On today's episode of Gathering the Kings. Do you sacrifice your soul on the altar of this self perceived success? And you keep saying it's for everyone around you, and it's for everyone around you, but, really, it's to solve this identity crisis and issue you really don't know who you are, and you really don't like who you are outside of the achievement and the accomplishment.
You are listening to Gathering the Kings with Chaz Wolfe, featuring fellow 78 and even 9 figure business owners who have real battle scars from business and life, but have prevailed as the king that they are designed to be. We welcome high performing entrepreneurs to the stage in order to reveal the reel of the reel. On what it takes to build a successful business today. Assess and how you too can get there.
Through this dialogue, you will learn the value of growing your network and surrounding yourself with power players and keys like today's guest. Grab your pen and notebook because we're about to dive in. Well, what's up everybody? Chaz Wolfe, gathering the king's podcast today. I've got Cody Jefferson on the king stage. My brother, how are you? Dude, I'm doing well. Listen. That was we've had a little conversation before this, and that like, on radio voice you just did.
That was something special. It was You like that? That sounds special. You need a radio show. I had to had to bring had to bring the heat. You know, it's funny because, for a long time, I've had some people, you know, your voice, you know, but You know, what I was gonna say was that you're, a bearded brother from another mother over there. You know? Listen, I feel like for there's so many guys who can't grow good beards you know, it's like the beards that wish they could. We owe it to them.
If you have to, man, it's it's our cross to bear. Yeah. It is. It is. It's a tough one. It is, man. It takes a lot of work. Yeah. And, a lot of people like it. I'll have to send you some of our we have a custom beard ball. We'll have to send you at the end of it. Yes. It's funny because the the the more shows that I do, the more people I meet with beards, the more places I speak, it's like, man, it gets mentioned everywhere. Oh, yeah. Everywhere I go.
And it's like, man, I should be some sort of a or make, like, you create a product. I mean, I I need to start maximizing this beard, I guess. Yeah. It's funny, man. Like, most of the guys inside of our community, during about 4000 guys, like, majority of them are bearded. So I don't know if it's, like, a a a like attracts like type of thing. Sir. I mean, dude, we you and me, we both have flannels on right now. I know. It's October. It's a it's a Midwest thing, I think. Yeah. That's true.
Yeah. Yeah. When I that I was just, like, going to my brain, going, you know, backwards. I'm like, yeah. I guarantee you my dad has a flannel on today. For showing a percent, and my dad's got one on with probably Harley Davidson T shirt on here. Yeah. Just the way it works. And and even being Harley, like, that's not in my lane. But like you said, it's, like, it's the same it's the same clock. We can use it for multiple multiple scenarios. That's it, man. Okay. Tell us about Cody real quick.
What kind of business are you in? What's the community? Give us the lowdown real quick. Yeah. Yeah. So Cody Jefferson, listen. I do a lot of fun things, but 1st and foremost, The only thing that I care about at the end of this life is that, you know, that I was, the best dad that I could be to Seth and Foster Jefferson. So I get asked all the time, what do I do? Number 1, I'm a dad. Outside of that, we've got a coaching and consulting company called embrace the line. We started Chaz in 2017.
We helped good men become great. Outside of that, I have, pushed into the business sector. So I sit on the board of 5 companies. I'm invested in 6 as we move towards exit. We've got just about, 480,000,000 unsecured exits over the past 5 years that we've been a part of, walking with our founders and and seeing. Travel the country a couple times a month, 2 to 3 times a month as a keynote speaker in MC.
So that's a lot of fun, but, the the crux of that is I won't ever miss anything for my son, as best as I can. So I am on the PTA. I'm a homeroom dad. I am a wrestling coach with baseball coaches. So for all the listeners who say they just don't have enough time, I would say show me what you do, and I'll show you what is actually true about your schedule. That's right.
You know, well, I'm sure we'll get into this because it's it's part of just, your message, but even recently, I've got young, young kids. Yep. But even recently, I had to make another adjustment. And so this one this one's really stretched me. I I in my day now at 2. And There's for 3. 3 to 3:15. Yep. Yeah, dude. Well, so, like, this is a big deal. Yep. You know, I'll I'll work 18 hours a day and love it. Dude. I get I get in my DNA. I love it. You don't shut it off. People don't understand.
Like, you don't I I get asked, like, how do you shut off? You don't. You don't ever shut it off. And I don't ever wanna be the guy who says you should shut it off, but there does need to be a prioritization and a dance. Right? There is no balance. Like, you don't you don't create this. It's but there's an integration Yep. That can happen. Yeah. That's that's the right word because I I guess shouldn't say my day's done at 2 because my family time starts at 2.
It ends at 7 when we're done praying with each other after we gotta read the bible. And then and then I usually have a evening flow know, I I come back into the office and and and then get my quiet time in in the office, you know, things that doesn't require the phone or zoom. So, you know, I just I just appreciate that perspective, because, you know, we can we can say things are important to us. Right. Listen. I was a pastor for 13 years.
I mean, I guess I should say I'm still a pastor that the pulpit was just preparation for this platform that got out. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. But, you know, you show me what you do. I I've had people for 20 something years tell me what they believe. But you show me what you do, and I'll show you what you actually believe. That's why for so many of your listeners, getting very, very clear on what you want and and really leveraging those KPIs Right.
So that you can leverage time in a more effective way is so crucial now before you start stacking on zeros to your company, and you find yourself over leverage out of time because you never learn how to prioritize properly. Yeah. No. It's huge. A lot of I think a lot of entrepreneurs learn Chaz, they build their ship at sea per se, which is okay. Sure. I think both of you and I probably have done that, but the reality is is that it has to be done. Otherwise, there is no leverage.
There the leverage is figuring out that and then, obviously, duplicating that into a team. Totally. Which is why, I mean, masterminds like yours or mine, whoever, they're so important because they can help you, you know, you you you can't see the label of a bottle from the side.
So to be able to have that perspective for somebody like you or myself or someone else who can who can speak to that leverage and speak to that prioritization and speak to you know, the activities that are high leverage and the activities that might just be you being busy so you can give yourself justification as to why you're stressed. 100%. Yeah. Because we like that. We like that justification. I'm busy. I'm getting things done or at least it feels like it.
Okay. So wanna jump in here, before we get to your story. Sure. I wanna know at this level, like, you threw out some incredible stats at the beginning, some exits that you've been a part of and are a part of. You're building this huge community of men that want to become great. Why are you pushing? Because at for all intents and purposes, you could probably just go be dad and and check the box for that one thing that you say that you're living the life for.
Why are you pushing on everything Yeah. Dude, money's set. And and that's a really unique place to be in. When people say that money doesn't solve all problems, you don't make enough because it does. You just have to find why you don't have more. Man, I love what I do. I feel like I've been put here on purpose and for purpose and with purpose faith is at the deepest crux of my identity. And you know, everybody asks what's your why, what's your why, what's your why. Yeah. Well, it's not my son.
It can't be. So because I meet so many entrepreneurs who they say their family is the reason, but they're overworking, over leveraging. They're not present. Right? Their kids don't even know them. They're in unhappy marriages, but but it's all for my family. That's a cop out. Right? So for me, it is I Chaz. So I do. Yeah. I've lost several family members, close friends, addiction, suicide, murder, They they will never breathe again.
And I don't want to take any breath that I wake up with for granted. And I don't wanna tell my son, like, so many dads on the sidelines, celebrating things they did 20 years ago, overweight, and can't do a thing about it with their kid, what they should do and how they should push hard. Right. I wanna show my son, like, I'm not gonna tell you to go chase your dreams if I'm not. I'm not gonna tell you to go all in on something if I'm not.
And I'm not going to preach a message of prioritization and Chaz you can have it all if I don't. Yeah. So if I Chaz, I do? I do. Love it. It's the, oh, I'm gonna forget it now. I think, actually, your buddy that we're just talking about, Coach JC. I if I can, I must? I must. I will. I I I can't remember the the phrase allergy there, but it makes me think of that. Yeah. We're we're we're full of, you know, we're full of euphemisms and Yeah.
Well, you know, it's What it is is a big thing is this is who I am. So this is what I do. This is who I am, so this is what I do. It's not this is what I feel because we go off emotions. Like, if you're not happy in business, but you started a business to become happy, like, your business is tracked when you're not happy anymore. If you get in a relationship because you wanna be happy, what happens when you're not happy anymore? So these things can't be based on emotional constructs.
So It's based on identity. This is who I am. So this is what I do, which is why it's so important for your listeners and anyone, you know, pushing forward to really define what you want and who you need to in order for that to become a reality because it won't be about the goal that you achieve. It'll be who you become in the process. Yeah. So two parts there just to summarize for the listener, you said not only identify what you want, but then specifically who you need to become.
Yeah. And so talk about that from your angle, obviously, with you know, maybe and and tell them a little bit of your story. You you were involved with being a pastor before. How did, you know, embrace the line, come, share it out? Like, give us a little bit of the backdrop. Yeah. So let's jump into this. I jumped into occupation ministry at 19. It wasn't a call from god. It wasn't some burning bush moment. No dream on a mountain top. Man, like, I just went to I wasn't even going to church.
I'd kind of rationalized my way out of religion. Did really well in school. I don't have that story of, like, I barely graduated 9th grade and got kicked out of 10 schools, and I'm an entrepreneur. Not an item. I did very well in school academically. I could go anywhere I wanted. At university, scholastically and academically, I was I was stopped.
And so because of that, I've just rationalized god out of the equation because we're like all the rules ended up in a and I grew up in a small southern baptist church, right, which didn't Yeah. It just only helped my cause Exactly. And so, I was managing a garage. I've been a licensed mechanic for about 20 years licensed barber as Wolfe. And I was rinsing on cars, and the owner asked me to go to church. It might not sound really my thing.
So you wanna go to you wanna go to coffee on a Saturday night. I'm like, well, I can get done with that. So we don't get coffee inside of a church. Big mega trip, like, 5000 people. I'd never seen anything like it before. Wow. Past comes out, blonde hair, long, rides of Harley. You know? I'm like, I I I can I don't know this? This guy. I don't, like, I I've never wait a minute. What? Yeah. We we hit it off, man. His name was Eastman Curtis, and and we hit it off.
He had a church called Destiny and He put me in a position of leadership that I didn't deserve, that I didn't earn. Like, I I really understood Grace in that moment because, like, man, you've got you've got a great voice. You I played guitar really well. I mean, I was a professional musician for a decade, through ministry. And he's like, you can speak and you're charismatic on stage. And, man, listen, back in, like, 2003, that's really all you needed to be a pastor in the megachurch.
So Theology, what's that? That's funny. The the real comes out. Yeah. I mean, I'm just being just keeping it a 100%, man. But through that, those 13 years, I worked there. I served the United Methodist Conference of Oklahoma for 8 years, and then I worked at a a church that was really about Convergent Theology. So liturgical, evangelical and charismatic. So really fell in love with church history. Went to school study church history. But throughout all of this, I became an addict.
And I was addicted to affirmation. I was addicted to people pleasing. I I grew up not really knowing who I was. I grew up in a bit of a broken home, really raised with my grandparents, primarily, and Very grateful. Great for my dad, girl, for mom, grateful for a grandparent for everyone. But you grow up, and and you don't really ever know who you are because everything is tied to what you do. Yeah. Well, I'm good at this. I can do this.
I can Wolfe, like, when you especially when you're good at solving problems for people. You identify your self worth as your ability to solve problems for people. Right. And ministry just exacerbated that. And, you know, I grew up in a single bedroom trailer. I grew up by a single dad who, I mean, we were just rubbing sticks together to make ends meet. We didn't have anything that the other kids had. And it's not that we went without things. It's just you you grew up being called trailer trash.
You grew up thinking like success or these kinds of things don't happen for people like me. You actually knew, if you knew my parents were divorced, if you knew, you know, I went through this as a kid. If you if you knew that sometimes I actually don't I I catch atheist flu, like, once a month. Sometimes I don't really know what I believe. I can't tell you that.
If you actually knew, you wouldn't want me leading you so that led to this anxiety in this need to perform and this need to be a problem solver and this need to overwork so that I would make myself invaluable. So Like, so I'm indispensable. Yeah. And the problem is and that happens so so much in the church. That happens so much of business Right? It's part of the reason this company was formed is you sacrifice your soul on the altar of this self perceived success.
And you keep saying it's for everyone around you. It's for everyone around you, but really it's to solve this identity crisis and issue you really don't know who you are, and you really don't like who you are outside of the achievement and the accomplishment. Right. And so in in 2015, I went through, a divorce no real great scandal or anything, a state ministry. It wasn't it was just she wanna do something different.
Yeah. We had a one year old at the time, over the course of walking through that divorce, still state ministry, still, you know, shaking hands and blessing babies and preaching on Sundays and leading worship on Sundays and leading men's group and liturgical formation and student ministry and men's ministry traveling, do all things. Yeah. Everything's fine. And then people start dying at a eighteen month old niece, that was murdered.
I lost an aunt, lost a best friend to suicide, lost a sister, a lot of suicide, a lost, nineteen year old sister to murder. And all this while walking through this. And everything's fine. Everything's fine. I'm a pastor. God's got a plan. Everything's good. You know, you put that mask on. Yeah. And and my body just, finally just threw a middle finger up to me, and I went septic in late 2016. And I was unconscious for 3 days. I was in this hospital bed. I'd lost like £30.
If you're if you ever look on me on social media, I'm about a 70 now, about a £170. I'm five foot 6. You know, just I'm a towering, man. But I'm pretty built, but I was, like, 120, 125. Yeah. Yeah. And so I'm in this hospital gown. Right? And so, I I get up go to the bathroom because I'm awake now, grab my IV tree. I try to close the back of it, you know, because I'm naked under it. I'm like, I'm not trying to get any nurses to stumble in their walk.
So I'm not trying to close the backup while I walk over to the bathroom. And I just look at myself. I'm just the shell, dude. Yeah. And I recognize in that moment, like, nobody's gonna save you, bro. Nobody. You spent every day, every evening making hospital visits for 20 years. Nobody's here. And that's not an indictment on anyone. That is just, like, if if you give people enough rope, they'll hang you by it. In your own need to self perform and be all things and over leverage yourself.
And I bet a lot of you're listening. Like, in some way, you you've you've felt that before. Oh, sure. And I look in the mirror and I said the the phrase that has become the mantra of our company, which is what needs to die in me to become the man that I said I'd be. Because is this it? Is this where you die? Son doesn't love you? What's he gonna say when he's older? Yeah. Like, you know, my daddy, Yeah. He he he just died overworking. Right. And, did not miss my son's first steps working.
Miss his first words working. And his mom and I were in the house, working from home because I had a new baby in the church let me work from home. I was there, but I wasn't there. Yeah. And so at that point, I recognized, like, this doesn't work over the over bearing those friends. Like, I Chaz buried 3 pastor friends who had taken their own lives due to their stress and anxiety. I buried several more since. Jeez. Like, something's gotta give, man. Like, something has got to give.
We are all sacrificing our soul on the altar of this self perceived success. We're like, what is a profit of man to gain the world and and lose his soul? Right. And that's where bracelet of the line started. Right? It was originally embraced the line of the tribe of Judah. Dude, that's a super long email you are. So Yes. It is. Yeah. ETL ETL rolls off the top of the world. Just a lot quicker. So we I just started sharing my story, man.
I stepped out of occupational ministry in early 2017, attended a conference 2 weeks later where I didn't know anybody's entrepreneur conference. What conference was it? What conference was it? It was called meltdown in the desert. It doesn't it it it happened for, I think, 3 years. Okay. Got it. Alright. And so here's how this works for all of you that are that are taking notes.
So I stepped out of ministry, k, out of my salary, which into that, like, my last salary in the church was $33,000, balling on a budget, if you know what I'm saying. You know what I mean? Yeah. It was. But I I walked away from that. I stepped there was no great, again, great relationship with church. Still go to church. Love Jesus. Like, I just really had this burden. To do this.
And I knew I couldn't say the things that I wanted to say and talk about things I wanted to talk about inside the walls too much politics. Go to this conference. I don't know anybody. And, like, I scraped to get there. This I didn't have the 6 figures in 6 days. Everybody sells online. I didn't have my 7 figure in 7 Right. Right? Like, I was flipping Harley's out of my garage. I was cutting hair out of the front room of my house.
I was giving guitar lessons, piano lessons, vocal lessons, building websites, doing graphic design for local businesses because when your ministry and you're young, they're like, figure out how to do graphics, figure out how to build this website. So you just learn. I'm taking all those skill sets. All the skill sets that so many of you take for granted are the ones that could catapult you into the success that you're looking for. Don't be too proud to use them and don't overthink it either.
Because the things that you're really great at that you take for granted are the things that people don't know how to leverage in their own That's why we coast, why we do the things that we do. Yep. So I go to this conference and, oh, dude. I'm, like, 2 weeks out of ministry. Like, 2 weeks. Like, I'm fresh. You know what I mean? Oh, he's he's baby bird. Man, listen. I'm just trying to get a worm over here. You know what I'm saying? And so I don't know anybody. I don't know what I'm doing.
I don't have an LLC yet. I just know that if I can get in the right rooms, because I've done conferences in the church, like, big, like, large 20, 40,000 member like, big conferences. I'm like, if I can get in the right rooms, I'll just run the pastor playbook. I will get to know everybody's story because everybody wants to talk about themselves. And I, like, I'm gonna I'm gonna hone me up everyone. And, so I go and I'm meeting everyone in the crowd. Like, I'm meeting.
There's, like, three hundred people there. So I'm like, this cake. This is life's youth rally. I'm gonna know everything. I'm gonna I'm gonna know everybody, dude. I literally I'm gonna I know everybody at this place. And then the power goes out. And, dude, it's, like, June in July in Phoenix. So it's it's like Yeah. Hotter than hell. Yes. Literally. And so and we're in a building called galvanized, which is steel. And so it just starts baking inside there. Right?
It's like having tattoos in the church. Like, you're just getting hot. And and so I go over to the the founder. He's the only he invited me through Facebook. Because he because my content at that time was going viral a lot. Back then was really easy to go viral more so than now. And I was like, hey. What's the name of the like, what's the number of the hotel? So he gives it to me. So I called the hotel.
I tell them that we need, If they ask that everybody's staying there, do we have a conference room that'll host, you know, 350 people? Yes, sir. We do. Great. We need 350 chairs up there. We need two screens running. AV to the back. We're gonna pipe in through a a laptop. We've already dumped everything onto it. I need water downstairs. And we need the shuttle to start coming to pick people up because it's getting hot. No problem, sir. We'll we'll get right on that.
I go down to all the food trucks. Hey, guys. We're relocating over this hotel. This is what we're gonna do. And then I go up and tell Colby, who was the founder of the conference, all these things. I was like, this is what's happening. This is what we're doing. This is how we're moving people starting now. And I'm gonna go over with your AV and we're getting everything set up upstairs. We'll be ready in 60 minutes. And he goes, what? Who are you? Who is this?
Dude, dude. So I forgot I forgot I wasn't in church. I I I it was 2 weeks, man. Like, I just I went default. So then I'm like, oh, dude. I have ruined every relationship. I totally just ruined my name. And, like, dude, I was just humiliated. But then everybody started code. Dude, you're the guy that the pastor guy who, like, just fixed all this. And I'm like, Yeah. And nobody can understand why I would do that without wanting something. Right.
I was like, ah, dude, I just this audience is what I do. So the next day, they get the power back on when we move back. There's this older gentleman sitting at the table by himself for lunch. What's Cody gonna go do? Yep. Sit with him. So, like, hey, man. What's going on? He's like, hello. You're the pastor guy. I'm like, I'm the pastor guy. He's like, I'm a pastor. I'm like, get out of here. Look at Chaz. 2 peas in a pod. He's like, you should be on my podcast. And I'm like, cool.
What's a podcast? And I don't know, dude. Yeah. And and he's like, well, we're just I'm just gonna ask you some questions. I'm like, dude, that would be really fun. I've never done that, but I've done a lot of interviews, like radio interviews and TV for the church. So I'm Chaz that sounds great. When should we do that? He's like, let's do it right now. I'm like, okay. So we go upstairs and we sit down. He's like, do you have a bio? I'm like, No. What? Co Cody? Yeah. My name is Cody.
He's like, it's fine. I know your story. We've talked. I know what you're doing. I love it. And so are you ready? I'm like, yeah. What do I do? He's like, sit down and stop pacing. I'm like, okay. Yeah. And so I put the headphones on. He's like, I'm like, I'm ready. He was Hey, everyone. This is Alan Taylor. Welcome back to Entrepreneur Magazine and entrepreneur.com and entrepreneur radio. And I'm like, oh god. Yeah. I mean, over my head. Yeah. What did I do? That went viral.
USA today, today show, like, started everything some 2 weeks ago. Yeah. Alan and I are and Alice become one of my closest friends. He is pioneer. He's cheered me on with such pioneer for my entire movement from the beginning. Yeah. And so we were together a couple weeks ago, if you saw the picture on my Instagram or Facebook, He and I are interviewing Tim Tivo because we were with Tim Tivo's Foundation That's awesome. In San Diego a couple weeks ago, and we raised a $4,000,000 for his charity.
So What a full circle moment. But Yeah. Seriously. You know, putting yourself in the in the right rooms, that's how it all started for me. I didn't really I didn't have some great business plan. I knew that I wanted to help men in a very specific way. Yeah. And there wasn't a road map for it, so I created it. Much like I've got a really, a dear friend, Garrett White, who, has a movement. It's a little bit more intense than mine. But the same.
You know, he didn't he didn't set out to create something to save everyone else. It was to save himself. Yeah. And that's how this started. So we've got 4 pillars, head, heart, health, habits, feel like everybody's got their 4 pillars. And it's kinda contingent to have immense movement. You gotta have 4. You gotta have 4. Not 3. Not 7. No. No. You gotta have the 4. And it's just been a it's been a wild ride ever since, and and it's gotten so it's grown so fast. Yeah. And it's gotta be God.
I'm good. Right? And I'm I can talk and I I can lead things, and that's all I've done for my entire life. But I'm not that good. God has had a sand in all of this. Yeah. Well, I I appreciate the perspective. The story, obviously, is just super encouraging. Yeah. Through that, what I pulled out, like you said, was getting in the right rooms and shaking a hand, not being afraid to meet people, like, of these things that we normally hear in business, but that came full circle for you.
And just one event. One event listen. You know, my my entire career thus far has been built on a couple things. One is that we are a culture that is desperate to be known but we will settle every day for being seen. So when you explain that, what do you mean by that? Well, look at social media. Look the way that we live. Yeah. We wanna be, you know, we we wanna be loved. We wanna be valued. We wanna be championed. Right. We want our potential to be pushed. In healthy ways and appropriate ways.
This is why men need accountability and community. This is why men need a brotherhood to belong to. That's right. Because Iron Sharp and Zion Most of us don't have that. So we'll settle for being seen. Look at these perfectly posted pictures on social media. Look at how I look from the outside in. Right. We'll settle for being seen. We'll settle for attaboys. We'll settle for it. How are you? I'm good. Doing great, man. Just living the dream. Right. But at our core, we wanna be known.
We want someone to sit down with us and not say, cool, man. What do you do? Right. As an intro, but, dude, what makes your cell come alive? Yeah. You got kids. Tell me about your kids. You'll find that it if anyone listening, if you meet me in person, which is not hard to do, I travel quite a bit. I wanna ask you. My first question will not be what you do. It's tell me what makes you come alive. Tell me what makes your heart dance. Tell me about your kids. If you got kids, Right.
People deserve to be known. And people are really looking to answer 3 questions. I don't care what vertical you're in. I mean, just if you think about it and and I learned this as a pastor, is that people are gonna answer three questions. Is it possible? Do I have permission and will you go with me? Huge. Yeah. I'm I'm, thinking about even just whether it's a a professional relationship, a brotherhood, even with my wife Mhmm. Those three things, I agree.
Yeah. You it's interesting that A lot of kids. Oh, yeah. Exact yeah. Exactly. I I just it was because it's purposeful. And and as a man, that's what that's what we need. Some more than others on the permission side, some just jump a little easier than the others, but the the camaraderie, the Wolfe you go with me, please. I think whether they admitted or not, every listener out there is going, mhmm. That's right. Because it's respect, it's respect.
And do we all want somebody to we listen, inherently, we wanna be on a winning team. That's right. We wanna win. And we want someone to so many men never move forward because they surround themselves with the same circle that they've had their entire life. They never said beyond it. 1, because they don't know where to go. Right? But 2, it's familiar. And the brain always prefers the path of familiarity, and that creates a lid.
So if we're all earning the same, I can't earn more than you because then what you're gonna think I'm better than you, or you're gonna think I think I'm better than you. And then I'm gonna have to diminish what I'm doing so that I don't, like, Yeah. It doesn't seem like I'm being arrogant. And so then maybe I just don't I don't go any further than where I'm at because I don't wanna make anybody uncomfortable. I don't wanna rock the boat. Right.
Or because nobody ever tells me, I never know more Chaz possible. Right. I hear a podcast like this, and I hear 2 guys who are successful talking, I think, yeah, but I don't have anybody like that in my corner. Right. And all it takes is filling out an application saying, hey, man. I'd like to actually learn more about what it would look like to be inside a circle like this.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're right because, that wind, that momentum just the idea of having the wind or the momentum can put us into action that, that we never knew that was possible for ourselves, even, you know, our own belief and then the action and then the more belief and then the more action and then the more belief. It always follows. I want you you have, obviously, you've just you've got your story.
You've got, you know, all these things that have been such, influential things, even here on the last, you know, 30 minutes that we've been talking. Yeah. I wanna flip the script here in in your business. You've given us so many different things that have worked. Tell me about a situation or maybe even a a mistake or a bad decision. Something that didn't work that you had to correct from. How many do you want? Just one. Well, first one that pops into your brain.
Yeah. Hiring the wrong people for the job. Interesting. Okay. So, hiring people that are good at a lot of things rather than being great at 1 or 2 things. K? Specialist versus generalist? Right. So we we could have gone further faster. And and that's not to say, like, there's a lack of gratitude for where we are. It's just you learn over time that hiring for a specific skill set that is required Right. Far more useful than hiring based on somebody's personality and wanting to train them.
Like, we just don't train anymore. So we have solid SOPs. And anytime someone comes into any of our organizations, like, there's a very, very clear line of responsibility and role in KPI. Yeah. Versus, you know, are you just fun to be around and you get the culture? That's important. Sure. More than that. Some of the mistakes that I made early on was, you know, hiring generalists, generalists that I thought could cover a lot of ground.
Yeah. Which we did but we didn't grow in the ways that we could have early on, because I was I didn't understand the value of really, really tactical precision Right. In in filling positions. Would you would you agree with that the majority of, I guess, maybe startups, because, obviously, that's what, you know, ETL is a startup or just maybe smaller businesses that are maybe listening today that aren't at the 7 figure mark or above.
Would you maybe agree that there has a there's a phase that you go through with a generalist. You as the owner are a generalist. Obviously, you're doing everything, but then you have maybe 1 or 2 others. Or maybe 3 before you really hit that level of like, okay. Yeah. Now we need that one specific talent doing this one specific thing. Is that kinda like a just a like a have to step through that anyway no matter what? I think you have to. I don't but, well, one, it's a resource conversation.
So, you know, there's always gonna be gaps that keep you from, like, that really kind of proverbial next level. And they're, you know, Grant Cardone talks about break points. Right. And it was with him a couple ago, and he broke this down. And it was really, really phenomenal. And so I'm really happy to be able to share kind of some of that insight from somebody who runs, you know, multi $1,000,000,000 organizations.
But that 0 to 2 mil, your your margins, are probably fine, but you you don't have the resource to be able to bring in those real heavy hitters. You don't really even know what you need because you're just starting to get to where success might be feasible, impossible. And so you have some VAs. You might hire, you know, somebody to build funnels or to, you know, build out your CRM. Something of that nature. And and I'm speaking specific to kind of more our industry.
Yeah. Yeah. But even in any in any startup, I mean, really, you're looking for someone to to handle those kind of lower income task that a generalist can. So even if you're a brick and mortar, you're hiring somebody to take you know, items out to someone's car or to, you know, fill out paperwork and you're gonna sit there as receptionist. Like, so these are general positions.
It's not until you really get to that 3 to $5,000,000 range and above where you really have to start looking at, okay, are am I going to remove myself as a business owner and function more as a CEO that is over culture, people, and finances. Right? Versus all of the and then source out everything else that needs to be done on a daily basis and track that through KPIs.
That's really when you have the resource and you have the proven track record now through your revenue to be able to make those hires because, again, just because you have a great month doesn't mean that you go below that on someone because you don't have the you don't have the MRR that proves that this is actually sustainable. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. There's no history there. And you're right.
The there's there's those, you know, breaking points and some along the ways there and key roles that they have to go in. The transition that you described, we use the language of warrior to King. Right? The warrior is that 0 to 1,000,000, maybe a little over. Yeah. That Chaz warrior king a little bit, but that warrior who's in the business doing the tactical, doing it themselves, right, they haven't removed Yeah. Them or their mind. And then the king is full full blown. I have to work on.
I have to become the facilitator. I have to become bigger than just me, team, buying back time for my family. I've to take care of my church, my community, all the people, the weight of the crown, if you will. Yeah. Right? So I I love how you, from my business perspective, laid down. This is the exact transition that we go through in a business, male, female, whatever, but it's also kinda how we'd go through as men. Right? We go to the same transition.
John Eldridge breaks this down in in fathered by god. Right? Cowboy or boyhood, cowboy warrior king sage. Absolutely. These are the stages that we go through. Like, and we have to continue to progress and our mindset changes. Yeah. Well, and, you know, even look at a hero journey or if you look at, you know, falling upward by Richard Roar where he talks about the 2 halves of life. Right?
The one is about proving, proving, proving, proving, and then there's something inevitably that happens that leads us to the 2nd half of life where he would say the true spiritual contentment or contemptuous manners when there's nothing to prove, hide, or protect. Right? Just so you move into more of that that sage. Yeah. Well, there's a there's a mature perspective is really what you're Right. You're saying.
And, yeah, it's not it's no longer about, like you said, earning or maybe proving that you're worthy as the king, but but Hey. Like, I've done it already. This is who I am. This is what I do. Yeah. It's it's it's who I've been designed to be. It's who I was. It's who I am. Love it. Okay. What kind of, process do you have around decision making? We've kinda tossed around some good and bad decisions here. What would you say for the listener, give a couple steps that you take.
If someone comes across your desk, are there people you talk to? What's your process for decision making? Yeah. So I have mentors and coaches in my life, and I have a a band of brothers a close group of 4 horsemen in my life. That's Okay. We are we are incredibly close, and and I will I will go to them, just they would go to me. And, you know, just, again, it's it's hard to read the label of the bottle from the inside sometimes.
I've gotten pretty good at being able to make analytical decisions and removing any emotional contracts that might happen as a result of that. But that doesn't mean that I don't want, you know, eyeballs on this that are far more qualified than mine.
Especially when we talk about, you know, invest, so investing in companies or if I have proposals that come across my desk, those are more the high level decisions in decisions that that I'm looking at that require obviously capital and funding and that that I would want other eyeballs on. In terms of the, like, my company, or any daily business decisions that come across my desk.
For the 98% of those, That's a it's just a very logical process of looking at the weighted pros and cons and does it fit into the vision of the company? Does it fit into the culture? Does it fit into you know, our our year long projections, does it fit into a 5 year projection? And, you know, if it's a higher, you know, does Does this person on paper have the right qualifications when we, you know, go through 2 or 3 Zoom interviews?
Do we feel like this person is the most appropriate for our culture and for the positioning? And we go from there. So, yeah, for me, it is, again, when they are large investment decisions or decisions in take, like, I take equity and companies, after I've coached for a specific, amount of time, usually 1 year, if we're moving towards exit and it makes sense. So looking over, obviously, I'm gonna get the the eyeballs of my attorneys on those. And so there are far more qualified eyes rather.
You know, handshake goes a long way in Oklahoma. But it only goes so far. Yeah. I'm with you. I think we can all appreciate those things. And and I think the bigger that you get, the bigger the decisions, the more specialists, the more qualified the eyeball, we I think that that makes a lot of sense. Yeah. Okay. Transitioning here, I wanna know talking about trackables. Right? Like, you've mentioned KPI a couple times. Yeah. Thinking about your business.
Okay. What is the one thing that if you can only pick one thing to track? What what would that one thing be? This is a really great question. So if we could only track one thing, it would be fulfillment. K. In terms of the personal professional film fulfillment of our guys because if our guys are because we track all of this on a weekly basis, like, we have forms that all of our guys fill out every single Sunday.
And then our coaches look over them, our one to one clients I look over, and we we have a sliding scale from physical, emotional, financial. We look at KPIs in business because all of our guys, for the most part, especially on a one to one level, are running companies that are 5 to a $150,000,000. Sure. So we're tracking a lot of things, but if you are not finding fulfillment from within, you'll look forward everywhere else, and that's a recipe for disaster.
Yeah. Yeah. So you're gonna look for that happiness in the business. And then when things aren't going well, that's gonna lead to anxiety, depression, frustration, and overwhelm, which is gonna lead to withdraw, and isolation, and sedation. And all of those things. Chaz bleeds into your family. That bleeds into your staff. That bleeds into community life. It bleeds everywhere.
Yeah. So So I I I'm actually hearing, I'm hearing your trackable, but then I'm hearing 2 trackables for the listener because I would assume that if it's that's your trackable for your guys, which, you know, a lot of which are business owners, then they should be tracking that. My listener should be tracking fulfillment but then what I also heard you say in the in you, specifically, Cody, tracking fulfillment, really what you're gauging is the health of your client experience.
Yeah. And so would you, like, is that is that the language that you're given to the listener here is, of course, you gotta check your fulfillment. Like, you personally, because if you're if you're driving up We also yeah. But then we also have to look how we're fulfilling with the client. Like, are we are we walking close enough? Are we are we're not done for you. Right? So we walk with you. But are are we walking in a way that's appropriate that is meaningful that is impactful?
Like, if we look over the breadth of our of, our our forms every single Sunday. Like, are we seeing a measurable trajectory upward? Yeah. Yeah. Love that. What book would you recommend for a 6 figure business owner? Man, woman. Yeah. Just uh-uh I was gonna say, like, for for men or for anyone, you need to read as a man, thinketh. Great book. Yeah. Absolutely. But if you haven't, a book that I think every I'll give 2 books. Let's get, like, just let's really go deep into it. Let's get.
Like, let me just give away the farm. Yeah. So one, as a man, thinketh, 2, you should retraction by Gina Wickman. I just think it's a great foundational book. Everyone of business should probably memorize. And then 3rd is, everybody Alex has a book called $100,000,000 offers, Alex Hormozzi. Yeah. And that book Chaz been, absolutely transformational for, I mean, just tens, if not 100 of 1000 of people. Yeah. He's a young dude who has created an insane business acumen.
And the way that he breaks things down in that book is inspiring and applicable and tangible. Yep. And So everyone would be do would be doing themselves a favor to to read and apply that book. Yeah. I agree, on all the above, the business acumen there, I'll watch him talk about topics that I already understand and already, like, already fully get just to hear how his brain thinks. Well, and it's so fascinating how he can articulate something in 30 seconds And I'm like, man. Yep. You're smart.
Yep. That's all I got. That's all I got. We need guys like that. It's good that he can he can dissect things. Yeah. Okay. What do you think about intentionally networking and mastermind? That's my normal question. For you, obviously, know, getting around a community, obviously, is how you built your business. So Yep. Quick plug here for for your community, but really what's the power behind when I say to someone networking or master mining, what what is it? What's the power?
What's underneath all of Chaz? That that maybe you're delivering that someone doesn't have in their life currently, maybe listening that they don't have in that community field. Yeah. So so let me not plug my community Let me actually talk about what it means for me and being part of a community. Perfect. So I've I've I've got masterminds that I'm a part of that are outside of my mastermind.
Sure. And the proximity to people who are at and above where I am in success in in different areas of life. Right. There are people who have been married 60, 70. I wanna know about that. Who have raised incredibly successful, well rounded articulate, purpose filled, joy filled, like, authentic kids who are now adults. Yeah. I wanna know all about that. People who have built incredibly successful companies and and have created healthy marriages and those healthy kids as well.
I wanna learn from you. So being in those rooms, So long as you're teachable, so long as you're open, so long as you're coachable, so long as you recognize that there's always something for all of us to learn. I never wanna be the smartest person in the room. Wanna be somewhere, like, in the top middle. Right? I don't wanna be the dumbest guy. Nobody would nobody likes that guy.
So but, also, you know, even if I think about my close network of friends, if I think about, like, my my best friends, if I think about Garrett. Thinking about Keith Yaki, if I think about Lo Silva and Josh Smith, if I think about these guys who have built these amazing companies and amazing lives. Like, success is normalized in every area, and it's expected. Right. And you rise to that level, or you don't because we're not required to be friends.
We're not required to be in the network together. We're not required to do things together. That's right. So to me, like, there is this really so the the hard part about, potential maybe for a lot of your listeners, it was for me. I grew up in the church and potential was always something I needed to live up to. And I didn't even know what it was, dude. It was like Yeah. I would I started playing piano with, like, 7.
And so I was doing gospel singing conventions by 9 and, like, playing from a grandparents. And, you know, I was the kid who could memorize all scripture. I was could do all the things. You know? It was god's got such a big plan for you. God's got such big plans. God's gonna do such big things. What do you even do with that as a kid? Right. Like, that led to a lot of insecurity of me.
And again, trying to prove that I was worth something to god, and it led me to overworking and, like, over stimulating burning everything to the ground because I just, like, I was I did not know whether that meant. Sure. Yeah. And led to such an exact and always feeling like I was letting god down in some way. Yeah. Like, what, like, I if I stop working, if I don't, like, am I is employed? But potential. Like, am I letting god down?
Right. And what I've learned with with my friends Chaz we normalize success. We normalize what it is to have it all. Chaz potential isn't an expectation that god ever created for you to live up to. That potential is a promise that god created in you to live through. And so now because I can, I do? And I surround myself with people who also believe the same way because iron does sharpen iron where we can celebrate together because I'm a words of affirmations person.
So you sell I don't need stuff. I can buy whatever I want. I don't need anything. I don't want anything. I'm a pretty minimalist guy. Like, But you tell me. And if it's listen. You gotta qualify the criticism. You gotta qualify also. Right? You gotta qualify somebody's praise. That's right. Unqualified praise can be just as detrimental as unqualified criticism. And if you live for somebody's praise, you will die by the criticism. That's right.
So but for me having that, the this band brother, she holds me accountable, checks in on me, checks in on my relationships, checks in on my son, Right. Checks in on business and, you know, ensures that I'm becoming the man that I say that I'm called to become and vice versa. Likewise, Yeah. Right. There's a real power to that. There's there's a power that that I believe every man should look into and needs in his life to to push past, you know, the propensity of of mere performance.
Yeah. Yeah. The mindset, that can only come when when poaked prodded Yeah. Rubbed against created friction, with others. Absolutely. Yeah. It's it's just as you said, you just don't know and and unless you know, and you made a challenge there that every man, I would say every business owner, every man, specifically, Yeah. You should look into it for sure, and every business owner, male, or female because Yep. Women need to move forward. Talking to the ladies too.
I'm just sure you're stalking the men. No. It's it's it's good because the message is clear there are certain things that, you know, most entrepreneurs are men. It's because the achievement, ambition, all of that's an energy that usually falls in, in a manner. And as a provider, Yeah. Yeah. It's a masculine energy. Provide protect. Praside. Yeah. Exactly. So, okay, last question here for you. Right. But you've been incredible.
I wanna know if you had a chance to whisper in the younger Cody's ear. What would you what would you say? You're worth 11 the way you are. Good. Yeah. There's nothing to prove, hide, or protect. But then again, I don't know that I had to whisper that to myself because I wouldn't be where I am today. Right. And I don't know if a younger version of me would have been ready to hear it or knowing what to do with it. Or even grab it. Exactly. Incredible insight, incredible perspective.
It's been an absolute, pleasure Same. To, you know, go back and forth with you here and then be stretched and challenged. How can the listener find you? How can they find your community? How can they connect? Yeah. So if you go to only fans, man, how many Do not go to only fans. Do not go there. Bounce your ass. That's the devil's playground. So Right. Man, you can you can Google me. Cody jefferson.com is the website. You can find me on social.
I'm probably more active on Instagram than any other platform. So it's just Instagram Cody_jefferson. Shoot me a message, and we do get a lot of messages. So, you know, bear with me. Put this podcast as the title. That way if it goes to my request, I know where you're coming from. So I I make sure to prioritize that and get back to it. I believe we all have a really powerful story. We're just waiting for somebody to hear it. So shoot me a voice message.
Let me hear your story, and that way you're going. I love that that you're open on that. We'll put all the socials in the in the show notes. Cool. And, of course, some easy ways for them to connect with you. You've been incredible. Thank you for going through what you've gone through so that you can share the insights that you have. We wish nothing but blessing you, your son, your community, everything. Thank you for for being here today. We appreciate it, Cody. Thanks, buddy.
Thanks for listening to Gathering the Kings. We hope you got a ton of value today and learned a thing or 2 about taking your business to 7 figures and beyond. If you desire more and want a community around you to help you get there, but want you to go to gathering the king's dot com. That's gathering the king's dot com and I want you to apply for our next becoming a king 90 day intensive. We are extremely exclusive by nature as a group.
What that means that we're really wanting only the entrepreneurs who take their business and targets super serious to apply. So if that's you, you think you got what it takes. Level up your business, I want you to go to gatheringthekings.com and apply. And we will see you on the other side.