On today's episode of Gathering the Kings. Entrepreneurs who are having those rock stars and you're pulling them up the hill and you want it more than they do. Stop. Right? Yeah. Hold them accountable. Call them on, you know, call them on the mistakes and see what they do. You are listening to gathering the kings with Chaz Wolfe featuring fellow 7, 8, and even 9 figure business owners who have real battle scars from business and life but have prevailed as the king that they are designed to be.
We welcome high performing entrepreneurs to the stage in order to reveal the reel of the reel. On what it takes to build a assess and how you too can get there. Through this dialogue, you will learn the value of growing your network and surrounding yourself with power players and keys like today's guest. Grab your pen and notebook because we're about to dive in. What's up, everybody? I'm Chaz Wolfe.
Back with you today, gathering the king's podcast, got a special queen here on the stage, Carmen Barrison. How are you today, miss Carmen? I'm impressed you said queen. It was it was fun. I list into some of your podcasts, after being asked to be on your show. And, and I was like, I was like, well, I can get the queen instead of a king today. Exactly. Well, I I say this every single time we have a queen on the stage that, king is not masculine. It's mindset. Chaz?
For today, we will make sure that you're very queenly. Your story is gonna absolutely back up the fact that you're a queen, so I can't wait to get to that But at this level, tell us what kind of business that you're running, and I wanna ask you some high level questions first. I love it. I have a women's empowerment company. And that has multiple branches. And we have a line boutique under it. Then we have four locations. We have a line stories.
That includes my memoir that got published and hit number 1 on Amazon, which was new release, which is awesome. And we have a line of ventures. Which I take clients to Paris and to New York and to ice climbing and to hanging off the cliffs and fun things like that. Wow. Wow. I mean, I can only assume that, you know, I shopping or doing things in Paris, and then ice mountain things are extremely different. But it sounds incredible.
They are, but they're also in extremely similar in Chaz, they both have a sense of aliveness. Right? Yeah. Yeah. And I love I love I always say in, like, wizard thoughts pulling back the curtain. Right? I love taking people and letting them experience fashion week, and showrooms and kind of like, oh, and also the humanness of it, like, really the the glitz and glamour gone.
And I was just actually talking to someone last yesterday about how, like, the supermodels of the world, like, literally Gigi Kendall. I mean, we're talking Carly. And that if you are backstage with them before a runway show in Paris and New York and Milan, they are all taking laxatives. They are all farting It is not funny. It is not what you think of of the super women. Right? Yeah. That's crazy. Fantastic, but it literally is like, oh my gosh. I'm just like them. Right?
And this is empowerment. And the same thing to take women, you know, off of a cliff and have them say hanging 300 feet. Very safe, but on a fraud and stuff like that. Sure. Yeah. Get out of your comfort zone and you realize what you're capable of. And and, yeah, you live. And the same thing within with clothes, you know, I can't tell you the number of women that have come in and are kinda like, you know, I have this and pull back that curtain and walk out, and they are just like, Ready to work.
And they are empowered and they feel beautiful and seen and all the above. Well, I I can't ever say that necessarily, sell I felt beautiful and seen, but I know when I go get a nice button up that's tailored just for me Right. Being 65 long and skinny. Right. I feel sharp. I I come out and it fisked me nice. And so I can only imagine what you're doing, just even with the clothing things, but, You know, it's funny that you say that it's like that human element. We do the same thing.
Gather and the king started as a mastermind group, and so we've got these moments in time where business owners get together. And, of course, we get together over Zoom, and we're talking business strategy, and everybody feels like they have it all together. But then there's these human moments, you know, where you go. Oh, wow. He's just like me or she's just like me. She's struggling with the same things that I am. And you're right.
It's that human perspective of going, and it doesn't actually allow us to lower standard of, like you said, farting and all these other weird things that go behind but but it's like, no. No. They're just like me. I can now empower myself to be like them. Yes. Absolutely. That is so well said. Wolfe, I'm excited to dive in here. Before we do, you obviously are speaking at a level of just you've been doing this for a minute. You're uber successful.
You're, like, exploding with success and joy, and you're helping other people do it. Why are at this level? Do you, like, you're you're still pushing. You're still you're on podcast. You're you're doing the the business thing. Why? What's the bigger picture for you? Oh, I am. I am very much doing it. And I very much work a lot of hours every week. And I do it, though, because I love what I do. I and what I do is I help souls feel alive. I mean, it's as simple as that.
Like and to wake up every day and to do what your were meant to do, right, and to have that benefit is huge. And I think that's one of the biggest things that I've learned with the gray hair is is that I don't do everything. I do what I want to do. And and listen. I mean, that's different Chaz everyone says, you know, there's things that only you can do and learn to delegate. Yes. That's very true. Right? Sure. Yeah. Who says do what you want to do?
Because there is this thing of, I love always saying you shouldn't should on yourself. Don't should on. Right? You do it all the time. I should go to this dinner. I should do this. I should wear this. I should eat this. Right? But the reality is there's so much there there's so much weight and and and fatigue with that. But when you say, what do I want to do? Right? And then why do I want to do it. It's so much power.
And the reality is is to answer your question, I work really, really hard, and I'm very best invested right now because I am doing what I want to do. And what I want to do is daily help women, mainly women, but also men in different capacities. But, you know, really feel alive, seen, confident, powerful, just alive and show, like, show up. Like, this is your this is your human experience. Like, do something with it. Show up. Yeah. I love I love that because that can be defined.
In this case, for women, for you, or for Chaz, as a business owner, helping other business owners, or it could be whatever lays you said human experience. Right? Whatever that means for us. Yes. Show up be be all that you can be be the best version of you can be, reach for the potential, mean, we could probably split it like a 100 different ways here, but, be all that you're designed to be. Does that take or has that taken A certain acknowledgment for you.
For me and my journey, just real quick, I've had to acknowledge the things along the way of like, that's what I made for. And then you press it. You press into it. Or those are the things that I want to do as opposed to the things that I have to do or that I'm the only one that's good at it or whatever. Right. Has that been a journey for you? How do you explain that maybe to other women? Give us some input there?
I think that I think definitely the the first thing that had to happen for me is I had to do stop doing everything I thought would make me happy. Again, that's why I say, shoulding on yourself. I should I love it. I'm stealing it, by the way, just so you know. Oh, good. Go for it. Absolutely. I love it. You know, I should do this college, major in college. I should take this job. I should marry this man. Right? I did a lot of those. And I was really, really, really miserable for a lot of years.
Interesting. It wasn't until I stopped, and I was brave enough to ask why am I doing all this? Like, what do I need? Right? And for me, that's where then my memoir came about of learning to fly. And and that's why I published it was to share, you know, an extended podcast. Yeah. Yeah. The journey of me being able to, in a sense, reclaim my myself, right, and be proud of it and own it versus, versus diminish it. Be like, oh, that's not very good. Know, you should be this, Carmen. You know? Right.
Okay. And and so much of it, I was in survival mode for a long time. My My father left when I was 5, and my mom passed away when I was seventeen. And so I was on my own. And I remember like it was yesterday, when I was standing in the memorial hall looking at my mom's body in a casket. I I remember standing there and thinking, if I start crying, I will wake up fifty years old, a drunk on a park bench, and I would have missed my life. Yeah. Because Wow. I could not.
The It's almost like looking at that wave coming toward me of Oh, yeah. And sadness and despair, and I knew I wouldn't survive I wouldn't survive if I felt. And so I literally was like, I just zipped at my soul. Yeah. Lock it up. Yep. Mhmm. And I was like, you know what? I am gonna make. I'm gonna walk out of here. And she's in heaven. And I'm gonna become a doctor, and I'm gonna make a shitload of money. Sorry. Can I say that on your show? You know, and and I'm gonna need no one.
I'm gonna need no one. And, and that served me in in it served me in that I didn't become Chaz, like, literally mentally lose it. I didn't, turn to lots of drugs and everything else to numb all the pain. Right? I turned to ambition and success to numb the pain, right, and busyness. But finally, at 33, once I had sold my first company, and and done well and and been and on on a beach retired in Hawaii.
I finally, instead of deciding to win the iron man, you know, ironman fight or, you know, whatever next, right, distraction. Right. Yeah. Yeah. I literally was ex and it came from exhaustion. It was like, you were so brave. I was like, I was It was so exhausted. And I knew that also there was this gut knowing that if I kept going, I was gonna end up like my mom with 2 brain tumors. And so sick, and my body was gonna revolt. And Oh, wow. And so I just sat down and I felt it.
And what I thought was gonna destroy me and just sitting in that pain and sitting in all the anger. And then all of a sudden, It's like you start healing. And I was like, oh my gosh. The world is so beautiful, and it's not against me. And I don't have to fight everyone. I don't have to manipulate and and, you know, and just and now, literally in my now third business that I'm in, You know, I manifest. I, I meditate, and there's a lot of magic in my You know?
It's it's really different, and it's so much more fun. So but I could not it's, to your point, Absolutely. It's a journey. It's a absolute journey. I did not just I was not blessed or, you know, the the the the fairy didn't sprinkle me with, like, oh, well, you're gonna live this perfect enlightened life. You know what I mean? Right. You have to sit in the pain. And grow and then and then blossom to Yeah.
I mean, you bring you bring up such a great point, and I love thank you for sharing and just being vulnerable. I think that, whether male or female listening right now, we all have these moments, these mom and the casket wave coming towards us moments, and sometimes we deal with them, in the moment. Sometimes we deal with them later. Knowing what you know now, and then we'll get into some more business for the listener, hang tight here. I I really think this is important.
Do you think if you had dealt with it Yeah. Like you did at 33 on the beach in Hawaii at 17. Right. Do you think that would have changed the trajectory at all? Yes and no. It's a great question. I am I'm a risk taker. I'm fearless. I I'm an entrepreneur throwing through. It's just how I'm wired. Right? And now and I think that's innate to my DNA. So What what I have done? What I've done with with less regrets? Yes. A few less divorces a few, yeah.
But you had some casualties along the way because you didn't deal with it. Yeah. I haven't had dead bodies. Not not literally. Okay. Yeah. We're good. Yes. It would have been a little it would have been a lot less painful. But I don't think it's not like it's not like I think if I would have dealt with it in a healthy way, I would miss out on success. No. I would've had just as much success. It's you do not have to be coo you don't have to be the villain.
That's what also business to now come back to business. Right? It used to be that CEO had to be the Steve Jobs. Right? You you're not anymore, and it's not you don't have to be that person to have success, and you never did have to be that person. Yeah. That's right. I was just talking about this actually with my team. Like, the dad and the king's team, about a week or so ago, and and what kept coming up was this phrase of, you know, basically becoming successful in a different way.
Or you know, in essence, what you're describing, becoming successful, but not how you think you have to. Right. And and I liken it even back to my sales career before I was a business owner, is I I really took pride in being the best, the number one guy, but that no one had any They couldn't tell me that I cheated or that I stole an account or that I wasn't the one willing to give, you know, accounts back to people because I was just abundant. You know?
And there's this different way of operating, which you've alluded to, and and just something very similar.
My team and I were just discussing about a week ago, which Chaz you can be this, you know, this uber successful individual, business owner, businesswoman, businessman, you know, mom pop you know, sibling, whatever whatever title we wanna give ourselves in in life and all these different relationships and and and circles that we run-in, but you can do it in this way that actually brings, like, wholeness. Right? Absolutely.
And you you and said something really key is that it's an abundant mindset. And Yeah. And that's what we Wolfe turn. That is a hard, like That's real. That's real. That is Your hands open or it's closed. It is it is very and you either approach everything, and I approach life from a scarcity. Right? The world is against me. I have to fight everyone. Nothing's good. It's gonna happen unless I make it happen even from a manipulating way. Right? Sure. Yeah. Now I approach the world.
The world is beautiful and abundant, and there is more opportunity than I can ever make good on. Right? And you still it's still just as much work. Right? Yep. It's, and but you it's it's a mindset. You're absolutely right, and it's very real. So Yeah. I love that you brought that up. Yeah. That's huge for business. That's at your, a 100% right. I would agree with you on on the mindset, and then and then you have to remind yourself. Or at least I do. I have to remind myself sometimes that, hey.
Like, you know, we don't wanna operate in scarcity here Oh, yeah. Because I think it's something that we have to kinda daily choose or weekly choose at least. Alright. So tell me about so early on, you you obviously sold a company at 33. You you were successful. You've got multiple companies now. So Right. Pick from whatever situation you'd like to, but I'd like to know in one of these businesses Yeah.
Before it was doing a 1,000,000 in revenue, I wanna know a good decision that you made Chaz you can share that was practical Chaz maybe the listener can write down, take a note of, and something that they can implement into their business as well. Oh, well, the first decision is going for it. I mean, seriously Chaz simple as that. Right? But I think the second decision is, hire, personal, or if you wanna call them executive assistant, hire an assistant.
I am It is so when I was first starting GP Synergy, my first company in the tech industry, someone said to me, your first hire needs to be a personal assistant. And I literally I was like, I I'm sorry. I have no revenue. I have no clients, and you're telling me how an expense of a personal assistant. Right. And, and they said, well, very quickly, you will have something to run to the post office. You'll have, you know, you'll have a lease to look at.
You'll have You'll have a e you know, you need a proof reader. You need this. You'll have stuff. Stuff. Late stuff. Right? And, and I did. And I swear it is one of the my secrets to success is that Yeah. I am, and that first personal assistant you know, after a couple years, grew into this role and getting into this role. And when I sold the company, she was named CEO.
Wow. And it makes sense when you think about it, you have someone who's joined at your hip, who's hearing, hearing everything, has complete visibility until almost everything, I mean, pretty much. Right? And so they you literally are trying to clone yourself. Right? Yeah. And so that person when you're moving on, of course, they can step in. Right? It just it makes sense. And, and the really good ones are, you know, They're ambitious, and they're different than you, but guess what?
As a company evolves, it needs a different leader. Yeah. Sure. It's okay, you know, for that person not to be not to be your clone and personality. Right? Because they're they're not an entrepreneur. Right? Right. Also, let's I mean, you know, you can talk about that. Here's this is the CEO that's needed to launch a company. This is a CEO once it's in maintenance mode. Like, I am a horrible CEO in maintenance mode.
I, oh, I make a mess of everything, right, because I don't know how to do maintenance mode. I'm a creator. I like to create And so that's why then a line of interest came about. A line stories came about. Right? We're opening out in Salt Lake City. We're going out of state. Right? I have to keep creating. And now and I've and then I surround myself with people who are the maintenance, you know, who who are amazing managers and directors and executives in the maintenance mode. Yeah. A 100%.
I think the you the the the the serial entrepreneur ish that you've described not only do we get bored in maintenance mode, but we it's like, it doesn't fulfill the crazy in Wolfe. Like, there's a certain level of crazy where it's like Oh, yeah. Yes. I wanna go back to beating my head against the wall Oh, totally. For a brand new thing. Right? Totally. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. But I'll take the beating of the head on the wall over, you know, every like, everything is going great.
I actually kind of oddly. I think a lot of entrepreneurs and this is probably good for the for the listener here. Even though they haven't hit a 1,000,000 in revenue yet, they have this same mentality. A lot of entrepreneurs do where it's like, We look for problems. Sometimes we create problems Oh, yeah. Just to keep our Wolfe entertained. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. No. And I think that's where if your goal isn't big enough or and and as soon as you start meddling, you need to create.
You need to have a bigger goal, or you need to excuse yourself, and you should get out. Yeah. That's so good.
Okay. So just right on that, before we leave this good decision topic, what you just said there as far as, like, kinda acknowledging that moment of like, when you begin to get a little restless, a little, like, little meddling going on, little creating of problems, what would you say for the person listening right now who, again, business isn't very big yet, and maybe they've got the the meddling. What I heard you just say is the goal is not big enough. Yeah. Expand that just a little bit.
I'm I'm a I'm a business owner. I'm in the trades or I'm in marketing, whatever it is. I'm doing 5, $600,000 a year. I'm starting to get a little antsy. Yep. Fill in the blank. Well, I think I can think of a lot of entrepreneurs who were the best technician or the best skilled trade, right, and before when they're working for someone. And they said I wanna stop making everyone else money, and I wanna make my own money. Right? Right. And so they they do Chaz. And But that was their goal.
Their goal was really just to work for themselves and feed their kids. Right? And so the the if they're honest, they might have said, oh, yeah. The company is this, but really, their goal has already been met. If you're at 5 or 6, you know what I mean? You're under that 1,000,000, but guess what? You're profitable or you're Right. You know, you have the revenue coming in. You're feeding your family. So your goal needs to grow. So now it's time to sit back and say, what do you actually want?
And I call it moonshot goals. Like, it's literally shooting for the moon. Right? Yeah. And so what is that huge audacious hairy big goal? Right? And is it you know, like, for me years ago, when I had a I bought a line, it was an established boutique here in Denver, one store 26100 Square Feet in a strip mall, which now is called Lifestyle Center. I just learned that. So in a Lifestyle Center, So anyhow, we're all evolving. Yeah. Apparently so. I just learned something. There you go.
It's not called a strip mall anymore. It's called a lifestyle center. So so anyhow, but it's, you know, it's and and they the owners were your quintessential boutique owners. They had an amazing night. They loved go to market. It was a hobby for them. It was a paid hobby. Right? And, and they were gonna close it because it really wasn't profitable, and they were had moved to Europe.
And And, and so I bought it, but I bought it really as, a way to meet other cool women in Denver who wanted to show up and not just be like, here's my sling bag because it wasn't about a label. It was about being casually chic, you know, putting put together, but not being fussy and and having style and showing up in the world. And so I thought, if I love this, someone else is gonna love this. And so, and I'm gonna meet other women. And I have, and that's what's been incredible.
But so my goal was very small. Does that make sense? And Yeah. And they did 300,000. The 1st year, we did 700,000. The next year, we had 1,400,000. Right? And so when we hit that, I had to pause and I had to go, what is my next goal? Because I've done it. Right? Yeah. You quadrupled. I know some And I could say I have now, you know, I think we had maybe a 1000 customers and, like, 200.
I mean, there's there's a lot of women I vacation with now that I've met through my VOTE right, just because we would have never met life. And it's such a cool, hub. And so I had to say what's my next goal, and it was really interesting because I literally set it at a party because I was standing at a party and, and someone said something like, oh, you know, they're like, oh, you're at the point, you know, maybe Nordstrom will buy you. And I was like, no. I'm gonna buy Nordstrom.
And they're like, they kinda joke. And then I was sitting there, like, you're serious. And I was like, oh, I'm dead serious. 100%. And this is when I was, you know, 26100 square feet, one little store in a suburb of Denver. Right? Right. But I was like, that's my moon shot goal. I'm not gonna get bought by Nordstrom. I'm going to buy Nordstrom or compete with them and take them out. Does that make sense? Yeah. And that's an audacious, hairy, big goal. Right? Yeah. And, and now we're on our way.
You know? Yeah. Yeah. I I love I love the transformation that you just took us through because it's so true. It can go from feeding my family Yep. Purchasing a little boutique. Let me see what I can do with this. Let me just meet a couple of ladies Yeah. To, you know, obviously, all the relationships that you've done you know, life with have actually created your other companies, actually.
Yep. And and so not only has that been an expansion of the original goal now into bigger goals, But what you just said is, you know, obviously, I laugh, not not at you, but in like, wow. You know, you buying Nordstrom. Wow. You know, like, the the audacity that you have to say that. But you're right. We have to have those moments. And even if we chuckle at ourselves Oh, totally. And this is a thing. I couldn't if someone would tell me the plan, I didn't have a plan.
I didn't have a business plan to do Chaz. And and this is where you don't know how to tell everyone Right? But you have to have it yourself, and you have to it has to be something actually that you want to. It's not, again, the should goal. It's not like the answer you're supposed to get. Right? Because it could have also been, let's say I wasn't, didn't want the business goal. Right? But now that I was fading my family, it could have been, like, Oh my gosh.
You know, now I wanna co create with a designer. Right? I wanna I wanna, or I want to, started charity for wealthy women who I help people who are struggling and getting jobs and dressing and stuff like that. Does that make sense? It didn't but it had to you have to have a new goal because, you know, you have to realize, wow, my first goal I achieved. And maybe I achieved in 3 months. Maybe I achieved it faster than I ever thought possible. Well, then pause. Right.
And figure out what is the next thing that gets you excited? Yeah. Yeah. And then go for it. If you don't have that next thing, what I have found is that it's either that or it's basically, like, accepting average. That's it seems a little harsh. It is. We've we've heard these things that either either growing or you're declining. And so even though it feeds my family, I've I've reached my goal. It's it's good.
Anything that I've ever had my hand to, the second that I'm in coast mode or in maintenance mode, like we talked about, personally, as creators, as these high driving entrepreneurs. Yeah. It it just it just doesn't work. I I can't be in that in that in that, that realm.
And so I guess the encouragement here for the listener before we move on is just Chaz, first off, acknowledge that if this is if if you're like this, if you're like me and Carmen, that'll you don't don't don't don't meddle and create problems. Yep. But in all seriousness, sit down and be proactive about, you know, moving out that goal or creating some some Chaz here where you've got this ginormous target around something that you don't probably even believe, but it's okay. It's okay.
We need we need to have it. We need to have it written down, and we need to probably go after it. What what would you add to that? Oh, yeah. What I was just gonna add was I think it took me a while to realize though that I hadn't, let me say it differently. For a little bit, when I started getting bored, right, I thought maybe I've lost my edge. Maybe I was a sprinter. I just had this one good drive, and now I'm actually I'm a phony. I'm an imposter. I'm really not capable of anything more.
And I'm not capable of running this business. And this is the that was the Chaz went, no. I'm not capable of maintaining painting a business. Sure. I was meant to create. Yep. That's good. Chaz because I think I got stuck there for a while. And I was really hard on myself. And I was kinda like, you know, and I felt like I couldn't say to anyone. I'm kind of over it, right, or I'm kinda bored. And I'm not saying you said that too, you know, maybe your direct worker bees, right, right there?
Like, well, if you're over it, I'm over it. But the a this is what's interesting. Even if you don't say it, they feel it. Oh, 100%. Right. So but there's nothing wrong with you. You just weren't created to maintain a business. It's right. So good. Yes. Or run a business. You're Yeah. It's you just gave permission to 100, if not thousands of entrepreneurs to go. Ah, yes. That's how I feel because I I've I've those exact moments that you just described, I feel. And you're right.
We feel like this imposter syndrome sometimes that pops in and maybe it's not who I'm designed to be, but you're a 100% right. It just means that there's another level, and you can still be in that business. You just need that next layer of entrepreneur or integrator or COO. However, you wanna label this individual or team. That can, can that can play that maintenance maintenance role or growth role, but in a different trajectory, it's not the creator role. Okay. Let's flip the script, Carmen.
Tell me about a bad choice you made Chaz was just, you know, fist on the paw, you know, palm on your forehead going, I have made so many. It's not even funny. Right? I think everyone Chaz, but and it's interesting because I think all of the bad decisions, are all rooted. And when I am reacting on a fear, or control. And I love I love to pause and and start there at 1st there because It really is any time that I'm because it's a reaction and it's a it it's not it's not strategic.
It's creative and it's not kind. And I I can't believe if you would have known the twenty year old, if you would have ever told her that the forty eight year old would have been using the word kind in a business podcast. Right. I would have thrown up. Okay? I I I am an ambitious tenacious, adventurous, fierce person, but I have learned the power of kindness. And so every time that I have not been kind, and I have been reacting out of control and fear.
It has gone horribly wrong to the point of you know, losing a phenomenal team member. Right? I mean, truly, like, I can look back and say, This was the conversation where there was a fork in the road, and I was never able to recover him or her. And, to, you know, to, even just personally and, you know, relationships with relationship with my you know, daughter, child Chaz I'm like, oh, that was bad. If there's any way to rewind that, you know.
So, I mean, I can lose lots, like, I mean, for boutique owners, please, please, please, do never put one on the floor like Europe. I tried it. I thought it was brilliant It doesn't work because guess what? Americans are used to seeing what's available.
And if they only see extra smalls in the floor, they assume you don't carry larges, which I pride myself in carrying larges in size 10s and twelves, right, from book you know, worst mistake was, thinking that I was my story was brilliant enough that I could spend you know, less than a year, and I wrote this phenomenal story. And I found an editor and I thought it'd be published, and it was published 12 years later. Once I learned the writing, right, I had a phenomenal story.
I was a horrible writer. There's a very big difference. Now I could've had someone ghostwrite it, but I wanted to learn to write. Yeah, I have made, oh, not knowing what cash flow is. Okay. That was a really, really, really bad mistake. In in lightness on the cash flow. Give us a story. This is a good one. Yes. I mean, I made so many mistakes. So, yeah. You know, I, obviously, we can all relate to that. I I appreciate your vulnerability around relationships because I think if You're right.
Like, the the twenty year old version of yourself may maybe a little, you know, like, confused with the word kind. But really, what it is is it's it's maturity of relationship. It's maturity of communication. It's it's not being so urgent and so deadline oriented or, as you're saying, fierce about your targets, that you realize that there's other humans involved. Yeah. Yeah. You realize the sum is really gr greater than the parts. Right?
And Yeah. And if you if you wanna be an independent consultant, fine. You can plow over everyone, right, except for the clients and be successful. Right? Yeah. If you want a team and you want a company and, you know, Organization just Chaz Latin for organism. It's a living thing. Right? If you want a living thing, you can't kill it in getting to the And I used to. I used to power everyone in anything to get to. And then I was like, we won. And it's like, no. Nobody was there with you.
No. Is there with me? Yeah. So it was, you know, that's my most painful mistakes. Right? The other ones are transactional and growth and industry and stuff like that. But mean, if I could have known that now and that's another reason why, you know, someone said learning to fly my memoir, should be required reading for all in all business schools. Because, and I I agree because if I would have listened to someone and approach business differently. I, again, have a lot less regrets.
And a lot more success. Because the people I didn't honor and I didn't respect were the valuable people. Right. The worker bees put up with me because they were getting enough from me. The equals of mine, when I didn't treat them like an equal, Chaz a human equal. Right? Right. Exactly. They were gone, and that was a that's a really big loss to a business. Yeah. Yeah. You know, the Yeah. That's it's just really, really good perspective.
I think that even, you know, I hope that your book does become required reading. But even if it does, I I can see myself at 20. I probably you at 20 also. Maybe there's a twenty five year old or even, you know, someone listening right now that's that's hearing us talk about this. And even if you and I had heard us talking about this in our twenties Right. Would we have listened would we have had the perspective I don't know. I don't think I would have Chaz the confidence. That's the difference.
I don't think I would have had the self confidence not to have the need to prove myself. Right? Oh, yeah. So aggressive. But what I would have everyone just told me, be kind, be this, but no one actually actually said, okay. Wait a minute. If you want the rock stars, if you want use, how do you want to be treated? Right? And would you put up with this? And if I think someone would have said that to me, I would have been like, That makes sense. Yeah. Chaz makes sense. Like, wait a minute.
I need to pause, you know, before I just pounce Yeah. Yeah. Because the use and the eyes of the world don't wanna be under the thumb or controlled or manipulated or No. Or any of Chaz, not that we're trying to do those things to the people who aren't like us. Right. But it's just a different profile, and so we're providing something different for those profiles than we would be for someone that would be more like us. And you're right. That's the fastest way to drive a driver away.
Yep. Yep. We need we need drivers. We can't be the only one. The example that you gave there of of racing all the way to the finish line, and, hey, we made it. And then being by yourself, I think that we can all relate that to a degree, you know, whether it's been, you know, some of the holidays with edible arrangements for me, we get done. And I'm the only one at the end, like, that is still standing, even though I I was up for 4 days, everybody else is dead.
It's like, we made it, but but but Was it worth it? You know? You gotta you gotta be able to really take care of people along the way, I think, is is the number one thing here. Yes. Wanted to give you just a quick quick opportunity here before we transition to the speed round. Is there some sort of a discipline or a process that you have now when making decisions. We talked about you making decisions early, good and bad. What about now, this uber successful profile?
How does how does this happen nowadays? I don't make any decision then, Silo. You know, we're too big. And big, I mean, we only still, like, with a line 20 some employees. You know what I mean? But but still, we have 4 stores. We have 18,000 customers. We, you know, but we are too big. I don't make a decision. Right? I I And also we've grown to the point that, like, our CFO, I mean, she came from Janice, our COO.
We have I have really I have great team members, right, And so I I don't, you know, people laugh at me all the time. Our CFO's husband, literally, we were out to dinner. And I looked at her and I was like, can I do this? And he looked at me and he goes, looked at my boyfriend. He goes, doesn't she own the company? And I was like, oh, I don't make a move without her because there's an honor and there's a respect. Oh, yeah. It really is. Like, I and I don't I don't need I have that confidence.
I don't need to prove I'm in charge or I own the company. Of course, I own the company. Right? You know, That's I don't have to prove that. So I really don't. I mean, there's times I don't make a decision without my assistant. I'm like, can I do I mean, I pause and ask her? You know, I mean, because she's managing up to me. And she's like, you know, wait. You're kinda packed here, and I'm like, Thank you. You know what I mean? Like, I ask people.
I ask all the time, and I I have a practice of encouraging my team to manage up, manage me. Communicate, rumble with me. I love that from Renee Brown's dare to lead, rumble, that term of rumbling, bravely, confidently, respectfully, Yes. Trust rumbling. And and and we are a team member. So that's the biggest practice that I will I I consciously and intentionally do on a daily basis. Yeah. Yeah. That's incredible. I think that you're right.
And and for entrepreneur listening right now who most likely, they don't have that healthy rumble. They probably got some rumblings. But it's probably more of a of a challenge of, you know, a young, person on their team that is unbridled. They don't know how to handle it. How how would you suggest the listener right now if they wanna they walk away. I have this too. I Yeah. Of course. Yeah. I was like, wait a minute. I don't I I mean, we're still small enough.
It's not like I got this insulated bubble. Right? I still, so all of our stylists, I don't have any store managers. Because I don't hire anyone who has to be managed. So from a from an organizational strategic perspective, I've kinda solved it right away Chaz if you need to be I tell people this. If you need to be managed and told when to get to work and when to go home and when this is the wrong company for you. Right? Because I won't do it. I'll just fire you. You're done.
You're gonna be done very fast. Right? But what, and so with that, I do give them this I expect, and we all we all react even the twenty year olds. I, you know, I I go I set the frame. I frame it. I set the expectations. And then I trust they're gonna do that. And I when they don't do it, when there is a miss, I pause and I invest in them. Invest time in them. And I pause and I sit and I sit down and I have coffee with them, and I go, you are better than this. This is what I know about you.
This is the reality. And the minute they start spinning it, I go, don't bullshit a bullshitter. I am the queen of spin. You cannot spin to me. Do not tell me you had this and this. I I've seen through all of it. Right? Yeah. So either we're gonna have a real conversation right now or I'm done investing. And every single time, they either coach them up or out. They either go, you know, screw you and walk out the door. Great. I'm done. That was easy. I'm No more. Not worth investing in.
Or leap, huge leaps. Now do they go backwards? Sure. We all do. That's a human journey. Right? Yeah. But it really is. They leave. And I I have these people on my team, and they're like, how do you have these phenomenal independent driven, you know, just team members who are in their twenties. And I'm like, because I expect things of them, but I also support and coach them, and I believe in them. I really do. It goes back to that heart and kindness. I actually really believe in them.
And I think and I and I pause and I cement when that twenty year old who maybe didn't have the maturity to handle client situation Wolfe, has the insight on how to post something or maybe a line we need to be carrying. And I cement then. I go, you are valuable, and you just brought this to the team. And they did for real. Right? Now what I get to bring to them is some coaching on maybe how to handle and finesse and how to have a little more maturity. Right?
But, but and I don't pull people up the hill, by the way. Entrepreneurs who are having those rock stars and you're pulling them up the hill and you want it more than they do. Stop. Right? Yeah. Hold them accountable. Call them on, you know, call them on the mistakes and see what they do. Yeah. Exactly. So, I mean, I think I think they could just hit pause. We could stop probably the whole thing right now, and they'd just be, I mean, writing notes for days.
But in all seriousness, if you're listening right now, hit the pause button, go back. Probably just to the beginning. But the the last 3 minutes have been incredible. I wanna transition to the speed round. First question is this for you, Carmen. We take your entire business conglomerate. Yep. We dwindle it all the way down into only one thing that you could track What would you choose to track forever and ever? Right now, right now, I answered it as right now. I would check sell through.
So it's it's very very logistical. It's very quantitative. It's literally sell through on a product in our store, etcetera, because we do have 4 physical locations. And, you know, and that has the most liability, and I would track that. K. Great. And what book would you recommend for a six figure business owner just getting started? Oh, good to great. It's, it's the oldest, right, Jim Collins, but it and I think a lot of new entrepreneurs that have missed it, right, it is still still applicable.
Right. Right. You know, it's I, you know, yeah. So, so go back to good to great. And, yes. That's okay. I'm I'm talking. It's our speed rock. No. It's such a Exactly. It's okay. It's such it's it is a it is It is one of the classics, and it does get overlooked, I think, a bunch. But I use phraseology from that book. Almost every single week. You do? Right seat, right bus. You know? Yeah. I mean, you you name it. It is very applicable to the building of business in today's environment.
So Yes. What, what do you think about intentionally networking or master mining with other entrepreneurs? I I think it's phenomenal. I mean, I I believe in collaboration, I do not think I'm the smartest person in the room. And I love the power of insight and lessons and everything like that. I do a lot of master money right now thankfully with my team just because it has grown to that level and that caliber. But at Absolutely.
It is every chance I get, you know, it's so funny when I go to, New York market or Paris market, I will grab you know, this phenomenal, owner from another store out in Charlotte or, you know, what I mean for LA. And I'm like, Wait in my best conversations are right there just just and I dive right in or with a designer. So I'm I believe in Master Mining. It's huge. Yeah. I love that. Okay. Operational question. If you only had 1 hour each week, this is not on your list, by the way.
This is a secret question. You only had 1 hour each week to operate your business. What would you do in that 1 hour to successfully do what you do now? Oh, that's easy. I'd call clients. I'd call clients. It's my favorite thing that I do. So when we have when when either, you know, a new client walk in and and does a larger than average sale, or maybe someone who's been shopping has a, you know, four times the normal sale. I pick up the own, and I call them.
And I say, you know, we have 4 locations now. Right? So, obviously, I'm not in the stores and I'm really not the things going on. So I pick up the phone. And I just literally call them and I go, hey, this is Carmen, you know, I own a line. Thank you for shopping local and just Thank you. I just want you to have my name, my phone number, you know, but I also just really want to tell you how important it is. Right? For me as a business owner to have your support in Utah Shop Local. Right?
And it's been it is by far It's that Elsa eightytwenty rule, right, in 1 hour, how many clients could I call a lot? Because it's a short conversation. It's not a strategy not a long session. It's a quick, you know, connect. And those connections, I cannot tell you years later years later. I mean, And there's some people I don't even know who they are. Like, like, I mean, there's some, like, wife of this player. Right?
I mean, like, we're talking like the biggest players in the Wolfe, or I didn't even know I called someone who is a lead singer. I mean, his his husband is the lead singer of, like, one of the biggest fans in America. I mean, you know, cause I don't I don't know who these Wolfe are. I just like, oh, you've shopped. I wanna thank you. Later, they're like, I, literally, that phone call is what differentiated you. Yeah. Don't. I love calling. And I call all of our clients who are also angry.
I per the first thing I said, if you have a client issue, your call, when you hang up or you walk away from that client, your first call better be me or your asses fire. Right? Yeah. I better know about it, and I don't wanna hear about it later. I can fix it, or I wanna lease an at bat that I can fix it. So I call any client who's also had a bad experience personally, and I connect to them.
Yeah. I think that the the the little drop, the connection that you've described here, is is what transcends time or We've we've got this phrase inside of Gathering and the Kings, actually Brianna on my team who you got to meet, came up with it. It's this transcending the transaction. And Chaz moment. So that one, that one's for me now. You can have my shirt and I'll Exactly. The transaction. Because that's exactly what you're talking about.
You're making it about the human, about the relationship, not about necessarily just that one individual transaction, and it matters. Long term, years later, it matters. Last question for you, Carmen. Are you ready? Yep. If you lost at all, what would you do? Oh, I would move to Costa Rica. I almost hit a little bit. I'm not kidding.
So when you're signing leases, right, on 46, like, the one behind me, 46100 square feet, and we have 15,000 square feed of a class retail space that I am personally guaranteeing. Yep. Okay? And that's no problem when you think, okay. One store could fail. Right? Right. But when all four get closed simultaneously with COVID before PDP came out and you don't know what's happening, and I still and no one's waving rent Right? And it's unforeseen. And and and I have all this inventory.
I mean, I literally there was a very real moment, Chaz, where I went I'm going to have to start over. I'm going to have to declare declare bankruptcy. Yep. And, And first, I had a big panic, then I had a really, really big cry. And then I started training. And I was like, okay. So what am I gonna do? And it was a real question. It wasn't a like this philosophical or hypothetical.
It was a very real question that I was and I went, I'm taking my daughter, We're moving to Costa Rica, and I'm gonna open a source school. And it's gonna be phenomenal. I love it. I love it. That Yeah. That moment that you described of of almost utter failure due to COVID, I I remember exactly where I was when I had that exact same feeling. Obviously, being in retail, some of my businesses are in retail as Wolfe. I remember those 1st 3 weeks after the lockdown, and it was like, okay.
Well, Wolfe might have to go a different direction here and, and exploring all different types of options. And so I guess I correlate that, you know, not only just to your story, obviously, it's the same moment in time, but As entrepreneurs, we have these ups and downs. We have these moments. But what I didn't hear you say is I cried, and and then I wanted to quit. Wonderful. It was I cried. I got it out. Yep. And then what's next?
Yeah. Yeah. Life is still and I think that's where losing my mom at 17 from 2 brain tumors that, you know, one night we're playing their UNO and healthiest can be in the next morning. I found her in a grandma seizure, and then she's given 3 months to live. You know? I think there's something very, you know, environmental that was taught to me at a very young age of just, if Chaz long as I have my health, Chaz long as I have my health Yeah. The sky's the limit. Right?
And so, so, you know, COVID you know, thankfully, I was healthy. Right? My business was not. But I was healthy, and I still had all my great ideas and all. And now I had all experience, and I was just gonna do it better. So, there was no victimhood. There was no blaming. There was no for me. There was there was real, like you said, real fear, real crying, real mourning. Chaz are those are healthy, you know Yeah. Feelings. And then there was, okay, birth.
Okay. Now now I have a clean slate and let's birth something else. Yeah. And, and see. That that moment, that confidence that you now have Chaz even in the pressing of the heart of the, moment Yes. Knowing what you would do now. And this is what this is what I mean, I I don't know if I've actually ever said this on a show or 75 shows in. The the reason for this question is to to give confidence to the entrepreneur today just like you have right now to where you're like, I can't lose.
Of course, of course, the individual storefront there, you know, something might tactically happen wrong, but you know beyond a shadow of a doubt that you can't lose. Yes. Yes. And I would say reclaim your confidence to those entrepreneurs listening. Reclaim that confidence you had as a kid. Okay? There is a beauty and innocence of our soul when we are little and we burst in a room, and we don't think is the idea smart enough? Is my shirt, you know, do I have the right outfit on? Whatever.
We just burst in and we say it. Right? Yeah. And and reclaim that and know that you were born with that. You didn't go to school for that. You didn't that's just who you are. It's your net worth. Right? It's it's just intrinsic. You are beautiful and divine. And like and so, yeah, like he said, hold on to that. You know, have that confidence and let it stem from Chaz. That nothing can take it away because, also, you didn't do anything to do it. You were just born with it. That's who you are.
That's right. Carmen, you've been absolutely incredible. How can the listener find your boutiques? How can they If they're a woman and they wanna they wanna hang off of a side of a cliff and they wanna just connect with you, they get out, that can they find your book, all of it. Yes. All of it. You can just literally go to a line hyphenonline.com, and you'll find everything.
And then also personally me, everything's under just my name from LinkedIn to Instagram to to Facebook and everything else. Just literally spell my name, Carmen with a k. My mom's name is Karen, and if you put an imminent, it becomes Carmen. Okay? Yeah. Then Barrenson, as it sounds, b e r e n t s e n. So, those 2, they can connect with me, and I would love to hear from anyone.
That's me, DM me, you know, all the above because it's wonderful to know that you, you know, more than you and I Chaz, got to hear this episode. And and if it did bless someone, if it did inspire someone, I I would love to know that. So let me know. That's incredible. Wow. Wow. Wolfe. Thank you for being here. Blessings on your store, your family, your daughter, maybe your move at some point to Costa Rica. You never know. Thank you for being here, Carmen. Sounds good.
Thanks. Thanks for listening to Gathering the Kings. We hope you got ton of value today and learn a thing or 2 about taking your business to 7 figures and beyond. If you desire more and want a community around you to help you get I want you to go to gathering the king's dot com. That's gathering the king's dot com, and I want you to apply for our next becoming a king 90 day intensive We are extremely exclusive by nature as a group.
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