Love this podcast? Support this show through the A Cast Supporter feature. It's up to you how much you give and there's no regular commitment. Just click the link in the show description to support now. The River City Wrestling Con is happening June 8th and 9th at the World Golf Village in St. Augustine, FL Visit rivercitywrestlingcon.com For more information and tickets.
I'm telling you right now brothers and sisters, this is going to be the biggest and best River City Wrestling Con ever. Guests scheduled to appear include The Icon, Sting, Trish Stratus, Devon Dudley, Big Vito, Legrazzo, Lita, Booker T, The Hardy Boys and so much more. But get this, it will also be live wrestling action. Fishing Pro wrestling champion Tiffany Nieves takes on Ruthie Jay.
We also have Scotty Sosa going to be taking on the TNA Knockout champion Jordan Grace. We also have the gold medalist herself, the Suplex Queen herself, Tiny Funnelly. She'll be in action once again folks. World Golf Village St. Augustine, FL June 8th and 9th The River City Wrestling Con River City Wrestling con.com For ticket information, check it out. That's right. You're locked in. Look. At what we have here, folks. To the only show that matters, the queen of the crop do gloves
wrestling. And there is no. One that does it better than your house. I have come here to chew bubble gum and kick ass and I'm all out of bubble. Brothers and sisters, welcome back to the Duke Loves Wrestling podcast. In fact, we have the debut of a special series within Duke Loves Wrestling World and every Sunday you are going to hear conversations with one of the most accomplished wrestlers of all time. Someone who legitimately is one of the most decorated wrestlers of all time.
Considered one of the greatest tag team wrestlers of all time. The WWE Hall of Famer himself, our favorite brother, Devon Dudley. How you doing that, Devon? I'm. Doing well. How you doing my man? I am doing fantastic. It is always great to touch base with you, man. It's, it's, it's funny, over the past couple of months, you and I have really developed a special relationship with each other. Just shooting the breeze all the time.
Absolutely. I mean, it's been an honor and a privilege to talk to somebody that actually knows what the hell they're saying. Listen, don't put me over too much, man. You know, somebody going to come out of the woodwork and say, no, we can't stand him, Come on. Listen, damned if you do, damned if you don't. If you do everything good, somebody's still going to hate you. If you do everything wrong, they're really going to hate you. So you know, you got to do what you got to do.
And don't worry about the the haters. The haters will be haters regardless. That's right. And if they're not talking about you, then you might not be doing enough good. So there, there's that. I love it. Exactly. I love it when people, you know, if they say bad things or do bad things, you know, like the, you know, the dirt sheets and things like that. You guys don't get it. Even if you don't like me and you're sitting there saying bad things about me, you're helping
me to stay in social media. It's like or, or with the young, with this new generation of wrestling fans, it it's just, it's ridiculous that they don't figure that out. And some of a lot of them don't like me, which is fine, but keep saying the stuff that you're saying about me keep me in the limelight and that that's going to happen. Absolutely, because out of sight is out of mind. So as long as they keep you, keep talking about you and what have you, you stay on folks mind.
Can't go wrong with that. I love it. I love it. Speaking of staying on folks mind, the Dudley boys, you know the, the historic, the, the well accomplished, the the Hall of Fame tag team that you formed with your brother Bubba Ray Dudley. You fellas were a trending topic this past week and you know for an interesting reason on the Pod Meets World podcast. OK, this is a podcast that was developed by some of the stars of the Boy Meets World franchise.
The original version one Danielle Fishel, AKA Topanga. She had the following to say, quote, I do have a real, it's kind of a secret goal. At some point in my life, I want to be put through a table in a wrestling ring. End Quote. So she said that and literally all over social media, folks latched onto that. The Dudley boys were trending. So many people were talking about it. I mean it, it's a big deal.
So I got to ask you, the Hall of Famer himself, 1/2 of the Dudley Boys, Devon Dudley. What do you have to say in response to Topanga? Well Topanga, I've been a very big fan of yours since you know the TV show and thought you were always a beautiful young lady and you still are to this day. Most people in Hollywood who start off beautiful don't normally end beautiful. But she's done her job very well. She's again a fine young lady. Stayed out of the media any negative publicity.
So this came as a complete shock to me when I heard about this. All I got to say is I have a training facility in Winter Park, FL with a ring and we have tables. So, you know, if she's ready to get put to a table by the Dudley boys, come on down. It'll be our honor and our pleasure to do that. Have you come down, bring the cameras, bring everything you possibly can to put it out there that the Dudley boys put you through a table.
We would love to work with her and make that dream a reality. So depending if you're listening, then you'll come on down. Give us a call. Follow me on Testify Devon Instagram and Twitter getting excited here and let us know what you want to do and we'll definitely, you know, do what we got to do to make that dream happen. I love it so. So there you go. The the gauntlet has been laid down. The challenge has been put out
there. Danielle Fishel AKA Topanga Pod Meets World folks, you can follow Devon that testified Devon on your social media, Twitter and Instagram. In fact, you know what, I will send a special message to you folks as well just to try to bridge that gap a little faster here. Let's make it happen. You know, bring you, bring your crew out there to Devon school. Let's make it happen. It would be fantastic to to give Topanga her ultimate dream of being put through a table,
especially by the Dudley boys. I love it. Celebrities, they're just regular people just like anybody else. I mean, you're a celebrity, so you can you can attest to that and what have you here. But for you, as someone who's been a famous TV star, excellent in your field, you're a Hall of Famer and what have you, who are some celebrities that not only were you surprised to to learn or wrestling fans, but who you've personally had really
good experiences meeting? The 86 Giants, the Championship, Super Bowl, 86 Giants met them in New York City probably about six months after being in WWE. And was it Bill Banks, I think his name was? They were there at this, an event that we were doing the same club that P Diddy got in trouble for in New York City, which was right around the corner from the the restaurant, the WWE restaurant at the time.
And we did an autograph signing there and the just about everybody from the New York Giants 86 championship team was there. And it kind of blew me away because you know, I watched those guys. I grew up in Brooklyn, NY, I was a Jet fan. But we also, if The Jets didn't win, we also went with the Giants. So I knew who they were. And so to actually go to introduce myself and for them to tell me I know who you are, me and my kids, we watch you all
the time. It blew my mind because you're not thinking that guys that you idolized or you looked up to or you watched would know who you were without even introducing yourself to them. So that was completely honored there. LL Cool J was another one when he came to Smackdown and I believe this, if I'm looking correctly in my mind, where this building was, I think it was in Virginia, we had did a Smack Down taping.
He was promoting. I know, I think he was promoting his album and a movie that he was doing. And WWE of course, was helping him do that. And I remember meeting him and him being a huge wrestling fan, still kind of chilled, you know, LL, you know, didn't really show excitement, but expressed it when you talk to him and how much he followed, like during the Hogan and Andre era, the Dusty Ric Flair era. I mean, he he was a definitely a wrestling fan. But you hear stories about this
all the time. You hear about it with Mike Tyson coming into WWE, doing things with the WWF and then coming in and expressing his love for all of the people that he's watched over the years. I mean, it's been truly an honor to meet so many people over my years that have been wrestling fans and actually showed you and told you how much of A wrestling fan they were, especially of you, the individual they're talking to. That's awesome.
And like you said, the the 86 giants who were talking about Carl Banks. Carl Banks, Yes, I'm sorry. He was a linebacker there. No, you were, you were right on it there, man. And that was one of the greatest defenses of all time. I mean, they had, you know, the the man literally considered one of the greatest football players of all time at any position, Lt. Lawrence Taylor. Right. Yeah.
But Lt. too. Yeah, he was great because, you know, he had the experience with Bam Bam Bigelow in WrestleMania coming out and doing his thing. So, you know, he was a huge wrestling fan even before he did that. So, you know, he said it was an honor for Vince at the time to have asked him to be a part of WrestleMania. How all of that went down. And that's one of the greatest
matches of all time. I mean Bam Bam Bigelow for for a guy his size to be able to put Lt. in a position to look that good in a match, that was incredible. Well, again, I mean, I, I don't think people gave Bam Bam the credit that he actually deserved and what he did in the ring.
I mean, I noticed him really in the things that he was able to do to help people was when he was in ECW, you know, when he was part of the triple threat, Shane Douglas, Chris Candido, the original triple threat, the original guys that held up the three fingers, which is where Bub and I got it from. And then of course, John Cena took it and now Bianca Bel Air and Jay Conwell, they're doing it now.
So, you know, it's amazing how you know, it starts way back when and still now relevant to this day. That's right. That's you talk about telling the history. That's that's awesome. I didn't even realize that you got that from the triple threat. You know, that's that's amazing. Absolutely. I remember, you know, in the very beginning I I looked at I I would see Shane Douglas like, look, I hope you don't have an offense to us using the, you know, please and this.
And I think Bam Bam had already passed and Candido had had already passed. He was like Devon. No, he was like, he's like, it's an honor. I think anyone who gets mad or goes on social media, and I'm not saying any names that gets mad about people using things that you might have used back in the day that made it popular, Why get mad, feel honored. Well, they didn't ask me if it was OK. Really. If they've never met you or seen you, why would they?
How would they do that be honored that they're paying, you know, homage to you and that's I've always thought that even with, you know, people using 3D, the Usos, Cesaro and Seamus during a house show one time that I was producing at that time, you know, asked me he's like, do you mind if we use three DI was like, absolutely. Please, by all means, do it. Because you know, again, you're introducing this new generation that might not even know who the Dudleys are, but they know who
Seamus and Cesaro are. They know who the Usos are because this is their generation. So by all means, if you can introduce that to them, yes, please. It's my honest, my privilege, and I'm sure Bubba feels the same way. You don't knock the new generation for paying homage to yourself and what you've done over the years, because that could backfire very easily. Sure. Again, out of sight and out of mind.
If you, if you knock the the new generation for picking up the baton and carrying it, you put yourself in a position where maybe they never make reference to you. The fact that you just said that you got that those three fingers from the triple threat. For all these young folks who are listening right now who did not grow up watching ECW, they weren't even born when it was happening, They may go back and Google what the triple threat is.
And. Now you just exposed them to a whole point in time in his in history, right where they can go back and learn more about Bam Bam. Learn more about Chris Candido, 2 great wrestlers, learn about Shane Douglas who at one time he's one of the the best. In fact, I think he was rookie of the year when he first broke into the business. Not only that, and on the mic, I mean, he really developed his craft in CW.
He didn't, you know, he had his falling outs and whatever happened in WWE when he was the Dean. But when he left there and pretty much went to ECW W Paul Heyman gave him the privilege to be able to go out there and be Shane Douglas. And that's exactly what he did. He was able to go out there and really, you know, create that
character. And it was probably at that time during an ECW, probably one of the most hated villains next to the Dudley's at the time, Yeah. Yeah, hated so much that he ended up becoming beloved, you know, just like the Dudley's. That's that's that's an irony in that there, folks, definitely don't don't hesitate. Go out of your way to check out some of Shane Douglas's stuff, especially from those ECW years.
He, he made the promo that sparked the Revolution, where it went from, you know, an N.W.A affiliate to a standalone, you know, remember that, remember that. You know, it's, it's funny when we think about these, these moments in history and how it can affect what happens going forward. One move that the WWE made. And I wanted to get your thoughts on this, Devon.
They decided a few years back that they were going to start doing business in Saudi Arabia. And that was at a time where they received a lot of criticism for that. You don't want to do business with them. And how can you do that? And, you know, politically it may not be good and that might hurt business and yadda, yadda, yadda. All these naysayers and what
have you. Despite the fact that the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia in terms of a nation, they have been an ally with the United States for for years and years and years. When you go back, you look at that history, they legitimately are one of our strongest allies. And we make a lot of money doing business with them as a country. But you want to criticize a a company for doing business with them that that never really made sense to me, but it was a shrewd business move that the WWE made.
And Russell Nomics, you know, Brandon Howard Thurston the third, he has that that brand and I want to shout them out. Folks, definitely check this stuff out on social media. They have a podcast you can listen to. Brandon does a lot of hard work in in analyzing the economics of pro wrestling, especially WWE, since it's a publicly traded
company. Wrestlnomics put together a graphic in which they showed how much money WWE has made in the 40 year history of WrestleMania. So they gathered a lot of information from various sources here and it says every WrestleMania ticket sale ever in its forty year history, adjusted for inflation, WWE has made about $338 million.
OK, that's the estimate on that. In 40 years of Wrestlemanias all ticket sales and what have you in comparison, since 2018 when WWE has been going over to Saudi Arabia and hosting these events, which is sponsored by the government of Saudi Arabia. There's been eleven of these events, $550 million have already been raised from going over to Saudi Arabia since 2018
of putting on these events. So, you know, that's over $200 million more from 11 events as opposed to WrestleMania, which in over 40 years they've gotten an estimated $338 million. I want to ask you, Devon, just what are your thoughts about that? Do do you feel that WWE made the right move starting to do these events over in Saudi Arabia? You know, my thing is, why not? We're not at war with Saudi
Arabia, you know. So if the Saudis have all that money that they're willing to burn for us to come over there and to entertain the people of Saudi Arabia, why not? I thought we were in the business of making money, not holding grudges about what you think, you know? So why not go over there and make some money? Why not go over there and be able to feed your families and to make history with numbers like that?
I mean, look, wrestle Mania did an excellent job over the years over the 40 wrestle Manias that we've had. But look at the little bit of shorter time that we've been in Saudi Arabia, the money that we've made over there. I mean, think of the the payday when people have come in The Who were past legends and made one huge payday just off that one night being in Saudi Arabia. Hell, I wish I would have you know one person I read somewhere.
And it was about the whole Vince McMahon thing that's going on, got on somebody and I got to try to make this the statement accurate. I'm almost positive when I say this, This is exactly what was said. They basically got on the person that basically worked for the company during Vince's time. And when a question was asked about Vince McMahon, you know, the person said, you know, well, I don't have any ill feelings towards Vince. If these accusations are true, then yes, he needs to pay for
his actions. In other words, he needs to go through whatever he's going through. But if it's not, then he needs to be vindicated and get out of this. So my thing, but the one and then somebody said, well, you know, you would say that about this guy 'cause you worked for him and this and that you didn't care about the money when he was raping all of these people. Number one, we don't know about these allegations, whether they're true or not. It still hasn't been to trial
yet. Everybody's waiting and anticipating, you know, biting your fingernails, hoping to get the actual truth on what's going on. No one has that thought yet. But you can't knock somebody for working for someone who made them money to help feed their family, put food on the table, clothes on their backs. I mean, that person that said that that got on the person for not wanting to bury Vince and said, oh, well, I guess not. I mean, you would, you know, you took his money and blah, blah,
blah. And if you were in that position, you would have done the same thing as well. You would have taken the money even in those accusations at that time weren't even out yet. These accusations are brand new. So whatever was done in the past, we didn't know about it. You know, we're working for the company of the WWE.
That was our dream. Anybody who's been in the wrestling business or has watched the wrestling business and wanted to be a part of it, your ultimate dream was to work in the WWEI don't care who you are. That's what you wanted. And if you say you didn't, you're lying. I'm not saying you didn't want to go to Japan or WCW or any other places, but the ultimate goal was the WWE. That's the grandfather of them
all. It's foolish to put it on somebody in terms of saying because you took the money in the past because he paid you a good amount of money, so of course you're going to defend them. No, wait until the accusations are proven without a shadow of a doubt and then make those assumptions. So leave the WWE alone. Going over there and wanting to make money and provide for the company as well as the talent
that's over there. You know, they open their doors to us and they have welcomed us with open arms. And the one thing I love about the Saudis is that they love nostalgia. They love the older wrestlers because that's what built this company today was the blood, sweat and tears in the back of yesterday's wrestlers. So you know, before you fans sit up there and make these comments and say the things that you say, understand what's going on,
understand the business aspect. It's not just what you see on TV, but it's all the stuff that's behind the scenes as well. Get your biz, get your facts straight and know what's going on before you open your mouth. And that's the sad part about today on social media. Well said. Well said. And I mean, listen, I'll, I'll piggyback a little bit on that
there. There's a big difference between rumors and blind items as opposed to someone literally bringing a lawsuit, putting their name on it, pursuing legal action, and even there, there's a difference between a lawsuit and a conviction. So no one is out here trying to defend or make excuses or anything like that. Certainly not. But I will say this, in the United States of America, we have a Constitution that says everyone is innocent until proven guilty.
But you don't, you were going there with that. But I have to say this and you and I both know in the United States that is not the case here. You are guilty until you are proven innocent. And that has seems to be the key always here in the United States. With that being said, you know, again, I'm not defending at all anything that has been alleged about the man. I'm just saying let it go
through the court system first. Let it be proven before you make these accusations and before you condemn people. Then, and only then, will you be justified in what you're saying verbally. Well said, well said. And I agree 100%. Again, you know you, how would you want to be treated? That's what I always say. You know, if if you're in a position and you're saying something is true or something is not true, how would you want
to be treated? And that should apply to how you treat others and, and how you look at others. And, you know, I'll, I'll, I'll leave it there. Certainly, you know, next time we get together, Devon will definitely talk about King and Queen of the Ring. You know, the latest event happening in Saudi Arabia. It's it's going to be an exciting event.
People are very excited about that to see what happens next, because the winner of King of the Ring and the winner of Queen of the Ring will get the title shot at summer Slam. So, you know, stakes are high. Hey, I think it's great.
You know, the king of the ring has always been, in my opinion, a pay-per-view that hasn't really given the right, what's the word I'm looking for publicity that it should be because, you know, it's been known in history that if you won the king of the ring and now the queen of the ring, you were gonna be pushed to the moon. You were going.
That was your ticket to saying, OK, this person is now the person that we're gonna put the rocket on and we're gonna fly him out there and see what what what goes on. That is such a huge pay-per-view. Just the fact that, you know, it's taking place and it's out in in another country by any means. I mean, that's huge, you know, and I can't wait to see the numbers. I can't wait to get the reaction from the fans and just the world in general.
You know, WWE is doing great things and it's no secret I've always been a WWE guy and an ECW W guy. And I said this last time on your podcast. You know, I've always been, that has always been my home. Even when we said farewell to the Dudley's on Monday Night Raw after our second run, I made it clear that the WWE is my home and it will always be my home. So yes to all the 8 AEW strong
hearts yes, it is my home. It is the place where I grew up watching pro wrestling and it's the place that I would I'd love to end my career in. You know, a lot of AEW fans don't understand that it's gotta be a EWAEW yes, a EW is a good organization. I, I love the talent that's there, but for me, I've never worked for them. So I don't know what that organization is all about.
I do know the organization that I do know, which is the WWE and very happy that I've been a part of them for over 20 years. Whether it been talent OR whether it had been a producer, you know, I had a tremendous time there and hopefully that time will continue. We'll see what happens, but in that aspect, and that's as a producer, that is, as a producer. The WWE is a young man's sport now, so I can't get my old butt in that ring no more and play
with those guys. I mean, I could, but I don't think the people want to see that as much, you know? Besides, I wouldn't want to take anything away from the younger talent. You know, again, I would love to help out as much as I can, whether it be in the ring to help them with their matches to get over or definitely as a producer for them. I had so much fun as a producer in WWE. I can only imagine what it would be like being under the ruling of Paul Levesque, Triple H.
Well said, well said. And listen, you, you brought it up. This is a great transition here 'cause I did want to get your thoughts on this. AEW, they continue to have these challenges with their ratings. And you know, folks, Full disclosure, you know that I am one of the people who have led the charge. The Nielsen ratings are not completely accurate. They have a small sample size of people that they get their
information from. They have lost their accreditation in the past because they were, they were not accurately counting black and brown households. You know, I've been on the record on that. I was actually a a Nielsen household myself. So I could speak from experience on how that goes. But with that said, Tony Khan, who's a big numbers guy, he's a
big analytics guy. He has always pointed out that his key audience, the folks that he's trying to attract the most are the key demo and they're primarily who, who's the quote UN quote key demo. They're white males. So there's no, there's no challenge there in terms of being, you know, inaccurate with how many people are watching AEW because if you're getting that information correctly, they, they never mess up that information.
And unfortunately for AEW, this this past Wednesday, their flagships show Dynamite, it did 713,000 viewers on average. Now that's up from the previous week, which was only 672,000 viewers. But you know, currently they're, they're in bad shape, man. I mean, when you compare where they were just a year ago in May, 847,000 viewers is what
they were averaging a year ago. So they're down about 17% because they're only pulling in about 700,000 on average for the month of May and in in quarter two, you know, they're, they're only averaging about 727 thousand as opposed to 855,000 viewers in quarter 2 of 2023. So that's, that's 15% drop there. All this is according to Wrestlnomics. Once again, I'm plugging them. Check out their, their podcast, check out their social media
Wrestlnomics there. But I want to get your thoughts on this, Stevonne, at a time in the wrestling industry where WWE is making money hand over fist, they are actually expanding partnerships everywhere. Everyone wants WWE on their their television networks. Everyone wants to do business with them. They they got a show on Twitter called Speed. So they're doing all these innovative things here. AEW continues to drop. They continue to lose market share, lose viewership and what
have you. What do you think of that just from a general standpoint there, Devon? Well, you know. Wrong time, wrong place for Tony Kahn to make the analogy about AW being a Pepsi of the pro wrestling business and WWE being a Harvey Wolstein. Wolstein, how do you say his name? It was the wrong time. And you know, a grant you because of somebody who wants owned the company who no longer works in the company or owns or has any shares in it no longer.
And they've done a great job in trying to erase all of that. There was no need to bring that up. Now to me, if you ask me, I think it actually backfired in his face for saying that. Because now look at what WWE is doing and look at what his show is doing. Now, who's the Pepsi of the wrestling business? Although I like Coca-Cola, but still, who's the Pepsi of the wrestling business? Now, if you want to say that the numbers don't lie, Ken AEW. And I was thinking about this.
Because I heard a podcast, Ken AEW, you have WWE who does back-to-back sold out events at WrestleMania and then goes and does Monday Night Raw the. Arena right next door. To it and sells out there. Can AEW do that? Can you do 80,000 two nights in a row?
80,000 plus whatever the number was in Philadelphia back-to-back at WrestleMania. Can AEW go do that twice in a row and then go to Monday Night Raw and fill up that arena where they had to make the screen a little smaller on the titantron just to add more seats to sell more tickets and sold it out? They're doing great numbers. They're doing great things. Instead of worrying about taking shots at the WWE, maybe you should concentrate on your in house.
Maybe you should concentrate on the inmates running the asylum because there seems to be a lot of turmoil going on within the company where certain people aren't happy. How about fixing that first before you start making cracks at somebody else? And again, I like a W I I you know, I think it's great. Every business football. Business. Basketball, baseball, NHL. We all need competition. Competition is great. Competition is what's going to keep the WWE on their toes and
vice versa. So as long as you're trying to outdo each other in a fair and respectful way, then it's good for business because you're going to always try to top it. And that means you're going to give the people great entertainment, which is great across the board. But the minute you start name bashing and doing all of that crap, it's going to come wind up biting you in the behind. And correct me if I'm wrong, I think that's what I'm seeing
right now. You know, there was no need to say that it was the wrong platform to do it on this. Let's get the NFL draft. What were you thinking? You know, and again, I met Tony Khan on three separate occasions and he's not a bad guy. I just think that he doesn't have the right people in order. Look, I don't know who's running the asylum in terms of the in house.
I don't know. But all I know is if you don't have wrestling minds, great wrestling minds that have made money, made history and that has done things in this business to produce history and to make people know that that company is going places, you're not going to make it. It's just as simple as that. I'm sorry. You know, you had Pat Patterson and Vince is there, you know, Michael Hayes, Triple H, the list goes on on.
You had students of the game that has made money and has done things that has been able to create history and things that we still talk about to this day. You know, I don't see that on that side. Not people that made money or made history like they have on the WWE side. So again, what are you bringing to the table by listening to people that haven't done that? You got to stop doing that. I mean, that's that. I think that's first and foremost. And again, I think everybody
wants to see AEW succeed. I think everybody wants them to definitely be in direct competition with WWE 'cause everybody, you know, knows how much fun it was to flip back and forth from your TV sets when WCW was going at it with WWE during the Monday Night Wars. It was a good time back then. Business was up, people were happy, they were entertained. You know, whether it be Devon get the tables, you know what's up, or you know, Degeneration X Suck It, or you know, rest in
peace, it doesn't matter. We were entertained. We knew the catchphrases, we knew the people, we knew the people from the opening match. To the main event. To the close of the match. And that's what you have to have nowadays. So Tony needs to concentrate on how to get that company back to where it once was when it first started because it seems like the helium has been let out of the balloon. And it's a shame because you have so much talent in that company that is that are that
are great. And again, I said this on your podcast before. If you have somebody like Paul Heyman over there running it and doing it, there's no telling where that company would be right now. He would have everything in order, everything, just like he did ECW. He took a bunch of nobodies that nobody wanted and ECW at the time when WCW and WWE were in existence, nobody wanted us. He took us and made us into somebody. He did what nobody else could.
Can you imagine what he could do with a company like AEW and all of the die hard AW fans? You could sit there and disagree with me all I want and say that I don't know what I'm talking about, but I've been around this business over 30 years. I've seen the UPS and I've seen the downs. I've been behind the scenes. I've been in front of the scenes. You're looking at it from your TV set at home. I'm looking at it from a business aspect of it. Look at what Paul Levesque did
with NXT. He took nobodies that were on the Indies and made them into somebody. You need minds like that that's going to be able to turn that place around and make it what it should be because there's no reason in hell why that company should be doing those type of ratings with the talent that they have. Oh my God, it is. It is incredible, the talent that they have, so they should be able to do things the way they should in terms of being on top of the world right now.
They just aren't. It's true, you know you. You. Kind of sparked an interesting discussion that's happening right now and starting to notice a trend here because you talked about meeting with Tony Khan and AW officials 3 separate times and just how inconsistent and bizarre the whole experience was there on, on his podcast. And I'm going to do it another plug here, an old friend of yours, Bill Alfonso, he has something called the right down the middle podcast that he just recently debuted.
And on his second episode, he talked about the fact that he had met QT Marshall at an event and QT on behalf of AEW said something to Fonzie. In fact, I'm, I'm going to read the quote from Fonzie here. Quote. So I was doing a show for CCW and QT Marshall was on the show. He came up to me and he said, Fonzie, I'm QT Marshall. I'm kind of an agent. I work for Tony Khan. Your name came up in production meetings. I said, well, what do you, what do I do?
Do I call Tony? He said no, no, just hold on, just hold on. I said OK. Nothing happened. A month later I see QT Marshall again and he says, Fonzie, your name came up again in a production meeting at a EWI said, wow, that's great. So what's what's that? What do I have to do? He said hold tight, let's see what happens. So I'm holding tight. End Quote here.
So, so here we go again, where AEW officials are speaking to folks with name value and I, you know, for lack of a better term, it almost feels like you're stringing people along. But at the end of the day, there's really nothing of substance that is coming out of this. I wonder demon, do you do you know QT Marshall? Well, he trained at my. School in 2008 I believe it was, or maybe even 2009. He trained for a little bit
until Bubba threw him out. I do recall him being there and his attitude and demeanor was not very light. And it was a couple of times where I had to rest, not physically restrain him. But you know, as Bubba, please don't do anything crazy. Don't knock this boy in his head and this and that 'cause you're gonna kill him if you do that. You know. And because at the time, you know, a lot of people back then thought he was a little pompous
kid. And you know, I kind of saw certain things, but I kind of ignored it. Cause back then I wasn't the type of person like to call people out on certain things. But you know, I never really had a problem with him up until recently.
He was the one. Exactly what Fonzie said is exactly what happened with me. In other words, my sons reached out to me. I never ever had any desire to go to a EWI know when I was at my ends with, you know, with WWE at the time, working with Vince, I was stressed out. I just wasn't happy. I had asked was there any producers role and I was, I was told no. And I was like, all right, not a problem.
I was like, I'm not going to jeopardize my job with the WWE to go somewhere else and, you know, not get what I'm, you know, rightfully deserve. And so sometime it went by, I think it had to be about maybe a good almost six months. And I basically got a phone call and a text from my sons, Terrance and Terrell TNT saying Dad, QT Marshall wanted me to get in touch with you because they were talking about bringing us in and having you as our manager.
And I remember saying to the boys, this was at the time I had said I was not going back in the ring. I said, well, you do know that I don't want to wrestle anymore, that I don't know if I can physically handle it anymore. And this was right after I was having, I had the stroke and then I, it was like might have been just after the back surgery. And I was like, I thought I was done. You know, I, I really thought I
was done at that point. But the rehab and all of that did really wonders for me. And now of course, I got to plug this guy. DDP Yoga is incredible. We can get on that little later. But I told my son that said, I don't know if I want to do that full 10. I said we have to sit down and talk. So they went back to QT and they said my dad said he would be interested, but he needs to talk to you first before anything. And so they said, all right, have your dad, you know, tell
him. I said, you know, let's talk in Orlando. We're going to be in Orlando where TNA used to do their television show. Same sound stage, everything and. I said OK. I said, you know, so I I went and I went down to Orlando, spoke to QT. He says, yeah, Tony, we have this idea to bring you in as a manager for the boys and, you know, help get them over. I said like Billy Gunn is doing his sons and he says, yeah, I said, OK, And I said, that's great.
I said, I don't mind doing that. I said, you know, just as long as you guys know I'd rather be a producer. I don't want to wrestle. I just rather be a producer. But if you want me to come and help out my sons, then I'll do that. I have no issues with that. But I am not trying to get in that ring full time and go hard like I used to. And he said, OK, he. Said, no, I completely understand that. We don't want that. We just want you to come in and help the boys out. I said perfect.
And if you, if you want me to do that, then that's a done deal. And he he was like, yeah, he was like, we're going to speak with Tony later on tonight. He's just got a he's doing a couple of the show is going on now. He's actually on headset now. So when we're done, we're going to take a break and then we'll meet with Tony. I said OK, fair enough. So I'm waiting and catering, waiting, waiting, nothing. Finally I get up.
I walk inside the sound stage and I look around saying hello to everybody that I hadn't seen in a long time. People were asked me what's going on. I said well they wanted to meet with me, so I don't know what's happening right now. I said, well, we'll see. Went over. QT brought me over to Tony. Tony gets up and he says, hey, Devon, He's like, how you doing, man? It's great seeing you. I haven't seen you in years. He was like, I'm a little different now. I'm all grown up.
I was like, yeah, I see that said you all grown up with a lot of money now behind you. And he kind of laughed and this and that. And he was like, yeah. I was like, well, listen, I'll let you get back to doing what you're doing. We're going to talk later, correct? Oh, yeah, we're going to definitely talk later. I said, OK, not a problem that took place. And that that that incident just happened. So I was like, all right, so I'm
waiting and waiting. And then QT comes to me and goes, hey, Tony's just really busy right now. He was like, you know, maybe we can talk later. I said, look, that's fine. I was like, anything that's going to help my sons out. You know, I'm I'm all for. It he says, all right, great. He was like, what are you looking to make? So I told him and he was like, all right, I don't see anything unreasonable about that. I said, you're handling this. He goes, yeah, pretty much.
I'm kind of like the, you know, leeway into it. I was like, all right, I said this is what I would like and I said I'm not asking for anything crazy. I just want to be here to help my sons out. He says OK, yeah, there's. Enough. He goes. I like it. He was like, OK, I'm going to go back and talk to Tony and then I'll call you back. I'll call you later on this week. I said OK.
So I waited, waited, nothing. So I was talking to the boys, my sons, because they were going down to their training facility and QT was heading, heading the training facility with Billy Gunn. And I trust Billy, you know, So I wanted, even when my sons moved to Georgia, I wanted them to have full capability of a great mind in the business like Billy Gunn. Cause Billy, like I said before in your podcast, he helped run my school when Bubba and I were
on the road lot. And so with that being said, I was very happy that they were going down to that school working with Billy Gunn. I let 2 1/2 weeks go by. I didn't hear anything, so I contacted QT and I was like, hey, QTI was like, what's going on? You guys still want to do business or not let me know. Oh, yeah, we'll we'll get back to you. We'll we'll get back to you. We're still waiting on Tony. I said, all right, whatever. I mean, you just let me know.
And that was it for that in about a month and 1/2 went by me and my sons were talking and I said, had anything occurred? He's like, no, not at all. I'm like, let me give QTA quick text and see if this is on the table or not 'cause if not, then I'm just going to make plans. I'm not gonna you know, do anything that's going to be in a waiting pattern for me. I'm going to continue to do what I'm doing and that's it. And so I texted him again. I said, hey, I was like, any
news yet? And he goes, no, nothing yet. He was like, but you know, give me your availability and things like that. So OK, I'm booked pretty much every week. I was like, but I'll send it to you. So I sent it to him and it started kind of like a little beef with my sons and I because he went back to my sons and said, you know, your dad keeps calling me, keeps texting me and all about. And I'm like, I told my son, I said, wait a minute.
I said the man is asking me to come into the company and to help you guys out. That's the only reason why I entertained this stuff. I said other than that, I can care less about going to a EWI said if I do go to AW, it'll be because of you two. No other reason. I said because if anything, I'd rather go back to WWEI said that's my home, not a EW, not Tony Kahn. And my son was like, no, I understand, I understand. I was like, you know, the thing about it is I'm not sure will Q,
will QT gets off on saying this. I'm bugging him. I was like you contacted my sons. To get in touch with. Me to come in to the company to help them out and now you're saying that I'm bothering you and I'm like, are you serious right now? I was like, damn it, I should have let Bubba whoop your ass when he wanted to and but I you know, I didn't say anything like
that. I just, you know, I just, I kept to myself and some time went by and then I remember talking to my agent at the time who was good friends with Tony. And I said, do me a favor, find out if any of this is legit. And I told him everything I just told you. And he says I'll talk to him about it and see what happens. I said, OK, so he talked to him, he says, and Tony told him, he says, yes, let's meet with Devon in Montreal. We did want to talk to him, but I'm not sure what happened with
that. And I said, I'll tell you what happened. QT Marshall happened and my agent goes yeah, yeah, but he wants to meet now, so I said OK, so we met in Montreal. And it seemed like a very. Positive and good meeting and then, you know, I gave some ideas what I would like. But he kept pursuing the fact that he wanted me to wrestle even after I told him. I said I'm not really interested in wrestling like that. I'll come in, do a couple of things like my son's with my
son's. I said, but I'm not really interested in doing that. I was like, you know, but I'd rather be a producer. And he says, well, right now we don't have any producers roles open. He was like, but I'll be more than happy to, you know, check and see what's going on. I said, OK, I said not a problem. I said we could do that. I said you just let me know. I said, but understand, I don't want to go full time. I just want to be like a manager
slash 6 man tag. Anything like that is good, I said, but not, you know, full time wrestling. Not a problem at all. You're good to go. Yeah, we're good. We're good. Thank you. I even told him I said let me go around and help out with like, ambassadorship, like going around when you need somebody to help plug the company and go down there and help you. You know, I can go down and, and, and go to these places, sign autographs and do whatever you want me to do to help do this with you.
And he pretty much says, I thought it was a great idea. Oh yeah, it's great. And I said also I have a training facility in Winter Park, so if you need somebody to have extra training without being like one-on-one type of training, I said send send him to me and in Winter Park and I'll work with him. Oh, I think that's fantastic. Great, great. I love it. Alright, great. Shook hands and that was it.
Thought the meeting went good. Then he was like let's meet in Orlando. So it's another show in Orlando. And I said, OK, let's do that. And I was like, why do we need to have a third meeting? I was like the first one, the second one looked pretty good, so why not just go up for that? But I didn't say anything. So we met in Orlando and I basically was told at that point we don't have anything as a
producer and blah, blah, blah. But I'll get you some dates to bring your sons in and, you know, we'll get some dates for you to clear your schedule, and that'd be great. And then we can get your boys rocking and rolling. And I was like, all right, you know, fantastic. But yet when he told me there was no producer's role available, he had already hired three people that I know of in that producer's role, which I was very happy for them. But at the same token, don't lie to me.
And when you go and hire people that I know, but I said, remember, I didn't come to you asking for a job. You came to me asking me to come to your company with my sons because you were talking about getting my sons in. I had not wasn't even thinking about you guys know where you are, my radar. And all of a sudden, you know, this goes down and then nothing happened. And so I called my trainer, I called my agent. I said, hey, listen, I was like, what's going on with this thing
with Tony? He was like, I don't know, let me check. And it will always seem to be like there was a run around. So finally I said. Look, Terrance and Terrell I. Said I'm sorry, I said I can't deal with business with this man. I was like, he's all over the place. He doesn't have the right people guiding him or helping him. I can't be a part of this. I was like, I'm sorry, I really am. I said but I'm going to have to
decline on this. And I told my agent, I said if they come to you, give you dates, tell him I said thank you, but no thank you. I'm not interested anymore. And I walked away. That is, that is as. Detailed as a telling of a stories you're going to get folks and again, this is somebody who is speaking from first hand experience. This isn't rumors this isn't he says she said this is legitimately this is what happened. I was there. This is what happened and if if if Fonzie.
Is saying this and I believe it because it was done to me, you know, don't come again. You're having people that work within your organization that is talking on your behalf, but yet that shouldn't be and they should not be in the position that they're in. This is why the company is not going to make it as far because you've got to stop this
nonsense. You got to stop the growing pains in order for you to get ahead and to be even in any way, shape or form directly in competition with the WWE. You got to clear house. You got to do what you got to do to get people that know what they're saying and know what they're doing and how to handle business correctly. Well said. Well said my. Goodness gracious. Listen folks. Yvonne Dudley, like he said before, there was a period in his life where he didn't like calling people out.
He was trying to take a different path. He's learned through experience that sometimes, you know what? You just got to stand firm and just say, say the thing. And certainly here on these special conversations, you're going to hear Devon Dudley like you've never heard him before. Say the things, OK, Unfiltered, straight to the point, no games. Still a gentleman, though, when he says it, which I, I appreciate there. You, you, you have a way with words, Devon, that folks really enjoy.
We've gotten such a tremendous response since you've been coming on the show here and, and it's pretty cool there. You know, in fact, what's the best way people can reach out to you, Devon? If they want to follow you personally, what have you? Well, they can go to testify. Devon on Instagram. I just started going back to Twitter a little bit here and there, not too much, but I'm really on Instagram a lot, so you can inbox me there.
And all you AEW hate fans out there that like to hate on people that don't agree with everything that you hate. Sure, you can come on my you can come on my Instagram and talk too. But again, I'm not sitting up there burying the company. I'm just sitting up there saying we want to see the company succeed. We want to see them become either the number, the number two company or I don't think they'll ever be #1 because again, WWE has been around for so long and has held that
position for so long. I just don't see it happening. But we would love to see you in direct competition with the company. But you know, you have to clean your in house first. You got to clean in house first in order to make that happen. That's all we're saying. So let these guys who the talent that's in AW, let them shine the way they should because you have some great talent there. Let them shine. Let them be who they are, give them good storylines, give them great matches and let them
flourish the way they should. And I guarantee you won't have that. So sure, we can talk about that and you know, love the, you know, shoot the shit or what have you with you guys. So again, testify Devon on Instagram and testify Devon on Twitter. Monday is Memorial Day. I know that you're a person who has never been shy expressing yourself about our veterans and your love and appreciation for them. So do you have anything to add about Memorial Day? Absolutely. You know it's a day to.
Celebrate the fallen soldiers and the people that are in the special services now, not just hot dogs and hamburgers and going to the beach and doing all of that. But really pay tribute to those who have allowed you to be able to enjoy that type of freedom as opposed to just using it as a holiday where you can drink and eat. You know you wouldn't be able to do that if they didn't give
their lives and sacrifice. Think about even the people that have survived the wars who come home and not they are not mentally right because of what they've seen or what they've done. But yet we take advantage of what we do every single day and not think about those who have fallen or who has, who was hurting in that sense, whose family is going through what they're going through because their loved ones have come back from the wars and they just
aren't the same. You know, let's give, you know, praise to those guys, you know, and, and honor them in a way that they should be honored. And again, not through alcohol and hot dogs and hamburgers, but honor them the right way.
You know, every time you see a soldier or what have you, or you know someone who's been in the Special Forces or city special services, give them a salute, shake their hand, tell them thank you because without them, you would not be here right now enjoying the lifestyle that you have. Well said. Well said. That is the hall. Of Famer Devon Dudley showing love to our veterans. Great guy here.
Listen, Devon, as always, man, I enjoy touching base with you and and the fact that we can share this with the world like we're doing man, it's very, very special. And folks, every Sunday you can check us out here special editions of the Duke loves wrestling podcast. I think for now we're going to just call it Devon and the Duke. You know, we'll be talking about current story stories in wrestling and also Devon will open up and share about his
experiences in general there. So it's good stuff there but until next time folks, this is the Duke signing off. Devon, give us the last word. Oh testify. Mr. Tony Cavani and we're. Definitely out of time on Duke Love Wrestling.