On today's episode of Gathering the Kings. So the entrepreneurs that are trying to figure out, and if they're an entrepreneur that is disrupting, something I think that's really important to think about is, you know, those of us that can see the future, we have an idea and the 99% of your industry or your sector that doesn't think that's a good idea, you know, they could be right, but they could also be wrong. Right.
And you you really kinda have to be a little self aware and a little delusional, you know, when you're going after, you know, a big vision. You are listening to Gathering the Kings with Chaz Wolfe featuring fellow 78 and even 9 figure business owners who have real battle scars, from business and life, but have prevailed as the king that they are designed to be.
We welcome high performing entrepreneurs to the stage in order to reveal the real of the real on what it takes to build a successful business today. We dissect the good and bad decisions they made along the way to give a true and accurate picture of the journey of success and how you too can get there. Through this dialogue, you will learn the value of growing your network and surrounding yourself with power players and keys like today's guest.
Grab your pen and notebook because we're about to dive in. What's up, everybody? I'm Chaz Wolfe. Gathering the King's podcast. I'm your host. Today, I've got Carson Combs on the King stage. My brother, Carson. How are you? I'm wonderful, Chaz. How are you this morning? I'm good. I was just going back and forth with you. We we've got deer season that's amongst us. You were just hunting with your son, and I'm gonna take my little kiddos out here this week here in Missouri.
And so tis the season is my is the way I say it. Right? Yep. Bambi's dad. Family Stange. Exactly. In fact, I'll say Grandpa too. You know? He's probably bigger and burlier, and, and he's he just needs help anyway. That's right. Going to the end. So, anyway, I'm just excited to have you here, Carson. Tell us what kind of business that you have. Yeah. No. Great. And I'm excited to be here to chat. Really appreciate the insight and help into other entrepreneurs.
I think that's something that we all have. Rising tides, you know, all of that. Tries. So our company is called on ZenBuild@zenvil.com. And what we built, my wife and I started at our kitchen table many years ago, And we brought ecommerce into, industry that's operating the same way for a 100 years plus, which is a working stone products. And when we started, it was literally at the table. The dog was barking.
The kids were little, and we were shipping samples out of our garage to different to the country. Fast forward, we had build out, rebranded, launched a new site in 2019, brought in some capital, Chaz hit continue to grow and we've shipped majority of our products are kind of thin brick and thin stone for any Wolfe thing from multifamily commercial project to a homeowners doing a fireplace or back spot. Wow. And so we've hit every state in the country.
We have the joy of of talking to, you know, sweet little homeowners. It's the first project to, you know, MasterCraftman, you know, who do this every day. And so it's been a a wild ride and lots fun. Yeah. I Wolfe ride is probably an oversimplification for sure, but we're gonna get into some of that. Before we do, though, I got a question for you.
It's really more so around, you know, maybe your purpose or your why, but at this stage in the game, you kinda just gave us a little bit of a backdrop. Right? You had You had young kids. They've obviously gotten older. You've built a great business. I'm sure you have a great team. There's a lot of things in place. But you're still going after it. Just a couple of years ago, you rebranded. You brought in some capital. Like, you're really going for this thing, but you already had success.
You're already there. Quote, unquote, maybe. Why are you still doing this? Why are you pushing so hard? Well, I think, you know, I think Chaz personally, you know, I'm not speaking for for others. I have so many friends that are entrepreneurs that have built businesses. Some have sold them. You know, some are still in them. And I think when it comes down to it, is it about the money? Yeah. But really about something bigger. And that bigger portion is, you know, what are you trying to change?
How is whatever the process or product how does it operate today? And why is that a problem? And why do you and your vision and your team see that as something that can be changed and that you can make better. Yeah. You know, and, ultimately, in our industry, it represents close to about $20,000,000,000 annually in the US. And when I started, I've been in the industry for close to 2 decades.
Many colleagues, mentors, VPs, and CEOs of companies in our industry were like, this is a stupidest damn thing. Nobody will buy this product online. Interesting. And that it it hurt, you know, and you would have some that would tell you, oh, it's a good idea. And then you'd hear from another colleague who worked with him, like, oh, man. He thinks that's the dumbest shit ever.
And you kinda had to have Big skin, I think anybody does that's trying to bring, you know, not just disruption, but making something better. And, ultimately, You know, we're employed by our customers. And without the customer, we don't exist and with thousands that come to us, you know, a day right now, obviously, we've figured out that the customers are there and they do need our help. That's right. That's right. Yeah. I think that I love what you said. Obviously, it's pretty simple about it.
It's not it's it is about the money, but it's not. You know, I think at some point, we we have that realization of what money can do for us or do for the team or do for the community, do for your family. It turns from a selfish perspective to What's the abundance? Right? How how can it overflow? But I also love the perspective that you just gave around. The customer is is who's paying your payroll? You. Right.
You're you personally, as well as team, but, yeah, you've hit you've hit a disruption, probably a level. And, you know, you're doing things in an industry that's that's old, but wanna get and maybe get into some of those things. Before I do though, the why that you just gave me the kind of the it's a bigger picture. There's there's you know, maybe a little chip on your shoulder. You kinda gave me a couple different angles there, which I think was really, really good.
Has that always been like that? Did that not happen until that moment? Do you remember being a young kid thinking? I'm gonna I'm gonna, you know, charge the Wolfe. You know, is it not about the money? Like, give us a little backdrop? No. No. I mean, I think I think everybody you know, when you're growing up, yeah, you'd see different different people you idolize, either, you know, on a business level or as, you know, an uncle, a father. You know, a grandmother, Evelyn, is very important.
You know, the foundation of of who I am today was my grandmother. And she had lost her first husband, remarried, lost that husband, and she was an entrepreneur. And I was her only grandchild, and she owned a little grocery store in a small town in Ohio where I grew up in You know, she worked a butt off and eventually, you know, some of the larger grocery chains came in and, you know, she lost the business. But she never lost that drive, and so I remember helping her. It was a little kid.
This is so funny. Fee Wolfe sell vitamins Yeah. And she would she would do mail order. You know, this is before internet. You know, so people people would mail a Chaz, and she would put vitamins in in boxes. And I remember being over there on the weekend, you know, helping her sort zinc from vitamin c or beach without burning the stuff. He just always had that. And I think a a major impact for me and my wife, the company that I was working for in the industry had been bought twice.
And the last buyout we went through was by Berkshire Hathaway. Yeah. And I got that first paycheck, and it was, like, employee 3066 or something. And I was like, Woah. You know, this is an Einstein with a family business, and we had built it up on our team and ended quite well. And so when that happened, In that same period, my grandmother was diagnosed with stage 4, and she was still in Ohio. We're in Chattanooga, Tennessee, and she called me the Saturday after Thanksgiving.
And, again, I'm a grandson. She's like, Carson got cancer in the doctor give me 6 weeks, and, I remember talking to my Wolfe, then said, you know, hey, I'm gonna drive up. I'm gonna get a grandma. And what vitamin she was still doing the vitamin game. What drove up, so high, packed up, you know, everything we could, and F One Fifty and brought her down, and she was with us for almost 7 weeks since she passed. But this is prior to me going out on my own. And 2 important things.
I remember sitting in the sunroom on a December day with her, and we had the windows open because it was rather warm and chat new gunners, slight breeze. And I was talking to her about being in this big entity and how I just thought they weren't taking care of customers. They weren't operating efficiently. And I was like, you know, I kinda wanna do this on my own, but I'm scared. And she told me You know, honey, she was like, I've had a couple businesses. She was like, just go do it.
You know, the worst thing that can happen is you fail. And if you were good at what you did, the company you're with or company similar would hire you back, and it was it was weird. I'll give you one on the point too, but What was weird is I've I've found that borrowed confidence is something that's so important Yeah. And and friends of mine that have started their own business since I went out on my own. Chaz had one that texted me 2 weeks ago.
General Contractor Ingeny is a Robert Roberts Construction. And 7 years ago, he went out and started his business, and he texted me on the 7th year anniversary. Early in the morning, he said, man, I just wanted to tell you. I was thinking about you this morning. 7 years ago, the day is when you and I had the conversation, I was gonna go work for somebody else, and I went out on my own. And he was like, my life has changed, and, you know, my family is better because of it.
And I think Chaz borrowed confidence that my grandmother, grandma, Betty, god bless her, gave me is something that I try to pass on to other entrepreneurs. So Yeah. So good. On that side, you know, there's that. And then send build what happened when I left and went to start my first company The initial company I started with the family business, when they sold the first time I'd signed an on to Pete. And so They were bought, signed in on compete.
Several years later, they were bought by Berkshire Hathaway, and Berkshire Hathaway was like, oh, hell, no. You're not gonna start your own business. And so in my early thirties, I was sitting in court against Berkshire Hathaway. My wife and I had sold everything, moved to a small condo, and it was scary as shit jazz. Yeah. And so for the entrepreneurs and, you know, the people that are Chaz are listening, you know, to the podcast.
I think something that's important to remember is you talked about a chip on your shoulder. Think that's part of it, but I think it's bigger than that. You know, you've got a vision. There's a lot of scary things. There's a lot of worries. Cash flow. How are we gonna do this?
You know, you know, I've heard the analogy multiple times, you know, being an entrepreneur starting your own businesses, like jumping off a cliff and assembling your parachute as you fall down, I think that's so accurate because there's a lot of times where you go, oh, shit. I don't know what I'm doing. And all you do is you just take the next step. And you could just keep going and surround yourself with people that make you better and challenge you. Yeah. Yeah. You're a 100 it right.
We're just coming off of a weekend gathering the king started as a mastermind group even before the podcast. And so we've got 7, 8, and even 9 figure business owners that actually to my house here in Kansas City. We had a phenomenal weekend. Hit the Chiefs game. It was awesome. But That's sweet. All that to say that when you walk away from a weekend like that, it's borrowed confidence. Like you just said, I've never had it said like Chaz, but that's exactly what it is. It's borrowed confidence.
It's yeah. I gotta chip on my shoulder. I wanna go do this thing, but when I lock arms with a community, like you said, even at the beginning, you're, like, rise rising tide raises all ships. Like, the power in Chaz, it's it's unseen. You can't measure it. But it's it's literally what propels guys like you and I forward because we're gonna go far. Like, we're just drivers. We're gonna do the thing.
But how much more is the thing impactful to us, our families, our communities, when we're pushed, encouraged, challenged from from the guys and and ladies around us that that are just as sharp. And doing their thing as well. So I just I just appreciate that perspective. I think that grandma Betty or another business owner, even the guy that you encouraged to get in business, maybe you're further down the road. I guarantee you when you saw that text message that fired you up that day.
Oh, I absolutely did. Not I didn't text him. I called in, and I was like, your dumbass was gonna go work for somebody else. He started laughing, and I think, you know, You you talk about the group that you were just with. You know, Mike, not team, my queen, you know, my wife is very much, a giver of borrow conference, compliments to me. Yeah. You know, and she worked in in the business.
And, you know, that's something that's challenging for a lot of people, but At the end of the day, you know you've got somebody that has the same vision as soon as it's gonna work just as hard. And when you have your low points, Hopefully, they're they're going back and forth.
So when one of you is down, the other one's up and, you know, whether that's a spouse or it's, you know, a a business partner, or, you know, ahead of sales or anything else, you know, putting those people, you know, in place with you along your journey because you can't do it alone. There's no way you can do it alone.
Yeah. I loved how you how you how you brought that into the the marriage or the home because support sounds like submission and we know how that sometimes can can create some controversy. But the reality of it is is that we each port, and then we each like, my wife and I, we have lanes. And so there's things that I submit to her, and there's things that she submits to me.
And it just seems so like our culture has just you know, toiled that word, but I love with how you applied borrowed confidence to it because that's really what it is. I don't have to necessarily Like, if I if I'm feeling whatever sort of way and I can get some borrowed confidence, if my wife's a giver, as you said, of borrowed confidence, I can go charge the hill the next day, and I will. You probably are the same way. Look. Is she just Just breeze a little bit of that borrowed confidence.
I'll go beat my chest and run the hill over and over and over again. It's like McDonough hay on. What's the Wall Street? Hoping. Dude, yes. This past weekend, we we did a cold plunge, and we were we were, you know, a little little little, you know, odd for the moment, but it it It's camarader. It's in that moment of, like, yes. You just breathed that into me, and now I'm freaking fired up. So let's go. Just appreciate that perspective. I wanna get into some practicals here.
Actually, early early on in the business, if you can think back to him, a thing that you decided on, you know, maybe even pre $1,000,000 revenue, I wanna know the good decision. Something super clear that you can look back on and go, boom. I would do it over and over again, and that's something that the listener can maybe takeaway. I think a really good decision. There were a lot of bad wins. You know, greed.
One of the, you know, good ones Chaz kinda comes to mind right now, and it it plies back to kinda your drive, you know, your team. There was a gentleman that I had worked with. Chaz a The small company he started with, and he kinda went to different company after the buyouts. Sure. And I went to him. He was on the logistics side. He was older than me. And still on our team and and great guy. He's a he's a good general. And I went to him and said, look, I've got this I've got this vision.
And, you know, nobody's doing it. In our industry, people were going outside the industry, and I went to him and said, I need help. And I think that comes back to the good decision, which I think all entrepreneurs should be willing to to really look at and say, if I can't do this on my own, I need help. And that's a hard thing too. It it's it's a weird balance chance Yeah. In between Okay. Entrepreneur, it sounds like it's one person.
You know, you get the images of, yeah, Elon, Steve Jobs, you know, Steve Chaz was, Elon's got somebody out who it is. You got a lot of people. And, that is something you really need to be able to be vulnerable to hear no. Or, yes, you know, I'm I believe in where you wanna go, and I'd like to be part of it and here's how I contribute. And I think Chaz is something that I think would be helpful.
And it was a good decision and has bared fruit, you know, for us and and our company is Being willing to ask for help. Yeah. Yeah. And you gave a couple different on ramps there. I just wanna highlight it for the listener, not only someone that you would maybe consider bringing on to the team or bring on as a partner or grandma Betty, or your spouse or another entrepreneur. Like, there's a lot of different on ramps there of asking for help, and maybe it's tactical. Maybe it's mindset.
Maybe it's borrowed confidence. Like, there's nothing a lot of different on ramps, and then there's a lot of different passing back and forth of what can happen in those moments. But you're right. Think that every entrepreneur can take that away. Why do you think in that moment, your instinct was to go ask for help and not try to figure it out yourself?
Because I knew that the value of my time was not handling that portion of the business, and I also knew that the expertise was so much more in-depth. You know, we call he said, we we communically call him, you know, our logistics shut on. You know, he's our obi wan in in that field, and Wolfe I knew that, you know, we could do it, you know, we could get somebody else. I trusted him. And I was like, Man, if I can add this building block into our team, it can help us excel faster.
And I think that's, you know, that's important. And it's scary when you're making your first hires because you're like, oh god. You know, here's my here's my catch runway. You know, my burn is gonna go up, you know, but what can I do with that time that I would've been involved in helping with Chaz? Yeah. Well, I can move that over to help build a business faster through sales and get them to customer. What would you say to the guy listening right now who hears you? But he's not hearing you.
You started thinking as an architect. How do I architect the team? How do I put people in place? Right? But so many people, including many of our listeners today listening to you right now, they just got started, right, which is fine. That's good. Better than not. No. But they're stuck in the I'm doing everything.
Maybe because they're nervous about hiring somebody, maybe because they just don't know any different, They haven't thought of architecting or maybe from, like, an investor perspective. They're more thinking just I gotta feed my family so I need to go do a project or service, a marketing client, or whatever. We'll just get to that guy who didn't have that mindset. How does he need to get there? You know, being not in the construction field. Right?
And in background, I've seen large scale projects being built, you know, multi $100,000,000 projects, corporate offices, hotels, schools, I saw on the job site that, you know, for our side, you know, information that's doing the block, that's doing the break that's doing the stone. Wolfe, then you Chaz the plumber that's doing the plumbing. You had the electrician running the wire. You had the sheet rock company doing the sheet rock.
And then you had the general contractor and their team of superintendent and a project manager. They were essentially managing all of those groups. And so for the entrepreneur that's going, hey. I gotta do this because I gotta get, you know, some money in to pay my bills. You gotta take calculated risks. And if you're building a big building and you've never done electrical work, you're gonna sub that out to somebody.
You're not gonna do it yourself because it gets behind schedule, and it really, really, you know, ultimately Wolfe be horrible for the project if somebody didn't know what they were doing, tried to do it, or knew just a little bit. You know, you're you'd turn a light switch on, and it would turn the fax machine power off and, you know, the other whirom or something.
So I would Yeah. That's my that's my how I look at it, Chaz, or how I might express it as, you know, sub out the stuff that doesn't drive your revenue and do that as soon as you possibly can. Hey, Chaz Wolfe here. As many of you know, I have been on an absolute mission to help entrepreneurs from all across the country in many different industries, level up their game and grow their business, and intentionally connect with other entrepreneurs.
We do Chaz, obviously, through the podcast, but We also have a peer to peer mastermind group specifically for 7 to 9 figure business owners. We are bringing some of best and most successful entrepreneurs and minds together in a regular and a super intentional way to not only grow our network, but to be able to leverage.
And at a certain point in business, success becomes about leverage, leveraging time, leveraging resources, leveraging key relationships, This is exactly what we're doing inside of the peer to peer mastermind group called Gathering the Kings, specifically for 7 to 9 figure business owners, So if that's you, if you're ready to level up your 7 to 9 figure business, even to the next level and get around other big hitters just like you, I want you to
go to gathering the king's dot com, fill out a short application, and, it'll come to an application, call with me and I wanna chat with you and see if it might be a good fit. Talk soon. Yeah. The way that you put it on a large scale of if you were you know, a GC running a $150,000,000 project. 0 chance you or one of your superintendents is gonna go install the electrical. 0 chance. Correct?
And so Chaz the gap there obviously is is that the guy who's listening to a 600,000, and he's got a you know, a $10,000 project or a $40,000 project is just so much smaller. So he thinks, well, I'll just I'll get it done myself. It's the same principle, though. Right? He's like, yeah. Is he really the best fit? Is it gonna keep it on schedule? Does that really the best use of his time? Could he be going to get another $40,000 project while someone else is installing the wiring. Right?
Yeah. Yeah. I would say, you know, I'm just add on or throw on onto Chaz, you know, and looking we had a conversation with either a venture capitalist or, you know, a contractor. I can't recall. It was maybe a month or 2 ago. And it was about time. And so what Zenville does is we Chaz press time, not only for a homeowner, but also for the the contractor. And so a con I'm pretty sure it was a contractor.
He was like, man, I spent half my week, you know, driving to physical stores to get samples to take them back to my clients, and he was like, it's cutting my pro productivity down horribly. And I don't have anybody else to do it because I've guys working in the field and then I own the company.
And so he said, you know, I can get on, you know, my iPhone, and I can get the samples so I can order or I can get the estimate, write off Zen build, and I can send it to the customer and let them pick it. And he was like, that just saved me, you know, 4 hours, you know, on Monday. That I can be going out and gain more business. I think that's something for the entrepreneur that's doing the $40,000 job.
You know, they've gotta kinda look at, you know, what's my time and what's the multiple if I was I was doing something else and then you kinda look, man. And it's hard, man. I mean, you want to It is. Operate business at a 100% the way you wanna do it, and sometimes it's gonna be okay to be like, alright. This this team member is gonna be able to do it 80% of the way I would do it.
But I'm able to take that time and and, you know, drive the business forward, whether it's in sales, whether it's in meeting with partners, vendors, or whatever your business applies to. Yeah. Carson, I heard a new a new kind of mindset on this 80%. And I've talked about this for many years. The, you know, you you're not you stop looking for you. You know? Your 100% is not there, 100%. Like, we gotta get we gotta get in the right mind space here.
But but hiring somebody at 80% sounds like maybe lowering a standard. And so this thing that got presented to me maybe last week or week before I can't remember, but he said, look, if you're doing it all, literally, you might you might be better. Of that one task than your employee. But if you're doing 17 other things also, 0 chance you're at a 100%. He's like, most likely, you're actually at 25, 30, maybe 40%. And so their 80% is literally double as good as you. So it was just like, wow.
It was like a really good perspective. Obviously, I'm in agreement. You know, I've been teaching the same thing, but it's like, that was a new perspective. What do you think about that? No. That's great. I I mean, I You say 14 different things, try, like, you know, 80. Yeah. And so, you know, when you think about that, I think that's where you also If if you if you think of it that way and then you go, look, where do I make the biggest impact? Yeah. Exactly. Click.
And and that that's what you've got to always kinda keep in mind on the bigger vision is, do I need to be spending my time on Chaz? Or do I need to empower my team members and go look? I I got your back. Right. Here's our, you know, here's our values. Here's our vision. If you execute on that, whether it's 80, 70, 90. You're doing what we need you to do, and you're representing myself, my wife, you know, our shareholders and our business.
And I think empowering the people on your team is a really important thing too, and it's hard to coach people, man. I mean, because some people have it. You know, and have that drive to wake up everyone. Like, I'm unemployed. I gotta make money today. I think that's an entrepreneurial mindset. I mean, others are like, okay. I'm a go to work. You know? Hour lunch, you know, be 4 o'clock or 30, start checking social media, you know, not really be affecting.
It's the guys and gals that gives as much as they can, you know, while they're they're on your clock or, you know, helping you build your business. Yeah. 100%. Carson, let's flip the coin here. Let's talk about a bad decision that you made. Something that didn't work out at all that we can Oh, god. Chaz list that that's a big list.
You know, I think something that I regret in the business is We're really stuck in a kind of a funnel, if you will, in disrupting what Zenvold essentially does is The industry has about 1500 physical distributors all across the country. K? And our vision was huge. Right? We're like, alright. Contractors, B2B, B2C is gonna come to, you know, our site. They're gonna buy product. Right. Well, what I underestimated were the manufacturers of the product.
You know, who rely on that distribution network. I thought they'd be like, hell, yeah. We're going in on the internet with Carson and sharing the team. This is awesome. You know, they've got thousands of shoppers a day on their sites. You know, my physical stores might have five people walk in a day. What I underestimated what was a bad decision that we pivoted from was we were trying to, you know, supply a full bed depth break like cladding brick.
And I only had a couple manufacturers that realize, yeah, we'll do that and let you bypass our and disrupt you know, the distribution network. And I just kept hammering, you know, being an industry for 2 decades, you know, I know Chaz CEOs and and the VPs of sales of all all the companies. And just kept hammering. I'm like, hey. I've got this customer in Phoenix. So wants to buy, you know, a hundred thousand bucks worth of product. And the manufacturers were like, now let's gotta go to this guy.
I'm like, well, that guy didn't procure it. You know, it came in through our efforts in in marketing and and the platform. And we beat that horse for so long, and we finally got to the point that we went what products would they let us sell and what market is big enough within it? And so we pivoted over to the Synvenir prop. That's in Brick and the thin stone and made that customer journey so freaking amazing Yep.
That the experience online and on Zen build would so much easier and so much faster and transparent in pricing Yeah. That at which we would have done that earlier, instead of trying to just take on, you know, the goliath of we wanna do all this and just go and go and go, Yeah. The, you know, vendors and partners on our platform, which we have over half the industry on our platform now from, you know, back when we were trying to do that, we were maybe 3% Right.
If we would have done that earlier, you know, we would have been further down the road than we are. And I think that time, you know, I'd love to go back and Talk to Jagarsson, you know, at 33, 34 and be like, do this.
But and this is why because you're gonna spin your wheels and So the entrepreneurs that are trying to figure out, or if they're an entrepreneur that is disrupting, something I think that's really important to think about is you know, those of us that can see the future, we have an idea and the 99% your industry or your sector Chaz doesn't think that's a good idea, you know, they could be right, but they could also be wrong. Right.
And you you really kinda have to be a little self aware and a little delusional, you know, when you're going after, you know, a big vision. Yeah. You're right. And so it it obviously puts you in a position now where you say you regret, but it's it's what got you to dial in to what you have now. And so Sometimes you have to be a little delusional to take that risk of let's take on everything in order to then finally get to where you are now. So I I just appreciate both both of those perspectives.
Did you feel that, like, through that process of niching down or or dialing in? Obviously, you said it it it allowed you to, like, really, really tighten up customer experience. Was there any other benefits that you could think of? I mean, Chaz we got lots of different industries listening of of focus or of niching other than being able to speak directly to your customer through the process and really make it like this beautiful thing, or is there something else inside of that you wanna mention?
They asked me asked me that in different way, Chaz. I wanna make sure I understand that to give you the best Yeah. Yeah. So feedback. So what you the the pivot that you made was that you niche. You you you narrowed your focus of product, which then allowed you, you said, to be able to make this super dialed in customer experience. Was was that the biggest thing that came out of that? Was there anything else that came out of you narrowing the focus?
Yes. Yeah. The opportunities in narrowing the focus that would have presented themselves Chaz were outside of just our core you know, function as a business started to present themselves, and that wouldn't have if we hadn't have narrowed and really fine tuned because our and partners and vendors and even customers started seeing how easy it was, and then our growth started. And then our reach got bigger.
And so, you know, on the manufacturing side, we had one manufacturer that was like, we've never had a You know, we know you guys are ecommerce, and you're servicing the entire country and not just, you know, Kansas City, you know, one certain market like, you guys grew, you know, nearly 90% 1 year over year in in product, and you're shipping product into places that we don't even have distribution.
And that came with an opportunity, which we then later developed into, you know, a marketing service agreement. Or, hey. You know, we've got our spend that we put out on marketing. If you want to, it's Gramal Betty, it's grocery store.
You wanna put, you know, your product you know, on that front shelf, you know, there's there's some payment that comes on to that in that marketing service agreement, you know, allows our manufacturers to get more of their product out to the customers that are shopping, you know, on the internet. So this product niche, and I think that was an opportunity that wouldn't come. Because we weren't even, you know, we weren't looking at that. We were just like, hey. We're gonna do this.
We're gonna do this. Charge forward. Charge forward. Charge forward. And I think that is definitely something that came out of narrowing and focused Yeah. It it's funny. I wanna point this out for the listener. Maybe they felt the same way listening, but you said you narrow. Meaning, you took away things. Mhmm. And and what was left was more opportunity. Right?
Which is a conundrum in itself, but how that works is that because you narrowed it in, because you were able to speak a very specific language, or because you were able to solve a very specific problem, Then the opportunities came out because they understood. It was so dialed in. They were like, oh, I see what you're doing here. I need to get on the bandwagon. Or before taking on the whole giant, it's kinda like, yeah. We've already gotta kinda get this figured out.
We don't really have a problem. You're not really solving anything for us. If anything, you were making it harder for them because they already had these relationships with the distribution network. Right. Correct. Yeah. And and that's what scared them. I mean, yeah, on the manufacturing side, You know, they didn't see it. You know, they didn't see us as a painkiller. You know, the customer is in pain. The customer is taking so much time. It's costing them money.
Yeah. They they're like, our customer is the network, the distribution network, not the end user. And so that end user up camera, which bugs talked about Steve Jobs always put an empty chair, right, at Amazon Staples? Who's that represent? That represents the customer. It's like the customer wasn't in, you know, our industry at the level they should have been in in my opinion.
And so focusing on that customer and how we make it easier in the niche created so much more opportunity because it was, like, messaging clear. And then the manufacturers were like, oh, yeah. That makes sense. Yep. You know, we're on board with that. And so, again, you know, assuming that parachute, yeah, as you're going off the cliff, you know, that's one of the things that that happened while we were assembling the parachute. Yeah. It's so good. I wanna switch over to our speed round.
I'm gonna come at you in a little different angle with some questions. Yeah. My first question is around KPIs. Yep. I'll give it to you to a couple different directions or a couple different ways. I'm really wanting to know your most important KPI, but I'm gonna say it is if you could only track 1 forever and ever, what would it be? Customer conversions daily. K. K. Give us give us a little behind the scenes on that.
So if I look at the amount of people that are coming to site and we're not having, you know, what our benchmark is for transactions a day, that's a problem. You know, and that that's where I know we need to focus in because we've got the the customer's coming if they're not purchasing, why? Is it something we've done wrong? Is it an update we've done that make it harder to check out? Are we not providing enough information, you know, with customers or your wife's blood?
Yeah. Yeah. And and for the listener to your ecommerce, and so that conversion. Tactic is good, and maybe they're not ecommerce, but it's a it's a pipeline KPI. Right? Find out how many people are coming to the pipeline, but then nobody's coming out of the pipeline. There's an issue with the pipeline. No. Something wrong with the pipeline. Yeah. That's exactly right. It's good. Carson, what book would you recommend? Or a business owner trying to grow. I mean, I got tons. Chaz I give you 2 Chaz?
Yeah. Yeah. Give give give us 2. You know, kind of on the, macro you know, just theory each lossy side. Yeah. There's a book called The Alchemist k. By a public, I believe. I I have you can have my kids listen to it. And, essentially, the gist is what you're looking for may be right where you're at. What you're building and what you're trying to find might be right where you're at, not out in the desert or in in another country.
On the business side, Phil Knight shoe dog, I think I read it six times, dude. Wait. He gets the tax bill for importing shoes, and it's, like, $70,000,000. And I can just imagine him in Oregon opening that letter going, what? Right. How are we gonna get through this? I think that is a phenomenal entrepreneur at any level, whether it's, you know, 60 years or, you know, in figures. I think that's a great book. Yeah. It really it and it's entertaining. It it's easy.
It's although thick, it's a it's an easy read. Yeah. Okay. What are your thoughts on intentionally networking or masterminding with other entrepreneurs, specifically? I think if you don't do it, you're missing a lot of you know, we call it our tribe. I've got a workout tribe. My wife's here across shit people. Yeah. That's my workout tribe, but I've got my entrepreneur tribe and me buddies Chaz, factoring companies, logistics companies, restaurants, some that I don't even know what they do.
John's a buddy of mine. They they extract THC from hemp and There you go. I mean, it's a cool stuff, but, I mean, we essentially are all, you know, doing the same thing in different areas. And so the pain points, I would encourage anybody to, you know, get a group. I've got a buddy of mine, mine today, Mark Baker, entrepreneur. I think he's sold 2 businesses. He was like, lunch. And I'm like, no, man. I'm busy today. And he was like, I miss us. But structured life fit.
And I was like, I miss us too, Baker. You know, those are the people you call on the high days, Chaz, and on the days where you're going, what the hell am I gonna do? You know, and and send builds had those, you know, as as we started and, you know, as we continue to grow and you've gotta have somebody that's like minded Yep. That can go And it's gonna be alright. Erin, have you thought about this? Or take a breath. Calm that.
Yep. I think it's very important to have Those things that we already know. But we're we're so far into the forest. We can't see the trees. I've got I've got one more question here for you. Alright. Carson, if you could whisper into the younger Carson's ear. What would you say? Wow. That's a great question, Chaz. How how young am I how young am I going? Chaz is a great follow-up question, and I'm gonna let you determine that. I think parts of the answer would be trust your gut.
And take the step. I wish I would've started sooner. You know, you you help. You learn your skill, right, which is important with the 10000 hour rule. I could have started so much sooner than what I did, but I was scared. You know, and I didn't wanna be vulnerable. I didn't wanna ask for help. I just kinda went to work, killed it. It was a top performer. I would have told myself, you know, trust your gut. You know, and and and take action. Yeah. It's good.
Carson, how can the listener find you whether they need to order some product from, you know, your website or maybe they just wanna reach out and connect with you as an entrepreneur. How can they find you? Yeah. Absolutely. You'd be happy to. Best way to get me Chaz email address. You know, my personal email is carsoncrs0n@zenbuild.com. And then our website of course is zenbuild.com. If you type in Zen or build or thinbrick or instant. We don't pop up.
Email me because I pay Google a shit ton of money. And so I need to make sure that we are, but In every area of the country. Every every area of the country. So, yeah, and I think that it's good. And, you know, by no means, I think any of us, you know, on the entrepreneurial side that have built businesses, and, you know, scale Wolfe say we don't have all the answers.
You know, I've got I've got 2 buddies I know that are billionaires that have done extremely well in they're like it's a good idea. I mean, that's a stupid idea. Or, you know, I don't know about that. And I think that's, you know, that's something that we all should do you know, to help each other. And so, yeah, welcome any of the listeners, you know, especially if they're in a construction side, we probably have a lot in common. You know, feel free to reach out. We happy to talk to you.
That's right. Well, you've been incredible. Thank you for giving up your time and your experience and knowledge. We wish you nothing but blessing on your family and your business, your team, all the people that you're affecting across country. Thank you for being here, Carson. Chaz, it was awesome. Pleasure, buddy. Thank you for listening to gathering the Kings today. Hope that you were able to pull out a few nuggets to go apply into your business right away.
More importantly, though, I hope that you're realizing that it takes more to be successful than just being by yourself, doing it all on your own, carrying the weight all by yourself, What I have realized, not only in my own journey from multiple businesses and multiple different industries, and now interviewing over 2 or 300 other very successful 7, 8, and 9 figure business owners is that it's tough to do it alone. And so gathering the Kings exists to bring together successful entrepreneurs.
In fact, we are putting together 1000 Keynes specifically who are grateful but not done. We're intentionally assembling kings who fight tooth and nail for their business family and communities, and here's what we believe Chaz in the pursuit of excellence in those areas, that it ignites within us the responsibility to govern power and forge a lasting legacy.
So if that relates and and resonates with you and you know that you need people around you, sharp qualified other very successful business owners. I want you to go to gathering the king's dot com. I want you to take a look at what we're doing and see if it makes sense for you to be part of our pursuit to 1000 kings. Talk soon.