic as far as you don't you don't resell obviously you're familiar with it because you're in the culture.

Are people still doing that?

And how much money can can somebody actually make a being a reseller?

Yeah? I mean that's a great question.

And that's probably the thing that I get messaged and the most about on social media is like yo, because everyone thinks, YO, get rich quick, get a couple pairs of easy and and you know you're in there, but and there is a ton of money in it. One of the reasons why I never really went in that direction. I mean, I have sold sneakers. I sold my entire collection a few years ago, but about that. But it's in order to really make real money in that you

Of course? Right? So man, he wore a pair of sneakers.

I don't even remember which one it was, maybe it was the Chicago ones. And I went to stock X the next day and they were up like five six hundred bucks from where they were.

Same thing.

So if you were smart, now I wasn't, But if you were smart, go buy fifty pairs and then anticipate the boom and then cash out. And so if you can predict the way things are gonna go, which is never something that I've invested a lot of time or energy into.

But if you are able to do.

That, then like you said, there's there's there's tons of money in it is it's a huge industry.

Like I guess the big question is, and I know there is like an inside a lot of people know, people like district managers of stores, so they get picked. How is somebody getting fifty piers Like I'm come from that era where you waited in line on Saturday, right, and then if you were able to get into the store, you got one. Then it turned into like if you

Yeah, sure, A bot is basically something that you run on your computer to help you check out lightning fast so that you can beat you know, the person who's there at their computer doing it manually, trying to put in their credit card info and boom, you already got the sneaker and you're already you know, down the virtual block, so to speak. But as far as how resellers get the stuff, that's not something that I'm necessarily too privy to because I don't do it. But sure you could

After sneakers, and that's not really the case.

A lot of times I got to pay the resell price on it myself just to get it so we can, you know, do the video on it and get the product in hand. So there have been other times where I'll go to a local resale shop here and do the video on said sneaker and then give the sneaker back sometimes.

So sometimes I'll.

Get lucky and you know, I'll get a pair at retail, you know, online or however it goes. But it's getting the product is is definitely one of the biggest obstacles as far as someone getting into that line of work.

Yeah, I read somewhere where it's become a lot harder now because, yeah, a lot of places you can only buy one pair at a time limit you online. Then if you try to buy it on like the easies, you can't even buy them like retail, like they sell out so quickly it's limited edition. So it's become so the counterfeit market I've actually read is actually booming and

I think they sees like a there was like a seventeen million dollar season at the border, like they got a shipment of just fake Jordan's seventeen million.

It was crazy.

Yeah, I think they are mostly from China. I'm not.

Super familiar with it because we completely stay away from it. There's been other sneaker YouTube channels that have dove much deeper into that, where you know, maybe they'll compare a real pair and a fake pair, or try to educate people in that regard or whatever. So they've got their hands on the fake pairs, but we don't really do

Well, they probably make them in the same factor they make the real ones. It's like this, it's a factory in China that's making the real ones. So what's the difference between They'll just put summerside for fake they actually probably aren't.

Real making millions.

They had advice had a whole show on the fake retail market.

Dude's making millions.

Yeah, he's making millions of dollars and everybody knows it. But the thing is, like, yo, I could just fit in with this fifteen pair of fifteen dollars pair of sneakers, or I could have the one hundred and eighty dollar pairs sneakers. They gonna look the same and when I walk out the side, you're not gonna know difference anyway.

Nah, But that you know what, that's crazy though, what you said as far as like predicting events, because that reminds me of the stock Like we look at we buy stock and were like iPhone thirteen is about to come out, so we predict that Apple's stock price is going to go out.

It's all an educated guest.

We don't really know it not, So I never really looked at it as far as sneaker is in the same capacity. But yeah, you could say, okay, like let's say that you know, Lebron decides he's going to retire after this season, then the last sneaker that he puts out hypothetically could be more valuable because he's not gonna put on anyone.

That literally happened this year with the untimely death of Kobe Bryant. So like Kobe passing, now, if you try to get any Kobe sho any of the thirteen or fourteen ones he put out, they're over a four hundred dollars each, like whereas when he was alive and playing, that wasn't the case, like you could buy a Kobe so outside, like the Kobe nine. When he came out the high top and it changed, it was like it was affordable to do. And now it's like, yo, four hundred dollars at the minimum.

So but Mike, yeah, let me let me ask you this, what is what is the how does sneakers actually get value? Because to me, it's a little I feel like, I said, I'm not a sneakerhead, but I saw you did a review on your on your page a few days ago with the off white something off white oes. Yeah, it looked it looked like it was it was a dope sneaker to me. But she was like, you can actually

I think it's just what the consumer kind of pushes it to and and or lets it drop to. You know, it really is and That's why sometimes you'll see people, you know, complaining about prices, and even me sometimes I'm like, man, I can't I want that sneaker, but I'm not going to pay that.

But it's us who set the market. You know.

It's supplied and demand like anything else, and obviously certain sneaker releases.

Are more limited, so already the supply is low.

So then if the demand is even up a little bit, it's going to be something. It's going to reflect that in the resell price of the sneaker. So it's it is something that's pretty hard to predict. Like I said, to me, it would be a headache, you know, Like I know, if if that's something that you're doing for a living, which I know plenty of people who do do that and do very well for themselves, But to me,

You know, Nike skateboarding.

Is something that several years ago were really popular, and then over the past few years they kind of got stagnant. No one really wanted them other than people who were skating in them, but they had no resell value. And now over the last year or so, it's just bananas. Like it was a pair that I had and they were reselling for like two grand and retails like a hundred bucks. So it's but about a year ago, you

Yeah, So the SB, I'm glad you brought that up because the SB obviously, and we're going to talk about the Ben and Jerry that you got we need to talk about that, because I saw the post we're gonna talk about that.

We got to talk about that.

But the SB has, like you said, like a year ago, came back, and I feel like it was a Travis Scott effect, Like that's the power of influence. Like every time Travis Scott would put on the SB, whether it was the Diamond or the ones he made.

You would see that shoe go up.

But prior to that, I think, and maybe you can add to this, the one that changed the way sneakers looked at I think it has to be the SB Pigeon.

No, well, I mean that was that was one of the first sneakers that really created like a real real craze, you know. And so yes, but I think there's been an ebb and flow to sneakers, and I mean really everything goes that way, but it's the things will be sky high and then you know, they'll kind of gradually slide back down and then something will happen where it

She's getting them for free.

Well yeah, and like, yo, she's she's new to this.

And but the truth of the matter is they still have incredible influence. And when people start seeing that stuff on Instagram and they start saying, I want that sneaker, I want that one, and you know, now they're on stock x or now they're you know, searching to where they can find the sneaker. And so celebrities have really boomed things in my opinion, and Instagram specifically, and you know, just social media in general.

I guess.

So you spoke about not having the magic carpet where the sneakers are getting delivered to your door as a company. Was there one that you said you know what, I need to have this, and if so, what was the highest price you had to pay for that shoe?

Okay, So it goes two different ways. First is how much would I pay for a sneaker that I want to wear? You know, I want to wear it. I'm going to beat them up and I'm just okay with that. And then how much am I willing to pay for a sneaker that I'm going to get and we're going to create content around it, and then maybe down the line, I think it's going to hold value and it will

That that come and go, you know.

So the first part of that would be the Kobe six Grinch, which is that you know that really bright green pair of Kobe sixes and it was it's my

So that was That's.

Probably about the most I've spent on a sneaker to actually wear. And then as far as getting something that I knew would have some value down the line or down the road, would be the Red October Easies when when he was when he was still with Nike.

Yeah, and I can't remember exactly what I paid.

It was a homie who looked out, so I think it was around two thousand, and I ended up selling them for like maybe forty five hundred or five thousand, you know, maybe a year later or something like that.

Yeah, that's crazy.

Like I said, if you look at it from a stock and how much of those now, like ten thousand.

Probably the red out too, probably fifty five hundred right now.

Yeah, I think depending on the size, and that's another thing, right, that's true too, Yep, yep, you know, depending like I think I wear size thirteen. I think in my size, I think the lowest listing that I saw on stock X recently might have been close to ten grand.

That's true.

So like that sometimes when they put these things out, I can get a shoe for four hundred dollars if you were size thirteen, or if you got like a real small foot.

The small foot is that's tough.

The small like sometimes like a size four and a half and it'll be like double what any other size is.

Yeah, and at thirteen makes a big difference too, because I wear thirteen too, and it's like that's the last size that there's no half, So it's like there's no twelve and a.

Half mostly mostly so.

It's like eleven, eleven and a half twelve, So after twelve, it's like twelve, thirteen, fourteen to so now it becomes harder and it's less sneakers. I think the most popular is like ten and a half something like that, the most Like yeah, but now that's crazy that but like I said, looking at it from a stock standpoint, you brought it, sold it for forty five hundred, that's.

Like twenty two hundred.

Yeah, yeah, twenty two hundred.

You sold it for forty five hundred.

Yeah, So that's that's like one hundred percent increase, more than one hundred percent increase. So if you look at it from a stock that's like, you know, a great investment.

But that's so that's true, right, But that imagine if you got it at retail, right, because in retail puts two hundred dollars, you know what I'm saying. So if you're one of those people who got lucky, like Nike put that out on a random day, you bought it for two hundred, Now you're selling it for five thousand.

Show me the stock that's going to do that right now?

Oh yeah, no, it's crazy. Now. Now it is important to note, like.

I think something with people who resell sneakers because it is so hard and it is there is so much luck required to get pairs at that retail price. But going back to what we were talking about as far as being able to predict the market, like what if you cashed everyone out who had a pair who was

You know that they'll go up. Like Travis scott.

Sneakers for example, pretty much every single one that I've seen since he started, you know, doing collaborations with Nike, every single one is noticeably more expensive six months after release than it was a month after release. So it's just going up and up and up and up. So being able to predict that, I think allows you to maybe get more in bulk, although of course if you can get something for retail, then it's a home run.

Yeah, him in Virgil right now, the cash kings for sneakers As far when it comes to Nike it's not even close.

Yes, So we got the backstory on the whole sneaker industry. But now we're gonna go into my favorite part. We're gonna you're gonna look in your business model as far as you know, like I said, you're an entrepreneur, you're not just a sneaker enthusiast. So we're gonna we're gonna look at your business model and see how you know, how you've become successful.

In the next segment, let's do it all right.

So yeah, so in this segment, this is this is the interesting thing about Earn your Leisure because it's like, if you talk about businesses and there's so many different ways to make money in this world and so many ways to capitalize off of your passion, and sneakers is no different A lit of time, Like I said, people, I wanted to do this episode a little different because everybody knows about the resale aspect of it, and that's

So yeah, can you.

Talk about that as far as like your your business model, because yeah, you got a whole business around sneakers, and it's not it doesn't involve selling sneakers.

Right right exactly, Yeah, no. And I didn't go to school for business. My brother didn't go to school for business, you know. So uh but we are from New York City, as you know, and and you know, so it's it's

Like, erners, what's up.

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Be protected sponsored by the United States Department of Homeland Security. Well, if the brands are willing to pay us to show product, why can't we just make our own product and just kind of like we don't need the brand, you know, as far as that goes, really, And so we created Uncivilized, which is like, you know, a little streetwear brand that we started, and you know, we do really well with it, man, and it's you know, we keep it simple. We didn't

You know.

So it's it's kind of just a more advanced version of that. And so yeah, so we have the the brand deals. And we also noticed as we grew the channel and got bigger and talk to more brand people and stuff, that those brands have a lot of money they got a lot of money for advertising. And YouTube is kind of like a new frontier in that regard

You know.

It's like the way we saw advertisements growing up. It's different now, you know.

And so.

We realize that a lot of these brands had had pretty big money that they could put into what we do. And so the brand Lane and Angle is is one way that we work and make money. The Uncivilized clothing is is another way we We even had a beard care company for a little while called Beard Necessities where we were, you know, selling beard oils on Amazon, so and we were kind of promoting it through because right, we've we've built this audience and we've built this this

You know. I think sometimes people are like, oh, you work with your brother. You know we live together too. You live with your brother.

We you know, you know I would be ready to strangle my brother, but you know, for him and I we've always had a great relationship. We don't fight, we don't argue, we love the same stuff, and so it's just worked out really well, you know, doing what we do.

When you said the brands are reaching out, are you talking about the actual brands, so we're talking like Nike Adida Okay, yeah, because I mean there's also partnership. Are you also doing partnerships with shoe accessory so I'm thinking like shoe cleaning devices and things like that.

Yeah, you know, we we haven't done too We have done some stuff with shoe cleaner companies, we haven't done too too much. We've done a lot of stuff with stock X. We've done stuff with the brand like Nike Adidas. We've also done stuff with the retailer like finish Line, foot Locker, something like that. So we've really kind of worked with them all at this point. What what we try to focus on, my brother and I is.

Not number number one.

It's it is more authentic and organic to do it this way in my opinion, and I think.

There's also a.

There's more money in it as well, and that is trying to create and form long term partnerships and relationships as opposed to one offs. So as opposed to you know, okay, uh you know, say you know finish Line, Okay, you give us exit amount of dollars and we'll do this video for you and then okay, see you later. Now, when I talk to brands, I'm like, hey, listen, let's let's try to create something that's a little bit more long lasting than that. I think it has more impact.

Off stuff that you see.

Sometimes we talk we talk about the middleman a lot, so like people, we talked about what stocks is fundamentally, but really they're just the middleman between a buyer and a seller, right and then making a profit of the commissioner of those sales. So how did that deal come about? And when did it come about?

Yeah?

So I actually the guy who I guess you could say invented it. I actually knew him through social media before it even was a stock X and it was called Campless at the time, I think it was campleus dot com and it was no sneakers were being sold, but it was just all the numbers and the analytics and you know, the stock market aspect and documentation of stuff.

It's it was crazy.

Even at that time, this was probably I don't know, three four years ago.

Even at that.

Time it was they had a bunch of employees, like they were already booming, and so we we kind of were in on the on the ground floor with them. And it's also the place that that I was comfortable

No, I think that's important.

And it's like you know, Aren Alesia, it's a business podcast, So we never apologize about making money, Like that's the

Yeah, So when we first started the channel like seven years ago, neither one of us knew what we were doing, my brother or.

Myself, and we didn't really know how it was going to go.

Neither one of us were tech guys, neither one of us were necessarily on screen guys. So he just really really didn't want to be on camera. And I was like, all right, well, you know, I'll be on camera.

I don't care.

And then he kind of gravitated towards the editing thing and you know, the camera stuff, and so he got really really really good at it, you know, to the point where you know, I think, hands down, he's one of the best in the space when it comes to you know, the sneaker footage and you know, getting the b roll and you know, he's gotten really really good, and you know, we have we can afford good equipment now, and so it was just kind of a natural progression

Yeah, prior to Corona, I noticed sneaker conventions and we actually ended up at a convention. I know that the people have booth. Is that another way to earn income, like when people pay for you to come to these conventions?

You know, I think it definitely can be.

I know that a lot of sneaker people, for lack of a better word, were or sneaker influencers were doing those events for free for a very long time. And I think the way they justified it or made it make sense was that when they were there, they would sell merch or they would sell sneakers, or they would

But they weren't really paying to have people go.

So for me personally, I haven't been to a lot of sneaker events, believe it or not. You know, I've only I've been to probably less than a handful. That's not something that I did growing up. Really, It's not something like I said, growing up, I never was like I'm a sneakerhead.

So you know, it's never like I just like to be fresh. I just like to have some you know, some good feats.

So I've done a few and gotten paid for him, but it's so few and the money was good, but it's been so few and far between for me personally that it's never something that I could make a living on. If it was that exclusive, you know, if that was my main income, it would be tough.

Is there any stop to sneak a mania? Because it's been proven to be re session proof, it's been proven to be pandemic proof.

It's crazy. They had a lot.

I think it was Chicago, so in the middle of Corona they was like fighting with each other. So like, yeah, it's any Is this ever like it's only going up?

Huh?

It's it's not slowing down. Huh.

It's not slowing down right now. But I think you know, what goes up must come down. You know, I do think that there is ups and downs to everything. I've already seen it a little bit, just in the time that we've you know, technically worked in or with sneakers. There has been an ebb and flow to it, and there has been some peaks and valleys, but I think the general trend has pretty much been steadily, steadily, steadily up,

They were like, well, you know, the market's.

Going to crash you and it's going to crash youn and so we're like, all right, cool, and the crash didn't come.

So it's so.

It's kind of the same thing with sneakers, Like I think at some point there will be a crash, but I.

Don't know when that's going to be. I don't know.

Maybe it's going to be in a year, maybe it's going to be inten years. I mean, I really don't know. But it's the trend has been up for the most part, at least the general trend has been.

Up as long as influencers are still putting them on. I can't see it like as guilty as it sounds. Like when we were going through Corona and like mid March and April, I looked on stocks, I'm like, yo, nothing is changing, right, Like these things are still holding their value.

It's crazy.

It really is crazy. I mean, just for us. When the COVID stuff hit, I'm going to keep it a buck. I actually was pretty worried because I didn't, you know, we don't clock into a nine to five.

I don't have a.

Paycheck and paid leave and all that stuff, and so I was like, man, like we're just kind of out here getting it and we're doing well. But I'm like, man, if this thing just crashes and burns, man, I'm gonna have to really hustle. So actually I noticed the like the first week we took really a pretty.

Big hit.

Just with with kind of with everything that we do. I noticed that the numbers were down across the boards for us, and I think after people realized, okay, it's it's not the bubonic plague, not to downplay what it is, and the severity of it and the seriousness of it. But I think when people realize like, Okay, it's not going to be something where it's going to seep through the windows of my house and get me at night type of thing, then it was like, Okay, now people

I've never been too much of an.

Amazon shopper, and somehow I ended up buying all kinds of crazy. I bought this right here, like it's something that you it's like putty and you roll it on your keyboard and it takes the dust off your keyboard.

I don't I didn't need that.

I bought it on but I bought it on Amazon because I'm sitting there quarantined.

You know.

We were down here basically at the workshop at you know, at the studio where we work, and we were basically quarantined for like probably over a month straight.

Like I was starting to go crazy.

And so I think with people just at home on their computers, on their phones, you know, a lot of if you know, if you're selling a product, you know, I think that you know it made it go up even more than it was beforehand.

Online I was gonna say, online has been extremely profitable for a lot of people during the pandemic. Is unfortunately in life is life is a game of winning, winners and losers, and a lot of people lost a lot during Corona, especially brick and Martar businesses and stuff like that. But the winners in Corona have been the people would online operations. Because online operations, educational platforms, courses, all that stuff. I mean, you would you would never know that it

Business is booming absolutely absolutely, and you know, I think also and you know, it's ah, you know, I definitely feel for the people who you know, we're out of work and and and missed out on money. I know my I know it hit my pops really hard as far as what he does for work, and he works at a machine shop and so it's just out of work, you know, and so it's it can get really tough.

I know you've got the uncivilized brand, the clothing brand, but I'm thinking, now, any aspirations for shoe or have any brands approach you about a collaboration.

Yeah, so we actually did a shoe with Salcony. You know, growing up, I always said ny wait, yeah, no, I know, maybe it's a New York thing, And then when when we got up to their headquarters, they were like, you know, it's Socony so so but yeah, now we did a Salteny sneaker and it was awesome. You know, there was only like one hundred and twenty pairs, so it was ultra ultra limited, but nonetheless it's still a our own sneaker.

So we would love to do a sneaker, you know.

You know, I think sometimes because the YouTube thing is still kind of in its early stages at least big picture wise, I think sometimes people on YouTube might might not get the respect to do a sneaker like that, like you know, they think, okay, that's for somebody like

As far as uncivilized movement. Man, I went on the site. Man the Shirts is sold out.

Well, I noticed that that's part of the I mean that's part of the marketing though, because it's like it's always a release. It's always a limited amount, right, Like it's not like an unlimited amount. It's like like you gotta get it. It's like, you know who does that to west Side Gun. You're familiar with him.

Oh yeah, yeah.

From What's what's the Czilla?

They make it like one hundred thousand dollars a month off merch and I heard on our interview one time and he was like, their marketing scheme is that they only put out a limited amount and they'll drop it like on a random Tuesday and it's sold out by Wednesday, and they don't put it out.

They only do it like one day a month.

So now you create it's like sneakers, like you know, you create that command a lot of times when people feel like it's people are funny like if it's unlimited, but if it's limited, even if the price is higher, psychologically you feel like I have to get in on this.

Before it's everybody does it. When artists go on tour, it's the same thing. It's like, yo, I was there for that moment everybody wants to capture that moment.

So if you drop that, I know you did. The London artwork on his last album was like, well, I was a part of that release. Everybody wants to be part.

Of it because I've seen that might take. I need that Mike Tyson. That Mike Tyson hoodie that you had that was that was hard. I think that was last year.

Yeah, I'm gonna have to send you guys some stuff, you know, you know once once we wrap up, I'll get your guys sizes and stuff. But it's we uh yeah, we do. We keep everything limited. We do it for two reasons. One is because obviously we recognize that, you know, we're not a Nike, you know, brand name, so that type of demand is not there.

So we we try to meet the demand.

But we try not to go over that because it is just my brother and I were putting up all our own bread.

We don't want to have you.

Know, uh, five thousand pieces in the back storage room here that we're just sitting on for for nothing. So we do keep stuff limited, and it also helps us keep the uh the quality control really good because it is just him and I and we're doing all the shipping ourselves and so it just lets us operate in a functional and practical way. But yeah, yeah, we we pretty much keep everything pretty limited.

So what's the what's the scaling model? How what's your vision for for the brand?

Uh?

Moving forward in the next year five years? Like, how do you see how do you see the brand growing?

Yeah?

I mean, I guess we have some goals, but also we're kind of just moving with things, and we know that if we work hard and keep putting in the work, that will end up where we're supposed to be.

We try not to get too.

Rigid in like our path because you know, maybe something you know, stuff comes up and and things change and you know, maybe it's better to shift over this way a little bit. And you know, it's like I think it was Bruce Lee right who says you got to be like water, right, you know, like we're just kind of trying to flow with things and kind of see where things go. Definitely, we want to continue to grow the Uncivilized brand. We're working to open up a coffee shop.

You go through the bathroom and it's like on the left hand.

Side exactly exactly, so you know, you got to give them the pass word through the door.

But so we're working on some stuff like that.

The main thing is just keep creating content, keep paying attention to what's going on, and keep trying to outwork anyone else who's who's next to us, not even on some we don't want them to do well type of thing.

You know, we want everyone to eat.

But that's just what's worked for us, not just in the sneaker thing, but in basketball, in a lot of stuff. You know, when we got up to school up in Massachusetts, I was saying the same thing. I was coming from LaSalle Academy on the Lower East Side. I thought we had a good team there, and then when I when I got up to school, I was like, man, these dudes are our next level good. But I just worked and worked and worked until I was on the court

One last question before we finished. I noticed that you you do more stuff on YouTube than you do on Instagram. Any particular reason why you why you're more active on YouTube, you.

Know, that's that that that's one of the flaws right now. Actually, my brother and I were just talking about how I have to get the Instagram jumping a lot more. You know, I almost never post on my main feed. I keep the Instagram story pretty active, but the Instagram main feed is is not something that I focus on at all. And honestly, right now, it's been kind of like a time thing, and I'm super I guess picky about the quality. I don't want to just you know, post stuff that

For sure.

I can't let you leave without asking you the number one question, what's top five sneakers?

Man?

Come on, ah man, you.

Know you can't ask a sneaker guy that. I'm sure you can relate that. There's so many, there's so many to pick from, but I would say probably, you know, for me, when I think of a top five, it's more like nostalgia and sentimental reasons, you know, So like for me, the Jordan eleven, the black and red pair, the bread eleven's that was the first Jordan sneaker that I ever bought with my own money in like two thousand and one.

So, uh, that's that's in there.

I think I would probably put the air Max one twenty, which is a sneaker that a lot of people don't know about. It's it's kind of that that Spider Man looking air Max that has like it has like a there's different colors, but had the.

Sunrise colors on it, right, is what did it have the sunrise colors?

Yeah? Yeah, Yeah, the Sunrise.

So that was the first Airmac sneakers that I ever had back in ninety eight.

So it's stuff like that.

But I think you almost have to put, you know, an air Force one in there just for the culture, just for the longevity.

And it's been a mainstay forever other than that. Man, it's tough. It's tough.

The answer one that the iverson answer one. There's a couple of the Penny sneakers, the early Penny sneakers that I was in love with, the bo Jackson. I'm looking over here to my right because a lot of my favorite sneakers.

We can hang them up. We hang them up in the rafters down here.

So there's a and then you know, I gotta throw the salt Andy sneaker that we did just because we did it, you know it, so that there's like twelve five all fire a fight.

I would say, I would say, I'm not a sneaker officiato, but like sneakers, because sneakers, I feel like sneak. It used to mean a lot more in it. For like it's like music, like I'm old from nineties, Like you know what I'm saying. I remember when sneakers first came out and it meant it meant so much to the to the culture. Like now it's like those sneakers are being re released. But the Chris Webbers, which.

Which one is? Like the first one, the Golden State.

He's going to say, yeah, the Chris Webbers, the andre Agassi's, oh yeah, the.

The ure Agacines. So the bug Bunny Jordan's the Bugs.

Bundy New York Classic, Yeah, New York Classic.

Bo Jackson's the Orange and Blue.

That's what's saying.

They're right here.

I got him, I got him. I got him in the next room, bro. Yeah.

Yeah, And you gotta go with the air max. I think the three six one with the air bubble all the way around, was that the the ones the ninety six nove.

I'm surprised you didn't have the ninety five's in there, the.

Ninety five or you might be you might be thinking about the ninety five or the ninety seven. The air bubble was broken up a little bit, but it basically you thinking about the ninety seven.

The ninety five.

I thought that you would say that every every like you gotta have a ninety five and then and.

You know, probably and and whenever this comes up. My brother always throws the ninety five in there. You probably have to have it in there. Honestly, it's just it's so tough to narrow it down. But the ninety five is another New York City classic.

I'm gonna tell you.

I'm gonna tell you one and shout out to what's my man's name from Seattle Maclamore. He's the only one who's ever put this shoe in his tops, the Nike Spirit on.

Again.

I mean, it's it's one of those sleepers, but it's class.

I bought like five different colors of that shoe. Is so comfortable. But yeah, I'm with you, the greatest who ever made the Jordan Love.

Remember remember Addas with the sock that came out and it was different colors.

Oh that I think those the Adida XLT or something like that. They at the side like.

It was like blue black, like you can have, Like.

Yeah, that's that's real nineties that.

I'm nineties. I'm a product.

And well, so we got the eleven.

I got number one bo Jackson's obviously, but like you said when I watched, I still have this game on tape. Arizona played Kentucky in the ninety six championship when Mike Bibby had all these blue sneakers that I.

Couldn't figure out what they were. I said, what is that? What is that?

That ended up being the Pennies the original phone posit that had that's in my top five?

Is that why your name is former Simpson.

After after Bibby or actual every hardaway.

Just after the phone posits.

So when we were starting the YouTube channel, I was like, all right, you know, I gotta, you know.

Put a name in.

And again we weren't looking at it big picture wise, so and at the time I had a bunch of phones, you know, right on the on the floor next to me, and I was like, hey, former Simpson with it. So and then and then you know, it kind of just went from there. But yeah, it's funny because I rarely wear phones now. But you know, obviously the you know, the YouTube name don't change.

Sims a vintage.

So, mister Fomer Simpson has been a pleasure. How can the people contact you, well, not contact you, but what's your social media handles all that information? How can they, yeah, get aware of what's going on? Any any initiatives that you you got going on?

Sure, sure, sure, so, uh, mister former Simpson.

On YouTube that's the main platform. Mister former Simpson on Twitter and Instagram. My brother and I have a podcast also where we talk about non sneaker related stuff like more just like uh, you know, music, movies, food, all of the stuff that's part of the same culture, but you know, not sneakers per se. And that's the Phamy and Buckets Unnamed podcast and that's been really fun to do.

Troy Housekeeping.

Yeah, shout out everybody on patreon dot com. That is our proud to pay program. You already know what time it is if you're tier four or five. That gives you access to E y L University, our online school, the number one online business school in the universe.

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New ey l you university merchant.

We're gonna get you some merch Mike. Yeah.

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Yeah.

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