On today's episode of Gathering the Kings. The 3 of us had made over a $100,000,000 in deals with these different companies. Unrealized revenue. Share the knowledge you have. It's my personal opinion that if I don't share the knowledge that I've received or read or learned or gained by attrition, then I shouldn't have that knowledge in the first place. You are listening to Gathering the Kings with Chaz Wolfe featuring fellow 78 and even 9 figure business owners who have real battle scars.
From business and life, but have prevailed as the king that they are designed to be. We welcome high performing entrepreneurs to the stage in order to reveal the real of the real on what it takes to build a successful business today. We dissect the good and bad decisions they've made along the way that giving true and accurate picture of the journey growing your network and surrounding yourself with power players and keys like today's guest.
Grab your pen and notebook because we're about to dive in. What's up, everybody? I'm Chaz Wolfe, gathering the king's podcast. I've got Paul Trowl here on the king stage. My brother, Paul. How we doing? I'm doing wonderful today, Chaz. How you doing? You know, I'm wonderful, and I appreciate you asking, but the listener head doesn't know that We we've we've already been in a dance with each other. I was traveling on our original podcast time. Had my all my to go podcast items with me.
And, they went forward in the traveling process. And without me, because I got delayed due to some weather, but here we are, finally. Paul on the King stage. I'm glad that you're here, man. No. I'm I really appreciate you having me. Thank you. Of course. So, Paul, tell us what kind of business Chaz you got. So currently, I mean, I've been an entrepreneur for 23 years. This one is probably gonna be my last one. I I was trying to decide whether I retire or do one more.
And I decided to do one more because it really hit home for me with people in Texas being arrested for marijuana possession. In 2018, the the United States legislature and then sign into in into law by President Trump, and then the the same year. The Texas legislature assigned into effect a hemp bill, allowing cannabis usage and consumption for the entire population.
And, you know, I was talking to one of my friends who's a lobbyist for a normal, and I spoke to another one who's a lobbyist from marijuana policy project. And I said, you know, I said I got arrested in 2005 in Texas for bringing my medical marijuana in from California for my chronic migraine, and I really wanna get that product to people here in here in the United States. And I'm thinking about moving to Oklahoma because Oklahoma just passed medical. And she said, don't have this. Don't worry.
Don't don't go to Oklahoma. Stay here with him. And I said, why is that? And she said, because Marijuana will be legal in Texas soon. If you start with him, then you'll have a established brand that can easily transition into the legal marijuana movement. And I said, yeah, Heather, I said that's great and all, but, you know, health benefits are a very small segment of the population that use marijuana. The the majority of it is adult use of recreation and Hemp just doesn't get you high.
And she said, clearly, you're ignorant and you don't know what you're talking about. You need to go do your research. And then sit down with me and and talk. And I said, okay. Fair enough. I am ignorant about the subject. I'm gonna go do some research.
So for 2 years, I traveled to every single CBD trade show, every single marijuana trade show, met with countless farmers of hemp and marijuana, went to countless extraction facilities and brought home thousands of samples for my team volunteer team, of course, you know, what a what a job testing marijuana on cannabis products, right, to evaluate the market and see if, you know, if see if we can provide a better alternative to products that are in Texas.
And my goal really was to create products that are as strong or equal equally strong or stronger than products in legal marijuana states. And I learned about the endocannabinoid system. I learned about all the different cannabinoids in the cannabis plant, and I learned that Delta 9 THC, which is the active ingredient in marijuana, is what the government regulates. It's just one of the many THCs in cannabis.
There are so many other THCs and CVDs and other cannabinoids like HHC that give the user the same if not a more desirable effect than Delta 9 THC. So not only are we able to help people with their medical conditions, but for people that want to use it as adult use instead of drinking alcohol, which is poison to the body, or, you know, any other, you know, vice that they might be participating in, they can use the products that we're legally bringing to them.
So in February 2021, I started the Urban Inc company and the the brand Urban Bud to do Chaz. And Since then, we have gotten countless letters from people both on Instagram, Facebook, and e and email us saying, hey. We read about your story online about being arrested for bringing smuggling your medicine in. And because of the pro of your products, I don't have to do that anymore.
And I told myself when I started this company, you know, if I stop one person from being arrested, we've been successful because I have a second degree felony possession of a controlled substance THC on my record until I get pardoned. And I don't want that to ever happen to anybody ever. Yeah. A pretty powerful story. And I love I love from a business perspective. You know, regardless of the of the mouse trap, you just built a better one. Yeah. And that's what that's what business is.
That's what I love about your story. We I definitely wanna dive more into it. You you've kind of already answered this. My first question is always why or, like, what's your burning desire. You kinda gave that a little bit for this business with you know, your story and helping one other person, you know, not being arrested. I think that that's a great purpose and a great why. What's even below that? Like, what's Paul's burning desire? Just as an entrepreneur.
So just I I already achieved it, but it was it was financial independence. Yeah. I grew up in a very well off family on the Northern shore of Long Island Wow. In the eighties. And when I was in college, my parents opened my foot locker, and they found a gay travel guide, and they found marijuana. And I was cur I was currently working at Disney World over the summertime of my refreshment year, teaching kids, you know, underprivileged kids how to use computers.
This is, like, 1990. And I got a phone call from the secretary's office saying, you know, you have I was like, who's calling me here? You know? And I was my parents very, very conservative, religious, Catholic, saying they found my what they found is they said they out gay porn, which it wasn't, and pot. So they completely cut me off, cut me out of the Wolfe, stop paying for college, stop paying my dorm, my apartment for the summertime, and I was homeless.
Literally, on that phone call, I I went from having somewhere to live to not having somewhere to live. I think I had, like, 14 days you know, left for the for the months that they pay for the rent. And from that point on, I realized that I have to do I have to depend on myself in order to be successful in this life. And and, you know, all I can do is my best. Yep. And it has Chaz moment in time has really driven every single thing I do.
Yeah. Yeah. I I think that each entrepreneur has a moment like that where it's a little bit of a self awareness or a situational slap in the face of sorts. Where you realize that, like, no one's gonna give it to you, whatever it is, whatever success is that we we, you know, talk about your referencing you know, a financial independence, which is obviously money money connected, but there's a bunch of other things that can go along with that.
And so I it stinks that it had to come from your parents. You know, from Chaz, from a from a disconnect like Chaz, but do you find even in your journey now of 20, almost, you know, 30 years in business on different types of businesses and through the years Chaz other entrepreneurs, like you and I, have a little bit of a chip on their shoulder. Is that is that a little bit of a part of the drive for lot of folks you've met.
I did have a chip on my shoulder until I got really, really humbled back in 2013 and And now I just use that experience as an ego check. Hello? What really what really helped was going down to Peru and studying with a shaman for 10 days and taking Ayahuasca to cure these chronic migraines that I had been plagued with since 1989. I mean, they've just got constantly worse over the years.
And that experience in 2013, and then, you know, studying with the Shabito tribe in in the Amazon jungle really, really keep me grounded. Yeah. Yeah. You've got quite the the rolodex of experiences. I don't know if if I'm gonna be able to speak to, you know, getting into the Amazon juggle, but I do wanna hear practically what's what's some cool stuff that you've done in your business. So tell us tell us you kinda talked about the on ramp to this business.
How did you get in business to begin with? How'd you become an entrepreneur? How did collide for you. That's a great question because I never had any plans of being a entrepreneur. I really didn't. All I wanted to do as a kid was make video games. That's it. My parents, Bobby OIBMPC Junior, I think, in, like, 84, yeah, when I was in, like, 8th grade or something like Chaz. And and my dad wanted me to learn programming classes because he Yeah.
You know, he he worked take program because he he learned he believed that programming was the future. And I tried my hand in programming, and it really wasn't for me. I just couldn't sit at a keyboard, you know, staring at code all day long. And I tried it. I mean, I really gave it my all. What I really like doing was playing video games on the computer. I'm like, wow. This is something that I've never experienced before. Right. And I wanna do more of it.
You know, what kids are normally video games? I mean, they're all I mean, it's so prevalent now, but, you know, in the early eighties, it was kinda taboo. It was like, pornography or, you know, gambling or something. It was not something that, you know, everybody did or talked about because you're isolated in your and you're doing it by yourself and it's so antisocial and you should be out, you know, playing football and, you know, with the rest of the kids in the neighborhood.
So what I found was that I was finding all these bugs and all these games. And I would call up the companies, you know, back then it was a phone call and tell them about the bugs. And they said, oh, you know, you know, this is, like, your 20th phone call about this game, you know, would you mind being one of our beta testers? And so I don't know what a beta tester is.
And she's, like, it's somebody, you know, that we send the game to before we release it to see if they can, you know, help us get all all the the kinks out. Yeah. Yeah. And I said I'd love to do that. They said, we'll write a letter to our president of our company telling him, you know, the bugs you found and that you wanna be a beta tester and granted that this time I was fourteen years old. And I thought I was typing on my typewriter, and I I I was like, you know what?
I'm like, if I quadruple space these lines, it'll be a much longer More perfect So it might have been, like, 12 or 13 pages, right, quadruple space, thinking that nobody had ever thought of that trick before. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Everything. So called the CDO, you know, I I followed up, which seemed like, you know, 6 months for me, but it was more like about a week or 2. And I got his assistant. She said, oh, we got your letter. You know, we're gonna send you to the QA manager.
And at the time, I thought QA stood for questions and answers, not quality assurance. Sure. So I spoke to the Chaz manager, and he said, yeah. You know, we can see your letter here. We see all the bug reports, but, you know, honestly, you're you're a kid. You know, you're you're a teenager. What do you know about about debugging games? You know, what do you know about, programming bug versus an ARPA versus you know, a collision detection.
I said, I don't I don't know really honestly know anything about that. I said, but I seem to be finding all the bugs. You know? Oh, you know, they're like, well, you know, we have 3 beta testers. They're in their thirties. You know, you know, we're looking for a 4th one, but looking for somebody that can clearly articulate the bug.
I still don't know if you're making these games for kids or if you're making them for people in their thirties, I seem to be finding all the leftover bugs in the finished product. Right. And the guy's like, okay. You make a good point. We're gonna send your parents some confidentiality paperwork sign that and then, you know, we'll we'll we'll get you into the system. And from that, I started beta testing games. They wanted to hire me out of high school.
I said, no. I wanted to get a college degree. Got my college degree. And then I did the only thing I could, which was go to work for them at $9 an hour 95. Testing video games. But because I have this drive to succeed, especially after the event in 1989, I was not com I was not happy staying a beta tester. I mean, I wanted to do the best possible or a few way tests rather, but I want them to do the best possible job I could.
So every time a game would be would would would release, I would create a business plan of what bugs were in the final version of the game, What's it gonna take to patch the game? How much is, you know, is it gonna get cost? Will we receive a return on the on the programming and art efforts post production? And, you know, they were just, like, blown away because these people in quality assurance testing games are they weren't thinking like that.
They're not thinking like they're just looking for bugs and that, you know, and they're they're clock watching and they're taking their designated breaks and so forth.
So I very, very quickly rose up through the ranks at Sierra online from QA tester to to lead tester to production coordinator associate producer, and then I got hired at Activision in Los Angeles Chaz an associate producer and a promotion to producer, and I got hired a way to open a North American office for Gremlin Interactive, the company that made the Grand Theft Auto series of games to bring their games to the US. GTA was just one of many.
And we got bought by Atari, and then I worked for Atari, and then we started I I started completely new line of business, which was taking games and bundling them with video cards and sound cards and computers, which is something that nobody had ever done before. Yeah. And it it was very, very successful business model for both Gremlin and for and for Atari.
So I was lured away to come to Austin, Texas to do something similar to his head up, their business development efforts of putting games on a DVD back in 2000. Wolfe Nobody was using DVD for storage back in 2000. As a matter of fact, only 4 of the 7 movie studios were using DVDs for movies. They weren't all signed on.
So all these DVD replicators were sitting idle, so they were willing to pay us to use these me these mediums of storage to get them out there and show the world that you could, a, you could use DVDs as, you know, large storage. Right. So My idea was to take games, encrypt them, like, take the top 10 PC games, encrypt them on the DVD, and then bundles them with all these different computer manufacturers Chaz Dell, Compaq, which is now part of HP, HP, Sony, and gateway computers at the time.
And we had done 3 of those deals. We did Sony. We did Dell, and we did Gateway. And my and I said, I had to make a really big argument to this computer company. I said, we gotta we gotta reduce the price from the re MSRP by half because they're not getting a box. They're not getting a physical unit, you know, that they can stare at, that they can feel good about spending $50, you know, Chaz they They're not gonna get that. There's something tangible there that they really like.
And I convinced electronic I convinced all the top publishers to reduce the price by half. And then out of that half, we would take half and split it amongst the companies we're doing this project and give half of that revenue back to the developer.
And what I found out, I learned a really good lesson about publicly listed companies and SSC regulations, apparently, the 300,000 shares stock at 10¢, which which over time, the year that we were doing this business rose up to about $3.10 because they were sending out press releases as we were starting NDAs. Now I didn't know anything at at the time about Ping Sheet listed companies over the counter You know?
So now and I was wondering why they were sending out press releases for signing an ending. I'm like, you don't do that. I'm like, everybody signs NDAs every day. So it was a pump and dump that I was I was working for, but I made a real business out of it. And what happened was the the board of directors siphoned off all that revenue, never paid the royalties to the video game companies Wow.
And paid themselves then then what they would also do is issue themselves millions of shares of stock that they would sell in the open market and then, you know, buy things with that. So After they went bankrupt, I said, you know what? I said I've made a lot of money for all these companies over the last 10 years.
I'm gonna go ahead and start my own company and and just do it for myself because These people don't appreciate me and they don't appreciate the effort and the work ethic and everything that I'm putting in there to try and prove to myself that I'm worth living because of the incident in 1989. You know? Yeah. Yeah. So that's that's when I started my first cell phone game company. I sold that in 0506. Chaz a 2 year noncompete, started another one in 2010.
Sold that one in 2016 and took 3 years off and then started this woman. Here here we are. Yeah. I first off, I I love the tenacity of, you know, one, you just being placed randomly because that's just kinda what you had done and what you liked. But then turning that into a career and then eventually turning it into a business. I just think it's, like you said, it's an accidental story. It's an accidental business.
It's an accidental entrepreneur that we're talking to, but but not really at the same time because you had a mind from the beginning if I want more. And, I have found I don't know. Tell me if you agree, I have found that desire or the the want for more pushes us into a creative state of, like, okay. I gotta figure this out.
And sometimes that eventually gets us to I gotta do this myself because it were either I'm no longer in alignment with this guy that I'm working for or this company or whatever. And that that tips us over the edge as entrepreneur. So it's like, you were an entrepreneur this whole time. I didn't know it. Yeah. You just you just finally took the leap.
Yeah. The I guess the inside of all Chaz, I mean, you've had just so many just opportunities of wins and losses, and that's what I wanna dive into now. I wanna know of a good decision that you made along that journey that you can look back on and you go, this moment right here, I would do that over and over and over again. Something that maybe we Chaz go implement into our businesses. That's a really, really good question. What was the what was the one thing?
The one thing was me getting fed up with being treated like a number. Because at Activision, Gremlin, and Atari, I had given them so much revenue. I mean, un unrealized revenue. It was so much so that the CEO of Activision would come down to our offices and say, hey. I need I need, you know, 25,000,000 before the end of the quarter. Close whatever deals you guys have possible with the with this whole bundling thing going on. Before, like, well, we're gonna we're far away.
We're leaving money on the table, and this and that, but, like, he's like, I don't care. He's like, we're gonna be short, you know, for our financial forecast. He's like, we need the revenue. You know, so it was it was and and then it was being treated like I just didn't matter. Mean, I wind up getting fired from Activision. Gremlin got absorbed by Atari. So so Gremlin loved me, and and I love them, but it was a small family company. And it was time for them to sell.
And we did a big deal with rock star games and Sony for for Grand Theft Auto. So they were very, very happy with with with what they got to take home. But atari really just treated me like a number and Sierra online did too after, you know, after a certain point. So, honestly, it was just I got fed up with putting so much in because I was working anywhere from 12 to 15 hours every single day. Yeah. And I was young, so I can do it, you know, and and live off not great food.
You know, poor eating habits and so forth. You can get away with that, you know, when you're in you're in your twenties. Not so much when you're in your fifties. But, yeah, it was that. It was it was it was just me valuing me finally, which was very hard for me because of the psychological situation that I encountered 1990 with my parents. It's the opposite. Exactly. You're you're you're treated like you're worthless. Like, you're, you know, you're not you're not part of this family.
You're not worth worthy enough to be part of this family. Yeah. So for me to make that realization was very pivotal in my opinion. Yeah. It's a it's a I'm sure a complex that you had to work through. What do you think for a guy that's listening right now or a gal and and really doesn't really even matter how big their business is or small?
But they're but they're ready to go all in again, or they know that they need to go all in on themselves, on their business, whether it was at the beginning, that's what you were just describing, is that you decided to go all in on you Yep. As opposed to someone else. And we'd we've all done that.
If someone's listening today and and they are a business owner, they own a business, Even if they've done $1 in revenue, they've they've made that choice to go in on themselves at what level we don't know. But even some of the bigger guys that are listening, it's like, okay. There are times where we re go all in. Oh, like, we kinda have to do that several times throughout the throughout the years.
So knowing that that was, like, maybe the one of the most important things that you did, What would you suggest to a person listening right now who knows that they need to kinda, like, re up or, like, recommit or go all in on themselves again? Even though that that may have already made the initial jump like you're talking about, what would you say to that person? Don't hesitate the best investment is in yourself. Honestly, it really is. You know, don't buy the fancy car. Don't go out to dinner.
Save that every doll every penny, every dollar that you spend on something frivolous, like, you know, a meal outside, you could be investing into yourself or your business. I mean, yeah, that that's honestly the the best advice I could possibly give because Chaz money adds up very, very fast, and you could use that working capital towards towards your business. It's just a mindset, really. Most people out there don't have this mindset. It can be taught. Absolutely Chaz be taught.
I taught it to myself. And I I get that's that's it really, but it's it's a short answer. Yeah. Love it. Let's flip the coin. Paul told me about a bad decision that you made something that you did along the way Chaz that caught you a couple bruises Chaz they say and something that we can learn from. Stay away from ourselves. It would probably be being fired from activation. I I had The activation where is where we we started this whole bundling thing.
The these video card manufacturers like Nvidia who you're I'm sure you're probably aware of the make video cards and AI chips and they've really divested or Let's say changed. Yeah. Diversified. Yeah. 3 d effects, rendition and AMD slash now it's, I mean, a at the ATI at the time now, it's AMD because they acquired them. They came to all these different video game companies and said, you know, we're coming out with these chips that do 3 d hardware acceleration for games.
And I was like, what the hell is that? And I'm like, well, you guys are making 3 d games, but you're doing it in code We want you to take all that code and off load it onto the video hardware so Chaz, well, you know, how you have a lot more CPU cycles to run your program and you have a lot more computations that you can actually bring back and make the game faster. And I said, well, that's great. You know, but, you know, we'd have to incorporate.
I mean, the we have planning, like, you know, 3 years out. Like, we can't just do this all of a sudden, Wolfe Nilly. So we wound up working a deal out with all every single one of these three d card and three d video chip any saying we they'll reimburse us for not only reimburse us, but they'll pay the opportunity cost of taking a program or off of a game to reengineer a game that we've already released to take advantage of the video cards. Right. And and Chaz was good.
That Wolfe that convinced management to do that. And I was like, that's nice and all, but what are we gonna do with the game after it's done? And nobody has these these cards. Like, you you have to see the market. And so they said, okay. You know, to make the deal a little sweeter, we'll go ahead and bundle them. With the cards when we come out with them, which is in, you know, like, a year or a year and a half. That's where this whole business of bundling came in.
So as an associate producer at Activision, we had me I say we. It was myself, the one programmer who I hired externally, and then one tester, production tester that worked in our little three person team. And that was it. Any art that we needed, we've outsourced to a company. But the the 3 of us had made over a $100,000,000 in deals with these different companies. Unrealized revenue And it was so much that, like I said, the CEO was coming down saying, hey.
You know, we need x amount of money, you know, so quickly, what what kind of deal skins it was me, and there was some business development guy who kinda led the the sales effort on this. So when bonus time came around, I was getting paid, I think 51,000 as a year, I got paid a $2000 bonus. And I I was so sneaky. I I thought I was sneaky. I sent an anonymous email, if you know, from a hotmail account to the CEO saying, you really undervalued your employees.
You need to pay them what they're worth. You wouldn't be in the position you're in if you weren't for them, you know, keep your word. It's it's all that integrity or something like that. Sure. And then you traced it back to the my desktop computer in my ink by cubicle at at the office. Wow. I'm like, we know it's you. I'm like, no. No. It wasn't me. No. It wasn't me. So, yeah, that was that was probably the biggest mistake of of of my career.
But, you know, I mean, In hindsight, it led me to to to better things because I, I, again, I wasn't valued there, and I found Gremlin Interactive or or Gremlin Interactive found me. And, you know, we we did great things with Grand Theft Auto. We bring it to the United States, getting a place with Sony. I mean, the game took off after we came out with the 3rd So, that's really like the answer.
As a true entrepreneur, the the the pain point turns into a story and then a learning and then and then some success. On top of it. I mean, you can give up and go home, or you can, you know, keep plugging away. So Yeah. Persistence. I you know, being spending some time in corporate America, I I can I can just smell the environment that you were just referencing?
And, you know, obviously, in small business, we try to stay away from those things and and we try to be a little more family oriented or do the things that, like, see our people and value them. It's tough. It's tough as a business owner. Like, I'm sure everybody listening today has experienced the CEO seat of your experience. Right?
Like, we're They thought that they had delivered or done something Wolfe, or maybe just over sought something and and didn't and had this person leave or cause a ruckus or or an email or whatever.
And so I think it's actually a learning point on the reverse of the corner, not only of what your actions were, but the actions of the CEO and what it caused you to want to do, I think it's actually also a learning point for us here as we learn because know, we're we can't be all things to all people, and we're definitely not all perfect, especially the bigger the business gets, the the more money that's handled and managed, sometimes people make moves that are greedy or cause strife.
You know, it's just money makes people do weird stuff. So I appreciate the story because it it brings light on both sides. I would hope. What's, like okay. We're talking about good decisions, bad decisions. How do you make decisions now? You're in a brand new industry. It's not anything like videos. You've got a lot of decisions to make, some that are pretty weighty because you're, you know, making some large investments.
I'm sure the the folks that I know in the hemp or cannabis industry are making some substantial investments. How do you process a decision today? Making good decisions, of course. Like, what's your secret formula? Well, first is to realize that I know nothing. That's the first step. Learn it all. Right? 35 years of video industry. I came into this, you know, just 2 years of research. Learning as much as I possibly can before I open the doors. And it's still a lot of learning.
Yeah. How do I make decisions? I ask everybody for their input. I and I feel like, you know, captain Bacard on the on the on the starship of the enterprise where where he he he's he's out of options and he goes, suggestions. Alright. So we're going to not what he said, but, yeah, it was one of those You know? And and we're, you know, it's the industry is so new that I'm I'm try I try to put myself in as many roundtables as possible.
As a matter of fact, today, there's a there's a a roundtable I'm going to in person in Austin, where we just try and learn from each other and help each other. You know, Ram Doss said it best, in my opinion, we're all just walking each other home. Now now, absolutely, there's gonna be competition in the marketplace. Absolutely. Some of these people at the roundtable are my competitors.
But, you know, if we can if we can learn and share and or help them, you know, to be better business people, you know, to, you know, be more transparent about their lab reports or, you know, whatever it is, better it is can be for the entire industry. So it it's honestly, it's just learning as much as I can, leaning on the people that are on my team, which are the best, and I love them so incredibly much because the company wouldn't be where we are without my team.
And and others in in other roundtables, you know, that are in the industry. And attending, you know, events all the time and learning from as many people as possible. Yeah. Yeah. Being a learner at all versus a no at all. And then, of course, like you said, just you know, putting yourself around other people, I think is a great decision making tool.
I liked even how you said just being able to be around specific people who maybe you wouldn't naturally think would be a fit, like a competitor or someone who maybe has even, you know, done something that could potentially harm your business even.
I think that's, when you have freedom in your mind, like Chaz abundance, and freedom and and humility is really when all the things that I was just hearing you pour on us, man, there is a you can operate at a whole another level when you have those things. Would you agree? Yeah. I I'm I'm gonna work. We're trying. We're trying. That's all we can do. Right? Yeah. Exactly. Well, Paul, I got I got my first speed round question coming at you.
It's around KPIs, and so I know that you're in a new industry and you're still learning all, but I gotta know if you could only pick one thing to track. Chaz would it one thing to track? Which KPI is the most important to you in that that business? It would be sell through. K. Give me a little bit more. Sell sell through. So we sell 99% of our sales right now are two stores. K. And they sell to their to their customers. We we have, you know, a retail web site presence as well.
And and that's definitely where our big growth is gonna happen, but Yeah. It's it's our product selling into the stores and then selling through to the customer. That's really where I see see the success. And I do a lot of research and formulation myself to make sure that as the end user. If I was the end user and I bought this product, would it be something I was happy with?
And, you know, that's why it takes us, like, 6 months to do R and D on one one vape or one gummy or whatever because we want that sell through to be a 100%, not Right. 50%. If The sell through is 50%. We've done a horrible horrible job. Yeah. Well, you've you've got waste. And then in more than that, you're not delivering what what's wanted in the marketplace. Exactly.
Yeah. We're just pushing our people, and they're taking it for whatever reason, you know, relationship or they want the coolest to do thing or whatever, but then we're stuck with it. So we re we recently just went through a recall because one of the cannabinoids that we've been using was deemed by the DEA to be controlled one substance. So, you know, we could have either stuck the store with those products, or we could have taken them back and giving them store credit and company credits.
And and that's what we did. I think Bert, don't get me wrong. Get it was the right thing to do. Yeah. Love that. Love that a little slide in there of a good decision with a vendor or your people. It, it's always it's always good just to make things right. Even if the scale is tipped, I would much rather have the scale tipped where I don't owe anybody.
Yeah. That's where value that's that's where you you just you just overbring the value, even if it's in a situation where you're trying to make good on a on something you can still bring value by tipping the scale. What Paul, what book would you recommend or maybe a business resource for someone who's trying to grow today? Met Stephen Covey back in 1994. And he had just come out with his books, 7 habits of highly successful people.
That's my top 2. The I think, really, the number one is the 4 Agreements. Okay. Yeah. Quick book. Haven't haven't heard anybody talk about that one in a minute. What's what's your takeaways from that one? You know, keep your word. Don't take anything personally. I forgot what the other 2 were. But it's basically the golden rule, which sounds simple enough in the book is really, really small. I think it's maybe 50, 75 pages, but the concepts are so broad.
And have such sweeping ramifications for everybody that you do business with, whether it be the dry cleaner or the the the letter carrier that delivers our mail, or your coworkers. Yep. So, you know, I would love to say something like how to win friends and influence people or, you know, whatever, but it's that one. And then and then Steven Covey's 7th habit. Yeah. Well, those those all three of those or any in that in that realm are are great classics.
I mean, classics, but they'll live on is my point. They're not going anywhere. That's for sure. What do you think about intentionally networking or master mining with other entrepreneurs. You kind of already mentioned roundtables that you're trying to get around other people, competitors even. What are what are some of the other value points that you'd say to maybe someone listening who hasn't gotten around some other folks like that. Share the knowledge you have.
It's my personal opinion that if I don't share the knowledge that I've received or read or learned or gained by attrition, then I shouldn't have that knowledge in the first place.
Yep. And I know, you know, well, obviously, clearly, I'm not gonna, you know, give company trade secrets or proprietary information, but anything, any knowledge that we can do to further, especially the hemp and cannabis industry with that because lawmakers are so far behind the curve, and this really is medicine for 1,000,000 and 1,000,000 to people and, you know, just just share and and you'll be amazed at what comes back to you.
Yeah. But you don't don't do it with the intention of I'm gonna share this because I wanted to come back to me times 3 or whatever. That's the wrong intention. Do it because you wanna help others. That's right. Yeah. It's interesting. I I have a a short little interview. I don't I don't I don't grill too too hard, but I make a big point when someone's interested in joining our 7 and a figure mastermind is that right there that it's this is not networking.
This is not you trying to, you know, I don't know, make another make another 1,000,000, although All the businesses that I'm aware of a lot of even our podcast guests are growing their businesses. Like, that's that's fine. They're growing their connections. They're growing their network. All these things are totally fine. But it's are you showing up to serve? Are you showing up to give? I'm totally good with you getting. Trust me, there's gonna be plenty of value at the table. That's my job.
As the facilitator or as the person gathering the Kings to make sure that I'm putting the right people at the table where I know for sure there's gonna be value. But you better believe it. If I'm gonna give you an invite, you better bring the value. And I'll be I'll be looking to take. You better be looking to give today. Yeah. Which is exactly what we're even doing right way more fun giving way more fun giving. It really is. I was just talking about this.
Yesterday, actually, I had an old podcast guest from, like, I don't know, probably 6, 7 months ago. And, we caught up on a real estate transaction we were both looking at, and I was helping him with some thoughts on some short term rental stuff, and we're going back and forth. And And this this idea of, you know, like, outgiving each other. I've got a couple couple of guys in the groups that are or that are local here to Kansas City.
And, it's like it's like, I get a gift, or we go to lunch, and I'm trying to, like, hurry up quick and take the tab. Like, there's all these, like, little tick knickknack things that we're trying to do to like, out give each other, you know, and, so I I just think it's it's just another game. Like you said, it's another level of the game. It's no longer about you know, what can I get? But it's it's like, how can I have fun today by serving? Joe Vitale taught me something really Wolfe.
Really amazing, actually. He said if you make a a game out of giving, it makes it way more fun. So what I do is I took one of his I took one of his his his ideas. And when I'm out and about, not in an affluent place, but like a Walgreens or a CVS or, you know, like, a, like, you know, a place that everybody already goes to, Just stash something. Stash either a dollar or, you know, just think about how how excited you are when you find a quarter on the floor, which never happens. Right?
You're always selling pennies or whatever. But, you know, $5. And then so, you know, when I lapse with the dollars, I'll go above and do, like, a 50 or a 100. And what I'll do is I'll stick it where inside the packaging where they won't see it until they get home and they open it up. Like, oh my god. You know, is this real? And that and that is just so gratifying because you never know where it's gonna land.
Yeah. Yeah. You don't actually get the gratification of seeing them enjoy it, but you know it's happening. And at some point, somewhere. Yeah. You know, you help somebody. Even a dollar, you know, hell. I would learn from a dollar right now. Yeah. Yeah. It's the joy of it's really not the amount. It's the joy, even for the receiver. It's really good. What what do you what do you think about?
I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna give you a word of obsession, and it's it's my belief that as business owners, we easily fit into this obsessive category and we go all in on the business, and that's how we win. So I love the word obsession, but my question to you is how how do you do that as an entrepreneur in all the other areas of your life? You guys Emily, kids, relationships. Like, how how do we do them both at the same time, Paul? You can't. You you you have to find a balance.
And everybody's balance is gonna be different. So I was married for 22 years, and we found a great balance between our work lives or our careers, our us being together and then our independent selves as well. There's, like, three parts of I in my opinion, those are three important parts because I have my independent self that I value. So I'm in a new relationship now. And before this relationship, It was all about work. I was just obsessing about work.
And I I got into a skyman scot of instructor. I'm a, you know, wingsuit flyer, videographer, and and I got into an accident, and I had to end I'm a career in 2019. And skydiving and my work slash passion were the only things I like to do in in in the world. So, like, I would be at the I would be at the drops on every weekend, you know, do 7 rate jumps on both days and then go balls to the wall Monday through Friday. And now that that's gone.
And I haven't re I I can't do any adrenaline sports because I have, like, 4 fuse discs. So My obsession really has been about the company and making better products and, you know, tweaking these little things to make it better. And we Christian and I have been dating since August now it's all about finding that balance again. I mean, we'll find it. It's just you you have to, you know, it takes time. Yeah. Yeah. And try not to bring the work into the homes.
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I I I have to I have to spar with you a little bit here because I agree with you. The word usage of balance is and it's an icky word to me. And in your situation that you're describing, It's like you have to find the obsession with the new relationship where you have to find the obsession with your individual time. And so what that looks like I don't have it perfect by any means at all. I'm still, like, working this out.
That's, like, literally why I bring it up on, like, on the pod because I wanna hear people's opinions on it. Is like, okay. So my individual time at, like, it's that's my morning routine. I need to be obsessed with my morning routine because that's me time. Right? Like, whether that's my breath work or whether that's my workout or whether that's my bible reading or whether that's my you know, my work on my own. Like, I'm like, I get to work in the morning. I kinda like that sometimes.
Or that could be time with my wife and and date night, and I off my phone, and I'm I'm away from work. Or if I'm I'm all in, the door shut. They know not to bother, and I'm, like, zoned in. Like, I think I think we're saying the exact same thing. Yeah. But but to me, that's like, I'm all in in all areas. Yes. As opposed to this, like, to take away from one to give to the other. That's not obsession. That's not what what led us to be successful in business to begin with. Right?
I'm taking the lesson from your shutting the phone off Look. Hey. I said that out loud because that was a suggestion for my wife that I'm still learning to do. No. For any entrepreneur listening right now, just keep at it. Right? Keep keep turning the phone. I, like, oftentimes, I'm, like, I gotta turn it over even while I'm, like, look. I have to do the same exact thing. You know, I gotta I gotta turn it over. Otherwise, it's just like, stop. Here's a great one. So when we go out with friends.
What we'll do is we'll take all of our phones and place them in the middle of the table. That's right. That's good. On or off. And then whoever touches their phone first picks up the check for the whole table. That's awesome. Yeah. That's awesome. And in that way, you did. And then you're kind of incentivized to eat something expensive and not touch your folks. And and stare at each other because it might be a stare off for a while. Oh, yeah. You you got everybody winds up.
Some somebody winds up always getting their phone because it's an emergency somewhere. Exactly. I love it. I love it. I got one last question here for you, Paul. Are you ready? I'm ready. If you had a chance to whisper in the younger Paul's ear, What would you say? Don't be so angry. I carried the anger with me for so long, and it permeated everything I did. It permeated every single decision I made. And I really regret a lot of the decisions I've made because of the anger.
Because when you're not in therapy and you don't talk about the things have happened to you in your life and bring them up voluntarily, they come out. It'll either come out in therapy, it'll come out some other way. And my anger towards my parents for doing what they did came out. And I was not a pleasant person a lot of the time. I was just so demanding of people I work with or people I work for or whatever. And I'm just grateful for for my therapist and and trauma therapy, honestly.
Yeah. I'm still in it. Yeah. Yeah. There's I think that there's, really, it's a continuation of becoming the best version of you, letting go of certain things, and accepting fresh beliefs and letting go of even limiting beliefs, but it's like, that's a journey. Like, you just said at the very end there, it's not like you're done. That's just you just reached it this far.
Yep. And and what I have found, whether it's a a therapist or a group of business owners or your spouse, like, there are people in essence around you that that can walk through you, dark walk with you through it. And that that makes it all the sweeter because We're not alone. So which sounds a little cheesy, but it's so true, and everything's always better with friends, I think. I completely agree. Completely agree. Wolfe, how can the listener find you?
Whether whether they're in Texas and can buy your products or maybe they're across the country, how can they find you get connected We're on the web at urbanbudd.com. It's herbanbud.com. I'm also on link, Paul Trout, t r o w e. Perfect. Well, we'll drop all that in the show notes for people easily to connect with you. You've been a storyteller here today, and I've enjoyed listening to stories and the ups and downs of of how you've been successful. So thank you for being vulnerable and sharing.
I think that's the most important part of the journey is to see guys further down the road or gals and be able to know how to bob and weave as we go. So, Paul, thank you for being here. Blessings on your new business. And, thank you for being here and the giving of yourself. I appreciate you helping me on time. Thank you for listening to gathering the Kings today. I hope that you were able to pull out a few nuggets to go apply into your business right away.
More importantly, though, I hope that you're realizing that it takes more to be successful than just being by yourself doing it all on your own, carrying the weight all by yourself. What I have realized, not only in my own journey from multiple businesses in multiple different industries and now interviewing literally over 2 or 300 other very successful 7, 8, and 9 figure business owners is Chaz It's tough to do it alone.
And so gathering the Kings literally exists to bring together successful entrepreneurs. In fact, we are putting together 1000 kings, specifically who are grateful, but not done. We're intentionally assembling kings who fight tooth and nail for their business, family, and communities, and here's what we believe Chaz in the pursuit of excellence in those areas, that it ignites within us the responsibility to govern power and forge a lasting legacy. So if that relates and and resonates with you.
And you know that you need people around you sharp, qualified other very successful business owners. I want you to go to gatheringthekings.com. I want you to take a look at what we're doing and see if it makes sense for you to be part of our pursuit. To 1000 kings. Talk soon.